Re: Help Rescue an IBM System/38

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I missed out on the System/38. I worked in the old IBM General Business
Group when it replaced the 34 and 36 range.

In those days, DP division (Mainframe) always won out if there was a
customer looking for a suitable system. Thos were the days of the antitrust
case and we were told that there may be a split of the various divisions.
Unfortunately, it didn't happen.

A couple of years later, I worked on a 4331 that utilised 3310 drives
(piccolo drives because that was how they sounded when the heads were
clunking in and out). The 3310 drives were a temporary replacement for
failing 3370 FBA devices that were suffering HDA crashes.

On Wed, Sep 11, 2024 at 3:12 AM Mark Waterbury <
01c3f560aac1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

>  Not quite a "mainframe" but very similar
> See:
> https://www.gofundme.com/f/ibm-system-38-computer-rescue-and-restoration
>
> The IBM System/38 used IBM 3310 FBA DASD, and the "channel" hardware was
> the same as used in the 4331/4341, with different microcode.
> Announced in 1979 and delivered in late 1980 to early 1981, the IBM
> System/38 was the world's first commercially available system to implement
> "single level storage" where all DASD was formatted as 512 byte pages, and
> the entire system ran in a single enormous address space, with 48-bit
> addresses in the "hardware" (microcode/firmware), and at the application
> level, (MI assembler and all HLL compilers) saw only "system pointers" that
> are 16 bytes or 128 bits, on a 16-byte boundary, and approx. 96 of those
> bits were used for addressing.   IBM System/38 implemented over a terabyte
> of virtual address space, way back in 1980!
> IBM S/38 systems were all CISC based, with an instruction set very similar
> to 370 ISA, with 48-bit wide registers.  They were microcoded machines,
> using the same technology as used on IBM mainframes of the period.  The
> memory hardware provided additional "tag bits" to protect MI pointers from
> being modified by software, instead of using official instructions or
> APIs.  If some user code accidentally (or on purpose) modified any bytes
> within a 16-byte quadword pointer, the memory hardware/microcode would
> "reset" the tag bits so the next attempt to use that pointer as an address
> would result in an exception message.
> IBM System/38 included an integrated relational database, released to
> customers well before SQL/DS or DB2 became available.  S/38's (unnamed)
> database did not use SQL (yet), as that was still a new language.   All
> "files" on S/38 CPF are "database" files.  There really was no traditional
> "file system" on disk -- you had named objects in named libraries, all laid
> out in the vast single-level store address space.  The MI instruction
> RSLVSP (resolve system pointer) allowed the CPF OS or user applications to
> "resolve" an object name to its 16-byte System Pointer address.
> S/38 was all made available to customers several years before MVS/XA
> became available.
>
> Please consider contributing to this worthy cause. :-)
>
>
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


-- 
Wayne V. Bickerdike

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Re: ODBC from MVS to a non-MVS (say Linux or Windows)

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Broadcom supply drivers for access to Datacom/DB.

ODBC is a supported protocol, it has been for 30 years! JDBC came later and
is supported. It requires Datacom server which is similar to IBM DB2
Connect and DRDA.

I don't think there is a generic talk to everything, you have to configure
for each data source.

We used ODBC connections from MS Excel to Datacom as a data source back in
the 90's.


   1. Create/edit the SVDBSPR job stream which initiates the Mainframe
   Server.
   2. Define a
   Datacom Server
ODBC data source on the Windows workstation or web server.
   3. Select the
   Data Source
tab on the
   Datacom/DB
ODBC
set-up panel and click the
   Test
button.
   4. Supply a user ID and password if required by the Mainframe Server
   startup parameters and click
   Connect
   .




On Sun, Aug 25, 2024 at 7:19 PM Attila Fogarasi <
05b6fee9abb7-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> ODBC connects to the local SQL implementation, for z/OS there is only Db2
> for z/OS.  In theory the C/C++ application program with ODBC calls coded
> could run unmodified on Linux or Windows with the same ODBC calls, after
> recompilation (of course this kind of platform independence is very hard to
> achieve).  The ODBC goes to the local SQL implementation, such as SQL
> Server.  The communication layer for Db2 on z/OS is DDF or DRDA and this is
> unrelated to ODBC but the ODBC requests can flow on it (just like they flow
> on TCP/IP).  This is standard part of Db2 so nothing more to install,
> however there are add-on products to enrich the solution.  The
> Linux/Windows end typically has both DDF and DRDA software already
> installed but Microsoft sells HIS (host integration server).  From an
> application standpoint, there are superior solutions to using ODBC, which
> is now a very old, legacy and almost obsolete solution.  For db2 remote
> data, using 3 part database name is what applications generally use, for
> example.
>
> On Sun, Aug 25, 2024 at 7:00 PM Binyamin Dissen <
> 0662573e2c3a-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
> > ODBC is only good for connecting to DB2?
> >
> > Lets say that I want to connect to an arbitrary RDMS on an arbitrary
> > platform,
> > such as MYSQL or M%crosoft database on Windows from MVS.
> >
> > Does JDBC work out of the box?  Is software required on MVS or Windows to
> > allow the connection?
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, 23 Aug 2024 00:45:06 +1000 Attila Fogarasi
> > <05b6fee9abb7-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> >
> > :>ODBC is a programming API for application programs written in C/C++ to
> > use
> > :>as an alternative to SQL.  It isn't a connection protocol to a remote
> > :>database server.  That connection can be a variety of ways, such as
> DRDA
> > or
> > :>Db2 Connect (that is a gateway) ... it all depends upon the specific
> > remote
> > :>system you want to use.  JDBC is often more convenient as it is a
> > :>newer/more powerful protocol than ODBC (ODBC is over 30 years old now).
> > :>It's a bit unusual to run C/C++ application in z/OS to access non-z/OS
> > SQL
> > :>databases using ODBC, depending upon UOW and 2 phase commit
> requirements
> > :>there can be better solutions than ODBC.  Db2 z/OS does have some
> special
> > :>connectivity to remote Db2 systems including LUW with/without ODBC, a
> bit
> > :>easier than to non-Db2 Unix or WIndows systems.
> > :>
> > :>On Wed, Aug 21, 2024 at 1:12?AM Binyamin Dissen <
> > :>0662573e2c3a-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> > :>
> > :>> It would seem that this would be controlled by the DSNAOINI (based on
> > the
> > :>> DSN8OIVP).
> > :>>
> > :>> It is not clear to me if (1) how to specify the remote non-DB2
> > connection
> > :>> and
> > :>> (2) if special software is required. For example, while I can find
> > MYSQL
> > :>> ODBC
> > :>> for various platforms, I do not see a ZOS version. Are MVS drivers
> > :>> required to
> > :>> be installed for each database type?
> > :>>
> > :>> --
> > :>> Binyamin Dissen 
> > :>> http://www.dissensoftware.com
> > :>>
> > :>> Director, Dissen Software, Bar & Grill - Israel
> > :>>
> > :>>
> --
> > :>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > :>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO
> IBM-MAIN
> > :>>
> > :>
> > :>--
> > :>For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > :>send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
> > --
> > Binyamin Dissen 
> > http://www.dissensoftware.com
> >
> > Director, Dissen Software, Bar & Grill - Israel
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
>
> ---

Re: 3270 programming

[Wayne Bickerdike]

SPF when I joined IBM in 1978 was Structured Programming Facility.
Internally we were starting to embrace Jackson Structured programming and
it was clear to me having already been exposed to Jackson that SPF was no
such thing.

It was handy for formatting in a structured / indented manner. A programmer
in our team would write all his PL/I in a continuous stream with the
semi-colon delimiters. He would then use the structured formatter of the
interactive checkout compiler to format the code nicely.

As previously stated the product morphed into ISPF. Productivity is a
better word for bean counters.


On Sun, Aug 18, 2024 at 8:40 PM David Spiegel <
0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Hi Lennie,
> When I became a SysProg in 1982, I became more familiar with the IBM
> alphabet soup entries PP, FDP and IUP.
> In today's world, not having PDF is laughable. Back then it was slightly
> possible if corporations wanted to save money (and could live with only
> TSO).
> BTW, SDSF started life as an FDP. (I supported (IUP) ADRS-II.)
> Believe it or not, PCF (actually, PCF-II) still exists as TSO Command
> Limiting in ACF2. Some of my employers use it, even though it is
> completely useless. (I opened a case with Broadcom on this topic. They
> reluctantly agreed with me.)
>
> Regards,
> David
>
> On 2024-08-18 06:24, Lennie Bradshaw wrote:
> > David,
> > Yes, I remember that name change too. The original scripting language
> used for SPF panels was way simpler than the sophistication we have now. Of
> course ISPF then split into two products, ISPF and PDF. I always felt that
> was a little silly. I never came across anyone who only had one of the
> products.
> >
> > FDP stands for Field Developed Program. I think it referred to products
> developed in the field for specific customers rather than developed in
> software labs. Other FDPs I have encountered include PCF which provided
> controls over who could execute which TSO commands. This was in the days
> before RACF of course. I think maybe JES328x was also originally an FDP.
> You can find a short discussion about FDPs in this Wikipedia article.
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Type-III_Library
> >
> > Lennie
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> Behalf Of David Spiegel
> > Sent: 18 August 2024 02:41
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: 3270 programming
> >
> > HI Lennie,
> > The "P" in ISPF was changed to "Productivity" (from "Programming").
> > I was still in university and had no clue what "FDP" meant.
> >
> > Regards,
> > David
> >
> > On 2024-08-16 19:34, Lennie Bradshaw wrote:
> >> David,
> >> Yes, I remember that. Was it an FDP? I used it on MVS 3.8. Its
> full-screen editing capabilities were a wonder after using TSO EDIT!
> >> But this was after I had already written the 3270 programs.
> >> ISPF followed on after the success of SPF.
> >> Lennie
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> >> Behalf Of David Spiegel
> >> Sent: 16 August 2024 17:34
> >> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >> Subject: Re: 3270 programming
> >>
> >> Hi Lennie,
> >> "... (in the late 1970s) I wrote some program for TSO using 3270
> protocols. This was in the days before ISPF ..."
> >> I Used ISPF's predecessor in the late '70s. (It was called SPF --
> Structured Programming Facility).
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> David
> >>
> >> On 2024-08-16 09:13, Lennie Bradshaw wrote:
> >>> Seymour,
> >>> That is interesting. I was unaware the protocol had been externalised
> from IBM. I guess this absolves them of the responsibility of providing
> documentation as well.
> >>>
> >>> Phil asked what was the original posters requirement. Well years ago
> (in the late 1970s) I wrote some program for TSO using 3270 protocols. This
> was in the days before ISPF and before the extended attribute support was
> available. I have been involved in such programs rarely since then, but
> have maintained some knowledge of the protocol. I have somewhere a "Green
> Book" which has all the tables and so on, but I have mislaid it. I had to
> make some changes to a VTAM USS table recently and was looking for the
> specifications for the control strings I could use. As I couldn't find my
> Green Book, I looked online and could not see where IBM had this documented.
> >>> Hence my questions.
> >>>
> >>> The website that Sebastian found was really useful.
> >>>
> >>> Many thanks to all who contributed. I will try and butt out now.
> >>> Lennie
> >>>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> >>> Behalf Of Seymour J Metz
> >>> Sent: 16 August 2024 12:56
> >>> To:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >>> Subject: Re: 3270 programming
> >>>
> >>> I would start with  RFC 2355, TN3270
> >>> Enhancements
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> >>> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
> >>> עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי
> >>> נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְ

Re: Mainframe history - 12 inch floppies?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

David asked:

*Do you? The keyboard wore out on my Speccy years ago.*

I did the keyboard upgrade that Sinclair pushed out. My old one had the
rubber keys but the replacement had a larger hard plastic case and hard
keys with engraved white characters. I still have the Centronics 779
interface, a modem interface and Tasword 2, Colossal Adventure, Manic Miner
and Small business accounts. I guess I should hang on to an old analog TV
too!

On Mon, Jul 22, 2024 at 9:59 PM David Crayford <
0595a051454b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> > On 17 Jul 2024, at 05:09, Wayne Bickerdike <
> 059234794979-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> >
> > I still have my ZX-Spectrum.
>
> Do you? The keyboard wore out on my Speccy years ago.
>
>
> > When the micro drives were available, I bought
> > two and the serial interface. The drives reduced the program load time to
> > five seconds. The capacity was around 100 Kbytes.
> >
> > That little machine helped me get a well paid job. I typed out my CV and
> > printed it on a Brother electric typewriter that used thermal paper. I
> > photocopied the CV several times to beef up the dot matrix typeset.
> >
> > This was in 1987, no internet, only corporate email (PROFS).
> >
> > I hand delivered the CV to the recruitment company and within two weeks I
> > was hired.
> >
> > I still have the ZX Spectrum and the typewriter in my garage. Alas I sold
> > the microdrives to a friend.
> >
> >
> >> On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 1:17 AM Phil Smith III  wrote:
> >>
> >> Since we're drifting: My dad had many friends in Prague, because he
> >> studied there in 1947 (and was there when the Communists took over,
> though
> >> he was across town). He visited there as often as he could, and at one
> >> point in the 80s got a tour of a data centre. Technology there included
> >> paper tape machines, only they couldn't get paper tape--so they were
> using
> >> used movie film from the Russian movie industry. Pretty weird!
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> Behalf
> >> Of Radoslaw Skorupka
> >> Sent: Monday, July 15, 2024 12:12 PM
> >> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >> Subject: Re: Mainframe history - 12 inch floppies?
> >>
> >> W dniu 15.07.2024 o 14:35, Paul Gilmartin pisze:
> >>> On Mon, 15 Jul 2024 05:19:52 +, Timothy Sipples wrote:
> >>>>...
> >>>> Drifting even further afield, ...
> >>
> >> --
> >> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> >> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Wayne V. Bickerdike
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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>


-- 
Wayne V. Bickerdike

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Re: World’s largest computer outage!

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I lost an argument when I worked at a very large discount broker in San
Francisco.

We had a big upgrade going in with a complex back out process. I said we
should install and immediately back it out to test the backout scenario.

Senior people scoffed at the idea. In went the update and boom! It went
pear-shaped. The backout process didn't work too well and we spent way too
many hours getting stable.

Test everything, even backout.

On Mon, Jul 22, 2024 at 7:21 AM Steve Thompson  wrote:

> Some of us that worked for good companies that wanted our
> products to be bullet proof (as much as we could make them) did
> that level of testing -- specifically with tape drives until SCSI
> came along and everything went virtual (still had cartridges in
> those machines).
>
> And M/S should be doing that level given the damage done this
> past week.
>
> Just my opinion.
>
> Steve Thompson
>
> On 7/21/2024 1:07 PM, Paul Gilmartin wrote:
> > On Sun, 21 Jul 2024 10:49:04 -0400, Phil Smith III wrote:
> >> 
> > Has anyone explained how this passed CrowdStrike integration test?
> >
> > But these things happen.  I heard of a product that crashed
> > reproducibly at customer sites having 8 or more tape drives.
> > Who does that in a test lab!>
> >
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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>


-- 
Wayne V. Bickerdike

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Re: World’s largest computer outage!

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Paul wrote:


*Are you suggesting using physical cash because software andhardware
engineers are unable to create a reliable alternative?*

Absolutely yes. There are myriad reasons, in my case I have a pension paid
into a UK account. Domiciled in Australia it's the best way for me to
access these funds and have cash.

In Australia there's a push to cashless, however, lots of businesses have
suffered through similar outages and are going back to cash. EFTPOS is a
cash cow for banks and network providers of ATMs.

The PC would be fine if it wasn't trying to do everything and had a myriad
of vulnerabilities in the registry and installation and update processes.
The multitool in my toolbox does everything badly and nothing well, except
for loosening the odd screw. It's a lousy hammer, wrench, knife etc.



On Sat, Jul 20, 2024 at 10:53 AM Paul Edwards <
0676ab6435a5-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Sat, 20 Jul 2024 10:26:46 +1000, Clement Clarke 
> wrote:
>
> >Can we bring back OS/2?
>
> It's still available. I bought a commercial license for ArcaOS
> because I was thinking of switching to it - where there is the
> ability to actually report bugs and get them fixed without
> being asked to pay full western contract rates for an unlimited
> time.
>
> But I decided to switch to the ARM processor instead, and
> bought a Pinebook Pro and run Windows 2000 under that.
> With the expectation of weaning myself off Windows 2000
> and onto the mini-equivalent of Windows for ARM 32-bit.
> Possibly literally using my Android smartphone running
> PdAndro to do programming, charged with a portable solar
> exclusively.
>
> But I don't have Hercules or equivalent running yet, so am
> still using my Pinebook Pro to do mainframe work, as that
> is a separate body of work.
>
> BFN. Paul.
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


-- 
Wayne V. Bickerdike

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Re: World’s largest computer outage!

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Some kind of false economy to make the PC the entire tool of choice for
certain routine tasks.

In the 1980s we had proprietary banking terminals, private/leased line
point to point communications and passbooks.

No way our branch network would be unable to perform front counter
transactions. We had store and forward whereby local transactions would be
kept until the network was back up and running.

In those days we had 3 ATMs, preferring to let other banks provide that
service and we would absorb the fees.

I drew out $620 in cash from an ATM yesterday, just a few hours before the
crash. Too many people are embracing the cashless world. Time to wake up
and apply some common sense.

On Sat, Jul 20, 2024 at 2:40 AM Radoslaw Skorupka <
0471ebeac275-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> In fact it is not first time where defender or antivirus transformed
> into enemy.
> I remember Symantec update which crippled my Firefox. Just at the moment
> I needed it to get to HMC and perform IPL, etc.
>
>
> Not to mention the Defender and other AV software deletes your files
> despite it is NOT a virus.
> Sometimes it is false positive and sometimes the AV is aware it is not a
> virus, but it deletes the file anyway. It can be something like Winnuke
> or some keygen, etc.
> Next time your files will be deleted because of curses in the text.
>
>
> --
> Radoslaw Skorupka
> Lodz, Poland
>
>
>
>
> W dniu 19.07.2024 o 17:58, Rick Troth pisze:
> > I'm not running Windoze so I haven't experienced it first hand, but
> > this does sound serious. From the Wikipedia page:
> >
> >"On July 19, 2024, a faulty CrowdStrike software update
> >  caused blue screens of death on Microsoft Windows machines,
> >  disrupting millions of Windows computers worldwide.
> >  Affected machines were forced into a bootloop, making them unusable.
> >  The downtime caused a widespread global impact, grounding
> >  commercial airline flights, temporarily taking Sky News offline,
> >  and impacting 911 emergency call centers."
> >
> >
> > What is ironic and amplifies the worry is that CrowdStrike is a
> > *defender* of systems and services.
> > Something about monitoring the monitors might fit here.
> >
> > References:
> >
> > https://cybersecuritynews.com/crowdstrike-update-bsod-loop/
> >
> >
> https://www.theverge.com/2024/7/19/24201717/windows-bsod-crowdstrike-outage-issue
> >
> >
> >  ... and of course ...
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_screen_of_death
> >
> >
> > -- R; <><
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 7/19/24 11:36 AM, Schmitt, Michael wrote:
> >> The impact is larger than just Microsoft's cloud. The cloudstrike
> >> update is causing crashes in Windows PCs and servers. For some it
> >> causes the PC to be unbootable.
> >>
> >> (It crashed my PC but it was able to restart)
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> >> Behalf Of Dave Beagle
> >> Sent: Friday, July 19, 2024 10:19 AM
> >> To:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >> Subject: Re: World’s largest computer outing!
> >>
> >> lol spell check but thanks for correcting a 2nd grade word.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Dave B.
> >>
> >> لقد قتل الفلسطينيون 40 ألف درع بشري بريء
> >>
> >>
> >> On Friday, July 19, 2024, 10:32 AM, Phil Smith III
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> *outage not *outing
> >>
> >> The real question is how many (OK, how FEW) CxOs are going to look at
> >> this and say "Gee, SPOF, eggs in one basket, *not under our control*,
> >> is this cloudy thingy really such a great idea?"
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >>> On 7/19/24 at 9:38 AM, Dave Beagle wrote:
> >>>
>  Microsoft via a Crowdstrike security update is experiencing the
>  largest outage in world history. Long live the mainframe.
> >>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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>


-- 
Wayne V. Bickerdike

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Re: Inquiry on Powerful Sorting and Query Tools for Linux Platform

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Don't really know the answer, however, DB2 with an order by must perform
some kind of sort. Or any Linux relational database.

The RDB dream didn't really eventuate, we're still sorting lots of data the
old way.

On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 8:34 AM Jason Cai  wrote:

> Hi all
>
>  DFSORT has impressed us greatly with its versatility, offering
> functionalities beyond mere sorting, including robust key-based fuzzy
> querying at exceptional speeds. As we are currently transitioning our data
> from a mainframe (ZOS) environment to Linux, we are in need of tools that
> can efficiently handle high-performance sorting and fuzzy querying of large
> historical binary data on Linux.
>
>  Any advice or suggestions on optimizing these processes on Linux would be
> greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks a lot!
>
> Jason Cai
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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>


-- 
Wayne V. Bickerdike

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Re: Mainframe history - 12 inch floppies?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I still have my ZX-Spectrum. When the micro drives were available, I bought
two and the serial interface. The drives reduced the program load time to
five seconds. The capacity was around 100 Kbytes.

That little machine helped me get a well paid job. I typed out my CV and
printed it on a Brother electric typewriter that used thermal paper. I
photocopied the CV several times to beef up the dot matrix typeset.

