On 3 December 2013 09:49, Quentin Anciaux <allco...@gmail.com> wrote:

> 2013/12/2 LizR <lizj...@gmail.com>
>> On 3 December 2013 09:40, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote:
>>>  On 12/2/2013 8:43 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
>>>   I'm sorry but we will have to agree we disagree on that. You're also
>>> misleading atheistic position, and you're wrongly attributing "belief" to
>>> atheist people (especially belgians)... I'm belgian, I'm not a materialist,
>>> I consider myself atheist in regards of religions, and that's what most
>>> atheist means when they say they are atheist.
>>>  Call it "ultimate reality".  It is OK, until you grasp enough of comp
>>> to see that this rings a bit faulty.
>>>  There is no problem to call it "ultimate reality", as long as you are
>>> open it might have "personal" aspects, and have no prejudice on wht that
>>> "ultimate reality" can be (with this or that hypothesis).
>>> Then you should have no prejudice toward accepting matter as the
>>> possible "ultimate reality".  It too might have personal aspect.
>>> I believe Bruno's only "prejudice" about this is he thinks it leads to a
>> contradiction.
> Assuming computationalism...
> I was taking that as read. But yes, Bruno also thinks that if you don't
assume computationalism, you have to adopt a supernatural stance towards
consciousness, and I imagine he's prejudiced against *that!*

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