And why is the design not public domain?
-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Friday, December 18, 2015 9:23 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - Captilism (was Martin Shkreli)
I have to ask myself why a drug that is 69 years old is manufactured by
one entity in the US and other global manufacturers don't have access to
our market. More research would probably give me the answer or a bunch
of conspiracy theories.
Lewis Bergman wrote:
I loophole created by the government from the regulatory environment the
government setup which now needs to be fixed by Whom? The government. Not
saying there should be no regulation of drugs. I don't want to go back to
the tapeworm diet pill. But the pharma industry is an excellent example of
why everything the government gets involved in will eventually be so
broken it needs to be trashed and restarted from scratch.
On Fri, Dec 18, 2015 at 9:06 AM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com
<mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:
The guy isn’t “brash”, any of the adjectives I think of are
inappropriate for a public forum.
Read this interview, or just skip to the end:
http://hiphopdx.com/interviews/id.2825/title.martin-shkreli-plans-to-bail-out-bobby-shmurda
Or watch his live stream.
As far as capitalism, the approach is to find something that is
inexpensive to make and has been around forever and there is only
one supplier because there isn’t enough demand for multiple
suppliers. So you buy that supplier and jack the price up to
ridiculous levels until a competitor can go through getting
government approval to compete, which can take a year or more.
Meanwhile, you make a bazillion percent profit, because of a
temporary market failure.
That isn’t really capitalism. It’s exploiting a loophole. Capitalism
assumes an efficient market, where competition drives
prices down to cost plus a reasonable profit. The pharma market
is different for two reasons. First, there is a lengthy
government approval process. Second, the payer is usually an
insurance company, pharmacy benefit manager, or Medicare.
*From:* Lewis Bergman <mailto:lewis.berg...@gmail.com>
*Sent:* Friday, December 18, 2015 8:47 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT - Captilism (was Martin Shkreli)
I can't defend his brashness, but the fact remains that pure
capitalism is the best way demonstrated to date to innovate and
health care or pharma is not exempt. Big rewards encourage big
effort yielding big results. These pharma companies have something
like 7 years until the exclusivity period expires. That can be a
pretty short time to recover investments. This particular case may
be a bit extreme but to say that capitalism is broken in America
is simply ludicrous.
I recently attended my sons graduation from Texas Tech on a
Friday. Thursday night at the hotel was $159 and Friday was $269.
I don't think that is price gouging. I think it is a reflection of
the simple fact that there are fewer rooms available on that
particular night than are demanded at $159. The equilibrium was
found at $259 where supply and demand come closer to being equal.
At that price I still witnessed people turned away wanting a room
due to their poor planning. I don't think that is price gouging.
Their hotel was full at $269 a night. The next day was $159 again.
Since the hotel was full they probably could have been even higher.
I really don't understand what people have such a huge issue with
the fundamental theory of supply and demand. Yes I understand that
it is a potentially life saving drug. There are other cheaper
treatments. Maybe they aren't as good, which is why they are
cheaper. When did we stop rewarding people for the value they
provide? I know this jerk didn't invent it but he obviously was
willing to reward those who did with a price they thought fair.
Sales over the next few years will prove if he made a mistake.
Why not force Chuck to sell a unique mount he made for 5% over
cost? Heck, why not only cover his cost? Why not less than cost
and force him to provide his great product for the good of the
people? There is a reason it is named Animal Farm. How many have
read this book? While not about capitalism it does speak to the
kind of central control that skulks below the overt argument for
"controlling" this type of behavior.
I know people might die. I'll put on my really jerky hat and say
"so what?". People die every day for less meaning and in greater
numbers. There is practically a mass suicide movement going on now
with texting and driving. I don't see where people value there
lives or others that much anyway when reading a text or email is
more important than life itself.
I guess I am just a big libertarian at heart. Give me the loose
framework of a "fair market", whatever that is, and let the system
fight it out. The word isn't fair, not ever going to be fair, stop
trying to warp it to be that way.
Have fun with that on a Friday and have a Merry Christmas, Happy
Hanuka, or whatever else gets your boat floating.
On Fri, Dec 18, 2015 at 8:02 AM Patrick Leary
<patrick.le...@telrad.com <mailto:patrick.le...@telrad.com>> wrote:
The irony? Your local poor schlub a-hole can be arrested and
charged if he doubles the price of gas, water, or other
life-critical goods after a natural disaster – that’s a crime
in America. Meanwhile, it’s completely legal for a company to
raise a life-critical drug by over 5000% -- that’s capitalism
in America.
Shkreli is only the most written about example. This “business
trend’ is all the rage and has been widely employed in the
U.S. for a number of years now.
http://news.health.com/2015/09/25/6-insane-examples-of-prescription-drug-price-increases/
Patrick
*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com
<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Thursday, December 17, 2015 8:28 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT - Martin Shkreli
Apparently this guy AND HIS LAWYER were arrested today. Everybody
knows him as the guy who raises drug prices 5000%,
but I did not know he live streams almost daily to his fans.
Watch the first video, isn't he just like every annoying,
entitled, slacker kid living in his parents basement that we
have to deal with bitching about his Internet? Except he is
CEO of a drug company.
I didn't think it was possible to hate him more, but watch the
video.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8gjB1PSXv_oAUSAQ16S0fA
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