Re: [ozmidwifery] Wish me luck...

2006-02-04 Thread angelapetrut
Hi Jo
Hope your day goes well,youre an absolutely brilliant midwife and have led 
-by-example with Will and your family choices.We all know how we feel going 
back to work after our holidays let alone THE  most important work-break,but 
you will suprize yourself that sometimes policies  paperwork may change ,but 
your contribution to some families day is an invaluable as ever.
Take Care , Ange


 Jo Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Well, after nine months on maternity leave, my finances (and my  
 husband!) have told me it is time to do some casual shifts at work.   
 This morning is my first one.  I am just doing a 6 hour shift, and my  
 husband will bring my 8 month old, Will, to work for me at 10am for a  
 feed. :)  (these are the benefits of working in a 'baby friendly'  
 hospital...)
 
 I am a little nervous!  Being a hospital based Midwife, having had a  
 wonderful babymoon after an awesome homebirth - I wonder if I will be  
 any different as a Midwife??  We'll see.
 
 There is a great discussion on 'Extended Breastfeeding' on the UK  
 Midwifery list - anyone keeping an eye on that?  I find it amazing  
 that so many people are against breastfeeding in public, not to  
 mention extended BF.
 
 Anyway, time to don the 'still too small' uniform...
 
 Regards,
 Jo
 
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RE: [ozmidwifery] nice story....

2006-02-04 Thread Dean Jo
Title: Message



yeah, 
my first thoughts were the same!

  
  -Original Message-From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of 
  jesse/jayneSent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 7:56 
  AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Re: 
  [ozmidwifery] nice story
  How about the dad in Melbourne yesterday morning 
  that delivered his baby in the back of the car?! My kids were 
  listening to the news on the radio and my youngest said "WOW!! A MAN HAD 
  A BABY!"
  
  Jayne
  
  
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Janet 
Fraser 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:31 
PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] nice 
story

I'm glad there was someone 
to "deliver" her baby. Sigh. Don't women give birth?
Cute otherwise ; 
)
J

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Steve 
   Janine Clark 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 9:21 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] nice 
  story
  
  
  Farm birth nothing to kid 
  aboutCarla Danaher03feb06MANY four-legged kids have been born at 
  Collingwood Children's Farm, but never a two-legged one . . . until 
  now.Brunswick woman Nicole Allard gave birth to Saskia under a peppercorn tree at the farm on Sunday 
  afternoon. 
  A 
  baby goat born at the farm later that day has been named Saskia in her honour. 
  
  Nicole and her partner Julian Elliott, both 
  doctors, were on a family outing with their two children when the 
  36-year-old went into labour. 
  They 
  had been aid workers in Cambodia for the past three years. 
  
  The 
  pair only returned home to Melbourne so they could have their baby in a 
  local hospital, not knowing she would be born at a farm instead. 
  
  But, 
  after trying to walk to her car, Nicole knew she wasn't going to make it 
  to the hospital in time. 
  After 
  farm staff fetched towels and cordoned off the area, Julian delivered his 
  daughter under a peppercorn tree, with their children watching on. 
  
  "It 
  was beautiful to have a child outside," Nicole said. 
  
  "The 
  thing I'm most relieved about is that I delivered there and not one of the 
  other places I was last week, like 
  Federation 
  Square." 
  Mother and baby are doing well, with Saskia a healthy 3.5kg. 
  Collingwood Children's Farm assistant manager 
  Frank Palomares said the happy event came as 
  quite a shock to staff. 
  "Our 
  farmers are trained to deliver animals, but not humans," he said. 
  
  
  --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by 
  AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.0/249 - Release 
  Date: 2/2/2006


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RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread Mary Murphy










I also was surprised at the outcomes of
the study. One of the great benefits of being a community midwife is the
opportunity for women to debrief over a period of time. Usually from day
2-28, a little at a time. Even with a normal seemingly non-traumatic
birth, women need to talk it through.MM 









From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Nicole Carver
Sent: Saturday, 4 February 2006
3:42 PM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs
support







HI Mary,





I remember reading about that research and
being surprised. I have discussed it with the psych nurse employed where I
work, who spends time nearly every day with women who have experienced
traumatic births (or perceived them to be even when we might not have called
them such). She feels it does help. Even one visit can help women who want to
understand what happened to them and why. Some require much more, and
thankfully our maternity support workers are great with these women. However, it
is a tragedy that we need to have these workers. They do also work with
antenatal and postnatal depression.





I can't remember the specifics, but I
don't recall being particularly impressed with the methodology of the study
that you mention. And if women want to talk about their experience they should
be able to, whether it is formal debriefing or whatever. I suppose you don't
want to treat all women the same, ie what is appropriate debriefing for one
woman, would not necessarily work for another. If you did try to treat them the
same it would not be surprising if it did not work.





Nicole Carver.





