On Tuesday, December 19, 2017 at 8:03:00 AM UTC, [email protected] wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 18, 2017 at 6:37:39 PM UTC, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 16 Dec 2017, at 19:00, John Clark wrote: >> >> On Thu, Dec 14, 2017 at 9:20 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>> I don't see how Wigner's friend presents a problem for Copenhagen. >>> According to the CI, the wf collapses when the system measured, which is >>> when the box is opened. What am I missing? >>> >> >> >> According to >> >> Copenhagen >> >> Wigner's friend >> >> opens the cat box and that >> >> collapses >> >> the cat's wave function, and so Wigner's friend >> >> now knows the cat's fate, but Wigner's friend >> >> is also in a box and Wigner >> >> himself is outside that box, so until Wigner opens his friend's box his >> friend is in a "I see a dead cat" state AND a "I see a live cat state". >> And of course you could put Wigner himself in a box with somebody outside >> it and you could keep increasing the number of nested boxes until the >> entire universe is included, and that is why the Copenhagen >> >> interpretation is useless if you're >> interest is in >> dealing in cosmology because there is nobody outside >> to >> universe observe it. >> >> And God >> is of no help unless somebody knows who collapses God's wave function, >> and even then there would be another unanswered question too obvious to >> mention. >> >> >> And with Digital Mechanism, even a Universe cannot help. How could >> *anything* select a computation, or a class of computations, among all >> computations? >> But the first person associated to the universal numbers, involved in the >> semi-computable relations, localized themselves in the relative way allowed >> by the local self-referential correctness, apparently. >> >> Gödel's arithmetization of metamathematics embed the mathematicians in >> the arithmetical reality/truth/model (the structure (N, 0, +, x). >> >> Remarkably, incompleteness justfies the equivalence, at the truth level, >> of all modes p, Bp, Bp & p, etc. , and the fact that the machine cannot >> justify those equivalences, and that they obey quite different logics. >> >> Kant can be tested, by looking for time, space and the quantum "in the >> head" of the universal machine. Apparently he is right. >> >> Bruno >> > > *Translation: CMIIAW: Mumbo Jumbo OR There is a God. His name is Plato. > He knows arithmetic. (Since he learned it from his father, we have an > infinite regression of turtles within turtles.) AG * >
*Alternatively, you're putting WILL at the core of creation manifested by a Mathematician. AG * > > >> >> >> >> >> >> John K Clark >> >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> >> >> http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ >> >> >> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
