RE: [Repeater-Builder] Bandpass filters
And,...what kind of radio is he trying to use for this auxiliary station ?? Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sean Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 12:04 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Bandpass filters What band is the remote base on? -Sean On Fri, 3 Jun 2005, Jed Barton wrote: Hey guys, OK, got a friend of mine who has to resolve a desense issue with a remote base. He's got 2 repeaters, 147.000, and 443.800. The antenna for the remote base is on the same tower. How can he make it so both of these repeaters won't cause interference to his remote base, and desense the hell out of it. Any ideas? Thanks, Jed Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Bandpass filters
As I was afraid of ..one of those wide band, receive everything from DC to light radios. Those radios have very little immunity to heavy local RF and are certainly not designed for operation in that type of environment close to repeaters and other 2-way systems. Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jed Barton Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 1:15 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Bandpass filters It's a duol band remote base, you can switch frequencies remotely. It's the G707 from kenwood. Thoughts? Thanks, Jed -Original Message- From: Sean [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 12:04 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Bandpass filters What band is the remote base on? -Sean On Fri, 3 Jun 2005, Jed Barton wrote: Hey guys, OK, got a friend of mine who has to resolve a desense issue with a remote base. He's got 2 repeaters, 147.000, and 443.800. The antenna for the remote base is on the same tower. How can he make it so both of these repeaters won't cause interference to his remote base, and desense the hell out of it. Any ideas? Thanks, Jed Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] I need to take 5 volts to 8 volts, and one have a schematic
The 5 volt CAS signal from the TM-V7 can very easily be converted to an 8 volt (or even higher) level by using a VP0300L switching MOSFET and pullup resistor of about 510 ohms to your 8 volt source. If logic level conversion is required, then use the VN0300L or 2N7000 MOSFET. They are available from JDR Micro Devices. If you are not familiar with these devices, they are WONDERFUL switching devices and require almost no drive current on the gate (unlike a 2N or 2N3904), so you can apply 5 volt logic levels to them directly to drive relays directly if you need to. I've used bunches of these for various tasks within our repeater systems and personal radio projects. Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joe Montierth Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 7:52 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] I need to take 5 volts to 8 volts, and one have a schematic --- w9mwq [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wonder if anyone has a simple diagram to build a small circuit from 5 volts to about 8 volts. Was told I could use an opto isolator, but am not familiar with them. I'm getting ready to interface the Kenwood TM- V7 radios to the RVS-8 voter, am told it needs at least 8 volts to run it. The TM-V7a I know has 5 volts out of the packet controller connection. I will also need to take a 3 volt up to 8 volts from my GE receiver. Any suggestions. Thanks. Mathew What you are needing is level translation of digital levels from one voltage to another. You can do it with transistors and resistors, op-amps, or other chips designed to do this. Depending on how many receivers you need to do will determine the actual easiest and cheapest solution. I did a similiar thing with an RVS-8, and used 2 LM324 op-amps to do the level shifting. Besides the 2 chips, a few resistors were required. I built the whole thing on a RS proto board. Or you could use a ULN2003 or similiar chip. Another solution is to run a 47K pullup from the RVS-8 input to 12v, and a series zener diode of about 3.9 volts to the RX COR out. This will change your 0 to 5 volt logic to 3.9 to 8.9 volt logic, which is enough to make the RVS unit work. Joe __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Triplite supply is a linear regulator type.
Mike: Your problem with the Astron 35 will most likely be a bad solder joint on the collector tab of one of the (4) 3771 transistors. We keep reminding people that have problems with Astrons that this is where to look because it is a VERY common failure mode with those supplies and how they solder the buss wire from collector to collector. If you take a pair of pliers and grab the joint at each transistor and pull on it, you will most likely find one that will simply pull off. All it takes is for one of those transistors all wired in parallel to have a bad collector solder joint and all of the source current from the supply tries to flow through the Emitter-Base junction of that one transistor that has the bad solder joint. Bingo !!! Immediate current limit mode !! Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Perryman Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 2:11 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Triplite supply is a linear regulator type. I ordered the re-fit kit (regulation board, and 4 2N3771 transistors)... when it arrives, I plant to try and revive a RS35M that crowbared anytime any load was applied just look at it funny, and it would trip!! I guess we shall see how it goes.. This supply was removed about 2yrs ago from the now defunct Metro-Vision ATV System (RIP) in Springfield, VA. I read Skipp's comments, and decided the 44 bucks was worth a shot. I was, however, stunned to learn that Astron won't process a credit card to pre-pay. Had to send a check by snail-mail... still waiting. 73 mike -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of skipp025 Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 2:01 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Triplite supply is a linear regulator type. I'm also running the same supply, the non rack mount version. (Just mounted and secured on a rack shelf) I tested the supply pretty well, it still works fine and runs very cool for the remaining duration of its stay. Got to love that burst electrolytic smell and goo. Too bad the crowbar didn't fire. Before Astron's latest pc board upgrade (which uses my suggested pre-regulation circuit approach), they also needed a crowbar circuit that worked. (the early crowbar design was much subject to mis-fires and not-at-home no fire operation). Both the regulator pre-regulation and crow bar circuits in newer Astron Supplies have been re-engineered and updated. I now consider the current generation of Astron Analog DC Power Supplies to be much more reliable. cheers, skipp DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I should mention that I run a 40 amp tripplite power supply non-rack version. About a year ago it blew the PA and controller on my 64 repeater. For some reason the crow bar refused to fire and short out the supply The problem was electrolytic capacitors that were 16V in areas where 25 volts and alot of ripple are present. Tripplite is famous for not giving out schematics, but what I can tell is these caps were filtering the AC voltage from the transformers secondary tap for the main PCB. You can also put a voltmeter on AC and touch the output terminals and measure the ripple I think it was at 350mV for me before exploding and about 15mV now. I don't know what failed first but I had the capacitors explode and spray electrolyte on everything in the case. I had to replace all the active components on the PCB, the 4 pass transistors and the 2 capacitors on the PCB, used 35V parts this time. Feel the face of the power supply, if it is about 130-140 degrees, you may have a problem. I thought it was normal, but on repair the face is running fairly cold. Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.