-Original Message-


















RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread Judy Chapman
I am sure that debriefing helps even if it does not cure. I
remember one particular woman at my previous place of work who
rang me many times and needed to talk about her EM CS (possible
not necessary) and I felt sad for her when I left there as we
had not finished debriefing. I think it helped a bit but she was
still a bit of a mess. 
For my self, I would loved to have had a sympathetic ear, it
took me nearly 25 years to come to terms with the 2 CS that I
had. Fortunately I have been able to channel into midwifery,
trying hard not to let women get the raw deal that I had. 
Cheers
Judy


--- Nicole Carver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 HI Mary,
 I remember reading about that research and being surprised. I
 have discussed
 it with the psych nurse employed where I work, who spends time
 nearly every
 day with women who have experienced traumatic births (or
 perceived them to
 be even when we might not have called them such). She feels it
 does help.
 Even one visit can help women who want to understand what
 happened to them
 and why. Some require much more, and thankfully our maternity
 support
 workers are great with these women. However, it is a tragedy
 that we need to
 have these workers. They do also work with antenatal and
 postnatal
 depression.
 I can't remember the specifics, but I don't recall being
 particularly
 impressed with the methodology of the study that you mention.
 And if women
 want to talk about their experience they should be able to,
 whether it is
 formal debriefing or whatever. I suppose you don't want to
 treat all women
 the same, ie what is appropriate debriefing for one woman,
 would not
 necessarily work for another. If you did try to treat them the
 same it would
 not be surprising if it did not work.
 Nicole Carver.
   -Original Message-
   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mary
 Murphy
   Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 10:59 AM
   To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
   Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support
 
 
   I believe there is some research out there that looked at
 de-briefing
 women after birth, particularly traumatic births.  As I
 remember it, the
 research did not show that this debriefing had particularly
 helpful
 outcomes.  Of course it is all in the Who, the When and the
 How.  Does
 anyone remember it?  Mary Murphy
 
 
 
 


 --
 
   Andrea wrote:
 
   Any suggestions. Should all women have a follow up
 appointment with the
 midwife who was at her birth, is this appropriate as they may
 have been part
 of the problem, should all women have a follow up appointment
 but the woman
 be allowed to choose who she wants the appointment with, at
 what stage would
 this be appropriate, 2 weeks, 8 weeks 3 months? How does this
 fit with the
 MCH nurses who are now involved in the woman's on going care?
 How does her
 doctor, be it her own GP, obst or the one who attended (or
 not) her birth
 be involved in this?
 
 
 




 
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[ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread Dean Jo
Title: Message



Interestingly last year our South Australian Gov held 
an inquiry into post natal depression and direct links to birth- cs 
specifically. I sat there and listened to a private OB who said "none of 
my patients are unhappy with their cs".

how 
would he know? when does he ask? who does he think he 
is?

yes 
Andrea, the problem is a difficult one to address but I think there are 
definatley ways to start. Inclusion of PTSD during antenatal classes and a 
handout describing the difference between PND and PTSD; a list of possible 
contacts of support from outside the hospital and perhaps maybe one within. Find 
out if someone can be appointed a specific consumer relations counselor with 
expertise in PTSD and birth at the unit who acts as the consumers advocate or 
point of call, actively encourage any birthing woman (but especially those who 
have had difficult or emergency births) to contact this person to at least 
register their concerns regardless to when it happened. This person could 
also be used to document the cases and make links to particular behaviours or 
procedures that cause harm and even individuals who are repeat offenders in 
offending - then they could be encouraged or even enforced to get educated or 
get out.

Units 
need to actively support the consumer groups in their area. Advertise the 
details of consumer groups and LISTEN to the group's findings and 
feedback-good, bad and ugly. 

Educate women about the realities of birth in our 
current system. This is a hard one as it would be easy to tell them that this is 
the way it can be but it doesn't need to be or worse, tell them this is the way 
it can be so accept it. educating women about birth as a positive thing is 
an ongoing challenge but attention to wording, and reiterating the rights of 
women to say NO or in the very least be ASKED not TOLD. If a midwife 
witnesses an event that has clearly disempowered the woman, if that mw has not 
the strength to stand up for the woman, to at least pull her aside after and 
tell her that should not have happened and would she like to make a 
complaint. I would hope that this scenario would be avoided however by not 
letting it happen.

Perhaps a list of standard things that happen during 
each visits (breast checks etc)is given to the woman and unless she ticks 
the 'yes' box the procedure can not go ahead.Information or rationale can 
be given for all procedures so the woman is informed as to the reasoning for 
it. INFORMED CONSENT. If she ticks 'no' and it happens then 
her rights have been abused and consequences must occur.

Agreed 
that going back to where the trauma was committed is not what most people 
do...as many have said before, no one goes back to their rapist and asks why 
they did it or gives them an opportunity to defend the attack. 


MOST 
WOMEN WHO SUFFER TRAUMA UNDERSTAND THAT THEY CAN NOT GO BACK IN TIME AND CHANGE 
THINGS- BUT IF THEY CAN DO SOMETHING TO PREVENT IT HAPPENING TO SOMEONE ELSE 
THEY WILL. Most women who are hurt emotionally and physically do not 
want to sue: they want an APOLOGY an acknowledgement that they have been 
wronged. Most have the strength to go back if they knew they were going to 
be taken seriously and not dismissed off handedly for not "getting your fantasy 
birth" like I was told by the Bendigo Hospital CEO a few years back (sorry but 
these days I name names. It is the only right I have 
left.)

