Anyone? -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 16:13:47 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
No -- we have graduated to nothing at all. You are beating around the bush my friend. You don't want to answer
DAVEH:
Then it would seem to me that one isn't truly
(or perhaps fully) saved from their sins then.
One is saved from sin in the sense that he is no longer brought under the
power of sin. He no longer has to be a slave to sin. However, if he at
some point chooses to rebel against God and
DAVEH wrote:
From the perspective of a saved Christian, why does
it matter whether one sins or not? Do not Christians
believe their salvation will save them from any sins
they may commit?
There might be some on the list who think this way, but I do not.
Sin defiles a person, whether they
Dave wrote:
DAVEH: From the perspective of a saved Christian, why does it matter
whether one sins or not? Do not Christians believe their salvation
will save them from any sins they may commit?
Our actions indicate the
DAVEH: Thanx for taking time to respond to this, Terry. I understand
your explanation, though I'm not sure it quite answers my question.
IOWOnce a person becomes a saved Christian, can sin prevent him from
ending up in heaven?
Terry Clifton wrote:
Dave wrote:
DAVEH: From the
Dave wrote:
DAVEH: Thanx for taking time to respond to this, Terry. I
understand your explanation, though I'm not sure it quite answers my
question. IOWOnce a person becomes a saved Christian, can sin
prevent him from ending up in heaven?
DaveH wrote:
Once a person becomes a saved Christian, can sin
prevent him from ending up in heaven?
Yes.
Peace be with you.
David Miller.
--
Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know
how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6)
Judy Taylor wrote:
Terry,
I'm glad to see wisdom is still around :)
How's the wind at your place?
===
As always, the Lord was good to us. The eye of the storm ( Highest
winds) passed over Pensacola, 120 miles
Judy and Terry,
There is a position that says those that let go or slip from their
moorings were never truly saved in the first place. This position preserves
once saved always saved. How do you respond to this position?
Perry
From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To:
Charles Perry Locke wrote:
Judy and Terry,
There is a position that says those that let go or slip from
their moorings were never truly saved in the first place. This
position preserves once saved always saved. How do you respond to
this position?
Perry
DAVEH: Then it would seem to me that one isn't truly (or perhaps
fully) saved from their sins then. Would it be best to frame it that
one has the promise of salvation instead of them actually being saved
from their sin while in mortality? Maybe I'm making this too
difficult.
David Miller
John Smithson wrote to Judy:
I am going to describe you. Tell if I am 10 %
or 30% aor 90% will you.
John, Judy has told us that she attends a Presbyterian church. How could
she possibly be the way you describe her?
Please try to get your eyes off of man and onto Christ. We would have much
Lance wrote:
IMO, some of what I 'hear' comes from the Lord
and some from your redeemed/fallen nature.
There's much of the 'old' Christine David alive,
well and, posting on TT. Wouldn't you agree?
No way, Lance. Maybe my old man is really wicked compared to yours, but you
certainly are not
David, perhaps you should do likewise and, thereafter say some of this to
Judy.
- Original Message -
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 09, 2005 11:30
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
John Smithson wrote to Judy:
I am
"Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes: David, perhaps you should do likewise and, thereafter say some
of this to Judy. - Original
Message - From: "David Miller" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 09, 2005 11:30 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk
5 11:30:47 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
John Smithson wrote to Judy:
I am going to describe you. Tell if I am 10 %
or 30% aor 90% will you.
John, Judy has told us that she attends a Presbyterian church. How could
she possibly be the way you describe her?
Please
Deeply hurt your daughter??? !!! Yes I do care. Example please. Apology soon to follow.
Jd-Original Message-From: Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 9 Jul 2005 13:51:48 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
David, perhaps you
-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 09 Jul 2005 18:44:33 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
Deeply hurt your daughter??? !!! Yes I do care. Example please. Apology soon to follow.
Jd-Original Message-From: Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED
s daughter BS. -- not even by "mistake."
JD-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 09 Jul 2005 19:15:59 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
Actually, DAvid -- I considr this accusation an outright l
John wrote:
I never saw the Presbyterian post !!
Did that ever occur to you?
Take a pill and enjoy life for a change.
Oh, great! One of the guys who thinks I am too loose with my definition of
sin is encouraging me to take drugs and enjoy life for a change! No thank
you, John. It amazes
iller" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 7:16 PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of
James
John wrote: I never saw the Presbyterian post
!! Did that ever occur to you? Take a pill and enjoy
life for a change. Oh, great! One of th
just proven that you are no closer to sinlessness than anyone.
Jd-Original Message-From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 9 Jul 2005 21:16:39 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
John wrote:
I never saw the Presbyterian post !!
Did th
John wrote:
Deeply hurt your daughter??? !!! Yes I do care.
Example please. Apology soon to follow.
You can talk to her privately about it if you like, but please courtesy copy
me if you do. As far as I'm concerned, it is the typical frustration that
Izzy has expressed on the list with
Yes, that is correct, Bill -- but now that he mentions it -- . nay.