Did you check the TX-RX web site ? http://www.txrx.com/ If your model is not listed then drop them an e-mail. They are usually quite responsive. Ron WW8RR From: T.J. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 11:18 AM To: Builder Repeater Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer. What info, if any does anyone have on a TX RX Band pass cavity duplexer, model number 89-37-06-CM? It says on the label 144-174 Mhz, but I want to know the specs. The usual, loss and isolation and all that other fun stuff. The duplexer is made up of eight, four inch wide, fifteen inch tall,band pass cans. Four band pass cans transmit side, four band pass cans receive side, no notchs. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, T.J. Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Desense im guessing/Preamp-n-Pads
Nice web site and tool for attenuator calculations... Just be sure to use only carbon composition resistors for RF attenuators...no wire wound or spiral-wound precision resistors.they become reactive at RF frequencies. Ron Rogers WW8RR -Original Message- From: Laryn Lohman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 25, 2005 9:15 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Desense im guessing/Preamp-n-Pads Or build your own pad using values from this site: http://www.g4bks.fsnet.co.uk/attn.html Have a great Easter weekend. Laryn K8TVZ Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Hyper Terminal
Title: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Hyper Terminal Procomm or ProcommPlus is used pretty widely for packet TNC control and programming the ACC controller equipment. Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: Don [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2005 12:21 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Hyper Terminal I have a Digital audio recorder that is Programmed by the PC But I did see this Note, The device may not Program Properly with the HyperTerminal program that comes with Microsoft Windows all versions, So the question I have What else is around that I could try, Any info will be greatly appreciated. Thanks Don KA9QJG Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Comm Spec TP-38
The TP-38 only displays what tones are programmed to be enabled for decoding. There is a keypad command to step through and display all active tones that are enabled. Refer to the manual to validate your programming Ron Rogers WW8RR -Original Message- From: skipp025 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 1:49 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Comm Spec TP-38 Does the tone panel even display frequencies above 100Hz, just not decode them? That's a software problem or programing. Most other problems are hardware related. Just running a test sub tone in from an external source will tell you mucho. skipp Brent [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Question... Has anybody had a problem with the Communications Specialists TP-38 Tone Panel not decoding PL tones about 100.0hz it decodes from below 100.0 just fine and 100.0 but 100.0 is little slow decoding but above 100.0 it just does nothing.. Thanks Brent -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.2.0 - Release Date: 2/21/2005 --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses at TNWEB LLC] Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Wanted to Buy or Trade
Title: Wanted to Buy or Trade Looking to buy a functional VHF exciter module from a Uniden ARH-351 VHF repeater. Or.I have a UHF exciter from a model ARU-251 willing to trade for the VHF exciter. Please contact me directly off the list you can help me out. Thanks. Ron WW8RR [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Micor PA question
Title: Micor PA question If it is the 150-162 version (TLD1693), it will work OK but you will run out of tuning range on the 2 trimmer caps when you try to tune it to the 146-148 range. You can solder 10 pf (2Kv) caps in parallel to those 2 trimmer caps to optimize the tuning and optimize the power transfer between stages get a few more watts output. The purists in the group will tell you that other more extensive modifications should be made to convert it to a TLD1692 (142-150) but many unmodified TLD 1693 amps have worked for years on 2 meter repeaters without all the serious surgery . Ron Rogers WW8RR From: Kevin Bednar [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2005 10:38 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Micor PA question I have a 110 watt PA from a micor base, that was on the low end of the 150mhz range. Am I correct in assuming this should tune up fine on the 2 meter band? Also, I believe these require about 400mw drive but I want to confirm it. I think I have the schematics for this someplace but have to dig them up if needed. TIA to all. Kevin K2KMB Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Adjacent Channel Noise, how far should it be heard
That's easyjust wind up about 25-30 feet of RG-174 coax and install that between the 2 watt exciter and the Vocom Amp. That wound up coax will give you about a 3 Db loss at 146 mhz and supply only 1 watt to the amp instead of the 2 watts. Very simple and highly reliable...nothing to break. Ron Rogers WW8RR -Original Message- From: w9mwq [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 12:53 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Adjacent Channel Noise, how far should it be heard I want to say thanks to all those that replied on this matter, I believe I have it fixed. Found that the deviation had changed and was running at about 6 Khz wide. Not sure why, unless a pot had a dirty spot on it. Everything looked ok on the spectrum analyzer. Someone asked why I was running so much power. Not that I am a power hog, but I took off the Motorola PA that everyone said would go bad, and replaced it with a Vocom 200 watt amp, just have not built a pad large enough to drop the power output. 2 watts drives the PA at 200 watts. All that will have to change when the antenna goes up at 150 feet. Again, want to say thanks for the quick responses. Mathew And yes the Diamond Antenna is only a temp setup, as it will be replaced with a DB224 when the new tower goes up. Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Adjacent Channel Noise, how far shouldit be heard
