For what it's worth, I like Josh's idea for several reasons:
- production ncsu service runs from the apache code
- its a great way for ncsu to help promote the apache project
- it helps maintain the community that has been building over the years
- appears to me (a newbee) to support the apache naming policy

John Bass
john_b...@ncsu.edu
www.cnl.ncsu.edu
(919) 515-0154


On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 10:51 AM, Josh Thompson <josh_thomp...@ncsu.edu>wrote:

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> But what does it mean to "stop using theirs"?  Does it mean the letters
> "VCL"
> cannot appear anywhere at their site?  (I feel really weird saying "their"
> since I'm employed at NCSU, but I'll try to stick to saying this with my
> ASF
> hat on).
>
> I feel really strongly that we (ASF) should continue using VCL as the name
> for
> the project because that's what it has been know as for the last 5 years.
> So, I want to work toward figuring out what NCSU must do to allow that to
> happen.  If everything at NCSU gets changed to "Apache VCL at NCSU", would
> that work?  The goal of moving VCL from NCSU to ASF is to allow more people
> to get involved in development of it, and thus have it used at more places.
> So, it would make sense to me for multiple places to be able to call their
> install of it "Apache VCL at <insert institution name here>".
>
> Josh
>
> On Thursday February 19, 2009, Alan D. Cabrera wrote:
> > As Matt pointed out there needs to be a distinction between this ASF
> > project and its original progenitor, NCSU VCL.  It's quite simple,
> > either we change our name or they stop using theirs.
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> > Alan
> >
> > On Jan 6, 2009, at 8:18 AM, Josh Thompson wrote:
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> > > Maybe we should look at this from a different angle - is there
> > > anything that
> > > *can* happen for the name to continue as "VCL" at ASF?
> > >
> > > Josh
> > >
> > > On Tuesday January 06, 2009, Alan D. Cabrera wrote:
> > >> Thanks for your comments Matt.
> > >>
> > >> Well, it's after the holidays.  Time to pick this thread back up.
> > >> This issue needs to be resolved before we graduate.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Regards,
> > >> Alan
> > >>
> > >> On Dec 19, 2008, at 1:01 PM, Matt Hogstrom wrote:
> > >>> Alan,
> > >>>
> > >>> Thanks for starting the discussion about this.  I think there are a
> > >>> few different issues so I'll try to separate them.  The issues we
> > >>> need to address is the trademark of VCL and the other is the
> > >>> identity of the community.  Perhaps we should talk about these in
> > >>> reverse order.
> > >>>
> > >>> First is the identity  of the community.  The move of the
> > >>> development for the VCL codebase from NC State to Apache marked the
> > >>> formation of a community outside of NC State.  So, what NC State
> > >>> decides to do or not to do is not particularly relevant to the
> > >>> community collaborating at Apache.  Given this separation, perhaps a
> > >>> different name is appropriate so their is a clear distinction
> > >>> between NC State's use of VCL and the Apache Incubator's community.
> > >>>
> > >>> As far as the name goes.  Since Virtualization and hosting is, well,
> > >>> virtual, perhaps a name like spectre or Casper would be good :)
> > >>> (ya, I already can see the naming police coming).
> > >>>
> > >>> On Dec 19, 2008, at 10:19 AM, Henry E Schaffer wrote:
> > >>>> Alan writes:
> > >>>>> ...
> > >>>>> If VCL is a trademark owned by NCSU then they would have to assign
> > >>>>> the
> > >>>>> trademark to the ASF or we would have to change our project's
> > >>>>> name.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> OK - I think we've reached a very clear question to be resolved.  I
> > >>>> think here's what needs to be resolved (at least in my mind):
> > >>>>
> > >>>> If VCL is a trademark owned by NCSU, and If NCSU assigns the
> > >>>> ownership
> > >>>> to the ASF - then would ASF give NCSU permission to continue its
> > >>>> web
> > >>>> site as is (possibly with an acknowledgement to the ASF)?
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Alternatively: If VCL is a trademark owned by NCSU, and If NCSU
> > >>>> doesn't assign the ownership to the ASF, but gives permission to
> > >>>> ASF to use
> > >>>> "VCL" as part of naming this ASF project - could, and would the ASF
> > >>>> use
> > >>>> "AVCL" ("Apache VCL") as the name?  (Or some other formulation
> > >>>> which
> > >>>> would be an Apache name but clearly portray to users and potential
> > >>>> users
> > >>>> that it's the same project.)
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Does the above make sense?
> > >>>> --
> > >>>> --henry schaffer
> > >
> > > - --
> > > - -------------------------------
> > > Josh Thompson
> > > Systems Programmer
> > > Virtual Computing Lab (VCL)
> > > North Carolina State University
> > >
> > > josh_thomp...@ncsu.edu
> > > 919-515-5323
> > >
> > > my GPG/PGP key can be found at pgp.mit.edu
> > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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> > >
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> > > O7WjXdHQWfQ6B3uUTkTr9+g=
> > > =iwnz
> > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
>
>
> - --
> - -------------------------------
> Josh Thompson
> Systems Programmer
> Virtual Computing Lab (VCL)
> North Carolina State University
>
> josh_thomp...@ncsu.edu
> 919-515-5323
>
> my GPG/PGP key can be found at pgp.mit.edu
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> 08/+XKmuBe0HDLfJDogNMKc=
> =NPtg
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>

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