Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

True, but if I leave the batteries in it for a long time and they leak, the GPS 
could be harmed.  The time to install the batteries is minimal compared to the 
time to obtain a fix. 

The handheld is 3rd or 4th down the list in terms of use. 

Dennis C.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 17, 2017, at 10:45 PM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Denis,
>  
> If you keep the GPS without the batteries, it would take longer to get the 
> first fix. Since the 76 is a fairly old device (I have a 76s for 12 years; if 
> I remember, it has only 24 MB of memory!) that first fix can take 15 minutes.
>  
> There is always a compromise.
>  
> Marek
>  
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. 
> via CnC-List
> Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2017 20:13
> To: CnClist 
> Cc: Dennis C. 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none
>  
> Wow!  A wide range of answers in this thread.
>  
> I have a Garmin 128 (text only display) below at the navstation, a 5 inch 
> charplotter at the helm.  The two are connected to a switch which feeds the 
> instruments, autosteerer and VHF (with AIS receive capability).  One of the 
> units is always "active".
>  
> I keep a Garmin 76 handheld in the navstation with fresh batteries in a 
> plastic bag.  Do not store batteries in the GPS.
>  
> I have a Samsung tablet with OpenCPN also for back up.  I have Navionics USA 
> on my iPhone.
>  
> I have the latest edition of MapTech's regional chartkit.  Great paper chart 
> compilation if available for your region.
>  
> If I was budget limited, I'd probably go with the tablet with OpenCPN or 
> Navionics or a used Garmin 182 and a chartkit.
>  
> In my opinion, paper charts are great if you can plot your position from and 
> old text only GPS rapidly.  Otherwise a chartplotter is the way to go.  
>  
> There are reasonable priced GPS units with few features available.  There are 
> lots of used ones on eBay.
>  
> Dennis C.
> Touche' 35-1 #83
> Mandeville, LA
>  
> On Sep 16, 2017 9:30 PM, "Chris Hobson via CnC-List"  
> wrote:
> We’re in Vancouver BC, Georgia Straight can get foggy, tides come and go and 
> we’re new at this. We have no GPS on our new to us 1981 C&C 30 and very 
> little in the way of navigation other than dead reckoning, basic familiarity 
> with the area and a compass at the helm. It’s fun because it’s like we just 
> purchased a 1981 C&C and technology isn’t around yet. However every sail is a 
> guessing game and I’d like to hear what others use for costal navigation. 
> Whether it’s real tangible maps, a GPS system you swear by or an iPad with 
> some software curious to hear what other C&C owners use to get find their way.
>  
> Chris Hobson
> S/V Going
> 1980 C&C MKI
> Hull 615
>  
>  
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
>  
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Ken Heaton via CnC-List]

"but if I leave the batteries in it for a long time and they leak, the GPS
could be harmed. "

However, Lithium AA batteries are relatively inexpensive and have a shelf
life of 10 years or so so you could leave a pair of those in the 76 and not
have to worry about it for years at a time.  I use the low self-discharge
rechargeable nickel–metal hydride battery (LSD NiMH) Panasonic Eneloop in
mine and keep two more pairs in the 12v changer when on trips.  These will
not leak either so they can stay in the 76Csx as long as I wish to leave
them there.

Ken H.

On 18 September 2017 at 08:13, Dennis C. via CnC-List  wrote:

> True, but if I leave the batteries in it for a long time and they leak,
> the GPS could be harmed.  The time to install the batteries is minimal
> compared to the time to obtain a fix.
>
> The handheld is 3rd or 4th down the list in terms of use.
>
> Dennis C.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 17, 2017, at 10:45 PM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Denis,
>
>
>
> If you keep the GPS without the batteries, it would take longer to get the
> first fix. Since the 76 is a fairly old device (I have a 76s for 12 years;
> if I remember, it has only 24 MB of memory!) that first fix can take 15
> minutes.
>
>
>
> There is always a compromise.
>
>
>
> Marek
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com
> ] *On Behalf Of *Dennis C. via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Sunday, September 17, 2017 20:13
> *To:* CnClist 
> *Cc:* Dennis C. 
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is
> none
>
>
>
> Wow!  A wide range of answers in this thread.
>
>
>
> I have a Garmin 128 (text only display) below at the navstation, a 5 inch
> charplotter at the helm.  The two are connected to a switch which feeds the
> instruments, autosteerer and VHF (with AIS receive capability).  One of the
> units is always "active".
>
>
>
> I keep a Garmin 76 handheld in the navstation with fresh batteries in a
> plastic bag.  Do not store batteries in the GPS.
>
>
>
> I have a Samsung tablet with OpenCPN also for back up.  I have Navionics
> USA on my iPhone.
>
>
>
> I have the latest edition of MapTech's regional chartkit.  Great paper
> chart compilation if available for your region.
>
>
>
> If I was budget limited, I'd probably go with the tablet with OpenCPN or
> Navionics or a used Garmin 182 and a chartkit.
>
>
>
> In my opinion, paper charts are great if you can plot your position from
> and old text only GPS rapidly.  Otherwise a chartplotter is the way to go.
>
>
>
> There are reasonable priced GPS units with few features available.  There
> are lots of used ones on eBay.
>
>
>
> Dennis C.
>
> Touche' 35-1 #83
>
> Mandeville, LA
>
>
>
> On Sep 16, 2017 9:30 PM, "Chris Hobson via CnC-List" <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> We’re in Vancouver BC, Georgia Straight can get foggy, tides come and go
> and we’re new at this. We have no GPS on our new to us 1981 C&C 30 and very
> little in the way of navigation other than dead reckoning, basic
> familiarity with the area and a compass at the helm. It’s fun because it’s
> like we just purchased a 1981 C&C and technology isn’t around yet. However
> every sail is a guessing game and I’d like to hear what others use for
> costal navigation. Whether it’s real tangible maps, a GPS system you swear
> by or an iPad with some software curious to hear what other C&C owners use
> to get find their way.
>
>
>
> Chris Hobson
>
> S/V Going
>
> 1980 C&C MKI
>
> Hull 615
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Danfoss Compressor Controller

[Edd Schillay via CnC-List]

Tom,

Awesome! Thanks!

All the best,

Edd

---
Edd M. Schillay
Captain of the Starship Enterprise 
C&C 37+ 
Sail Number: NCC-1701-B
City Island, New York
---
914.774.9767   | Mobile
---
Sent via iPhone 7
iPhone. iTypos. iApologize


On Sep 17, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List 
 wrote:

Edd

OK, I located the info. The deal is that it's not so much the manufacturer, but 
the compressor.  These Nova Kools have a Danfoss.  These 4-pin controllers work 
with them.  It got the lead  from the folks at Sure Marine. They could not help 
due to the age of our units.  But they did some research and came up with 
these.   Guess I caught em on a good day!

> Hi Tom,
> 
> The information David provided you is not completely accurate.
> The 4-pin Danfoss was used by a bunch of companies.
> it is definitely obsolete, but if you do a Google search, it appears that a 
> few people still have stock.
> 
> http://www.outbackmarine.com.au/null~1325
> 
> http://www.penguinfrigo.co.uk/shop/product/436/control-module-12v-dc4-pinfor-danfoss-bd3-earlier-compressors/
>  
> 
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Todd Glenn
> 
> *Sure Marine Service Inc.*
> (206) 784-9903
> (800) 562-7797
> Fax (206) 784-0506
> 
> t...@suremarine.com

They're the best.

Tom B

At 04:56 PM 9/17/2017, you wrote:
> --
> 
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Stus-List Gas solenoid

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

Sitting in mystic seaport this morning could not heat water ( bummer) because 
panel switch for propane kept clicking off. Solenoid replacement?  Looks pretty 
decrepit. Also what does lighted on/off gas switch under sink do?  

Sent from my iPhone
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List Gas solenoid

[Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List]

Hi David,
The lighted switch under the sink turns on/off the solenoid.  So, you need 
power to it from your panel switch, and you need the switch on to allow the 
solenoid to turn on the whole system.  Interesting that it keeps clicking off 
sounds like a short.  

You might want to turn off the switch under the sink and see if that keeps the 
circuit breaker from tripping.  

Thankfully the solenoids are not only cheap, they're readily available - I 
would try an RV store if there is one nearby.  Much cheaper than "marine".  

Good luck! Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net


  From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
 To: CnC CnC discussion list  
Cc: davidakne...@gmail.com
 Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 8:35 AM
 Subject: Stus-List Gas solenoid
   
Sitting in mystic seaport this morning could not heat water ( bummer) because 
panel switch for propane kept clicking off. Solenoid replacement?  Looks pretty 
decrepit. Also what does lighted on/off gas switch under sink do?  

Sent from my iPhone
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


   ___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List Danfoss Compressor Controller

[Ken Heaton via CnC-List]

Hi Edd,

If your existing refrigerator is powered by a Danfoss or Secop compressor
(BD35, BD50F and BD80F compressor) with one of the following controllers on
the side of the Compressor:

DC ONLY: 101N0210, 101N0320, 101N0400, 101N0410,  010-1153

AC & DC: 101N0500, 101N0600 and 101N0630


...which looks like this: http://www.swrefrigeration.com/photo/
pl13692115-danfoss_dc_compressor_danfoss_pistion_
protable_refeezer_compressor_bd_series.jpg

...you may want to look at the http://stainlesslobster.com/ Josh
recommended.  It seems to be the best solution currently out there.  And it
seems really easy to install, basically, Plug and Play.