Jim: I assumed that a seasoned repeater owner would know to do that as a precaution. But, if the repeater suffers from desense coming from RF at the 1 watt level leaking from a small roll of coax, then the repeater has more serious problems than can be overcome by 1 small shielded box. This coax attenuator trick using RG-174 has been used on many a repeater using a Motorola 400 Mw drive amp (UHF or VHF) and works just fine. Ron Rogers WW8RR -Original Message- From: Jim B. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 2:12 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Adjacent Channel Noise, how far shouldit be heard Except that RG-174 is NOT 100% shielded, and he is using a duplexer. If it was mounted in a metal box, and the box was grounded to the exciter chassis, it *might* work without causing desense...maybe. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Rogers, Ron wrote: That's easyjust wind up about 25-30 feet of RG-174 coax and install that between the 2 watt exciter and the Vocom Amp. That wound up coax will give you about a 3 Db loss at 146 mhz and supply only 1 watt to the amp instead of the 2 watts. Very simple and highly reliable...nothing to break. Ron Rogers WW8RR -Original Message- From: w9mwq [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 12:53 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Adjacent Channel Noise, how far should it be heard I want to say thanks to all those that replied on this matter, I believe I have it fixed. Found that the deviation had changed and was running at about 6 Khz wide. Not sure why, unless a pot had a dirty spot on it. Everything looked ok on the spectrum analyzer. Someone asked why I was running so much power. Not that I am a power hog, but I took off the Motorola PA that everyone said would go bad, and replaced it with a Vocom 200 watt amp, just have not built a pad large enough to drop the power output. 2 watts drives the PA at 200 watts. All that will have to change when the antenna goes up at 150 feet. Again, want to say thanks for the quick responses. Mathew And yes the Diamond Antenna is only a temp setup, as it will be replaced with a DB224 when the new tower goes up. Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Adjacent Channel Noise, how far should it be heard
What does the repeater output signal look like on a spectrum analyzer ?? That's the only way to tell if something is wrong with the transmit signal. It cannot simply be determined by what someone else observes on their radio. Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: w9mwq [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 17, 2005 4:09 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Adjacent Channel Noise, how far should it be heard I had something brought to my attention yesterday on my 2 meter repeater. ABout 15 miles away, I'm being told that my repeater can be heard on the output for about 20 to 25 Khz away. From what I am told, it is not legitable, but it's there. The transmitter is a Majorrie Hi-Pro running about 2.5 watts and the PA is a Vocom 200 Watts. I'm getting right about 165 watts out of the duplexer, fed through 7/8 hardline 160' to the top of the tower into a Diamond Dual Band Antenna with a vsr of 1.1 with 1/10 of watt reflected. Is this normal, or is there a problem. Mathew Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] question on repeater set up...
If this is for an Amateur Radio repeater, then you need to start by researching the South Eastern Repeater Association and contacting the appropriate frequency coordinator for your state. SERA is the organization that coordinates Amateur repeaters for Kentucky. www.sera.org Ron WW8RR From: Ed Lemley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 9:38 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] question on repeater set up... I am wanting to know how hard would it be to get 2 frequencies for a repeater. It will be in the VHF band, and I don't have a preference of what frequencies it is. And if it helps, i live in southeastern KY. Thanks Ed Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! What will yours do? Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Touch lamps
Title: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Touch lamps I have always had great luck in eliminating the RFI element (turning them on and off from your RF) of touch lamps by installing 2.5 mH chokes in the touch sense lead of the lamp. Install the chokes as close as you can to the PC board or electronic module. The choke can be rated as low as possible on it's current capacity. J.W. Miller has some very small 2.5 mH chokes. Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: JOHN MACKEY [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 2004 10:11 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Touch lamps Yea, I know it is a little off topic for this group. But this is one of the most technically competant groups around! Has anyone here had any success stories in dealing the the RF noise received from RFI given to Touchlamps?? I have a problem where every time I get on 75 meters/40 meters/15 meters (with 100 watts off my balanced fed dipole), I make the neighbor's touch-lamp lights go off/on/bright/dim with my modulation. Also, the lights put out RF trash starting at 210 Kc every 210 Kc all the way up to 12 meters!!! right now my plan is to build a low pass filter to let the 210 Kc signal for the touch-lamp pass but filter out all above 210 Kc. I got plans for this from QST April 1995 pages 72-73. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] 600 - 10k ohm Interface
John's correct..a low impedance output will usually drive a higher impedance input withno problem...try it and see if it works, Kevin. The reverse (high impedance output driving low impedance input) requires more "engineering" .like a cheap audio transformer ? Ron WW8RR -Original Message-From: WD7F - John in Tucson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Sunday, December 12, 2004 7:04 PMTo: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 600 - 10k ohm Interface You guys are all purists. Hook it up and see if it works. de WD7F John in Tucson - Original Message - From: Chuck Kelsey To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, December 12, 2004 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 600 - 10k ohm Interface I believe Radio Shack sells a matching transformer that will work. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: Kevin Natalia To: Repeaters Users Group ; Repeater Builder Users Group Sent: Sunday, December 12, 2004 6:14 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] 600 - 10k ohm Interface Hi All, I need a simple interface for a 600 ohm output radio to a controller which accepts 10k ohm. This isa RX not TX. I don't want to make a circuit board if I don't need to. Any ideas? Regards Kevin. Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Greenlee punch info
Title: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Greenlee punch info 5/8 Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: johnmichaelwelton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 12:02 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Greenlee punch info I want to put some N barrell antenna connectors through a GE indoor cabinet. What size Greenlee punch do I need? tnx, John Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] snide remarks
I agree.let's get back to technical discussions now and away from setting technically worthy criteria of someone posting a question on the list Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: Buley, Kenneth L (GE Consumer Industrial) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 11:07 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] snide remarks Is this the Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com or Whiner's Club Kenneth Buley Bullitt County DES CD-2 Bullitt County Red Cross/Certified ECRVDriver/Operator BC-6 Bullitt County ARES\RACES Coordinator KY4DES Mr. Grizzard- So now I ask YOU, are you normally this oblivious, or is this a special case? As you state below, the thread evolved into discussing coordination. The squelch sense issue was *WELL* addressed in recent threads here. It is also covered on several web sites in very, very basic transistor logic handbooks. Why do you propose beating that dead horse, Mr. Grizzard? snip snip snip snip snip snip snip snip snip snip snip snip Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] radial tire static?
