[LUTE] Re: Fingering question
Dear Gernot, The composer who has caused me the most concern over fingering is Fuenllana. There are many instances where he could have made life easier for everyone. I don't know if being blind was an issue here. I doubt it. What occurred to me is that some odd fingerings could have resulted from the way he possibly composed the pieces, one voice at a time, setting each voice seperately and not changing fingering when the second or third voice entered. It is up to you, as you are the performer, to make your own decision. What is to be lost and gained by changing the printed fretboard positions? Did the composer really want a different tone quality by placing it on the second course instead of the third - they are not so different on most lutes? If temperament is a possible reason for difficult fingering, is the composer consistent in his use of those particular frets in that particular mode or key? I always try to do what is asked, but will certainly change something if I feel it helps me articulate my reading of the score. You have to be convinced about every note you play, otherwise your performance will suffer. My opinion, of course. There are many others. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: WG: Charles Mouton lute music EL 082326
-- Forwarded message -- From: Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 27 Mar 2008 23:05 Subject: Re: [LUTE] WG: Charles Mouton lute music EL 082326 To: wolfgang wiehe [EMAIL PROTECTED] I had a problem with this. I paid for the download with paypal. The money was taken out of my account, but the download didn't work. Now I'm going to have to negotiate downloading the files again for free, or get my money back - not easy when you don't speak the language. Take care. Rob On 27/03/2008, wolfgang wiehe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Ursprungliche Nachricht- Von: E lucevan le stelle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Sonntag, 23. Marz 2008 13:34 An: E lucevan le stelle Betreff: Charles Mouton lute music EL 082326 Charles Mouton lute music by Franco Pavan EL 082326 Dear friends of Music, we are very proud to present you a wonderful recording: http://www.elucevanlestelle.com/le-mouton-fabuleux/ Best regards from E lucevan le stelle Records -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: WG: Charles Mouton lute music EL 082326
I wrote to the company saying that the download failed, and they sent me downloads of the booklet but not the sound files...I've replied asking specifically for the sound files. I've downloaded many mp3s from various sites, with no problem at all. I hope this is a one-off. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: WG: Charles Mouton lute music EL 082326
I agree, Jean-Marie, they do need to do so something to improve their service. I have just had an email from them asking ME to apologise to THEM for making people on this lute list aware of the problems I have had. They accuse me of not being able to download a file. However, it seems from other remarks on this list that I am not the only one who is incapable of saving a file! They have also offered me one file to download at a time - many tracks. I can't be bothered. Poor Franco Pavan - a player well-worth hearing. Hopefully in the future he will record with a proper record company, one which doesn't accuse its customers of being incompetent in the most basic of computer operations. They obviously read this list. I'm sure some of you have had no problems, but clearly some of us have had problems. Apparently we should all apologise to them, so here goes: I am indeed sorry I bothered trying to download one of your discs. It won't happen again. Rob On 28/03/2008, Jean-Marie Poirier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had the same problem with tthem Rob, for other downloads... They eventuelly sent me a different address system and I could download what I had paid for, at 2 ko/second... It took the day ! They should do something to improve their service and make it reliable. Too bad, especially as they have good music to propose ! Best, Jean-Marie === 28-03-2008 08:20:28 == -- Forwarded message -- From: Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 27 Mar 2008 23:05 Subject: Re: [LUTE] WG: Charles Mouton lute music EL 082326 To: wolfgang wiehe [EMAIL PROTECTED] I had a problem with this. I paid for the download with paypal. The money was taken out of my account, but the download didn't work. Now I'm going to have to negotiate downloading the files again for free, or get my money back - not easy when you don't speak the language. Take care. Rob On 27/03/2008, wolfgang wiehe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Ursprungliche Nachricht- Von: E lucevan le stelle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Sonntag, 23. Marz 2008 13:34 An: E lucevan le stelle Betreff: Charles Mouton lute music EL 082326 Charles Mouton lute music by Franco Pavan EL 082326 Dear friends of Music, we are very proud to present you a wonderful recording: http://www.elucevanlestelle.com/le-mouton-fabuleux/ Best regards from E lucevan le stelle Records -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://poirierjm.free.fr 28-03-2008 --
[LUTE] Re: WG: Charles Mouton lute music EL 082326
The company have very kindly and very promptly returned my money. I'm so sorry this didn't work out. I want to encourage downloads, especially as discs are so hard to find. I've had a few thousand downloads of mp3s on my own website - a free service. Why is it so much harder when money is involved?! Good luck to them, nonetheless. Judging by the snipets on their website it sounds like a great recording. I wish Franco well with it. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: my new theorbo! - pics and sound file
Dear Urs, I'm sorry to say I don't know the wood used for the core of the neck. It just never came up in conversation, but I could find out for you easily enough. The neck IS veneered in ebony, with red paint in both peg boxes. The kingwood was Malcolm's idea, and I have to say it works very well for large instruments. Rob On 29/03/2008, Urs Leo Gantenbein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a fine instrument, indeed. What are the timbers used? Kingwood for the bowl and beech for the neck? Or does the neck has a pine core? The neck doesn't seem to veneered, but stained black and red inside the pegbox. Urs Leo Rob MacKillop wrote: I brought this home on Tuesday from Malcolm Prior's workshop - a stunning theorbo in A, 85cms string length. I've uploaded a photographic history of its construction, and an mp3 file of Piccinini's Corrente Prima - a slower than I would have liked performance, but I think (hope) you will forgive me! These are difficult instruments to get around on, and I haven't had much time: http://www.rmguitar.info/theorbo.htm This was my first commission for Malcolm Prior, but it certainly won't be my last. He had a 10c ready for shipping to Germany which I fell head over heels in love with. Malcolm has had an on/off/on/off building career these last few years as he twice became a father, but he is now very much back into building lutes, and by all accounts better than ever. I think he has reached the top rank of luthiers. He is currently updating his website, but it is already well worth a visit. Excuse my gushing - I am not on commission - honest! Rob MacKillop www.rmguitar.info -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Urs Leo Gantenbein Ackeretstrasse 16 CH-8400 Winterthur SWITZERLAND --
[LUTE] Re: my new theorbo! - pics and sound file
Malcolm has told me that the core of the lower neck is mahogany (Khaya), the core of the upper neck is South American cedar, which he thinks helps the tone. Rob On 29/03/2008, Urs Leo Gantenbein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a fine instrument, indeed. What are the timbers used? Kingwood for the bowl and beech for the neck? Or does the neck has a pine core? The neck doesn't seem to veneered, but stained black and red inside the pegbox. Urs Leo Rob MacKillop wrote: I brought this home on Tuesday from Malcolm Prior's workshop - a stunning theorbo in A, 85cms string length. I've uploaded a photographic history of its construction, and an mp3 file of Piccinini's Corrente Prima - a slower than I would have liked performance, but I think (hope) you will forgive me! These are difficult instruments to get around on, and I haven't had much time: http://www.rmguitar.info/theorbo.htm This was my first commission for Malcolm Prior, but it certainly won't be my last. He had a 10c ready for shipping to Germany which I fell head over heels in love with. Malcolm has had an on/off/on/off building career these last few years as he twice became a father, but he is now very much back into building lutes, and by all accounts better than ever. I think he has reached the top rank of luthiers. He is currently updating his website, but it is already well worth a visit. Excuse my gushing - I am not on commission - honest! Rob MacKillop www.rmguitar.info -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Urs Leo Gantenbein Ackeretstrasse 16 CH-8400 Winterthur SWITZERLAND --
[LUTE] Re: Recercare
I loved it, Val. Very nice phrasing, breathing and tone. The question over professional and amateur is an interesting one. Pros need to be consistent, amateurs can be consistent sometimes (!). I've definitely heard better performances from amateurs than professionals on many occasions, and vice versa of course. Ultimately it is meaningless. The performance at the moment is all that matters, and that performance in front of a lute audience seemed to me to be near perfect. If I was a pro waiting to go on after you, I would have felt very uncomfortable indeed! Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] 7c at 64cms
I'm thinking of getting a 7c in G at 440 - is 64cms the longest length possible? I have big hands and find small lutes uncomfortable. I'm thinking of it principally for Dowland's chromatic fantasies but also accompanying a singer in songs from Dowland's first three books (all for seven-course), and need to be at 440. How stable will be the pitch at 440? Gut strings would be preferable, but might well opt for nylgut for the first course if it keeps breaking. What diameters and tensions would you suggest? Also on relatively small lutes (not baroque) such as a 7c, what difference in tone might one expect from a multi-ribbed back as opposed to wide ribs? Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 7c at 64cms
Thanks Ed and David (and other comments too). Refining my comments a little, I would say that for the solo work I would be happy with a lower pitch, so tuning to F would be no big deal. I was worried about asking a soprano or tenor to sing a tone lower, especially those who have already learned some of these songs at 440. In this regard, I find David's comments very interesting. I will not, however, be able to afford two lutes (why not use a capo? - much cheaper!). I will give it much thought. But Ed, I totally understand, agree with and appreciate what you are saying. Rob On 02/04/2008, David Tayler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 64 is a bit long in the tooth for 440. You can get the gut up to pitch barely but it is a stretch. But if you want it for Dowland, F is very good both singer and solo wise. The tessatura of the songs is such that a significant number phonate better at 392, although some of the nice ones lie low, eg Can she excuse, In Darkness I usually use two lutes for the songs a tone apart, so as to include Flow not so fast, Weep you no more, and a few of the low ones, Shepherd in a shade, etc.For a soprano you can go 392/440 For a mezzo or alto/countertenor 370/415 dt At 12:38 PM 4/1/2008, you wrote: I'm thinking of getting a 7c in G at 440 - is 64cms the longest length possible? I have big hands and find small lutes uncomfortable. I'm thinking of it principally for Dowland's chromatic fantasies but also accompanying a singer in songs from Dowland's first three books (all for seven-course), and need to be at 440. How stable will be the pitch at 440? Gut strings would be preferable, but might well opt for nylgut for the first course if it keeps breaking. What diameters and tensions would you suggest? Also on relatively small lutes (not baroque) such as a 7c, what difference in tone might one expect from a multi-ribbed back as opposed to wide ribs? Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: 7c at 64cms
