+1 - there is room enough.

On a related note, what is the current status of HiveMind? the site is still blanked out in Commons. Could someone please update general as to the current situation re: HiveMind?

Andrew C. Oliver wrote:

I don't think that Avalon has any right to have a stranglehold on all
service frameworks.  I also must say that I hate the "come discuss this in
'our' house" approach to collaboration.   One size does not fit all and
Avalon has shown over the years that this is especially true for it.  I say
that Howard Lewis Ship is a skilled coder and community builder and if he
wants to give it a try with HiveMind, while the topic bores me personally,
I'll give him my support.  If he does want to collaborate with the
Avalonites (Avaloners?) then he should be encouraged to do so; however, if
his approach is different enough to warrant its own show then I encourage
him to do that as well.  I trust his judgment to that effect.

We have Struts, Turbine, and Avalon.  We have Velocity, JSP, XSLT, etc.  We
have commons digester and XMLBeans...  None are "preferred" and BTW Avalon
isn't even "preferred" as Tomcat, for instance, doesn't use it.

To suggest that there can be only one "true" service framework is misguided,


On 11/18/03 12:49 AM, "Stephen McConnell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Howard M. Lewis Ship wrote:

I'm moniroting the avalon dev list.


As mentioned earlier there are some things that would be interesting to
discuss over on the avalon dev list.  Perhaps you could put forward you
thoughts about the potential or lack thereoff on collaboration.  I think
some good points have already been put on the table for working together
and for working apart - but just at the moment these thoughts are only
on the table and no real discussion is happening as a result.  I think
that could change if we were to go beyond mutual monotoring.

Cheers, Steve.

Howard M. Lewis Ship
Creator, Tapestry: Java Web Components

-----Original Message-----
From: news [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Stephen McConnell
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2003 10:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Proposal] HiveMind Service Framework


I've put up a limited copy of the HiveMind documentation on

my personal home page:


Are you open to the idea of discussing some mutual areas of interest?

There are a number of aspects of the work you are doing that are
complimentary with the work on-going in Avalon, and several areas in
Avalon which after review your material are complimentary
with your own efforts. Can I get you to sign up to the avalon dev list bacause I
would very much like to discuss this further together with
other members of the Avalon crew.

Details for the Avalon dev list are available at the following URL:


I'm looking forward to hearing from you.

Cheers, Stephen.

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