2014/1/16 Edgar L. Owen <[email protected]> > Stephen, > > Once again, that's not the argument in question that proves it, that's a > different train of thought. > > Liz's "repost" has nothing to do with the argument I'm referencing. She > clearly doesn't know what it is. >
I know it... you're a troll... could you please go back in the cave you came from ? > > Edgar > > > > On Wednesday, January 15, 2014 6:21:35 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: > >> Dear LizR, >> >> Thank you for the repost! >> >> Dear Edgar, >> >> >> There is a reason why "this simple obvious fact" was not recognized in >> literature. It has been proven to be nonsense. >> >> Your concept is: "the time of the present moment (what I call P-time) >> which is absolute and common to all observers across the universe." >> >> P-time is not common to any pair or combination of observers. It cannot >> be extended in any unambiguous way to span any pair of observers, so forget >> about greater groups. Each observer has its very own notion of a Present >> moment" and it is not shared or sharable. To be sharable, there must exist >> some way to map the observation that one observe might have to that of >> another and guess what, when we construct the set of possible maps between >> observers that connects each and every shred of content, all of the >> "commonality" of a notion of a present moment vanishes! >> >> In fact, in the math of GR there is a serious prohibition on a clock >> that has a size greater than an infinitesimal point! See General >> Covariance <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_covariance>. What kind >> of periodicity do you think such a clock might have? The solution to this >> obstruction to the notion of clocks in GR is to use something like afiber >> bundle >> construction<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiber_bundle_construction_theorem>and >> associate a system to each and every infinitesimal point of the >> space-time manifold. >> This has been done http://arxiv.org/abs/quant-ph/0410061. >> What was found is that each bundle must be completely disconnected from >> all others. We cannot create a *single* space of points that will map to >> the set of infinitesimal points that make up a space-time manifold. To do >> so would prevent the existence of curvature - commonly known as gravity. >> A way out is to have an infinite number of totally disconnected spaces, >> each mapped to a single point of space-time and build your clocks in those >> spaces. This construction allows for a notion of time that is consistent >> with both GR and QM but is not consistent with any notion of a *absolute >> and common P-time for **all observers across the universe*. >> >> We do experience gravity, thus the association of a single >> external computational space to the space-time manifold is not allowed. >> >> >> >> On Wed, Jan 15, 2014 at 5:59 PM, LizR <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> On 16 January 2014 11:53, Edgar L. Owen <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Liz, >> >> Do you know what my argument is? Quentin also claimed it was invalid but >> he couldn't tell us what the argument is that he claims is invalid. Do you >> know? >> >> You argued as follows: >> >> The proof is simply the fact that the time traveling twins meet up again >> with different clock times, but always in the exact same present moment. >> This proves beyond any doubt there are two kinds of time, clock time which >> varies by relativistic observer, and the time of the present moment(what I >> call P-time) which is absolute and common to all observers across >> the universe. >> >> When this is realized there are a number of profound implications. >> >> First that time travel outside the common present moment is impossible >> since all of reality (the entire universe) exists within/is the common >> present moment. The only time travel that is possible is having >> different clock times within the same shared present moment. >> >> Second, that this is compatible with only one cosmological geometry, >> named that the universe is a 4-dimensional hypersphere with P-time (not >> clock time) as its continually extending radial dimension. That is >> cosmological space is positively curved and finite. In fact we all see all >> 4-dimensions >> >> ... > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy Batty/Rutger Hauer) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