On 02/04/2008, LGS-Europe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PS: the shoulder is not troubling you anymore, especially with the new theorbo? Thanks for asking, David. Oddly, or not, I have less trouble with the theorbo. Must be using the muscles in a different way. I now play about an hour a day, in two or three sessions, and have no problems...so far. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 7c at 64cms
Confession time: I was originally thinking of a 7c, then played Malcolm Prior's 10c (before it was shipped to Germany), and decided on one of those, at 64cms. Now I'm thinking 7c again...I drive myself and everyone around me crazy sometimes. So what do I want it for? I don't have a lute in Renaissance tuning. Repertoire I would like to explore: 1. Dowland songs, especially the first three books - 7c 2. Dowland solos, including the chromatic fantasies - 7c 3. Francesco da Milano - 6c 4. Airs de cour - 10c 5. Scottish - 10c All of the above could be played on a 10c, but not successfully. Likewise on a 7c, but again with debateable compromise. So I need a luthier with a 'three for the price of one' offer! The airs de cour could be played on the theorbo or 7c. The Scottish repertoire is OK on a 7c, though not ideal. Francesco on a 7c? I wouldn't be the first to do that. I could always take the seventh off and add an octave to the fifth course, but is it worth it? Dowland songs down a tone or tone and a half? Yes, I like a more spoken delivery - that might work if I could get a singer willing enough. So... Today, it looks like a 7c in E (440), all gut, 64cms. Tomorrow? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Test 17
No, it hasn't. Please send me it privately or try again to the list. I'm very much interested in what you have to say, Stewart. Rob On 02/04/2008, Stewart McCoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Test 17 My message sent yesterday to Rob MacKillop about 64 cm lutes does not seem to have come through. Stewart McCoy. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: 7c at 64cms
A couple of folks have written to me off-list suggesting an 8c. Sorry, not interested. Just don't like them. Neither one thing or another. I'll go either 7 or 10. Probably 7. Thanks for the suggestions, nonetheless! Cheers, Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 7c at 64cms
Thanks to everyone for their input. I've decided instead to get a Fender Stratocaster - covers most things from Francesco to Jimi, and costs a lot less. Jean-Marie - I used to have an 8c (seems like a thousand years ago) on which (at the advice of Jacob Lindberg) I swaped the bottom two courses around. I just never felt happy with it, and soon sold it. Everyone is different, thankfully. 9c - why play a 9 when a 10 opens up so much more? So, Anthony, I will not be phoning Matt Wadsworth who has a 9c Gottlieb for sale (I'm sure it will be a great buy for somebody). It has been interesting thinking out loud on this list. Lots of good experience here to draw on. Much appreciated. I seem to be experiencing my own renaissance as a lute player. By the end of this year I'll have an 11c, a theorbo and a 7c (or 10c!). That should keep me busy enough! Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Dowland's Books
Stainer and Bell in the UK have published all Dowland's songs in reliable modern editions - including lute tablature and transcription: http://www.stainer.co.uk/dowland.html Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Dowland's Books
I bow to your superior knowledge, Ron. It is an area I will be looking into eventually. The SB editions seem a good place to start, plus the facsimiles. Have the Poulton biog. Rob On 03/04/2008, Ron Andrico [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Rob all: I have to say that one must approach even the sainted SB editions with a bit of caution. The poetry retains many of the 'corrections' perpetrated by Fellows, who should be commended for his pioneering work but scolded for messing with the texts. It is worth the bother to check the SB editions against the facsimiles, Diana Poulton's Dowland biography (with song-by-song analysis), and Doughtie's _Lyrics from English Airs_. It seems like a great deal of trouble just to sing some lute songs, doesn't it? Best wishes, Ron Andrico http://www.mignarda.com Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2008 07:47:58 +0100 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [LUTE] Re: Dowland's Books Stainer and Bell in the UK have published all Dowland's songs in reliable modern editions - including lute tablature and transcription: http://www.stainer.co.uk/dowland.html Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Pack up or back up-use SkyDrive to transfer files or keep extra copies. Learn how. --
[LUTE] Re: 7c at 64 cms
I have a friend I push around in a wheel chair. We pull that trick every time. Suckers! Rob On 03/04/2008, Anthony Hind [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David You forgot two of my favourite whiskies, Bruichladdich and Clynelish. A friend of mine found a very ancient Bruichladdich at Edinburgh University Celtic association, and was bringing it back to Paris, when at the exit of a tube gate, he found a person in a wheel chair who needed help to get over the gate. My friend put everything down, including the treasured whisky, and when he had helped the fellow through the gate returned to pick-up his goods, and found that his ancient whisky was missing. Since he had told me he was bringing it back, and I was already imagining the exquisite taste in my mouth, I found myself both laughing, and sort of crying as he told me this tale. I imagined this mugger chuckling over the 35 year old Whisky. I only hope he did not cut it down with lemon juice, as many do in Scotland, I am told, calling it Whisky Toddy, or some such. http://www.rampantscotland.com/recipes/blrecipe_toddy.htm It could, of course, be that my friend invented the whole story just to keep the bottle to himself. I had never thought of that, I wonder ... Now I will declare that I love all 8c lutes, if you can find another such bottle for me; but a one hundred year old Calvados of a very rich dark green colour (that this friend also found me, bless him), would do as well, I can assure you. No such a friend could not possibly have invented that story. Best wishes Anthony Le 3 avr. 08 =E0 19:56, David Tayler a ecrit : I continue to hold the unpopular view that the eight course may slightly slow musical development: If you have any interest in continuo, the non linear bass is a hurdle, and if you wish to play 10c, archlute or theorbo, the course memorization for the bass courses is slowed a bit: you have to think, is that an F or an E? However, all of these issues can be--and are-- dealt with by practice. In a way, it is also a very special lute, for precisely those reasons--the quirky jump, the noted F and D reasonance. So for these reasons, every collector should have one, just not learn on one--if continuo, 10c, archlute is a possibility down the line. For the same reasons, I would not recommend learning harpsichord with a short octave, although it is a cool instrument. I wouldn't play Dowland or Francesco on an eight course for stylistic resons, and that is a big chunk. I hope this won't prevent me from sampling any of the Islay whiskies, including Lagavulin, Laphroaig, Bowmore and Ardbeg, my preferred four course dt To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- --
[LUTE] Re: Kapsberger mp3s
It was difficult, but I asked the fans to stop cheering...oh, you mean the other kind of fans... I record into Nero Wave Editor - nothing special about it, in fact it is a simple programme, the likes of which you could pick up for free on the internet. I'm not at all technically minded about these things. I just plug the mic into the computer and press record. I don't know how the fans are not picked up. Rob On 06/04/2008, Stephen Arndt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rob, Very nice playing as always. I found the Kapsberger piece especially soothing. Tell us, what recording program are you using on your laptop? And how do you avoid picking up fan noise? Stephen -Original Message- From: Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Apr 6, 2008 2:23 PM To: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Kapsberger mp3s Passacaglia in Am, Canario and Kapsberger. Scroll to the very bottom of the page: http://www.rmguitar.info/theorbo.htm I love this instrument! Recorded with cheap Sony mic straight into laptop, and a very slight touch of reverb added. I would like to be able to afford all the equipment David mentions, but in the meantime this will have to do. Sounds best through a good pair of headphones, favourite drink in hand... Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Kapsberger mp3s
I've just been informed my Malcolm Prior that I had the wrong diapason string length on my web page. It should say 168cms, not 164. Just thought I'd mention it... Rob PS Thanks for nice comments... -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Re dark red Loaded Strings
Looking forward to trying them some day. Thanks for that, Anthony - and Mimmo, of course. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Pavana
Hi Stephen and Vance, I've just checked my facsimile - definitely in duple time and seems to me to be notated correctly. I personally would not play it too slowly. Rob MacKillop On 13/04/2008, Stephen Kenyon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Greetings. I notice the Pisador vihuela Pavana muy llana para taner is notated in triple time in the Schott guitar edition, which says that the original was given in duple. Normally pavans are duple, but looking at it it does seem to insist on being triple (or is that just knowing it so long in triple?). Three questions pertain: - should this piece really be in triple time? - if so how does it end up in triple: is it a function of its being from an earlier time than many pavans we are used to? - is there an implication for tempo, eg should it be quicker than the stately progress we think of for the standard duple pavan? Umpteen thankings, Stephen To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Pavana
On 13/04/2008, Stephen Kenyon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If playing in duple where would the stress fall? Upon the player... Rob PS Sorry about that flippant response - I'm suffering from flu at the moment, and don't feel up to what you are asking of me (my fault, not yours - I'm happy to discuss these things usually). Without looking at it closely, I would say that looking for a regular stress in Renaissance music, even dance music, is often stress-inducing. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Essays on Scottish 17th-century music
This academic book has been published recently: Defining Strains The Musical Life of Scots in the Seventeenth Century You can read about it, incuding contents, here: http://www.buchhandel.de/detailansicht.aspx?isbn--8-3-03910-948-7 It includes a chapter on Scottish lute music by yours truly... Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Longest 6c piece?
