Mark, Just curious what time of year the outages have been occurring at. If it is during the summer, I would expect that the cause has more to do with a large use of hvac units, not televisions or evse's. If during winter, then it probably has to do with unexpected increase in heating demands. How fast is the housing unit growth in the neighborhood? The utility may not be increasing the power in ratio to the # of units coming online.
-Tom On Wed, Jan 3, 2018 at 6:20 AM, Mark Abramowitz via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: > Dubious or not, our local infrastructure couldn't handle the change in > technology coupled with numbers of units in each household. Try telling > those who suffered frequent outages that they were imagining it. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Jan 2, 2018, at 5:09 PM, Steve Condie via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> > wrote: > > > > This statement, as written, is dubious. All flat screen TV's except > plasma > > use less electricity than the older CRT sets did - a 50" LED set uses > less > > electricity than a 30" CRT. Plasma is comparable to CRT, but plasma TVs > > never really had a lot of market share, even in their brief heyday. > What's > > more, the total energy usage by TV sets is minimal compared to HVAC, > > refrigeration, cooktops, etc. I think someone's leg was being pulled. > > > > On Mon, Jan 1, 2018 at 11:42 PM, Mark Abramowitz via EV < > ev@lists.evdl.org> > > wrote: > > > >> You paint too broad a brush. > >> > >> There have been *serious* problems as new technologies have drawn from > the > >> grid and increased useage. > >> > >> As plasma and other big screen TVs got big, various parts of my city had > >> serious issues with power outages, as the system wasn't designed for > those > >> loads. And these weren't areas that had been there for 100 years. > >> Relatively new housing developments had continuing power problems. Our > >> City Council had to really squeeze the utility to get capacity > increased to > >> handle the loads. > >> > >> Sent from my iPhone > >> > >>> On Jan 1, 2018, at 7:33 PM, Thos True via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> > wrote: > >>> > >>> Peri & All, > >>> > >>> I recall addressing this fear about a decade ago when it the fear was > >> being > >>> pushed by mainstream media. > >>> The reality is no different than events that have occurred many times > >> since > >>> the inception of the electrical grid. It is interesting that the > >> utilities > >>> seem to do their best to avoid this conversation. > >>> Some that we might recall were the fears about every house having a > >>> refrigerator and washing machine, then it was the clothes dryer, > followed > >>> by microwave ovens & hand held appliances and the hot tub craze, > followed > >>> by the air conditioner installations. The air conditioners do have a > >>> noticeable effect on the grid due to a few factors (1. Grid already > >>> stressed due to over heating. 2. Large numbers in a region using the > >> device > >>> at the same time (large, continuous inrush currents). 3. Extended > periods > >>> of load for each device (in excess of 4 hours each).) > >>> The previous example share the relatively short, staggered inrush > current > >>> events, followed by lower power demands, which are barely noticeable, > >>> according to the utilities themselves, since most L2 units use the same > >>> amount of power per use as the average clothes dryer. > >>> > >>> Tom True > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Sun, Dec 31, 2017 at 7:28 AM, Peri Hartman via EV < > ev@lists.evdl.org> > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> I think this article raises a good question, though I don't really > think > >>>> it answers it. Currently, yes, the grid isn't significantly impacted. > >> But > >>>> what about if we had 100% EVs. What about local and long haul > trucking? > >>>> What about other ICE powered equipment, e.g. earth movers, etc.? What > >> about > >>>> generation capacity as well as distribution capacity? > >>>> > >>>> Personally, our EV boosted our electricity consumption by about 10%. I > >>>> don't know how that number compares in general as, even with our EV, > our > >>>> electricity usage is below the national average. Even so, that's only > >>>> accounting for residential EVs. Commercial and industrial electricity > >> usage > >>>> is much higher than residential. Is that enough to coincidentally > >> assume a > >>>> 10% figure for non residential EV charging? If this pans out to be > >>>> reasonably true, it would seem that EVs will not, long term, cause a > >>>> significant drain on our generation capacity, if any at all > (considering > >>>> time of use). > >>>> > >>>> For distribution, yes, we clearly can't have everyone charging their > EVs > >>>> at 5:30pm. But, as we move more and more to renewables, we'll need > grid > >>>> storage anyway and, using the "10% rule", EVs won't be a significant > >>>> factor. The significant factor will be how to get Nevada solar to the > >>>> cloudy Pacific NW or to get Texas wind to sticky South Carolina. And > >> how to > >>>> store several days worth to even out nature's effects. > >>>> > >>>> Does anyone have real numbers of the effects of 100% EVs on generation > >> and > >>>> distribution? > >>>> > >>>> Peri > >>>> > >>>> https://www.nrdc.org/experts/noah-garcia/good-news-evs-are-n > >>>> ot-crashing-grid > >>>> > >>>> ------ Original Message ------ > >>>> From: "brucedp5 via EV" <ev@lists.evdl.org> > >>>> To: ev@lists.evdl.org > >>>> Cc: "brucedp5" <bruce...