Do not 
fob off people like Janet and myself, we are the type of people who are angry, 
hurt and vocal yes-but we are the ones who units can learn from. the only 
way to improve things it to ask the ones who are not happy. The majority 
of unhappy people don't know what to say or who to say it to. Use people 
like Janet and myself as very open in tracks into just how stuffed this sort of 
thing can leave women (sorry Janet, but you know what I mean!:o)). We are 
the type of people who should be invited to come back and talk to the 
staff. we are classified as extreme minority...only by those who chose to 
see us as that. If you ask us, we will tell you that we are NOT a minority 
in any way shape or form.

Like 
Janet, I have a number of things that we can do to support women suffering 
this. Nothing is impossible. It all comes down to someone actually 
recognizing there is a problem and then be willing to do something about 
it.

once 
again, I mean no disrespect for anyone on this list. I only ever want 
people to think from a different view point for a few 
seconds.

with 
light and love

Jo



  


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Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread Janet Fraser
I'm sorry to hear of your personal experience, Judy, it's so common and so
ignored. I'm sure that the work you've done has been both informed, and
blessed by this sadness in your own life. Sometimes great things come from
tragedy!
Love to you,
J

- Original Message - 
From: Judy Chapman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 8:17 PM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support


 I am sure that debriefing helps even if it does not cure. I
 remember one particular woman at my previous place of work who
 rang me many times and needed to talk about her EM CS (possible
 not necessary) and I felt sad for her when I left there as we
 had not finished debriefing. I think it helped a bit but she was
 still a bit of a mess.
 For my self, I would loved to have had a sympathetic ear, it
 took me nearly 25 years to come to terms with the 2 CS that I
 had. Fortunately I have been able to channel into midwifery,
 trying hard not to let women get the raw deal that I had.
 Cheers
 Judy


 --- Nicole Carver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  HI Mary,
  I remember reading about that research and being surprised. I
  have discussed
  it with the psych nurse employed where I work, who spends time
  nearly every
  day with women who have experienced traumatic births (or
  perceived them to
  be even when we might not have called them such). She feels it
  does help.
  Even one visit can help women who want to understand what
  happened to them
  and why. Some require much more, and thankfully our maternity
  support
  workers are great with these women. However, it is a tragedy
  that we need to
  have these workers. They do also work with antenatal and
  postnatal
  depression.
  I can't remember the specifics, but I don't recall being
  particularly
  impressed with the methodology of the study that you mention.
  And if women
  want to talk about their experience they should be able to,
  whether it is
  formal debriefing or whatever. I suppose you don't want to
  treat all women
  the same, ie what is appropriate debriefing for one woman,
  would not
  necessarily work for another. If you did try to treat them the
  same it would
  not be surprising if it did not work.
  Nicole Carver.
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mary
  Murphy
Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 10:59 AM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support
 
 
I believe there is some research out there that looked at
  de-briefing
  women after birth, particularly traumatic births.  As I
  remember it, the
  research did not show that this debriefing had particularly
  helpful
  outcomes.  Of course it is all in the Who, the When and the
  How.  Does
  anyone remember it?  Mary Murphy
 
 
 
 
 
 --
--
  --
 
Andrea wrote:
 
Any suggestions. Should all women have a follow up
  appointment with the
  midwife who was at her birth, is this appropriate as they may
  have been part
  of the problem, should all women have a follow up appointment
  but the woman
  be allowed to choose who she wants the appointment with, at
  what stage would
  this be appropriate, 2 weeks, 8 weeks 3 months? How does this
  fit with the
  MCH nurses who are now involved in the woman's on going care?
  How does her
  doctor, be it her own GP, obst or the one who attended (or
  not) her birth
  be involved in this?
 
 
 




 
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[ozmidwifery] hyperthyroidism

2006-02-04 Thread Michelle Windsor
Hi,Just wondering if anyone can help. I have a friend with hyperthyroidism (diagnosed during the pregnancy). She is using alternative treatments as well as taking some medication, but her levels are still elevated. The problem is that the doctors now want to induce her (she is 39+ weeks now). She is keen to avoid induction. Does anyone know what the risks are to the baby (as in percentages)? The stuff I've read just says there is an increase of still birth but is not specific. Thanks in advance.Michelle
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Messenger 7.0: Free worldwide PC to PC calls

RE: [ozmidwifery] telemetry ctg machine?

2006-02-04 Thread Ken WArd
I can't remember

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Julie Garratt
Sent: Saturday, 4 February 2006 12:08 AM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] telemetry ctg machine?


Wow, The bath, what brand was it?
- Original Message - 
From: Ken WArd [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 5:29 PM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] telemetry ctg machine?


I have also used one in the bath

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Kathy
 McCarthy-Bushby
 Sent: Thursday, 2 February 2006 11:15 PM
 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
 Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] telemetry ctg machine?


 I find using telemitry units helpful for women planning vbac birth, where
 the hospital policy requires the woman to be continually monitored in
 labour, but the telemitry unit allows the woman to be mobile as well. I
 guess it could be considered a compromise.
 kathy
 - Original Message -
 From: Julie Garratt [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
 Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 4:01 PM
 Subject: [ozmidwifery] telemetry ctg machine?