I've just been listening to Bart Roose's very good recording of music by Neusidler (www.passacaille.be) - it has raised the profile of Neuslider for me at least. Anyway, there is one track which clocks in at 12 minutes 38 seconds - Ein sehr kunstreicher Preambel oder Fantasey. Is this the longest 6c piece? Depends how fast you play it, of course! I'm not used to hearing such long pieces on the 6c. Very nice piece, by the way. I usually get very restless listening to 6c recordings - so many short pieces. This makes a change. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Longest 6c piece?
An hour to perform - and an eternity to listen to, I imagine. It raises the question as to whether it is a 'composition' or a catalogue of examples. I haven't seen the notation. What do you think, Are? The Bakfark sounds more interesting. Anyone have more details? Rob On 15/04/2008, Are Vidar Boye Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Vincenzo Galilei wrote 100 variations over the Romanesca, which would take more than one hour to perform. Are IIRC, there's a Bakfark intabulation that runs around 18 minutes. I heard Jacob Herringman play part of it once, but that was some years ago and I don't recall the name. Guy -Original Message- From: Rob MacKillop [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 11:53 AM To: Lute List Subject: [LUTE] Longest 6c piece? I've just been listening to Bart Roose's very good recording of music by Neusidler (www.passacaille.be) - it has raised the profile of Neuslider for me at least. Anyway, there is one track which clocks in at 12 minutes 38 seconds - Ein sehr kunstreicher Preambel oder Fantasey. Is this the longest 6c piece? Depends how fast you play it, of course! I'm not used to hearing such long pieces on the 6c. Very nice piece, by the way. I usually get very restless listening to 6c recordings - so many short pieces. This makes a change. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] website updated
Luthier Malcolm Prior has updated his website: http://www.malcolmprior.co.uk/index.htm - he took some time out when his wife started having children. He is now fully back into lute making and has a fairly short waiting time, as well as non-commissioned instruments coming up for sale. Highly recommended! Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Aarrrgghhhh!!!
This page left me speechless: http://www.kiltmagazine.com/KiltMagMusic0305.html - does anyone know this guy? He even 'quotes' me - I said no such thing. And it's good to have confirmation that Dowland was in fact born in Dublin! - something I've always hoped for. I don't know whether to laugh or cry... Rob MacKillop www.rmguitar.info -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Aarrrgghhhh!!!
Just a thought - maybe he is one of us? The Phantom Lurker? I was going to write to him and the guy who wrote the article, but thought better of it. We reap what we sow. It's not the first time I've had quotation remarks around comments I never made. Seems to be the way reporters work. Nothing to be gained by picking a fight. Oh dear...I'm getting old! Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: continuo playing in Germany
Is there any possibility that this will be translated into English? Rob On 17/04/2008, Mathias R=F6sel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please excuse tze shameless ad: Order Fundamenta der Lauten-Musique from Deutsche Lautengesellschaft. It's a tutor for continuo with 11c lute in D minor tuning. -- Mathias To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Reportage (was Re: Aarrrgghhhh!!!)
Dear all, I think my original Subject line of 'Aarrrgg!!!' still holds! Rob On 18/04/2008, gary digman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: former Vice Presidents who claim to have invented the Internet and be the Fount of All Knowledge regarding global warming come immediately to mind. Isn't this an example of the type of misconsturing of facts that is being discussed? The fact is Gore never claimed to have invented the internet and he never claimed to be the font of all know;edge regarding global warming. Gary To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: ukr. lutes iconogr.
Interesting, as always, Roman. We generally read that the lute came to Europe through Spain and Italy from North Africa, but you seem to be saying that northern Europe had its own tradition? Am I reading you correctly? Rob 2008/4/24 Roman Turovsky [EMAIL PROTECTED]: A half dozen interesting iconographic titbits (mainly section 4) at http://www.torban.org/mamai/index.html for your perusal and delectation. RT To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] new website
I've decided to put all my mp3 sound files on a dedicated website called Song Of The Rose (www.songoftherose.co.uk). I have no interest anymore in making CDs, so all my future solo files will be placed here. It currently includes Renaissance lute pieces from my Graysteil CD, which is no longer available, and Bach's 2nd suite for cello on 11c. Much more to follow in due course. Cheers, Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: new website
Hi Alan, I can't get anyone to tell me what has happened to Graysteil. The company which bought Dorian are not responding to my emails, and there is no sign of the disc on their website. I have thought about uploading the entire disc to my website, but the other musicians on the disc are not keen on that. And, until we know the exact legal position, Magnatune wouldn't want to touch it. This futhers my arguement that record companies are dead or dying, and are to be avoided. Anyway, glad you like the website! Cheers, Rob 2008/4/24 Alan Hoyle [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Many thanks for this cornucopia, Rob. I'm sorry that you have given up the vihuela, but a chap's only got so many hands, so much time so much space, I suppose - and these instruments aren't cheap! The stuff on Renaissance lute sounds lovely - any chance of the CD being re-issued (on Magnatune, for example, if Greysteil no longer exists)? Best Alan - Original Message - From: Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 1:26 PM Subject: [LUTE] new website I've decided to put all my mp3 sound files on a dedicated website called Song Of The Rose (www.songoftherose.co.uk). I have no interest anymore in making CDs, so all my future solo files will be placed here. It currently includes Renaissance lute pieces from my Graysteil CD, which is no longer available, and Bach's 2nd suite for cello on 11c. Much more to follow in due course. Cheers, Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.4/1394 - Release Date: 23/04/2008 19:16 -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter for private users. It has removed 2030 spam emails to date. Paying users do not have this message in their emails. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len --
[LUTE] Re: Ray Nurse's words of wisdom
Monica's statement was originally on the Vihuela list... BTW, Ray is wrong - we (well, some of us, not me, and probably not you) do kill those whose beliefs we disagree with. I also doubt whether medieval man smelt worse than one of my students...and I haven't yet met a soprano who didn't think she was the centre of the universe! Rob 2008/4/24 Nancy Carlin [EMAIL PROTECTED]: If anyone here who is not a LSA member would like a copy of the Quarterly with that interview in it, email me with a street address and I will mail it out to you. Nancy Carlin Monica says: I have just been reading Ed Durbrow's interview with Ray Nurse in LSA quarterly and I particularly liked the bit where he say Their performance situation was different (from ours) they ate different food and smelled worse than we do, they burnt heretics and believed that the earth was the centre of the universe! (and a lot of other things that seem totally illogical to us today judging by the programmes on the Medieval Mind currently showing on BBC4 over here. Their world was certainly different from ours and they had fewer choices than we have. Nancy Carlin Associates P.O. Box 6499 Concord, CA 94524 USA phone 925/686-5800 fax 925/680-2582 web site - www.nancycarlinassociates.com Administrator THE LUTE SOCIETY OF AMERICA web site - http://LuteSocietyofAmerica.orghttp://lutesocietyofamerica.org/ -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[BAROQUE-LUTE] Tombeau de Mouton
This is a beautiful piece by Robert de Visee, with the 11th course lowered to B. I've just uploaded an mp3 of it to www.songoftherose.co.uk - please note that I've added an Updates link for easy access to files added since your last visit. You can find the link to the Tombeau there or on the Baroque Lute page. The opening two or three bars sounds familar. Is it a quotation from Mouton? Actually reminds me of Weiss... Further evidence that no-one ever wrote a bad Tombeau... Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: new piece of the month
Beautiful, Martin, and very sensitively played! Rob 2008/4/29 Martin Shepherd [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Dear All, In the nick of time, before April turns into May, there is a new piece of the month: www.luteshop.co.uk/month/pieceofthemonth.htm Do let me know what you think - sending parcels off into cyberspace sometimes feels like Mr Sting's message in a bottle Best wishes, Martin P.S. I hope to make it into the 17th C next time. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: new piece of the month
This is an interesting subject. I have to own up and say it was me who asked Martin why there were no twiddles in his performance. I didn't mention it on the list in case it came across as criticism, which of course it isn't. I thank Martin for bringing the subject to the list. Please excuse me personalising this for one moment. There was an internet discussion many years ago (I can't recall if it was here or elsewhere) about ornamentation in early music, and one guy said 'you should here Rob MacKillop - he ornaments on every other note' - this came as a surprise because I didn't think I was adding ornaments at all. So I listened to the cd Flowers of the Forest, and yes, I was surprised by the amount of ornamentation - although not quite on every other note! The thing is, I never consciously added ornaments, and now see those twiddles as an outcome of phrasing. I added those notes because it helped make the phrase sing. Now, that was with Scottish lute music which is closely related to a living tradition of singing in Scotland, and I've often said that the biggest influence on my playing was the phrasing and, I guess, ornamentation of traditional singers. Of course, the singers would argue that they do not add ornaments, and would be just as surprised as I was to hear that they have been. It's all about phrasing. So, what might that have to do with more 'posh' music - Milano to Dowland? Well, I don't think they are so unrelated. I can't quote chapter and verse, but it is my understanding that the same pieces can be found in different manuscripts with ornament signs in different places. Therefore...it is not an exact science about where these things go or how often they can be used. Different strokes for different folks, so to speak. One of the reasons I have probably avoided the English 6c and 7c repertoire is that I feel uncomfortable playing it in what seems to be the accepted style, which has very few if any ornaments. When I play with the freedom I have with Scottish music, the English repertoire sounds strange! I put it down to my inability to 'play the music properly', but maybe players generally should be adding more twiddles - it changes the phrasing, though, and to many that might be unacceptable. To more practical matters: Ron, how do you know that clarity of line in polyphony was of prime importance to singers? With one voice to a part, each singer might have extensively decorated their own part. The clarity of the written score (especially in modern editions with all the parts standing to attention alongside each other) might not have been general practice. This also goes for imitative graces at points of imitation. It looks neat and tidy, but did singers really care about that? And was there always a Choral Director, one person dictating how all the others should sing? I'm not making any bold statements here. The bottom line is I don't know how much ornamentation was added or how it was sung/played. But I do think singable phrasing is of prime importance, and this very often implies adding twiddles where they feel natural for the phrase. Just a feeling. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: new piece of the month