@juno.com> > >>>> Sent: 30-Dec-17 10:08:53 PM > >>>> Subject: [EVDL] EVLN: EV-newswire posts for 20171226 > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble. > >>>>> com/EVLN-Tesla-3-EV-handling-snow-covered-rutted-off-road- > >>>>> track-on-standard-tires-v-tp4689040.html > >>>>> EVLN: Tesla-3 EV handling snow-covered rutted off-road track on > >> standard > >>>>> tires (v) > >>>>> The current versions of Tesla's flagship vehicles control power to > all > >>>>> four > >>>>> wheels through dual independently operated electric motors, providing > >>>>> unparalleled traction in even the worst of winter conditions. Short > of > >>>>> driving your Tesla through a snow-covered off-road track with deep, > >> muddy > >>>>> ruts, Model S and Model X's ... > >>>>> > >>>>> + > >>>>> https://www.teslarati.com/verne-troyer-tesla-model-s- > >> kids-unboxing-video/ > >>>>> Verne Troyer just got a Tesla Model S for Kids and says it’s a beast > >>>>> December 28, 2017 Not long after, Troyer began his “unboxing” of the > >>>>> Model > >>>>> S for Kids, where he gave a surprisingly complete rundown of the > >> miniature > >>>>> vehicle's features. During the course of the video, Troyer showed off > >> the > >>>>> miniature car's frunk, Tesla-branded charger, and its battery pack. > The > >>>>> Austin Powers star also took ... > >>>>> https://youtu.be/6K_nTNvyTtE > >>>>> > >>>>> https://www.nrdc.org/experts/noah-garcia/good-news-evs-are-n > >>>>> ot-crashing-grid > >>>>> Good News: EVs Are Not Crashing the Grid > >>>>> Dec 27, 2017 First, despite fears that EVs would overwhelm the > >> existing > >>>>> electric grid infrastructure, only a very minor fraction of them―0.19 > >>>>> percent―have actually necessitated distribution system or service > line > >>>>> upgrades. Moreover, this data point has translated to relatively low > >>>>> levels > >>>>> of EV-related spending on grid maintenance: of the $5 ... > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: > >>>>> http://evdl.org/archive/ > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> {brucedp.neocities.org} > >>>>> > >>>>> -- > >>>>> Sent from: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4. > >> nabble.com/ > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > >>>>> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > >>>>> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA ( > http://groups.yahoo.com/group > >>>>> /NEDRA) > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > >>>> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > >>>> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group > >>>> /NEDRA) > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Remember, it is not that the glass is half empty, in reality, the glass > >> is > >>> merely twice the size that it needs to be! -TNT'82 > >>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > >>> URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/ > >> attachments/20180101/107ec2ce/attachment.html> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > >>> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > >>> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ > >> group/NEDRA) > >> _______________________________________________ > >> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > >> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > >> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ > >> group/NEDRA) > > -------------- next part -------------- > > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > > URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/ > attachments/20180102/2126f3bb/attachment.html> > > _______________________________________________ > > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ > group/NEDRA) > > > > > _______________________________________________ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ > group/NEDRA) > > -- Remember, it is not that the glass is half empty, in reality, the glass is merely twice the size that it needs to be! -TNT'82 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20180103/48d90cdf/attachment.html> _______________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