Ken H.

On 18 September 2017 at 08:46, Edd Schillay via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Tom,
>
> Awesome! Thanks!
>
> All the best,
>
> Edd
>
> ---
> Edd M. Schillay
> Captain of the Starship Enterprise
> C&C 37+
> Sail Number: NCC-1701-B
> City Island, New York
> ---
> 914.774.9767 <(914)%20774-9767>   | Mobile
> ---
> Sent via iPhone 7
> iPhone. iTypos. iApologize
>
>
> On Sep 17, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Edd
>
> OK, I located the info. The deal is that it's not so much the
> manufacturer, but the compressor.  These Nova Kools have a Danfoss.  These
> 4-pin controllers work with them.  It got the lead  from the folks at Sure
> Marine. They could not help due to the age of our units.  But they did some
> research and came up with these.   Guess I caught em on a good day!
>
> Hi Tom,
>
> The information David provided you is not completely accurate.
> The 4-pin Danfoss was used by a bunch of companies.
> it is definitely obsolete, but if you do a Google search, it appears that
> a few people still have stock.
>
> http://www.outbackmarine.com.au/null~1325
>
> http://www.penguinfrigo.co.uk/shop/product/436/control-modul
> e-12v-dc4-pinfor-danfoss-bd3-earlier-compressors/
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Todd Glenn
>
> *Sure Marine Service Inc.*
> (206) 784-9903
> (800) 562-7797
> Fax (206) 784-0506
>
> t...@suremarine.com
>
>
> They're the best.
>
> Tom B
>
> At 04:56 PM 9/17/2017, you wrote:
>
> --
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Marek — thanks for the nice words!  I’m firmly of the belief that if you’re 
sailing ocean waters, you should have a permanently installed, dedicated nav 
system of some sort aboard, with a laptop or (more preferably) a waterproof 
handheld GPS as a backup.  We’ve had lots of discussions of the benefits of 
laptop or tablet-based nav systems on the list; but in my experience, those 
systems are prone to fail at the worst possible time, i.e. when the weather is 
really bad and the boat is getting beat up.  At those times, you really need 
reliable nav info at the helm, where you’re doing the driving; not down below.

There are a bunch of relatively inexpensive but decent plotters out there; most 
of them now have internal GPS antennas, so they’re very easy to install with a 
minimum of fuss.  With a smaller subset of these, you can move up a notch and 
expand the capabilities by adding a radome and/or networked data like 
instruments and AIS.  Many of these are still under $1000 to get into; and you 
can start with a basic system, then add things as you can afford them.

For those of you new to the list, I spent several years as an ABYC- and 
NMEA-certified marine electrician and electronics installer up in my sailing 
grounds, the upper Great Lakes.  I’ve kept my vendor relationships, and offer 
advice and design services to those on the list, along with marine electronics 
at dealer pricing.  If I can be of any further assistance, please email me on 
or off the list.

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On Sep 16, 2017, at 10:52 PM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Chris,
>  
> A handheld GPS, as probably a minimum.
>  
> There are very cost effective smallish chart plotters that you can get for 
> about $500 (or $750 with maps).
>  
> I like Garmin, as I have a long history with their devices. A GPSMAP 78s as a 
> handheld (a lot of older maps work on that model). Something like echoMAP 
> 55cv as a minimalist’s chart plotter.
>  
> If I were sailing around the Vancouver and Vancouver Island, I would make 
> sure that I have full access to map updates (buy a subscription).
>  
> A tablet with Navionics may be of help, but I don’t believe that any tablet 
> works even close to well compared to a dedicated marine chart plotter (when 
> considering the wet or sunny environment). If you will only use it down 
> below, they should work well.
>  
> OpenCPN is a great option, if you have the stomach to learn how to install it 
> and maintain it.
>  
> Having said all that, if you are serious about navigating there, you may want 
> to think of a comprehensive instrumentation (multiple devices working 
> together over a NMEA network). For help with that ask Fred (and follow his 
> advice).
>  
> Marek
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Chris 
> Hobson via CnC-List
> Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2017 21:29
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Chris Hobson 
> Subject: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none
>  
> We’re in Vancouver BC, Georgia Straight can get foggy, tides come and go and 
> we’re new at this. We have no GPS on our new to us 1981 C&C 30 and very 
> little in the way of navigation other than dead reckoning, basic familiarity 
> with the area and a compass at the helm. It’s fun because it’s like we just 
> purchased a 1981 C&C and technology isn’t around yet. However every sail is a 
> guessing game and I’d like to hear what others use for costal navigation. 
> Whether it’s real tangible maps, a GPS system you swear by or an iPad with 
> some software curious to hear what other C&C owners use to get find their way.
>  
> Chris Hobson
> S/V Going
> 1980 C&C MKI
> Hull 615
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Oh, and I forgot to mention: as far as electronic charts go, all of the 
Raymarine plotters can be ordered with Navionics+ North America chips at a very 
reasonable cost; these charts are complete for BOTH US and Canadian waters, 
both coastal and inland.  I think the new Axiom 7” plotters from Raymarine are 
a particularly good value; fast new processors, the latest operating software 
and very attractive prices.

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 8:53 AM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Marek — thanks for the nice words!  I’m firmly of the belief that if you’re 
> sailing ocean waters, you should have a permanently installed, dedicated nav 
> system of some sort aboard, with a laptop or (more preferably) a waterproof 
> handheld GPS as a backup.  We’ve had lots of discussions of the benefits of 
> laptop or tablet-based nav systems on the list; but in my experience, those 
> systems are prone to fail at the worst possible time, i.e. when the weather 
> is really bad and the boat is getting beat up.  At those times, you really 
> need reliable nav info at the helm, where you’re doing the driving; not down 
> below.
> 
> There are a bunch of relatively inexpensive but decent plotters out there; 
> most of them now have internal GPS antennas, so they’re very easy to install 
> with a minimum of fuss.  With a smaller subset of these, you can move up a 
> notch and expand the capabilities by adding a radome and/or networked data 
> like instruments and AIS.  Many of these are still under $1000 to get into; 
> and you can start with a basic system, then add things as you can afford them.
> 
> For those of you new to the list, I spent several years as an ABYC- and 
> NMEA-certified marine electrician and electronics installer up in my sailing 
> grounds, the upper Great Lakes.  I’ve kept my vendor relationships, and offer 
> advice and design services to those on the list, along with marine 
> electronics at dealer pricing.  If I can be of any further assistance, please 
> email me on or off the list.
> 
> — Fred
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Randal Stafford via CnC-List]

Listers-

I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
to share.

When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t have 
enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though my 
other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled the 
batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 volts and 
83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% and 12.9 
volts.

So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
hypotheses.

Thanks in Advance,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C&C 301- #7
Ken Caryl, CO
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[John Irvin via CnC-List]

Check the fuel bowl for sediment.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 10:30 AM, Randal Stafford via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Listers-
> 
> I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
> to share.
> 
> When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
> then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
> flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
> ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
> started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
> out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
> couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
> happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t 
> have enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though 
> my other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled 
> the batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 
> volts and 83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% 
> and 12.9 volts.
> 
> So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
> circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
> as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
> start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
> step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
> hypotheses.
> 
> Thanks in Advance,
> Randy Stafford
> S/V Grenadine
> C&C 301- #7
> Ken Caryl, CO
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

I would jump over to the Moyer Marine forum for this.
http://www.moyermarine.com/

Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I


-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Randal 
Stafford via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 10:30 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Randal Stafford 
Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

Listers-

I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
to share.

When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t have 
enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though my 
other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled the 
batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 volts and 
83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% and 12.9 
volts.

So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
hypotheses.

Thanks in Advance,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C&C 301- #7
Ken Caryl, CO
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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Danfoss Compressor Controller

[Edd Schillay via CnC-List]

Ken,

The compressor doesn’t look 100% like that, but it’s close. 

Nova Kool says they haven’t sold the unit in 25 years, and has no explanation 
about the lights. They sell replacement thermostats without LEDs, but I kinda 
like the LED so I can see if the thing is actually powered and running without 
going into the aft cabin, closing the door, etc., etc.

They also say it uses “Refrigerant 12”, which is no longer available, but I may 
not need it anyway since it appears the unit is cooling. I’ll have to do some 
more tests to know for sure, I guess. 

The Stainless Lobster looks pretty cool, but like its crustacean namesake, 
pretty damn pricey! Before I lay out $250 on a maybe, I need to determine 
whether or not I’ll need to swap out the entire unit for something AC/DC and 
probably more efficient. 

And then, of course, weigh that against just buying a $3.00 bag of ice when I 
need it.  