Dave: I remember when this was a problem that seemed to surface years ago more with fiberglass belted radial tires than with steel beltedand also a problem with the older bias-ply tires. One thing I heard many years ago from one mechanic that really seemed to understand the problem was to wait for a rainy day with 80-90% humidity in the air, then one by one, release the air from your tires and re-inflate them with this wetter ambient air from your air compressor. If your tires didn't have any leaks then the air inside the tires would remain highly humid and keep the static bled off. But, I also understand that some sports car and luxury car tire purists are listening to the BS being preached from some tire dealers which recommend inflating with a dry gas (Nitrogen) to keep the Oxygen in atmospheric air from attacking the rubber content of the internal tire !! Of course, they want to charge a premium price to inflate your tires. Dry Nitrogen gas would tend to make for a terrible build up of static in a rotating tire. Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: na6df [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 4:12 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] radial tire static? Not repeater related so much, but I thought the great minds here might know... One of my corporate bosses, a ham, is having his bridgestone tires generate static while they are rolling, interfering with AM radio reception. I know somebody used to sell a powder to put in the tires that dissapated the static, but can't find any info on it now. It has to do with some problem with low rolling resistance tires that have low carbon content.. Any ideas? thanks! dave Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: repeater nostalgia
I built the first micro-processor controlled repeater (what was believed to be) in the state of Ohio back in 1973. It was the WR8AET 146.85 repeater and the processor I used was the very first Intel microprocessor, the 4004 which was a 4 bit machine with 16 instructions !! This repeater eventually became the W8VP repeater. Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: wb6ymh [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 11:34 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Kinda of a strange question Since we into nostalga what's the earliest date of a microprocessor based repeater or remote base controller? I built a Z80 based controller during 79 and 80 that ended up with 6 K of assembly language and 4 radio ports. As soon as I replace the watchdog timer's capacitor (again) it'll be back on the air. 73's WB6YMH --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks Is anyone aware of the earliest use of a synthesized remote base on an amateur repeater? One that allowed full frequency agility? My take is that it happened in 1976 (and of course, I think I know who did it g). Ken --- --- President and CTO - Arcom Communications Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories. http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html We now offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages! AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000 http://www.irlp.net Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] RC-96 EEPROM
Hey folks, A 6264 is an 8K X 8 CMOS Static RAM..when you unplug it, it loses all data. The 2864 is an 8K X 8 CMOS EEPROM...does not lose data when unplugged. They are completely different Ron Rogers WW8RR (previously WB8ERB) -Original Message- From: Bryon Jeffers K0BSJ [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 30, 2004 11:56 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] RC-96 EEPROM Yes the controller boots fine and functions as it should... Very strange the I see the 6264 blank as you do. Maybe someone else will have some input on this? Bryon K0BSJ At 10:11 AM 8/30/2004, you wrote: On Mon, 30 Aug 2004 08:11:25 -0500, Bryon Jeffers K0BSJ wrote: I attempted to get the binary info out of my U30 and found it was blank. Seems I'm having the same problem here as well Bryon. Does the controller boot normally with that eeprom in place? I have verified that the eprom programmer works on all the other eproms I check this weekend I'm starting to think that the 6264 is slightly different from a standard 2864, but the 2864 works in it's place?? This was a private email to me, so I hope you don't mind me sending it to the list Bryon. Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] RE: RC-96 EEPROM
Tedd: I have not been following this thread so I have no idea of the whole story here. I was simply explaining the difference between the 6264 and the 2864. But, many years ago someone made a low profile socket for the 6216 and 6264 chips that had a built-in battery and blocking diode. To give your CMOS RAM chips battery backed capability, you simply plugged this special socket onto the existing socket on the PC board, then plugged in your CMOS RAM chips. Could it be someone retrofitted this RC-96 with this mod ?? Ron Rogers WW8RR -Original Message- From: Tedd Doda [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 30, 2004 1:00 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] RE: RC-96 EEPROM On Mon, 30 Aug 2004 12:38:08 -0400, Rogers, Ron wrote: A 6264 is an 8K X 8 CMOS Static RAM..when you unplug it, it loses all data. The 2864 is an 8K X 8 CMOS EEPROM...does not lose data when unplugged. Hi Ron: Well that would make sense! My only question arises is how can the base data be loaded into the 6264 if it looses it's data when unplugged? As the RC-96 doesn't have any backup battery, how is the data saved? Cross-posted to the ACC list. Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Getting frequencies for UHF repeater eithe r commercial or ham?
