I agree with Fae. I strongly oppose the proposal, and I somehow used to
assume that our opinion would be asked in a structured way.

Cheers
Yaroslav

On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 7:03 PM Fæ <fae...@gmail.com> wrote:

> If the WMF is going to make statements that are not derived from all
> the demonstrable facts, perhaps the community should now respond with
> a completely unambiguous RFC on meta so there can be no doubt?
>
> Something along the lines of:
> "The WMF have employed Wolff Olins for rebranding advice, and they
> recommend that Wikimedia rebrands itself around the word "Wikipedia"
> and projects like Wikimedia Commons are renamed to "Wikicommons" to
> ensure marketing of the projects can easily be delivered by the WMF.
> Do you support or oppose this rebranding programme?"
>
> With a straightforward RFC to keep on linking to in every discussion
> on every venue, we might then have tangible evidence of whether "There
> is considerable support for the branding proposal" or "There is
> considerable opposition for the branding proposal" is factual. Rather
> than drifting along for months with the debate and unhappiness that
> comes from arguing both sides of a mostly political case without
> firmly verifiable evidence available or relying on complex and less
> credible stats from surveys that are likely to suffer from embedded
> bias, especially considering the already banked investment in
> consultancy that drives the need to change something, to prove the
> spent money had impact and "value".
>
> P.S. Zack and others, it's best to avoid the word "collaboration" when
> communicating with an international group. It has unfortunate history
> and gives the impression that you are quoting views from collaborators
> rather than holding open collegial discussion.
>
> Thanks,
> Fae
>
> On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 at 17:19, Diane Ranville <dranville-...@wikimedia.org>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I agree with Pine.
> > There is a majority of people who actually oppose the rebranding
> > proposition.
> > I don't quite understand why this is still going forward (except that it
> is
> > difficult to acknowledge a mistake and take steps backwards - but it is
> > sometimes necessary).
> > Have other options even been considered?
> >
> > -speaking in my own name here-
> >
> > Diane
> >
> > On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 7:35 AM Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hello Zack,
> > >
> > > Thank you for the report on Meta.
> > >
> > > I am troubled by your statement in this email that "There is
> considerable
> > > support for the brand proposal and general appetite to improve our
> > > movement’s branding system." What that statement appears to omit is
> that,
> > > according to the report on Meta, there is also considerable opposition
> to
> > > the rebranding proposal.
> > >
> > >
> > > Can you explain why you characterized the proposal as having
> "considerable
> > > support" without in the same sentence acknowledging what appears to be
> > > considerable opposition?
> > >
> > >
> > > Of the three top-level metrics that the report on Meta displays that
> > > measure community and affiliate support or opposition regarding the
> > > rebranding proposal, one of the three metrics is in favor and two of
> the
> > > three metrics are opposed. If this was an RfC, and I was using those
> > > measures of sentiment to evaluate support and opposition regarding the
> RfC,
> > > I would probably close the current rebranding proposal as declined.
> > >
> > > Pine
> > >
> > > ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, Sep 5, 2019, 20:49 Zack McCune <zmcc...@wikimedia.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > > *Summary* - We want your help with a voluntary, OPT-IN design
> process for
> > > > movement branding.  Please join the in-depth discussion group, or
> watch
> > > for
> > > > updates on Meta-Wiki.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hello all,
> > > >
> > > > After 4 months of community consultation, spanning dozens of
> affiliates,
> > > > several mailing lists, community conferences, and Meta-Wiki, I am
> pleased
> > > > to share a summary of feedback on the proposed 2030 movement brand
> > > strategy
> > > > [1].
> > > >
> > > > From more than 319 comments, representing 150 individual
> contributors and
> > > > 63 affiliates, we assessed 6 major themes in feedback:
> > > >
> > > >    1.
> > > >
> > > >    Reducing confusion
> > > >    2.
> > > >
> > > >    Protecting reputation
> > > >    3.
> > > >
> > > >    Supporting sister projects
> > > >    4.
> > > >
> > > >    Addressing (legal, governmental) risks
> > > >    5.
> > > >
> > > >    Supporting movement growth
> > > >    6.
> > > >
> > > >    The process of change
> > > >
