R C Macaulay wrote:
Howdy Vorts,
This thread is becoming downright argumentitively unscientific and
fallen into the realm of they said, who said.
Even a kid from North Zulch Texas ( and it don't get any dumber than
that) knows talking to sum'buddy that loves to argue is like "rasslin"
with
If a million people believe a false thing, it is still false.
Terry
On Sun, Nov 9, 2008 at 3:45 PM, thomas malloy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Terry Blanton wrote:
>
>> On Sat, Nov 8, 2008 at 10:27 PM, thomas malloy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> In the beginning G-d (Yahweh) created th
Terry Blanton wrote:
On Sat, Nov 8, 2008 at 10:27 PM, thomas malloy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
In the beginning G-d (Yahweh) created the heavens and the earth. Some time
later, his choir director, Lucifer, rebelled against him.
You seem to equate Lucifer with Satan. This is an incorre
Indeed, Dr. Erhman wrote of hundreds of thousands of variations in the
NT is his book:
http://www.amazon.com/Misquoting-Jesus-Story-Behind-Changed/dp/0060738170
What was interesting were the *reasons* behind the misquotes including
intentional changes due to the personal opinion of the scribe and
>From Thomas:
...
> I have reason to believe that it's 5997, something significant is supposed
> to happen at the end of the 6000th year, so eini mimi mini mo, pick your
> plan it's time to go.
Dang! Someone forgot to authorize a freeze on the version upgrade.
There will be hell to pay for this s
Thanks Terry for clearing this up. So many similar
misinterpretations, bad translations, and conflicts with knowledge of
history and science exist in the Bible that a literal belief is hard
to accept, at least for me. While many wise and useful concepts are
in the Bible, I have to ask our
On Sat, Nov 8, 2008 at 10:27 PM, thomas malloy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> In the beginning G-d (Yahweh) created the heavens and the earth. Some time
> later, his choir director, Lucifer, rebelled against him.
You seem to equate Lucifer with Satan. This is an incorrect
reference. In the KJV of
Howdy Vorts,
This thread is becoming downright argumentitively unscientific and fallen
into the realm of they said, who said.
Even a kid from North Zulch Texas ( and it don't get any dumber than that)
knows talking to sum'buddy that loves to argue is like "rasslin" with a pig
in the mud,,, so
Edmund Storms wrote:
On Nov 7, 2008, at 11:46 PM, thomas malloy wrote:
Edmund Storms wrote:
I find the logic of this discussion odd. If, as Christians,
Muslims and Jews believe, there is but one God, then they are all
worshiping that one God no matter what they call it.
You're makin
Not much physics, David, but there could be science involved. Suppose
a reality exists independent of this one. Would not an effort to
understand this reality be interesting, independent of the old and
primitive explanations provided by religion? By the way, I don't
think Buddhists are a
Ed sez:
> Good choice. You must be a Mac user.
>
> On Nov 8, 2008, at 2:09 PM, OrionWorks wrote:
>
> > Ed sez:
> >
> >> ...This would make the Bible the Vista version.
> >
> > I refuse to convert.
Alas, we humble employees of the state of Wisconsin we are solidly of
the XP faith.
I'm incapable o
Good choice. You must be a Mac user.
Ed
On Nov 8, 2008, at 2:09 PM, OrionWorks wrote:
Ed sez:
...This would make the Bible the Vista version.
I refuse to convert.
Regards
Steven Vincent Johnson
www.OrionWorks.com
www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Ed sez:
> ...This would make the Bible the Vista version.
I refuse to convert.
Regards
Steven Vincent Johnson
www.OrionWorks.com
www.zazzle.com/orionworks
and each new (christian) church is the latest patch?
harry
- Original Message -
From: Edmund Storms <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Saturday, November 8, 2008 11:00 am
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
> Good idea, Steven. This would make the Bible
Good idea, Steven. This would make the Bible the Vista version.
Ed
On Nov 8, 2008, at 8:49 AM, OrionWorks wrote:
Ed sez:
Don't you think that belief is an assumption? Don't you
think God would have updated his instruction manual by now?