All the best,

Edd


Edd M. Schillay
Starship Enterprise
C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
City Island, NY 
Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 






> On Sep 18, 2017, at 9:45 AM, Ken Heaton via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi Edd,
> 
> If your existing refrigerator is powered by a Danfoss or Secop compressor 
> (BD35, BD50F and BD80F compressor) with one of the following controllers on 
> the side of the Compressor:
> 
> DC ONLY: 101N0210, 101N0320, 101N0400, 101N0410,  010-1153
> 
> AC & DC: 101N0500, 101N0600 and 101N0630
> 
> ...which looks like this: 
> http://www.swrefrigeration.com/photo/pl13692115-danfoss_dc_compressor_danfoss_pistion_protable_refeezer_compressor_bd_series.jpg
>  
> 
> 
> ...you may want to look at the http://stainlesslobster.com/ 
>  Josh recommended.  It seems to be the best 
> solution currently out there.  And it seems really easy to install, 
> basically, Plug and Play.
> 
> Ken H.
> 
> On 18 September 2017 at 08:46, Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
> mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> Tom,
> 
> Awesome! Thanks!
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Edd
> 
> ---
> Edd M. Schillay
> Captain of the Starship Enterprise 
> C&C 37+ 
> Sail Number: NCC-1701-B
> City Island, New York
> ---
> 914.774.9767| Mobile
> ---
> Sent via iPhone 7
> iPhone. iTypos. iApologize
> 
> 
> On Sep 17, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List 
> mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> 
> Edd
> 
> OK, I located the info. The deal is that it's not so much the manufacturer, 
> but the compressor.  These Nova Kools have a Danfoss.  These 4-pin 
> controllers work with them.  It got the lead  from the folks at Sure Marine. 
> They could not help due to the age of our units.  But they did some research 
> and came up with these.   Guess I caught em on a good day!
> 
>> Hi Tom,
>> 
>> The information David provided you is not completely accurate.
>> The 4-pin Danfoss was used by a bunch of companies.
>> it is definitely obsolete, but if you do a Google search, it appears that a 
>> few people still have stock.
>> 
>> http://www.outbackmarine.com.au/null~1325 
>> 
>> 
>> http://www.penguinfrigo.co.uk/shop/product/436/control-module-12v-dc4-pinfor-danfoss-bd3-earlier-compressors/
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> Kind regards,
>> 
>> Todd Glenn
>> 
>> *Sure Marine Service Inc.*
>> (206) 784-9903 
>> (800) 562-7797 
>> Fax (206) 784-0506 
>> 
>> t...@suremarine.com 
> They're the best.
> 
> Tom B
> 
> At 04:56 PM 9/17/2017, you wrote:
>> --
>> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
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Stus-List Garhauer Story...

[David via CnC-List]

So I have been volunteering at the Marion-Bermuda Race for the past 10 years or 
so and the booth that is located right across from ours is Garhauer.  I would 
see folks manning the booth but was usually too busy to think much more of it 
as we were busy fielding our own visitors.

Well this past Sunday I find myself talking with a gentleman at our booth that 
was from Garhauer and it was Guido!  We had a nice conversation about how the 
company started and I thought you might appreciate the great story he conveyed.

They started the company in 1971 and the name Garhauer is a compilation of the 
first half of Guido’s last name and the last half of Bill’s (the other founder) 
last name.
Bill was in tooling and Guido in engineering at another non-marine company when 
they started talking about starting their own company.  Not knowing what 
product line to manufacture they started to look around at opportunities.  Bill 
owned a sailboat and they looked critically at its hardware and the market.

So…they amble over to MacGregor yachts and in the middle of a parking lot full 
of boats on trailers they were approached by a gentleman who asked if they 
needed help.  They asked to speak with Roger MacGregor.  Well that gentleman 
was Roger MacGregor!   After talking about why they were there, Roger invited 
them back to his office.

Roger showed them the mast cradle used when the mast was stepped for trailering 
(it was inserted into the gudgeons) and asked them for an estimate.  They gave 
him one on the spot and Roger ordered 200 units right there.   That started 
them on their path to become a vendor of most of the boat manufactures in the 
Costa Mesa area for years to come.

Whereas in the past manufacturers was their primary customer and the retail 
customer a small piece.  Presently the inverse, not surprisingly, is now true.

Guido is a very nice man and I was sure to enthusiastically convey all your C & 
C accolades of his great customer service and products.





Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Paul Fountain via CnC-List]

Check the internal walls of your fuel line is not collapsing - had this on a 
friends C&C 29 a few years back - 

-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Randal 
Stafford via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 10:30 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Randal Stafford 
Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

Listers-

I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
to share.

When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t have 
enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though my 
other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled the 
batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 volts and 
83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% and 12.9 
volts.

So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
hypotheses.

Thanks in Advance,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C&C 301- #7
Ken Caryl, CO
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Garhauer Story...

[John Irvin via CnC-List]

Thanks for posting this.

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 18, 2017, at 10:47 AM, David via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

So I have been volunteering at the Marion-Bermuda Race for the past 10 years or 
so and the booth that is located right across from ours is Garhauer.  I would 
see folks manning the booth but was usually too busy to think much more of it 
as we were busy fielding our own visitors.

Well this past Sunday I find myself talking with a gentleman at our booth that 
was from Garhauer and it was Guido!  We had a nice conversation about how the 
company started and I thought you might appreciate the great story he conveyed.

They started the company in 1971 and the name Garhauer is a compilation of the 
first half of Guido’s last name and the last half of Bill’s (the other founder) 
last name.
Bill was in tooling and Guido in engineering at another non-marine company when 
they started talking about starting their own company.  Not knowing what 
product line to manufacture they started to look around at opportunities.  Bill 
owned a sailboat and they looked critically at its hardware and the market.

So…they amble over to MacGregor yachts and in the middle of a parking lot full 
of boats on trailers they were approached by a gentleman who asked if they 
needed help.  They asked to speak with Roger MacGregor.  Well that gentleman 
was Roger MacGregor!   After talking about why they were there, Roger invited 
them back to his office.

Roger showed them the mast cradle used when the mast was stepped for trailering 
(it was inserted into the gudgeons) and asked them for an estimate.  They gave 
him one on the spot and Roger ordered 200 units right there.   That started 
them on their path to become a vendor of most of the boat manufactures in the 
Costa Mesa area for years to come.

Whereas in the past manufacturers was their primary customer and the retail 
customer a small piece.  Presently the inverse, not surprisingly, is now true.

Guido is a very nice man and I was sure to enthusiastically convey all your C & 
C accolades of his great customer service and products.





Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[jackbrennan via CnC-List]

Of course, the caveat to all of this is that,  depending on where you sail, 
even up-to-date charts can be anywhere from mildly off to wildly and 
dangerously inaccurate.

In the Keys and South and West Florida, where sand shifts all of the time, 
TowboatUS and Seatow do a fine business from boaters blindly following their 
chartplotters. Many inlets and channels in West Florida have nasty, uncharted 
sandbars.

After Irma, forget about it. Who knows what's where? You could go aground on a 
sunken boat.

Depth sounders and the ability to read water are more valuable navigation tools 
in places like this. I like paper charts because you get a bigger view. A GPS 
is wonderful for confirming that you are where you think you are. 

Still, I get the allure of all that gear. I crewed on a friend's catamaran to 
Fantasy Fest in Key West last fall. His electronics were several times more 
valuable than many of our boats.

I felt like I was on the con of the Starship Enterprise. Especially when we hit 
warp speed (10+ knots). The only thing the electronics couldn't do was spot 
crab pots at night. :)

Jack Brennan
Former C&C 25
Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
Tierra Verde, Fl.










Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Tab®|PRO

 Original message 
From: Frederick G Street via CnC-List  
Date:09/18/2017  10:14 AM  (GMT-05:00) 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Frederick G Street  
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none 


___

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Stus-List Water heaters

[Glenn Gambel via CnC-List]

I am contemplating replacing my 6 gallon Raritan hot water heater with 
heat exchanger with an Atwood/Whale 6 gallon hot water heater with heat 
exchanger.  I could get a new Raritan for in the neighborhood of 800 
dollars or a new Atwood for around 300 dollars.  Wonder what other's 
experience in this area may be???  Would appreciate any feedback.


Glenn Gambel
Wind N Spirits, 1981 C&C 36___

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Re: Stus-List Water heaters

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

I replaced an Atwood with an Atwood.  The cheapest place was an RV dealer!

