On 02 Oct 2017, at 02:19, John Clark wrote:
On Sun, Oct 1, 2017 at 1:59 PM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]>
wrote:
> That is why you don't listen to the copies. They are elves in
Santa Clause's shop
As I said the copies have nothing to do will it. The elves in
Santa Clause's shop have just as much to do with this as the copies
do, nothing. The one person to ask after it is over to learn the
truth is the one and one one person that is two people; the
copies are no that, the original is not that, the elves are not
that, nothing is that.
I have a thought experiment of my own and this is the protocol:
1) I have TWO coins, a regular coin and a two headed coin.
2) I flip both coins.
3) Predict if the one and only coin will land heads or tails.
You can't predict it because of coin indeterminacy.
> Hmm... let me think.
I think that I can't answer, because there is two coins landing on
the table, so that the question is meaningless.
Very good Bruno! Do you believe there are others or was that
the only meaningless question in existence?
That question is weird. of course there are many others, but if you
accept that "coin" can think, then the question or similar becomes
meaningful because you can apply the 1p-3p distinction. You have just
mimic the question in a context (coin) where such distinction was
meaningless. That is poor strategy!
> the last Prize I got disappeared, and the promotion which was
promised got transformed into widening defamation.
I don't get it, you said I was the only one that disagreed with
you.
Yes, the disappearance of the prize was not motivated by any
disagreement. I would have heard them since.
Now, guess what is missing in your coin theorem? The coin 1p/3p
distinction.
Guess what is missing in the thought experiment. It's the 1p/1p/1p
distinction because there are three of them and when Bruno Marchal
refers to "he" or "I" or "you" or "THE 1p" there is no way of
knowing which ONE of the THREE Bruno Marchal is referring to.
You distract yourself from the question asked.
> You don't refute step 3. You just stop
Guilty as charged. It's impossible to refute gibberish because
there is nothing there to refute, but it is possible to stop reading
it.
yes. Your refutation is now limited to the insult. If you were feeling
it is gibberish, you would be able to say something senseful. But you
just forget the 1p/3p distinction, and then ... get the gibberish
aspect that you are introducing all by yourself.
> You forget that you agreed that both are the original guy.
No. The original guy is both of them but neither them is the
original guy,
Then you contradict yourself, as you have agreed many times that the H-
guy survived in both cities.
the copies have all the memories of the original man but in addition
they have memories the original man does not have.
Then you don't survive either with the simple teleportation, and comp
(CT+YD) is refuted, and ... QED, by reductio ad absurdum.
>> It makes no difference if computationalism is true or
false, if there is no question there can be no answer.
> It is just because you deny the answer of the copies.
I can't deny any answer if I don't know the question!
> Then you deny that you survive duplication.
Maybe so, it depends on what "you" means. In my language "you"
means somebody who remembers being Bruno Marchal yesterday and so
"you" has survived, but I don't know what "you" means in Brunospeak.
Good, you come quickly back to the identity criterion on which we both
agreed, but then you re-contradict yourself, because the H-guy has now
survived in both places, and so it makes sense to interview them,
after all. But then we get the first person indeterminacy immediately.
I would say case close. But we know that you will not be happy with
this, and continue your rhetorical maneuver.
Bruno
John K Clark
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