This was in 1987, no internet, only corporate email (PROFS).

I hand delivered the CV to the recruitment company and within two weeks I
was hired.

I still have the ZX Spectrum and the typewriter in my garage. Alas I sold
the microdrives to a friend.


On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 1:17 AM Phil Smith III  wrote:

> Since we're drifting: My dad had many friends in Prague, because he
> studied there in 1947 (and was there when the Communists took over, though
> he was across town). He visited there as often as he could, and at one
> point in the 80s got a tour of a data centre. Technology there included
> paper tape machines, only they couldn't get paper tape--so they were using
> used movie film from the Russian movie industry. Pretty weird!
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Radoslaw Skorupka
> Sent: Monday, July 15, 2024 12:12 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Mainframe history - 12 inch floppies?
>
> W dniu 15.07.2024 o 14:35, Paul Gilmartin pisze:
> > On Mon, 15 Jul 2024 05:19:52 +, Timothy Sipples wrote:
> >> ...
> >> Drifting even further afield, ...
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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>


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Wayne V. Bickerdike

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Re: Mainframe history - 12 inch floppies?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

43xx series had an 8 inch floppy drive for IML.

I had a drive taken out of a 4341 by a mate who was an IBM CE. It was a
vain hope that I might be able to use it on a Zilog based machine. That was
in 1980.

I tend to hang on to historical artefacts. I have 8" floppies with ancient
CP/M tools in my garage.

Never saw a 12" floppy but plenty of 12" LPs .

Off topic but I have a complete "Learn Japanese" set of 78 RPM discs. The
style of Japanese would probably be unknown to the current generation. Like
the substitution of D for T in US/Australia pronunciation. Sadderday for
Saturday, communidy for community. Sad..

On Sat, Jul 13, 2024 at 3:27 AM Schmitt, Michael 
wrote:

> They're 12" if you measure the sleeve /diagonally/
>
> 😊
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Phil Smith III
> Sent: Friday, July 12, 2024 12:19 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Mainframe history - 12 inch floppies?
>
> Some Googling suggests that there really were no 12" floppies. I suspect
> if you grew up with late "hard" floppies, 8" look enormous, are easily
> mistaken for 12"!
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Ed Jaffe
> Sent: Friday, July 12, 2024 8:51 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Mainframe history - 12 inch floppies?
>
> On 7/11/2024 9:00 AM, Radoslaw Skorupka wrote:
> > I just found information in some book that IBM mainframes used 12 inch
> > floppy diskettes. Late 70's.
> >
> > Anybody heard about such diskettes?
>
>
> When I first set foot in an IBM-mainframe computer room, the CPU and
> peripherals used 8"floppy diskettes for loading the internal code.
>
> I never saw a 12" floppy diskette used.
>
>
> --
>
> Phoenix Software International
> Edward E. Jaffe
> 831 Parkview Drive North
> El Segundo, CA 90245
> https://www.phoenixsoftware.com/
>
>
>
> 
> This e-mail message, including any attachments, appended messages and the
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Re: message IEA793AJUsr wonderinfJ

[Wayne Bickerdike]

D DUMP command will show the dump dataset name configuration.

Once you have that go to ISPF 3.4 and list all the datasets;

eg: SYS1.DUMP.DS

Try and delete them.

You may also have some phantom dump files catalogued. Add the VOLSER to the
3.4 display. If they aren't found, uncatalog the phantoms.






On Wed, Jul 10, 2024 at 7:16 PM Sebastian Welton 
wrote:

> On Tue, 9 Jul 2024 08:31:34 -0400, Joseph Reichman 
> wrote:
>
>
> >
> >*01 IEA793A NO DUMP DATA SETS AVAILABLE FOR DUMPID=001
> >. USE THE DUMPDS COMMAND OR REPLY D TO DELETE THE DUMP
> >
>
> Did you try replying 'D' to it like it states in the message?
>
> R 01,D
>
> https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/3.1.0?topic=messages-iea793a
>
> Sebastian.
>
> --
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Re: About Python and REXX

[Wayne Bickerdike]

See
https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/2.4.0?topic=directories-using-ishell-manage-unix-files

Use the ISPF shell (ISHELL) to perform the following functions on UNIX
files:

   - Copy a PDS or PDSE to a UNIX directory.
   - Copy a UNIX directory to a PDS or PDSE.
   - List files in a directory.
   - Create, delete, or rename directories, files, and special files.
   - Browse, edit, and copy files.
   - Display file attributes.
   - Search files for text strings.
   - Compare files or directories.
   - Run executable files.
   - Display information about symbolic links.
   - Mount and unmount a hierarchical file system.
   - Create an HFS data set or other UNIX file.
   - Set up character-special files.
   - Set up directories for a root file system.
   - Set up users and groups for z/OS UNIX access.


On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 6:55 PM Wayne Bickerdike  wrote:

> From ISPF Option 6 - TSO commands:
> Enter the command
> OMVS
>
> Your RACF profile will need an OMVS segment and a UID.
>
> You can also poke around using the Interactive shell. It's a menu based
> shell into OMVS.
>
> ISHELL command...
>
> On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 5:58 PM Thomas Berg <
> 0619bfe39560-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
>> Sorry for my ignorance, how do I access OMVS?
>>
>> Thomas Berg
>>
>> Den tors 4 juli 2024 06:38Wayne Bickerdike <
>> 059234794979-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> skrev:
>>
>> > In OMVS try the python command For version 3,1, it's python3. Or just
>> have
>> > a look around the OMVS directories.
>> >
>> > On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 8:02 AM   <
>> > 0619bfe39560-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>> >
>> > > A question:
>> > >
>> > > * How do I check if Python is installed/availible in an existing z/OS?
>> > (I
>> > > can't ask anyone for the moment due to an organisational mess at this
>> > > site.)
>> > >
>> > > * Regarding REXX:
>> > > - If performance is a priority and concern for the task I use a proper
>> > > tool delivered by IBM or third party vendor (the latter if
>> portability is
>> > > not important).
>> > > - If a proper tool is not avalible or usable and performance is a
>> > priority
>> > > etc for the task I code a COBOL or assembler program. But I very
>> seldom
>> > > have had a need to do that, at least the latest 20 years or so.
>> > > - If performance is NOT a priority I use REXX.
>> > > - I would use langs like Python if they are as easy and fast to code
>> as
>> > > REXX. If not they are irrellevant for me. And here portability may
>> > probably
>> > > be a concern.
>> > > - I have never felt limited by REXX functionality in z/OS (other than
>> > > regarding performance sometimes, but then you can easily use tools
>> from
>> > > REXX!).
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Thomas Berg
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO
>> IBM-MAIN
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Wayne V. Bickerdike
>> >
>> > --
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>> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>> >
>>
>> --
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>
>
> --
> Wayne V. Bickerdike
>
>

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Re: About Python and REXX

[Wayne Bickerdike]

>From ISPF Option 6 - TSO commands:
Enter the command
OMVS

Your RACF profile will need an OMVS segment and a UID.

You can also poke around using the Interactive shell. It's a menu based
shell into OMVS.

ISHELL command...

On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 5:58 PM Thomas Berg <
0619bfe39560-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Sorry for my ignorance, how do I access OMVS?
>
> Thomas Berg
>
> Den tors 4 juli 2024 06:38Wayne Bickerdike <
> 059234794979-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> skrev:
>
> > In OMVS try the python command For version 3,1, it's python3. Or just
> have
> > a look around the OMVS directories.
> >
> > On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 8:02 AM   <
> > 0619bfe39560-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> >
> > > A question:
> > >
> > > * How do I check if Python is installed/availible in an existing z/OS?
> > (I
> > > can't ask anyone for the moment due to an organisational mess at this
> > > site.)
> > >
> > > * Regarding REXX:
> > > - If performance is a priority and concern for the task I use a proper
> > > tool delivered by IBM or third party vendor (the latter if portability
> is
> > > not important).
> > > - If a proper tool is not avalible or usable and performance is a
> > priority
> > > etc for the task I code a COBOL or assembler program. But I very seldom
> > > have had a need to do that, at least the latest 20 years or so.
> > > - If performance is NOT a priority I use REXX.
> > > - I would use langs like Python if they are as easy and fast to code as
> > > REXX. If not they are irrellevant for me. And here portability may
> > probably
> > > be a concern.
> > > - I have never felt limited by REXX functionality in z/OS (other than
> > > regarding performance sometimes, but then you can easily use tools from
> > > REXX!).
> > >
> > >
> > > Thomas Berg
> > >
> > > --
> > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Wayne V. Bickerdike
> >
> > --
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> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
>
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>


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Re: About Python and REXX

[Wayne Bickerdike]

In OMVS try the python command For version 3,1, it's python3. Or just have
a look around the OMVS directories.

On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 8:02 AM   <
0619bfe39560-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> A question:
>
> * How do I check if Python is installed/availible in an existing z/OS?  (I
> can't ask anyone for the moment due to an organisational mess at this
> site.)
>
> * Regarding REXX:
> - If performance is a priority and concern for the task I use a proper
> tool delivered by IBM or third party vendor (the latter if portability is
> not important).
> - If a proper tool is not avalible or usable and performance is a priority
> etc for the task I code a COBOL or assembler program. But I very seldom
> have had a need to do that, at least the latest 20 years or so.
> - If performance is NOT a priority I use REXX.
> - I would use langs like Python if they are as easy and fast to code as
> REXX. If not they are irrellevant for me. And here portability may probably
> be a concern.
> - I have never felt limited by REXX functionality in z/OS (other than
> regarding performance sometimes, but then you can easily use tools from
> REXX!).
>
>
> Thomas Berg
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


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Re: OS/VS2 Release 2: Happy 50th Anniversary!

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I was almost there! I started in 1975 as an application programmer. We'd
just gone from OS/MFT to OS/VS1 and an IBM SE came and talked about this
thing called "virtual storage".

As a trainee, I had absolutely no idea what this meant for me. I had spent
weeks poring over the IBM Orientation books. At this point I wondered if I
would make it in the industry. Learning PL/I first probably saved my
sanity. The more experienced guys were all Assembler programmers.

On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 11:45 AM Timothy Sipples  wrote:

> My colleagues point out an interesting anniversary. IBM introduced OS/VS2
> Release 2 (IBM Program Number 5752-VS2) on July 3, 1974. The history is a
> little complicated, but essentially it's the date when "MVS" was born.
> Today's z/OS 3.1 operating system is the direct, lineal descendent of
> OS/VS2 Release 2. Of course z/OS is vastly more capable and broader in
> scope.
>
> Happy 50th anniversary!
>
> OS/VS2 Release 2 was WAY before my time. Do you have any personal memories?
>
> —
> Timothy Sipples
> Senior Architect
> Digital Assets, Industry Solutions, and Cybersecurity
> IBM Z/LinuxONE, Asia-Pacific
> sipp...@sg.ibm.com
>
>
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Re: What's at a comma?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Surprised it ever worked!

I would have coded   *CLI   0(R7),C','*

CLI embeds the hex value in the assembled source.

No doubt someone will chime in with whatabout codeset.






On Wed, Jul 3, 2024 at 8:39 AM Mike Shaw  wrote:

> It's zeroes on our z/OS V2R5 system (display by zXDC):
>
>  XDC ===>
>
>  _  _ 0s (A.S.RSC010) --- LOWCORE+0, @LEPILOG+0, @R6+0,
> @R8+0, PSA+0
>  _+0  0s       **
>
>  _   +10  0s  00FD7AE0  7000 7000  *..:\".0.".0.*
>
>  _   +20  0s  7000 7000 7000 7000  *".0.".0.".0.".0.*
>
>  _   +30  0s    7000 7000  *".0.".0.*
>
>
> Mike Shaw
> MVS/QuickRef Support Group
> Chicago-Soft, Ltd.
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 2, 2024 at 6:20 PM Phil Smith III  wrote:
>
> > Schmitt, Michael wrote:
> > >The REXX code displays:
> >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > >Which would explain why it isn't branching.
> >
> > >We were on z/OS 2.4 before.
> >
> > It would indeed. But I'm astonished that the IPL PSW is zeroes?! Perhaps
> > some IBMer can explain that. And maybe someone else on 2.5 can run the
> > snippet?
> >
> > --
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> >
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Re: As a long-time Rexx programmer (SDSF)

[Wayne Bickerdike]

RGEN X is great. Most of the examples are well thought out and work well.

On Sat, Jun 15, 2024 at 11:52 PM Don Leahy  wrote:

> I am a huge fan of RGEN.  It’s like a context aware version of the ISPF
> MODEL command.   That is some excellent work.  And so is the HELP facility
> in general.
>
> On Fri, Jun 14, 2024 at 18:29 Rob Scott <
> 0618c90e6fdf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
> > For every z/OS release we also create a "What's new in SDSF" style
> > presentation that we give at Share and GSE and then upload to the IBM
> > Education GitHub. There is also an in-product help table of new functions
> > for the release.
> >
> > As for SDSF rexx examples, you can use the RGEN command that will
> generate
> > sample rexx statements to navigate to where you currently are in the
> > product OR use "RGEN X" to pick a sample from the supplied list of basic
> > scenarios.
> >
> > Rob Scott
> > Rocket Software.
> >
> > Sent from Outlook for Android
> > 
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> > of Radoslaw Skorupka <0471ebeac275-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> > Sent: Friday, June 14, 2024 9:02:59 PM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU 
> > Subject: Re: As a long-time Rexx programmer (SDSF)
> >
> > EXTERNAL EMAIL
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Friday, a little bit off-topic, but still about mainframes and SDSF
> >
> > SDSF is great tool. I was enhanced significantly last years. I like it.
> > However I observe many users are simply *not aware* of many new features.
> > They obviously use panels, which are visible in main menu, but they miss
> > many other tools.
> > I believe everything is documented, but it is rather rare that someone
> > read whole documentation as a novel.
> >
> > Q: is there any presentation or whitepaper describing "new and shining"
> > things in SDSF?
> >
> > Regarding SDSF and REXX - I miss simple examples. It is not only
> > SDSF-related pain. I observe many z/OS users are looking for code
> > samples via Google search and we find some bad or very bad ones,
> > submitted on some forums.
> >
> > My €0.02
> >
> > Regards
> > --
> > Radoslaw Skorupka
> > Lodz, Poland
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > W dniu 14.06.2024 o 20:20, Rob Scott pisze:
> > > I must admit that I find nothing amiss with the quoted section.
> > >
> > > It describes the syntax requirements of the SDSF-specific ISFEXEC verb.
> > >
> > > It does not get into any generic REXX techniques to provide the
> > statement buffer to the verb as that is not required in this case.
> > >
> > > Contrast that with the documentation for ISFSLASH that does include
> > required REXX techniques as it supports alternate input using stem
> > variables.
> > >
> > > The product documentation is written by information development team
> > members, but based on input provided by the development team. In this
> case,
> > that developer (not me) has decades of asm, plx and rexx experience and
> is
> > fully aware of the nuances of the language.
> > >
> > > The documentation will always be updated when required for the current
> > (most recent) release.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Rob Scott
> > > Rocket Software
> > >
> > > Get Outlook for Android >>
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
> > 
> > Rocket Software, Inc. and subsidiaries ¦ 77 Fourth Avenue
> > <
> https://www.google.com/maps/search/d+subsidiaries+%C2%A6+77+Fourth+Avenue?entry=gmail&source=g
> >,
> > Waltham MA 02451 ¦ Main Office Toll Free Number: +1 855.577.4323
> > Contact Customer Support:
> > https://my.rocketsoftware.com/RocketCommunity/RCEmailSupport
> > Unsubscribe from Marketing Messages/Manage Your Subscription Preferences
> -
> > http://www.rocketsoftware.com/manage-your-email-preferences
> > Privacy Policy -
> > http://www.rocketsoftware.com/company/legal/privacy-policy
> > 
> >
> > This communication and any attachments may contain confidential
> > information of Rocket Software, Inc. All unauthorized use, disclosure or
> > distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please
> > notify Rocket Software immediately and destroy all copies of this
> > communication. Thank you.
> >
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Re: As a long-time Rexx programmer

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I got into the habit of using Q = '7D'X in my REXX prologue.

I would use Q as the Quote in expressions and avoid all the internal
confusion of what is a quoted double quote.

Nasty but worked for me...

On Sun, Jun 16, 2024 at 1:10 PM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Sat, 15 Jun 2024 22:28:11 -0400, Bob Bridges wrote:
>
> >Jeremy, you and I agree on a lot of things, but nah, this one isn't for
> me;
> >it's 'way too much like work.  I'm much more likely to do it the other
> way:
> >
> >  msg="You've misdefined '"xyz''' as "'xyz'".'
> >
> >It may take me a couple tries to get it right, but after that I'm never
> >going to look at it again so I don't feel the need to do all the extra
> >typing in order to make it obvious to the passing eye.
> >
> It can't be made obvious.  It's irreducibly complex/x  Aggravated
> by proportional fonts which make a quotation mark indistinguishable
> from a double apostrophe.
>
> >---
> >-Original Message-
> >From: Jeremy Nicoll
> >Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2024 05:37
> >
> >Many of the literal strings in my Rexx programs are parts of error
> messages
> >etc and lots of those have single quotes in them, mostly as apostrophes
> ...
> >so I enclose these texts in double quotes.
> >
> >I tend therefore to use double quotes nearly all the time.
> >
> >When I do need to build strings with both in them I tend to do it via two
> >vars
> >
> >  dq = '"'  ;   sq = "'"
> >
> >and end up with lines like
> >
> >  msg = "You've misdefined" sq || "xyz" || sq "as" dq || xyz || dq || "."
>
> --
> gil
>
> --
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Re: PL/I Options question

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Charles,

I've only ever specified ISASIZE as a PARM override.

You could try PARM='/TEST()'

You need the slash delimiter, you probably know that.

On Thu, Jun 13, 2024 at 7:47 AM Charles Mills  wrote:

> This is one of those things where the surrounding details are what they
> are, and would be a distraction if posted here. Please trust me, the
> situation is what it is.
>
> I have a PL/I source file that includes *PROCESS TEST(BLOCK,SYM); Let's
> pretend that cannot be changed.
>
> Is there anything I can code on PARM= to force the SEPARATE sub-option of
> TEST?
>
> z/OS Enterprise PL/I 6.1.
>
> Thanks much,
> Charles
>
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Re: VTOCs vs. catalogs

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I remember a lecturer at IBM in London 1975 when I was taking a PL/I course.

He asked, "Why is VSAM like a cow in a meadow".

Answer : "Because they are both outstanding in their field".

Our company was still using ISAM and continued well past 1978. I first
encountered VSAM at IBM when I went to work there in 1978.

I wasn't sure what all the fuss was about.

On Sat, May 25, 2024 at 11:46 PM billogden  wrote:

> > What you described about VSAM is what I heard too, a replacement of the
> then dominant access methods.
> >
> Wow -- I distinctly remember that goal. It really scared many of us
> (customers and IBMers) and made some of us aware of the gaps between
> "developers" and "users".
>
> KSDS worked well to replace ISAM (and ISAM is another bad memory!) The
> other
> VSAM types mostly vanished, although there is a newer one for LINEAR data.
>
> Some participants here are roughly as old as I am -- with notes about 2311s
> and 2314s (and we should probably skip our potential comments about 650s,
> 1620s, 1400s, and 709xs)!
>
> Bill Ogden
>
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Re: Mainframe performance tool replacement

[Wayne Bickerdike]

EasySMF. Andrew Rowley may chip in here.

On Wed, May 8, 2024 at 7:23 AM Bob Bridges <
0587168ababf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> I think I'm about to reveal my obsolescence:  Where my clients didn't use
> SAS, they mostly used DYL-280II or QuikJob.  Or REXX, of course.
>
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
> /* Jonny snorted. "You mean out among the decadence of the big worlds?
> Come on, Jame, you don't really believe that sophistication implies
> depravity, do you?" / "Of course not. But someone's bound to try and
> convince you that depravity implies sophistication."  From _Cobra_ by
> Timothy Zahn */
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of raji ece
> Sent: Tuesday, May 7, 2024 8:20 AM
>
> We have been running with SAS and MICS software to analysis system
> performance and to produce reports on daily basis.
>
> There is a situation to come out of using SAS due to many reasons.
>
> We would like to know the alternate product for this SAS and MICS.
>
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Re: ./ ADD - which utility?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I guess when the utility was developed JCL was way simpler and test cases
were limited.

After Gil raised the various gotchas, I wrote myself a PUTPDS program with
a user defined delimiter. Eschewing 2 bytes means I can come up with a very
random string such as !@#$%^&*  ADD NAME=MEMBER. Not likely to be embedded
in usual members.

Now adding some bells and whistles. Not that I need it in retirement. Golf
today.

On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 12:47 AM Steve Thompson  wrote:

> In a single word, yes.
>
> And as has been stated, setting up "DLM=" requires, at times, a
> scan of just the first several bytes of each logical record to
> find what unique value(s) one can use.
>
> Steve Thompson
>
> On 4/15/2024 3:30 AM,   wrote:
> > Just curious. Have anyone had problem with this delimiter problem in
> real life with anything other than JCL in the inline input data?
> > (I mean the alternative of a separate file seems to be a better/normal
> alternative unless the inline data is at the end of the member/ds.)
> >
> > --
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Re: ./ ADD - which utility?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

VSE JCL. First time I had to use it...Well all the DLBLS before the EXEC.
Actually more logical.

The O/S? We could run a production CICS region on a 1 MIP machine. That's
tight. (and a Meg of main).