 Hi wise midwives,
 Do any of you know any compelling reasons or
 research on the advantages or disadvantages of using telemetry ctg 
 machines
 as apposed to the usual ones? I'm trying to get my head around whether 
 they
 are a good or bad thing to have in a practice setting and how having one
 avaliable for use changes how midwives care for women in labour.
 Thank you, Julie:)



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Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread Honey Acharya
Title: Message



As a doula what do I offer my clients in terms of 
support pre and post c-section?
Well Iwrote this before all the discussion 
happened today.

With all my clients we discuss the possibility of a 
c-section birthand as part of their "birth plan" have a c-section plan. I 
do this now because so many women seem toignore the possibility of 
c-section and say "that won't happen to me" even though they are birthing in 
places with rates of 1 in 3, or 1 in 2. Once we have done that (unless they are 
planning a c-section of course) we then put that aside and focus on the birth 
she wants. I also teach them simple tools that they can use to help them feel in 
control even when things don't go as planned so if they choose tothey can 
remain the ones making the final decision about what happens to them and their 
baby.

Postbirth I am available to debrief whenever 
they wantto and refer them in needto good independentpreg and 
postnatal counselling. Often the debriefing happens casually over time in those 
first weeks but we also make a special time to sit down and have a thorough 
debrief when the parents are ready.

I am a co-facilitator for a course/support group 
called Healing Birth for women who have had traumatic birth experiences (many 
but not all are women who have had c-sections) and already wesee trends 
with the things done and said by the same careproviders over and over 
again. Sometimes I think If only the ob's and midwives involved in these 
women's experiences could hear and see these women tell what happened from their 
point of view perhaps something might get through and change their practice 
-many of the women write letters to help them heal but very few are 
actually posted.

I think it is true that almost all women need to 
debrief their birth no matter how it wentand I have seen the positive 
changes in women after they have had the chance to debrief in a supportive place 
over a number of weeks. Some even look physically different after the 
debriefing. Not to mention the more positive empowered experiences they go on to 
have with any future babies.
The other thing with debriefing is have you noticed 
that those who don't debrief their births are still telling people the horror 
stories (up to 60 years later in the case of a family member of mine.) Often 
pregnant women are bailed up in checkout queues or odd places bya 
strangertelling them titbits oftheir birth story that perhaps would 
really have benefited from a reflective debrief.

Honey Acharya CD (CBI)
Studying BMid through UniSa

Birth Buddies - Doula
Townsville





- Original Message - 

  From: 
  Janet 
  Fraser 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:30 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs 
  support
  
  Jo, you're speaking from my 
  heart as well. I was at a meeting last year of women working to support others 
  in birth trauma. All of us had been suicidal at one point, myself included, 
  none of us had had any support from careproviders.
  I'm always happy to share my 
  journey but it rarely scores a comment on ozmid. What this means I cannot 
  judge but it makes me fear for other women in my position if we can't talk 
  about it with careproviders. It's not about blame, it's about responsibility 
  for our actions as consumers and a hope that our careproviders will also take 
  responsibility for their actions. We really need everyone to be be truly "with 
  woman" on this one, not with protocol and not with status quo.
  J
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Dean 
 Jo 
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 

Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 7:43 
PM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs 
support

I 
think it is ESSENTIAL for midwives and consumer groups to be working 
together on this one. Amazingly enough, many complaints we hear about 
are from women who feel their midwife let them down. Interesting issue 
(as I am a doula also, perception and expectation of support is of great 
interest). 

Most would agree with the fragmented care currently offered there is 
a huge reliance on trusting someone who has just walked in the door. 
anyone caring for a woman tries to do their best; but their best may not 
correspond with the woman's needs, even the 'nicest' midwife can upset 
someone unintentionally. where does the accountability lie? bit 
tricky there...probably too hard to define: but it doesn't remove the fact 
that some woman is feeling like shit.

I 
think it is important for midwives and doctors (if they would ever listen) 
to listen to the trauma experienced by women. From experience I can 
say that MY perception of a particular birth was it was positive: but to the 
woman is was shit. Care providers need to base their post birth care 
on not what defines positive to them, but what defines positive to each 

Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread Susan Cudlipp
Title: Message



This is a fascinating thread
I have a friend whose first birth was in a private 
hosp with epidural and forceps = no reason medically for the forceps and the 
epidural was not working well at that point.No one allowed her to push, 
she was made to wait for the doctor who then pulled the baby out. She was 
young and believed thatit was all normal, her ob came the next day and 
patted her on the knee and said "lucky you - no stitches, you must be very happy 
with that" She agreed at the time and went home believing she had had a 
good birth because she did not have stitches.
Next pregnancy she experienced total panic and went 
to a different (and more empathetic ob, fortunately) and demanded an elective 
C/S. He had the insight to discuss the first birth in detail and assure 
her that things would be different this time - and they were. She had a very 
healing birth experience.
My point is that the trauma she suffered was very 
real, but she was unable to identify this at the time of birth and agreed with 
all that the first birth had been fine.Ten years later she discusses this 
with me, a newly made friend, and the pain is still evident.
I do believe that many OB's do not have the 
slightest idea how much they sometimes traumatise women, whether this is due to 
women NOT complaining at the time (at least not directly to the traumatiser) and 
very few who actually complain later either, or to their (often) blase and 
overbearing attitude - believing that the delivery of a live child is the only 
important outcome.
Irecently had a situation where I personally 
wastraumatised by the brutality I witnessed, but the OB stated to me 
later that the woman was very happy with her care! This made me wonder 
about the discussion he had had with her and the slant he must have put on 
things, because I cannot imagine any woman being truly happy to have been 
subject to the assault that I witnessed.
My CNM at the time told me that I could not state 
that the couple had been traumatised, because it was MY perception and theirs 
may have been different - true enough I guess but.:-(

One only has to listen to women of all ages and 
backgrounds - we all love talking about our births, good or bad, the joy 
or the pain stays with us forever.