> > > > Please visit our feedback summary page to learn more [2]. You will
> see
> > > > examples of comments within each section, along with a rough
> indication
> > > of
> > > > how many of the comments that we received were related to each theme.
> > > >
> > > > The comments sometimes contradict one another, showing that across
> our
> > > wide
> > > > movement’s experience, different points of view are common (and a
> sign of
> > > > health!). To visualize these tensions, we have created “polarity
> maps”
> > > > which are used to help visualize how different arguments coexist in
> > > tension
> > > > with each other.
> > > >
> > > > Ultimately, the comments provided from you all are very thoughtful
> and
> > > > useful guidance on what is needed to make our movement’s branding
> > > > successful. One can read the 6 themes above as “criteria” for
> assessing
> > > > branding systems.
> > > >
> > > > == Thanks ==
> > > >
> > > > I would like to thank the organizers of Iberoconf, Wikipedia
> Education
> > > > Summit, and the Wikimedia Summit for inviting us to hold discussions
> > > during
> > > > their sessions. I would also like to thank my colleagues Elena
> Lappen,
> > > > Samir Elsharbaty, and Blanca Flores who conducted extensive parts of
> this
> > > > consultation. To the hundreds of people, and dozens of affiliates
> > > > commenting, thank you for reviewing the proposal and offering your
> > > > perspectives and insights.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > == Next steps and staying involved ==
> > > >
> > > > There is considerable support for the brand proposal and general
> appetite
> > > > to improve our movement’s branding system. Further, we believe that
> > > > critical feedback on the proposal offers direct guidance for
> precisely
> > > what
> > > > branding must do to be successful for our movement. We have shared
> these
> > > > insights and our proposed continuance with the Board of Trustees, who
> > > > approved continuing these efforts.
> > > >
> > > > Acting on community insights, we will be collaborating on formal
> brand
> > > > naming, visual identity, and brand system design that will use
> > > “Wikipedia”
> > > > as the central reference point. The resulting system will be OPT-IN
> for
> > > > affiliates.
> > > >
> > > > This design process will be guided by a “brand network” – a group of
> > > > volunteers who would like to continue advising on brand during this
> > > > consultation. Dozens of people have already volunteered, and we
> invite
> > > you
> > > > to join the group. We will use a group on Wikimedia Space to host
> this
> > > > discussion and the group will be closed to allow candid discussions
> and
> > > > room for iterations. EVERYONE IS INVITED TO JOIN [3]. If you do not
> want
> > > to
> > > > commit to the in-depth, longer term discussions that will be
> happening
> > > > within the brand network group, we will still be tracking comments
> left
> > > on
> > > > the project’s Meta-Wiki page [4]. Furthermore, all important ideas
> and
> > > > updates originating from the brand network discussion will be shared
> > > > publicly to mailing lists and Meta-Wiki.
> > > >
> > > > The development of this proposed identity system will take
> approximately
> > > 6
> > > > months. As stated, regular updates will be shared to mailing lists,
> > > > Wikimedia Space, and Meta-Wiki [4]. Please engage us where you are
> most
> > > > comfortable! Once complete, community groups will have the power to
> > > decide
> > > > if/when they opt in to using the new system.
> > > >
> > > > Yours,
> > > >
> > > >  Zack
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> https://wikimediafoundation.org/news/2019/02/26/leading-with-wikipedia-a-brand-proposal-for-2030/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [2]
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Communications/Wikimedia_brands/2030_research_and_planning/community_review/results
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [3] https://discuss-space.wmflabs.org/g/brand-network and click the
> gray
> > > > "Request" button. When your request is approved, you will be able to
> see
> > > > and access the brand network discussion category on the Discuss Space
> > > main
> > > > page.
> > > >
> > > > [4]
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Communications/Wikimedia_brands/2030_research_and_planning
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > >
> > > > Zack McCune (he/him)
> > > >
> > > > Director of Brand
> > > >
> > > > Wikimedia Foundation <https://wikimediafoundation.org/>
> > > > _______________________________________________
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> --
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
> Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote.
>
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