expeditionradio wrote:
The use of the Automatic Sub Bands on HF ham radio for digital data
has been increasing tremendously over the past 5 years. Obviously,
automatic and similar types of operation have become extremely
popular with ham operators.
.
What nonsense. In fact it is a small
From the ARRL CONTESTER'S RATE SHEET, 17 OCTOBER 2007
Joe K1JT reports, Some of us have been experimenting recently with
two new narrow-band digital modes called JT2 and JT4. A basic
description and a status report is now available at
http://tinyurl.com/2c7ktb
If you are interested in making
Zack wrote:
From the ARRL CONTESTER'S RATE SHEET, 17 OCTOBER 2007
Joe K1JT reports, Some of us have been experimenting recently with
two new narrow-band digital modes called JT2 and JT4. A basic
description and a status report is now available at
http://tinyurl.com/2c7ktb
If you are
I left out part of the last line.
From the ARRL CONTESTER'S RATE SHEET, 17 OCTOBER 2007
Joe K1JT reports, Some of us have been experimenting recently with
two new narrow-band digital modes called JT2 and JT4. A basic
description and a status report is now available at
For Sale:
$10.00 Shipped U.S.
73,
Bert W1DFU
I concur with many of Howard's suggestions. Here are some of the
criteria that I think will insure success of a new emergency
communications mode, not in any special order:
1. Open source so that many can help with developing and even tweaking
the program. We have seen how successful major
Zack wrote:
I left out part of the last line.
From the ARRL CONTESTER'S RATE SHEET, 17 OCTOBER 2007
Joe K1JT reports, Some of us have been experimenting recently with
two new narrow-band digital modes called JT2 and JT4. A basic
description and a status report is now available at
Hi Rick,
I feel compelled once again to make some statements on the subject of
frequency busy detection.
1. Item 5 makes no sense to this station unless you have Automatic
Station initiating contacts to forward traffic, whereas Automatic
Station A has 1 to number of messages queued and needs
My web site, see signature, is for the development of such a network. Anyone
who wants to work collaboratively on a network is invited to let me know of
their interest.
There is another mailing list where I have discussed the development of a
network. They say managing software developers is like
Before you can say anything about setting up a server you need to determine
what the server is to do.
The primary purpose of the Winlink servers is to route messages to their
destination. However, the Emcomm PMBOs can provide local routing of messages
when needed, i.e. an area is isolated from
I agree with Roger. This plan would place uncontrolled stations on many of
the presently used CW calling frequencies world wide. These are not dormant
sections of the band.
To use the I don't hear anyone statement during the solar minimum is just
irresponsible. I hear the call of CQ in
--- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, Rud Merriam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My web site, see signature, is for the development of such a
network. Anyone
who wants to work collaboratively on a network is invited to let me
know of
their interest.
There is another mailing list where I have
Demetre,
I think one of the design requirements is that once the network gets a clear
frequency it never stops using it. grin That way any interference is
caused by THEM!!
Rud Merriam K5RUD
ARES AEC Montgomery County, TX
http://TheHamNetwork.net
Rud,
I wish you good luck with your effort
While I agree that over the past several decades, there has been
increased interest in digital HF modes, I would not include automatic
stations as having increased as much. There are some beginnings of a
rudimentary STANAG mode network that may eventually make it possible to
send e-mail
I am curious as to the negative attitude of ham developers toward open
source development. Many successful applications programs have been open
source have they not?
These include very complicated and advanced programs that are better
than some of the commercial developed closed source
Isn't this exactly what can be accomplished with open source collaboration?
How does it work now with PSKmail?
The main thing is to insure that no additional complications are needed
that can be yet another failure point. This is one of my criticisms of
Winlink 2000 and why I don't consider it
It's the programmers choice to make it open
But it seems to me that some feel cheated if it's not.
Either way I can live with it.
John, W0JAB
You know I almost believe each and every one of these. Almost sound
exactly what the winlink crowd is saying.
Greg
KC7GNM
--- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, Dave Bernstein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
1. You're using panoramic reception and consider signals anywhere on
your waterfall to be QRM
I totally disagree. Expanding the auto sub-bands would only make room
for more PMBO's which later on would want more spectrum because the last
bit they got was not sufficient enough. When is enough, enough. Why are
we thinking about using these band hogging protocols like Pactor 3
instead of
Dan, KA3CTQ
presently used CW calling frequencies world wide. These are
not dormant sections of the band.
... PSK, Olivia, RTTY, and other modes use calling frequencies
in these ranges.
Hi Dan,
Could you please give an example of the CW calling frequencies or
the PSK stations who
Greg KC7GNM wrote:
The point is Bonnie I have seen digital radio going down the tubes
thanks to winlink. ...
I don't think they need more space to operate in.