On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 11:29 AM Wayne Bickerdike  wrote:

> If there are embedded ./ IEBUPDTE in the JCL, I write a .# ADD card as
> the header and then use my PUTPDS REXX code.
>
> The odds of a .# ADD appearing I guesstimate as nil.
>
> Yes, it's annoying but really, who cares?
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 10:37 AM Paul Gilmartin <
> 042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 14 Apr 2024 19:47:38 -0400, Steve Thompson wrote:
>>
>> >JES3 is not retarded.
>> >
>> I may have judged hastily from such as that the OUTPUT JCL statement
>> came to JES2 before JES3.  You could pay extra to not get the feature.
>>
>> >JES3 has this:
>> >//*DATASET parameters.
>> >
>> >//*ENDDATASET
>> >
>> Those look like comments.  I guess it provides a sort of compatibility
>> in that JES2 will ignore them.  At the cost of making it harder to
>> detect and report typos.
>>
>> Can the delimiter be changed to allow such lines within instream data?
>>
>>
>> >This is what the z/OS MVS JCL REF has for the parameters:
>> >   ...
>> >//*DATASET DDNAME=ddname[,parameter]...
>>
>> >This allows one to put that data in-stream, define what DD will
>> >be using it. And then the JOB Step that gets it, the data is
>> >encapsulated better than JES2 does it.
>> >
>> I see little use in the feature.  But if I don't like it, or dln't
>> understand it, I don't have to use it.
>>
>> >So I think this can handle the problem of "IEBUPDTE".
>> >
>> No.  The problem is not in JES[23], but in IEBUPDTE, which
>> has nothing like a DLM= parm which would allow data lines
>> resembling IEBU{DtE commands to appear instream.
>>
>> --
>> Thanks,
>> gil
>>
>> --
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>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>>
>
>
> --
> Wayne V. Bickerdike
>
>

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Re: ./ ADD - which utility?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

If there are embedded ./ IEBUPDTE in the JCL, I write a .# ADD card as
the header and then use my PUTPDS REXX code.

The odds of a .# ADD appearing I guesstimate as nil.

Yes, it's annoying but really, who cares?

On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 10:37 AM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Sun, 14 Apr 2024 19:47:38 -0400, Steve Thompson wrote:
>
> >JES3 is not retarded.
> >
> I may have judged hastily from such as that the OUTPUT JCL statement
> came to JES2 before JES3.  You could pay extra to not get the feature.
>
> >JES3 has this:
> >//*DATASET parameters.
> >
> >//*ENDDATASET
> >
> Those look like comments.  I guess it provides a sort of compatibility
> in that JES2 will ignore them.  At the cost of making it harder to
> detect and report typos.
>
> Can the delimiter be changed to allow such lines within instream data?
>
>
> >This is what the z/OS MVS JCL REF has for the parameters:
> >   ...
> >//*DATASET DDNAME=ddname[,parameter]...
>
> >This allows one to put that data in-stream, define what DD will
> >be using it. And then the JOB Step that gets it, the data is
> >encapsulated better than JES2 does it.
> >
> I see little use in the feature.  But if I don't like it, or dln't
> understand it, I don't have to use it.
>
> >So I think this can handle the problem of "IEBUPDTE".
> >
> No.  The problem is not in JES[23], but in IEBUPDTE, which
> has nothing like a DLM= parm which would allow data lines
> resembling IEBU{DtE commands to appear instream.
>
> --
> Thanks,
> gil
>
> --
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Re: ./ ADD - which utility?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I have some REXX code that extracts all members of a PDS and writes it to a
sequential file. Each member extracted is prefixed with the ./ADD card with
the original member name. Handy for moving a PDS to another system.
IEBUPDTE was the utility of choice when all we had was a card punch and
card reader. (1975).

On Sun, Apr 14, 2024 at 8:08 AM Mike Schwab <
05962a42dc49-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> No relation to the ditty bops band.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iu7289s7l64
>
> On Sat, Apr 13, 2024 at 4:56 PM Rupert Reynolds 
> wrote:
> >
> > Affectionately known in UK as I-E-B-up-ditty :-)
> >
> > On Sat, 13 Apr 2024, 15:39 ITschak Mugzach, <
> > 05a7ced721d8-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> >
> > > IEBUPDTE. JCL can be found in google
> > >
> > > ITschak Mugzach
> > > *|** IronSphere Platform* *|* *Information Security Continuous
> Monitoring
> > > for z/OS, x/Linux & IBM I **| z/VM coming soon  *
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sat, Apr 13, 2024 at 5:30 PM   <
> > > 0619bfe39560-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Which utility do you use for control statement/input:
> > > > ./ ADD
> > > >
> > > > A jcl for that would be nice too.
> > > >
> > > > ...Embarassed by my lack of memory after 8 years out of this
> > > > envirinment...
> > > >
> > > >
> --
> > > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO
> IBM-MAIN
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
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> > >
> >
> > --
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>
>
> --
> Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA
> Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all?
>
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Re: Loss of data for logstream

[Wayne Bickerdike]

You can still fall back to DASD SMF logs in the event something goes wrong
with log streams.

Also ensure AUTODELETE(YES) and RETPD are reviewed for removing old data.

Ensure automation is archiving correctly.

Larger Log streams?

There is a 2010 Share presentation on log streams for SMF. Google it.

On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 3:17 PM Mark Jacobs <
0224d287a4b1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Yes, one of them. It's in our systems programmer sandbox so I'm not too
> concerned, just looking for a procedure that we can follow if it occurs in
> other sysplexes.
>
>  Mark Jacobs
>
> Sent from ProtonMail, Swiss-based encrypted email.
>
> GPG Public Key -
> https://api.protonmail.ch/pks/lookup?op=get&search=markjac...@protonmail.com
>
>
> On Monday, April 1st, 2024 at 11:33 PM, Wayne Bickerdike <
> 059234794979-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
> > SMF log stream?
> >
> > On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 11:41 AM Jousma, David <
> > 01a0403c5dc1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> >
> > > Rename the logstream, and then define a new one.
> > >
> > > Dave Jousma
> > >
> > > Vice President | Director, Technology Engineering
> > >
> > > Fifth Third Bank | 1830 East Paris Ave, SE | MD RSCB2H | Grand
> > > Rapids, MI 49546
> > >
> > > 616.653.8429
> > > 
> > > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU on behalf
> > > of Mark Jacobs 0224d287a4b1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu
> > > Sent: Monday, April 1, 2024 2:34:57 PM
> > > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > > Subject: Loss of data for logstream
> > >
> > > One of my logstreams is showing a status of LOSS OF DATA. What's the
> > > procedure to fix that condition? Mark Jacobs Sent from
> [ProtonMail](https:
> > > //urldefense. com/v3/https: //protonmail.
> > >
> com;!!MwwqYLOC6b6whF7V!jnO1EuISd0MISz0CjMwxO6G-PoatxeReVDzn0c2kQipBbLl0FsMyvhyaBTXvv0h1-wXtaF_hC1OS8Tv3XlJ4tAhb4qhYrTWdaFY$),
> > >
> > > One of my logstreams is showing a status of LOSS OF DATA. What's the
> > > procedure to fix that condition?
> > >
> > > Mark Jacobs
> > >
> > > Sent from ProtonMail,
> > > Swiss-based encrypted email.
> > >
> > > GPG Public Key -
> > >
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://api.protonmail.ch/pks/lookup?op=get&search=markjacobs@protonmail.com__;!!MwwqYLOC6b6whF7V!jnO1EuISd0MISz0CjMwxO6G-PoatxeReVDzn0c2kQipBbLl0FsMyvhyaBTXvv0h1-wXtaF_hC1OS8Tv3XlJ4tAhb4qhYL0jDObo$
> > >
> > > --
> > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> > >
> > > This e-mail transmission contains information that is confidential and
> may
> > > be privileged. It is intended only for the addressee(s) named above. If
> > > you receive this e-mail in error, please do not read, copy or
> disseminate
> > > it in any manner. If you are not the intended recipient, any
> disclosure,
> > > copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information is
> > > prohibited. Please reply to the message immediately by informing the
> sender
> > > that the message was misdirected. After replying, please erase it from
> your
> > > computer system. Your assistance in correcting this error is
> appreciated.
> > >
> > > --
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> >
> >
> > --
> > Wayne V. Bickerdike
> >
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Re: Loss of data for logstream

[Wayne Bickerdike]

SMF log stream?

On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 11:41 AM Jousma, David <
01a0403c5dc1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Rename the logstream, and then define a new one.
>
> Dave Jousma
>
> Vice President | Director, Technology Engineering
>
>
> Fifth Third Bank  |  1830 East Paris Ave, SE  |  MD RSCB2H  |  Grand
> Rapids, MI 49546
>
> 616.653.8429
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of Mark Jacobs <0224d287a4b1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> Sent: Monday, April 1, 2024 2:34:57 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU 
> Subject: Loss of data for logstream
>
> One of my logstreams is showing a status of LOSS OF DATA. What's the
> procedure to fix that condition? Mark Jacobs Sent from [ProtonMail](https:
> //urldefense. com/v3/__https: //protonmail.
> com__;!!MwwqYLOC6b6whF7V!jnO1EuISd0MISz0CjMwxO6G-PoatxeReVDzn0c2kQipBbLl0FsMyvhyaBTXvv0h1-wXtaF_hC1OS8Tv3XlJ4tAhb4qhYrTWdaFY$),
>
>
> One of my logstreams is showing a status of LOSS OF DATA. What's the
> procedure to fix that condition?
>
> Mark Jacobs
>
> Sent from [ProtonMail](
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://protonmail.com__;!!MwwqYLOC6b6whF7V!jnO1EuISd0MISz0CjMwxO6G-PoatxeReVDzn0c2kQipBbLl0FsMyvhyaBTXvv0h1-wXtaF_hC1OS8Tv3XlJ4tAhb4qhYrTWdaFY$),
> Swiss-based encrypted email.
>
> GPG Public Key -
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://api.protonmail.ch/pks/lookup?op=get&search=markjacobs@protonmail.com__;!!MwwqYLOC6b6whF7V!jnO1EuISd0MISz0CjMwxO6G-PoatxeReVDzn0c2kQipBbLl0FsMyvhyaBTXvv0h1-wXtaF_hC1OS8Tv3XlJ4tAhb4qhYL0jDObo$
>
> --
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>
> This e-mail transmission contains information that is confidential and may
> be privileged.   It is intended only for the addressee(s) named above. If
> you receive this e-mail in error, please do not read, copy or disseminate
> it in any manner. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure,
> copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information is
> prohibited. Please reply to the message immediately by informing the sender
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Re: Ideas for less-distruptive disruptions - Netmaster:Solve and CICS

[Wayne Bickerdike]

David Spiegel...

I have my presentation PDF. Send me your email address and I'll forward it
to you.

My email: wayn...@gmail.com

On Tue, Mar 26, 2024 at 12:06 AM David Spiegel <
0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Hi Tom,
> I logged in with SHARE Userid/Password before asking the question.
>
> Regards,
> David
>
> On 2024-03-25 08:29, Tom Marchant wrote:
> > SHARE proceedings are available to SHARE members only. Log in with your
> SHARE user ID.
> >
>
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Re: Ideas for less-distruptive disruptions - Netmaster:Solve and CICS

[Wayne Bickerdike]

David,

I'll see if I have my original presentation. I can send it off list.

Regards,

Wayne

On Tue, Mar 26, 2024 at 12:06 AM David Spiegel <
0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Hi Tom,
> I logged in with SHARE Userid/Password before asking the question.
>
> Regards,
> David
>
> On 2024-03-25 08:29, Tom Marchant wrote:
> > SHARE proceedings are available to SHARE members only. Log in with your
> SHARE user ID.
> >
>
> --
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Re: Ideas for less-distruptive disruptions - Netmaster:Solve and CICS

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Tom Longfellow.

I presented a session at Share in Phoenix in 2019 on the subject of CICS
transactions written in REXX.

https://www.share.org/Events/Past-Events/Proceedings/Proceeding-Details/cics-and-rexx-some-useful-tips-and-tricks

The capability has been around for years. Just happens that nobody bothers
to install the feature (unless it's me, LOL).




On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 6:35 AM Sri Hari Kolusu  wrote:

> >> I see a lot more research in my future.
>
> Tom,
>
> Here is something to get you started.
>
> https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/cics-ts/beta?topic=server-rexxcics-commands
>
> Thanks,
> Kolusu
>
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Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I use Ashampoo Office. It costs around $20. It's like an old version of MS
Office. does the job without being stupidly bloated.

Ashampoo sell a lot of useful products for sound editing, video editing. I
have a bunch of them.

I also have Libre Office.

Office 365 came bundled with my latest Dell laptop. I've just cancelled the
annual subscription. I should do the same with OneDrive and remove it.

On Wed, Feb 21, 2024 at 10:47 AM Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw <
032fff1be9b4-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> I have the CDs.
> I could create an image. I assume you have an activation key.
> Lennie
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of
> Steve Beaver
> Sent: 20 February 2024 22:30
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question
>
> I'd like to find a set Office 2010 of install media
>
> Regards,
>
>
> Steve Beaver
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On
> Behalf Of Pommier, Rex
> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2024 1:06 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question
>
> For my personal use, nope.  Still using 2010.  At work, they're moving us
> to
> 365.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of
> Steve Beaver
> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2024 12:37 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Question
>
> I have run MS Office 2010 for years.
>
>
>
> Has anyone in the group Subscribed to Office 365 since there is
>
> No more MS Office.  I also have my own domain for email
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Steve
>
>
>
>
> --
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Re: IBM Reopens Its Frozen Pension Plan, Saving the Company Millions

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Looks like they are reverting to a Defined Benefit scheme. I never received
anything from IBM after my employment with them in the 70's.

The 401K contribution limits are too low to ensure a comfortable
retirement.

On Wed, Feb 14, 2024 at 5:38 AM zMan <
059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> "The company has stopped making contributions to 401(k) accounts, and
> instead gives workers cash credits in a new version of its old pension
> plan."
>
> https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/09/business/ibm-pension-plan.html
> (login required but surely will be elsewhere as well)
>
> IBM plays more financial engineering games.
> --
> zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it"
>
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Re: Racf Userid

[Wayne Bickerdike]

documented here:

https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/2.3.0?topic=records-record-type-80-racf-processing-record



On Thu, Jan 11, 2024 at 11:21 AM Wayne Bickerdike  wrote:

> SMF type 80 records.
>
> On Thu, Jan 11, 2024 at 8:38 AM Chalk, Shelia  wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> I have a userid abc that was last access in racf on 1/7/24 at 5:06 a.m.
>> Is there a report or something that will tell me who (batch job, script,
>> etc..) is using this userid?
>>
>> Thanks
>> Shelia Chalk
>> Mainframe System Programmer
>> sch...@ssfcu.org
>>
>>
>> ==
>> This email, and any files transmitted with it, is confidential and
>> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which it is
>> addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the
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>> the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this message by
>> mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. If you are not the
>> intended recipient, you are notified that disclosing, copying, distributing
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Re: Racf Userid

[Wayne Bickerdike]

SMF type 80 records.

On Thu, Jan 11, 2024 at 8:38 AM Chalk, Shelia  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I have a userid abc that was last access in racf on 1/7/24 at 5:06 a.m.
> Is there a report or something that will tell me who (batch job, script,
> etc..) is using this userid?
>
> Thanks
> Shelia Chalk
> Mainframe System Programmer
> sch...@ssfcu.org
>
>
> ==
> This email, and any files transmitted with it, is confidential and
> intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which it is
> addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify the
> system manager. This message contains confidential information and is
> intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee,
> you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify
> the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this message by
> mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. If you are not the
> intended recipient, you are notified that disclosing, copying, distributing
> or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this information is
> strictly prohibited.
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Re: allowed characters in member name

[Wayne Bickerdike]

DCB was often used in referbacks, eg DCB=(*.STEP1.MASTER), I'm sure most
modernspeak prefers LIKE. Blame the Beatles.

Yanno what I mean like?

On Mon, Jan 8, 2024 at 9:15 AM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Sun, 7 Jan 2024 21:50:07 +, Gibney, Dave wrote:
>
> >DCB for the subparameters as been depreciated and, in my opinion, bad
> form for most of the 40 years I worked on mainframes. The DCB=modeldscb
> form used for new GDS allocations hasn't been needed since SMS came along.
> Early 90s'?
> >I may recall wrong, but I think LIKE was new with SMS.
> >
> Formerly needed; now deprecated.  Why was it ever needed?  I suspect the
> change
> was less to accommodate SMS than UNIX files, which support attributes but
> no DCB.
>
> Answering my earlier question (IRTFM):
> 
> Example 2
> //SMSDS7  DD  DSNAME=MYDS7.PGM,LIKE=MYDSCAT.PGM,DISP=(NEW,KEEP),
> //  LRECL=1024
> In the example, the data set attributes used for MYDS7.PGM are
> obtained from
> the cataloged model data set MYDSCAT.PGM. Also, the logical record
> length of
> 1024 overrides the logical record length obtained from the model data
> set.
>
> --
> gil
>
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Re: Style (was: LISTDSI - ...)

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I often create a function to deal with quotes. Typically I'll use an
UNQUOTE function and a REQUOTE function. My use of the letter Q was by way
of an example.

MyDSN = UNQUOTE(MyDSN)
MyDSN = REQUOTE(MyDSN)

Use of the STRIP function is recommended too. This is where embedded quotes
can confuse:

STRIP(MyDSN,,"'") or
STRIP(MyDSN,,QuoteChar)

I know which I prefer..

On Sun, Jan 7, 2024 at 1:23 PM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Sun, 7 Jan 2024 01:36:44 +, Seymour J Metz wrote:
>
> >It is a capital error to assume unfamiliarity just because sombody
> eschews a language feature. I am a very heavy user of abuttment in REXX. I
> agree with Wayne that there is a good case for using variables in this
> particular case,
> >
> I agree strongly when a string expression is to be used repeatedly.
> Less so for assigning a single character string to a symbol.
>
> > although I would quarrel with his coice of name. The constructs '"' and
> "'" can be hard to visually distinquisheverywhere they appear. The style
> >
> >apost = "'"
> >uoote = '"'
> >
> (proportional fonts aggravate the problem.)
> >...
> >foo = apost|bar||apost
> >
> A mone mnemonic name (Hungarian notation?) might be:
> fqbar = apost||bar||apost
>
> >concetrrate the problem at the point of definition.
>
> --
> gil
>
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Re: Style (was: LISTDSI - ...)

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Way to miss the point.

On Sun, Jan 7, 2024 at 2:58 AM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Sat, 6 Jan 2024 14:25:09 +1100, Wayne Bickerdike wrote:
>
> >Quoted strings always gave me grief. I started to use Q='7D'X and
> >concatenate my strings this way:
> >
> >Str = Q||DsNAme||Q.
> >LISTDSI(Str)
> >
> I find that less transparent and surely more verbose than:
> LISTDSI( "'"DsNAme"'" ) or even:
> LISTDSI( ''''DsNAme'''' )
>
> Programmers who eschew concatenation by abuttal are
> flaunting their unfamiliarity with the language.
>
> (But how does this play against the wise principle that
> self-defining terms should be assigned to symbols
> rather than used repeatedly:
> TWO = '2'
> SAY TWO + TWO
> ?)
>
> --
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>
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Re: LISTDSI - hardcoded dsn vs. read in from file

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Quoted strings always gave me grief. I started to use Q='7D'X and
concatenate my strings this way:

Str = Q||DsNAme||Q.
LISTDSI(Str)

PROF NOPREFIX works but can leave you that setting when you don't want it
on termination.

On Sat, Jan 6, 2024 at 8:00 AM Willy Jensen 
wrote:

> > . .
> >Unquote: return strip(space(translate(arg(1)," ","'")))
> >
> >Isn't that a verbose equivalent of:
> >return strip( arg( 1 ), 'Both',  )
> Not exactly, the Unquote also removes spaces between the quote and the
> text. It has happened.
>
> >Requote: if arg(1)='' then return '';else return "'"Unquote(arg(1))"'"
> >
> >If arg( 1 ) is a string of blanks, do you want to pass listds()
> >an empty string?
>
> Yes, though one could return something like '*missing name*' I guess
> and/or do a SAY with a message.
>
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Re: CBS's "60 Minutes": Quantum Computing

[Wayne Bickerdike]

The future as we have it now is quite technologically different from when I
started in IT.

Prior to that, I worked in the nuclear physics industry and back in the
60's fusion was a few years off. We still haven't cracked it.

By the late 80's we were debating how fast infrared and wireless bandwidth
could go. None of my peers believed we'd get beyond that of a wired modem.
Bluetooth would look like magic to our former selves.

Disappointed that we don't have safe flying cars..




On Thu, Dec 7, 2023 at 6:40 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> A lot of things have happened in my lifetime that seemed like engineering
> impossibilities, including things that were deemed impossible. On the flip
> side, things that we thought would take only 5 years turned out to be a lot
> harder than we thought. My gut feel is that we will eventually see
> economically viable quantum computers but that there will be false starts
> along the path (pun intended.)
>
> There are certainly hard limits according to current theory, but the
> Planck length is minuscule; we've got a lot of room before we run into it.
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
> עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי
> נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of Phil Smith III 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 6, 2023 2:28 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: CBS's "60 Minutes": Quantum Computing
>
> All the big-brain mathematicians/cryptographers I know are extremely
> skeptical about quantum computing ever becoming a reality. The problems of
> stability are also exponential, and so getting from a few dozen/hundred
> qbits to something big enough to be reasonable may be essentially
> impossible.
>
>
>
> Of course some breakthrough could happen; so could room-temperature
> superconductors, anti-gravity, or a cure for cancer. Tomorrow-or never.
>
>
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Re: Assembler programmer wanted

[Wayne Bickerdike]

When a bank runs an EFTPOS transaction, a fee is charged, all thanks to
some code. When they run a mortgage amortization program, a debit occurs
on  a periodic basis. The whole system of direct debits generates a
transfer of funds from a customer to the code executor...

