> [Nick previously] > I purchased this land in the most peaceful way I know how. > > [Arlo] > Sooo close, Nick. By whose authority is that transaction valid? Why should I > recognize that "purchase" as legitimate? What makes it YOURS?
Nick: It's natural Arlo. It's a concept that has been understood before the government of the U.S. ever existed. I handed out a paper on this. I suggest you read it. > [Nick previously] > I can't change what happened in the past. If I could change it, then I would. > > [Arlo] > In other words, hey, I wasn't the person who killed the Indians > for this land, I just bought it from the murderer... but because I bought it > it is > now morally mine. Right. Nick: I didn't partake in the murderous actions. I wasn't even born yet. All the vices of people past can't be pin-pointed upon me. I did not consent to their actions. I would not have consented to their actions. I had no part in it. None. I can only control what I am capable of controlling presently on my own free-will. I will do peacefully what I can, but you can't tell me I did something when I wasn't even born. As I said, if I was here I would have advocated not to steal the Indians land. So you are bringing up a non-sequitur by saying I have partaken in something that I would have denounced on the spot. So you are veering off-course. But now you partake in stealing and murder. I do too by forking over to the government what is mine, but I am coerced to do so. But I am willingly to not do it anymore, but I fear for my life. You are not willingly to do so. Big difference. > [Nick] > It is not my fault what people did over 400 years ago. I wasn't alive. > > [Arlo] > Yet you still call your land "yours", despite the fact that it was > stolen. Give it back, Nick, be moral. Nick: I would not have stolen the land Arlo. I can not change what people did then. I would have advocated against it. You are going against what I would have done. You are talking about a fictional event by including me in something I would not have wanted to happen. I do what is within my free-will and I advocate for peace and seek justice. It is a long road to haul, but I had nothing to do with the Indians dying. Arlo you are throwing in a strawman. > [Nick] > Indians owned their land. It was their territory. > > [Arlo] > They saw the land as being given to their tribe. No one person "owned" a lake, > and could put a fence around it and keep others from swimming in it. In many > ways, our public parks are like this. Nick: Oh, really. So now you're the Indian expert? You speak for them? I simply know they had a homeland and defended it. It was theirs. Each person had a stake in their home. I don't know how they viewed another person coming into their tee-pee and stealing their bow. I don't think it would have been advocated. You don't know any of this Arlo. You're making it up as you go. > [Arlo] > Damn. And you were so close. Then you go posting nonsense like > this. "Property" > is not a natural right. It is an intellectual right conferred by civil > governance. Nick: No Arlo. The government didn't make up property rights. Humans did for thousands of years and have discussed it. It's not a new concept Arlo. Read the article I posted. It will help you learn. You are way off....lol You don't even understand how the government came into existence do you? It is clearly understood by the founders that individuals with reason gave consent and authorized the local states. Those local states gave consent over the federal government. The individuals even according to the U.S. government well-established due to the common sense of that time are the power and authority of the local states and of the federal government. This is why succession is in the Constitution Arlo. It is well understood that the individual(s) made the state and made the federal government so what the individuals made they can tear down. It is the individual(s) government and individuals can succeed and so can states. It's a known historical fact that was common sense back then but people today, like yourself, don't even understand natural rights so you are lost. Arlo: It was not until very recent in human times did people create a > civil governance that would allow "property". And it was a good thing. But it > was not "natural". So close, Nick, so close. Nick: It is natural. aka natural rights. Now read up and learn why they are called natural rights Arlo. You really don't understand what you are talking about and are seriously looking foolish. That's why they are called "natural" rights. Are you suggesting you will steal my land? I never stole anybody's land. -- I -- never did. Wow you need to read up on this stuff...lol > [Arlo] > Me look foolish? Haha. Funny. History is on my side here, maybe you > should read > more than one or two books, and you might learn a thing or two. Nick: They are called "natural" rights for a reason. Unless YOU are advocating stealing my land. Are you? > [Arlo] > You can call somewhere "home" without "owning" it. Property is not natural. In > fact, it is about as UN-natural as you can get. Nick: Ah, no Arlo. Home and property are the same thing. If you take my land, then it is called stealing. Based law Arlo....lol It's like talking to a kindergardener. lol I gave you an article now read up before you look even more foolish. Arlo: "How can you buy or sell the sky, the warmth of the land? The idea is strange > to us. If we do not own the freshness of the air and the sparkle of the water, > how can you buy them?" (Chief Seattle) Nick: It was strange to them. duh? But if you tried to invade them or steal a person horse don't you think they would try to stop you? duh? you idiot...lol > [Arlo] > No, its your food, your water and your shelter. You don't "own" them outside a > civil governance that recognizes this exclusive claim. Move to some > area in the > world that does not do this, say central Australia among the Aborignees, and > tell them "this is MY water", and they'll laugh at you. If someone else in the > tribe is thirsty, it would be an affront not to give it to them.. > because it is as much theirs as it is yours. Nick: duh!! You idiot of course. When there is plenty of water we share. I have well water and share the same water source with my neighbors. But they can't come in my house and say it's my water so I'm coming here anytime I want to drink it. Your pathetic you dummie. > [Nick previously] > You are coercing upon me the sufferings and pains of what criminals did to > these people centuries ago. > > [Arlo] > Well you have their stolen land. You bought it from a murder and a thief. Does > that make it okay? So if I kill you and steal your land and then sell it to > someone else, it should morally be theirs because they didn't do the killing? Nick: Arlo there is a time for reason. And you don't have it. Use some common sense you idiot. I didn't steal it and I wouldn't have if I was around. Since I said what I would have done, then I would have been liberty then as now. But you are at a time in your life when you CAN choose liberty and you don't. So you are more the fool. > [Arlo] > Gee... sounds to me like that's how you got your land in the first place. Nick: I didn't live around then Arlo. So how could "I" have gotten it that way in the first place. You're such a stupid fool. > [Arlo] > Nope. I am saying that your choice to be part of a civil infrastructure > requires you to pay your fair share to support it. Nick: And if I don't you advocate IPC. You have a choice for liberty now and you choose to steal and murder. Such a sadistic fool. > [Nick previously] > So you are advocating IPC against me because I believe in liberty. > > [Arlo] > Time for those meds again, Nick. Nick: Yeap you advocate IPC against me. I don't advocate it. If I was around back when the Indians were here then none of their land would have been stolen since you say I have a choice in this. So there. I would have solved it. My actions would have saved them. You don't know otherwise, but I do since I'm in your fiction world of non-sequitur. Nick -- Be Yourself @ mail.com! Choose From 200+ Email Addresses Get a Free Account at www.mail.com Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
