Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

From: Clem Cole Hey Clem...thanks for the input. Definitely enjoying the last couple of weeks discourse with Bliss and Fortran. Good times they were. >On Mon, Feb 5, 2018 at 4:27 PM, Kenneth Seefried wrote: >> Have you looked at the Intel Fortran

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

ge.com> Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game Again speaking for myself ... not Intel... On Mon, Feb 5, 2018 at 4:27 PM, Kenneth Seefried <kjseefr...@gmail.com<mailto:kjseefr...@gmail.com>> wrote: Have you looked at the Intel Fortran compiler (https://software.int

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Again speaking for myself ... not Intel... On Mon, Feb 5, 2018 at 4:27 PM, Kenneth Seefried wrote: > > Have you looked at the Intel Fortran compiler (https://software.intel.com/ > en-us/fortran-compilers)? Intel/AMD-only, of course. Supports > Fortran-IV/77 through at

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

--Original Message- From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Paul Koning Sent: Monday, February 5, 2018 4:55 PM To: SIMH <simh@trailing-edge.com> Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game > From: Johnny Billquist <b...@softjar.se> > > > &

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> From: Johnny Billquist > > > > A caveat is that most any Fortran compiler I've seen or heard of for > > Linux is not so good. I've used the GCC Fortran compiler over the years, for substantial applications (like NEC2) without trouble. And I know it's still in active

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

From: Johnny Billquist > > A caveat is that most any Fortran compiler I've seen or heard of for > Linux is not so good. > Have you looked at the Intel Fortran compiler ( https://software.intel.com/en-us/fortran-compilers)? Intel/AMD-only, of course. Supports Fortran-IV/77

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Tim Shoppa wrote: > Keep in mind that back in the old days, that in addition to the > various filesystem options saying whether a file was Format carriage > control or not, that there was also the ability for FORMAT statements > to be dynamically changed on the fly by a READ. So while the source >

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

I think adding the 1X to the FORMAT is the right thing to do long term. The DEC TYPE-as-a-synonym-for-PRINT-but-with-different-FORMAT-usage extension will not be familiar to the vast majority of Fortran programmers even if they used it decades ago. I used it a LOT back in the 80's and just barely

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Timothe Litt wrote: > You're going to have to change something. Either the format (to > discard the carriage control), or the IFILE to OPEN (to tell the RTL > discard it for you). If it's only read with one format statement, I'd > go for that. Thanks. I opted to add 1X to the FORMAT statements

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

if people could Dan. *From:* Simh <simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com> on behalf of Johnny Billquist <b...@softjar.se> *Sent:* February 3, 2018 8:20 PM *To:* simh@trailing-edge.com *Subject:* Re: [Simh] Crowther's

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

un...@trailing-edge.com> on behalf of Johnny Billquist <b...@softjar.se> Sent: February 3, 2018 8:20 PM To: simh@trailing-edge.com Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game Um... FORTRAN IV and FORTRAN-77 are as much standard as anything you could ever come up with. Now, DEC did do exte

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Castle a whirl, I left all the debugging in place just in case. thanks, and hope you enjoy Dan. From: Larry Baker <ba...@usgs.gov> Sent: February 3, 2018 5:00 PM To: dgahl...@hotmail.com Cc: simh@trailing-edge.com Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

.uk>>, > Bob Nelson > <rmkri...@gmail.com <mailto:rmkri...@gmail.com>> > Cc: "simh@trailing-edge.com <mailto:simh@trailing-edge.com>" > <simh@trailing-edge.com <mailto:simh@trailing-edge.com>> > Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

IFILE (and OFILE) don't allow specifying a file extension.  In fact, they only support 5 (or fewer) character file names.  (5 x 7-bit = 36-bit word - don't ask about the extra bit.)  They're a hack to allow specifying a filename at runtime; earlier, you had to use a hardcoded name associated with

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Timothe Litt wrote: > Is the file extension .DAT? that may trigger this. It is. > Is there an OPEN statement for that file? If so, what does it include? There's no OPEN statement. The input is opened by this: CALL IFILE(1,'TEXT') The accompanying file is called ADVENT.DAT. The IFILE

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

That's amazing! I'll have to see if I can get it all going as i have never opped a Dec 10 so it will be a learning journey. Sent from my iPhone > On 3 Feb 2018, at 18:04, Lars Brinkhoff wrote: > > Quentin North wrote: >> A bit off topic, but if anyone has a BCPL compiler for

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Quentin North wrote: > A bit off topic, but if anyone has a BCPL compiler for the Dec 10 I > have the source code and files to the original Essex > MUD. Unfortunately I think the compiler is lost, but I live in hope. You're in luck. The Essex BCPL surfaced last year.

