Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

`What we actually need is clarity from the en:wp arbcom. They could easily say "yes Legal has advised X but we are stricter", and note that they have already banned users for outing blatant bad faith spammers. GorillaWarfare's commentary on this, both personal and speaking for the arbcom, are

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Perhaps the WMF should drive the paid editing companied out of business by competition? They could try setting up a subsidiary trading company to carry out paid editing in a professional and legally compliant manner. I am sure this could be popular with the community as a way of getting a return

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Okay I have been bold and started a list of the known banned socks of companies involved in undisclosed paid editing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Doc_James/Paid_Editing_Companies I have also started the discussion of the policy implications of such a list here and will not work further on

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

If we had such a list of known bad actors created by the WMF we could than more easily apply the G5 speedy deletion criteria. It is easier to associate an undisclosed paid editor with the company they are from than with their previous sock accounts. James On Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 9:40 PM, Jytdog

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Hi Jacob, Thank you for following up. I wonder what more Legal could to deter bad-faith editors from venturing onto Wikipedia in the first place and engaging in inappropriate activity. Keep in mind how much high-skill volunteer time is diverted into investigating and cleaning up after bad-faith

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Thanks for this Jacob. Would you please address Legal's approach to the following scenario: a company advertises Wikipedia editing services for clients, and there is no disclosure of paid editing by an editor employed by or affiliated with the company on Wikipedia. (In other words, a company

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Jacob and the rest of the legal team. Many thanks for your clarifications on the "private information" versus "off Wikipedia information" issue. Also it is excellent to see your willingness to adjudicate on especially controversial cases. Best James On Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 7:17 PM, Jacob

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Charles, Very few paid editors who currently advertise use the trademarks; they do say that they will write or help write articles in Wikipedia , and that is a true statement. They will sometimes say they are authorized to do so, or that their work is legitimate, which is false, but that does

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Hi Jacob, Can we get an ETA on the longer statement? Pine On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 9:41 PM, Jacob Rogers wrote: > Hi all, > > I want to share a few thoughts on the paid editing issue. First of all, we > do have the ability to enforce our terms of use. If there are cases

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

We regularly take action against websites offering Wikipedia paid editing services when they use the Wikipedia puzzle globe or other Wikimedia trademarks [1] in a way that could suggest to visitors that their services are offered or

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Undisclosed paid promotional editing is one of the biggest risks we face not only to the quality of our content but to our reputation. We need to do a more to address it. No company editing Wikipedia for pay should be allowed to use the Wikipedia logo or name IMO. I am not sure how much the law

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Just want to note that in my OP I had linked to an ANI thread (now archived here ) about the discovery of a long term paid editor; the same editors who found that, have found another -- this time the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

On 7 January 2017 at 20:31, Jytdog at Wikipedia wrote: > With those companies freely (and often mockingly) advertising their > services, the spigot is opened wide - they constantly get more customers > and send people here to edit.I would like to know if legal is >

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Thanks for your note, Jacob. It is great to know that WMF is happy to help with specific on-Wiki issues, working from the ground up, as it were. Yes members of the community are constantly playing whack-a-mole to deal with specific incidents. The reason I asked the original question, is that

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Just thought, all the solutions have been directed at the people making money for providing the service has anyone tried contacting the companies paying for the service, if so what was the outcome? On 7 January 2017 at 13:41, Jacob Rogers wrote: > Hi all, > > I want to

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Hi all, I want to share a few thoughts on the paid editing issue. First of all, we do have the ability to enforce our terms of use. If there are cases where you're encountering a severe problem with paid editing and community efforts are not able to solve it, please get in touch with us via

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

I've just crossed https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:CentralAuth/Paulinapaulina3030 but I must confess I won't do anything out of the wiki (it.wiki) where I am a local sysop. Catching crosswiki paid editing is the most frustrating activity ever, a couple of years ago I wasted two months in

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Sending a cease and desist letter costs little.WMF will find many volunteers happy to provide what evidence they possess linking various companies to various articles. Yes, attempting to enforce a cease and desist letter would entail court costs, and that should be considered. One thing that