Joel


Virus-free.
www.avg.com

<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 11:10 AM, Glenn Gambel via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I am contemplating replacing my 6 gallon Raritan hot water heater with
> heat exchanger with an Atwood/Whale 6 gallon hot water heater with heat
> exchanger.  I could get a new Raritan for in the neighborhood of 800
> dollars or a new Atwood for around 300 dollars.  Wonder what other's
> experience in this area may be???  Would appreciate any feedback.
>
> Glenn Gambel
> Wind N Spirits, 1981 C&C 36
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>


-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[David Kaseler via CnC-List]

Jack I agree with all you say.
Dave.
1975 C&C 33
SLY

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 8:33 AM, jackbrennan via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Of course, the caveat to all of this is that,  depending on where you sail, 
> even up-to-date charts can be anywhere from mildly off to wildly and 
> dangerously inaccurate.
> 
> In the Keys and South and West Florida, where sand shifts all of the time, 
> TowboatUS and Seatow do a fine business from boaters blindly following their 
> chartplotters. Many inlets and channels in West Florida have nasty, uncharted 
> sandbars.
> 
> After Irma, forget about it. Who knows what's where? You could go aground on 
> a sunken boat.
> 
> Depth sounders and the ability to read water are more valuable navigation 
> tools in places like this. I like paper charts because you get a bigger view. 
> A GPS is wonderful for confirming that you are where you think you are. 
> 
> Still, I get the allure of all that gear. I crewed on a friend's catamaran to 
> Fantasy Fest in Key West last fall. His electronics were several times more 
> valuable than many of our boats.
> 
> I felt like I was on the con of the Starship Enterprise. Especially when we 
> hit warp speed (10+ knots). The only thing the electronics couldn't do was 
> spot crab pots at night. :)
> 
> Jack Brennan
> Former C&C 25
> Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
> Tierra Verde, Fl.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Tab®|PRO
> 
> 
>  Original message 
> From: Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
> Date:09/18/2017 10:14 AM (GMT-05:00) 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Frederick G Street 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

I agree with Jack, as well; but the original post was sent by a person who 
sails in the Vancouver Island area, which has far less shifting sand and far 
more immovable rock…   :^)

Any electronic device is not a replacement for good seamanship and piloting — 
but it can definitely be of great help when the wether goes bad or it’s dark 
out.  You still have a responsibility for keeping proper lookout, and for 
double-checking your position.

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:22 AM, David Kaseler via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Jack I agree with all you say.
> Dave.
> 1975 C&C 33
> SLY
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 8:33 AM, jackbrennan via CnC-List  > wrote:
> 
>> Of course, the caveat to all of this is that,  depending on where you sail, 
>> even up-to-date charts can be anywhere from mildly off to wildly and 
>> dangerously inaccurate.
>> 
>> In the Keys and South and West Florida, where sand shifts all of the time, 
>> TowboatUS and Seatow do a fine business from boaters blindly following their 
>> chartplotters. Many inlets and channels in West Florida have nasty, 
>> uncharted sandbars.
>> 
>> After Irma, forget about it. Who knows what's where? You could go aground on 
>> a sunken boat.
>> 
>> Depth sounders and the ability to read water are more valuable navigation 
>> tools in places like this. I like paper charts because you get a bigger 
>> view. A GPS is wonderful for confirming that you are where you think you 
>> are. 
>> 
>> Still, I get the allure of all that gear. I crewed on a friend's catamaran 
>> to Fantasy Fest in Key West last fall. His electronics were several times 
>> more valuable than many of our boats.
>> 
>> I felt like I was on the con of the Starship Enterprise. Especially when we 
>> hit warp speed (10+ knots). The only thing the electronics couldn't do was 
>> spot crab pots at night. :)
>> 
>> Jack Brennan
>> Former C&C 25
>> Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
>> Tierra Verde, Fl.

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Stus-List Factory Direct RIB

[Danny Haughey via CnC-List]

Hello all,

I'm considering ordering a RIB factory direct and want to throw the idea 
out there and if there were any opinions on the topic.


So, a 10ish foot PVC tube, Aluminum hull is about $900 and about $300 
hundred to ship to Boston.  I'm not completely convinced on the aluminum 
solution and may stick with Fiberglass.


These look like the same boats sold under various names, North Atlantic, 
Coastal, Highfield  all of which were offering a 10ish footer at the 
boat show for $2000.


The $893 boat is for 0.9MM 16 inch tubes.  I'm also asking for the 1.2MM 
fabric quote.  One company only upped the price by $65 for the heavier 
fabric


Anyone have any thoughts?

Anyone interested in buying a rib this way?

One nice thing is that they have started offering the tube cover or 
Dinghy chaps right from the factory.


I was considering ordering a full package including a trailer.

So far I've got a price for;

Boat, aluminum hull no bow locker $893 plus $90 for the bow locker
Chaps $80
Boat Cover $30
Trailer $560
SubTotal $1563
Shipping Approx $500 (adding over $200 beyond the quote to cover 
whatever...)

total $2063

So, for the price of the boat at the show, I could get all the extras 
shipped to Boston.  Price on the trailer is pretty good given it is the 
roller type not the bunk style.  I can get the bunk type locally for $699.


The trickiest part is the shipping.  I'm not quite sure how that all 
works and how I'd receive the shipment.


Do I have to go to the docks and get it?

Anyway, it's my frugal self trying to get a deal!  The shipping is the 
only savings if ordering more than one so not a deal breaker either way 
in my opinion.


Danny


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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Danny Haughey via CnC-List]

depending on how much cranking you did, could be hydro locked? pull the 
plugs and see how they look and hope you don't get water out.


I did have an issue with a bad wire to the coil.  it seemed the wire 
would heat up and beak the connection somehow after running a bit and 
then allow it to start again after it cooled a while.  I replaced the 
wire and it did the trick.


Danny


On 9/18/2017 10:37 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote:

I would jump over to the Moyer Marine forum for this.
http://www.moyermarine.com/

Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I


-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Randal 
Stafford via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 10:30 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Randal Stafford 
Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

Listers-

I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
to share.

When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t have 
enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though my 
other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled the 
batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 volts and 
83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% and 12.9 
volts.

So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
hypotheses.

Thanks in Advance,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C&C 301- #7
Ken Caryl, CO
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!



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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Jim Reinardy via CnC-List]

 
When I owned an Atomic 4, I was told to close the water intake when cranking 
the engine for more than a few seconds because the waterways in the block were 
open at the top and would splash into the oil sump under heavy cranking.  After 
a number of initial problems with water in the oil, this cleared things up, so 
I always believed it.  
 
I had a similar issue with that engine cutting out.  In that case the issue was 
a hairline crack in the rotor in the distributor.  When it heated up enough, it 
would distort and no longer make proper contact with the points.  
 
I sold that boat to buy my 30-2 with a Yanmar and have never regretted it!  
Diesels have their own challenges, but it just seems like there is a lot more 
to wrong with an A4.
 
Jim Reinardy
C&C 30-2 "FIrewater"
Milwaukee, WI 
- Original Message - Subject: Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
From: "Danny Haughey via CnC-List" 
Date: 9/18/17 10:14 am
To: "Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List" 
Cc: "Danny Haughey" 

depending on how much cranking you did, could be hydro locked? pull the 
 plugs and see how they look and hope you don't get water out.
 
 I did have an issue with a bad wire to the coil.  it seemed the wire 
 would heat up and beak the connection somehow after running a bit and 
 then allow it to start again after it cooled a while.  I replaced the 
 wire and it did the trick.
 
 Danny
 
 
 On 9/18/2017 10:37 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote:
 > I would jump over to the Moyer Marine forum for this.
 > http://www.moyermarine.com/
 >
 > Joe
 > Coquina
 > C&C 35 MK I
 >
 >
 > -Original Message-
 > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Randal 
 > Stafford via CnC-List
 > Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 10:30 AM
 > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 > Cc: Randal Stafford 
 > Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
 >
 > Listers-
 >
 > I'm having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some 
 > thoughts to share.
 >
 > When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always. But 
 > then she cut out heading away from the marina. Initially I suspected a fuel 
 > flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn. After 
 > ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
 > started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes. Then she cut 
 > out again, and wouldn't start back up after some cranking. I sailed for a 
 > couple hours anyway. When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
 > happened when I pressed the starter button. I assumed my batteries didn't 
 > have enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, 
 > though my other electronics were running fine. So I docked under sail power, 
 > pulled the batteries, and brought them home to charge. They both tested at 
 > 12.7 volts and 83% charge when I put them on my charger. Now they're both at 
 > 100% and 12.9 volts.
 >
 > So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
 > circuit. Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
 > as pushing in the ignition switch. I've yet to get into the lazarette and 
 > start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that's my next 
 > step. I thought I'd write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
 > hypotheses.
 >
 > Thanks in Advance,
 > Randy Stafford
 > S/V Grenadine
 > C&C 301- #7
 > Ken Caryl, CO
 > ___
 >
 > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
 > to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
 > https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 >
 > All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
 > ___
 >
 > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
 > to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
 > https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 >
 > All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
 
 
 ___
 
 This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 
 All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Water heaters

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

I rebuilt my Raritan.  I don't completely understand why the price is so
high but the company is quite proud of their product being "glass lined"?

Here are rebuild pics:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/18AwfYQFWmm_r8VMKbZRgmPyw5YklmfCltHQ_c7MdcjQ/edit?usp=drivesdk

I replaced all the insulation AND included a flush manifold and themal
mixing valve.


Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD


On Sep 18, 2017 11:28 AM, "Glenn Gambel via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> I am contemplating replacing my 6 gallon Raritan hot water heater with
> heat exchanger with an Atwood/Whale 6 gallon hot water heater with heat
> exchanger.  I could get a new Raritan for in the neighborhood of 800
> dollars or a new Atwood for around 300 dollars.  Wonder what other's
> experience in this area may be???  Would appreciate any feedback.
>
> Glenn Gambel
> Wind N Spirits, 1981 C&C 36
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Water heaters

[Edd Schillay via CnC-List]

Josh,

Your rebuild photos look a lot like a limited release of liability document for 
your charter company. 