Dear Ron, I'd like to thank you, in turn, for your thoughtful reply. If I take issue with one or two points, it is nothing personal - I'm just thinking out loud. 1. How can you say that you 'can state this without reservation' that 'everyone in the sixteenth century who was fortunate enough to lay hands on a lute was first taught to sing'? Everyone? But I'm being picky. You probably mean 'most people'? Impossible to know for sure. 2. The important part of your useful Zarlino quotation, for me at least, was 'progressions absolutely intolerable in composition'. This clearly divides the matter into two seemingly polar camps: Performance Practice and Compositional Practice. I guess Zarlino was a composer?! 3. Your phrase, 'Personally, I think this fantasia has its own calm, quiet integrity and really does not need finger ornaments to tart it up.' I find interesting. I have never saught to 'tart up' a composition by using ornaments. Nothing could be further from my mind. The term 'finger ornaments' is also interesting. 4. I'm not sure of your contention that a 'full, round, warm tone' would a) cloud the polyphony, and b) is not possible (your implication?) on a lute. Anyway, your stance is a common one today, and might well have been common in the 16thC, which is not to denigrate it in any way. I played Fuenllana fantasias without decoration because they just didn't seem to move me to do so. So I am not contra anything you say, but I do feel that the relationship between ornamentation and phrasing is one that is little discussed, either historically or today, possibly because it is difficult to put into words. Coming from a different angle...I spent some time in Istanbul studying with the State Orchestra - traditional Turkish classical music, one might say. Everyone had the same score, treble clef, but they all decorated it in their own way. 20 people doing the same thing differently. And it worked beautifully, although it took me over a month to really start appreciating it. There is also the belief by many scholars that larger-scale part music, ten-part masses, for instance, were a product of the tradition of vocal improvising. The style still exisits in some west coast islands in Scotland, and elsewhere in the world. Some might say it sounds cacophanous, some say it sounds beautiful. I tried it with ten of my students: I got them to sing the first line of the Lord's Prayer starting on a C and finding their way to a G. After a few terrible attempts, they started listening to each other, and it started to sound very convincing. The point is, singers DID improvise in the 16thC, and there is a long tradition before and after that century of improvising florid lines, away from the written score. I'm just wondering out loud if we shouldn't do something similar? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] theorbo in Spain?
What evidence is there for the theorbo being used in Spain? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: theorbo in Spain?
Thanks to Manolo and Monica. The answer seems to be 'not much'. Mainly viols, keyboards and guitars for continuo. I suppose the same in Portugal. Rob 2008/5/1 Manolo Laguillo [EMAIL PROTECTED]: In the DICCIONARIO DE INSTRUMENTOS MUSICALES, Barcelona 2001, under 'tiorba', the author of it, Ramon Andres, after mentioning an inventar of possesions of Felipe II, the king of Spain, where two theorbos figure, he tells that culteran poets employed it in its poems because it was considered an aristocratic instrument, 'emblem of a refined art'. He cites, among others, Luis De Gongora (1561-1627): Un d=EDa pues que los cisnes de espuma tiorbas fueron de pluma esto el aire oyo sereno (The day when the surf swans where theorbos made of feathers the serene air heard this) He also cites the count of Villamediana (1582-1622), Pedro Soto de Rojas (1584-1658), Gabriel Bocangel (1603-1658) and Antonio Sol=EDs (1610-1686). Rob MacKillop wrote: What evidence is there for the theorbo being used in Spain? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- --
[LUTE] Re: Barto Weiss 9
Interesting to see that Amazon are selling mp3 files of the whole disc. Rob 2008/5/1 Daniel Shoskes [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Volume 9 is now out in the USA. Hardcopy from Amazon: http://snipurl.com/26pdk mp3 from Amazon: http://snipurl.com/26pdw iTunes store: http://snipurl.com/26pe5 I think it's the best of the bunch so far. DS To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Barto Weiss 9
Do you get the booklet notes? Rob 2008/5/2 Daniel Shoskes [EMAIL PROTECTED]: They have been doing this for some time now. As a Mac addict I must admit that I prefer them to the iTunes store. Discs are usually a dollar or so cheaper and there is no DRM restrictions. Also, I pay with an Amazon Visa card which gives me an additional 5% off all purchases. It's a pretty good deal. DS On May 2, 2008, at 3:58 PM, Rob MacKillop wrote: Interesting to see that Amazon are selling mp3 files of the whole disc. Rob 2008/5/1 Daniel Shoskes [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Volume 9 is now out in the USA. Hardcopy from Amazon: http://snipurl.com/26pdk mp3 from Amazon: http://snipurl.com/26pdw iTunes store: http://snipurl.com/26pe5 I think it's the best of the bunch so far. DS To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: machete
Well, you could start by translating every Portuguese guitar book or manuscript from the 17th to 19th centuries...Too much to ask? Oh well... Seriously, Bruno, I appreciate your offer, and if I come across something I need translated, I'll get in touch. Many thanks. Rob 2008/5/8 Bruno Correia [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi Rob, I speak Portuguese, if you need help... -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Left hand positioning
Daniel, It would be worthwhile getting a teacher to guide you through these early stages, but I appreciate that there might not be any teachers in your area. In that case you will have to start analysing the natural movements of each hand very carefully, because if you try to ask the hand to do something it was not designed to do, then you will cause tension which will affect the music and you might possibly even injure yourself. How you hold the instrument is of prime importance. If, for instance, the neck of the lute is parallel to the ground you must approach the fingerboard with the palm of your left hand facing in towards your body or face. On the other hand, if you hold the lute like a classical guitarist, with a footstool, with the neck at a 45 degree angle to the floor, then your hand might be less angled in towards your body. There are many subtle degrees in between. As a beginner, you will spend a lot of time in first or second position. The hand must be flexible in its approach to the fingerboard. When there are two notes far apart on the same fret, you often have two options: either do as Vance said and use a barre - the index finger lies flat across the strings, or play both notes with different fingers but angle your hand differently, maybe with the palm facing the middle of your body instead of the upper part. It all depends on what comes before and after these notes. What I am trying to stress is that they way you hold the instrument and the way you approach the fingerboard are VERY important, and you should aim to be as relaxed as possible. Any problems you have will probably result from asking your arm, hand and fingers to do something they were not designed to do, or you are using too much pressure. Most of us use far more pressure than is needed. Rob MacKillop 2008/5/8 Daniel Ramey [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Greetings All, I am a rare poster to this list, but I was practicing last night and found an interesting issue cropping up.I am a beginning lute player and most of the songs I have learned to this point have been out of the DeGroot Learning to play the lute book. This is the one that came with my EMS lute. Now, I have another book of 31 pieces for the Renaissance Lute, and those are a bit more complex. Well, I was feeling brave and attempted a couple last night. I quickly found the left hand fingering patterns to be more than I bargained for. I realized after a few attempts, that the tablature showed me everything (which finger to pluck with, which course to pluck, and which courses should be fingered at which frets). But it did not tell me which fingers to use on my left hand! Are there any general rules for fingering position with the left hand? I tend to use my pointer finger for the second fret and my middle for the third, but I find it difficult when I have two or three positions I need to have depressed, that are on the same fret and vertically far apart. Any advice would be appreciated, Thanks, Daniel -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: new piece of the month
Got your new Gottlieb 11c, Anthony? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Flat-back lute
They also have it here, along with other inexpensive lutes and related oddities: http://www.celticrenaissancemusic.com/lutes They say there is a soundfile as well, though I haven't heard it. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Mp3s and Pdfs
Well done, Ron. Nice to hear the viol in there. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Vivaldi Concerto as lute solo
I have uploaded to the new Lute online community a keyboard arrangement of the string parts to Vivaldi's D Major concerto for lute - useful for practising with a harpsichord. http://lutegroup.ning.com/ Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] new network site
Ever one to jump on a bandwagon... The Lute and Baroque Lute lists now have a useful network site, as does the cittern crowd. Now we have the vihuela-baroque guitar social network website: http://earlyguitar.ning.com/ What is there? Well, you can discuss things in a forum, upload photos, pdf files, videos, mp3 files, have your own blog. You have to log in for your first visit. The lute and cittern sites seem to have become popular very quickly. Will it replace this forum? I doubt it, but some might find it more enjoyable. I've also extended the timeline to pre-Torres guitars. It will be useful to have all our sound files, scores, illustrations on one site. If it doesn't work, I'll take it offline in a month's time. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Lute Fury
That's been around for a while. Funny watching again, though. Rob 2008/5/18 Benjamin Narvey [EMAIL PROTECTED]: This is the funniest thing I have seen in a long timea mockumentary that deals withe the wherefore and why of being a lute player; heavy emphasis on the former! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIkc1_zqaC8 -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: First Attempt
Well done, David! What a nice piece. I've read through Zamboni's music and thought it well worth playing and hearing - like Weiss but not as hard, although some of the pieces do require a 14c archlute, but are playable, sort of, on a 10c. Anyway, thanks for that and well done! Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] 4th course octave on 7c?