I could go on

On Mon, Dec 4, 2023 at 7:03 AM Bob Bridges  wrote:

> LOL, the Indians and I would have more work offered to us :).
>
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
> /* I like what the Roman fellow said: “I think nothing human alien to me.”
> When I read of a Mao or a Susan Smith, I try to imagine their temptations,
> not to exculpate them, but to implicate myself. Part of the greatness of
> Macbeth lies in the way it shows terrible crimes from the inside, without
> in the least excusing them.  -Joe Sobran, Dec 1994 */
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Doug Fuerst
> Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 15:37
>
> Maybe we should ask for residuals for our creative property like actors.
> We give it all away too easily.  What would happen if we all went on strike?
>
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Re: Rexx to clone users in RACF

[Wayne Bickerdike]

*Doesn't the RACF ISPF interface have the ability to close a user?*

No, Consul RACF which became z/Secure has that capability. As Radowslaw
says, set up a template or use an ISPF file tailoring skeleton with a set
of templates and generate from a panel.


On Fri, Nov 17, 2023 at 1:55 PM Jon Perryman  wrote:

> On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 08:04:47 +0400, Peter  wrote:
>
> >I am looking for a rexx logic which can multiple RACFID based on one
> model user ?
>
> Doesn't the RACF ISPF interface have the ability to close a user?
>
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Re: PC Interference from shredder Was: Kinda fun

[Wayne Bickerdike]

On the subject of RF interference. Years ago we came back from living in
California to Australia. We had a 110V coffee espresso machine. It worked
well and we ran it from a voltage changer plugged into the socket. Early
rise time, my wife would go into the kitchen and make a coffee.

I'm in the habit of reading my email and surfing at that time (like now in
Australia).

For weeks and months my internet would go off and come back a few
minutes later. I eventually tied it back to the coffee machine/voltage
reducer. We stopped using it and all good. The wireless router runs on
2.4Ghz and is located in my study, maybe 30 feet from the kitchen and there
is a double brick wall in the way.

As an adjunct to this. I switch off my router at midnight and I get much
better sleep.

On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 6:11 AM Joel C. Ewing  wrote:

> I think shielding of the PC itself is unlikely the problem, unless the
> case is not properly closed.  All PCs I have ever seen have metal cases,
> which if properly seated and grounded act as a RF shield, inbound and
> outbound.
>
> Any electric motor could be producing power transients at power on/off
> and possible RF interference from contact arcing (which can increase
> with motor age), which might travel over the house wiring, or via air
> and get picked up by other cables in the room which are connected to the
> PC.  Any magnetic effects of a motor should be minor by comparison.
>
> If it's a large enough motor, start up may produce a temporary dip in
> voltage big enough to be a problem for a computer that is not powered
> through an Uninterruptible Power Supply (UPS).  If you notice any lights
> flicker when the shredder powers up, that definitely could be an issue.
> If you are not already using a UPS for your PC, you probably should be,
> for other reasons as well. The shredder definitely should not be plugged
> into the same outlet as your computer, and it would be best if it were
> on a different house circuit as well.
>
> If the problem only started occurring after adding RAM, maybe the PC
> power supply is now working harder making it more sensitive to power
> dips than before.  It's also possible the computer may be getting old
> enough that the power supply is getting less effective at filtering out RF.
>
> If for some reason the shredder motor is broadcasting more RF
> interference than in the past, keeping it further away from any cables
> connecting devices to the PC may help.  There are also some relatively
> inexpensive ferrite beads that can be clipped onto cables near the
> computer to block RFI from entering via that route.
>
> Assuming you are in a house, the simplest experiment is to try moving
> the shredder to another room far away from the PC where it can be
> powered from a different house circuit.  If that eliminates the problem
> and having the shredder in a different room is acceptable, moving the
> shredder away from the PC may be the simplest short-term solution.
> Otherwise you can either try using a UPS for the PC and/or adding
> ferrite RF filters on PC device cables that don't already include a
> filter, especially if there are any cables that are routed close to the
> shredder.
>
>  JC Ewing
>
>
> On 11/11/23 06:34, Bob Bridges wrote:
> > Hah!  A few years ago I had my hardware-geek son build my latest tower
> PC.  It's pretty good - not water-cooled like the one he made for himself,
> but a nice big monitor and I finally gave him permission to load me up on
> RAM.  But ...
> >
> > Do normal commercial PCs have Faraday cage around them, or something?  I
> can't use my old paper shredder any more, because when it fires up within
> the same room, the PC suddenly dies and has to be rebooted.  A minor EMP, I
> take it.
> >
> > ---
> > Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
> >
> > /* The will to win is not nearly as important as the will to prepare to
> win.  -R.M. Knight */
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> Behalf Of Leonard D Woren
> > Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2023 02:12
> >
> > Long ago I was told why my shop didn't carpet the tape storage area.
> Apparently some shop that did had a problem with unreadable tapes.
> Eventually they figured out that all the unreadable tapes were on the
> bottom row of the tape storage.  And the outside cleaning people used a
> vacuum cleaner...
> >
> > --- Bob Bridges wrote on 11/8/2023 6:56 AM:
> >> /* The more sophisticated the technology, the more vulnerable it is to
> >> primitive attack. People often overlook the obvious.  -Dr Who, 1978 */
> >
> --
> Joel C. Ewing
>
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Re: SORT Help with JFY and SQZ

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Agree, however, it took me less than 2 minutes to add the code for FIELD
card.

I was responding to the original, however, here's the extra code,

OUT2.I = 'RPT FIELD,TABLE,'||Dbname|| VERSION
SAY REC.I
SAY OUT.I
SAY OUT2.I
D
"EXECIO * DISKW  OFILE(STEM OUT. FINIS "
"EXECIO * DISKW  OFILE(STEM OUT2. FINIS "

Adding a return code for an empty file is also trivial.





On Fri, Nov 10, 2023 at 2:28 PM Sri h Kolusu  wrote:

> >> I tried this in REXX, more familiar for me than DFSORT.
>
> Wayne,
>
> Thanks for the REXX code, however, please note that there is additional
> processing.  OP wants to generate 2 different command files and make a copy
> of the input along with setting a return code if the input file is empty,
> so that they can skip further processing.
>
> Rexx is good at some tasks, but it is not good at I/O when compared to
> DFSORT.
>
> Thanks,
> Kolusu
> DFSORT Development
> IBM Corporation
>
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Re: SORT Help with JFY and SQZ

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I would probably use a 26 char ALPHA string and index into that to
avoid the stem variable with the hard coded A to F.

or a Hex to Char based on the suffix value

Been a while since I saw Datacom/DB dictionary output :)

On Fri, Nov 10, 2023 at 1:13 PM Wayne Bickerdike  wrote:

> I tried this in REXX, more familiar for me than DFSORT.
>
> My code:
>
> Stor = ''
> ALPHA.1 = 'A'
> ALPHA.2 = 'B'
> ALPHA.3 = 'C'
> ALPHA.4 = 'D'
> ALPHA.5 = 'E'
> ALPHA.6 = 'F'
> "ALLOC F(IFILE) DA('BDB204.OUTLIST(FROM)') SHR REUSE   "
> "ALLOC F(OFILE) DA('BDB204.OUTLIST(TO)') SHR REUSE   "
>   "EXECIO * DISKR  IFILE(STEM REC. FINIS "
> Suffix = 0
> DO I = 1 TO REC.0
>   Parse Value REC.I ,
>   with DBID . . WORD1 Dbname VERSION .
> If POS(Dbname,Stor) > 0 Then Suffix = Suffix + 1
> Else Suffix = 1
>   Stor = Stor || Dbname
>   OUT.I = 'UTL COPY,TABLE,'||Dbname|| ,
>   VERSION || ','|| WORD1 || RIGHT('000' ||DBID,4) || ALPHA.Suffix
>   SAY REC.I
>   SAY OUT.I
> END
>   "EXECIO * DISKW  OFILE(STEM OUT. FINIS "
>
> 400  B400-DATABASE 1001 BRN   B400-BRANCH-BLDG (1001)
> T
> UTL COPY,TABLE,B400-BRANCH-BLDG(1001),BRN0400A
>
> 400  B400-DATABASE3 HST   B400-TRANHIST  (0003) H
>
> UTL COPY,TABLE,B400-TRANHIST(0003),HST0400A
>
> 400  B400-DATABASE4 HST   B400-TRANHIST  (0004) H
>
> UTL COPY,TABLE,B400-TRANHIST(0004),HST0400B
>
> 400  B400-DATABASE5 HST   B400-TRANHIST  (0005) H
>
> UTL COPY,TABLE,B400-TRANHIST(0005),HST0400C
>
> ***
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 10, 2023 at 4:56 AM Don Johnson <
> 02ee771a0785-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
>> Kolusu, thanks once again! This is now complete and working as I had
>> hoped!
>>
>> Have a good evening!
>> Don
>>
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>
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>
>

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Re: SORT Help with JFY and SQZ

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I tried this in REXX, more familiar for me than DFSORT.

My code:

Stor = ''
ALPHA.1 = 'A'
ALPHA.2 = 'B'
ALPHA.3 = 'C'
ALPHA.4 = 'D'
ALPHA.5 = 'E'
ALPHA.6 = 'F'
"ALLOC F(IFILE) DA('BDB204.OUTLIST(FROM)') SHR REUSE   "
"ALLOC F(OFILE) DA('BDB204.OUTLIST(TO)') SHR REUSE   "
  "EXECIO * DISKR  IFILE(STEM REC. FINIS "
Suffix = 0
DO I = 1 TO REC.0
  Parse Value REC.I ,
  with DBID . . WORD1 Dbname VERSION .
If POS(Dbname,Stor) > 0 Then Suffix = Suffix + 1
Else Suffix = 1
  Stor = Stor || Dbname
  OUT.I = 'UTL COPY,TABLE,'||Dbname|| ,
  VERSION || ','|| WORD1 || RIGHT('000' ||DBID,4) || ALPHA.Suffix
  SAY REC.I
  SAY OUT.I
END
  "EXECIO * DISKW  OFILE(STEM OUT. FINIS "

400  B400-DATABASE 1001 BRN   B400-BRANCH-BLDG (1001) T
UTL COPY,TABLE,B400-BRANCH-BLDG(1001),BRN0400A
400  B400-DATABASE3 HST   B400-TRANHIST  (0003) H
UTL COPY,TABLE,B400-TRANHIST(0003),HST0400A
400  B400-DATABASE4 HST   B400-TRANHIST  (0004) H
UTL COPY,TABLE,B400-TRANHIST(0004),HST0400B
400  B400-DATABASE5 HST   B400-TRANHIST  (0005) H
UTL COPY,TABLE,B400-TRANHIST(0005),HST0400C
***

On Fri, Nov 10, 2023 at 4:56 AM Don Johnson <
02ee771a0785-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Kolusu, thanks once again! This is now complete and working as I had hoped!
>
> Have a good evening!
> Don
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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Re: Kinda fun

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I never used a 3270 in my early career (1975-78). I joined IBM in 1978 and
we still used punch cards built on an 029 card punch. Customers generally
got the technology before IBM internal.

In a team of 20 we had a handful of Series 1 emulating a 3270 and you had
to book a 30 minute session to input your code. That's when I learned the
job deck with a TYPRUN=COPY statement. One way to build up your program
between sessions.

On Thu, Nov 9, 2023 at 6:29 AM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Wed, 8 Nov 2023 13:46:09 -0500, Phil Smith III wrote:
>
> >Stuart Holland wrote, in part:
> >>Also, the cards only had the punches - no text across the top.
> >
> >That was called "interpreting" cards, IIRC. I forget whether there was a
> machine to do this (not that a site with no more punches or readers would
> have had one!), but I bet others here will remember.
> >
> 
> 550 Interpreter?  (Many hits fail with 404.)
> Q   What was the IBM 550?
> A   Introduced in 1930, the IBM 550 Automatic
> Interpreter was the first commercial IBM machine capable of sensing
> numerical data punched in cards and printing such data across the top of
> each card. The information to be printed could be placed in any sequence.
> The machine automatically interpreted at the rate of 75 cards a minute or
> 4,500 cards an hour. The feeding hopper had a capacity of 800 cards, and
> the stacker in which the interpreted cards were deposited had a capacity of
> 1,000 cards.
>
> "placed in any sequence."  But not aligned with the holes, if that
> mattered.
>
> 1930!
>
> --
> gil
>
> --
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Re: PL/X

[Wayne Bickerdike]

So many acronyms.
I've Been Married
I've Been Moved
It's Better Manual
I Broke Microcode

etc..

On Mon, Oct 2, 2023 at 4:17 AM David Spiegel <
0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Hi Peter,
> I was generalizing the problem. Allowing access to PL/ wouyld also
> solve the lack of PDFs.
>
> This reminds me of a joke.
> Q: What does IBM Stand for?
> A: Ich Bin M'shugoh
>
> Regards,
> David
>
> On 2023-09-30 08:18, Peter Relson wrote:
> >> There is another solution
> > What are you thinking the "problem" is for which you mention a
> "solution"? The first post I saw was asking about PDF's, not about access
> to PL/X. Was there a post that did not show up in the daily digest? The
> "access-to-PL/X ship" sailed long ago.
> >
> > Peter Relson
> > z/OS Core Technology Design
> >
> >
> > --
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>
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Re: Utility to Read from JES2 spool

[Wayne Bickerdike]

RGEN X is great. It came in very handy when we had SPOOL output that
emanated from a third party product that was difficult to archive in a
manner that could be retrieved later (Jobname was not meaningful).

Used RGEN X to dissect the output and wrap a meaningful Job name and Job
class around it. Needed an extra IEBGENER step but solved the problem. Hats
off to Rocket.


On Sat, Sep 30, 2023 at 9:59 AM Wayne Bickerdike  wrote:

> For Dinosaurs:
>
> OUT Jobxxx PR(FRED) HOLD KEEP
>
> On Fri, Sep 29, 2023 at 9:03 PM Kirk Wolf  wrote:
>
>> FWIW, Co:Z SFTP has full support for JES spool files, but there are also
>> Co:Z shell commands for using JES2/3.
>>
>> example:
>>
>> *> todsn //intrdr <> *//BR14 JOB 'KIRK',MSGCLASS=X**
>> **// EXEC PGM=IEFBR14**
>> **//**
>> **EOD*
>> todsn(INTRDR)[N]: 67 bytes read; 3 records/240 bytes written in 0.024
>> seconds (2.726 KBytes/sec).
>>
>> *> lsjes
>> *JobidJobname  OwnerStatus   Class Completion
>> JOB00853 BR14 KIRK OUTPUT   A RC=
>> JOB00852 KIRKTKIRK OUTPUT   A RC=
>> JOB00851 KIRKTKIRK OUTPUT   A RC=
>> ...
>>
>> *> fromdsn -JES.J853.all > j853.log*
>> fromdsn(KIRK.BR14.ALL)[N]: 39 records/2476 bytes read; 2515 bytes written
>> in 0.011 seconds (223.278 KBytes/sec).
>>
>>
>> Kirk Wolf
>> Dovetailed Technologies
>> http:// <http://dovetail.com>coztoolkit.com
>>
>> PS>  Thanks to Darren's action, I'm following ibm-main again.
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 29, 2023, at 2:12 PM, Paul Gilmartin wrote:
>> > On Fri, 29 Sep 2023 15:27:37 +, Rob Scott wrote:
>> >
>> > >To generate sample SDSF REXX - issue the "RGEN X" command and choose
>> an example from the list - there are the following including :
>> > >
>> > >Browse job output with EXECIO
>> > >Browse job output with ISFBROWSE
>> > >Browse job output with ISFBROWSE - groups of lines
>> > >
>> > >
>> > +1
>> >
>> > Based on examples in what was then the Admin Ref.  I wrote a Rexx script
>> > that works in OMVS, IRXJCL, or ISPF and unloads (almost) all the spool
>> > data sets of a job into a UNIX hierarchy.
>> >
>> > My narrowminded co-workers deemed it useless.  ("UNIX!?")
>> >
>> > I used IEBGENER rather than EXECIO.  SDSF allocates with (almost)
>> > the right attributes (WAD) and i used alternate ddmame list to override
>> > SYSUT1
>> >
>> > "Almost all"?  There's a JES3 spool file that IEBGENER can't handle.
>> > I bypassed it.
>> >
>> > Residual wishlist items:
>> > o Suss FILEDATA()?  I guessed according to DDNAME.
>> > o Suss CCSID?  Why isn't that a spool data set attribute?  Idea?
>> >
>> > --
>> > gil
>> >
>> > --
>> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>> >
>>
>> --
>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>>
>
>
> --
> Wayne V. Bickerdike
>
>

-- 
Wayne V. Bickerdike

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Re: Utility to Read from JES2 spool

[Wayne Bickerdike]

For Dinosaurs:

OUT Jobxxx PR(FRED) HOLD KEEP

On Fri, Sep 29, 2023 at 9:03 PM Kirk Wolf  wrote:

> FWIW, Co:Z SFTP has full support for JES spool files, but there are also
> Co:Z shell commands for using JES2/3.
>
> example:
>
> *> todsn //intrdr < *//BR14 JOB 'KIRK',MSGCLASS=X**
> **// EXEC PGM=IEFBR14**
> **//**
> **EOD*
> todsn(INTRDR)[N]: 67 bytes read; 3 records/240 bytes written in 0.024
> seconds (2.726 KBytes/sec).
>
> *> lsjes
> *JobidJobname  OwnerStatus   Class Completion
> JOB00853 BR14 KIRK OUTPUT   A RC=
> JOB00852 KIRKTKIRK OUTPUT   A RC=
> JOB00851 KIRKTKIRK OUTPUT   A RC=
> ...
>
> *> fromdsn -JES.J853.all > j853.log*
> fromdsn(KIRK.BR14.ALL)[N]: 39 records/2476 bytes read; 2515 bytes written
> in 0.011 seconds (223.278 KBytes/sec).
>
>
> Kirk Wolf
> Dovetailed Technologies
> http:// coztoolkit.com
>
> PS>  Thanks to Darren's action, I'm following ibm-main again.
>
> On Fri, Sep 29, 2023, at 2:12 PM, Paul Gilmartin wrote:
> > On Fri, 29 Sep 2023 15:27:37 +, Rob Scott wrote:
> >
> > >To generate sample SDSF REXX - issue the "RGEN X" command and choose an
> example from the list - there are the following including :
> > >
> > >Browse job output with EXECIO
> > >Browse job output with ISFBROWSE
> > >Browse job output with ISFBROWSE - groups of lines
> > >
> > >
> > +1
> >
> > Based on examples in what was then the Admin Ref.  I wrote a Rexx script
> > that works in OMVS, IRXJCL, or ISPF and unloads (almost) all the spool
> > data sets of a job into a UNIX hierarchy.
> >
> > My narrowminded co-workers deemed it useless.  ("UNIX!?")
> >
> > I used IEBGENER rather than EXECIO.  SDSF allocates with (almost)
> > the right attributes (WAD) and i used alternate ddmame list to override
> > SYSUT1
> >
> > "Almost all"?  There's a JES3 spool file that IEBGENER can't handle.
> > I bypassed it.
> >
> > Residual wishlist items:
> > o Suss FILEDATA()?  I guessed according to DDNAME.
> > o Suss CCSID?  Why isn't that a spool data set attribute?  Idea?
> >
> > --
> > gil
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


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Re: AI will surpass human intelligence!

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Just quoting a survey proves nothing. Plenty of Muslims became Muslims
because they married a Muslim.

So I guess you can divorce your ethnicity and marry another one.

On Mon, Sep 18, 2023 at 7:29 AM Bob T Roller <
044ef325f6c3-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Johnson is correct.
>
> To U.S. Jews, being Jewish is not just about religion
>
> There is no one way that American Jews think about being Jewish, as the
> survey makes clear. When asked whether being Jewish is mainly a matter of
> religion, ancestry or culture, some Jewish respondents pick each of those
> things, and many choose some combination of them. In fact, among the most
> common answers – expressed by about one-in-five U.S. Jews (19%) – is that
> being Jewish is about religion, ancestry and culture.
>
> Similar shares say being Jewish is mainly a matter of just culture (22%)
> or just ancestry (21%). About half as many (11%) say being Jewish is mainly
> about religion alone. The remainder give other responses, such as that
> being Jewish is about both ancestry and culture (10%).
>
> From Pew research.
>
> https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2021/05/11/jewish-identity-and-belief/
>
> Sent from [Proton Mail](https://proton.me/mail/home) for iOS
>
> On Sat, Sep 16, 2023 at 1:09 AM, g...@gabegold.com <[g...@gabegold.com
> ](mailto:On Sat, Sep 16, 2023 at 1:09 AM, g...@gabegold.com <
> wrote:
>
> > You could also incorrectly "tell" that I didn't have a college degree.
> >
> > You have a talent for gratuitous insults and an obsession with starting
> and then arguing about wild digressions from whatever was the topic at hand.
> >
> > AI to assembler language to system programming demographics is quite the
> meander; each of those would have been worth separate discussions, but not
> in the unpleasant way you bring them up and then harangue anyone who
> disagrees with you.
> >
> > A basic question is why, since you disdain everyone here and disagree
> with most of what people say, you're still here. You're not changing minds,
> not making friends, not providing useful information, and not contributing
> anything. You're excellent at trolling though, which seems to be your sad
> reason for being. So you're entertaining, in a ghastly sort of way.
> >
> > On Fri, 15 Sep 2023 18:33:25 +, Bill Johnson 
> wrote:
> >
> >>Are you that naive? Ever been to Share? The current makeup of mainframe
> systems programmers is 65% white, 15% Asian, 9% Hispanic & 5% African
> American. Factoring in most of the heavy posters are over 50, the
> demographics are even more white since almost all systems programmers who
> got into IT in the 50’s through the 70’s were almost exclusively white.
> Guess what? I can also tell which people are Jewish, Asian, Hispanic,
> Scandinavian, Irish, and most other ethnicities. That’s not nearly as easy
> but it’s not as difficult as you’d think. I’d bet Oujeski isn’t a black
> guy. My Father in Law’s name was Majewski.
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>
> --
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>


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Re: AI will surpass human intelligence!

