On Thu, Apr 02, 2015 at 07:07:09AM +0200, Platonist Guitar Cowboy wrote: > > > Which assumes perhaps too strong a form of functionalism and/or digitalism > that runs into its own contradiction with 1p consciousness? > > As pointed out in earlier post: With that move, it is no longer relevant to > distinguish recording from person who has 1p experience, zombie question is > nonsense, no indexical property, there is correct substitution level, all > possible 1p consciousness of all persons supervenes on the recording > (everything digital) *or* none at all since recording has no CC and other > such funky consequences I can't recall. How is this avoided if everything > is one bland sauce of digital?
It is not at all obvious that counterfactual correctness (CC) is required for a computation to be conscious. Bruno usually argues that feature is a red herring. If it is, then non-CC recordings are not conscious, and the MGA goes through in the small (non-robust) universe case. But recordings can also be counterfactually correct in principle (in the form of a huge lookup table, for example, in Searles's Chinese Room), or in the form of a precise specification of the quantum wave function, or of a finite chunk of the UD* trace. Modulo the no-cloning theorem, or the Seth Lloyd limit which would prevent such a recording existing in our current universe. > > Thanks for pushing the question though Russell, as my earlier posts were > perhaps less clear on this. I guess you're coming from some ground I can't > parse or have missed reading and you have my apology here if so. But > zombies can be tricky bastards :-) > > > > Where do you draw the line? I'm afraid > >> intuition does not help much in this matter, which is why I say it is > >> a weakness of the MGA. > >> > > > > There must be something more to it than just complexity or even Turing > > universality. Bruno says human-like consciousness requires Lobianity. But > > I think that's asking for more than just awarenss; it's asking for > > self-awarness. > > > Which with comp assumptions/environment includes the properties that come > with that kind of self-awareness, e.g. incompleteness, machine's silence > etc. PGC > > > > If I were building a Mars Rover and gave it the ability to learn from its > > experience by reviewing its memory of events and projecting hypothetical > > futures, I would be concerned that I had created a sentient being that > > would forsee its own end. So I would be sure to avoid putting its > > indefinite survival into its value system. > > > > Brent > > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile) Principal, High Performance Coders Visiting Professor of Mathematics hpco...@hpcoders.com.au University of New South Wales http://www.hpcoders.com.au Latest project: The Amoeba's Secret (http://www.hpcoders.com.au/AmoebasSecret.html) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