Is there any evidence, pictorial or otherwise, for an octave pairing on the fourth course of a 7c lute? In other words - a 6c lute plus a seventh course? It's hard to believe that all sixes were strung one way and all sevens another way. Rob MacKillop www.songoftherose.co.uk -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 4th course octave on 7c?
Hi John, You should post more often. That was an interesting comment. John Dowland complaining...imagine that! Seriously though, it is interesting you are playing the Pesaro ms on a 7c - or, on re-reading your comment, you are considering it. I like the octave on the fourth and lament its abscence from almost all 7c lutes I've heard. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] These new network sites
So what do we think of the new 'social network' sites? There is one for lute, one for cittern and one for early guitars/vihuelas. Some have written to me saying they are worried that this list might stop running, but I don't agree. The questions on the Forum of the network sites are generally different in kind, less 'academic', one might say, more social, and some people have contributed there who have not done so here. So I have no fear that the lists will disappear. What the network sites are good at is sharing soundfiles, pictures and scores, and people seem to contact each other more readily when they can see a photograph of the person they are writing to. The Music Player is interesting. Each member has his/her own. You can upload your own soundfiles and have it playing when people visit your My Page. But you can also import soundfiles from other people's pages. I even managed to put my Music Player on my own website. I've been wondering how to do this for some time. Instead of playing one file at a time, you can hear (should you want to, of course!) the whole lot with just one click - then minimise the page while you work on other things. I imagine more players will use this feature in time. See www.songoftherose.co.uk - scroll down the main page. Lots of interesting videos beginning to appear, imported from You Tube - nice to have them all in one place. I've really enjoyed looking at all the images of lutes that have appeared on the photos page - many I haven't seen before, and comments are welcome, leading to discussion. So, I think these networks have their place and are most welcome. But I am happy to still read and enquire on this list. Hopefully both can live in harmony together. I'm sure they can. Discuss... Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] first video
I've added four videos - one lute, three baroque guitar - to the vimeo site. This is my first attempt at making a video - not something I enjoyed too much! My first take - the sound was terrible, so I set the computer up and recorded with a mic in to the laptop at the same time as recording the video. Then in Windows Movie Maker I had to take out the audio from the video and install and line up the mp3 track which I had boosted the volume of and added a tiny bit of reverb. It sounded ok. Then I uploaded the lot to vimeo and also to the lute and baroque guitar networks. The uploads did not go so well. One of the videos would not upload. The others did, but not the little picture for the video icon for clicking on...The sound is a little weird too...not what I heard on my computer before upload...And I should mention there was 20 minutes of my performance which did not get recorded - I never noticed the video tape had run out...Geez, I need to go for a long walk! Still, I hope you get something from these efforts. Was it worth it? Probably not! Go to www.vimeo.com and search for MacKillop. Rob MacKillop PS Excuse the cross posting... -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] more videos
Six short videos of pieces from Wemyss, Straloch and Panmure manuscripts: http://www.vimeo.com/robmackillop/videos Cheers, Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Straloch
I should have mentioned that on the wall behind my head on the new videos is a map of Scotland by Robert Gordon of Straloch... Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: more videos
Thanks Ed. Looking forward to your videos someday! Rob 2008/5/27 Edward Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Very lovely, Rob! I love the music from Wemyss MS. Thanks, ed At 06:44 PM 5/27/2008 +0100, Rob MacKillop wrote: Six short videos of pieces from Wemyss, Straloch and Panmure manuscripts: http://www.vimeo.com/robmackillop/videos Cheers, Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.1/1468 - Release Date: 5/26/2008 3:23 PM Edward Martin 2817 East 2nd Street Duluth, Minnesota 55812 e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] voice: (218) 728-1202 --
[LUTE] strumming
Somone asked me about my strumming techniques so I've added a video on strumming the baroque guitar here: http://www.vimeo.com/robmackillop/videos It's more MacKillop than Corbetta, but you might get something out of it. Not sure about doing it on the lute, though! Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: strumming
Not so far... Rob 2008/5/29 LGS-Europe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Sounds like you were having fun, Rob. Do you ever knock a bar out of place, or seriously damage the top? I have some rather deep scratches (woodchips coming out of the top) and recently needed a loose bar fixed. There are players I know who protect their tops with something coming close to what a flamenco guitar has: tapas. ;-) So, all baroque guitar players out there: beware! David David van Ooijen [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.davidvanooijen.nl To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: strumming
A helpful note from the maker of the guitar: ''As for the proposed idea of soundboard bars getting loose, there are some precautionary measures against this in your guitar - bar end supports. So with the kind of strumming / hitting that you do the bars should be fine, unless you hit really hard.'' I should add that I don't actually hit hard at all - it just sounds that way. And no nails to do damage. The guitar is over two years old, and not a scratch on it. Rob 2008/5/29 LGS-Europe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Sounds like you were having fun, Rob. Do you ever knock a bar out of place, or seriously damage the top? I have some rather deep scratches (woodchips coming out of the top) and recently needed a loose bar fixed. There are players I know who protect their tops with something coming close to what a flamenco guitar has: tapas. ;-) So, all baroque guitar players out there: beware! David David van Ooijen [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.davidvanooijen.nl To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: strumming
Wear your scars with pride! Rob 2008/5/29 LGS-Europe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Well done! Then, I'll blame the dry weather for the loose bar and old age for the scarred top. My guitar is 20 years old by now. David David van Ooijen [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.davidvanooijen.nl To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Vimeo Lutes and Early Guitars Video Channel
With more people appreciating the audio and visual quality of the Vimeo site over YouTube, I've created a Vimeo Channel - one page bringing together all the Vimeo videos with lutes and early guitars. I urge all those of us who have videos to upload them to Vimeo, then inform me and I'll link them to the Lutes and Early Guitars Channel, which is: http://www.vimeo.com/Francesco Visitors welcome. Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[BAROQUE-LUTE] Vimeo Lutes and Early Guitars Video Channel
With more people appreciating the audio and visual quality of the Vimeo site over YouTube, I've created a Vimeo Channel - one page bringing together all the Vimeo videos with lutes and early guitars. I urge all those of us who have videos to upload them to Vimeo, then inform me and I'll link them to the Lutes and Early Guitars Channel, which is: http://www.vimeo.com/Francesco Visitors welcome. Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Double headed 12c
I used to have a 12c. You can see it on David Van Edwards' site. I bought it second hand, so had no choice in model, woods, measurements etc. My understanding is that the larger instruments work better. I didn't have it long enough to get into the specific repertoire for it, and to be honest, the repertoire is not as great as that for the 11c or 13c, and it felt like neither one. But it needed someone to specialise in it to bring out the riches. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: These new network sites
Very nicely said, Jean-Pierre! Rob On 02/06/2008, Jean-Marie Poirier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Peter, I aa just coming back from Norwich where I collected a lute from David Van Edward and he told me thet you lived nearby ! Next time I go there I would be very glad to meet you. After my lightning visit to Norwich, I also dropped an email to Ian Harwood about his forthcoming publication on the English Consort. David had given me his email and he has just replied to me with very kind words. So I am glad to seize this opportunity, after your email arrived on this list, to express my deep gratitude for the contribution of people like you, Ian or David and others as well to make the so-called revival of the interest in Early Music possible. I am very happy to know part of this network in spite of all the frustrations you express ! Take care, as our American friends say, and all the best, Jean-Marie Poirier (from France) === 02-06-2008 11:31:02 == on 22/5/08 8:14 pm, Rob MacKillop at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So what do we think of the new 'social network' sites? There is one for lute, one for cittern and one for early guitars/vihuelas. Some have written to me saying they are worried that this list might stop running, but I don't agree. The questions on the Forum of the network sites are generally different in kind, less 'academic', one might say, more social, and some people have contributed there who have not done so here. So I have no fear that the lists will disappear. What the network sites are good at is sharing soundfiles, pictures and scores, and people seem to contact each other more readily when they can see a photograph of the person they are writing to. The Music Player is interesting. Each member has his/her own. You can upload your own soundfiles and have it playing when people visit your My Page. But you can also import soundfiles from other people's pages. I even managed to put my Music Player on my own website. I've been wondering how to do this for some time. Instead of playing one file at a time, you can hear (should you want to, of course!) the whole lot with just one click - then minimise the page while you work on other things. I imagine more players will use this feature in time. See www.songoftherose.co.uk - scroll down the main page. Lots of interesting videos beginning to appear, imported from You Tube - nice to have them all in one place. I've really enjoyed looking at all the images of lutes that have appeared on the photos page - many I haven't seen before, and comments are welcome, leading to discussion. So, I think these networks have their place and are most welcome. But I am happy to still read and enquire on this list. Hopefully both can live in harmony together. I'm sure they can. Discuss... Rob MacKillop Hi Rob, I am painfully aware that the new technology can supply access to information and experiences that were not available even 12 months ago. My problem is that as an aging one-time pioneer of the EM movement I am finding it difficult to keep up. Out in the country with an iMac G3 running OS 9.2 where do I go to learn more? And perhaps wouldn't I be more useful buying and learning to use a metal-turning lathe to produce those machine-heads that you and other guittar-players are going to need shortly? Except that I may miss something important in the meantime... Yours frustratedly, Peter To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://poirierjm.free.fr 02-06-2008 --