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Johnson doesn't understand the difference between ethnicity and religion.
How surprising.

On Mon, Sep 18, 2023 at 4:44 AM Bill Johnson <
0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Ok, you’re right, as your fragile ego needs.
>
> As I stated, and proved, I can tell most people’s color and ethnicity just
> using their names. It’s not hard. Most people can do it. I’m neither
> Buddhist or Christian.
>
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>
>
> On Sunday, September 17, 2023, 1:22 PM, Seymour J Metz 
> wrote:
>
> I know what you told me. As usual, you're dodging the question and lying
> about those who disagree with you. Saying that I'm Jewish Isn't any closer
> to identifying my ethnicity than saying that You're Buddhist or Christian.
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of Bill Johnson <0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2023 12:55 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: AI will surpass human intelligence!
>
> I already told you, you’re Jewish. Just like most people can tell I’m
> Swedish. But, you can’t tell where in Sweden my ancestors came. Just as I
> can’t tell (without more research) where your ancestors are from.
>
> As usual, you like to try to prove me wrong. And can’t.
>
> African Americans are more difficult. Because most have names derived from
> or taken from their slave owners. And tracing their roots is almost
> impossible since there is little paper trail. Most traces end in their
> arrival on the east coast. That’s not much of a problem here. There’s not
> many African American systems programmers.
>
> You should watch “Finding Your Roots”. Excellent series. I love
> educational programming.
>
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>
>
> On Sunday, September 17, 2023, 12:45 PM, Seymour J Metz 
> wrote:
>
> The question is whether you can, as you claimed, determine my origins from
> my name. You can probably determine whether I am Ashkenazi, Mizrachi or
> Sephardi, but beyond that it is not as easy as you believe.
>
> For that matter, can you tell from his name whether an American-born
> citizen has ancestry from Benin versus Gambia versus Ghana vversus Guinea?
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of Bill Johnson <0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2023 12:32 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: AI will surpass human intelligence!
>
> You should read some history of the Jewish ghettos of Europe. Also read up
> on the pope declaring “Cum nimis absurdum”. You got to love the Christians
> right? An excerpt.
>
> In 1555, Pope Paul IV issued the “Cum nimis absurdum” proclamation, which
> required the Jews of Rome to live in separate quarters and also severely
> restricted their rights, including what businesses they could engage in.
> The purpose of this edict was to encourage conversion to Catholicism, an
> act that would serve as a ticket out of the ghetto. The ghetto made a clear
> distinction to the wider society between those who were accepted” and those
> who were not. Though anti-Semitism was alive and well in the centuries that
> preceded this papal order, until 1555 the Jews of Rome had enjoyed freedom
> of movement. Under the papal order, they were relocated to a crowded and
> unsanitary area that regularly was flooded by the Tiber River. While the
> ghetto was a place of squalor, the rest of the city was being built up with
> magnificent churches. This contrast allowed the authorities to highlight
> the differences between Jews and Christians, making it seem as though the
> destitute living conditions of the ghetto were the natural consequences of
> denying the divinity of Christ. Though the ghetto was designed to segregate
> Jews, who were seen as a threat to Catholicism, it did not stop Jews and
> Christians from maintaining social and economic interactions; indeed
> Christians were allowed to enter the Roman ghetto during the day.
>
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>
>
> On Sunday, September 17, 2023, 11:50 AM, Bill Johnson <
> 0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
> I’ll guarantee you’re Jewish. There aren’t many Irish kids with the first
> name Shmuel. Are you really equating the degree comments as something I can
> determine in actuality? Really? Snowdon is from the old English meaning
> snow hill. (Snow dun) Williams is from old German. (Wilhelm) It’s easy to
> tell most people’s ethnicity from their names.
>
> Here’s some help for you.
>
>
> https://secure-web.cisco.com/1UYI-6B0pT8CfY2vwZ5Cak5kS32Ue-VZ0Y0U22Q5CiZ2CJZ9rvI89gSWf_dA9KtORFKLx14XsQ8JYWVmAlTg5kt_EAIz4sjSFHgaXxZLdeb9z3TN1Lp___CdnPd4he268_eyYVOLkNTMcRD8O5QmDjFtKnx0c0wEqZRpnoIUtrmWSWGBzcXStK6RVqXgZFSfWZXH073HeTxE8wXQtEx4eDVMrHMbQJF31Uqi0fX_h8VAWw8dtRm5XS2DTV9lT46D-ZbmMBcxARaUHlWMDd7Zp2ot0YUMB6X5d-hBpEL0xpiIRvT9y_-rZ2U81JZ9CuCBkbAxETWX866XSMD9fd07RDmgpCH_zITdsVICzNR9_N

Re: Is the IBM Assembler List still alive - Dumps - Early days

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I used ROSCOE in a couple of sites. Once you got used to it, it was better
than TSO EDIT with the same footprint.

RPF was easier to master than ISPF/PDF and it had a lot of similarities
with REXX.

I regressed back to a DOS/VSE shop for a while. A 4331 with 1 MB of memory.
We managed to run CICS with ADABAS and write all the code in PL/I. ICCF was
our only editor. It was a dog. A few years later I found myself in another
VSE shop and they had VOLLIE. Way better than ICCF.

On Fri, Sep 8, 2023 at 10:42 AM Roberto Halais 
wrote:

> This list is becoming like Tik Tok. Enough.
>
> On Thu, Sep 7, 2023 at 8:37 PM Lance D. Jackson <
> ljack...@pandrueassociates.com> wrote:
>
> > UNSUBSCRIBE- I'm OUT!  You guys go on far too long about stories no one
> > else is interested in.  You should consider taking these drawn out
> > discussions offline.
> >
> > > On 07/09/2023 15:56 EDT Leonard D Woren 
> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > What was the first OS that you had a 2 MB TSO region?  What hardware.
> > >
> > > MVT TSO on the 4 MB 360/91 at UCLA was about 3/4 MB .  There was a lot
> > > you could do, although it was slow.  I did experiment with overlay
> > > modules though.  Bleah.
> > >
> > > The reason you could do a lot in 3/4 MB is that it was done in
> > > efficient languages, like Assembler.  None of these modern bloatware
> > > languages that make every app on my phone 32 MB minimum, and often up
> > > to 500 MB.
> > >
> > > /Leonard
> > >
> > >
> > > Seymour J Metz wrote on 9/7/2023 3:32 AM:
> > > > I never had TSO in less than 2 MiB; 768 KiB gives me shudders.
> > > >
> > > > 
> > > > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on
> > behalf of Clem Clarke 
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, September 6, 2023 6:38 AM
> > > > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > > > Subject: Re: Is the IBM Assembler List still alive - Dumps - Early
> days
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Running TSO in 3/4 of a meg was interesting.  And VERY slow.
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
>
> --
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>


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Re: SDSF REXX Question

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Lionel,

Does the storage not dropped create a problem? Or is this just a thing you
want cleaned up?

On Thu, Sep 7, 2023 at 4:02 AM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Wed, 6 Sep 2023 13:46:25 -0400, Phil Smith III wrote:
> >
> >This is not meant to be snide, just a citation of sorts: these behaviors
> were discussed long ago when Rexx was introduced to VM/CMS, are established
> canon. (Is that redundant? Can there be UNestablished canon?)
> >
> I used to know that.  Perhaps I saw it in the (CMS?) Ref.  That has gotten
> thicker and harder to search.  I see no information about storage in:
> 
>
> And I once considered writing an asynchronous ATTACH and find no
> description of whether REXX storage compaction is likely to move
> storage addressed by IRXEXCOM.  I use SYSCALL SPAWN instead.
>
> --
> gil
>
> --
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Re: Simple request from chatGPT to write assembler program.

[Wayne Bickerdike]

How can Bombastic Bill have worked all those years and never worked in a
RACF shop? VSE shops never had RACF, however, RACF has had the Lion's share
for years.

On Thu, Sep 7, 2023 at 5:32 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> Yes, assemblers came first, but <
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laning_and_Zierler_system> was well before
> FORTRAN. I' not sure whether to cite the earlier <
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plankalk%C3%BCl>, as it was never
> implemented.
>
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of Bernd Oppolzer 
> Sent: Wednesday, September 6, 2023 3:02 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Simple request from chatGPT to write assembler program.
>
> Ok ... not quire correct, but:
> the first ASSEMBLER languages go back to the years 1947 to 1951, if my
> sources are right;
> there was some sort of ASSEMBLER for the 701 (which was available in
> 1953, IIRC).
> The first HLL was Fortran, IMO, which should be 1956 ca.
> So there are some years in the 1950 time frame, where ASSEMBLER was the
> only choice;
> that's what I am talking about.
> IIRC, in the first years of HLLs, there were some debates that HLLs are
> not usable because of
> the poor code the compilers generated at that time. This was true even
> in the 1960s for the
> first versions of PL/1.
> Kind regards
> Bernd
>
>
> Am 06.09.2023 um 17:55 schrieb Seymour J Metz:
> >> because in the 1950s and 1960s,
> >> it was the only language we had.
> > ?
> >
> > COBOL
> > COMIT
> > FACT
> > FARGO
> > FORTRAN
> > IPL-V
> > LISP
> > PL/I
> > RPG
> > SNOBOL
> >
> >
>
> --
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Re: Simple request from chatGPT to write assembler program.

[Wayne Bickerdike]

My favourite use of Assembler was an E15 sort exit. I developed it to
enable access to CA-Datacom database tables. It was originally written for
a VSE shop and it proved to be so useful (and fast), I maintained the code
when I worked in MVS shops. It was enhanced over the years to be condensed
down to a single macro with parameters to define the table name and
optional key. For those familiar with Datacom, there are two simple fast
retrieval commands, GETPS (get physical) and GETIT (get in key sequence).

My final version used a parameter that enabled a single exit to cover any
table required, the parameter defined LRECL, Key name, table name. I don't
think an exit like this could be developed in COBOL without jumping through
hoops to perform the parsing required.

A classic example of how to process large tables in batch.

On Wed, Sep 6, 2023 at 5:30 PM Bernd Oppolzer 
wrote:

> Thanks a lot,
>
> it would be always better to give even a very small ASSEMBLER program a
> test run
> instead of simply posting it to a public web site.
> I will fix this on Wikipedia as soon as I can.
>
> I'm not sure if ASSEMBLER should be used by humans :-) given this episode.
> In fact, it was used in the past (heavily), because in the 1950s and
> 1960s, it was the only language we had.
> And it is still used on Mainframes (some say: Mainframe Assembler is the
> only usable Assembler, all others are not)
> and as long as we have large code bases in Assembler, there is no other
> way than supporting it
> (and we have large code bases, this is what John Ehrman once told me ...
> most customers who still have that
> don't want to talk about it).
>
> Anyway: the reasons to learn it (like: to understand the code produced
> by other language translators better etc.
> and to understand language translators, BTW) are very valid, and that's
> what Ray Mullins (liebe Grüße)
> tells in his papers, too, if I understand him right.
>
> Another fun story:
>
> Once a co-worker of mine (at the large insurance company mentioned
> earlier) had a problem with IBM software,
> and while communicating with IBM, he posted a bit of ASSEMBLER code
> showing the error, and the answer of
> IBM support was "Customer should not use ASSEMBLER" :-)
>
> Kind regards
> Bernd
>
>
> Am 06.09.2023 um 05:44 schrieb Tom Brennan:
> > Your sample assembled fine but abended 0C1.  I made some minor mods.
> > Hope you don't mind my pretend German in the comments :)
> >
> > The biggest problem is trying to use R15 as a base.  That gets messed
> > up by OPEN.  The other problem is LA instead of L when loading R13 for
> > the return.  I mix those up a lot myself.
> >
> > https://www.mildredbrennan.com/mvs/hello.png
> >
> > P.S. My wife and I were in München last May.  Beautiful city and it
> > was fun trying to understand the language based on a high-school class.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 9/5/2023 6:19 PM, Bernd Oppolzer wrote:
> >> FWIW:
> >>
> >> ChatGPT could have used this ASSEMBLER program, which I posted some
> >> years ago
> >> to German Wikpedia ... this does not do the addition of two integers,
> >> but instead it
> >> is a simple Hello World program. In contrast to the program provided
> >> by ChatGPT,
> >> it has no errors (I hope) and it will work.
> >>
> >>
> https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_von_Hallo-Welt-Programmen/Assembler#IBM-Mainframe-ASSEMBLER
> >>
> >>
> >> Kind regards
> >>
> >> Bernd
> >>
> >
> > --
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Re: Simple request from chatGPT to write assembler program.

[Wayne Bickerdike]

ChatGPT could have written the requirement in PL/I, compiled and produced
the Assembler listing. The Assembler generated would work, albeit
incredibly wordy.

It does appear that the PUT macro was confused usage of a PL/I PUT
statement.

No conversion attempted to get from full word to a displayable format (CVD,
UNPK).



On Wed, Sep 6, 2023 at 6:06 AM Tom Marchant <
000a2a8c2020-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Nor does it know how to code instructions.
>
> I don't know what this should be, but it isn't adequateor correct:
> >MAIN C  0NUM1   Check if NUM1 is zero
>
> ZERO is not a label on code:
> >  BE ZEROBranch to ZERO if true
>
> NUM1 is not a DCB address
> >  GETNUM1,NUMIN  Read NUM1 from input
>
> Wrong:
> >  LA 0,NUM1  Load NUM1 into register
>
> NUM2 is not a DCB address:
> > GETNUM2,NUMIN  Read NUM2 from input
>
> NUM1 is not a register number:
> >  A  NUM1,NUM2   Add NUM1 and NUM2
> >  ST NUM1,RESULT Store the result in RESULT
>
> RESULT is not a DCB address:
> >  PUTRESULT,NUMOUT   Print the result
>
> --
> Tom Marchant
>
> On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 14:10:20 -0400, David Spiegel 
> wrote:
>
> >Hi Tom,
> >It looks like ChatGPT is not aware of "Housekeeping".
> >
> >Regards,
> >David
> >
> >On 2023-09-05 13:47, Tom Brennan wrote:
> >> GET and PUT use R14, so as Tom Marchant said, if the program managed
> >> to get that far it would never return to the OS.
>
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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Is SMP/E needed for installs?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

The wheel has turned full circle. When I worked at IBM UK in 1978 we had a
JOBPROC statement.

It was internal code developed by one of our systems programmers. It worked
but sometimes broke.

On Fri, Sep 1, 2023 at 4:58 AM Tom Brennan 
wrote:

> Thanks, I forgot about that.  But we may have known it at one time,
> because I "think" we coded our exit 4 conversion from PROCLIB to JCLLIB
> with that in mind.
>
> On 8/31/2023 10:50 AM, Gibney, Dave wrote:
> > EasyProclib did DD concatenations.
>
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Re: Availability of "Orphanware"?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Tim,

I worked for ICI from 1969 to 1978. Do you know which division wrote WRS?
We had quite a few divisions that had mainframes. Central Management
Services held sway for quite some time. I was at Fibres division and we
used to time share until we installed our first 370 in 1975.

There are not many folks around from those days, although I know of one guy
who worked at Doncaster works before moving to Fibres HQ in Harrogate. I
had stints in Harrogate, Wilton and Billingham. Fibres and petrochemicals.
We also had dealings with Dyestuffs division in Huddersfield.

We also ran works payroll for Pontypool on an IBM 1130. Took a while to run!

On Wed, Aug 30, 2023 at 10:17 PM Timothy Sipples  wrote:

> I'm wondering what the status is of the following software:
>
> 1. The Works Record System (WRS), developed by ICI in the United Kingdom.
> First version in 1974. One report suggests it was still used as late as
> 2001.
>
> 2. ExecuCalc, developed by Parallax Systems and first released in 1982.
> ExecuCalc was similar to VisiCalc – and file format compatible according to
> the advertising. Available first for VM/CMS, then for MVS/TSO in 1983.
> Apparently supported color GDDM graphics by about mid-1983.
>
> 3. WordPerfect/370. This version used the WordPerfect Version 4.2 base
> plus some enhancements such as additional printer drivers. Available for
> both VM/CMS and MVS.
>
> —
> Timothy Sipples
> Senior Architect
> Digital Assets, Industry Solutions, and Cybersecurity
> IBM zSystems/LinuxONE, Asia-Pacific
> sipp...@sg.ibm.com
>
>
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Re: Creating an SMP install tape

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I used to package a software product I maintained. It was a simple
template. We built the SMPE zones, defined the FMID and APPLY / ACCEPT.
Load modules and macros were in PDS form. It wasn't "difficult".

Clem can email me off list if I can help.

On Thu, Aug 24, 2023 at 6:28 AM Phil Smith III  wrote:

> Clem Clarke wrote, in part:
> >I have some PDSes that need to be installed with SMP on Z/OS.
> > What would be the easiest way to create a files that can be installed
>
> >with SMP?
>
>
>
> As others have perhaps made clear, "SMP/E" and "easiest" do not belong in
> the same sentence, for the most part.
>
>
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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Has anyone

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I use both Libre Office and Ashampoo office. The Ashampoo products are like
MS-Office used to be. Not overloaded with features I don't need and each
component offers compatible file formats with MS-Office. Costs about $20. I
have a number of other Ashampoo products for disk backup, video editing,
audio editing and photo processing.

There is a free version for their Office suite too.

On Wed, Aug 16, 2023 at 5:46 AM Charles Mills  wrote:

> I use it. I have nothing to really compare it to, but it does the job for
> me. Supports EBCDIC.
>
> Charles
>
> On Tue, 15 Aug 2023 22:16:16 +, Pommier, Rex 
> wrote:
>
> >I highly recommend "HxD hex edit".
>
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Re: The ultimate (another one!) definition of mainframe

[Wayne Bickerdike]

A bigger head beats a bigger mouth every time. Johnson by name Johnson by
nature.

Yeah, I found this on the internet too:

Noun[edit
<https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=johnson&action=edit§ion=4>]

*johnson* (*plural* *johnsons
<https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/johnsons#English>*)

   1. (slang <https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Glossary#slang>) Penis
   <https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/penis>. quotations ▼synonym ▲Synonyms:
   *see* Thesaurus:penis <https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Thesaurus:penis>


On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:33 AM Wayne Bickerdike  wrote:

> Way to miss the point Bill. Do you write programs that miss out things
> because they can be easily found on the internet?
>
> On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:23 AM Bill Johnson <
> 0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
>> https://www.itprotoday.com/compute-engines/windows-nt-and-vms-rest-story
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>>
>>
>> On Monday, August 14, 2023, 7:17 PM, Wayne Bickerdike 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Windows NT came from the VAX guys, I think.
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:15 AM Wayne Bickerdike 
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > *The facts. According to Bill Johnson.American computer programmer
>> Timothy
>> > Paterson, a developer for Seattle Computer Products, wrote the original
>> > operating system for the Intel Corporation’s 8086 microprocessor in
>> 1980,
>> > initially calling it QDOS (Quick and Dirty Operating System), which was
>> > soon renamed 86-DOS. A year later, fledgling company Microsoft
>> > purchased exclusive rights to sell the system, renamed MS-DOS, to IBM
>> for
>> > their newly developed IBM-PC. IBM-compatible versions were marketed as
>> > PC-DOS. Version 1.0 was released in 1981; additional upgraded versions
>> kept
>> > pace with the rapidly evolving PC. Windows 95, introduced by Microsoft
>> in
>> > 1995, incorporated MS-DOS 7.0 but ultimately superseded the MS-DOS
>> > platform. Starting with Windows NT, Microsoft’s operating systems were
>> > designed independently of MS-DOS, though they were capable of running
>> some
>> > MS-DOS applications.*
>> >
>> > Facts but missing lots of pivotal events. No mention of Gary Kildall.
>> > Windows 2.0 was a brief look at a Windows O/S. Windows 3.0 preceded WIN
>> 95
>> > as did Windows 3.1.
>> >
>> > Really who cares?
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:09 AM Jon Perryman 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >>  > On Monday, August 14, 2023 at 03:15:12 PM PDT, Grant Taylor wrote:
>> >>
>> >> On 8/14/23 3:16 PM, Bob Bridges wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > My hang up is that -- as I understand it -- DOS was /never/ IBM's to
>> >> start with.
>> >>
>> >> > DOS was /Microsoft's.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Again, if you want some insights, you can watch
>> >> https://youtu.be/Qc5khH5gllg?t=339 that seems to be the prevalent
>> story.
>> >> Is this different from the story as you understand it?
>> >>
>> >> 1. MS-DOS did not exist prior to IBM / Bill Gates meeting.
>> >>
>> >> 2. IBM wanted a new OS. IBM contractred Gates to create this OS which
>> was
>> >> to be called PC DOS.
>> >>
>> >> 3. Because IBM was gun shy from anti-trust lawsuits, it chose to
>> exclude
>> >> ownership of PC DOS thus allowing PC-DOS to be sold as MS-DOS by
>> Microsoft.
>> >>
>> >> Microsoft was not the sole owner of DOS. One piece of software was
>> owned
>> >> by IBM and Microsoft. It was IBM's choice not to retain sole ownership
>> of
>> >> DOS.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> >> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Wayne V. Bickerdike
>> >
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Wayne V. Bickerdike
>>
>> --
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>>
>>
>>
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>
>
> --
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>
>

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Re: The ultimate (another one!) definition of mainframe

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Way to miss the point Bill. Do you write programs that miss out things
because they can be easily found on the internet?