Do you make your passengers sign your hot water tank? :-) 

All the best,

Edd


Edd M. Schillay
Starship Enterprise
C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
City Island, NY 
Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 





> On Sep 18, 2017, at 1:45 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I rebuilt my Raritan.  I don't completely understand why the price is so high 
> but the company is quite proud of their product being "glass lined"?
> 
> Here are rebuild pics:
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/18AwfYQFWmm_r8VMKbZRgmPyw5YklmfCltHQ_c7MdcjQ/edit?usp=drivesdk
>  
> 
> 
> I replaced all the insulation AND included a flush manifold and themal mixing 
> valve.
> 
> 
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD 
> 
> 
> On Sep 18, 2017 11:28 AM, "Glenn Gambel via CnC-List"  > wrote:
> I am contemplating replacing my 6 gallon Raritan hot water heater with heat 
> exchanger with an Atwood/Whale 6 gallon hot water heater with heat exchanger. 
>  I could get a new Raritan for in the neighborhood of 800 dollars or a new 
> Atwood for around 300 dollars.  Wonder what other's experience in this area 
> may be???  Would appreciate any feedback.  
> 
> Glenn Gambel
> Wind N Spirits, 1981 C&C 36
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Water heaters

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Shit... Thanks Edd.  It wad just a test to see who would follow my link!
Haha

Try these.

https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B8pEh5lnvP1ydEpoMU1MWmx6Qms

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD

On Sep 18, 2017 1:51 PM, "Edd Schillay via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> Josh,
>
> Your rebuild photos look a lot like a limited release of liability
> document for your charter company.
>
> Do you make your passengers sign your hot water tank? :-)
>
> All the best,
>
> Edd
>
>
> Edd M. Schillay
> Starship Enterprise
> C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
> City Island, NY
> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 1:45 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> I rebuilt my Raritan.  I don't completely understand why the price is so
> high but the company is quite proud of their product being "glass lined"?
>
> Here are rebuild pics:
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/18AwfYQFWmm_r8VMKbZRgmPyw5YklmfCltHQ_
> c7MdcjQ/edit?usp=drivesdk
>
> I replaced all the insulation AND included a flush manifold and themal
> mixing valve.
>
>
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
>
>
> On Sep 18, 2017 11:28 AM, "Glenn Gambel via CnC-List" <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> I am contemplating replacing my 6 gallon Raritan hot water heater with
>> heat exchanger with an Atwood/Whale 6 gallon hot water heater with heat
>> exchanger.  I could get a new Raritan for in the neighborhood of 800
>> dollars or a new Atwood for around 300 dollars.  Wonder what other's
>> experience in this area may be???  Would appreciate any feedback.
>>
>> Glenn Gambel
>> Wind N Spirits, 1981 C&C 36
>>
>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Water heaters

[Ken Heaton via CnC-List]

We have one of these.  It seems fine.  Ours may be a 20 gallon, I'm not
sure.  Stainless Steel casing, Aluminium Tank.  Made in the USA apparently,
North Carolina?

http://us.binnacle.com/m101/Kuuma-Grills-&-Water-Heaters/p3467/Kuuma-11-Gallon-Hot-Water-Heater-Front-Heat-Exchange/product_info.html

Ken H.


On 18 September 2017 at 15:08, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Shit... Thanks Edd.  It wad just a test to see who would follow my link!
> Haha
>
> Try these.
>
> https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B8pEh5lnvP1ydEpoMU1MWmx6Qms
>
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
>
> On Sep 18, 2017 1:51 PM, "Edd Schillay via CnC-List" <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Josh,
>>
>> Your rebuild photos look a lot like a limited release of liability
>> document for your charter company.
>>
>> Do you make your passengers sign your hot water tank? :-)
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> Edd
>>
>>
>> Edd M. Schillay
>> Starship Enterprise
>> C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
>> City Island, NY
>> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sep 18, 2017, at 1:45 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>> I rebuilt my Raritan.  I don't completely understand why the price is so
>> high but the company is quite proud of their product being "glass lined"?
>>
>> Here are rebuild pics:
>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/18AwfYQFWmm_r8VMKbZRgmPyw
>> 5YklmfCltHQ_c7MdcjQ/edit?usp=drivesdk
>>
>> I replaced all the insulation AND included a flush manifold and themal
>> mixing valve.
>>
>>
>> Josh Muckley
>> S/V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C&C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>>
>>
>> On Sep 18, 2017 11:28 AM, "Glenn Gambel via CnC-List" <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I am contemplating replacing my 6 gallon Raritan hot water heater with
>>> heat exchanger with an Atwood/Whale 6 gallon hot water heater with heat
>>> exchanger.  I could get a new Raritan for in the neighborhood of 800
>>> dollars or a new Atwood for around 300 dollars.  Wonder what other's
>>> experience in this area may be???  Would appreciate any feedback.
>>>
>>> Glenn Gambel
>>> Wind N Spirits, 1981 C&C 36
>>>
>>> ___
>>>
>>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
>>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>>
>>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>>
>>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Stus-List 2018 C&C Northeast Rendezvous -- Please Take our Survey

[Edd Schillay via CnC-List]

Listers,

Please take our short online survey regarding the 2018 C&C Rendezvous in Port 
Jefferson, NY — https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/QZ2S52J 
 

The sooner we obtain information, the sooner we can lock down dates, marinas, 
restaurants etc. 

Port Jefferson was selected due to its mid-Sound location and easy access for 
those who won’t come by boat (Long Island Expressway or Bridgeport Ferry). We 
are thinking Danford's Hotel Marina and Spa, but possibly also moorings at Port 
Jeff Yacht Club for those who don’t want to shell out “big bucks” for a slip. 

Great choice of restaurants, great hotel for those coming by car, and a 
well-protected harbor. 

Rendezvous “Movie Teaser” — https://youtu.be/OxOu2Ciucy0 
 

All the best,

Edd


Edd M. Schillay
Starship Enterprise
C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
City Island, NY 
Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 







___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Randy Stafford via CnC-List]

Thanks Danny and Jim.  I registered on the Moyer Marine forum and will post the 
question there as well.

I doubt I cranked it enough to hydro-lock it.  When it cut out the last time, I 
cranked it twice for maybe five or six seconds each time.  Enough to suck fuel 
through if necessary, but no more.  There’s no point in continuing to crank, I 
figure, and risk running the batteries down.  If it won’t start in a few 
seconds of cranking then something is wrong.

But I didn’t know about the hydro-locking potential.  I’ll change the oil and 
pull the plugs and see what it looks like.

But even hydro-locking wouldn’t explain why the starter wouldn’t operate when I 
pushed the starter button the last time and nothing happened.  I’m inclined to 
suspect one or more faulty circuits.

Cheers,
Randy

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:36 AM, Jim Reinardy via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> When I owned an Atomic 4, I was told to close the water intake when cranking 
> the engine for more than a few seconds because the waterways in the block 
> were open at the top and would splash into the oil sump under heavy cranking. 
>  After a number of initial problems with water in the oil, this cleared 
> things up, so I always believed it.  
>  
> I had a similar issue with that engine cutting out.  In that case the issue 
> was a hairline crack in the rotor in the distributor.  When it heated up 
> enough, it would distort and no longer make proper contact with the points.  
>  
> I sold that boat to buy my 30-2 with a Yanmar and have never regretted it!  
> Diesels have their own challenges, but it just seems like there is a lot more 
> to wrong with an A4.
>  
> Jim Reinardy
> C&C 30-2 "FIrewater"
> Milwaukee, WI 
> - Original Message -
> Subject: Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
> From: "Danny Haughey via CnC-List" 
> Date: 9/18/17 10:14 am
> To: "Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List" 
> Cc: "Danny Haughey" 
> 
> depending on how much cranking you did, could be hydro locked? pull the 
> plugs and see how they look and hope you don't get water out.
> 
> I did have an issue with a bad wire to the coil.  it seemed the wire 
> would heat up and beak the connection somehow after running a bit and 
> then allow it to start again after it cooled a while.  I replaced the 
> wire and it did the trick.
> 
> Danny
> 
> 
> On 9/18/2017 10:37 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote:
> > I would jump over to the Moyer Marine forum for this.
> > http://www.moyermarine.com/
> >
> > Joe
> > Coquina
> > C&C 35 MK I
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Randal 
> > Stafford via CnC-List
> > Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 10:30 AM
> > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> > Cc: Randal Stafford 
> > Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
> >
> > Listers-
> >
> > I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some 
> > thoughts to share.
> >
> > When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always. But 
> > then she cut out heading away from the marina. Initially I suspected a fuel 
> > flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn. 
> > After ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, 
> > she started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes. Then she 
> > cut out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking. I sailed for 
> > a couple hours anyway. When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
> > happened when I pressed the starter button. I assumed my batteries didn’t 
> > have enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, 
> > though my other electronics were running fine. So I docked under sail 
> > power, pulled the batteries, and brought them home to charge. They both 
> > tested at 12.7 volts and 83% charge when I put them on my charger. Now 
> > they’re both at 100% and 12.9 volts.
> >
> > So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
> > circuit. Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same 
> > effect as pushing in the ignition switch. I’ve yet to get into the 
> > lazarette and start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but 
> > that’s my next step. I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone 
> > has any quick hypotheses.
> >
> > Thanks in Advance,
> > Randy Stafford
> > S/V Grenadine
> > C&C 301- #7
> > Ken Caryl, CO
> > ___
> >
> > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you 
> > wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
> > https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> >
> > All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> > ___
> >
> > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you 
> > wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
> > https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> >
> > All Contributions are greatly appreciated

Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Danny Haughey via CnC-List]

the guy sitting in the office next to me just went through this on his 
powerboat with a V8. He said the same thing and thought it had to be the 
starter.  I guess the starter will push against the locked engine and 
stay there.  Then it has no where to go and is all stuck.  He pulled his 
plugs and got water out.