On a more positive note - this week I was 2nd 
midwife at a delightful birth with a lovely couple. There was a persistent 
and prolonged 'anterior lip' and she seemed to take a very long time to get past 
that point. As I was just standing quietly awaiting I remembered something 
someone posted a while back and thought I would try it so I said to her "What is 
your biggest fear right now?" She didn't answer for a couple of 
contractions then suddenly burst out " My biggest fear is that I won't be able 
to birth the baby" What do you know - lip went and baby started to 
appear!
So thanks to whoever it was who posted that one - 
it's good to tap into all this wonderful midwifery wisdom.

Sue

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do 
nothing"Edmund Burke

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Dean 
   Jo 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 5:00 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] Post cs 
  support
  
  Interestingly last year our South Australian Gov held 
  an inquiry into post natal depression and direct links to birth- cs 
  specifically. I sat there and listened to a private OB who said "none of 
  my patients are unhappy with their cs".
  
  how 
  would he know? when does he ask? who does he think he 
  is?
  
  yes 
  Andrea, the problem is a difficult one to address but I think there are 
  definatley ways to start. Inclusion of PTSD during antenatal classes and 
  a handout describing the difference between PND and PTSD; a list of possible 
  contacts of support from outside the hospital and perhaps maybe one within. 
  Find out if someone can be appointed a specific consumer relations counselor 
  with expertise in PTSD and birth at the unit who acts as the consumers 
  advocate or point of call, actively encourage any birthing woman (but 
  especially those who have had difficult or emergency births) to contact this 
  person to at least register their concerns regardless to when it 
  happened. This person could also be used to document the cases and make 
  links to particular behaviours or procedures that cause harm and even 
  individuals who are repeat offenders in offending - then they could be 
  encouraged or even enforced to get educated or get out.
  
  Units need to actively support the consumer groups in 
  their area. Advertise the details of consumer groups and LISTEN to the 
  group's findings and feedback-good, bad and ugly. 
  
  
  Educate women about the realities of birth in our 
  current system. This is a hard one as it would be easy to tell them that this 
  is the way it can be but it doesn't need to be or worse, tell them this is the 
  way it can be 

Re: [ozmidwifery] hyperthyroidism

2006-02-04 Thread pinky mckay



Hi Michelle,
I cant offer any help re risks to baby -I have 
Graves disease athough being an autoimmune disorder it went away during my last 
pregnancy ( 14 years ago). Darn thing came back almost a year ago.

Hyper thyroid is hell!!! Palpitations/elevated BP/ 
anxiety/ exhaustion/ extreme hunger with weight loss(you might think this 
sounds like fun but sadly its a bitch to be up 2 hourly to feed -yourself!). I 
had never had anxiety/ panic before and wonder how many women who are diagnosed 
with pnd actually have a thyroid problem - anxiety/ palpitations go when the 
levels balance.

Proper diagnosis and treatment is important for the 
mother's health -mine escalated very quickly and required a radioactive scan to 
diagnose properly. Obviously this cant be done on a pregnant woman so it 
probably depends on her TSH levels what would be the best choice re induction/ 
treatment. Is she seeing an endocrinologist? I have found that not all doctors 
really know their stuff re thyroid.

Recently, despite pleading that my symptoms had 
returned was given everything from 24 hr heart monitoring ( yep 
speeding!).to being advised to take a range of meds from calcium 
channelblockers to anti deporessants- none of which were necessary 
once I finally did a blood test and altered my carbimazole (thyroid suppressant) 
-although this has takena couple of months of see-sawing.According 
to Hale thyroid meds areok during breastfeeding - just monitor baby's 
levels. However, rest is vital/ hot weather plays havoc and so does stress/ 
overdoing things.

Thyroid Australia have a website with links to 
other thyroid info. They seem to need membership to access complete articles but 
I do know that Raelene, director at Knox Private recently attended a conf 
run by thyroid Austraia redisorders during pregnancy sothey should 
have some info or a name to refer to.

Thyroid Australia 
HomeProvides personal support, counselling, 
information and training. Aims to raiseawareness and interest in 
thyroid conditions.www.thyroid.org.au/ 

I am interested what alternative treatment she is 
taking.

Pinky

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Michelle Windsor 
  To: Ozmidwifery 
  Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 10:27 
  PM
  Subject: [ozmidwifery] 
  hyperthyroidism
  
  Hi,
  
  Just wondering if anyone can help. I have a friend with 
  hyperthyroidism (diagnosed during the pregnancy). She is using 
  alternative treatments as well as taking some medication, but her levels are 
  still elevated. The problem is that the doctors now want to induce her 
  (she is 39+ weeks now). She is keen to avoid induction. Does 
  anyone know what the risks are to the baby (as in percentages)? The 
  stuff I've read just says there is an increase of still birth but is not 
  specific. Thanks in advance.
  