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

9 PM To: Bob Nelson Cc: simh@trailing-edge.com Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game A bit off topic, but if anyone has a BCPL compiler for the Dec 10 I have the source code and files to the original Essex MUD. Unfortunately I think the compiler is lost, but I live in hope. Sent from my i

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

A bit off topic, but if anyone has a BCPL compiler for the Dec 10 I have the source code and files to the original Essex MUD. Unfortunately I think the compiler is lost, but I live in hope. Sent from my iPhone > On 3 Feb 2018, at 15:06, Bob Nelson wrote: > > There are

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

There are people trying to preserve significant old computer designs and operating systems in a form most likely to survive going forward such as simh. There are also people trying to preserve significant old programs in a form most likely to survive going forward. Being in a simh forum it

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

On Sat, 03 Feb 2018 00:37:25 -0500 Phil Budne wrote: > > Last year Eric Raymond (The Cathedral And The Bazaar guy) and a few > > others took the ugly machine translated C code from the last known > > Fortran version and rewrote/structured it into something that is > > much

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Carey Tyler wrote: > Whoops, memories are slowly coming back, I think.  Adventure was > always Fortran.  It was Zork that was originally written in the > proprietary list processing language. Right, Muddle aka MDL. Not to be confused with Infocom's ZIL.

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> Last year Eric Raymond (The Cathedral And The Bazaar guy) and a few others > took the ugly machine translated C code from the last known Fortran version > and rewrote/structured it into something that is much more readable and > maintainable. To (apparently) quote the new version(*): "Well,

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

dy2...@gmail.com>> > Cc: Carey Tyler Schug <sqrfolk...@comcast.net > <mailto:sqrfolk...@comcast.net>>, Simh > <simh@trailing-edge.com <mailto:simh@trailing-edge.com>> > Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game > Message-ID: <13523f5

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

The Fortran version of Adventure may be the most authentic but if you don't want to deal with building 'ancient' code on a language few are proficient in now there are better options. Last year Eric Raymond (The Cathedral And The Bazaar guy) and a few others took the ugly machine translated C

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Then, adventure was converted to many other languages by thousands of fans. Numerous basic, C, zil, etc. versions exist. Probably the most cloned program of all time. On Fri, Feb 2, 2018 at 3:42 PM, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > Whoops, memories are slowly coming back, I

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Whoops, memories are slowly coming back, I think.  Adventure was always Fortran.  It was Zork that was originally written in the proprietary list processing language. On 02/02/2018 01:07 PM, Lars Brinkhoff wrote: Carey Tyler Schug wrote: I had always been told it was first written in some

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> From: Carey Tyler Schug > Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2018 10:41:11 -0600 > I had always been told it was first written in some proprietary DEC list > processing language, and only later converted to FORTRAN. Is this the > original conversion? You have been misinformed, or you

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> Timothe Litt wrote: >> I may have missed it, but you'll get more help if you provide the OS that >> you're running on, the file attributes (for DCL, dir/full and/or >> dump/header), and a hex dump of the first block or two of the file. > I'm running this in ITS, using the DECUUO TOPS-10

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Timothe Litt wrote: > I may have missed it, but you'll get more help if you provide the OS that > you're running on, the file attributes (for DCL, dir/full and/or > dump/header), and a hex dump of the first block or two of the file. I'm running this in ITS, using the DECUUO TOPS-10 emulator. So

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Bob's comments agree with mine. What may be confusing people is that that reading a data file may be different from a print file. This depends on the OS.  In the case of VMS, it depends on the file attributes, which tell RMS whether the file has embedded carriage control character, FORTRAN

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure Game

Bob Supnik wrote: > So adding '1X,' to the start of the SPEAK FORMAT statement should do > the trick. Yes, it does. Or should, I tested with 1H . I see some other versions come with a data file which doesn't have that extra space in front of the text. So of course they would need to add it in

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure Game

SPEAK got banged up a lot during the conversion to the PDP-11, because of the difference in word width, but the relevant fragment is: 5    TYPE 2,(LINES(I),I=1,L) 2    FORMAT(' ',36A2) This is still 1977-78, but the PDP-11 Fortran compilers (both F4 and F77) adhered to the 'standard' for

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Also, given the FORMAT(/), I’ll also hazard a guess that TYPE did not automatically add a new line on whatever was printed. But that is just a guess. Note that the / in the format statement is not in quotes. It's a format specifier that causes a new output record (new line). On a typewriter, I

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> I see that the data file from which the strings are read do prefix all > strings with a space character. So it looks like the intent is that > FORMAT(20A5) should do the right thing. Maybe the root cause is in > the code reading the data file. For example the data file contains lines like