After all. its has been over 2000 years and a lot has
Ed sez:
> Don't you think that belief is an assumption? Don't you
> think God would have updated his instruction manual by now?
> After all. its has been over 2000 years and a lot has changed.
>
> Ed
Perhaps the lack of change as perceived by some may be due to the fact
that, at least on Planet
On Nov 7, 2008, at 11:46 PM, thomas malloy wrote:
Edmund Storms wrote:
I find the logic of this discussion odd. If, as Christians,
Muslims and Jews believe, there is but one God, then they are all
worshiping that one God no matter what they call it.
You're making the assumption that th
Where is the physics in all of this?
Surely the atheist Buddhists have a point when they criticize western
physics which they find opinionated. This is consistent with how Buddhists
in general criticize theistic engagements and no one can deny that the
strong Christian tradition in the west could
Edmund Storms wrote:
I find the logic of this discussion odd. If, as Christians, Muslims
and Jews believe, there is but one God, then they are all worshiping
that one God no matter what they call it.
You're making the assumption that there is only one super human entity
desiring to be wors
Howdy Mark,
The thread has been more rant than rave but stimuilating to science.
For example.. consider the meaning and the word " TIME". Has science
reconciled time , it's meaning and purpose ?
If you started a digital clock display this moment , and if this was a
wonder clock that would accumu
Interesting discussion!
Who was it that suggested that religions usually last about 1500 to 2000 years?
By then, because the
religion is static but society evolves, the symbols lose their meaning and
impact, and the old
religion is cast off, and a new one comes in to replace it, and
the symbol
On Nov 6, 2008, at 1:06 PM, Horace Heffner wrote:
On Nov 6, 2008, at 9:15 AM, Edmund Storms wrote:
But, look at this process from God's point of view, if this is
possible. As God, I know I'm the only one. Humans call me by
different names and do different ritual, but I know all the effor
On Nov 6, 2008, at 9:15 AM, Edmund Storms wrote:
But, look at this process from God's point of view, if this is
possible. As God, I know I'm the only one. Humans call me by
different names and do different ritual, but I know all the effort
is directed toward me. So, why would I care what
Religion and belief systems exist out side the realm of logic. They gain
their power in part from the salient property of human nervous systems which
could be called "pattern regonition". It the funamental to all our sensory
systems and to our survival. It is how we make "sense" out of the senso
Well said Steven. That is the essence of the problem. That is why the
ego is such a handicap for real understanding and why its destruction
is at the core of Buddhist teaching. I would also add fear to the
reasons why religion is so powerful. Life is threatening and having
God on your s
HI Ed, Hi Horace,
IMO,
What many learned scholars and teachers seem to say on matters similar
to these recent discussions is that the ability to transform (or
update) a belief system is intimately linked to how deeply one has
personally identified their very existence to the care and feeding of
m
On Nov 6, 2008, at 10:48 AM, Horace Heffner wrote:
On Nov 6, 2008, at 8:11 AM, Edmund Storms wrote:
I find the logic of this discussion odd.
Perhaps because there is a lack of any logic at all.
If, as Christians, Muslims and Jews believe, there is but one God,
then they are all worshipi
On Nov 6, 2008, at 8:11 AM, Edmund Storms wrote:
I find the logic of this discussion odd.
Perhaps because there is a lack of any logic at all.
If, as Christians, Muslims and Jews believe, there is but one God,
then they are all worshiping that one God no matter what they call it.
The abo
I find the logic of this discussion odd. If, as Christians, Muslims
and Jews believe, there is but one God, then they are all worshiping
that one God no matter what they call it. If many Gods exist, as
Hindus believe then we have a problem. In any case, does anyone think
that God would ca
On Nov 5, 2008, at 8:49 PM, thomas malloy wrote:
Horace Heffner wrote:
On Nov 4, 2008, at 6:19 AM, Harry Veeder wrote:
Pope urged to admit common ground
Their letter, A Common Word, cited passages from the Koran which
the scholars said showed that Christianity and Islam worship the
s
> Thomas wrote:
>>Horace Heffner wrote:
>> Pope urged to admit common ground
>>
>> Their letter, A Common Word, cited passages from the Koran which the
>> scholars said showed that Christianity and Islam worship the same
>> God, and require their respective followers to show each other
>> particul
Horace Heffner wrote:
On Nov 4, 2008, at 6:19 AM, Harry Veeder wrote:
Pope urged to admit common ground
Their letter, A Common Word, cited passages from the Koran which the
scholars said showed that Christianity and Islam worship the same
God, and require their respective followers to sho
Thomas,
It has been my experience that the emotion, fear, is a very seductive
one. Fear constantly whispers in one's ear: PAY ATTENTION TO ME! ...