[LUTE] Francesco and the viola da mano
I understand the introduction of the vihuela into Spanish Neapolitan provinces helped the spread of the Italian viola da mano, but where does Francesco da Milano come in? Did he have a connection with the south? Or did the instrument spread to the north as well? How popular was the viola da mano? Any other publications for it? And can anyone flesh out the story of one of the d'Este family ordering a 'Spanish viola da mano' but having to settle for an Italian one instead? I can't remember the facts. I might copy this to the vihuela group as there are some people there who are not subscribers here. Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Francesco and the viola da mano
Thanks, Denys. That sounds an ideal starting place. I've just read this from Chris Wilson's review of the 1997 International Symposium on Francesco: Dinko Fabris had some intriguing new possibilities concerning Francesco's early years. He had uncovered in church records in Barletta, near Bari on the southeast coast of Italy, that a young cleric was working there for five years from 1512. He signed himself Francisco da Milano, the same spelling that is used for Francesco on the title cage of the anonymous publication 'Novamente stanpata', that had already caused so much interest at this symposium. The archbishop of the area came from Pavia but spent much of his time in Rome, only visiting Barletta twice a year. Dinko Fabris suggested that he may have brought Francesco with him from Pavia and that he traveled with his retinue. So he may have had connections with Testagrossa and it may well have been through his association with the archbishop that he obtained his position at the Vatican. So there is the possibility that he was in the south. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Francesco and the viola da mano
John Griffiths' book on Neapolitan Lute Music looks very informative - you can read some of it on Google Books: *http://tinyurl.com/5cjr6v* These links to Google Books are not always successful. Looks like the works of Dentice and Severino could be added to the viola/vihuela repertoire. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Francesco and the viola da mano
Thanks Antonio. So, allow me to simplify things, at least for my own benefit, and forgive me if I over simplify. I'm just thinking out loud... The vihuela de mano was created in Valencia and found its way to Naples where it became popular, more popular than the lute. Some Italian makers started making their own version which they called the viola da mano. Eventually there emerged two apparently distinct types, Spanish and Italian. The Italian version seems to have kept the classic viol shape with deep indents on the sides, while the Spanish version smoothed out the sides, as with the Raimondi drawing, or the figure of eight, almost classical guitar shape of Milan's book. Both types were used in Italy, either imported or copied, and the Spanish types were referred to as Spanish lutes or lyras. Isabella d'Este asks for a Spanish type, and, importantly, insists on it being made from ebony. Although there seems to have been a distinction in the physical aspects of the Italian and Spanish viola/vihuela, the repertoire could be played on either instrument. The Borgias, being originally Spanish, were important in spreading the popularity of the vihuela/viola to Rome and the northern states. Francesco, therefore, did not need to live in the South to come across the viola. His 1536 book mentions the viola before the lute: *Intavolatura de Viola o vero Lauto*. It was printed in Naples where the viola was most popular. This raises the possibility that Francesco did NOT play the viola, but its name was given chief prominence in order to boost sales in its area of publication...? However, it is certainly possible that he DID play the viola alongside the lute early in his career, but dropped the viola when it declined in popularity in favour of the lute. Two Neapolitan viola da mano players, Dentice and Severino, were active in both Italy and Spain, and their works could be added to the canon of vihuela literature. OK? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Francesco and the viola da mano
Dear Rob, Not quite ... The vihuela was not created in Valencia, that is just Ian Woodfield's interpretation based on insufficient iconographucal evidence which ha spread and somehow found acceptance. There was a strong vihuela-viola movement in the Aragonese territories which included the viceroyalty of Naples, but it did not displace the lute there. Incidentally, the tag da mano-de mano is very much the same both in Valencia and Naples, not so in Castile and other areas. Regarding types, iconographic sources exhibit quite a large degree of variation, both in Castile and Aragon, while some of them present besides certain characteristics we tend to associate with the viola da mano, so considering only two distinct types is an oversimplification. Early sources, both Spanish and Italian also show the deep indents, so there is no reason to associate this feature specifically with Italian instruments. The repertory could be played with either instrument (if we must insist on considering them as separate members of the same family), but it could also be played, and indeed was played on the lute. Regarding Francesco, we are on speculative ground, although I am tempted to believe he did play the plucked viola at some point, for which exercise the only thing he needed was an instrument which was readily available. We do know that Francesco played an instrument callled viola, as Cosimo Bartoli attests, but at present there is no way to establish whether this instrument was plucked or bowed. A nice bit of information, though, is that Francesco was known to improvise in Rome upon the Conde Claros tenor, the very same used by several vihuelists as a ground for their diferencias. Finally, we have no evidence that Dentice played the vihuela, but Severino is mentioned by Scipione Cerreto's _Della practica musica_ among the sonatori eccelenti del liuto, della cita di Napoli, che oggi non vivono, together with his father Vincenello and his brother Pompeo, to whic Cerreto adds that all three were known as della viola. Incidntally, Julio was buried in Madrid and was remembered later by Fancisco Pacheco, who remarked that he did play the vihuela (el ta=F1ido de la viguela de Iulio severino, exelente musico de ocho ordenes). My own impression is that we can add not only Severino's work to the vihuela repertoire, but also a substantial part of the Italian lute repertoire from the first half of the sixteenth century, as witnessed by the 1536 della Fortuna prints for viola a mano ovvero liuto. Best wishes, Antonio - Original Message From: Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Antonio Corona [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, 4 June, 2008 3:38:00 AM Subject: Re: [LUTE] Francesco and the viola da mano Thanks Antonio. So, allow me to simplify things, at least for my own benefit, and forgive me if I over simplify. I'm just thinking out loud... The vihuela de mano was created in Valencia and found its way to Naples where it became popular, more popular than the lute. Some Italian makers started making their own version which they called the viola da mano. Eventually there emerged two apparently distinct types, Spanish and Italian. The Italian version seems to have kept the classic viol shape with deep indents on the sides, while the Spanish version smoothed out the sides, as with the Raimondi drawing, or the figure of eight, almost classical guitar shape of Milan's book. Both types were used in Italy, either imported or copied, and the Spanish types were referred to as Spanish lutes or lyras. Isabella d'Este asks for a Spanish type, and, importantly, insists on it being made from ebony. Although there seems to have been a distinction in the physical aspects of the Italian and Spanish viola/vihuela, the repertoire could be played on either instrument. The Borgias, being originally Spanish, were important in spreading the popularity of the vihuela/viola to Rome and the northern states. Francesco, therefore, did not need to live in the South to come across the viola. His 1536 book mentions the viola before the lute: *Intavolatura de Viola o vero Lauto*. It was printed in Naples where the viola was most popular. This raises the possibility that Francesco did NOT play the viola, but its name was given chief prominence in order to boost sales in its area of publication...? However, it is certainly possible that he DID play the viola alongside the lute early in his career, but dropped the viola when it declined in popularity in favour of the lute. Two Neapolitan viola da mano players, Dentice and Severino, were active in both Italy and Spain, and their works could be added to the canon of vihuela literature. OK? Rob -- Sent from Yahoo! Mailhttp://us.rd.yahoo.com/mailuk/taglines/isp/control/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=52418/*http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html. A Smarter Email. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http
[LUTE] Re: Francesco and the viola da mano
