Founded in capitalism? Did God write up the founding theory for economics too? Is that what they teach you at school?
On 17 Jun., 02:41, gruff <[email protected]> wrote: > Hey Archy. Good seein' you around too. > > Capital didn't mysteriously vanish. Real capital is durable. Bubbles > create faux capital which of course disappears when the bubble pops > because it never had anything to it to begin with. No substance. No > reality. Never Never Land. A pinch of pixie dust. > > Nor am I saying or implying that socialism is the alternative to > capitalism. A healthy robust free market economic system founded in > capitalism can certainly produce sufficient profits to create not only > new capital but to also take care of the basic needs of all it's > citizens so they may be free to be innovative, creative or just plain > lazy if they so wish. A work ethic is not the standard by which > someone gets to live or die. Nor is there any rule or principle > which dictates that a healthy democratic society can be self- > sustaining for all it's citizens. A society does not need every > member's active participation in order to be healthy, wealthy, wise > and compassionate. Quite frequently a few can carry the load for a > large number of others. Besides, what do we do with the ones deemed > non-self-sustaining? Find a humane and compassionate way to get rid > of them? > > On Jun 15, 5:04 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > I've never been happy with the term capitalism; some bustard always > > seems to want us to forget notions of building it up and protecting > > capital in favour of magic wand tricks done by accountants - with the > > capital mysteriously vanishing from our grasp and use. Equally unhappy > > that socialism is an alternative. Freedom under democratic respect in > > societies that can sustain themselves is more where I see us going if > > we have any sense. Good to see you about Gruff. > > > On 15 June, 19:14, gruff <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Vam, if you were not espousing the paranoia of world domination > > > conspiracy theories, then may I suggest that when you send someone to > > > a conspiracy website, that you set that parameter up front else a > > > person might get suspicious you were of the nature and espousing the > > > message of that site. > > > > I'm not defensive about it. I've just been on the merry-go-round with > > > conspiracists in the past and to be truthful I've gotten tired of > > > their irrational paranoia. There are more than sufficient real > > > problems in the world to want not to deal with unwarranted and > > > emotional paranoia as well. > > > > I also don't agree that the point of the alternate view was as you > > > describe it. I can agree with your description but that was not what > > > the site was about -- at least to my perception. It's a paranoid > > > conspiracy website that wants to duck and cover from those who > > > allegedly wish to control the world. Maybe you were able to pick the > > > little good out of what was said. I must have missed it. > > > > I also agree with your new rules for global capitalism in that they > > > will include a lot of socialist agendas -- as they should. I'm fairly > > > certain we will wind up with a blend of socialism and capitalism with > > > the latter supporting the former -- again as it should. But we must > > > be careful that the support of socialist goals does not drown the > > > capitalist free market system. > > > > On Jun 15, 12:18 am, vamadevananda <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > " Vam, I'm sorry but I think you're seeing conspiracies in the > > > > mirror." > > > > > This is one reason why we signed off last time, Gruff ! You really > > > > don't know what I'm seeing. The link I posted was just that : a link > > > > to some descriptions of what the capital and market processes actually > > > > involve. If it makes you defensive, as what you write seems to > > > > indicate, it isn't really on me ... > > > > > The point in the alternate view was that ... it's the same ' feet of > > > > clay ' story, with obvious greed and power at work. We've all lived > > > > with it, and know that ' small mind ' capitalism is what is causing > > > > this disruption cycle of pain and waste. We now also know that we can > > > > now aim to establish ' large - mind - universal - empathy ' > > > > capitalism, that is more sustainable, honest and transparent, and > > > > mutually respecting of life everywhere. That recognises... ' excesses, > > > > like accidents, are forever imminent but entirely undesirable and > > > > completely avoidable.' That will not only accept moderation as a great > > > > and critically important value, but are actually wedded to doing > > > > everything to ensure ' moral profits,' healthy competition,' and ' > > > > productive power of capital and its democratised availability.' > > > > Capital may continue to be marshalled by and placed in the judgement > > > > of individuals, but capital will henceforth be social assets, free of > > > > its origins in greed and its power purged of frankenstein aspects. > > > > > The new rules of global capitalism would include a lot of socialistic > > > > goals and values, Gruff ! It's an awakening that has just begun to > > > > happen.My call to all linear thinking capitalists and socialists, and > > > > the others, is ... step up, and embrace it. > > > > > On Jun 15, 1:29 am, gruff <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Sorry Gabby. Couldn't do that trip. Along with a major fear of > > > > > heights, I can't breathe well at altitudes over 5,000 ft. However, I > > > > > have experienced a monkish environment here in the high deserts of > > > > > the Southwest. Very healthful, mentally and spiritually. > > > > > > Vam, I'm sorry but I think you're seeing conspiracies in the mirror. > > > > > Jekyll island is in Glynn County, Georgia and while it is an island in > > > > > the Atlantic Ocean it's not as isolated as the piece implies. It's > > > > > part of the U.S. and can be reached by rowboat, causeway or plane. It > > > > > has a golf club and a few resorts. And yes, Jekyll Island resorts > > > > > drew the elite for a number of centuries and it is a great part of our > > > > > history. It is also the place where the wealth elite gathered to plan > > > > > out a global economy that was not tied to gold but rather based on the > > > > > actual value of a nation's production and consumption. It was the > > > > > precursor to Bretton Woods. Now if you want to get into conspiracy > > > > > theories, Bretton Woods has spawned far more than Jekyll Island. It's > > > > > just that Jekyll Island has a much spookier name and thus gets more > > > > > press.