OR ELSE. Once it has got your attention, don't worry, it will supply
one with an infinite number of rationalizations to justify why it
should remain in
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_(The_Original_Miniseries)
-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 04 November 2008 17:06
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
For real!? Does he get one group of people to
OrionWorks wrote:
Hi Thomas,
Thanks for passing on the "Camelot" Bob Dean videos. I am enjoying
watching them.
He's seeing the same world that I am, viewed through the
lenses of a New Age Spirituality.
New Age, Schmuu Nage! Whatever! IMO, NewAgers' can't even agree
amongst themselve
On Nov 4, 2008, at 6:19 AM, Harry Veeder wrote:
Pope urged to admit common ground
By Robert Pigott
Religious Affairs Correspondent
When 138 senior Muslim scholars and clergy tried to establish the
common ground between Islam and Christianity last year, they said the
very peace of the world h
: 04 November 2008 16:31
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
There will be an entity stirring people up, urging them to march to the
Valley of Jezreel, his name is Lucifer.
--- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! --
http
On Nov 4, 2008, at 9:31 AM, thomas malloy wrote:
Taylor J. Smith wrote:
Jeff wrote:
Bible prophesy, which has a habit of coming true, indicates that at
the end of the age there will be a one world religion that will
punish Christian believers, who refuse to deny Jesus, with
execution b
Taylor J. Smith wrote:
Jeff wrote:
Bible prophesy, which has a habit of coming true, indicates that at the end of
the age there will be a one world religion that will punish Christian
believers, who refuse to deny Jesus, with execution by beheading.
I ask, "Is there any major religion on the
Hi Thomas,
Thanks for passing on the "Camelot" Bob Dean videos. I am enjoying
watching them.
...
> He's seeing the same world that I am, viewed through the
> lenses of a New Age Spirituality.
New Age, Schmuu Nage! Whatever! IMO, NewAgers' can't even agree
amongst themselves what criteria makes
Pope urged to admit common ground
By Robert Pigott
Religious Affairs Correspondent
When 138 senior Muslim scholars and clergy tried to establish the
common ground between Islam and Christianity last year, they said the
very peace of the world hung on the outcome.
On Tuesday, a high-rankin
programs, such as medicare or the interest payments on the debt, that
are growing out of control?
Ed
-Mark
-Original Message-
From: Edmund Storms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 7:24 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powel
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Taylor J. Smith
Sent: Tuesday, November 04, 2008 10:29 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
Jeff wrote:
Bible prophesy, which has a habit of coming true,
ind
2008 11:43
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
Just taking a shot of their front page today:
http://www.capmag.com/index.asp?page=2
This is the Objectivists (extreme rightwing) rag mag.
The Black reporter kicks in the Black guys they d
;s alright then.
-Original Message-
From: Jeff Fink [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 04 November 2008 11:30
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
That means you are suppose to bless those muslims who hate you.
Harry
Yes.
Before, duri
That means you are suppose to bless those muslims who hate you.
Harry
Yes.
Before, during, and after 9-11 America had troops in Kosovo protecting
Muslims from Serbian attack. My son was one of those troops.
Jeff
s level we can discuss the
free market.
-Original Message-----
From: Mark Iverson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 04 November 2008 07:24
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
For the most part I agree that most modern religions have decent goals and
t
1,779
1,795
1,734
Nat'l resources/envir 1,612 1,878 1,529 1,633
1,699
All other 1,818 2,079 2,233
2,743
2,384
Totak NON-defense 48,034 49,200 49,752 52,660 54,076
-Mark
-Or
OrionWorks wrote:
Hello again, Thomas,
Oh, THAT Bob Dean. Yes, I've heard of him. Many times. (Must have been
a senior moment.)
