Re: [wc] Re: Gallaudet

[Eleanor Keyser]

Ellen are you serious?  No, really?

The Deaf community is more than just a group of people who have trouble in the hearing world.  It's an entire culture, with its own language, arts, sports leagues, churches, and schools.  Sign languages are fully formed natural languages that have evolved wherever groups of Deaf people have lived together.  There are many sign languages, and many dialects within sign languages.  Many members of the Deaf community (especially those who are congenitally deaf and learned a signed language as their first language) don't feel disabled AT ALL.  They feel like they are constantly knocking heads with the "disabled" label.  Deaf people participate in a fully formed, beautiful culture based on a common language.  Gallaudet is one of the most important institutions in the American Deaf community.  Deaf people have a tremendous amount of pride in Gallaudet, and to imagine it being headed by a woman perceived as less than a full-fledged member of the community is appalling.  As I understand it, there are myriad other issues at stake for the protesters, but their main fear is people like you.  If you actually can't see past your own narrow-minded view of what is necessary to live a full and rich life, and what cultural experiences constitute the best possible life, I suggest you refrain from letting other people hear your nonsense, lest we pity you for your disabled imagination and clear lack of class.

And for the record, Signed Exact English is exactly that, a visual version of English using English syntax, a syntax which is nothing at all like the syntax of signed languages.  Finger spelling is also exactly what it sounds like--just English words spelled out with fingers.  In ASL finger spelling is used only for proper nouns, though many proper nouns have signs as well.  Being given a name sign is an honor.  ASL and other signed languages are just as complex and unique as any language--they are not some lower class of English.

Ellen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

That was a total non sequiteur. Do you honestly believe that deaf
people wouldn't rather be able to hear? And understand what people
are saying if they aren't using sign language? This has NOTHING to
do with how other people feel about them. This is just about
ability. Lightening your skin to have better opportunities would
just be about acceptance and changing how people feel about you
(maybe, unfortunately). It wouldn't change your inherent abilities
or strengths or skills. You still haven't answered my basic
question. Regardless of what deaf people say to the media or in
public, do you truly think that at least a good number wouldn't
rather be able to hear what is going on around them, given the
choice? Why is it any different than blind people wanting to be able
to see? Again, should I have been content to just go along with what
nature gave me and not be able to to fully function in society
because I refused to correct my vision? There is something wrong
with these people's hearing mechanism! They have to compensate or
correct it, or they won't be able to fully participate in their
society. Do I really sound prejudiced? You're certainly entitled to
your opinion, but I think deaf people should be able to do everything
they are capable of. I just think that if they want to take
advantage of technology to improve their hearing or comprehend speech
without sign language, they should be able to. Is that really a
problem? Black people don't have something wrong with their skin or
pigment, it's just different. I don't really think it is a
complicated philosophical question, and you can argue just for the
sake of arguing, but it is totally different than black people
wanting to be white just to be accepted. At least that is my
perspective, obviously.

--- In weingartenchatters@yahoogroups.com, "dvm8375"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> By your logic, should black people lighten their skin to have
better
> social/professional/etc. opportunities too?
>
>
>
> --- In weingartenchatters@yahoogroups.com, "Ellen"
> wrote:
> >
> > I guess my issue is that deaf people who don't lip-read can only
> > communicate with each other or people who happened to learn sign
> > language out of interest or in order to communicate with deaf
> people
> > in their lives. Do deaf people really think lipreading is such a
> bad
> > thing? I wonder if most deaf people don't honestly wish they
> could
> > hear. I don't think any blind people don't wish they could see.
> Yes
> > of course in a concert you can hear the vibrations, etc., you can
> see
> > people clapping, you learn ways around it. But don't you think
> you
> > have more professional, social, etc. opportunities if you can
hear
> > what is going on around you? I realize there are two different
> but
> > related issues, lipreading and cochlear implants or other devices
> > to "cure" deafness. I don't think I'm being harsh, just
> realistic.
> > You are welcome to disagree, but that is how I feel.
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In weingartenchatters@yahoogroups.com, "Daria Akers"
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Fully enjoy? Humm.... they don't enjoy them like you do but
> that
> > > doesn't
> > > > mean that they enjoy them less. I would insert the article
> from
> > the
> > > Post a
> > > > few months ago about the deaf interpreters at the Billy Joel
> > > concert. Great
> > > > article.
> > > > Besides people who are differently-abled sometimes do things
> that
> > > we never
> > > > even thought about..... This video is a perfect example:
> > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBv79LKfMt4
> > > > I've personally never thought about trying to learn to echo
> > locate
> > > because I
> > > > don't have to but sure would be cool.
> > > > Ok that had nothing to do with what we were talking about but
> > it's
> > > soooo
> > > > COOL.
> > > > Daria
> > > >
> > > > On 10/12/06, Ellen wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > gay vs. deaf is apples and oranges--I'm not talking about
> > > acceptance
> > > > > vs. discrimination like is the issue with the gay
community,
> I'm
> > > > > talking about being able to to fully participate in
> society.
> > Gay
> > > > > people can fully participate in society, except for getting
> > > married.
> > > > > They can fully enjoy concerts, movies, plays, waves
> crashing,
> > rain
> > > > > against the window, etc. It's not an issue of "getting
away
> > with"
> > > > > being a hearing person, it's an issue of being able to fully
> > > > > participate in/enjoy all life has to offer. IMO.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>






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