My complaint is that there doesn't seem to be a consistent definition of
existence!


On Sat, Jun 8, 2013 at 9:11 PM, Stephen Paul King <kingstephenp...@gmail.com
> wrote:

>
> smi...@zonnet.nl 
> via<http://support.google.com/mail/bin/answer.py?hl=en&ctx=mail&answer=1311182>
>  googlegroups.com
> 8:37 PM (31 minutes ago)
>  to everything-list
>  But if such a real physical pink elephant can't exist, that means that
> it is not a logically consistent concept to begin with. If one starts from
> a logically consistent system, then one can always find a physical system
> whose equations of motion realize it, it will then exist in a generic
> multiverse scenario.
>
> Saibal
>
> Hi Saibal,
>
> Does existence mean "has a physical structure that can be measured by
> arbitrary observers"? If so, how can a number 'exist'?
>
>
> On Sat, Jun 8, 2013 at 8:37 PM, <smi...@zonnet.nl> wrote:
>
>> But if such a real physical pink elephant can't exist, that means that it
>> is not a logically consistent concept to begin with. If one starts from a
>> logically consistent system, then one can always find a physical system
>> whose equations of motion realize it, it will then exist in a generic
>> multiverse scenario.
>>
>> Saibal
>>
>> Citeren meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net>:
>>
>>  On 6/8/2013 12:03 PM, John Mikes wrote:
>>>
>>>> You are mixing conventional physicalist-materialist apples with
>>>> imaginary oranges. Anything 'could be'.
>>>>
>>>
>>> That's my point.  Anything 'could be' if the only constraint is logical
>>> consistency (not self contradictory).  But in the sense of 'be' that
>>> requires a universe and observers there appear to be other, nomological
>>> constraints.  So there could be an animal that looks superficially like and
>>> elephant and lives on a planet who's atmosphere is as dense as water and is
>>> pink.  But it couldn't also have the same DNA and metabolic system as and
>>> elephant.  So it would only 'be a flying pink elephant' because we use the
>>> words to denote a certain similarity in appearance.
>>>
>>> Brent
>>>
>>>
>>>  Question: would such "anything" be topic for this physicalist-based
>>>> conventional EVERYTHING List?
>>>> Q-2: are OUR colors defined for different physical circumstances as
>>>> well? BTW - IMO  flying is not restricted to a conventionally called
>>>> 'gaseous' medium, so 'swimming' can be considered an alternate for flying.
>>>> - PINK Whales? <G>
>>>> Rem: of course 'they' all exist - if not otherwise: in our mind.
>>>> JM
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Jun 8, 2013 at 12:04 PM, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net<mailto:
>>>> meeke...@verizon.net>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     On 6/8/2013 5:23 AM, smi...@zonnet.nl <mailto:smi...@zonnet.nl>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>         They exist if there is a consistent description of them. Even
>>>> within
>>>>         conventional physics there is room for that, as discussed
>>>> recently on this list.
>>>>         In the MWI or in eternal inflation models, everything that is
>>>> not strictly
>>>>         forbidden by the conservation laws will happen.
>>>>
>>>>         Flying pink elephants can e.g. exist on planets with an
>>>> extemely dense
>>>>         atmosphere, there was a NGC documentary a few years ago about
>>>> this topic, it was
>>>>         suggested that you could have flying whales on such planets.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     Could you identify them as elephants and whales by their DNA?
>>>>  Could the elephants
>>>>     be pink?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     Brent
>>>>
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