They already are a menace in the auto sub bands as it is.
Greg,
Digital radio has been progressing tremendously.
I operate
Bonnie did you read my entire post or did you just read the part you
clipped out? Why don't auto stations try to conserve the space they
have instead of trying to gobble up more. The point is winlink and ALE
are two bandwidth hungry modes that should be looking to reduce the
bandwidth they use
expeditionradio wrote:
Automatic operation is essential to HF emcomm. It is certainly not
asking too much that 10% of each ham band be devoted to one of the
primary purposes for the existence of the Amateur Radio Service.
Greg, where is your volunteer force of non-automatic operators
Roger W6VZV wrote:
Where is the 24/7 volunteer force? Red Cross, RACES, and other
minuteman style ham volunteer groups.
Roger,
Respectfully, those are all wonderful groups.
But none of them provide 24/7 access for emergency traffic on HF.
At best, their response is measured in hours
Take a look at this map
http://winlink.org/positions/PosReports.aspx
I don't ZL3LL about 2000 miles south east of the big island of Hilo
had any internet connection to post this location update. nor did
any most of the hams all around Australia.
Yeah that's right, each and every one of them
Note I did not say the work would not be open source, i.e. available to all
eventually.
You know the old saying, To many cooks spoil the broth. It applies to the
development process. The negative attitude comes from experience.
The trick is to have enough people contributing to catch
Feld-Hell Club Sprint Rules:
Date: The third Saturday of every month, from 1500 - 1700Z
Open to:Any licensed amateur and SWL participants
Mode: Feld-Hell (any flavor)
Bands: 160 through 10 meters. No WARC bands
Power: Limited to 100
There is a huge difference between what one can call
emcomm in the larger organizational sense, and
the actual service of providing 24/7 emergency access on HF.
Presently there are no manually operated stations providing
24/7 emergency access on HF. But, there are several
automatic entities
expeditionradio wrote:
Roger, it's time to put your money where your mouth is.
If you can provide such 24/7 access on HF with manually operated
stations, they do so now. Show us your volunteer operator army on
duty. Otherwise, your continued protests ammount to little more than
lip
At 07:41 PM 10/17/2007, you wrote:
One last thing. I like to say only what I *know* to be so. I do not,
for a fact, know that a large portion of the internet messages that pass
on Winlink are business-related, although I do know that some are. I
will therefore withdraw my comment to that
Bonnie you keep forgetting one important factor in your automatic
scenario. There has to be a human on either end to 1) send the message
and 2) to read the message. What is the winlink station going to do?
Automatically send food and water?
Greg
KC7GNM
--- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com,
Video of Amateur Radio Emergency Service (ARES) use of D-STAR
http://youtube.com/watch?v=q8dUJp0rc0g
__
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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No one is saying you don't have a right to get on the air. What this
thread is about is expanding a sub-band that does not need to be
expanded. Also the problem with folks like you, not saying you do,
that cause so much harmful interference it is making it hard for us to
get on the air. Now I flip
It is quite easy to alert or wake a human within seconds or minutes
with phone text messaging, to provide real world emergency response
services. Phone texting is currently available right this minute, by
automatic methods on HF 24/7, covering most of the North America
region, and vast areas of
Rick,
I am not commenting on the validity of your point about PSKMail.
Your comment is exactly the problem with an open project. As is your
observation about Winlink 2000. An open project gets continuously
sidetracked into explanations of why the technique of some other project is
not being
*** comments in line.
At 07:59 PM 10/17/2007, you wrote:
No one is saying you don't have a right to get on the air. What this
thread is about is expanding a sub-band that does not need to be
expanded.
*** You do know that you slow and wide retry after retry mode of packet
will be in the same
snip
New Discovery from the Bolivian Journal of Medicine
Physcians in Bolivia have recently released a paper on the destructive
effects of pactor tones
On the middle-aged radio amateur population.
The pulse frequency of pactor 3 appears to cause anxiety and obsessive
behavior among
John,
Are you saying that you are able to monitor the traffic on Pactor modes
going to the Winlink 2000 system?
73,
Rick, KV9U
John Becker, WØJAB wrote:
Show us some of this business-related traffic.
I have never seen any at all pass my screen. Not any.
John, W0JAB
This is excellent . . . just what this group needs . . . and I deeply and
truly mean that . . .sheesh . . .
Rick - KH2DF
_
From: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of John Bradley
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 8:41 PM
To:
ROFL
Rud Merriam K5RUD
ARES AEC Montgomery County, TX
http://TheHamNetwork.net http://thehamnetwork.net/
-Original Message-
From: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of John Bradley
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 8:41 PM
To:
Hi All...I am about to unsuscribe to this group as im not interested in
having my mailbox filled up with the constant argueing about automatic
stations and there need for bandwidth and the opposite view that they
dont need the space.its not that it may be a valid argument but that
its got
in and out of this station yes.