Then you need to look into Family Radio Service radios and options or GMRS systems. Ron Rogers WW8RR -Original Message- From: Dakota Summerhawk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 4:51 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Getting frequencies for UHF repeater either commercial or ham? OK, I do have a ham license and the repeater is going to be for just two users me and my wife who doesn't have a license for ham right now. Thinking about Commercial service and the upkeep would be done by me so its not really going be making any money per se. Dakota -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 12:23 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Getting frequencies for UHF repeater either commercial or ham? Well having an understanding of repeaters is one thing. Being licensed within a service that allows you to put up a repeater is something else. Unless you are a ham radio operator putting up your own repeater (and you have the funds to support this) or a club repeater which the club will support you may want to think about the business end of this. Supply and Demand. What is in your area and Who's going to use it? How much will it cost to provide the service ? How much income will it provide ? (can it pay for it's self ? and your efforts?.) and then just the rest of the usual business questions how to build the business and keep it operating. hope this helps .bob The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! Yahoo! Groups Links --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.726 / Virus Database: 481 - Release Date: 7/22/2004 Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Astron Over Voltage or Crowbar issues
Sounds like the classic Astron cold solder joint on one of the output transistors problem. Many an Astron has suffered from this... or maybe only able to supply about 5 amps (50 amp supply) before it crashes. Be sure to check the buss wires connecting all 8 of the collectors of the output transistors. While the supply is powered down grab each connecting buss wire with a pair of pliers right near the collector connection. Tug on each one to see if any of them break lose. All it takes is for one of the 8 connections to be bad.when it does, the Base to Emitter junction of that transistor becomes forward biased and the main Driver transistor then becomes the primary current source element for the whole supply and the rest of the 7 transistors are doing nothing to hold up their end of the load sharing. If you do have one transistor with a solder problem, what you are probably experiencing is a quick in-rush of current when your small radios first have power applied. This in-rush current probably exceeds the capability of the driver transistor, the current sensing circuitry, and the unit goes into over current protection by shutting down. Ron Rogers WW8RR -Original Message- From: Daron J. Wilson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 4:12 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Astron Over Voltage or Crowbar issues I've read the description on the repeater builder website of the astron issues and circuits, but not sure if that will solve what I'm currently experiencing. I've got a 50 amp rack mount supply, the problem with them is that if there is much of a load or draw on them when you DO restore AC power, they go into this protect mode. I've got a couple small radios on them, but when power comes on there is an immediate current draw and that seems to lock the power supply down. The only way I have found to get it back is to turn it off, disconnect the load, plug it in, then hook the load back up. Is it all the same issue and will the overvotage circuit solve that as well? Thanks in advance, Daron J. Wilson, RCDD ) ) Telecom Manager ( ( LH Morris Electric, Inc. ) ) (541) 265-8067 office _|| mmm! (541) 265-7652 fax ( || coffee! (541) 270-5886 cellular \|| [EMAIL PROTECTED]|| Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] looking for two or three d8085ac-2 8 bit 4 0 pin prossors 3 mhz?
Lots of parts houses carry the good old Intel 8085 and 80C85 workhorses. Check Digikey, JDR Micro Devices, Mouser, etc. Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: randy kisthardt [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2004 10:07 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] looking for two or three d8085ac-2 8 bit 40 pin prossors 3 mhz? hello im looking to buy two or so d8085ac-2 prossors to repair my acc rc- 96, that got a surg on the phone line. the prossor was pulling down the 5 volt rail and pulling it out retured the 5 volts. im sure its bad. everthing elce looks ok so far ,the connect relay is toast but i got one of them and the transistor that turns it on . i need a prossor to go aney further with it. i miss the old controller all readey. we have been getting bad storms here in south kentucky latley. i know now that i shuld have grounded the ground terminal on the back of the controller. i thought that the signal grounds were the same. the termnial grounds the discharge tube.im learning the hard way ha ha so if you got one or two you can part with or know of a place i can get a few reasonable or a good sub with out big minumin order please let me know thanks randy AG4ZQ Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Help on Interference
Remind the fellow using 100 watts to talk to a repeater that he could be in violation of Part 97 rules on using minimal power. We had a similar situation and interference to our one 2 meter repeater on the mountain and we had to remind the guy of the Laws of Radio Physics, power, distance, and Part 97 !! Ron WW8RR -Original Message- From: Mathew Quaife [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 3:46 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Help on Interference Well I narrowed down parts of the problem, the first being the wide as a 2x4 Regency receiver, which is going to be changed out, and the other is a local ham using 100 watts to talk to this machine, when in it really only needs about 7 watts to hit it full quieting with minimal antenna height. My repeater actually is just gettting underway, new coordination. So each day is a new adventure for me. Having not played with FM and etcfor about 15 years, still trying to remember, kinda hard to get all the cobwebs out of the brain. Thanks. Mathew - Original Message - From: Virden Clark Beckman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 2:26 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Help on Interference Try using the math on the IF of your rx to see what is making them mix on your freq, how long have the 2 machines been co-existing on-the-air? If it were one or 2 users you would know it rather than the entire time the machine is active, can you see how clean the signal is from that machine, I doubt if 50 miles is gonna make trouble unless the have some really wide spurs and then every open rx is gonna see some falsing. w9mwq wrote: I have a repeater with an antenna up about 60 feet in the air, Frequency of 146.925/146.325 minus offset. Receiever sensitity is .25 micorovolt at 12DB, seems to be purring along just fine. IFR show the receive to be on frequency. Here's the problem, there is a repeater about 50 air miles away, on the pair of 146.910/146.31o minus offset. There repeater is getting into my receiver, causing the repeater to key up. There is no pl on my repeater at this time. They sound like they are on sideband when they come in. I can goto the 91 machine, hear them talking, when they quit, the interference quits. I took my IFR and inserted a tone on 146.310 into my receiver, it took 15 microvolts to open the squelch of my receiver. Is it my receiver, which is a Regency receiver, or is it the person transmitting on the other machine. I could see if it was the 91 machine if all it was doing was killing my receive, but it's actually keying up the repeater. SO my guess would be it would have to be the person talking on the 91 repeater. I hope I explained this right. Any suggestions. Thanks. Mathew -- 73...Clark Beckman N8PZD Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Help needed finding sources of interferenc e
Describe the interferencevoice, digital, video, dead carrier, etc ?? Ron Rogers -WW8RR- -Original Message- From: Dave Karr [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 11:32 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Help needed finding sources of interference Residents of lower Michigan, I'm in need of some help identifying two different sources of interference, which appear to be originating somewhere in lower Michigan, to UHF systems in the Milwaukee area. The systems being interfered with are commercial systems, one of which is a public safety repeater. The nature of the offending signals are continuos in nature, and neither appear to be licensed. As the propagation across the lake is enhanced, they become a problem. Its hard to know how much to trust beam headings under these sorts of situations, but bearings taken seem to indicate an origin, of both signals, slightly north of Milwaukee. While it would be wonderful if the FCC was actually interested in pursuing complaints of unlicensed operation on their own, at this point I'm prepared to offer cash rewards to those which provide a verifiable source of these transmissions. If you are able to help, please contact me directly for more information. Thanks, --Dave Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] To adjust or not....
