Randall, > I'm also from Michigan, doesn't mean I blindly accept the opinion of everyone who speaks here.
That goes "ditto" for me as well, especially when folks such as yourself point an entire list to spin sights dedicated solely to fragging those who present factual informatioin or reasonably supported perspectives contrary to the conservative party line. I was appreciably amused with the pro-Bill Oh-Really? bits found at one of your "sources." Forget Oh-Really's snotty mouth and bad manners. That sight conjours up distortions for every deceipt that he's practiced on the public for decades. And sadly, as long as he's got people similar to yourself defending him he'll never have to speak truthfully. Must be nice. Doubtful that you're getting paid for your efforts either..... What a sham....I mean shame. Again, thanks for the chuckles. I have this sneakin' suspicion that you have a few more of these gems up your sleeve just itchin' to slip out. Oh....one other thing. Relative to your poker skills, or in this case your lack thereof, there's this little beaut... > A large number of civilians > died in Iraq during the war and occupation. I'm willing to bet that a > very large portion of those deaths were not inflicted by Americans > though. Me thinks that you might want to get a grip on the numbers before you initiate your practices of dispersion, much less start laying money down on your peculiar beliefs. Ten to twelve thousand civilian deaths during the initial weeks of the invasion.... If the bombs hadn't dropped they wouldn't be dead, now would they? Those were American/Coalition bombs, now weren't they? And they were dropped because America's favourite antagonist decided to show everyone his full depth and breadth of ineptitude. But it's their fault that they're dead, huh? So how about quantifying what you call "a very large portion?" Go ahead, take your time. But when you're finished, I'll give you 10:1 odds that you're completely in error. But hell, it's your money - bet what you want. Seems to me that you've got a sad knack of placing responsibility in places where it doesn't belong. Doesn't speak well for your powers of discernment. Todd Swearingen ----- Original Message ----- From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <biofuel@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2004 1:20 PM Subject: RE: [biofuel] Re: Re: Fahrenheit 9/11 > I'm also from Michigan, doesn't mean I blindly accept the opinion of everyone who speaks here. The facts are true. Michael Moore is meticulous in making sure he doesn't say anything that is explicitly false. Instead, he uses cheap camera tricks and clever sequences to give a very clear picture of what he is trying to say without ever actually implicating himself. > Just a few examples from Bowling from Columbine because its been thoroughly analyzed numerous times. > Firstly, the gun from the bank. > > http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/bowlingforcolumbine/scenes/bank.htm > > He edits the seen to make it appear like he walked in wrote his name down and got a gun. This is supposed to show how easy it is to get a gun. This is a horrible example because the same process is used here as any gun shop would use. He neglects to show the fact that the clerk then took his ID and ran it through I believe its an FBI? database. But it certainly looks like America is handing out guns to anyone. If I remember correctly from read the process actually took closer to an hour and a half. Weak example yes, but none-the-less if shown honestly it would do nothing to promote Moore's arguement that any old fool can get a gun in the way he described. The requirements for getting that gun from the bank were just as stringent as getting it from any other registered gun shop. If he wants to analyze that, then fine, I support it. Maybe it is too easy to get a gun, I'm not here to offer an opinion on it, but the bank scene is only an example of the same process that would happen in any other legal weapon transaction. > I think the NRA bashes are more incriminating of Moore's deceptive style. He spends quite a while dehumanizing the NRA and especially Mr. Heston. I had a very good friend see this movie and tell me Heston and the NRA were a bunch of jerks for jumping up to hold rallies right after the killings in Flint and Columbine. I must say, the 'evidence' in the movie was compelling. But some other people slowed down the feeds and picked through the internet. The 'rally' in Flint wasn't actually a Rally, Heston showed up to support Bush on his campaign, and it was 7 months after the incident. The movie shows a headline that says, "48 hours after Kayla Rolland is pronounced dead" either right before or right after the Heston clip. It insinuates the meeting was 48 hours after, and there is no way its not intentional. But the headline continues on to say something about Clinton making a statement about the incident and is completely unrelated to the NRA. > http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/bowlingforcolumbine/scenes/hestonrally2.htm > He also uses the NRA meeting in Colorado right after the Columbine shootings as further ammo against the NRA. The video clips he shows of Heston are actually from another rally, and he fails to mention that the NRA cancelled most all of its other activities aside from the vote that by law is mandatory. I believe its a non-profit law to vote officials or something else similar. Irregardless the NRA had to have its meeting, which it did, but the NRA did nothing like what Moore shows. Frankly, I don't know what the whole NRA bash accomplished for his argument, but his entire basis against the NRA is made up. It looks more like he has a vendetta against the NRA and wants to publish it. > So, quite frankly, I don't trust the guy, or most of what he says. He has been explicitly decpetive in BFC. He has something compelling with the Iraq war, but just like most of the media, its entirely one-sided. And his theory on the Saudi connection and the plot with the Bushes to intentionally start a war is pretty weak. Its more an assertion using almost nothing. I think his smoking gun is a connection in the Carlyle group, which is a large investing firm. I don't know about you guys, but I don't know the other stockholders of the companies I invest in, much less socialize and plot to take over the world with them. I'm really anxious to see what little camera tricks he threw into this one when it comes out on DVD. > Randall Sanborn > > > > > -------------- Original message -------------- > Look pal, speaking as one of Mike's Michigan homeboys, you and I are > gonna throw down. When Mike says, "The facts are true, the opinions are > mine," he means it. If you have a mental disorder that distorts your > analytical skills to the point where you can't tell fact from opinion, > then you really should only read Mike's books or watch his films under > the supervision of a trained mental health specialist. Until you're > ready to seek mental health services, I suggest you go back to your > flock of ostriches and stick your head back in the sands of the > mainstream media informational wasteland. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Biofuels list archives: > http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > > Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. > To unsubscribe, send an email to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Yahoo! 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