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

On Thu, Jan 5, 2017 at 8:33 PM Risker wrote: > I do not know enough about how other Wikipedias handle such spam, although > I have heard from some people editing on some projects that similar > articles there would be speedy-deleted without a second thought. I do not > think

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

It's a difficult challenge. I agree with David; on English Wikipedia, we have masses and masses of articles of borderline notability that are so obviously blatant spamand they have a terrible tendency to be kept at Articles for Deletion. It's a reflection of our still-optimistic outlook that

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

I should add: I spent a few months following the various AFD queues on WP lately, and MY GOODNESS THERE ARE SO MANY BLATANT SPAMMERS. What Jytdog raises is an actual problem. The short reason for a lot of the Problems with Wikipedia is actually "spammers mean we can't have nice things". - d.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Christophe Thanks for replying! This is something the board should be paying attention to, as undisclosed paid editing that causes scandal that reaches mainstream media on a regular basis, damages the reputation of Wikipedia, and is something that both Jimmy Wales and Sue Gardner (when she

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Hi Christophe, Thanks for replying. I'd like to note that in addition to the quality problems that are created by some of the COI editors, these editors also cost us in terms of volunteer time, focus, and energy. With the available human resources, procedures and tools, my impression is that the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Thanks Katherine. I look forward to hearing from someone. On Mon, Jan 2, 2017 at 11:00 AM, Katherine Maher wrote: > Hi Jytdog, all - > > A gentle and kind reminder that the WMF offices are closed for the holidays > right now. Please look for an answer when we return. > >

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Hi Jytdog, all - A gentle and kind reminder that the WMF offices are closed for the holidays right now. Please look for an answer when we return. Our normal working days resume tomorrow. Happy New Year! Yours, Katherine On Mon, Jan 2, 2017 at 05:02 Lilburne

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

On 02/01/2017 00:52, Pine W wrote: (: I think that Legal could at least describe in general terms what they are currently doing and have plans to do in the near future. If it turns out that the answers are "we aren't doing much and we aren't planning to do more", then yes, asking the higher-ups

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Heu To be fair it's a topic that isn't currently in our plate. So to be honest, from a board level, I can't really give you an answer right now. As said before, there might be legal constraints we can't foresee. I made a not to work on that topic, but it might take some time as the current

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

​Like most in western countries you'll find most of the WMF staff are currently out of office so I wouldnt expect much back especially not officially from them until after the 9th​ January. On 2 January 2017 at 16:42, Jytdog at Wikipedia wrote: > This is something that

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

This is something that people can natter over endlessly. The question is to the WMF board and management. These are the people who can authorize action or not. Anything else is just talk. Again - what discussions has the WMF had, at the corporate decision-making level, about taking legal

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Good points, Gnangarra. I started to write out a reply before realizing that maybe I would give ideas to our adversaries, so I'll wait here for Legal to talk. Perhaps some of us can continue this conversation behind closed doors. Pine On Sun, Jan 1, 2017 at 7:59 PM, Gnangarra

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

I think it would be nice for a more direct input from the WMF over those not following the Terms of use. I see some potential pitfalls, even in chasing companies that charge for content; - would this draw WMF into a legal editorial position - would it drive them to further hide their

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

(: I think that Legal could at least describe in general terms what they are currently doing and have plans to do in the near future. If it turns out that the answers are "we aren't doing much and we aren't planning to do more", then yes, asking the higher-ups to do something about this sounds

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Pine, thanks for your reply, but Legal will not do anything like this unless they are instructed by management. That is why I directed my question to the board and management. I've asked at Jimbo's talk page (bad timing, archived over the holidays, will repost) and at Katherine's WP talk page.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Where is WMF with pursuing companies that offer paid editing services

Forwarding to Legal. I'm aware of the general problem of undisclosed COI editing, and agree that there should be some enforcement of this, particularly given that WMF wants to use Wikipedia's NPOV and RS policies as part of WMF's marketing. I also wonder if WMF might be able to recover the costs