On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 12:29 AM, Russell Standish <li...@hpcoders.com.au> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 01, 2015 at 01:50:51PM +0200, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > > OK, but so you agree that MGA shows that if comp is true, matter is > > of no use, unless we admit that a complex experience like a human > > dream can supervene on a very simple trivial activity. Then the MGA > > intuition pump seems to work well enough, imo. > > > > Bruno > > > > You have just conceded my point. Then the MGA is not a logical proof (as > you have sometimes claimed, and Quentin claimed even more forcefully), > but rather an argument by incredulity, or an intuition pump as Daniel > Dennett puts it. Nothing wrong with that of course, we just need to > know what has actually been achieved. > I still don't see what MGA "pumps intuitively and incorrectly", as you seem to assume that MGA is "bad" intuition pump, rather than "good" one that facilitates seeing something tricky. You've not shown that consciousness supervenes on broken gates, you don't treat movies like conscious entities, and haven't pointed towards a recording that is obviously or demonstrably conscious. Your statement also seems to presuppose an absolute standard of "logical proof" and that such would guarantee form of certain knowledge. Whatever personal standards we may hold for "proof", there is some sense in also interpreting it as form of relating to or communicating with other people convincingly: 'proving' is trying to convince that one statement follows from some specified other statements. If those other statements are true, then the statement in question is also true. I wish everybody a fine day, communicating with their movies, ensuring that their movies' living standards, education, careers, finances, health, social security, retirement plans etc. are in order. Each to their own, but I'm part of set of people to whom that's just weird and absurd. Sure, maybe I am weird and absurd. Fine, whatever. PGC -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to firstname.lastname@example.org. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.