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

gt; Cc: Ken Cornetet <ken.corne...@kimballelectronics.com>; simh@trailing-edge.com Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game > On Feb 2, 2018, at 2:26 PM, Lars Brinkhoff <l...@nocrew.org> wrote: > > Ken Cornetet wrote: > ... >> Also, given the FORMAT(/), I’

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> On Feb 2, 2018, at 2:26 PM, Lars Brinkhoff wrote: > > Ken Cornetet wrote: > ... >> Also, given the FORMAT(/), I’ll also hazard a guess that TYPE did not >> automatically add a new line on whatever was printed. But that is just a >> guess. > > I think your guess is correct.

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Ken Cornetet wrote: > Given the lack of a carriage control character in “FORMAT(20A5)”, I’m > guessing that TYPE was like write, except it was terminal oriented so > it didn’t use carriage control. It does. I have tried various control characters, and they seem to work as documented. > Also,

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > I had always been told it was first written in some proprietary DEC > list processing language, and only later converted to FORTRAN.  Is > this the original conversion? They are the oldest files that have been found, as far as I know. According to Woods, they are the

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

I had always been told it was first written in some proprietary DEC list processing language, and only later converted to FORTRAN.  Is this the original conversion? Did anybody suggest the following fix to put a blank in the carriage control position?? 998 FORMAT(1H ,20A5) On

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

>>> >>> >> I don’t think the slash is one of the ASA control characters > > It's not. Tim said it -- it indicates end of record. A FORMAT statement > gives the layout for one or more records. The fields separated by commas > specify the consecutive parts of a single record; each / is a

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> On Feb 2, 2018, at 10:19 AM, Jordi Guillaumes i Pons > wrote: > >> >> >> Also, given the FORMAT(/), I’ll also hazard a guess that TYPE did not >> automatically add a new line on whatever was printed. But that is just a >> guess. >> > I don’t think the

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> > > -Original Message- > From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com > <mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com>] On Behalf Of Lars Brinkhoff > Sent: Friday, February 2, 2018 3:41 AM > To: Dave L <davel@googlemail.com > <mailto:

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> > Also, given the FORMAT(/), I’ll also hazard a guess that TYPE did not > automatically add a new line on whatever was printed. But that is just a > guess. > I don’t think the slash is one of the ASA control characters https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASA_carriage_control_characters

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

On Fri, Feb 2, 2018 at 10:04 AM, Paul Koning wrote > > From what I remember, "carriage control" still applies; "TYPE" seems to be > simply a shorthand for "WRITE (5," I believe I remember that there was more to it than that explicitly when it 'knew' you were a TTY, but

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

. But that is just a guess. From: Clem Cole [mailto:cl...@ccc.com] Sent: Friday, February 2, 2018 9:46 AM To: Ken Cornetet <ken.corne...@kimballelectronics.com> Cc: simh@trailing-edge.com Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game On Fri, Feb 2, 2018 at 9:12 AM, Ken Cornetet <

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

> On Feb 2, 2018, at 9:46 AM, Clem Cole wrote: > > > > On Fri, Feb 2, 2018 at 9:12 AM, Ken Cornetet > wrote: > I have vague recollections that FORMAT(/) prints a new line > ​Sounds right - I'm O-O-O, but I​'ll try to verify with the

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

-edge.com] On Behalf Of Lars > Brinkhoff > Sent: Friday, February 2, 2018 3:41 AM > To: Dave L <davel@googlemail.com> > Cc: simh@trailing-edge.com > Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game > > Dave L wrote: > > Been a long time since I wrote fortran but II

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

sed "write". -Original Message- From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Lars Brinkhoff Sent: Friday, February 2, 2018 3:41 AM To: Dave L <davel@googlemail.com> Cc: simh@trailing-edge.com Subject: Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game Dave L wrote: > B

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Dave L wrote: > Been a long time since I wrote fortran but IIRC the first character on > the output line was to perform carriage-control of the LPT, so you'd > have to always have a leading pad character such as a space in order > to get the output lines to be correct. Some characters were

Re: [Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Been a long time since I wrote fortran but IIRC the first character on the output line was to perform carriage-control of the LPT, so you'd have to always have a leading pad character such as a space in order to get the output lines to be correct. Some characters were reserved actions, 1 =

[Simh] Crowther's Adventure game

Hello, Some time ago, an old version of the Adventure game was found. According to Woods, the March 11 files are the originals from Crowther. https://jerz.setonhill.edu/intfic/colossal-cave-adventure-source-code/ Maybe this is of come historical interest, and could be part of the SIMH games