Hi Andre So until there is culture and language there is no experience? Sounds like nonsense to me. You and DMB are promoting idealism not a metaphysics of qualities. Is this what Pirsig really wants? At least you and DMB should say percepts and qualities are 100% conceptual and stop bluffing that you are not idealists, sure you add DQ to this idealism to stop your idealism being determinist or closed, but otherwise than that gain what exactly differentiates you guys from Hegel?
David M Andre <[email protected]> wrote: >DM to Andre: >I recognise tastes, colours, etc prior to concepts,... > >Andre: >No you don't! You must have learned the recognition and the distinction. >You have learned what is what. Re-read Pirsig's These are transmitted >culturally. Any taste, colour, smell (not part of your own culture) you >come across in another culture you will not recognize... you may search >for associations with possible recognitions but they will remain unknown >to you...until someone tells you, teaches you. And when you come across >the same a next time you may recognize it. > >In other words DQ has no percepts. Percepts are what you bring to >whatever you are experiencing. Hold on tight to your percepts and you >will get repetitions of experiences. > >DM: >if there are only concepts why ever mention qualities? Your position is >just nonsense. > >Andre: >Qualities are the 'base line'. And they are concepts too. Pirsig's MoQ >is a static intellectual pattern of values. > >Remember, it's analogies all the way down. By naming it 'Quality' he had >already crossed a line (as he admits). But you seem to be treating DQ as >though it is some kind of unspecified string of DNA. > >That, in my book is nonsense. >Moq_Discuss mailing list >Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >Archives: >http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >http://moq.org/md/archives.html Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
