Dear LizR,
On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 9:04 PM, LizR <lizj...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 24 January 2014 14:55, Stephen Paul King <stephe...@provensecure.com>wrote: > >> Dear LizR, >> >> I argue against the block universe idea as well using quantum >> mechanics: positions and momenta cannot co-exist as definite states; a >> block universe must have all of its observables as mutually commuting so >> that they are all simultaneously definite. >> > > If this is a problem (which is far from certain) it's one of classical > physics vs quantum theory. It doesn't show block universes are impossible, > it shows that classical physics is impossible. (The resolution is almost > certainly a block multiverse.) > Umm, one more time: A block universe requires that it be a block, a fixed 4-dimensional object. As such all properties associated with the points making up that hypercube must be simultaneously defined. The general non-commutability of observables (energy, spin direction, position, duration, etc.) of QM disallows this requirement. Thus QM prohibits the existence of a block universe. I don't comprehend what a "block multiverse" could be. > > >> But let us ignore that and stipulate the block universe for the sake >> of the conversation. What we could see in the block universe, once we >> associate with it with the Hamiltonians or Lagrangians of the world tubes, >> is a *representation of action*. *It is not action itself*. >> > > No, it really is action. The past is a block universe (unless you know > some way to change it). You can associate a Hamiltonian with something in > the past (since physics worked in the past). So you can do all the above > with block universes. > The mathematical representation of the action *is* the action? Maybe you are thinking in a different way or interpreting the definition given in the wiki article in a different way... > > >> A world or "reality" is not in my thinking a representation of >> something that does not exist. We can define observers as being >> representable per Bruno's definition, but that is half of what they are, >> not all of what they are. *For every representation there must exist at >> least one physical object and for every physical object there must exist at >> least one representation*. >> > > So "no universe without representation!", eh? (So no universe before > beings able to make representations?) > No, a physical system, say the universe comes into being with its representation (at least its self-representation), one cannot exist without the other. This is a form of panpsychism... maybe... I am not married to this idea without the possibility of a divorce. It is weird, I admit, I am just trying to see if it "works". > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the > Google Groups "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this topic, visit > https://groups.google.com/d/topic/everything-list/TBc_y2MZV5c/unsubscribe. > To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to > everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- Kindest Regards, Stephen Paul King Senior Researcher Mobile: (864) 567-3099 stephe...@provensecure.com http://www.provensecure.us/ "This message (including any attachments) is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed, and may contain information that is non-public, proprietary, privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law or may be constituted as attorney work product. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, notify sender immediately and delete this message immediately." -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