I wouldn't touch it either. Reducing the TX power is probably the best thing at this time. However, read on If you recently rebuilt the final amp stage and changed components, chances are you have slightly changed the characteristic impedance of the amp output and this is affecting the match between the amp and the duplexer. (tuning an amp for maximum RF output at the antenna port of a duplexer after replacing the PA component DOES NOT ensure that you have tuned the amp to match the impedance of the duplexer) This could cause a number of issues including the duplexer's reject freq. notch setting on the transmit side of the duplexer. This could allow more white noise from the transmitter to get into the receiver if the notch is not set right on the RX frequency. This mismatch can also cause intermodulation or spurious components to be generated inside the PA section itself. Now, I assume you are using a band pass, band reject duplexer. If you would feel better by adjusting something and if there are separate RX reject notch tuning adjustments in the TX section of the duplexer (like Sinclair or TX-RX uses), I would only try adjusting them for best RX quieting while the TX is on the air and there is a weak signal being received by the RX. Start with the reject notch adjustment in the can closest to the amplifier stage. I certainly would not try to adjust the main Pass frequency plungers on any of the duplexer cans at this time. Ron -WW8RR- (formerly WB8ERB) -Original Message- From: Jim B. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 1:15 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] To adjust or not Tim Shephard wrote: I service a public safety repeater. It's a master II. About 6-8 months ago I rebuilt the PA, replacing the two output transistors, caps, etc... I even added a couple of fans and it's been working great at around 40 watts. Lately we have been having some trouble which has been nicely termed the whale noise. After dispatch would transmit via a wire line, very infrequently we would have a noise come through or cover their transmissions. Yesterday I checked everything and found I was getting some desense, around 8db. I looked at the duplexer and it looks like it has not been touched in around 25 years. The shafts are rusty, cables look very fragile. So, I decided not to try and retune it because I feel something inside may snap and I'd be worse off then I am now. So I adjusted the transmit power down to 25 watts and no desense. We are planning to replace the radio system in the next year, so I don't' really want to invest in a new duplexer. What do you guys think? -Tim I think you did the right thing. If it works ok at 25W, leave it alone and hope it lasts until you get the new box. Replacing the cables between the duplexer and station is easy enough, since length isn't important, if you suspect they may be a problem. The cables between cans in the duplexer are a different matter-length is critical, and unless one goes completely, I wouldn't mess with it, again since it's all gonna get replaced soon. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel repeater antenna question-unbalanc ed radiating loops
Yep folks, theseare commonly referred to as "Phasing Harnesses" just like we use in the contest circles to stack multiple antennas and phase them so the feed point impedance still "sees" 50 ohms at the design frequency. Ron Rogers-WB8ERB- -Original Message-From: Steve Grantham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 3:14 PMTo: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel repeater antenna question-unbalanced radiating loops I think you will find that the feed point is 50-Ohms whenfeeding one of these single unbalanceddipole elements.The harness is for makingthe multiple elements on the array look like one elementto thetransmission line. Look at their (DB's) folded unipole antenna for low band. It's aground-plane antenna with a similar radiating element that's fed with 50-Ohm line. The difference is that it's got radials on it instead of a mirrored counterpoise. There may be other subtle differences, but... Steve, aa5sg - Original Message - From: Paul Guello To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Decibel repeater antenna question-unbalanced radiating loops There are not any baluns on these antennas. If I remember right, they use 75 ohm coax on each bay (odd multiples of quarter wave length) and 35 ohm coax on the feed (again odd multiples) to match the impedance to 50 ohms. This info was on the group a while back, somebody must still have it. Paul, kb9wlc Mathew Quaife [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Would a close up pic of a DB304 work for your needs, or I have the DB420 there as well. Mathew bradley glen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: HiI have been studying the db stacked array and thebayed array seems to use unbalanced dipoles as theradiators .I have tried to find a close up view of asingle dipole so I can confirm my ideas.If anyone has some good tech info on these antennas Iwould appreciate the info.It would make sense to " by-pass " the need of balunsfor each dipole -cost and balun loss?RegardsBrad ZS5WT Repeater Owner [EMAIL PROTECTED]__Do you Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15thhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.htmlYahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Do you Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th Do you Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Infomation Needed
He stated it was conventional tone PL equipped, and not Digital PL equipped. Ron -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Bob [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 2004 12:46 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Infomation Needed What is a Micor PL'D DPL ? Bobby/N2BR --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 04:07 PM 4/13/2004 -, you wrote: I have a Micor or Mitrek Repeater or what i think is a repeater.Here the Model number can anyone tell me what it is Model Number C73RTB/3103CM ---Let's see how good my memory is... It's a Micor VHF, 110 watt, PL'd (not DPL) base station. I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm too far off :-) Ken --- --- President and CTO - Arcom Communications Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories. http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000 http://www.irlp.net Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] This is serious, yeah right!