Jd-Original Message-From: Bill Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 9 Jul 2005 19:48:51 -0600Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
David writes: Oh
John wrote:
Actually, DAvid -- I considr this accusation an
outright lie.
A lie is an intentional falsehood meant to deceive others. Are you
suggesting that Christine was never hurt by any of your posts and that I
just made it all up?
John wrote:
Please do settle this as soon as possible.
, knock it off and get back to issues.
Jd-Original Message-From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 9 Jul 2005 22:00:25 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
John wrote:
Deeply hurt your daughter??? !!! Yes I do care.
Example please
Bill wrote:
It amazes me that you cannot see how John's
statement is figurative; in other words, take a
chill pill and mellow out a bit! He's not encouraging
anyone to sin.
Oh, you mean like the chill pill picturedon this website?
WITH HEARTLESS INTENT KISS OFF DAVID AND MOVE ON.
JD
No more response from me --- Lance is getting ready to slap me again. -Original Message-From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Sat, 9 Jul 2005 22:03:31 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works
John wrote:
The fact of the matter is this -- you have just
proven that you are no closer to sinlessness
than anyone.
Fine, John. I have never claimed to be sinless. Please try to remember
that.
Peace be with you.
David Miller.
--
Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned
: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
John wrote:
The fact of the matter is this -- you have just
proven that you are no closer to sinlessness
than anyone.
Fine, John. I have never claimed to be sinless. Please try to remember
that.
Peace be with you.
David Miller.
--
"Let
John wrote:
No David -- you are not going to get away with
this. You made it a public accusation --
It was not an accusation, John. It was an off-handed comment, letting you
know that she had been hurt. I figured you did not know. Sorry, now that I
see your secondary reaction (your
John wrote:
You have been having this very problem on TT
for years -- and years before I, or BT came along.
I have been encountering sinning Christians all my life, John. Yes, it goes
way back, back before there was any Internet.
You really should remember that you came to this list because
Okay, David, you can skip the pill: just mellow out
without it :)
Bill
- Original Message -
From:
David Miller
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 8:33
PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book of James
Bill wrote
DAVEH: From the perspective of a saved Christian, why does it matter
whether one sins or not? Do not Christians believe their salvation will
save them from any sins they may commit?
David Miller wrote:
I have been encountering sinning Christians all my life,.
--
~~~
Dave
DAVEH: Exceeding the recommended 8 posts to TT per day
limit... ;-)
David Miller wrote:
Someone please identify one sin that I would not consider to be
a sin. Identify one thing that you try not to dobecause you consider
it to be sin,but that I would allow in my life because
nt: Sat, 9 Jul 2005 22:54:30 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
John wrote:
No David -- you are not going to get away with
this. You made it a public accusation --
It was not an accusation, John. It was an off-handed comment, letting you
know that she had been hurt.
You really do not have the foggiest as to what James is talking about in his letter, do you? Prove me wrong !! Tell me, what are the works of justification in the book of James?At what point are we saved -- at the point of faith or at the point of works? If we stop "working"do we suddenly lose
2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
Just like one can have DEAD WORKS, one can have DEAD FAITH
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I'm waiting
ooo
how thrilling
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You really do not have the foggiest as to what James is talking about in his letter, do you? Prove me wrong !! Tell me, what are the works of justification in the book of James?At what point are we saved -- at the point of faith or
If all one is holding to is dead doctrine from some
theologian - did they have salvation to begin with? One
cannot
lose what they never had to begin with. Jesus'
Words are life giving - they will quicken your mortal body.
jt
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You really do not
al Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 08:15
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book of James
If all one is holding to is dead doctrine from some
theologian - did they have salvatio
Can't do it Lance. Jesus told men not to be
called rabbi, rabbi (teacher)by men. "He said don't be called
rabbi
for one is your teacher, the Christ and you are all
brethren." (Matt 23:8); so He is the litmus test so far as Words
of Life are concerned and everything that conflicts
with His
Want to take a shot at answering the questions, deegan? -Original Message-From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 05:04:40 -0700 (PDT)Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith
-
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 08:36
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book of James
Can't do it Lance. Jesus told men not to be
called rabbi, rabbi (teacher)by men. "He said
I'm still waiting !!
Jd-Original Message-From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 08:15:21 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
If all one is holding to is dead doctrine from some
You've got to be able to recognize His Words Lance
before you can know if you are reading what He said.
You apparently are unable to do this which is plainly
evident by what you accept.
On Fri, 8 Jul 2005 08:50:55 -0400 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Wow! Do we agree on this
What for JD? Paul does not contradict James and
James is not contradicting Paul. The contradiction is in your
wide sweeping comprehension of this "incarnational"
thing which is a doctrine of men rather than the Word
of God. Just because the CofC misused God's Word
does not mean we should
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 09:08
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book of James
What for JD? Paul does not contradict James and
James is not contradicting Paul. The contradiction is in
your
wide sweeping
falling now into the latter category had better shape up.
- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 09:01
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book of James
You've got
oke screen defense. Interesting.
Oh, by the way -- I am still waiting.
Jd -Original Message-From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 09:08:53 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthT
You should be ashamed of such unbelief Lance; I've
never said God "inspires" my reading. What I have said is
that the Holy Spirit or the Spirit of Promise gives me
understanding as Jesus (our one mediator) said he would.
What's more I don't have to explain away or cut out any
scriptures,
Got answers?
Jd-Original Message-From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 05:05:53 -0700 (PDT)Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
I'm waiting
ooo
how thrilling
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You really do not have
I can not give you the answer you want JD. The
reason I mention the CofC is because I don't believe you are
free of some emotional entanglement and you reject
truth because of your experiences with that group in the past.
I have no smoke screen defense. I say again that no
prophecy of
: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
I can not give you the answer you want JD. The reason I mention the CofC is because I don't believe you are
free of some emotional entanglement and you reject truth because of your experiences with that group in the past.
I have no smoke screen defense. I say
Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 09:39
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book of James
You should be ashamed of such unbelief Lance; I've
never said God "inspires"
So now we are no longer discussing conflict between the
writings of James and Paul in the New Testament.
We have graduated to discussing smoke screens? Am
I correct? Exactly what have I committed myself to in
black and white JD? I have no problem with James
and Paul- Not only that I love
Lance I would prefer that you demonstrate in a legible
way how and when I employ scripture in an aberrant
fashion and skip the the patronizing
observations. You have never once been willing to prove what you
say
by God's Word but you constantly make these unproven
allegations. jt
On Fri, 8
with Paul.
- Original Message -
From: Judy Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 09:08
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
What for JD? Paul does not contradict James and James is not contradicting Paul
Many believers seek to harmonize the
unharmonizeable.
- Original Message -
From:
Christine
Miller
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 10:56
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book of James
Lance, of course James does NOT disagree
@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 10:11
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book of James
Lance I would prefer that you demonstrate in a
legible way how and when I employ scripture in an aberrant
fashion and skip the the patronizing
I am still waiting.
Jd -Original Message-From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 09:08:53 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
What for JD? Paul does not contradict James
Why not? If you have the light and I am in
darknessthen shine your light on my darkness? Just
criticizing
from the corner is not kind, nor is it
loving. I'd also like to know who the "all" consists of.
Is it the TFT/
Polyani, Newbigin crowd? jt
On Fri, 8 Jul 2005 11:14:07 -0400 "Lance
t: July 08, 2005 10:56
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
Lance, of course James does NOT disagree with Paul. The difference is, Paul teaches that Abraham's faith is counted for righteousness, while James actually tells us what faith is. Works without faith will lead you to hel
NO[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Want to take a shot at answering the questions, deegan? -Original Message-From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 05:04:40 -0700 (PDT)Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
2:20 But wilt thou
: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 09:47:12 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
I can not give you the answer you want JD. The reason I mention the CofC is because I don't believe you are
free of some emotional entanglement and you reject truth because of your
: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
What for JD? Paul does not contradict James and James is not contradicting Paul. The contradiction is in your
wide sweeping comprehension of this "incarnational" thing which is a doctrine of men rather than the Word
of God. Just because the CofC misused
@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 10:56
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
Lance, of course James does NOT disagree with Paul. The difference is, Paul teaches that Abraham's faith is counted for righteousness, while James actually tells us what faith is. Works without faith
you resort to the smoke screen defense. Interesting.
Oh, by the way -- I am still waiting.
Jd -Original Message-From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 09:08:53 -0400Subject:
.
- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 09:08
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and
the Book of James
! Reminds me of...wellME! (I
refer to Christine Kevin)
- Original Message -
From: Kevin Deegan
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 14:50
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of
James
Be ye DOERS and NOT HEARERS only deceiving your
own
y Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 10:08:29 -0400Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
So now we are no longer discussing conflict between the writings of James and Paul in the New Testament.
We have grad
CERTAINTY? Damn! Reminds me of...wellME! (I refer to Christine Kevin)
- Original Message -
From: Kevin Deegan
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 14:50
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
Be ye DOERS and NOT HEARERS only deceiving your own selves
TED]>wrote: Doncha just luv it when people communicate with such CERTAINTY? Damn! Reminds me of...wellME! (I refer to Christine Kevin) - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: July 08, 2005 14:50 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of
of the
'old' Christine David alive, well and, posting on TT. Wouldn't you agree?
- Original Message -
From: Christine Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 15:49
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
1Th 1:5 For our gospel came
.
- Original Message -
From: Judy Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: July 08, 2005 09:08
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the
Book
of James
What for JD? Paul does
Amazing.
Jd-Original Message-From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 09:29:15 -0700 (PDT)Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
NO[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Want to take a shot at answering the questions, deegan
gan [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 11:14:22 -0700 (PDT)Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Works and the Book of James
In your mind have you demonstarted the impossibility?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
This is a smoke screen (I refer to your denial of same, below). I will
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