  Michelle
  
  
  Do you Yahoo!?Messenger 
  7.0: Free worldwide PC to PC calls


[ozmidwifery] Banned Aussie dr

2006-02-04 Thread G Lemay
This guy sounds like he's a few fries short of a Happy Meal. Gloria in 
Canada


Please see:
http://www.northernstar.com.au/localnews/storydisplay.cfm?storyid=3671261thesection=localnewsthesubsection=thesecondsubsection=

Or:
http://tinyurl.com/94n3x

Or read it here:
--
Banned Doctor claims payback 

04.02.2006 

By SHAN GOODWIN 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

A SET of old-style scales, a desk with no computer and a jar of jelly beans. 

This was Dr Peter Stewart’s surgery. 


Each patient’s information was neatly placed in a pocket on his door on a
pink or blue card, depending on their sex. 

As they came in, his secretary asked what their family members were up to. 

It was the type of practice where everyone felt at home. 

One of the last of its kind. 


Dr Stewart practised in Lismore for 43 years and, if you speak with some of
the more than 1000 patients he had on his books when he retired, he was
‘nature’s gentleman’. 


He was known as ‘Doctor Delivery’, having brought hundreds of Northern Rivers
children into the world. 


He was also known as the ‘Farmer Doctor’, being the owner of the last piece
of undeveloped farmland between Lennox Head and Ballina — prime multi-million
dollar real estate on which he runs a few hundred head of cattle. 


And now, in the twilight of his career, he has been labelled the ‘Steroid
Doctor’. 


The 76-year-old shut his Conway Street practice on January 24 after being
found guilty of professional misconduct by the NSW Medical Tribunal. 


Given the option of working only when there was another medical practitioner
on site, he chose instead to retire. 


Brought before the tribunal last November, he was prosecuted by the Health
Care Complaints Commission which had received complaints over the number of
prescriptions he had written for anabolic and androgenic steroids. 


The steroids were largely prescribed to patients who worked in the security
industry. Dr Stewart maintained he acted in the best interests of his
patients. 


I’m human, he said. And why would a human want to see another taking
veterinary supplies? This way, I could monitor and supervise their use. 


In his experience, steroid use under these circumstances had not caused
anyone damage. It is this opinion which has proven most controversial. 


But controversy is not something new to Dr Stewart and it seems he didn’t
mind upsetting the apple cart amongst the medical profession. 


Outspoken on problems with North Coast Area Health and the anaesthetists’
debate, and one of the last doctors to support the circumcision of baby boys,
Dr Stewart more than once drew criticism from his colleagues. 


But the respect he commands from patients is phenomenal. They are standing by
him, claiming his prosecution was a witch-hunt and writing to the NSW Premier
to express their disgust. In the end, that’s all that matters, says Dr
Stewart. 

What do you think? 

Phone the Star Feedback 

line on 6624 3266 or email 


[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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[ozmidwifery] bounty packs

2006-02-04 Thread wump fish

I have a problem with giving out bounty packs as it is but...

Opened one yesterday and noticed an addition hidden inside. Castlemaine  
have produced a 'dad's pack'. It includes: earplugs (so you can ignore your 
crying baby); a face mask and gloves for nappy changing; stickers saying 'I 
changed my first nappy' etc; and BEER VOUCHERS


I cannot believe that queensland health (committed to 'community health') is 
handing this message out to parents. This seems so wrong on many levels: 
first, not all women have a male partner - should they get a 'dad pack', 
could cause upset. What message are we giving fathers about their role? How 
many problems are caused by irresponsible alcohol consumption - health, 
social etc. Is it just me? Or do others think this is totally inappropriate?


Rachel

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RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread B G
There is no 'cure' for PTSD!! You just learn to manage the triggers but
even then the physiological responses sometimes get away from you. Some
people wonder why you are so serious- so would you if you had this
constant mind battle to control triggers.
Barb- chronic PTSD sufferer, 8 years after an assault and prolonged
torture by an unsupervised prisoner in an Intensive Care Unit.


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jo Bourne
Sent: Saturday, 4 February 2006 11:34 AM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support


Talking therapies may be the only cure, that certainly sounds right to
me. However I can't imagine having been raped, assaulted OR traumatised
by my birth experience and then wanting to do that talking in the place
or with the people where it happened. Perhaps in the last stages of
healing, as a final letting go/closure thing, but certainly not in the
very first days of the shock. I did not have a remotely traumatic birth
experience but have had other traumas in my life and have had a lot of
talking to do about them, I can't think of one occasion I wanted to go
back to the person/place that was the source of the trauma.