On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:23 AM Bill Johnson <
0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> https://www.itprotoday.com/compute-engines/windows-nt-and-vms-rest-story
>
>
>
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>
>
> On Monday, August 14, 2023, 7:17 PM, Wayne Bickerdike 
> wrote:
>
> Windows NT came from the VAX guys, I think.
>
> On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:15 AM Wayne Bickerdike 
> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > *The facts. According to Bill Johnson.American computer programmer
> Timothy
> > Paterson, a developer for Seattle Computer Products, wrote the original
> > operating system for the Intel Corporation’s 8086 microprocessor in 1980,
> > initially calling it QDOS (Quick and Dirty Operating System), which was
> > soon renamed 86-DOS. A year later, fledgling company Microsoft
> > purchased exclusive rights to sell the system, renamed MS-DOS, to IBM for
> > their newly developed IBM-PC. IBM-compatible versions were marketed as
> > PC-DOS. Version 1.0 was released in 1981; additional upgraded versions
> kept
> > pace with the rapidly evolving PC. Windows 95, introduced by Microsoft in
> > 1995, incorporated MS-DOS 7.0 but ultimately superseded the MS-DOS
> > platform. Starting with Windows NT, Microsoft’s operating systems were
> > designed independently of MS-DOS, though they were capable of running
> some
> > MS-DOS applications.*
> >
> > Facts but missing lots of pivotal events. No mention of Gary Kildall.
> > Windows 2.0 was a brief look at a Windows O/S. Windows 3.0 preceded WIN
> 95
> > as did Windows 3.1.
> >
> > Really who cares?
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:09 AM Jon Perryman 
> wrote:
> >
> >>  > On Monday, August 14, 2023 at 03:15:12 PM PDT, Grant Taylor wrote:
> >>
> >> On 8/14/23 3:16 PM, Bob Bridges wrote:
> >>
> >> > My hang up is that -- as I understand it -- DOS was /never/ IBM's to
> >> start with.
> >>
> >> > DOS was /Microsoft's.
> >>
> >>
> >> Again, if you want some insights, you can watch
> >> https://youtu.be/Qc5khH5gllg?t=339 that seems to be the prevalent
> story.
> >> Is this different from the story as you understand it?
> >>
> >> 1. MS-DOS did not exist prior to IBM / Bill Gates meeting.
> >>
> >> 2. IBM wanted a new OS. IBM contractred Gates to create this OS which
> was
> >> to be called PC DOS.
> >>
> >> 3. Because IBM was gun shy from anti-trust lawsuits, it chose to exclude
> >> ownership of PC DOS thus allowing PC-DOS to be sold as MS-DOS by
> Microsoft.
> >>
> >> Microsoft was not the sole owner of DOS. One piece of software was owned
> >> by IBM and Microsoft. It was IBM's choice not to retain sole ownership
> of
> >> DOS.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> >> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Wayne V. Bickerdike
> >
> >
>
> --
> Wayne V. Bickerdike
>
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>
>
>
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Re: The ultimate (another one!) definition of mainframe

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Windows NT came from the VAX guys, I think.

On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:15 AM Wayne Bickerdike  wrote:

>
>
> *The facts. According to Bill Johnson.American computer programmer Timothy
> Paterson, a developer for Seattle Computer Products, wrote the original
> operating system for the Intel Corporation’s 8086 microprocessor in 1980,
> initially calling it QDOS (Quick and Dirty Operating System), which was
> soon renamed 86-DOS. A year later, fledgling company Microsoft
> purchased exclusive rights to sell the system, renamed MS-DOS, to IBM for
> their newly developed IBM-PC. IBM-compatible versions were marketed as
> PC-DOS. Version 1.0 was released in 1981; additional upgraded versions kept
> pace with the rapidly evolving PC. Windows 95, introduced by Microsoft in
> 1995, incorporated MS-DOS 7.0 but ultimately superseded the MS-DOS
> platform. Starting with Windows NT, Microsoft’s operating systems were
> designed independently of MS-DOS, though they were capable of running some
> MS-DOS applications.*
>
> Facts but missing lots of pivotal events. No mention of Gary Kildall.
> Windows 2.0 was a brief look at a Windows O/S. Windows 3.0 preceded WIN 95
> as did Windows 3.1.
>
> Really who cares?
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:09 AM Jon Perryman  wrote:
>
>>  > On Monday, August 14, 2023 at 03:15:12 PM PDT, Grant Taylor wrote:
>>
>> On 8/14/23 3:16 PM, Bob Bridges wrote:
>>
>> > My hang up is that -- as I understand it -- DOS was /never/ IBM's to
>> start with.
>>
>> > DOS was /Microsoft's.
>>
>>
>> Again, if you want some insights, you can watch
>> https://youtu.be/Qc5khH5gllg?t=339 that seems to be the prevalent story.
>> Is this different from the story as you understand it?
>>
>> 1. MS-DOS did not exist prior to IBM / Bill Gates meeting.
>>
>> 2. IBM wanted a new OS. IBM contractred Gates to create this OS which was
>> to be called PC DOS.
>>
>> 3. Because IBM was gun shy from anti-trust lawsuits, it chose to exclude
>> ownership of PC DOS thus allowing PC-DOS to be sold as MS-DOS by Microsoft.
>>
>> Microsoft was not the sole owner of DOS. One piece of software was owned
>> by IBM and Microsoft. It was IBM's choice not to retain sole ownership of
>> DOS.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>>
>
>
> --
> Wayne V. Bickerdike
>
>

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Re: The ultimate (another one!) definition of mainframe

[Wayne Bickerdike]

*The facts. According to Bill Johnson.American computer programmer Timothy
Paterson, a developer for Seattle Computer Products, wrote the original
operating system for the Intel Corporation’s 8086 microprocessor in 1980,
initially calling it QDOS (Quick and Dirty Operating System), which was
soon renamed 86-DOS. A year later, fledgling company Microsoft
purchased exclusive rights to sell the system, renamed MS-DOS, to IBM for
their newly developed IBM-PC. IBM-compatible versions were marketed as
PC-DOS. Version 1.0 was released in 1981; additional upgraded versions kept
pace with the rapidly evolving PC. Windows 95, introduced by Microsoft in
1995, incorporated MS-DOS 7.0 but ultimately superseded the MS-DOS
platform. Starting with Windows NT, Microsoft’s operating systems were
designed independently of MS-DOS, though they were capable of running some
MS-DOS applications.*

Facts but missing lots of pivotal events. No mention of Gary Kildall.
Windows 2.0 was a brief look at a Windows O/S. Windows 3.0 preceded WIN 95
as did Windows 3.1.

Really who cares?


On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 6:09 AM Jon Perryman  wrote:

>  > On Monday, August 14, 2023 at 03:15:12 PM PDT, Grant Taylor wrote:
>
> On 8/14/23 3:16 PM, Bob Bridges wrote:
>
> > My hang up is that -- as I understand it -- DOS was /never/ IBM's to
> start with.
>
> > DOS was /Microsoft's.
>
>
> Again, if you want some insights, you can watch
> https://youtu.be/Qc5khH5gllg?t=339 that seems to be the prevalent story.
> Is this different from the story as you understand it?
>
> 1. MS-DOS did not exist prior to IBM / Bill Gates meeting.
>
> 2. IBM wanted a new OS. IBM contractred Gates to create this OS which was
> to be called PC DOS.
>
> 3. Because IBM was gun shy from anti-trust lawsuits, it chose to exclude
> ownership of PC DOS thus allowing PC-DOS to be sold as MS-DOS by Microsoft.
>
> Microsoft was not the sole owner of DOS. One piece of software was owned
> by IBM and Microsoft. It was IBM's choice not to retain sole ownership of
> DOS.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
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Re: z/OS users

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Bank tellers do log on when they start work. Most of these scenarios
require a unique ID and if they hand over for breaks, they log off and a
relief teller will log on with a different ID.

There is generally a "supervisor" override. It used to be a physical key
they inserted and the teller software would detect this and elevate a
privilege, such as writing out a bank cheque (counter cheque or check for
you Yanks).

Similar things exist at supermarket checkouts and we would all have had the
supervisor come over if you didn't place your item in the bagging area.

As for the sysprog/application programmer discus. In the 1970s when I
joined the game, sysprog was either a clerical task or a very intense
assembler programming task. It could be either, however, IBM had the gurus
and the customer followed their best advice.



On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 2:06 AM Jon Perryman  wrote:

>  > On Monday, August 14, 2023 at 07:14:36 AM PDT, Phil Smith III <
> li...@akphs.com> wrote:
> > How many users do sites typically have these days?
> > In 1986, University of Waterloo had over 20,000 VM users
>
> z/OS is a server and as such, user counts are often irrelevant. TSO, IMS,
> Unix and CICS can have associated userids which is 1 person affect by 1
> userid. On the other hand, credit card transaction exceed 100M per day but
> it's not 100M people affected because people often use their credit card
> multiple times in a day. You will never know how many users of DB2 are
> affected when SAP is responsible for managing users. Unless you know every
> aspect of your z/OS, you can't say how many people (not users) are affected.
>
>
>
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Re: The ultimate (another one!) definition of mainframe

[Wayne Bickerdike]

IBM never showed enough interest or vision in microcomputer futures.

I quit IBM in 1979 to work with some former colleagues on microcomputer
software development. My IBM manager would have walked me if I had been
joining a competitor. This was the rule of the day. He said to me, "I don't
ever see IBM getting into that market, you can work out your notice period"
, (4 weeks).

At that time, there was no IBM PC, IBM was DP or OP (Data processing or
Office products). I worked for OP in software implementation for internal
systems. DP always assumed the senior position when bidding for sales. We
had the Series/1, System 34/38, Photocopiers, Selectric etc. Not hard to
see why IBM had no futurist identifying the "personal computer". It was
monolithic thinking. That's the SNA mindset, one big hub with dumb
terminals. It worked well but missed a lot of potential for small business
and artisans.

So we as a small business took on the challenge. We had CP/M, MP/M, Apple
Basic, NorthStar Horizon, Cromemco, early MicroFocus COBOL and 8080
Assembler to master. Long nights reading Dr Dobbs journal for hints. It was
challenging and we found it hard to make money. There was no venture
capital, all the money was still in box shifting. One big customer saw our
Catering stock control system and said, "Is it 3270 compatible?". LOL.

After a few years of trying, we went back to mainframe consulting and that
served me well for another forty years.

Somebody once said, "It's the vision thing". That and luck and timing.

On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 5:15 AM Grant Taylor <
023065957af1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On 8/14/23 3:16 PM, Bob Bridges wrote:
> > I sort of agree, but I think underneath we still disagree.  I agree
> > that IBM didn't think the PC software was worth developing.  And if
> > they had held onto MS-DOS and approached its development in the same
> > way that Microsoft did, sure, they'd probably be worth bazillions.
>
> My hang up is that -- as I understand it -- DOS was /never/ IBM's to
> start with.
>
> DOS was /Microsoft's/.
>
> Or are you suggesting that IBM should have purchased exclusive rights to
> use / distribute / etc DOS from Microsoft?
>
>
>
> Grant. . . .
>
> --
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Re: ISPF in batch

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I've used an EDIT macro in 3.4. Not sure what the OP is trying to do.

I have one REXX exec called ALLMEM which prompts for a macro name and it
applies a global edit to each member of a selected PDS.

I've used it in batch too as a poor man's FileAid or Filemanager.

On Fri, Aug 11, 2023 at 7:05 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> What are you tring to do? What's wrong with ADDRESS ISPEXEC EDIT ...
> within an ISPF script??
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf
> of Steve Beaver [050e0c375a14-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2023 12:04 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: ISPF in batch
>
> Do any one of the group have any experience editing a file under 3.4
>
> And executing an Init MACRO
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
>
>
> Steve
>
>
>
>
> --
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Re: Subject: Re: [EXT] Re: Cloud may be overpriced compared to on-premises systems

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I've driven on a few continents, Asia is basically watch out, there is no
"right of way".

Australia has terrible lane discipline, overtaking on the near side, people
braking when they see a speed camera on a freeway, limited use of turn
signals.

USA has better roads than Australia, people drive faster, tailgate about
the same as Australians.

The UK used to have very good driving habits but massive immigration has
led to a lowering of standards.

As for wind affecting vehicles, when I lived in the UK, I had a double
decker bus get blown into my path while I was overtaking. It was a day with
gale force winds, which are common and very destructive. The driver was
apologetic but the bus company didn't admit liability and I was stuck with
paying for my repairs. As a young person, I only had third party insurance.

France used to have "priorite a droit" which meant traffic could merge into
a highway from a minor road with the obvious consequences if you asserted
the commonly thought right of way.

The USA has great health care if you can pay. Probably has the worst
lifestyle.

On Thu, Aug 10, 2023 at 7:14 AM billogden  wrote:

> >Concerning the comments on trucks, driving, and the rest of the world.
> I lived for years in various parts of the world, including Germany (for one
> year). Driving can be more complex there (such as when driving 100MPH and
> being "blinked" from behind asking me to get out of the way!) Knew a few
> truck people with different mixtures of trucks and their stories were very
> mixed.
>
> Lived in Arizona for a year. Anyone who says "wind is never a problem"
> needs
> a bit more real-world education. This is a large country and different
> parts
> are different!
>
> I do believe that some of our long-distance trucking might be better via
> train, but loading/unloading containers has its own problems and issues.
> Simple-minded solve-it-all presentations are not very helpful.
>
> Bill Ogden
>
> --
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Re: Separation of Duties RACF Security Admins/Systems Programmers - Sarbanes-Oxley

[Wayne Bickerdike]

At Australian Defence we heavily used GROUP SPECIAL. That relieved sysprogs
from daily BAU tasks such as password resets or resume for IDs where people
were inactive due to vacations or active service.

Other shops I've worked at had a dumbed down RACF administrative function.
That often proved to be a bottleneck for new hires getting the profiles
right for their workload, that's why role based models work well if they
are designed correctly for incumbents.

On Sun, Aug 6, 2023 at 7:52 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> From a SysProg perspective, a well trained security administrator can
> relieve a lot of burden. OTOH, a poorly trained or uncooperative security
> administrator can be a nightmare, and may leave you less secure, As usual,
> the Devil is in the details.
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of Jack Zukt 
> Sent: Saturday, August 5, 2023 6:07 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Separation of Duties RACF Security Admins/Systems Programmers
> - Sarbanes-Oxley
>
> Role based security is the only kind that is manageable. Any other kind and
> you are playing at security, you are not managing it.
> Sysprogs and Secadmins really should be different persons. It is a very
> different role. It is a different mindset. I have worked both roles,
> sometimes both at the same time. From a security perspective, auditors,
> secadmins and sysprogs all should be different persons.
> But life can be much easier when you are a sysprog with the special
> attribute and you do know well the RACF structure. And the opposite is also
> true. You have a much easier life as a secadmins when you have a solid
> sysprog background.
> Best wishes
> Jack
>
> On Fri, Aug 4, 2023, 23:07 Mike Schwab  wrote:
>
> > The goal is to assign application security to a group then add the group
> to
> > the user's definition.  When a person transfers then you add and deleted
> > groups to the user while the user keeps access to personal datasets.
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 4, 2023, 15:51 Steve Thompson  wrote:
> >
> > > Don't know if TSS implements groups. But with groups, I can have
> > > access to certain DSNs read only, others update|delete|create. I
> > > can have access to console commands from TSO, but not have logon
> > > access to CICS. Just as examples.
> > >
> > > Having to change TSO IDs is problematic because one loses access
> > > to their private data sets... (tools you wrote for making
> > > ISPF/Roscoe or whatever better...).
> > >
> > > So role based using group definitions that give one authority
> > > until they don't need it (or can't justify it), is what I think
> > > you mean and need.
> > >
> > > Steve Thompson
> > >
> > > On 8/4/2023 4:25 PM, Wayne Bickerdike wrote:
> > > > To implement this would require systems that implement application
> > > > security. The idea that a systems programmer of any type would be
> able
> > to
> > > > perpetrate fraud is a stretch.
> > > >
> > > > I had access to everything mainframe (RACF, CICS, z/OS) in a top
> secret
> > > > installation. I wouldn't be able to place a purchase order but I
> could
> > > nuke
> > > > any dataset. I was also too damn busy doing my job to compromise the
> > > > systems.
> > > >
> > > > The worst case is where staff inherit privileges as they change
> roles.
> > > That
> > > > was a problem. Makes a case for role based security. Change roles >
> New
> > > > role based ID.
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Aug 4, 2023 at 11:34 PM Michael Babcock <
> bigironp...@gmail.com
> > >
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> I ran across this in a CICS security admin book (which should also
> > apply
> > > >> to z/OS sysprogs):
> > > >>
> > > >> Roles and separation of duties
> > > >>
> > > >>   A key security principle is the separation of duties between
> > > >> different users so that no one person has sufficient access
> privilege
> > to
> > > >> perpetrate damaging fraud. *This configuration is required by
> various
> > > >> audit regulations such as the United States Federal Law known as the
> > > >> Sarbanes-Oxley Act of 2002
> > > >> <
> > > >>
> > >
> >
> https://www.ibm.com/links?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.govinfo.gov%2Fcontent%2Fpkg%2FPLAW-107publ204%

Re: Separation of Duties RACF Security Admins/Systems Programmers - Sarbanes-Oxley

[Wayne Bickerdike]

To implement this would require systems that implement application
security. The idea that a systems programmer of any type would be able to
perpetrate fraud is a stretch.

I had access to everything mainframe (RACF, CICS, z/OS) in a top secret
installation. I wouldn't be able to place a purchase order but I could nuke
any dataset. I was also too damn busy doing my job to compromise the
systems.

The worst case is where staff inherit privileges as they change roles. That
was a problem. Makes a case for role based security. Change roles > New
role based ID.

On Fri, Aug 4, 2023 at 11:34 PM Michael Babcock 
wrote:

> I ran across this in a CICS security admin book (which should also apply
> to z/OS sysprogs):
>
> Roles and separation of duties
>
>  A key security principle is the separation of duties between
> different users so that no one person has sufficient access privilege to
> perpetrate damaging fraud. *This configuration is required by various
> audit regulations such as the United States Federal Law known as the
> Sarbanes-Oxley Act of 2002
> <
> https://www.ibm.com/links?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.govinfo.gov%2Fcontent%2Fpkg%2FPLAW-107publ204%2Fpdf%2FPLAW-107publ204.pdf
> >.*
>
>  An example of this separation of duties, is that someone with the
> role of CICS System Programmer must not also have the role of RACF
> Security Administrator.
>
>
> Does anyone know exactly which section of SOX it's referring to?
>
> --
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Re: Definition of mainframe? Was: Ars Technica

[Wayne Bickerdike]

COBOL MOVE was not intuitive. Should have been PROPOGATE or COPY, COPY was
already taken I guess.

On Mon, Jul 31, 2023 at 1:55 PM Grant Taylor <
023065957af1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On 7/30/23 7:58 PM, Andrew Rowley wrote:
> > They do dynamicaly expand. It's not growing that's the problem though,
> > it's shrinking - releasing space so that it can be used by another user.
>
> I feel like shrinking is a thing for many file systems.  The utility to
> shrink may not be included with the OS and need to be installed or even
> come from a 3rd party.
>
> Not all file systems can be expanded much less shrunk while mounted.
> Many of the ones that I've worked with need to be unmounted to do such
> actions.
>
> Usually, such actions also require the support of some sort of resizable
> container to put the file system in.  This is often Logical Volume
> Manager on Linux (across platforms).
>
>
>
> Grant. . . .
>
> --
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Re: IMS/Transaction Manager

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Mike Schwab said:


*One thong that helps ImMS is that everything related to a root key
isstored together, where as DB2 each segment is a separate database.*

Thinging the wrong thong methinks.

For starters, a DB2 database can have many tables/tablespaces. From a
physical POV an IMS DB can be a single segment or have multiple segments
linked by pointers. I've seen models for hierarchical databases implemented
in DB2 tables. It's messy and I have to ask why would you do that?

Disclaimer...Not a DB2 fan but it pays.