Bob Dean obviously has an interesting story to tell. I do not feel it
appropriate of me to cast judgment pro or con or evaluate the veracity
He's seeing t
Hello again, Thomas,
> BTW Steve, I happened upon this Utube video. I assume that you will
> agree with most of what Mr. Dean has to say. The bottom line is that:
> there's no evidence that they (Space Brothers), are from anywhere other
> than this solar system, that there is more than one species
- Original Message -
From: "Jeff Fink" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 6:25 PM
Subject: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
Indonesia is becoming a very dangerous place for Christians. I have
missionary acquaintanc
- Original Message -
From: OrionWorks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Monday, November 3, 2008 5:46 pm
Subject: Re: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
> Jeff Fink Said: > > ... > > > You may wonder how good of a Christian I am? Well, > >
- Original Message -
From: Jeff Fink <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Monday, November 3, 2008 4:36 pm
Subject: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
> You are perhaps mixing the Old Testament with the New.
>
> The Old Testament is primarily about the
-Original Message-
From: Mike Carrell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 5:36 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
With militant Islam, you see it filtered through a
honor-based desert culture. The
Just to throw another stick on the fire, have any of the very
religious contributors to this discussion considered that a real
reality exists outside of what we call the physical reality and their
religion is simply an imperfect way to describe this reality? The
explanation based on religi
o.com
Subject: Re: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
Jeff Fink Said:
...
> You may wonder how good of a Christian I am? Well,
> I am not as good as I need to be, but I am trying.
I often wonder how good a human being I am to myself and to others as
well. I know I co
Jeff Fink Said:
...
> You may wonder how good of a Christian I am? Well,
> I am not as good as I need to be, but I am trying.
I often wonder how good a human being I am to myself and to others as
well. I know I could use improvement, and I am trying.
> Bible prophesy, which has a habit of comi
le.
Jeff
-Original Message-
From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 12:09 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
The same argument applies to Christains with respect
to certain passages in their
IL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 12:09 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
The same argument applies to Christains with respect
to certain passages in their bible.
Harry
- Original Message -
From: Jeff Fink <
Hi Thomas,
I may get a chance to look at the youtube.com video you recommend
tonight. Incidentally, I have no idea what Mr. Dean's position is on
what I presume is the "ET" matter, whatever that is. Shoot! I don't
know what my OWN position is on the matter.
Regarding:
>>> If good Muslims kill al
OrionWorks wrote:
From: Jeff Fink
If good Muslims kill all non-muslims why have Jews been living in their cities
for over a millennium?
Because most Muslims are not living their religion by the book! Only what we
refer to as the extremists behave that way. Most Muslims show much more
t wait for the electron to be over and we get back to science...
Agreed
No hard feelings, I hope!
No hard feelings as long as we can communicate without personal attack.
Ed
-Mark
-Original Message-
From: Edmund Storms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 9:5
From: Jeff Fink
> If good Muslims kill all non-muslims why have
> Jews been living in their cities for over a
> millennium?
>
> Because most Muslims are not living their religion
> by the book! Only what we refer to as the
> extremists behave that way. Most Muslims show much
> more kindness than
Scan reading the posts and some "random thoughts",
I find talk about black tribal leaders selling other blacks into slavery a
non-sequitur. That was wrong but the Europeans took part and made it a
massive industry of pure misery.
OR
The US espouses the free market and yet gives a welfare cheque
>From Mark Iverson,
> RE: the Japanese Americans... If you're referring to internment
> camps, war is ugly. Bluntly put, if you kick sand in the scrawny
> dude's face, and he gets up and beats the living shit outa you,
> tough! You started it, you suffer the consequences if your
> assessment of t
il homogeny and just base, venal, top level
greed.
Least we not forget in November at this time or remembrance.
-Original Message-
From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 03 November 2008 11:19
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Kha
Harry Veeder wrote:
The same argument applies to Christains with respect to certain passages in
their bible.