At 11:19 AM +1100 4/2/06, Janet Fraser wrote:
I remember it but I disagree with it entirely. It struck me as no more 
logical and useful than the obstetric refusal to offer OFP because a 
study showing a crude, almost silly form of it didn't have the desired 
effect. (10mins a day on hands and knees rather than the lifestyle 
operation that is true OFP) Talking therapies are pretty much the only 
cure for PTSD and that's been well demonstrated over and over. The 
one study showing otherwise holds no weight. J

- Original Message -
From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Mary Murphy
To: 
mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 10:58 AM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

I believe there is some research out there that looked at de-briefing 
women after birth, particularly traumatic births.  As I remember it,
the research did not show that this debriefing had particularly helpful
outcomes.  Of course it is all in the Who, the When and the How.  Does
anyone remember it?  Mary Murphy
 

Andrea wrote:
Any suggestions. Should all women have a follow up appointment with the

midwife who was at her birth, is this appropriate as they may have been
part of the problem, should all women have a follow up appointment but
the woman be allowed to choose who she wants the appointment with, at
what stage would this be appropriate, 2 weeks, 8 weeks 3 months? How
does this fit with the MCH nurses who are now involved in the woman's
on going care? How does her doctor, be it her own GP, obst or the one
who attended (or not) her birth  be involved in this?
 


-- 
Jo Bourne
Virtual Artists Pty Ltd
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RE: [ozmidwifery] bounty packs

2006-02-04 Thread Ken WArd
You can request material not be included in the packs, and this I would
certainly have a problem with, also. Bounty really should notify when
additions are to be included, and give people a chance to comment. Maureen

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Janet Fraser
Sent: Sunday, 5 February 2006 7:42 AM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] bounty packs


That's utterly shocking, Rachel. There's enough crap from multinationals and
no real information about bf or birth but to add that rubbish in merely adds
insult to injury.
J
- Original Message -
From: wump fish [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Sent: Sunday, February 05, 2006 7:27 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] bounty packs


 I have a problem with giving out bounty packs as it is but...

 Opened one yesterday and noticed an addition hidden inside. Castlemaine

 have produced a 'dad's pack'. It includes: earplugs (so you can ignore
your
 crying baby); a face mask and gloves for nappy changing; stickers saying
'I
 changed my first nappy' etc; and BEER VOUCHERS

 I cannot believe that queensland health (committed to 'community health')
is
 handing this message out to parents. This seems so wrong on many levels:
 first, not all women have a male partner - should they get a 'dad pack',
 could cause upset. What message are we giving fathers about their role?
How
 many problems are caused by irresponsible alcohol consumption - health,
 social etc. Is it just me? Or do others think this is totally
inappropriate?

 Rachel

 _
 Are you using the latest version of MSN Messenger? Download MSN Messenger
 7.5 today! http://messenger.msn.co.uk

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 Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.

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Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.


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Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread Janet Fraser
Dear Barb, what a truly shocking experience. I am so sorry. I completely
agree with you though. Some women in Accessing Artemis have had great
results with EFT - emotional freedom technique - which I haven't tried yet.
I also found Boronia flower essence had an amazing and instant effect on the
reruns in my head. Stopped them immediately I took the drops!
Best wishes to you,
J
- Original Message - 
From: B  G [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Sent: Sunday, February 05, 2006 11:45 AM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support


 There is no 'cure' for PTSD!! You just learn to manage the triggers but
 even then the physiological responses sometimes get away from you. Some
 people wonder why you are so serious- so would you if you had this
 constant mind battle to control triggers.
 Barb- chronic PTSD sufferer, 8 years after an assault and prolonged
 torture by an unsupervised prisoner in an Intensive Care Unit.


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jo Bourne
 Sent: Saturday, 4 February 2006 11:34 AM
 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
 Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support


 Talking therapies may be the only cure, that certainly sounds right to
 me. However I can't imagine having been raped, assaulted OR traumatised
 by my birth experience and then wanting to do that talking in the place
 or with the people where it happened. Perhaps in the last stages of
 healing, as a final letting go/closure thing, but certainly not in the
 very first days of the shock. I did not have a remotely traumatic birth
 experience but have had other traumas in my life and have had a lot of
 talking to do about them, I can't think of one occasion I wanted to go
 back to the person/place that was the source of the trauma.

 At 11:19 AM +1100 4/2/06, Janet Fraser wrote:
 I remember it but I disagree with it entirely. It struck me as no more
 logical and useful than the obstetric refusal to offer OFP because a
 study showing a crude, almost silly form of it didn't have the desired
 effect. (10mins a day on hands and knees rather than the lifestyle
 operation that is true OFP) Talking therapies are pretty much the only
 cure for PTSD and that's been well demonstrated over and over. The
 one study showing otherwise holds no weight. J
 
 - Original Message -
 From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Mary Murphy
 To:
 mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
 Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 10:58 AM
 Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support
 
 I believe there is some research out there that looked at de-briefing
 women after birth, particularly traumatic births.  As I remember it,
 the research did not show that this debriefing had particularly helpful
 outcomes.  Of course it is all in the Who, the When and the How.  Does
 anyone remember it?  Mary Murphy
 
 
 Andrea wrote:
 Any suggestions. Should all women have a follow up appointment with the

 midwife who was at her birth, is this appropriate as they may have been
 part of the problem, should all women have a follow up appointment but
 the woman be allowed to choose who she wants the appointment with, at
 what stage would this be appropriate, 2 weeks, 8 weeks 3 months? How
 does this fit with the MCH nurses who are now involved in the woman's
 on going care? How does her doctor, be it her own GP, obst or the one
 who attended (or not) her birth  be involved in this?
 


 -- 
 Jo Bourne
 Virtual Artists Pty Ltd
 --
 This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
 Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.

 --
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 Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.