On Wed, Jul 26, 2023 at 9:28 AM Mike Schwab  wrote:

> One thong that helps ImMS is that everything related to a root key is
> stored together, where as DB2 each segment is a separate database.
>
> On Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 17:58 Attila Fogarasi  wrote:
>
> > IMS/DC predated VTAM (which came in 1974).  It was BTAM and later also
> > TCAM.  IBM MQ started life as a TCAM next generation before being
> > redesigned to be store/forward/transform messaging service.  That was
> more
> > than a decade after IMS/DC message queue.  As others have said IMS
> started
> > as a customer initiative, by Rockwell for the Saturn V moon rocket --
> they
> > couldn't keep track of the huge bill of materials needed.  The IMS
> > architecture and internal implementation was always performance
> > (instruction path length) and throughput focused.  In contrast CICS was
> > application services focused, hence a completely different architecture.
> > For the first 20 years, IMS was an order of magnitude faster than CICS
> once
> > IMS Fast Path came along (1977).  Over time the same technology (things
> > like Data in Memory) was adopted by CICS, so today there is less speed
> > difference.  Both exploit the system architecture for z very effectively,
> > something that other transaction manager solutions such as Tuxedo (now
> > Oracle) were never able to do, despite starting 20 years later with a
> clean
> > slate.  Meanwhile there are still IMS application programs running that
> > were written 50+ years ago and are fully supported today!
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 26, 2023 at 4:27 AM Schmitt, Michael <
> michael.schm...@dxc.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I wasn't working then 😊, but I think that IMS/DB was developed then,
> as
> > > the bill of materials database. The question I have is when IMS/DC come
> > > along? The online documentation is unclear.
> > >
> > >
> > > The Introduction to IMS says:
> > >
> > > IBM developed an online component to ICS/DL/I to support data
> > > communication access to the databases. The DL/I callable interface was
> > > expanded to the online component of the product to enable data
> > > communication transparency to the application programs. A message queue
> > > function was created to maintain the integrity of data communication
> > > messages and to provide for scheduling of the application programs.
> > >
> > > The online component to ICS/DL/I ultimately became the Data
> > Communications
> > > (DC) function of IMS, which became the IMS Transaction Manager (IMS TM)
> > in
> > > IMS Version 4.
> > >
> > >
> > > So *maybe* the original system just allowed some kind of communication
> > > access to the database, but not a full screen driven transaction server
> > > with a message queue like we know today.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > While we're on the subject of IMS/TM...
> > >
> > > Is it true that the MQ Series message queue was based on the IMS/TM
> > > message queue? Or is there no connection other than the function they
> > > provide.
> > >
> > >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> Behalf
> > > Of rpinion865
> > > Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 1:09 PM
> > > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > > Subject: Re: [EXT] Ars Technica: The IBM mainframe: How it runs and why
> > it
> > > survives
> > >
> > > I'm probably wrong.  But I thought IMS was developed for NASA during
> the
> > > Gemini and Apollo time frame.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Sent with Proton Mail secure email.
> > >
> > > --- Original Message ---
> > > On Tuesday, July 25th, 2023 at 2:05 PM, Schmitt, Michael <
> > > michael.schm...@dxc.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > No, I don’t know of an IMS/TM + DB2 system.
> > > >
> > > > But then the CICS systems I work with are also not using DB2. They
> use
> > > VSAM!
> > > >
> > > > And even for IMS/DB, my gut feel is there are a lot more CICS +
> IMS/DB
> > > installations than IMS/TM + IMS/DB.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Also, CICS is from ~1966, IMS/DC (later renamed to IMS/TM in IMS
> > Version
> > > 4) must have been much later than that, but I can't find the date.
> > > >
> > > > Reason I think I it is much later (late 70's? early 80's?) is
> because,
> > > as I understand it, the reason CICS was designed the way it is was
> > because
> > > at the time, the OS it ran on wasn't so great at multitasking. Or maybe
> > > didn't do multitasking at all. But IMS/DC was designed at a time when
> the
> > > OS was good at preemptive multitasking be

Re: How does Chinese banks runs their IT?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I believe that many Chinese banks ran mainframe but were limited to DOS/VSE
not MVS due to technology embargoes.

I also heard that huge numbers were running bootleg versions, including
Hercules.

When I worked in Indonesia, the company I worked at (A state enterprise)
ran lots of unlicensed software, IBM and third parties often overlooked
this in order to sell hardware. At the time, Hitachi were their main
competitor.

On Fri, Jul 28, 2023 at 6:44 AM Radoslaw Skorupka <
0471ebeac275-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> I would rephrase the question.
> We know the 95 of top 100 banks are using mainframes. The same for
> airlines, retailers, etc.
> Numbers presented may differ slightly, but it doesn't matter.
>
> The question is: WHAT ABOUT THE REST???
> I would like to know in details the remaining 5 cases.
>
>
>
> BTW: In Poland, due to historical reasons like communism and COCOM
> (export limitations) we were not using advanced technologies.
> In fact, before the 1989 IT in banking almost did not existed. Then we
> started from scratch, due to still existing limitations we started from
> PCs, LAN and Netware. And ICL DRS 300 (very poor). Then Unix systems
> arrived.
> In fact the first mainframe-based core banking system was launched in
> 2000. I know it well, because I was the person who launched it.
> Yes, it was pure-Internet (no branch offices) bank, called mBank.
> Today we have 3 largest banks on mainframes and some foreign banks (like
> Citi or DB) having their mainframes somewhere "in the cloud", means abroad.
> More, we have huge HSBC IT division in Cracow, despite HSBC banking
> business is not present in Poland. It it the largest IT employer in
> Cracow. With mainframe division.
> We also support Nordea, which is also not present in Poland (the were,
> but they sold the business and now hire 4000+ employees).
>
> --
> Radoslaw Skorupka
> Lodz, Poland
>
> --
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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [EXT] Ars Technica: The IBM mainframe: How it runs and why it survives

[Wayne Bickerdike]

IMS/DB vs most other databases?

Having worked with IMS/DB and DC and CICS with a variety of DBMS, I'd
venture that CICS offers way more flexibility. For example, I've worked in
CICS shops with ADABAS, DATACOM, TOTAL, DB2, not to mention that many of
the 4GL products were tailored to work in a CICS environment. DOS and
DOS/VSE had the ability to run CICS with a third party DBMS such as DATACOM
or ADABAS.

I did appreciate the simplicity of IMS DB and DC from a
programming perspective, however, the navigation of IMS/DB allows a mess of
methods to get to the pertinent data. How do you find a segment? Easy just
GN till you find it :) At some point you could just use a single segment
database and pretend it's relational with enough indexes.

MFS paging was perhaps "better" than BMS paging. I used the technique once,
it was simple to program but response time was extremely bad for large data
sets.

On Thu, Jul 27, 2023 at 3:05 AM Pommier, Rex 
wrote:

> This product is strictly for maintaining the old macro programs.  It works
> well and silently in the background, allowing us to keep running macro
> level code.  The only problems we had have been at upgrade time.  When we
> went to CICS 5.3 and again to 5.6, we had to have MacKinney refit MLI to
> the new CICS level.
>
> Rex
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Crawford Robert C (Contractor)
> Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 10:37 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [EXT] Ars Technica: The IBM mainframe: How it
> runs and why it survives
>
> Oh man, I feel your pain.
>
> I looked at the FAQ for the product.  Does MacKinney provide means to
> update the programs or does the customer have to keep the old macro level
> translator around?
>
> Robert Crawford
> Abstract Evolutions LLC
> (210) 913-3822
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Pommier, Rex
> Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 10:23 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [EXT] Ars Technica: The IBM mainframe: How it
> runs and why it survives
>
> "potential"?  :-)
>
> Rex
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Crawford Robert C (Contractor)
> Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 9:57 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [EXT] Ars Technica: The IBM mainframe: How it
> runs and why it survives
>
> I don't remember the specific date.  I think CICS 3.2.1 was the last
> release that supported it.
>
> Fortunately, we only had to run CICS 3.2.1 and CICS 3.3 in parallel for a
> few months.  I'm glad our application guys didn't know about MLI.  It
> sounds like a transition tool that has the potential to turn into a
> permanent solution.
>
> Robert Crawford
> Abstract Evolutions LLC
> (210) 913-3822
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Pommier, Rex
> Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 9:39 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [EXT] Ars Technica: The IBM mainframe: How it
> runs and why it survives
>
> And then there's this handy little tool from MacKinney systems called MLI
> that allows macro level code to still run in 2023!  Was macro code
> deprecated around 1988?
>
> Rex
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Crawford Robert C (Contractor)
> Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 9:26 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [EXT] Ars Technica: The IBM mainframe: How it runs
> and why it survives
>
> That's good to know.  I always assumed CICS had a storage manager because
> it was faster than GETMAIN/FREEMAIN.
>
> I remember the old macro interface and it was a mess, especially with
> application programs addressing system control blocks directly.  Not to
> mention how weird macro code looked in the middle of a PL/1 program.  IBM
> was wise to deprecate the interface even though the conversion caused pain.
>
> Robert Crawford
> Abstract Evolutions LLC
> (210) 913-3822
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Colin Paice
> Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 8:57 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [EXT] Ars Technica: The IBM mainframe: How it runs and why it
> survives
>
> CICS was "common code" between VS1 and DOS/VS(E) DOS/VS (I used to build
> it for CICS development), with AIF.. ANOP  statements around VS1/DOS
> specific code.  DOS/VS did not have the same facilities as VS1, so CICS had
> to be written to the lowest level of code.
>
>
> On Wed, 26 Jul 2023 at 14:45, Crawford Robert C (Contractor) <
> 04e08f385650-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
> > Yes, CICS has problems with shared memory which it mitigates through
> > storage protection and transaction isolation.  IMS MPR's are not
> > entirely immune from this either as a bad array index or funky pointer
> > can wipe out acres of storage and leave a region 

Re: Userid schemes

[Wayne Bickerdike]

When I worked at IBM it was first letter of surname plus personnel number
(5 numerics).

Another site used a role based ID such as SNRDBA for Senior DBA.

On Fri, Jul 14, 2023 at 10:31 AM Bob Bridges  wrote:

> One place I worked used the employee number as proof of identify when the
> help desk proposed to help him with his password.  The employee ID was
> printed on the photo ID we carried around.  As a security jock I never
> thought much of that scheme; no better than SSN, in my opinion.
>
> (The best scheme for that, at least that I've run into so far, is the
> policy of a company I worked for a long time:  Any department that had at
> least 25 people in it was required to have someone there scoped to update
> the passwords for folks in that department.  So no need to prove my
> identity through some hackable means:  I just walked up to Anna's desk and
> say "Anna, please fix my password".  Since Anna knows me (or knows my voice
> over the phone), no issue.  I've been a fan of decentralized (but
> monitored) security ever since.)
>
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
> /* It is hard enough, even with the best will in the world, to be just.
> It is hard, under the pressure of haste, uneasiness, ill-temper,
> self-complacency, and conceit, even to continue intending justice.  Power
> corrupts; the "insolence of office" will creep in.  We see it so clearly in
> our superiors; is it unlikely that our inferiors see it in us?  How many of
> those who have been over us did not sometimes (perhaps often) need our
> forgiveness?  Be sure that we likewise need the forgiveness of those that
> are under us.  -C S Lewis, "The Psalms" */
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Matt Hogstrom
> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2023 20:18
>
> A place I worked used initials followed by a 5 digit employee ID.  xxn
>
> --
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> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


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Re: z/OSMF

[Wayne Bickerdike]

The slash was an or symbol. Codeset anybody?

On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 8:35 AM Phil Smith III  wrote:

> Wayne Bickerdike wrote:
> *Was it Sterling Software/Platinum?*
>
> Heh. Different metals, different companies-but both wound up as part of CA
> eventually.
>
>
>
>
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Re: z/OSMF

[Wayne Bickerdike]

*Can anyone remember the major DB2 player was?*


*On Mon, Jul 3, 2023 at 8:26 AM Edward Gould
<04bcc43af339-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu
<04bcc43af339-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>> wrote:*

*Was it Sterling Software/Platinum?*

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Re: C DLL abend CEE3350S

[Wayne Bickerdike]

What compiler directives were used?

On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 5:18 AM Eric Erickson  wrote:

> I know, but the CEESTART CSECT is included in the program object. On
> another DLL, which is just 1 module with multiple functions, the CEESTART
> CSECT is listed in the load map as such.
>
>
>0  CEESTART*  CSECTB0  SYSLIB03  CEESTART
>
>
>
> In my problem DLL its listed as:
>
>   A48  CEESTART*  CSECTB0  SYSLIB03
> CEESTART
>
> Not sure what is going on here. Its my first foray into C DLLs and I
> wonder if mixing in the C LE Assembler routines is causing an issue?
>
> If I don't but the Entry statement into the deck, I get one what looks to
> be the module with the first alphabetically marked as the entry point.
>
> --
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Re: C DLL abend CEE3350S

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Do you have an INCLUDE for the CEESTART module? Does LE look for an
eyecatcher that it recognises as CEESTART, not just an ENTRY which as
Seymour says isn't the same.

Take LET off the bind in case there's another hidden problem.

On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 5:18 AM Eric Erickson  wrote:

> I know, but the CEESTART CSECT is included in the program object. On
> another DLL, which is just 1 module with multiple functions, the CEESTART
> CSECT is listed in the load map as such.
>
>
>0  CEESTART*  CSECTB0  SYSLIB03  CEESTART
>
>
>
> In my problem DLL its listed as:
>
>   A48  CEESTART*  CSECTB0  SYSLIB03
> CEESTART
>
> Not sure what is going on here. Its my first foray into C DLLs and I
> wonder if mixing in the C LE Assembler routines is causing an issue?
>
> If I don't but the Entry statement into the deck, I get one what looks to
> be the module with the first alphabetically marked as the entry point.
>
> --
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> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


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Re: DB2 install clist IRX0041I

[Wayne Bickerdike]

All good Bill.

On Tue, Jul 11, 2023 at 6:39 PM Bill Giannelli 
wrote:

> thanks for your response.
> I did run DSNTIJXZ, it turns out in the first panel I was pointing to the
> wrong version SMPe libraries.
> thanks
> Bill
>
> On Tue, 11 Jul 2023 12:24:05 +1000, Wayne Bickerdike 
> wrote:
>
> >Bill,
> >
> >Did you run the DSNTEJxZ job from SDSNSAMP. This captures your existing
> >parameter values for use later in the installation process.
> >
> >Which version of DB2 are you migrating?
> >
> >Check this chapter:
> >
> >
> https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/db2-for-zos/12?topic=jobs-running-clist-in-interactive-mode
> >
> >On Tue, Jul 11, 2023 at 8:03 AM Bill Giannelli 
> >wrote:
> >
> >> I am running the Db2 install / migration clist DSNTINST and am getting
> an
> >> IRX0041I error:
> >>446 +++ IRLMREG = (104857600 + (NUMTHRDS * IRLMLKUS * IRLMLKSZ))/
> >> 1048576
> >> IRX0041I Error running DSNTCALC, line 446: Bad arithmetic conversion
> >>
> >> SET &OPNPTS  =  * ((2000 * 11)/100)
> >>
> >> IKJ56545I THIS STATEMENT HAS AN EXPRESSION WITH OPERATORS OUT OF
> SEQUENCE
> >>
> >> ***
> >>
> >> any ideas?
> >> thanks
> >>
> >> --
> >> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> >> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >>
> >
> >
> >--
> >Wayne V. Bickerdike
> >
> >--
> >For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> >send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>
> --
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>


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Re: DB2 install clist IRX0041I

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Bill,

Did you run the DSNTEJxZ job from SDSNSAMP. This captures your existing
parameter values for use later in the installation process.

Which version of DB2 are you migrating?

Check this chapter:

https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/db2-for-zos/12?topic=jobs-running-clist-in-interactive-mode

On Tue, Jul 11, 2023 at 8:03 AM Bill Giannelli 
wrote:

> I am running the Db2 install / migration clist DSNTINST and am getting an
> IRX0041I error:
>446 +++ IRLMREG = (104857600 + (NUMTHRDS * IRLMLKUS * IRLMLKSZ))/
> 1048576
> IRX0041I Error running DSNTCALC, line 446: Bad arithmetic conversion
>
> SET &OPNPTS  =  * ((2000 * 11)/100)
>
> IKJ56545I THIS STATEMENT HAS AN EXPRESSION WITH OPERATORS OUT OF SEQUENCE
>
> ***
>
> any ideas?
> thanks
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


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Re: 0C1 abend

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Check any link edit for unresolved XTRN. One of a myriad of causers.

On Sun, Jul 2, 2023 at 4:15 AM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Sat, 1 Jul 2023 10:22:23 -0400, Steve Smith  wrote:
>
> >The "normal cause" is that an invalid opcode came up in the CPU's eternal
> >quest for things to do.
> >
> "quest for things to do" sounds like speculative execution.  What
> happens to a program check in speculative execution?  Does it
> speculatively enter the exception handler, etc.?
>
> --
> gil
>
> --
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Re: Datacom/Ad upgrade 15.1

[Wayne Bickerdike]

It is shipped with z/os serverpac. Depends on your installation. Perhaps
CPAC prefix library contains it if it wasn't copied to your active
linklist.

On Wed, Jun 21, 2023, 03:24 Sathish Kumar  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Am upgrading Datacom/AD 15.1 while running the installation job Axcus00
> it's amended due to the IPOUPDTE module not being found.
>
> I have checked the link list dataset I don't see that module.
>
> I checked the CPPUPDTE program it's not found.  IPOUPDTE is an alias of
> CPPUPDTE.
>
> Any idea how we can get that module?
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
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>

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Re: z/OS Authorized Code Scanner Webcast

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I should move back to Perth, it's the same time as Singapore :(

On Thu, Jun 8, 2023 at 12:49 PM Wayne Bickerdike  wrote:

> From anywhere in the world, I just Google "time in someplace". Look at
> your local time and work from there. Just be careful when daylight saving
> starts/ends. Australia has a 3 hour time diff from Singapore, except when
> it doesn't, such as now because we went back an hour for winter :)
>
> On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 4:00 AM Tom Brennan 
> wrote:
>
>> Everybody probably knows this in Google:
>>
>>11am in singapore
>>
>>11:00 AM Wednesday, in Singapore is
>>8:00 PM Tuesday, in West Covina, CA
>>
>> But maybe lesser known is this:
>>
>>11am in singapore in new york
>>
>>11:00 AM Wednesday, in Singapore is
>>11:00 PM Tuesday, in New York, NY
>>
>> Is that correct?  I guess so :)
>>
>> I did attend Tim's previous meeting and I believe the local 8pm time was
>> correct for that one.
>>
>> On 6/6/2023 7:17 AM, Pommier, Rex wrote:
>> > GIYF...
>> >
>> > Eastern Daylight Time (EDT), when observing daylight saving time
>> (spring/summer), are four hours behind Coordinated Universal Time
>> (UTC−04:00).
>> >
>> > -Original Message-
>> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
>> Behalf Of Seymour J Metz
>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 6, 2023 7:27 AM
>> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>> > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: z/OS Authorized Code Scanner Webcast
>> >
>> > I'm UTC-5, but the last time I converted (from Amsterdam) I seemed to
>> be an hour off, and I just got two different answers on this list :-(
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
>> >
>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://mason.gmu.edu/*smetz3__;fg!!KjMRP1Ixj6eLE0Fj!vf15eA_LVSP6rtOomcGg-7xXOoD62Wn_9p1JKXi1dZmpVmvAhOG8F1kb0Hp0Uh_5gdclpr7SQrabQSzz-g$
>> >
>> > 
>> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on
>> behalf of Tony Harminc [t...@harminc.net]
>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 6, 2023 8:16 AM
>> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>> > Subject: Re: z/OS Authorized Code Scanner Webcast
>> >
>> > On Tue, 6 Jun 2023 at 12:45, Seymour J Metz  wrote:
>> >
>> >> What's that in EDT (US East Coast, daylight)? Thanks.
>> >>
>> >
>> > Seriously - you don't know your own offset from UTC? But everyone else
>> should know it for you?
>> >
>> > Tony H.
>> >
>> >
>> >> I'm hosting another Webcast this Friday (June 9) at 11:00 AM Singapore
>> >> time (03:00 UTC). This time it's about the z/OS Authorized Code
>> >> Scanner (zACS).
>> >>
>> >
>> > --
>> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send
>> email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>> >
>> > --
>> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send
>> email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>> >
>> > --
>> > The information contained in this message is confidential, protected
>> from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this
>> message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible
>> for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby
>> notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or
>> action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be
>> unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify
>> us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its
>> entirety, whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you.
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>> >
>>
>> --
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>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
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>
>
> --
> Wayne V. Bickerdike
>
>

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Re: z/OS Authorized Code Scanner Webcast

[Wayne Bickerdike]

>From anywhere in the world, I just Google "time in someplace". Look at your
local time and work from there. Just be careful when daylight saving
starts/ends. Australia has a 3 hour time diff from Singapore, except when
it doesn't, such as now because we went back an hour for winter :)

On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 4:00 AM Tom Brennan 
wrote:

> Everybody probably knows this in Google:
>
>11am in singapore
>
>11:00 AM Wednesday, in Singapore is
>8:00 PM Tuesday, in West Covina, CA
>
> But maybe lesser known is this:
>
>11am in singapore in new york
>
>11:00 AM Wednesday, in Singapore is
>11:00 PM Tuesday, in New York, NY
>
> Is that correct?  I guess so :)
>
> I did attend Tim's previous meeting and I believe the local 8pm time was
> correct for that one.
>
> On 6/6/2023 7:17 AM, Pommier, Rex wrote:
> > GIYF...
> >
> > Eastern Daylight Time (EDT), when observing daylight saving time
> (spring/summer), are four hours behind Coordinated Universal Time
> (UTC−04:00).
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> Behalf Of Seymour J Metz
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 6, 2023 7:27 AM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: z/OS Authorized Code Scanner Webcast
> >
> > I'm UTC-5, but the last time I converted (from Amsterdam) I seemed to be
> an hour off, and I just got two different answers on this list :-(
> >
> >
> > --
> > Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> >
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://mason.gmu.edu/*smetz3__;fg!!KjMRP1Ixj6eLE0Fj!vf15eA_LVSP6rtOomcGg-7xXOoD62Wn_9p1JKXi1dZmpVmvAhOG8F1kb0Hp0Uh_5gdclpr7SQrabQSzz-g$
> >
> > 
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on
> behalf of Tony Harminc [t...@harminc.net]
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 6, 2023 8:16 AM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: z/OS Authorized Code Scanner Webcast
> >
> > On Tue, 6 Jun 2023 at 12:45, Seymour J Metz  wrote:
> >
> >> What's that in EDT (US East Coast, daylight)? Thanks.
> >>
> >
> > Seriously - you don't know your own offset from UTC? But everyone else
> should know it for you?
> >
> > Tony H.
> >
> >
> >> I'm hosting another Webcast this Friday (June 9) at 11:00 AM Singapore
> >> time (03:00 UTC). This time it's about the z/OS Authorized Code
> >> Scanner (zACS).
> >>
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send
> email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send
> email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
> > --
> > The information contained in this message is confidential, protected
> from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this
> message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible
> for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby
> notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or
> action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be
> unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify
> us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its
> entirety, whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you.
> >
> >
> > --
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> >
>
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Re: SMP/E JCLIN processing for job updates

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Bill,

If SCLM is installed there is a sample project you can work from. That
should be a good starter.