Here, let me just bend over and show you a REAL Radio Active Chemtrail !!! And I won't even charge a couple of bucks for the demonstration !! (And the sad part about this type of internet hype is that these people are usually allowed to multiply and vote !!) Ron -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Ken Arck [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 12:36 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] This is serious, yeah right! http://www.tearingdownstrongholds.com/ ---Obviously a Kerry supporter :-) Ken Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/http://groups.yahoo.com/gro up/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Rep [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/Yahoo! Terms of Service. -- President and CTO - Arcom Communications Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories. http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000 http://www.irlp.net Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] audio problems
I would start checking in 2 areas 1) RF getting into the audio chain or other power/control leads somewhere. Think about adding Ferrite mufflers (made from #43 ferrite) to any audio cables. Place the Ferrite near connectors on both ends. Make sure the power supply and control line leads are doctored the same way entering and exiting your cabinetry. 2) Loose audio connections, especially if you are using RCA type plugs and jacks in your audio chain. Had the same problem on one of our repeaters until I discovered only one brand of over-the-counter phono plug mates tightly and reliably with the jacks on the rear of the RC-850 controllers. That brand is Switch Craft. Had no more audio intermittent problems once we got all of the Radio Shack connectors out of the systems. Ron -WB8ERB- Sawnee Mountain Group -Original Message- From: Robert W Burton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 7:41 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] audio problems We have a hub repeater within our system that is having a problem. (http://www.georgiaskywarn.com ) Every so often the audio level just drops. No distortion, no intermod mixing that we can hear...the level of the audio just gets softer. No loss of signal either. The repeater is located on a tower that has 2 fm radio stations running lots of power on it. One of the radio stations has caused some problems with the local school and neighboors who are just underneath it's footprint. Problems with them getting into t.v. , intercoms, etc. This problem will just happen then fix itself. There are several pagers, cell phone and one digital t.v. (I think there still in businessif your in the Atlanta area it's Bellsouth's thing with the dishes in the tops of treesit's really too funny to see these things ;-) on this same tower. The repeater is a MCC converted GE Master Exec II with a SCom7 controller. Thanks, Robert The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: GE phoenix UHF
Why do you need to know the multiplier to order the xtals ?? Simply call Sentry Crystal and tell them the model number of the Phoenix and your desired TX and RX frequencies. I've ordered dozens of xtals from Sentry for my Phoenix and Century II VHF and UHF radios from Sentryalways good service and the rocks are always right on. Ron Rogers -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Russell Filling [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 7:43 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: GE phoenix UHF just out of curiosit , how do u program a crystal ? i have a crystaled GE phoenix , not one with a x2122 in it , i need to know the frequency mutliplier Russ N3TIH - Original Message - From: wavecomm1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 11:44 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: GE phoenix UHF need the programmer? Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Repeater for GMRS use-help needed??
Yep, there is a difference of legality depending upon the service they are being used in Ron Rogers -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Johnny [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 11:23 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Repeater for GMRS use-help needed?? Are they being used on the ham bands or on GMRS ??? Johnny [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So you mean that all these people who use the GE Master II and Motorola Mitreks are building NON-Compliant radio. Yes there not built to be repeaters but wow. If the FCC goes after people who do that then why arent these people being fined. JOHN B Quoting Lee Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Be very careful,mobiles are not type accepted for repeater use in the GMRS or commercial band. Check the rules to avoid a big fat fine,,,see www.fcc.gov --- Original Message - From: Jim B. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 02, 2004 2:47 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Repeater for GMRS use-help needed?? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Johnny, I havnt seen anything saying that you cant use 2 radio to make a repeater. I know most radios have about 50 watts output so the power should be turned down a bit to save that radio and help from people in the area complaining. No, most UHF mobiles are 25-35 watts, as are the radios he mentioned, but that is NOT continuous duty rated as is needed for a repeater. For repeater duty, it MUST be turned down or it will burn up. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] TE Systems Amplifier
Sounds like an exciter problem or duplexer/cavity filter tuning drift problem, not an amplifier problem. (Assuming you are using a duplexer in the repeater) Have you checked the input power to the amp from the exciter device ?? How are you measuring the output power in relation to the antenna ??? Before the duplexer or on the output of the duplexer. Amplifiers always heat up when used so cold WX should not make it reduce in power since the unit should be self-warming after a few minutes of on-time. Ron -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Jimmy Floyd [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2004 8:48 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] TE Systems Amplifier Has anyone that is using one of the TE Systems amplifiers ever had a problem with a low power output during cold weather ? We have one that has been running for 6 years and it seems when temp. drops below 50 degrees F, seems the output power is lowered quite a bit. Before we dig into the amp , I thought maybe someone on the list might have had the same problem and found a solution. Thanks Jimmy Floyd NQ4U Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fiberglass rod
Tedd: The rods I have gotten from them before seem to be on the order of G10 Fiberglass which is fairly workable, at least for 1/4 tools and tuning shafts. I have made a couple of screw driver tipped tools for tuning the Vari-notch trimmers on TX-RX duplexers with this material. I cut the tuning tools about 4 long, shape the end into a flat screwdriver blade using a Dremel then a file, and install a small radio control knob on the end for nice torque. When tweaking those TX-RX trimmers is mandatory to use a tool containing no metal whatsoever. Ron Rogers -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Tedd Doda [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 6:22 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fiberglass rod On Wed, 7 Jan 2004 12:04:20 -0500, Rogers, Ron wrote: McMaster-Carr carries all sorts of Fiberglass rod material in various sizes. An example is a 60 length of 1/4 rod for $2.25. Check out part no. 8543K59 on the McMaster Carr website if you are interested. 8543K27 looks to be the 1/8 rod..thanks! I've sent them an email to see if they can chop them up into 12 pieces, to make shipping a little easier. The only thing that worries me is that they are natural fiberglass, and may have a course grain. The red ones I have here have a very fine grain and are very easy to shape. Thanks for the tip Ron Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Way to go Matt! (NASCAR #17) Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] inline fuse holders
