On 5/25/2013 11:03 AM, Jason Resch wrote:
On Thu, May 23, 2013 at 10:35 AM, <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Interesting Jason,
My issue with the multi-generated clones created either by the actions of a
multiverse or the actions of hypercomputers, my concern is that, its such a
waste
(in my opinion) that a Jason who belongs to an identical Earth, but humans
all have
elephant tricks instead of noses. Or a Jason Resch, belonging to a species
that has
rectangular crystal panels built in their stomachs and backs (see thru). I
am
shooting for ridiculous incarnations of J. Resch, in order to illustrate the
unlikeliness, of this method of producing the actual person-thoughts
feelings
memories. The memory thing as a blue print, to me, seems, essential, for
resurrection. I could be totally wrong, but I am merely trying to simplify
this for
myself, if nobody else. Thanks, Jason.
Mitch,
Consider a few points: First, roughly 100 billion humans have ever lived in this
history of humans, the life expectancy of humans over most of that time was 10 years, so
roughly there have been 1 trillion years worth of human experience. Second, if
transhumanism is correct and we transcend our biological limits we could not only live
much longer but generate experiences at greatly accelerated rates. It would take the
then current population of people (say it is 10 billion) only 100 years to generate the
same total amount of experience of all humans going back millions of years. Even if
only 10% of the population, spends only 1% of their time simulating/experiencing
alternate lives or histories, it would take a mere 100,000 years for most of "human"
experiences to be generated artificially by our descendents. This ignores the
acceleration that is possible. Electricity flows through wires about a million times
faster than neurotransmitters conduct signals in the brain. This implies that without
any miniaturization, human thought could be accelerated by about a factor of a million
times, so it could take only a month (rather than 100,000 years) for these accelerated
humans spending only 0.1% of their collective time simulating ancestors for the bulk of
human experience to be artificially generated. Now consider that such a civilization
could live for billions of years. If each post-human experiences a few thousand or a
few million ancestor lives, or alternate species, etc., then odds quickly become
overwhelming that your current moment of awareness is not explained by that of some
biological being on a physical planet but that of some advanced being conducting a
simulation on some advanced computational substrate.
Jason
-Mitch
-----Original Message-----
From: Jason Resch <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
To: Everything List <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
Sent: Thu, May 23, 2013 11:10 am
Subject: Re: That the mind works even after the brain ceases to function
suggests
its ...
On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 4:57 PM, <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
So, Jason,by this reasoning, a sufficiently advanced technology, then,
in
indistinguisable from Resurrection.
If used for such purposes. Even if technology is not used for the explicit
purpose
of resurrection, say it is only used for exploration purposes, where
simulation is
applied to explore other possibilities of existence and being, a side
effect will be
to provide new paths for the consciousness of the simulated beings to
follow. It is
a bit like the guy who dreamed he was a butterfly. If it was an completely
accurate
dream (as simulation technology could allow), then the butterfly is given
the
ability to "ressurect" to become a human. Similarly, advanced "omega point"
civilizations or Jupiter brains may choose to explore potentiality for
consciousness
and thus try to experience the lives of other beings. Such an intelligence,
existing in any physical universe that provides infinite energy/infinite
computing
power has the ability to experience the life of every other being anywhere
in any
universe (assuming computationalism). If one of these exists anywhere, the
it
provides us the potential to wake up as it, just as the butterfly has the
potential
to wake up as a human. Such a being may even feel compelled to provide a
pleasant
afterlife given all the suffering that exists in the physical worlds,
although this
point is more contentious.
I mention this because I have discussed tech resurrection, as, at
least, an
intellectual phenomenon, over at the Kurzweil forum. There is an
enthusiast for
technologically based resurrection, on the forum, has produced a
moderately,
large, website, that presents this concept. Most people will say this in
impossible, and who am I to dispute them? But I still find the topic
interesting, none the less.
That is interesting to me. What is the website?
My suspicion is that there is some feature of the universe that acts as
a
substrate for all actions and characteristics and records it all. I am
trying to
peg it down to the Planck length as sort of a storage cell. The styllus
to
read-write could be anything from photons to neutrinos, that would
write to the
planck length. Who knows if it is even plausible, but I sort of like it
anyway.
I like NDE stuff too, and try to sort the most cogent stories from the
least
cogent.
Whether or not it is recorded or extractable in this universe is
immaterial. If the
universe is infinitely large or infinitely varied, we each reappear an
infinite
number of times. There are a countably infinite number of programs, and
for any
given level of complexity, there is a finite number of possible programs
shorter
than some length. Any consciousness we simulate is the consciousness of
something
that exists somewhere else in the infinitely varied/infinitely large
universe, and
if the universe is really this big, then someone else far away could
simulate you
perfectly without having to extract a record of you. Just running Bruno's
UDA for a
long enough time "ressurects" everyone, we are all contained in that short
program.
To which, one is tempted to respond: So what? If there is all this simulation going on,
what reason is there to suppose it is being done by being anything like us or that the
worlds in which the simulations take place (the "real" ones, if there are any) are
anything like this one. You are simply led back to trying to discover what are possible
worlds, where "possible" can be anything from "familiar enough I can understand it" to
"nomologically possible" to "not containing contradictions".
Brent
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