Thanks Gary. The claim is that he played 'viol' - plucked or bowed was not specified. See earlier comment by Antonio. Rob 2008/6/5 gary digman [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I seem to recall reading that Francesco played viola da gamba as well as lute. Gary - Original Message - From: Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Antonio Corona [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2008 1:38 AM Subject: [LUTE] Re: Francesco and the viola da mano Thanks Antonio. So, allow me to simplify things, at least for my own benefit, and forgive me if I over simplify. I'm just thinking out loud... The vihuela de mano was created in Valencia and found its way to Naples where it became popular, more popular than the lute. Some Italian makers started making their own version which they called the viola da mano. Eventually there emerged two apparently distinct types, Spanish and Italian. The Italian version seems to have kept the classic viol shape with deep indents on the sides, while the Spanish version smoothed out the sides, as with the Raimondi drawing, or the figure of eight, almost classical guitar shape of Milan's book. Both types were used in Italy, either imported or copied, and the Spanish types were referred to as Spanish lutes or lyras. Isabella d'Este asks for a Spanish type, and, importantly, insists on it being made from ebony. Although there seems to have been a distinction in the physical aspects of the Italian and Spanish viola/vihuela, the repertoire could be played on either instrument. The Borgias, being originally Spanish, were important in spreading the popularity of the vihuela/viola to Rome and the northern states. Francesco, therefore, did not need to live in the South to come across the viola. His 1536 book mentions the viola before the lute: *Intavolatura de Viola o vero Lauto*. It was printed in Naples where the viola was most popular. This raises the possibility that Francesco did NOT play the viola, but its name was given chief prominence in order to boost sales in its area of publication...? However, it is certainly possible that he DID play the viola alongside the lute early in his career, but dropped the viola when it declined in popularity in favour of the lute. Two Neapolitan viola da mano players, Dentice and Severino, were active in both Italy and Spain, and their works could be added to the canon of vihuela literature. OK? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.6/1481 - Release Date: 6/3/2008 7:31 PM --
[LUTE] string length and Francesco
I don't have a 6c and have never read Francesco's works on such an instrument, but I would like to know from the collective experience here at what length of string does it become very difficult to play his works? The lute in the portrait of him playing (if it is indeed him) seems to have quite a long string length, and many of the 6c instruments on, for instance, the Barber/Harris website are for very long string lengths, 72 cms or upper 60s. I vaguely recall Gordon Gregory playing me some Francesco on a long-fingerboard lute, and it sounded beautiful. But at what string length does it become just too awkward? Fuenllana, for instance, really requires a short vihuela, 55 to 60 cms. Not so with Francesco? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Novelties
Thanks Jerry. I was using you complete Sanz edition this very afternoon with a classical guitar student. An excellent edition, in my opinion. Rob 2008/6/5 Jerry Willard [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Thanks Rob that really helps because it's in the states (easier for me) I really enjoyed your B guitar playing where you're demonstrating strums. it really swings!! Jerry http://www.jerrywillard.com -Original Message- From: Rob MacKillop [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 10:25 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Jerry Willard Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Novelties The CDRom Martyn mentions, you can find it here, Jerry: http://www.lacg.net/facsimiles_page.htm A bit more expensive than Martyn remembers (more like 50 quid, Martyn) but well worth it. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: look what the cat brought in
I couldn't get any of the sound files to work. Pity. Rob 2008/6/5 LGS-Europe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: http://www.sabbatum.com/ :-) David David van Ooijen [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.davidvanooijen.nl To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: string length and Francesco
Well, lads, I hope you can make a recording sometime of Francesco plumbing the depths. I'm sure it would sound splendid. The duets would be amazing. We await... Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] FoMRHI
Forwarding this from the Early Music Fora - although it is from Chris Goodwin of the Lute Society, I haven't seen it here... Dear FoMRHI member You will be pleased to hear that after 6 years of silence, the Fellowship of Makers and Researchers of Historical Instruments, and its Quarterly publication, are being revived. We already have enough material for at least one, maybe two issues of the Quarterly. The first should appear in July. We are sure you will have had many interesting ideas, discoveries and thoughts about historical instruments in the interim, so please put them down on paper, and send them in for inclusion in forthcoming issues of FoMRHI Quarterly! You will remember that you must send in contributions - Communications or 'Comms' as they are called -EXACTLY as you wish them to appear - in 12 point type, on A4 paper with a 25mm / 1 inch border all round, or to put it another way, if you are using non-European paper sizes, then the text area must be 160 x 246 mm (or at least no wider or longer than this). You can send contributions EITHER on paper, OR as a Word-compatible or PDF attachment. NOTE OUR NEW ADDRESS: FoMRHI c/o Chris Goodwin Southside Cottage Brook Hill Albury Guildford GU5 9DJ United Kingdom and the email address for contributions sent as attachments is [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note the following: 1. Please tell everyone you know who might be interested that FoMRHI is being revived, and encourage them to send in contributions to the quarterly. 2. As we have unspent subscription monies in the bank, existing members will be credited with a year's subscription, for 2008. 3. Non-members will be given a year's free subscription if they send in a Communication for the Quarterly. 4. If you have changed address since 2000, please let us know; if you do not receive a paper version of this call for papers in the next two weeks that means we probably don't have your correct current postal address. 5. If you ever sent in a paper [in the last 6 years] for the Quarterly, and it never appeared, please re-send it now, to the new address. 6. There are plans to scan back issues of the Quarterly and make them downloadable from a website, to be set up; in the meantime you can obtain back issues for the princely sum of Pounds 3 per issue, including postage; send a cheque payable to FoMRHI, at the above address, or write with your credit card details. 7. If your interests have changed, and you don't now want to be a member of FoMRHI, please let us know, to save our postage costs. I look forward to hearing from you. best wishes Chris Goodwin -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: CD Von edler Art in Cleveland
I was looking for images of the 'vertical' keyboard, but couldn't see any. Nice sound files, though. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] John Donne
Dear Wisdom, What lute and voice settings are there of poems by John Donne (a long-time favourite poet of mine)? I'm also interested in settings for viols and voice or voices. Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: John Donne
Dowland? Which song? Together with Marlow, Donne and Dowland shared the same female patron, Lucy, Countess of Bedford. I suppose a concert programme of the three has been done many times? Rob 2008/6/16 howard posner [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Rob MacKillop wrote: What lute and voice settings are there of poems by John Donne (a long-time favourite poet of mine)? I'm also interested in settings for viols and voice or voices. Ferrabosco set The Expiration as So, so, leave off this last lamenting kisse (the seventh song in his book). I just did a web search and found this irritatingly tantalizing feature about Donne's poetry in songs: http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/music/features/was- john-donne-the-cole-porter-of-his-time-491049.html It will tell you: By searching music manuscripts in the British Library and the Bodleian in Oxford, Holmes found 10 settings of Donne's verse made by some of the leading English composers of his day, including John Dowland, Orlando Gibbons, Alfonso Ferrabosco and William Corkine. But gets no more specific than that. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: New Baroque lute/Meantone
Three cheers! Good luck with your new lute, Anthony. One day we will hear it. Until then, how about some pictures on the lute network site? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Web metronome
But does it beat at 415 pitch? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: new 11c lute Pictures
It looks very beautiful, Anthony. Take your time with it. You have to grow into each other. That takes time. Subtle instruments live longer in your heart. Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Meantone
If they were at all common why don't we see them in iconography? There is indeed a painting which clearly shows tastini - but I can't remember where I saw it! Sorry... Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Video - Port Jean Lindsay
I borrowed a friends camera - better quality than mine. It looked great on the camera viewer, but quite dark when uploaded. You might notice that I have strung my 11c temporarily as a 10c in viel ton... Here is the link: *http://tinyurl.com/5wrssk* Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: New piece of the month for June
Really beautiful, Martin. A fine piece and very fine playing. Isn't the Internet a wonderful thing when used positvely and creatively? And what a wonderful resource your website is already, with more to come. Keep up the good work! Rob McKillop 2008/6/20 Martin Shepherd [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Dear All, I have finally caught up - more or less. The new piece of the month is up and running at: www.luteshop.co.uk/month/pieceofthemonth.htm A wonderfully obscure but rather splendid piece, I think. Martin To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Gypsies Lilt - video
Two pieces from the Rowallan ms, the weird Gypsies Lilt, and the beautiful I Long For Thy Virginitie. Looks like I need my eighth fret tightened... http://www.vimeo.com/1204178 Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Late 19th-century film of man playing lute
Very rare footage: http://www.vimeo.com/1204502 Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Gypsies Lilt - video