From: Jeff Fink <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
If good Muslims kill all non-muslims why have
Jews been living in their cities for over a millennium?
Because most Muslims are not living their
iticians… they are more concerned about the
> power struggle with the opposing party, and how to get back or
> maintain power, than legislating in a responsible manner what's best
> for the average citizen. I have no doubt that this country would be
> much better off if we eli
ur 'revised' history
books... Perhaps your history is a bit skewed, or dare I say manipulated,
because certain facts have
been eliminated? And who controls what textbooks make it into our schools? A
very liberal
teacher's union.
Jed finally writes:
"Really, it is incredible th
ark
-Original Message-
From: Edmund Storms [HYPERLINK mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
]
Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 4:40 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
As usual, your emotions get the better of logi
The same argument applies to Christains with respect
to certain passages in their bible.
Harry
- Original Message -
From: Jeff Fink <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sunday, November 2, 2008 10:20 pm
Subject: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
> If good Muslims
R C Macaulay wrote:
I noticed that Colin didn't dwell on the oldest running war in history
that started way back in Canaan's day, next to 1800 BC with Ismael..
then to Edom.. to Herod ( Esau's kinfolk) and a slight jump to
Muhammed in AD600. Or as t
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXWqX_O4B
Message-
From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 9:47 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
If good Muslims kill all non-muslims why have
Jews been living in their cities for over a millennium?
Harry
If good Muslims kill all non-muslims why have
Jews been living in their cities for over a millennium?
Harry
- Original Message -
From: Jeff Fink <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sunday, November 2, 2008 9:33 pm
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
> Good C
l Message-
From: Edmund Storms [HYPERLINK mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL
PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 4:40 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
As usual, your emotions get the better of logic. First o
, the ignorance is astounding.
Jeff
-Original Message-
From: Mark Iverson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 6:56 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
Gee Ed, I don't know any christians, buddists, scientologi
>From Mark Iverson,
> Gee Ed, I don't know any christians, buddists, scientologists or
> any other belief systems that want to wipe out other belief systems;
> that would strap bombs on their children and handicapped, let
> alone 'sane' adults, all in the name of their religion/god.
>
> With all
Mark Iverson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Gee Ed, I don't know any christians, buddists, scientologists or any other
> belief systems that want
> to wipe out other belief systems; that would strap bombs on their children
> and handicapped, let
> alone 'sane' adults, all in the name of their rel
2008 2:38 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
How do you tell the good Christians from the bad Christians, Richard?
Surely you know that bad Christians exist. I suggest you use the
same method you would apply to
Christians.
Ed
O
ct: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
How do you tell the good Christians from the bad Christians, Richard?
Surely you know that bad Christians exist. I suggest you use the same method
you would apply to
Christians.
Ed
On Nov 2, 2008, at 3:29 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:
> R
>From Richard
> I noticed that Colin didn't dwell on the oldest running war in
> history that started way back in Canaan's day, next to 1800 BC with Ismael..
> then to Edom.. to Herod ( Esau's kinfolk) and a slight jump to Muhammed
> in AD600. Or as the song goes.. "the beat goes on" with Sonny a
How do you tell the good Christians from the bad Christians, Richard?
Surely you know that bad Christians exist. I suggest you use the same
method you would apply to Christians.
Ed
On Nov 2, 2008, at 3:29 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:
R C Macaulay wrote:
These people have their religious mand
R C Macaulay wrote:
These people have their religious mandate to kill us. You try
separating the good muslims from the bad ones because I can't see
the difference.
Not a problem! Not long ago, by historical standards, most Japanese
people had it in for us, and were determined to kill America
On Nov 2, 2008, at 12:23 PM, OrionWorks wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXWqX_O4BKY
It moved me to tears.
Me too. It was such a relief to hear someone at national level give
an honest and rational evaluation of the present situation. After
hearing unending bullshit for the last s
I noticed that Colin didn't dwell on the oldest running war in history that
started way back in Canaan's day, next to 1800 BC with Ismael.. then to
Edom.. to Herod ( Esau's kinfolk) and a slight jump to Muhammed in AD600.
Or as the song goes.. "the beat goes on" with Sonny and Cher.
Colin can s
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