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RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread B G
Thanks Janet, I have looked into EFT but its about trusting it enough to
lower your mental resistance. I have found if I lower my mental
resistance such as having a lovely massage or by doing heavy physical
work such as climbing Nourlangie Rock in the NT then I cannot have
control over triggers. The re-runs or flash backs start again, the jaw
grinding, hypervigilence and then the forgetfulness etc. It is a very
hard one to balance.
Barb

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Janet Fraser
Sent: Sunday, 5 February 2006 11:19 AM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support


Dear Barb, what a truly shocking experience. I am so sorry. I completely
agree with you though. Some women in Accessing Artemis have had great
results with EFT - emotional freedom technique - which I haven't tried
yet. I also found Boronia flower essence had an amazing and instant
effect on the reruns in my head. Stopped them immediately I took the
drops! Best wishes to you, J
- Original Message - 
From: B  G [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Sent: Sunday, February 05, 2006 11:45 AM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support


 There is no 'cure' for PTSD!! You just learn to manage the triggers 
 but even then the physiological responses sometimes get away from you.

 Some people wonder why you are so serious- so would you if you had 
 this constant mind battle to control triggers.
 Barb- chronic PTSD sufferer, 8 years after an assault and prolonged 
 torture by an unsupervised prisoner in an Intensive Care Unit.


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jo Bourne
 Sent: Saturday, 4 February 2006 11:34 AM
 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
 Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support


 Talking therapies may be the only cure, that certainly sounds right 
 to me. However I can't imagine having been raped, assaulted OR 
 traumatised by my birth experience and then wanting to do that talking

 in the place or with the people where it happened. Perhaps in the last

 stages of healing, as a final letting go/closure thing, but certainly 
 not in the very first days of the shock. I did not have a remotely 
 traumatic birth experience but have had other traumas in my life and 
 have had a lot of talking to do about them, I can't think of one 
 occasion I wanted to go back to the person/place that was the source 
 of the trauma.

 At 11:19 AM +1100 4/2/06, Janet Fraser wrote:
 I remember it but I disagree with it entirely. It struck me as no 
 more logical and useful than the obstetric refusal to offer OFP 
 because a study showing a crude, almost silly form of it didn't have 
 the desired effect. (10mins a day on hands and knees rather than the 
 lifestyle operation that is true OFP) Talking therapies are pretty 
 much the only cure for PTSD and that's been well demonstrated over 
 and over. The one study showing otherwise holds no weight. J
 
 - Original Message -
 From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Mary Murphy
 To: 
 mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
 Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 10:58 AM
 Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support
 
 I believe there is some research out there that looked at de-briefing

 women after birth, particularly traumatic births.  As I remember it,
 the research did not show that this debriefing had particularly 
 helpful outcomes.  Of course it is all in the Who, the When and the 
 How.  Does anyone remember it?  Mary Murphy
 
 
 Andrea wrote:
 Any suggestions. Should all women have a follow up appointment with 
 the

 midwife who was at her birth, is this appropriate as they may have 
 been
 part of the problem, should all women have a follow up appointment but

 the woman be allowed to choose who she wants the appointment with, at 
 what stage would this be appropriate, 2 weeks, 8 weeks 3 months? How 
 does this fit with the MCH nurses who are now involved in the woman's

 on going care? How does her doctor, be it her own GP, obst or the one 
 who attended (or not) her birth  be involved in this?
 


 --
 Jo Bourne
 Virtual Artists Pty Ltd
 --
 This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
 Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.

 --
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 Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Wish me luck...

2006-02-04 Thread Jo Watson


On 04/02/2006, at 4:13 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Hi Jo
Hope your day goes well,youre an absolutely brilliant midwife and  
have led -by-example with Will and your family choices.We all know  
how we feel going back to work after our holidays let alone THE   
most important work-break,but you will suprize yourself that  
sometimes policies  paperwork may change ,but your contribution to  
some families day is an invaluable as ever.

Take Care , Ange


Aww thanks Ange :)  You're a sweety!  My first day back was fine -  
apart from the splitting headache I had all day from being a bit  
tense and not getting much sleep.  It was a gentle ease back into  
it.  Just have to get used to all the new doctors, but there doesn't  
seem to be much new paperwork.  I have to say, though, that two of  
the four women I looked after had had a c/s!


Hope to catch up with you soon.

Love,
Jo

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RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

2006-02-04 Thread Kate Reynolds








In WA now the med students (student
doctors) in their training attend a SPEC (student pelvic examination clinic) supervised
by midwives but the teaching is done by volunteer women (teaching associates)
who not only teach the students as they perform the taking of a history, breast,
abdo, pelvic exam and pap smear for the women, they also very gently instruct them
on the subtleties of obtaining patient consent and on the appropriate language
to use during such examinations (they provide further feedback to the students
after the exam). It is very interesting to oversee as the students
(albeit it nervously) often say things such as Ok, could you just spread
your legs now or Im just going to have a feel around
in here now to which the women will say to them Did you just hear
what you asked me to do? and the students will always rephrase it until
the women is happy  usually to something like Are you comfortable
to let your knees fall apart now? or  Is it OK for me to
check you ovaries now?. Already nurses and midwives are seeing a big
turnaround in the bedside manners of our sensitive new age doctors (and are
very grateful to UWA for using more and more midwives and nurses in the design
of their teaching programs).

Cheers, Kate