The will that makes you act against your apparent nature is your innate nature. All that you strive for , the controls you exercise , and the efforts you make is your innate nature. The doer in you is a slave of your nature and your will is a tool of your nature whether apparent or innate.
On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:05 AM, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote: > There you are wrong RP my nature sez pull the trigger (Why I was never > allowed to play the bad guy..)my not doing it is against my nature. > Allan > > > On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 4:42 PM, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > >> What you choose to do and what you don't depends upon the way your brain >> is functioning , if you are nuts God help me and if you are frustrated and >> want to prove your point then also let God have pity upon me. What I mean to >> say Allan is that you are under the control of your nature and that part of >> you which strives to change and do is innate in you , in other words just as >> much a part of your nature. >> >> >> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 8:53 PM, iam deheretic <[email protected]>wrote: >> >>> RP I have been lost as to what you are arguing there are some laws you >>> can not change, but those laws are like thing example the speed of >>> light,, but even that can be changed some what. I think what every one is >>> talking about is the freedom of choice is in the nature of my taking my >>> browning high power and deciding to airiate your head by putting several >>> round through it. For me to do that would be totally of my choice. Now the >>> only genetic part of it is that I am very capable of doing it and have had >>> the training to develop the skills in handling the weapon. >>> What keeps me from doing it is I choose not to. You can always find some >>> argument to fit your view but when you are staring down the business end it >>> stops being illusionary and you start praying the holder is not nuts. >>> Allan >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 3:08 PM, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> We are the agents and therefore do everything which gives a false notion >>>> of freedom , but actually whatever we do it is by God given Nature. Our >>>> personality is an outcome of the interaction of our genetic makeup with the >>>> environment , both of which are in the hands of nature. Our will to strive >>>> , >>>> to control , to improve is innate in us and is therefore genetic in nature. >>>> It is all a chain , one thing leads to another which gives us a false >>>> notion >>>> of independence because our independence is dependent on so many factors , >>>> some of which are under our control but that control is illusory as it is >>>> due to the chain. The end result must be seen in the perspective of the >>>> previous causative factors. >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 5:35 PM, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> We just have different ideas about this and that's okay. I think we >>>>> also participate in our own corruption- often- but it is easier to >>>>> blame others or the situation. Our innate nature at birth is one of >>>>> potential and quite dependent on a multitude of factors. I do not >>>>> blame God nor think Him malevolent as we have free will within the >>>>> constuct of Determinism- an unsolveable. The brain can trump Nature, >>>>> in my opinion though we are bound. >>>>> >>>>> On Nov 20, 8:13 am, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > A man's innate nature is corrupted by others and that is not in one's >>>>> hands. >>>>> > Nature from inside and outside a person determines all actions, so >>>>> whatever >>>>> > happens it is ultimately God's will and there is nothing >>>>> presumptuous in >>>>> > accepting and recognizing that. >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 6:23 PM, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > For some it is the struggle to survive rather than strive.//You >>>>> might >>>>> > > want to acqaint yourself with Thomas Hardy- an early influence- >>>>> esp. >>>>> > > his "Tess of the D'Ubervilles" and "Jude the Obscure".//American >>>>> > > Democracy lures immigrants with freedom but materialism suffocates >>>>> > > them with greed and envy despite their often good nature and >>>>> > > generosity.//I do think it presumptuous to decide God's plan for >>>>> our >>>>> > > lives- there are too many surprises along the way. Plus our innate >>>>> > > nature can be corrupted in several ways. Adam and Eve wound up >>>>> > > dysfunctional- look at Cain and Abel! >>>>> > >>>>> > > Have wounded a thumb slicing a potato on the mandolin (a kitchen >>>>> > > tool). Difficult to type and surf. :-( >>>>> > >>>>> > > On Nov 19, 4:29 am, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > The " I " is self-sense which is just a reflection of the Self or >>>>> God. >>>>> > > Our >>>>> > > > will is totally bound by nature , when we strive and struggle it >>>>> is >>>>> > > because >>>>> > > > of our innate nature which was given to us. The effect is always >>>>> a result >>>>> > > of >>>>> > > > the cause and not vice versa. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 1:43 AM, [email protected] < >>>>> > >>>>> > > > [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > > RP Singh. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > So it is not you then? What is you? When people say that we >>>>> can >>>>> > > > > achive via the application of our will what does this mean? >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > There is I think in all of us a sense of 'Self''. What then is >>>>> this >>>>> > > > > Self? >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > On Nov 18, 5:01 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > > > " My " or " will " is the agent of Nature and is bound by It >>>>> though >>>>> > > > > seeming >>>>> > > > > > to be free. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 9:36 PM, >>>>> [email protected] < >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > > > > RP Singh, >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > I agree we are all products of our enviroments, I cannot >>>>> cease to >>>>> > > have >>>>> > > > > > > dark hair even if I wished, but I can choose to apply some >>>>> dye to >>>>> > > it. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > You used the word 'MY' quiet a lot in your response to me, >>>>> along >>>>> > > with >>>>> > > > > > > the word 'WILL'. If you have no choice then what is this >>>>> will you >>>>> > > > > > > speak of? Who's will is it, how do you Will to strive? >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > On Nov 18, 3:19 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > > > > > As a new-born I had a short or long nose , blue or black >>>>> eyes , >>>>> > > > > blonde or >>>>> > > > > > > > black hair, or a white or black complexion------------ >>>>> was it >>>>> > > > > determined >>>>> > > > > > > by >>>>> > > > > > > > me , no it was in my genes. I was not responsible for my >>>>> genes >>>>> > > and >>>>> > > > > > > whoever >>>>> > > > > > > > else was responsible but I was bound to them. Similarly >>>>> my reason >>>>> > > was >>>>> > > > > > > sharp >>>>> > > > > > > > or dull , my imagination was keen or dull , my grasping >>>>> power >>>>> > > was >>>>> > > > > good >>>>> > > > > > > or >>>>> > > > > > > > otherwise -- all such things were due to my genes. The >>>>> > > environment in >>>>> > > > > > > which >>>>> > > > > > > > I was born was not of my making , yet it acted and >>>>> reacted on me >>>>> > > and >>>>> > > > > I >>>>> > > > > > > acted >>>>> > > > > > > > and reacted to it. My personality which eventually >>>>> developed was >>>>> > > a >>>>> > > > > result >>>>> > > > > > > of >>>>> > > > > > > > this interaction and my will to strive , to improve >>>>> myself , to >>>>> > > learn >>>>> > > > > > > > ----was innate in me and not of my own making. So if >>>>> these things >>>>> > > > > were >>>>> > > > > > > not >>>>> > > > > > > > in my hands I can say that I am bound even though seeming >>>>> to be >>>>> > > free. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 2:32 PM, >>>>> [email protected] < >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > > [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > > > > > > Ohh how I disagree with this. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > > > It is clear that who we are, our very personalities are >>>>> made >>>>> > > from >>>>> > > > > not >>>>> > > > > > > > > only our experiances but our enviroment. Are we really >>>>> not >>>>> > > free >>>>> > > > > > > > > though to make of ourselves something other than what >>>>> we are? >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > > > Yes yes of course we are. The key is understanding, if >>>>> we can >>>>> > > > > > > > > understand what in our lives has made us 'Us' then we >>>>> can >>>>> > > surly >>>>> > > > > > > > > change in any mannor we wish. Of course this must be >>>>> true or >>>>> > > > > things >>>>> > > > > > > > > like cognative therapy would just not work. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > > > On Nov 16, 3:29 pm, RP <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > > > > > > > Man is bound by his actions and bound to his >>>>> experiences. >>>>> > > > > Whatever >>>>> > > > > > > > > > actions have to be done man is bound by them , as >>>>> also >>>>> > > whatever >>>>> > > > > > > > > > experiences he undergoes he is bound to them. People >>>>> say >>>>> > > > > marriages >>>>> > > > > > > are >>>>> > > > > > > > > > made in heaven , I say every action and every >>>>> experience is >>>>> > > > > destined >>>>> > > > > > > > > > in heaven. In big things we are able to accept >>>>> bondage but in >>>>> > > > > small >>>>> > > > > > > > > > things we think we are free , we are able to accept >>>>> the >>>>> > > > > importance of >>>>> > > > > > > > > > our genes as also our environment , but our reason >>>>> finds it >>>>> > > hard >>>>> > > > > to >>>>> > > > > > > > > > understand and accept complete bondage.- Hide quoted >>>>> text - >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >>>>> > >>>>> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >>>>> > >>>>> > - Show quoted text - >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> ( >>> ) >>> I_D Allan >>> >>> Be Paranoid. >>> God is always building a better idiot!!! >>> >> >> > > > -- > ( > ) > I_D Allan > > Be Paranoid. > God is always building a better idiot!!! >