Thanks to Kerry and for all the other positive comments I've received. Performance is everything, whether you are a beginner or a long-standing professional. What I like about the technology we have now is the ability to see the lute being played. I love watching beginners perform, and hope that more of you set aside your worries about making mistakes (all my videos have mistakes in them) and hopefully some more experienced players will offer words of advice, if needed. Making mistakes is perfectly 'authentic', and so are amateur performances among amateurs. I don't think I'm alone in enjoying a beginner trying to play, more than a virtuoso running through something without really being 'involved'. Of course, I get great pleasure out of watching 'real' lute players like Nigel North, Paul O'Dette, etc. I'll never ever be on their level, but I feel everyone has something to share, no matter what level. So, get those cameras rolling! Rob 2008/6/21 [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Beautiful, Rob. All of this discussion of tuning and strings is all well and good, (and interesting) but you cut to the chase with your sensitive playing and show us what it's all about. Kerry Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Two pieces from the Rowallan ms, the weird Gypsies Lilt, and the beautiful I Long For Thy Virginitie. Looks like I need my eighth fret tightened... http://www.vimeo.com/1204178 Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: New piece of the month for June
Fuenllana has a few moments where the third finger has to cover two courses, four strings. I could get it right about 90 per cent of the time by using one finger, as the courses on my vihuela were very close. But it is a case of swings and roundabouts. Sometimes we want the courses close, sometimes we want them further apart. Are we ever truly happy?! One luthier told me that thumb-in players preferred wider spacing at the bridge than thumb-out players, and this led to wider spacing at the nut, and when these thumb-in players commissioned instruments set up this way, they made some of the repertoire more difficult for themselves. Fuenllana was a thumb-out player... Rob 2008/6/20 Stewart McCoy [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Dear David, It may be that your finger tip really is too narrow, but there might be some mileage in turning the angle of your hand, as violinists do, so that there is a wider surface area to hold down both courses. Pointing the left-hand fingers toward the bridge, is something we try to prevent pupils doing, but this bad habit can have its uses. I have a small vihuela discante, with a fairly tight spacing, and I often find it useful to cover two courses with a single un-barred finger. My fingertips are podgy enough for that, but then I struggle to stop a single course while playing the two open courses either side. Sometimes I use my little finger, when really I should use one of the other fingers, but my little finger is thinner than the others, and causes less damage snagging up adjacent strings. Holding down two courses with one unflattened finger can present problems. At first one should aim to be satisfied with getting just two strings to ring - the lower of the upper course, and the upper of the lower course - and simply dampen the outside strings of each pair. Eventually, with time and practice, one finds one is covering all four strings, and they all ring on. I think it is important not to try too hard, but be content at first with just an approximation. If you don't think about it too much, your fingers will find a way to do it on their own. Another possible use of two courses stopped by a single finger is in this common example: _1c___3d___4f___1c___ _2d|_ _2d|_ __a|_ ___|_ ___|_ I wouldn't always finger those notes that way, but I have it up my sleeve for when it seems the best option. Best wishes, Stewart McCoy. -Original Message- From: David Tayler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 20 June 2008 22:50 To: lute-cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: New piece of the month for June Gee what an annoying chord that is. I have seen people play all four strings, that is two courses, with the tip of one finger. My finger is not wide enough. I accept this as more or less unchangeable, unless I go to a really narrow spacing. Thanks for the lovely edition. dt To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: Gypsies Lilt - video
That's the spirit, Kerry! Good luck.
Rob
2008/6/22 [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Rob
once I get a digital camera I will be posting some videos. Yes, I am just
starting on the lute (I own a 'lute like' object at the moment) and will
take possession of a better instrument before the end of this year, and I am
always open to suggestions on technique by more experienced players. Audio
has always been my preference and I have a small studio in my home. My wife
plays the flute and we are working up some arrangements of music, including
some original tunes. I may post some audio files in the interim.
Kerry
Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Thanks to Kerry and for all the other positive comments I've received.
Performance is everything, whether you are a beginner or a long-standing
professional. What I like about the technology we have now is the ability
to
see the lute being played. I love watching beginners perform, and hope that
more of you set aside your worries about making mistakes (all my videos
have
mistakes in them) and hopefully some more experienced players will offer
words of advice, if needed. Making mistakes is perfectly 'authentic', and
so are amateur performances among amateurs. I don't think I'm alone in
enjoying a beginner trying to play, more than a virtuoso running through
something without really being 'involved'. Of course, I get great pleasure
out of watching 'real' lute players like Nigel North, Paul O'Dette, etc.
I'll never ever be on their level, but I feel everyone has something to
share, no matter what level. So, get those cameras rolling!
Rob
2008/6/21 [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Beautiful, Rob. All of this discussion of tuning and strings is all well
and good, (and interesting) but you cut to the chase with your sensitive
playing and show us what it's all about.
Kerry
Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Two pieces from the Rowallan ms, the weird Gypsies Lilt, and the
beautiful
I
Long For Thy Virginitie. Looks like I need my eighth fret tightened...
http://www.vimeo.com/1204178
Rob
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[LUTE] New Dowland site
Dear Collective Wisdom, I am in the process of creating a website devoted to John Dowland - http://www.johndowland.co.uk/ - It will be a collaborative site with academic essays, a projected collaborative recording of all his works (we can argue about what exactly his works are...), videos, scores, biography, etc, etc. It is hoped that list members will contribute new essays, as well as providing copy of old articles for which they are author and which are currently out of print. It is a non-commercial site, free from advertising, created collaboratively by players, academics and enthusiasts. Would-be contributors (essays, mp3 files, videos, biography) should contact Rob MacKillop, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Why is the neck on the archlute so long?
2008/6/29 Mathias R=F6sel [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I once had to stand up with my arhlute on strap so as to get the sheets on the stand into proper order. When I sat down I realized great relief on the faces of the audience. Mathias Nothing to do with your zipper being undone? Rob -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: very low pitch
I'm 2008/6/29 Nigel Solomon [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I recently tuned my 72cm 13-course down to a tone below 415 (with strings intended for 392, so half a tone lower than that) and it really came to life. Could it be the lower tension strings (now around 3.5 on the top course, basses around 2.5, octaves 2.3or 2.4) or the fact that the pitch suits the lute better? Does anybody else play baroque lute at such a low pitch (and get away with it?) Pitch I know is a very debated subject, but if you are playing alone (usually but not always the case with baroque lute) surely you are less confined to what the Pyramid or Kurschner or Savarez string chart says you should be using? Nigel To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: very low pitch
Oops. I'm convinced that low tension is the way to go. I tune my 11c to 392. You can hear it here: www.songoftherose.co.uk - click on baroque lute. Rob 2008/6/29 Nigel Solomon [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I recently tuned my 72cm 13-course down to a tone below 415 (with strings intended for 392, so half a tone lower than that) and it really came to life. Could it be the lower tension strings (now around 3.5 on the top course, basses around 2.5, octaves 2.3or 2.4) or the fact that the pitch suits the lute better? Does anybody else play baroque lute at such a low pitch (and get away with it?) Pitch I know is a very debated subject, but if you are playing alone (usually but not always the case with baroque lute) surely you are less confined to what the Pyramid or Kurschner or Savarez string chart says you should be using? Nigel To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] Re: very low pitch
No. But my brain is another issue... Rob 2008/7/8 Ed Durbrow [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Do you folks using very low tension have a problem with string rattle? To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[LUTE] John Dowland Site Updates
I'm happy to report that the www.johndowland.co.uk site is taking shape nicely. The intention is to have a home for the complete recordings of Dowland for free download, plus essays, videos, etc. Today I have added: 1. David Taylor's dissertation on the Dowland canon - should stimulate discussion! 2. David Taylor's video performance of the Frog Galliard 3. Martin Shepherd's essay of Ornamentation in Dowland's solo lute pieces - a very useful contribution which I hope all Dowland performers will read. It also contains two mp3 performances by Martin on a gut-strung 7c he made himself. Luthier, performer, academic - is there any end to the man's talents?! There have been other updates since the first announcement, and I have had promises from other performers of soundfiles and essays, so please have a look, add it to your 'Favourites' and return every now and then to check the Updates page. Please report any errors to me. Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] videos
I'm also happy to report that the Vimeo site for lute video performances now has 101 videos! http://www.vimeo.com/Francesco You don't need to log in to watch, and the sound and vision is better than You-know-who-Tube. Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: videos
I have to do that, and I'll do it in a few minutes time. The more, the merrier. Rob 2008/7/11 [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi Rob and all, I just put my Biber to vimeo. But how do I put/move it to your Francesco? Arto On 7/11/2008, Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm also happy to report that the Vimeo site for lute video performances now has 101 videos! http://www.vimeo.com/Francesco You don't need to log in to watch, and the sound and vision is better than You-know-who-Tube. Rob MacKillop -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