There is a set of JCL members to set up a project, use that as a basis.

Any questions, just keep asking away.

On Fri, Apr 21, 2023 at 9:57 PM Bill Giannelli 
wrote:

> Hi Wayne,
> I see SCLM now in ISPF. I wasnt aware of it.
> Is the IBM online doc good enough for a SCLM newbie?
> thanks
> Bill
> On Fri, 21 Apr 2023 06:48:00 -0500, Bill Giannelli <
> billgianne...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >hi wayne,
> >what is SCLM?
> >On Fri, 21 Apr 2023 21:43:25 +1000, Wayne Bickerdike 
> wrote:
> >
> >>I would use SCLM if you don't have another source management tool.
> >>
> >>On Fri, Apr 21, 2023 at 9:37 PM Bill Giannelli 
> >>wrote:
> >>
> >>> Do many of you out there use SMP/E JCLIN processing to track and save
> job
> >>> updates?
> >>> Currently we do not make use of this and manually keep JCL up to date.
> >>> It seems there is a value to have SMPe ke
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> >>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>--
> >>Wayne V. Bickerdike
> >>
> >>--
> >>For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> >>send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
> >--
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Re: SMP/E JCLIN processing for job updates

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I would use SCLM if you don't have another source management tool.

On Fri, Apr 21, 2023 at 9:37 PM Bill Giannelli 
wrote:

> Do many of you out there use SMP/E JCLIN processing to track and save job
> updates?
> Currently we do not make use of this and manually keep JCL up to date.
> It seems there is a value to have SMPe ke
>
> --
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Re: What is BPXAS and how do I make them stop piling up?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Charles,

Correct it is VENDOR.PROCLIB. USER.PROCLIB was on our old ADCD back in the
old FLEX days.

We implemented some automation on Dallas to clean up spool (OTTO from the
CBTTAPE). We also paid for a lot of additional disk space so we could
extend JES spool.

On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 1:34 AM Charles Mills  wrote:

> Incredibly busy this AM but wanted to at least say that I used @sas's
> "real deal" *exactly* as presented below and it seems to be working
> perfectly. May comment on some later posts if I get a moment.
>
> If any Dallas customers are reading this a year or two from now, note that
> @sas's "USER.PROCLIB" is actually named VENDOR.PROCLIB.
>
> (In the slightly confusing nomenclature of Dallas, a customer is called a
> vendor -- because presumably the customer is a 3rd-party software vendor.)
>
> Charles
>
> On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 22:08:27 -0400, Steve Smith  wrote:
>
> >Well, here's the real deal:
> >
> >//BPXASJOB 1,MSGCLASS=Z
> >//BPXAS   PROC
> >//*
> >//* Note:  This is a started JOB now, so the MSGCLASS can be set.
> >//*Z is purged automatically.  Change to X if you want to
> >//*enable the output.  To revert to the IBM version in
> >//*SYS1.PROCLIB, just rename this member in USER.PROCLIB.
> >//*
> >//IEFPROC EXEC PGM=IEFIIC,DPRTY=12,PARM=',,&GETWORK,BPXPRJRW'
> >///
>
> --
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Re: What is BPXAS and how do I make them stop piling up?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I've used the Dallas systems. You are free to customize. IBM provide
USER.PROCLIB etc. It allows you to add your custom routines which can allow
such things as MSGCLASS=Z et al.

On Tue, Apr 11, 2023 at 2:10 PM Paul Gilmartin <
042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 18:58:29 -0500, Charles Mills wrote:
>
> >@Gil, which IBM?  This is a Dallas system, and it is set up the way
> IBM sets up Dallas systems, which might be a third case in addition to
> "defaults" and "recommendations." We have changed very little of that sort
> of thing.
> >
> If you didn't change it, and it's broke, and you're paying for  it,
> they should fix it, not IBM-MAIN.
>
> If a shop buys a brand new z/OS system, and they never had one before
> (does that happen nowadays?) does it come configured as "defaults",
> or  "recommendations", or "third case", or should they really, really hire
> a consultant?
>
> --
> gil
>
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Re: Cobol calling module with non alphanumeric no longer allowed???

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I can see a point whereby you wouldn't use interactive RDO to define
resources.

We used a change control system to implement CICS resources via batch jobs
running DFHCSDUP utility. It gives a better audit trail than using the CEDA
transaction. We also used a separate CSD for 14 CICS regions and rolling
out a common change meant more work.

We also always COLD started CICS so the odd "temporary" install that should
have been permanent often went missing. LOL.

On Mon, Apr 10, 2023 at 7:48 AM Farley, Peter <
031df298a9da-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> OK, so this was a shop standard rather than any actual requirement.  So
> not "cannot be defined to RDO" but "chose not to be allowed to be defined
> in RDO by management decision".
>
> That kind of thing is a deliberate decision to live with the consequences
> for some perceived benefit.  To each their own.
>
> Peter
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Steve Thompson
> Sent: Sunday, April 9, 2023 4:14 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Cobol calling module with non alphanumeric no longer
> allowed???
>
> In the case of a common routine(s) that is (are) statically linked for
> Batch and CICS environments. I didn't design the system the customer had, I
> just had to be aware of it when I was working on Compile support tools.
>
> So I thought that this aspect should be considered in this conversation.
>
> And, yes, if these routines changed, the causing the common
> copybook(s) to be changed, that would require a recompile and linkedit of
> the batch and CICS sides, QA testing, and then promotion back into
> production. So that had to be coordinated across a few application groups
> for each program that used one of those "dual" routine programs (dual from
> the idea that they were used in both environments).
>
> Steve Thompson
>
> On 4/9/2023 2:50 PM, Farley, Peter wrote:
> > The only CICS routines that MUST be statically linked are the DFH
> subroutines that are called as the result of coding CICS commands like EXEC
> CICS LINK or EXEC SQL SELECT.  AFAIK, any user-written program can be
> defined to RDO including those with national characters ($#@) in the name.
> >
> > I am curious, in what case(s) do you believe that a callable subroutine
> could NOT be definable in RDO?
> >
> > Unless it is for very high frequency user programs where maximum
> performance is critical, statically linked functional subroutines (under
> CICS or not) are a maintenance nightmare, because when (not if) those
> subroutines need to change, whether for new function or for defect repair,
> EVERY program that statically linked them must be re-linked and (more
> costly and more critically) MUST be re-tested for quality assurance.
> >
> > And even for high performance requirements, the EXEC CICS LINK (or
> better, a plain COBOL CALL variable-name, even under CICS) has a fairly
> efficient path to execute already-loaded subroutines, and if they are being
> used frequently they are almost surely already loaded in memory.
> >
> > Peter
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> > Behalf Of Steve Thompson
> > Sent: Sunday, April 9, 2023 2:16 PM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Cobol calling module with non alphanumeric no longer
> allowed???
> >
> > The other reason for the literal calls is because one wants the load
> module to have the subroutines statically linked that the COBOL program is
> using. In this way there is no LOAD done during execution time because
> COBOL "knows" that these are statically linked.
> >
> > There are a few reasons to want this behavior.
> >
> > The major one that comes to mind is you have to have static linkage for
> running in a CICS environment because the subroutines are not CICS
> definable (RDO) and so have to be statically linked.
> >
> > Steve Thompson
> >
> > On 4/8/2023 1:50 AM, Farley, Peter wrote:
> >> Not true for non-static calls.  We are past COBOL 5 (V6.2 at the
> moment) and "CALL variable USING . . . " where "variable" has any of the
> "national" characters ($#@) works every time.  We have multiple dynamically
> called utility subroutines with those characters in the program name.
> >>
> >> Why in the world are you using literal calls?  Or are you using the
> DYNAM option to convert literal calls to dynamic ones?  If so, bite the
> bullet - convert them to "CALL variable" and you are done.
> >>
> >> The only legitimate case I have seen for using literal CALL's is when
> you are using nested subroutine programs in the same source file as the
> calling program.
> >>
> >> Peter
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> >> Behalf Of Frank Swarbrick
> >> Sent: Friday, April 7, 2023 6:07 PM
> >> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >> Subject: Cobol calling module with non alphanumeric no longer allowed???
> >>
> >> I've tried calling modules (that exist!) with both '@' and '#' si

Re: ssid not recognized after erly code update

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Bill,

Read this:

https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/db2-for-zos/12?topic=delivery-updating-db2-initialization-parameters-function-level-activation



On Sun, Apr 9, 2023 at 8:45 PM Bill Giannelli 
wrote:

> I updated DB2 ERLY code dataset SDSNLINK, now the SSID is not recognized.
> Have IPLd and refreshed LLA then tried stopping and starting LLA.
> What is wrong?
> thanks
> Bill
>
> --
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Re: ssid not recognized after erly code update

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Bill,

Check the DSNTIJUZ member from your installation.

This should show you what subsystem was created in ZPARMS. Perhaps you have
dropped your custom module.

On Sun, Apr 9, 2023 at 8:45 PM Bill Giannelli 
wrote:

> I updated DB2 ERLY code dataset SDSNLINK, now the SSID is not recognized.
> Have IPLd and refreshed LLA then tried stopping and starting LLA.
> What is wrong?
> thanks
> Bill
>
> --
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Re: Subject: Re: Currency format suggestions, please?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Growing up in the 50's people could only fantasise about billions and
millions. These numbers just seemed far far from reality.

A good friend of mine boasted to me that his Dad was "a thousandaire". I
was impressed.

On Sun, Apr 2, 2023 at 10:35 PM Rupert Reynolds  wrote:

> Oh yes. Only slightly ambiguous when the speaker had alergies and a blocked
> nose :-)
>
> Roops
>
> On Sun, 2 Apr 2023, 11:18 Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw, <
> 032fff1be9b4-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
> > We used to have the Milliard as well.
> > https://www.dictionary.com/browse/milliard
> >
> > Lennie
> >
> >
>
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Re: Stop the ragging on COBOL please [was: RE: ASM call by value]

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I also like CA-IDEAL. A little bit PL/I like with a nice SELECT statement:

Example:

SELECT TRANS_CODE

WHEN 'A'

DO ADD_RECORD_PROC

WHEN 'D'

DO DEL_RECORD_PROC

WHEN 'P'

 DO PURCHASE_PROC

WHEN 'R'

DO RECEIPT_PROC

WHEN ANY

DO LOG_TRANS

WHEN OTHER

DO INVALID_CODE

ENDSEL




On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 11:23 AM Jeremy Nicoll <
jn.ls.mfrm...@letterboxes.org> wrote:

> On Wed, 29 Mar 2023, at 14:01, Paul Gilmartin wrote:
>
> > Too many languages lack ELSEIF and strong closure.  Fie on
> > the danglig ELSE!
>
> An ALGOL variant (S-ALGOL) that I used at university differentiated
> between, IIRC,
>
>  IF ... THEN ... ELSE
>
> and
>
> IF ... DO
>
> which meant that as soon as the compiler saw THEN or DO it
> knew whether or not there should be an ELSE later on.  It was
> such a simple idea but it worked well for both programmers
> & the compiler.
>
> --
> Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.
>
> --
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Re: Fascinating Interview with Steve Jobs [non-mainframe]

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Very interesting if one-sided interview. He gives Steve Wozniak very little
credit although Woz really was the inventor and Jobs the salesman in the
partnership.

I read Sculley's autobiography many years ago (From Pepsi to Apple). It
doesn't describe events quite the same way.

Nevertheless, good that it has surfaced at a time where nobody gets sued
for defamation.

After I left IBM in 1979 I wrote some applications on the Apple II. It was
a challenge and from an electrical engineering point of view, it was poor
with a weak power supply that ran the CPU, Floppy drives which caused the
screen to wobble when operating.

At the same time Apple were turning out the IIE, there was a host of other
nicer systems, such as the Cromemco System 3 and Altos 8000 which ran CP/M
and MP/M and had a more robust construction.

It was a shame that Gary Kildall died so young, he would have been a great
competitor for Jobs and Gates.

On Wed, Mar 29, 2023 at 9:28 AM Charles Mills  wrote:

> A friend shared this with me and I thought it was just extraordinary. It
> is not "mainframe" but his comments on what happens when the marketeers run
> a tech company will resonate with many of us. It’s a fairly long read. It’s
> a transcript of a long interview done for a TV show – only a few minutes
> were actually used – by Bob Cringely, and thought to be lost. Steve Jobs
> was at the time (1995) running NeXT, which he was to sell to Apple a month
> later. It is a fascinating read.
>
> https://sameerbajaj.com/jobs/
>
> Charles
>
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Re: Stop the ragging on COBOL please [was: RE: ASM call by value]

[Wayne Bickerdike]

Regarding Michael Jackson structured programming.

My first role at ICI was applications programmer. My Senior programmer gave
me three program specs that were training specs. The specs came with
flowcharts. I duly programmed them in PL/I replete with IF THEN GOTO ELSE
GOTO statements. Not a trace of a DO WHILE.

Another senior programmer chuckled when he saw my code. He produced a
Jackson structure for each of the programs. Sequence, Iteration and Select.
That was when the penny dropped and data driven design made sense.

The same programmer built a design language called CODEL (Component
Definition Language). Program specs were developed from the program
structure diagram. It used an Assembler like syntax with macros for SEQ,
SEL and ITER. The beauty of the utility was that it printed the program
structure on a 1403 line printer and built assembler code. It was great
because if the structure stood up to review, you had a working prototype
without writing a line of code.

I've always been in awe of people who can conceptualise and implement such
great tools. He also had an IQ well over 160 and eschewed MENSA..

On Wed, Mar 29, 2023 at 4:58 PM David Crayford  wrote:

> On 28/3/23 13:26, Tony Harminc wrote:
> >> I use programming languages that I don't like all the time. C, in
> >> particular, I dislike a lot. That doesn't mean they're not useful.
> > Whew! And I thought you were a C fanatic. Thanks for disabusing me of
> that.
> Ha! I don't develop emotional attachments to programming languages,
> except for Lua which I find exceptionally elegant. Its power and
> conciseness are truly impressive. I'm still astonished how such a tiny
> language can be so powerful with such economy. Nonetheless, I tend to
> follow the crowd and use Python as my primary scripting language, even
> though I have a preference for Lua. While Kotlin appealed to me for our
> latest project, we ultimately opted for Java due to its abundant talent
> pool, which eliminated the need for additional training of new hires.
>
>
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Re: Cloning SMPe Global, Target and DLIB

[Wayne Bickerdike]

ADRDSSU . DUMP and RESTORE with HLQ rename. After that, you'll need to
modify DDDEFs to reflect the newly created underlying datasets.

On Tue, Mar 28, 2023 at 8:08 PM Bill Giannelli 
wrote:

> What is the best or recommended way to copy or clone a SMPe Global CSI,
> Target and Dlib with all the underlying datasets?
> I want to create a new HLQ and clone under that.
> thanks
> Bill
>
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Re: Stop the ragging on COBOL please [was: RE: ASM call by value]

[Wayne Bickerdike]

During my early training we were sent to learn Michael Jackson structured
programming. MJ quotes Dijkstra a lot, however, I didn't realise that he
was a PL/I hater. That was the first language I learned and still think it
was a masterpiece. I encountered COBOL after I left IBM and it happened to
be Microfocus COBOL, a very odd variant designed for Z80/CPM based
microcomputers. It barely did the job since it only supported a rudimentary
ISAM file system. A couple of years later as our software house was going
broke, I went for an interview for a DOS/VSE COBOL role. The customer was
doubtful that my MF COBOL would translate to a mainframe role. It didn't
prove to be a problem but oh how I wished it had been a PL/I shop.

Inverted programs in COBOL? Blech..

On Tue, Mar 28, 2023 at 4:27 PM Tony Harminc  wrote:

> On Mon, 27 Mar 2023 at 23:22, David Crayford  wrote:
> >
> > I think it was flippant Edsger W. Dijkstra  quote:
> >
> >  “The use of COBOL cripples the mind; its teaching should,
> > therefore, be regarded as a criminal offense.”
>
> Dijkstra wasn't hot on a lot of languages:
>
> "If Fortran has been called an infantile disorder, PL/I must be
> classified as a fatal disease."
> -Edsger Dijkstra in Introduction to the Art of Computer Programming
>
> Which prompted, or at least provided a juicy quote for, Ric Holt's
> 1972 paper "Teaching the Fatal Disease (or) Introductory Computer
> Programming Using PL/I".
>
> > I use programming languages that I don't like all the time. C, in
> > particular, I dislike a lot. That doesn't mean they're not useful.
>
> Whew! And I thought you were a C fanatic. Thanks for disabusing me of that.
>
> Tony H.
>
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Re: Question for our international friends (mostly)

[Wayne Bickerdike]

I was giving a talk to some of our guys in Phoenix about REXX. About an
hour into my talk, one of the guys said, "excuse me, what is 'zed'' ". Oops
"zee".

Always amazed how US English strayed from the home origins.

In the North of England we always said zebbra not zeebra. Sarf and Norf are
completely different.

On Sat, Mar 18, 2023, 07:35 Bob Bridges  wrote:

> In English the letter 'z' is a voiced 's'.
>
> I believe the Italians pronounce it 'ts' like the Germans.
>
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
> /* If you're going to walk on thin ice, you may as well dance. */
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Bernd Oppolzer
> Sent: Friday, March 17, 2023 16:10
>
> not exactly "six" ... more like "tsix", the first letter sounds like a Z
> in Germany, a letter T followed by a letter S.
>
> It comes to my mind that most other languages don't pronounce the letter Z
> this way, only we Germans do ... the other (like French and English) simply
> say S.
> For example zebra. How do you pronounce it? The word is the same in all
> three languages, I guess ...
> We say t-s-ebra.
>
> --- Am 17.03.2023 um 20:36 schrieb René Jansen:
> > I’ve heard Germans say ‘six’; in Dutch we say ‘kicks’ like the Brits.
>
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Re: Running a Coupling Facility using a CP for a test Parallel Sysplex 0 anyh gotcha's?

[Wayne Bickerdike]

CICS/VSAM transparency may not solve this problem. You would need to
implement DB2 data sharing and that's not simple if you don't already use
data sharing.

ISI Pty in Melbourne also market a VSAM transparency product. I supported
this product for many years and it is still in use at one large Australian
bank. The ISI version works better than the IBM product which was a
bought-in product from a 3rd party vendor.

For less complex VSAM applications, I considered trying to transform VSAM
read/writes to CF equivalents because the code path overhead is large for
high volume VSAM I/O. The magic is in the intercepts for batch and CICS.

On Wed, Mar 8, 2023 at 12:57 PM Dale R. Smith 
wrote:

> On Wed, 8 Mar 2023 11:35:09 +1300, Laurence Chiu  wrote:
>
> >Just to explain why we need two LPARs. The application uses a VSAM dataset
> >which is updated for all incoming transactions.  If we want to run two
> >instances of that application on two different LPARs to provide
> >availability even if one of the LPARs goes offline for any reason, then
> the
> >VSAM dataset needs to be shared across the two instances when both are
> >running to support concurrent access.
> >
> >The only other option for the two LPARs on the same CEC is possibly VSAM
> >ShareOptions but given this is a package from a vendor, it might not be
> >coded to support the right queueing and de-queueing of access to that
> >dataset.
>
> IBM has a product called "CICS VSAM Transparency for z/OS" that claims you
> can migrate VSAM Files to Db2 Tables without having to change any program
> code.
> https://www.ibm.com/support/pages/ibm-cics-vsam-transparency-zos
>
> From the web page:
>
> IBM CICS VSAM Transparency for z/OS
>
> Helps you migrate valuable data from VSAM files to Db2 tables in a manner
> that can evolve as business needs change
>
> IBM® CICS® VSAM Transparency helps you move valuable data from VSAM files
> to Db2® tables. This migration can evolve as your business requirements
> dictate, without having to modify your CICS® and batch VSAM application
> programs. You can access the Db2® data 24x7, as well as integrate your data
> with new and existing Db2® applications, preserving your core investments
> and avoiding costly application rewrites.
>
> I'm sure it's not cheap, but it would allow you to share the data and it
> may be cheaper than what you would need to do to share a VSAM file.
>
> I have no experience with the product so I don't know if it works as
> advertised.
>
> --
> Dale R. Smith
>
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