On 9/18/2017 2:44 PM, Randy Stafford via CnC-List wrote:
Thanks Danny and Jim.  I registered on the Moyer Marine forum and will 
post the question there as well.


I doubt I cranked it enough to hydro-lock it.  When it cut out the 
last time, I cranked it twice for maybe five or six seconds each time. 
 Enough to suck fuel through if necessary, but no more.  There’s no 
point in continuing to crank, I figure, and risk running the batteries 
down.  If it won’t start in a few seconds of cranking then something 
is wrong.


But I didn’t know about the hydro-locking potential.  I’ll change the 
oil and pull the plugs and see what it looks like.


But even hydro-locking wouldn’t explain why the starter wouldn’t 
operate when I pushed the starter button the last time and nothing 
happened.  I’m inclined to suspect one or more faulty circuits.


Cheers,
Randy

On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:36 AM, Jim Reinardy via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


When I owned an Atomic 4, I was told to close the water intake when 
cranking the engine for more than a few seconds because the waterways 
in the block were open at the top and would splash into the oil sump 
under heavy cranking.  After a number of initial problems with water 
in the oil, this cleared things up, so I always believed it.
I had a similar issue with that engine cutting out.  In that case the 
issue was a hairline crack in the rotor in the distributor.  When it 
heated up enough, it would distort and no longer make proper contact 
with the points.
I sold that boat to buy my 30-2 with a Yanmar and have never 
regretted it!  Diesels have their own challenges, but it just seems 
like there is a lot more to wrong with an A4.

Jim Reinardy
C&C 30-2 "FIrewater"
Milwaukee, WI

- Original Message -
Subject: Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
From: "Danny Haughey via CnC-List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Date: 9/18/17 10:14 am
To: "Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Cc: "Danny Haughey" mailto:djhaug...@juno.com>>

depending on how much cranking you did, could be hydro locked?
pull the
plugs and see how they look and hope you don't get water out.

I did have an issue with a bad wire to the coil.  it seemed the wire
would heat up and beak the connection somehow after running a bit
and
then allow it to start again after it cooled a while. I replaced the
wire and it did the trick.

Danny


On 9/18/2017 10:37 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote:
> I would jump over to the Moyer Marine forum for this.
> http://www.moyermarine.com/
>
> Joe
> Coquina
> C&C 35 MK I
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf
Of Randal Stafford via CnC-List
> Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 10:30 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Randal Stafford mailto:randy.staff...@comcast.net>>
> Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
>
> Listers-
>
> I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have
some thoughts to share.
>
> When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as
always. But then she cut out heading away from the marina.
Initially I suspected a fuel flow problem, as the petcock on the
tank has become difficult to turn. After ensuring the petcock was
in the open position and the tank was full, she started right up
again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes. Then she cut out
again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking. I sailed
for a couple hours anyway. When I tried to start her to come back
in, nothing happened when I pressed the starter button. I assumed
my batteries didn’t have enough amperage for the starter, after
all the previous cranking, though my other electronics were
running fine. So I docked under sail power, pulled the batteries,
and brought them home to charge. They both tested at 12.7 volts
and 83% charge when I put them on my charger. Now they’re both at
100% and 12.9 volts.
>
> So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a
faulty starter circuit. Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire
is having the same effect as pushing in the ignition switch. I’ve
yet to get into the lazarette and start tracing the wiring and
testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next step. I thought I’d
write the list first to see if anyone has any quick hypotheses.
>
> Thanks in Advance,
> Randy Stafford
> S/V Grenadine
> C&C 301- #7
> Ken Caryl

Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

If you water lock it, it won’t crank anymore (nor you would be able to turn it 
over by hand). Don’t ask how I know.

Marek

From: Danny Haughey via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 13:19
To: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List
Cc: Danny Haughey
Subject: Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

depending on how much cranking you did, could be hydro locked? pull the
plugs and see how they look and hope you don't get water out.

I did have an issue with a bad wire to the coil.  it seemed the wire
would heat up and beak the connection somehow after running a bit and
then allow it to start again after it cooled a while.  I replaced the
wire and it did the trick.

Danny


On 9/18/2017 10:37 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote:
> I would jump over to the Moyer Marine forum for this.
> http://www.moyermarine.com/
>
> Joe
> Coquina
> C&C 35 MK I
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Randal 
> Stafford via CnC-List
> Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 10:30 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Randal Stafford 
> Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
>
> Listers-
>
> I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
> to share.
>
> When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
> then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
> flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
> ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
> started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
> out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
> couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
> happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t 
> have enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though 
> my other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled 
> the batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 
> volts and 83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% 
> and 12.9 volts.
>
> So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
> circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
> as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
> start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
> step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
> hypotheses.
>
> Thanks in Advance,
> Randy Stafford
> S/V Grenadine
> C&C 301- #7
> Ken Caryl, CO
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[David Castor via CnC-List]

Mostly lurk on this list since I bought a Sabre instead of C&C.

I live in Port Angeles, WA. Just wanted to say that I would make radar a
high priority in these waters.  Virtually any boat venturing into the
Strait of Juan de Fuca has radar, down to the 20 foot fishing boats.

Best of luck.

Dave Castor.

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 9:56 AM Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I agree with Jack, as well; but the original post was sent by a person who
> sails in the Vancouver Island area, which has far less shifting sand and
> far more immovable rock…   :^)
>
> Any electronic device is not a replacement for good seamanship and
> piloting — but it can definitely be of great help when the wether goes bad
> or it’s dark out.  You still have a responsibility for keeping proper
> lookout, and for double-checking your position.
>
> — Fred
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:22 AM, David Kaseler via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Jack I agree with all you say.
> Dave.
> 1975 C&C 33
> SLY
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 8:33 AM, jackbrennan via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Of course, the caveat to all of this is that,  depending on where you
> sail, even up-to-date charts can be anywhere from mildly off to wildly and
> dangerously inaccurate.
>
> In the Keys and South and West Florida, where sand shifts all of the time,
> TowboatUS and Seatow do a fine business from boaters blindly following
> their chartplotters. Many inlets and channels in West Florida have nasty,
> uncharted sandbars.
>
> After Irma, forget about it. Who knows what's where? You could go aground
> on a sunken boat.
>
> Depth sounders and the ability to read water are more valuable navigation
> tools in places like this. I like paper charts because you get a bigger
> view. A GPS is wonderful for confirming that you are where you think you
> are.
>
> Still, I get the allure of all that gear. I crewed on a friend's catamaran
> to Fantasy Fest in Key West last fall. His electronics were several times
> more valuable than many of our boats.
>
> I felt like I was on the con of the Starship Enterprise. Especially when
> we hit warp speed (10+ knots). The only thing the electronics couldn't do
> was spot crab pots at night. :)
>
> Jack Brennan
> Former C&C 25
> Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
> Tierra Verde, Fl.
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
-- 
Excuse the brevity. Sent from my phone.
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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Rick Rohwer via CnC-List]

I have general charts aboard and tools to dead reckon with! I can see no reason 
to not have at least a handheld GPS aboard with batteries. If you can swing it 
though you should have a plotter!  Great peace of mind!
I think I would prefer having AIS to radar. I have the radar but no AIS 
currently!
A good friend said the added benefit of AIS is knowing how many folks (roughly) 
are in the anchorage before you pull in! 
I have read some very negative feedback on real time tests on radar reflectors?