Off the air traffic, some but not all.
As you may know it's compressed.
John, W0JAB
At 08:41 PM 10/17/2007, you wrote:
John,
Are you saying that you are able to monitor the traffic on Pactor modes
going to the Winlink 2000 system?
73,
Rick, KV9U
Of course traffic going through your station has to be read or it would
not have a purpose, but one of the selling points that the Winlink
2000 folks claimed in the past, was that because of the compression it
made it virtually impossible to anyone to monitor the traffic. One other
ham claimed
At 09:23 PM 10/17/2007, you wrote:
Of course traffic going through your station has to be read or it would
not have a purpose, but one of the selling points that the Winlink
2000 folks claimed in the past, was that because of the compression it
made it virtually impossible to anyone to monitor
The reason for the open source concept in my mind is to insure
continuity of a project in case of death or disinterest by the initial
developers. I don't buy the too many cooks analogy in any way.
Completely wrong metaphor for software development. No one is in the way
of another, rather they
John Becker, WØJAB wrote:
At 07:41 PM 10/17/2007, you wrote:
One last thing. I like to say only what I *know* to be so. I do
not, for a fact, know that a large portion of the internet messages
that pass on Winlink are business-related, although I do know that
some are. I will therefore
I discontinued VHF packet about 15 years ago when it became obsolete in
our area. A few people still used it for a while but now the trunk lines
are gone and while some sites were converted over to APRS, long haul
traffic is not possible. In the last week I did help a ham a little bit
in
Gidday Young David,
Certainly no one has chained you to your easy chair
and put a screen in front of you, and forced you to
read anything at gunpoint :)
The digitalradio group covers all digital modes and methods.
Simply look at the subject lines, and read the ones you enjoy.
Pass by the
Assume an RF mesh network operating on 10m.
Is there an advantage in the ability to use 1200 baud? Or is multipath still
a big issue that would restrict the baud rate to around 100? Is it feasible
to do a protocol like DominoEx at the higher baud rate?
What distances are feasible on 10m at any
Rick, I wrote my first Fortran IV program in 1968. I have been doing
software ever since on multiple platforms. I have managed many software
projects.
How much software development experience do you have?
Rud Merriam K5RUD
ARES AEC Montgomery County, TX
http://TheHamNetwork.net
AA6YQ comments below
From: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jose A. Amador
snip
Rating automatic operations as extremely unpopular with most is
exagerated. It seems to just reflect a extreme point of view of a group
of hams with a certain point of view.
AA6YQ comments below
From: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Steve Hajducek
snip
2. With respect to Remote User to Automatic Station communications,
the human operator initiates the communications and its all up to
them to decide the coast is clear to do
I am an active proponent of open source development. I brought Rational
Software's development tools to Linux in the late 90s. I also established
the Eclipse Foundation, which oversees the development of the Eclipse
Programming Environment - the dominant open source programming environment.
Rud,
Running Linux in an old box requires an old version of Linux, matched to
the box contents.
I used RedHat 5.2 on a 486, and 6.2 on a P1. Mostly, text mode, with a
CGA or the older and less voracious GUI, with 1 MB RAM video cards. The
BBS's ran happy with it, and I even did ftp and http
I see no timestamp in the article. When did this show up? I guess it
must have been on October 1st, since seasons are 6 months out of phase
between the north and south hemispheres.
73,
Jose, CO2JA
---
r_lwesterfield wrote:
This is excellent . . . just what this group needs . . . and I
As Jean Paul Roubelat explains in the FBB docs, the design of FBB B1
compression had to comply with a requisite from the french authorities,
by which message headers must be sent in clear text.
But compression gives a measure of efficiency and allow to double the
traffic or reduce the channel
I had quite good results with 1200 baud on 10 meters.
It was a long time ago, but it was comparable to 2 meters at times.
Jose, CO2JA
--
Rud Merriam wrote:
Assume an RF mesh network operating on 10m.
Is there an advantage in the ability to use 1200 baud? Or is multipath
still a big
John Becker, WØJAB wrote:
***In 1984 they started doing the very same thing to Packed traffic
from one BBS to the other.
As far as I remember, compression started with FBB 5.13 around 1990.
MSYS (1.09 ???) and JNOS (1.10 ???) followed later.
SNIP
***So where do you stand on Packet. It's
I just read up on the details OFDM. I reached an interesting conclusion that
I would like verified:
The raw bit rate is the same as the bandwidth and is independent of
the symbol rate.
The frequency spacing for OFDM is 1/Ts where Ts is the symbol period. Since
1/Ts is also the symbol
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