You might also check your local car audio shops. They carry some pretty Beefy screw together inline cartridge fuse holders and fuses for these 800 watt and higher car audio systems. Some of these holders are made to accommodate that # 2 welding cable that the kids use to run power back to the rear mounted amplifier bays in their vehicles. I use a similar ones of these from the big Astron power supplies to the final amplifiers in repeaters. The larger cartridge fuse and holder has more surface area, stiffer spring tension, and less probability of voltage drop under continuous high current than your smaller 1/4 Buss fuses and holders. Ron Rogers -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 10:11 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] inline fuse holders On Thu, 8 Jan 2004 01:06:30 -0500 Rod Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: With that said, and we want to install fuses in the grounds of existing radios without the fuses, is there a favorite fuse holder for in-line use? I've never seen a 3AG style in-line fuseholder like comes with most radios as a stand-alone purchasable item. It usually comes with a short (most times inadequate) length of wire out each end, already crimped to the buttons or clamps used for contact to the fuses. Check your electrical wholesaler; once stumbled on a nice one -- rubberized, linked, ribbed cover ends (adjustable length can't get lost) with ready-to-crimp contacts for 14ga or so; price wasn't so bad. mfgr was maybe BUSS or TRON ?? R Scott Gilmore N8BQN Saginaw MI USA Give a man a fish, and he'll eat for a day. Give him the internet, and he'll leave you alone for weeks. Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] CW ID info
The latest re-write of the FCC Part 97 rules do not dictate that you have to add ANY /R, /L, or / anything to repeater or link transmitter callsigns. Just a plain callsign is fine and less than 20 WPM if using CW ID's ( Tone modulated FM in FM repeaters). Ron -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Don [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2004 6:02 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] CW ID info I just had a old rack mount data Signal CWID-70 Re programmed with My call , They forgot to put /R But I will use My controller for That. I was thinking of putting a 220 Link on My 440 repeater or a remote . Do I have to ID That as /L Or can it just be My call ? PS Data Signal is no longer in business , But they still had a former employee working for the New Company called Game Country in Albany Ga , that I got it re programmed and a Manual from. so if anyone is still using a Unit like this and needs info E-Mail and I will look in the Manual. Thanks Don KA9QJG Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fiberglass rod
McMaster-Carr carries all sorts of Fiberglass rod material in various sizes. An example is a 60 length of 1/4 rod for $2.25. Check out part no. 8543K59 on the McMaster Carr website if you are interested. http://www.mcmaster.com/ Tuning trimmers and waxed slugs in older equipment or cold WX without preheating with a hair dryer ??? Not me !! Ron -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Mike Perryman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 11:38 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fiberglass rod Yep, I am looking for twiddle sticks as well. Was 17° in the shack last night. Tuning on a Mitrek, and the waxy substance in the coil forms was like concrete. Twisted the tip right off. I haven't had a lot of luck with RS... your idea sounds like a good one... Just one question. Which gives up first... the fiberglass rod, or the slug? Breaking a slug can be a real pain in the hiney!! Mike At 10:19 AM 01/07/2004 -0500, you wrote: Hi Guys: About 5 years ago, I picked up some fiberglass 1/8 rods at Dayton. Using a Dremel tool, they were perfect for making all kinds of tuning tools. Of course, after modifying them over and over, they get shorter and shorter :) Has anyone seen these thing in their travels? The units I bought were about 8 long and red in colour, but any length/colour would be appreciated. Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Way to go Matt! (NASCAR #17) Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ - Mike PerrymanCavell, Mertz Davis, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Consulting Engineers http://www.cmdconsulting.com 7839 Ashton Avenue K5JMPManassas, VA 20109 USA (703) 392-9090; (703) 392-9559 fax; DC Line (202) 332-0110 - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] TPL website ??
Does anyone know if there is a web site for TPL amps ? Ron Rogers -WB8ERB- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] TPL website ??
Yep, that's why I responded the way I did about MFJ amps.. Ron -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Mike Perryman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 2:30 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] TPL website ?? I think maybe Ken was sending a message not necessarily a valid URL! Mike At 02:17 PM 12/16/2003 -0500, you wrote: Sorrythis must be a mistake because it seems to be the site for MFJ amps !! Ron -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: Ken Arck [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 11:50 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] TPL website ?? At 11:48 AM 12/16/2003 -0500, you wrote: Does anyone know if there is a web site for TPL amps ? Try http://www.spuriousunstablenevermakethepowerclaimed.com Ken --- - -- President and CTO - Arcom Communications Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories. http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html Our new Repeater Audio Delay (RAD) board is now shipping! Compatible with many controllers! AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000 http://www.irlp.net Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ - Mike PerrymanCavell, Mertz Davis, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Consulting Engineers http://www.cmdconsulting.com 7839 Ashton Avenue K5JMPManassas, VA 20109 USA (703) 392-9090; (703) 392-9559 fax; DC Line (202) 332-0110 - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Static / desense problems
Start off by getting rid of the LMR-400 feedline !! Do not use braid over tin foil feedline for repeater duplex operation. Internal chaffing of braid and tin foil with any feedline movement during transmit will kill your repeater. To confirm the problem IS with the feedline swap it out with a 50 foot piece of LDF-50 or even a piece of good old Beldon 8214 coax. Ron Rogers -WB8ERB- -Original Message- From: sledman11 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2003 1:57 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Static / desense problems Looking for idea's on tracking down an intermittent static and desense problem I am have with a 2 meter repeater. The set up is as follows - ge mastr II base, LMR 400 coax (about 50 ft) into a diamond F23A antenna mounted on a chimney with 22' of black pipe mast. The location is the local firehouse which has a antenna mounted on a tower about 70' feet away from the repeater antenna. We also have a 220 Mhz, 4 element beam mounted on the back pipe mast about 12' under the repeater antenna. This is for echolink. Have turned off the 220 Mhz link with no affect on the problem. Have not been able to determine a pattern to the problem (ie cold, wet windy etc). When it happens it can sometimes completely wipe out a signal that was full quieting. Have checked the antenna and all is tight, dry and no problems that I can see visually. Including the coil and capacitor at the bottom of the antenna. Thought about running jumpers between the antenna mount, mast, 2 meter antenna and the 220 Mhz antenna so all are at ground potential. Do feel it is something outside that is causing the problem and not the radio or duplexers. Can create static on a weak signal coming into the repeater by banging on the mast. All idea's welcome. Thanks, Don WW2N Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
