Let me reverse the sequence of your post for my ease:
The last part: "> If we accept Bruno's "we are god"<
">I have never said that. The most I have said in that direction, is
that, assuming comp, the first person inherits "God"' unanmeability.
So the first person has some "god" attribute. you cannot infer from
this that we are "God!".Bruno<"
I apologize for misunderstanding what you said.
 I tried to find the meaning of the (seemingly mistyped?)  "unanmeability"
in your present post  - the closest was :'untenability'. Is this what you
meant?
*
Now let me return to our 'human mind".
Reasonably: we are part of a world - assumably a small portion only - and
our
mind (whatever you identify as that) is 'part of us' = included into the
'model' we
may call 'humans'. We have certain exparience-stuff and logical thinking
ways,
we use that even in trying to 'understand' ideas beyond it - beyond our
reach of
observation. We do that, but can never be sure of doing it right.
In the sci-fi I wrote in 1988-89 I depicted the 'story' of human evolving as
done
by an experiment of aliens from another universe, to which I assigned
"energy"
with 3 (three) poles. One +, one -, and a THIRD one. (Maybe your math could
formulate this, but I could not. I accepted it as something beyond our human
mind.
(It facilitated direct mental contact, manipulation of time, overriding of
materially
induced space barriers, conscious machines and of course no lights-peed
max.)
[It was rejected  from publishers both in the US and Europe on identical
grounds:
too much science and insufficient sex and violence]
Speaking about such is different from understanding, more so from
'creating'.
We would need a bootstrap process to explain our origin (existence) from
within our existence. Maybe this is my mental limitation - I have to live
with it. And - of course - I am also guilty of 'human' thinking as you
charged.
Loeb created the idea of his machine. It is equipped with superhuman
(-natural?)
capabilities, all identified by a human mind, just as my 3-pole energy was.
The idea of a "pole" is very much from within our (humanly adjusted?)
worldview. If it
is 2, or 3, or 1457: it is still a (humanly divised) "pole".

I am a believer of 'creativity' so I do not find 'arguing' about 'ideas'
superfluous.
I am not 'prejudiced' against numbers: I asked so many time to get
understandable information and did not. I am agnostic, do not 'cut out'
other possibilities unless I see acceptable arguments to do so. (Acceptable
to me).
And: you are so smart that you do not have to resort to some 'racist' hint
which
seems to me as an ad hominem link.

Here I am again: decided so many times to keep off from arguments where the
word "god" is involved and am bugged down into it, both with you and Danny.

I have to control my 'mouse' better.

John M



On 3/12/07, Bruno Marchal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> Le 11-mars-07, à 17:33, John M a écrit :
>
>
>
> > Still: human thinking.
>
>
>
> You should subscribe to some alien list, if you are annoyed by us being
> human.
> You can answer "human thinking"  to any (human) post. So this does not
> convey any information, unless you explain what in our human nature
> prevent us to understand something typically non-human. It will be hard
> for you, human, to point on such a thing (actually the "human thinking
> critics apply to your own posts).
>
> Now, I am the one in the list which says: look we can already interview
> non-human lobian machine. So, in a sense, I could argue that all the
> lobian explanation with regard to our fundamental questions are lobian
> thinking, and a priori, this is not human. You, among the other, should
> be particularly pleased by this non human intervention in the list,
> unless you add that whatever the lobian machine says, it is us, human
> who interpret it, but then, again, we, humans, could stop arguing about
> anything, and even argue we should not talk with non-human entity given
> that we will deformed, by our human-ness, all what they talk about. But
> then we will certainly enforced our human prejudice.
> My feeling, John, is that you have typically human prejudice against
> number and machine, 100% similar to any form of racist prejudice: oh
> those entity are so different from us that we should not even listen to
> them ...
>
> And why do you say "human thinking". Why not "mammal's thinking"? Why
> not "carbon type of life thinking"? Why not "typical descendent of
> bacteria prejudices" ...
>
>
>
> > If we accept Bruno's "we are god"
>
>
> I have never said that. The most I have said in that direction, is
> that, assuming comp, the first person inherits "God"' unanmeability. So
> the first person has some "god" attribute. you cannot infer from this
> that we are "God!".
>
> Bruno
>
>
> http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
>
>

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