Rick Rohwer 
Paikea 37+
Tacoma, WA



> On Sep 18, 2017, at 12:55, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I agree with Jack, as well; but the original post was sent by a person who 
> sails in the Vancouver Island area, which has far less shifting sand and far 
> more immovable rock…   :^)
> 
> Any electronic device is not a replacement for good seamanship and piloting — 
> but it can definitely be of great help when the wether goes bad or it’s dark 
> out.  You still have a responsibility for keeping proper lookout, and for 
> double-checking your position.
> 
> — Fred
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
> 
>> On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:22 AM, David Kaseler via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Jack I agree with all you say.
>> Dave.
>> 1975 C&C 33
>> SLY
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On Sep 18, 2017, at 8:33 AM, jackbrennan via CnC-List 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Of course, the caveat to all of this is that,  depending on where you sail, 
>>> even up-to-date charts can be anywhere from mildly off to wildly and 
>>> dangerously inaccurate.
>>> 
>>> In the Keys and South and West Florida, where sand shifts all of the time, 
>>> TowboatUS and Seatow do a fine business from boaters blindly following 
>>> their chartplotters. Many inlets and channels in West Florida have nasty, 
>>> uncharted sandbars.
>>> 
>>> After Irma, forget about it. Who knows what's where? You could go aground 
>>> on a sunken boat.
>>> 
>>> Depth sounders and the ability to read water are more valuable navigation 
>>> tools in places like this. I like paper charts because you get a bigger 
>>> view. A GPS is wonderful for confirming that you are where you think you 
>>> are. 
>>> 
>>> Still, I get the allure of all that gear. I crewed on a friend's catamaran 
>>> to Fantasy Fest in Key West last fall. His electronics were several times 
>>> more valuable than many of our boats.
>>> 
>>> I felt like I was on the con of the Starship Enterprise. Especially when we 
>>> hit warp speed (10+ knots). The only thing the electronics couldn't do was 
>>> spot crab pots at night. :)
>>> 
>>> Jack Brennan
>>> Former C&C 25
>>> Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
>>> Tierra Verde, Fl.
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List 2018 C&C Northeast Rendezvous -- Please Take our Survey

[bushmark4--- via CnC-List]

 I wasn't going to say much because the Northeast location is too far for me to 
travel, then I watched the "trailer": I'm ready! sign me up! when do I show 
up!!!  

 


Richard
s/v Bushmark4; 1985 C&C 37 CB; Ohio River, MIle 584.4




Richard N. Bush s 
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
To: Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
Cc: Edd Schillay 
Sent: Mon, Sep 18, 2017 2:44 pm
Subject: Stus-List 2018 C&C Northeast Rendezvous -- Please Take our Survey


Listers,


Please take our short online survey regarding the 2018 C&C Rendezvous in Port 
Jefferson, NY — https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/QZ2S52J 


The sooner we obtain information, the sooner we can lock down dates, marinas, 
restaurants etc. 


Port Jefferson was selected due to its mid-Sound location and easy access for 
those who won’t come by boat (Long Island Expressway or Bridgeport Ferry). We 
are thinking Danford's Hotel Marina and Spa, but possibly also moorings at Port 
Jeff Yacht Club for those who don’t want to shell out “big bucks” for a slip. 


Great choice of restaurants, great hotel for those coming by car, and a 
well-protected harbor. 


Rendezvous “Movie Teaser” — https://youtu.be/OxOu2Ciucy0 



All the best,


Edd




Edd M. Schillay
Starship Enterprise
C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
City Island, NY 

Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log














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Re: Stus-List CnC-List Digest, Vol 140, Issue 81

[Rick Rohwer via CnC-List]

Good info Tom! He is now in autodial!


Rick Rohwer 
Paikea 37+
Thea Foss



> On Sep 17, 2017, at 13:34, Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Don
> 
> I used an excellent diesel mechanic in Sydney this summer.  He was 
> recommended by Stewart, at U.K. Sails and is the best diesel mechanic I have 
> used, ever.  Just wish he was closer.
> 
> His name is Ben Gartside, of Gartside Marine Engine.  250-655-4543
> gartsidemar...@shaw.ca
> 
> If I had what you have, I would consider flying him down to Seattle to check 
> I out.
> 
> GL
> 
> Tom B
> 
> Typoed from my iPhone
> 
> Tom Buscaglia
> Alera 1990 C&C 37+/40
> Vashon Island WA
> O 206.463.9200
> C 305.409.3660
> Skype - thombusc
> 
> 
> 
> On Sep 17, 2017, at 9:00 AM, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com wrote:
> 
 On Sep 16, 2017, at 23:14, DON JONSSON via CnC-List >>> > wrote:
 
 Hi
 
 It seems I have a leaking head gasket on my Yanmar engine.  It is an old 
 engine but only has 2,000 hours on it.  I'm going to get some quotes on 
 fixing it but I'm sure it won't be cheap and not sure it won't be a waste 
 on an old engine.
 
 The boat is leaking a fair bit of oil which ends up in the bilge.  The 
 best guess when tracing the source is the gasket.  Of course the leak is 
 from an area that is very difficult to get a good look at.  The boat has 
 also suddenly taken to starting very poorly.  Anyway those are the 
 symptoms.  
 
 Has any one replaced a similar engine?  What with and how did it go?  Any 
 things to watch out for?
 
 Thanks
 Don
 Victoria, BC
 ___
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

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Stus-List Riggers in Annapolis

[Brian Fry via CnC-List]

I got 3 quotes for standing rigging replacement (rod),  mast and boom strip
and paint. 2 were for 19000, 1 was for 12000.
M Yachts, Annapolis Rigging, and the Rigging Company, not in that order.
Any experience with any of the three?


S/V La Neige
1993 C&C 37/40 XL
Havre de Grace , MD
FB blog : thenext14years
Brian and Manon
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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 2:00 PM, David Castor via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Mostly lurk on this list since I bought a Sabre instead of C&C. 

We forgive you…   :^)   Actually, my slip neighbor has a Sabre 36, and it’s a 
beautiful boat.  I may go that way someday, too.

> I live in Port Angeles, WA. Just wanted to say that I would make radar a high 
> priority in these waters.  Virtually any boat venturing into the Strait of 
> Juan de Fuca has radar, down to the 20 foot fishing boats.  

I absolutely agree about radar, especially with all the large amount of vessel 
traffic and the chance for fog.  But radar will cost more than triple the 
amount you’ll pay for a smallish plotter, by the time you figure in the dome, 
the mount and the installation.  That’s what I suggested getting a 
radar-capable plotter first, then add things as you go.

I also agree with Rick’s suggestion about AIS; but you need to remember that 
not all vessels have AIS transponders.  I’m seeing far more of it on 
recreational vessels in my area; but there are still many commercial vessels 
under 300 tons that aren’t required to carry it, and don’t.  Radar will still 
see those vessels.

In the end, all of the toys will give you more and more info; sometimes more 
than you can keep track of, and the plotter just becomes a big video game.  
Don’t forget to look outside the boat…   :^)

— Fred


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[David Castor via CnC-List]

I'd put higher priority on radar. Not all vessels have AIS. Or have it on.
  Just my $0.02.

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 12:11 PM Rick Rohwer via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I have general charts aboard and tools to dead reckon with! I can see no
> reason to not have at least a handheld GPS aboard with batteries. If you
> can swing it though you should have a plotter!  Great peace of mind!
> I think I would prefer having AIS to radar. I have the radar but no AIS
> currently!
> A good friend said the added benefit of AIS is knowing how many folks
> (roughly) are in the anchorage before you pull in!
> I have read some very negative feedback on real time tests on radar
> reflectors?
>
> Rick Rohwer
> Paikea 37+
> Tacoma, WA
>
>
>
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 12:55, Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> I agree with Jack, as well; but the original post was sent by a person who
> sails in the Vancouver Island area, which has far less shifting sand and
> far more immovable rock…   :^)
>
> Any electronic device is not a replacement for good seamanship and
> piloting — but it can definitely be of great help when the wether goes bad
> or it’s dark out.  You still have a responsibility for keeping proper
> lookout, and for double-checking your position.
>
> — Fred
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:22 AM, David Kaseler via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Jack I agree with all you say.
> Dave.
> 1975 C&C 33
> SLY
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 8:33 AM, jackbrennan via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Of course, the caveat to all of this is that,  depending on where you
> sail, even up-to-date charts can be anywhere from mildly off to wildly and
> dangerously inaccurate.
>
> In the Keys and South and West Florida, where sand shifts all of the time,
> TowboatUS and Seatow do a fine business from boaters blindly following
> their chartplotters. Many inlets and channels in West Florida have nasty,
> uncharted sandbars.
>
> After Irma, forget about it. Who knows what's where? You could go aground
> on a sunken boat.
>
> Depth sounders and the ability to read water are more valuable navigation
> tools in places like this. I like paper charts because you get a bigger
> view. A GPS is wonderful for confirming that you are where you think you
> are.
>
> Still, I get the allure of all that gear. I crewed on a friend's catamaran
> to Fantasy Fest in Key West last fall. His electronics were several times
> more valuable than many of our boats.
>
> I felt like I was on the con of the Starship Enterprise. Especially when
> we hit warp speed (10+ knots). The only thing the electronics couldn't do
> was spot crab pots at night. :)
>
> Jack Brennan
> Former C&C 25
> Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
> Tierra Verde, Fl.
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
-- 
Excuse the brevity. Sent from my phone.
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[svpegasus38 via CnC-List]

Randy,Are you getting any noise out of starter (click) when trying to start? 
Even if you are hydro locked you should hear a click at the starter solenoid if 
electrics are good. Check the coil for cracks, check points and condenser, or 
electronic pick-up, ignition switch for loose/bad connections.  Good luck. 


Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE DeviceDoug Mountjoy POYC Pegasus (for sale) Lf38 
Rebecca Leah LF39 
 Original message From: Randal Stafford via CnC-List 
 Date: 9/18/17  07:29  (GMT-08:00) To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Randal Stafford  Subject: 
Stus-List A4 Cutting Out 
Listers-

I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
to share.

When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t have 
enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though my 
other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled the 
batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 volts and 
83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% and 12.9 
volts.

So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
hypotheses.

Thanks in Advance,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C&C 301- #7
Ken Caryl, CO
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Re: Stus-List Water heaters

[svpegasus38 via CnC-List]

When I first bought Pegasus I installed a 6 gallon Isotherm. Would keep water 
hot several hours, and warm for 24+ hours. All stainless steel construction.  
Wish I had one on Rebecca Leah.  


Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE DeviceDoug Mountjoy POYC Pegasus (for sale) Lf38 
Rebecca Leah LF39 
 Original message From: Ken Heaton via CnC-List 
 Date: 9/18/17  11:34  (GMT-08:00) To: cnc-list 
 Cc: Ken Heaton  Subject: Re: 
Stus-List Water heaters 
We have one of these.  It seems fine.  Ours may be a 20 gallon, I'm not sure.  
Stainless Steel casing, Aluminium Tank.  Made in the USA apparently, North 
Carolina?
http://us.binnacle.com/m101/Kuuma-Grills-&-Water-Heaters/p3467/Kuuma-11-Gallon-Hot-Water-Heater-Front-Heat-Exchange/product_info.html

Ken H.

On 18 September 2017 at 15:08, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
 wrote:
Shit... Thanks Edd.  It wad just a test to see who would follow my link!  Haha
Try these.
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B8pEh5lnvP1ydEpoMU1MWmx6Qms

Josh MuckleyS/V Sea Hawk1989 C&C 37+Solomons, MD
On Sep 18, 2017 1:51 PM, "Edd Schillay via CnC-List"  
wrote:
Josh,
Your rebuild photos look a lot like a limited release of liability document for 
your charter company. 
Do you make your passengers sign your hot water tank? :-) 


All the best,
Edd

Edd M. SchillayStarship EnterpriseC&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-BCity Island, NY 
Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log






On Sep 18, 2017, at 1:45 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List  
wrote:
I rebuilt my Raritan.  I don't completely understand why the price is so high 
but the company is quite proud of their product being "glass lined"?
Here are rebuild 
pics:https://docs.google.com/document/d/18AwfYQFWmm_r8VMKbZRgmPyw5YklmfCltHQ_c7MdcjQ/edit?usp=drivesdk
I replaced all the insulation AND included a flush manifold and themal mixing 
valve.

Josh MuckleyS/V Sea Hawk1989 C&C 37+Solomons, MD 

On Sep 18, 2017 11:28 AM, "Glenn Gambel via CnC-List"  
wrote:




I am contemplating replacing my 6 gallon Raritan hot water heater with heat 
exchanger with an Atwood/Whale 6 gallon hot water heater with heat exchanger.  
I could get a new Raritan for in the neighborhood of 800 dollars or a new 
Atwood for around 300 dollars.  Wonder what other's experience in this area may 
be???  Would appreciate any feedback.  
Glenn GambelWind N Spirits, 1981 C&C 36
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___



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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[svpegasus38 via CnC-List]

I have radar and AIS receiver on Pegasus, radar and installing AIS transponder  
on Rebecca Leah. I was cruising near Port Townsend in the fog when the screen 
of my radar went blank. Had the AIS receiver so was able to see the ferry that 
was too close for comfort. Called him on the radio. Was able to avoid a bad 
situation.  If interested in AIS talk to Doug Miller at MilltechMarine.com He 
is who I bought my LF39 from and he hooked me up with the AIS transponder.  


Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE DeviceDoug Mountjoy POYC Pegasus (for sale) Lf38 
Rebecca Leah LF39 
 Original message From: David Castor via CnC-List 
 Date: 9/18/17  13:24  (GMT-08:00) To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: David Castor  Subject: Re: 
Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none 
I'd put higher priority on radar. Not all vessels have AIS. Or have it on.   
Just my $0.02. 
On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 12:11 PM Rick Rohwer via CnC-List 
 wrote:
I have general charts aboard and tools to dead reckon with! I can see no reason 
to not have at least a handheld GPS aboard with batteries. If you can swing it 
though you should have a plotter!  Great peace of mind!I think I would prefer 
having AIS to radar. I have the radar but no AIS currently!A good friend said 
the added benefit of AIS is knowing how many folks (roughly) are in the 
anchorage before you pull in! I have read some very negative feedback on real 
time tests on radar reflectors?

Rick Rohwer Paikea 37+Tacoma, WA



On Sep 18, 2017, at 12:55, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
 wrote:

I agree with Jack, as well; but the original post was sent by a person who 
sails in the Vancouver Island area, which has far less shifting sand and far 
more immovable rock…   :^)
Any electronic device is not a replacement for good seamanship and piloting — 
but it can definitely be of great help when the wether goes bad or it’s dark 
out.  You still have a responsibility for keeping proper lookout, and for 
double-checking your position.
— Fred


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI


On Sep 18, 2017, at 11:22 AM, David Kaseler via CnC-List 
 wrote:
Jack I agree with all you say.Dave.1975 C&C 33SLY

Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2017, at 8:33 AM, jackbrennan via CnC-List  
wrote:

Of course, the caveat to all of this is that,  depending on where you sail, 
even up-to-date charts can be anywhere from mildly off to wildly and 
dangerously inaccurate.
In the Keys and South and West Florida, where sand shifts all of the time, 
TowboatUS and Seatow do a fine business from boaters blindly following their 
chartplotters. Many inlets and channels in West Florida have nasty, uncharted 
sandbars.
After Irma, forget about it. Who knows what's where? You could go aground on a 
sunken boat.
Depth sounders and the ability to read water are more valuable navigation tools 
in places like this. I like paper charts because you get a bigger view. A GPS 
is wonderful for confirming that you are where you think you are. 
Still, I get the allure of all that gear. I crewed on a friend's catamaran to 
Fantasy Fest in Key West last fall. His electronics were several times more 
valuable than many of our boats.
I felt like I was on the con of the Starship Enterprise. Especially when we hit 
warp speed (10+ knots). The only thing the electronics couldn't do was spot 
crab pots at night. :)
Jack BrennanFormer C&C 25Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30Tierra Verde, Fl.
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

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Excuse the brevity. Sent from my phone. 
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Stus-List Drawers for 1983 C&C 37

[Tom Jacobs via CnC-List]

Does anyone have a source for the three small galley drawers that are in the 
galley of the C&C. An expanding foam OOPS has made ours semi usable. Looking 
for full drawers or parts or information on a source to build new drawers. 





Best regards,
 
Tom Jacobs
(972) 849-4730  (Cell) AT&T
+886 978-291-624 (Cell) TW
Tom J (Line)
Jacobstom (Skype)
Mail to: t...@yankeecreek.camp 

The information contained in this e-mail message is intended only for the 
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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[David Castor via CnC-List]

Agreed. Radar is expensive. My boat came with a 10-year old or so Raymarine
chart plotter/radar. I looked into replacing the chart plotter since it has
some issues losing GPS fix. Discovered that I'd also have to replace the
radar.  So deferring chart plotter replacement for another season.

OK - back in my hole.

Dave Castor
Port Angeles, WA.
Sabre 32

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 1:08 PM Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 2:00 PM, David Castor via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Mostly lurk on this list since I bought a Sabre instead of C&C.
>
>
> We forgive you…   :^)   Actually, my slip neighbor has a Sabre 36, and
> it’s a beautiful boat.  I may go that way someday, too.
>
> I live in Port Angeles, WA. Just wanted to say that I would make radar a
> high priority in these waters.  Virtually any boat venturing into the
> Strait of Juan de Fuca has radar, down to the 20 foot fishing boats.
>
>
> I absolutely agree about radar, especially with all the large amount of
> vessel traffic and the chance for fog.  But radar will cost more than
> triple the amount you’ll pay for a smallish plotter, by the time you figure
> in the dome, the mount and the installation.  That’s what I suggested
> getting a radar-*capable* plotter first, then add things as you go.
>
> I also agree with Rick’s suggestion about AIS; but you need to remember
> that not all vessels have AIS transponders.  I’m seeing far more of it on
> recreational vessels in my area; but there are still many commercial
> vessels under 300 tons that aren’t required to carry it, and don’t.  Radar
> will still see those vessels.
>
> In the end, all of the toys will give you more and more info; sometimes
> more than you can keep track of, and the plotter just becomes a big video
> game.  Don’t forget to look outside the boat…   :^)
>
> — Fred
>
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
-- 
Excuse the brevity. Sent from my phone.
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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

Fred,

Why are you suddenly so friendly? In the past non-C&C lurkers where threatened 
with keelhauling…


Marek
1994 C270 legato
Ottawa, ON
Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Frederick G Street via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 16:09
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Frederick G Street
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none


On Sep 18, 2017, at 2:00 PM, David Castor via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Mostly lurk on this list since I bought a Sabre instead of C&C.

We forgive you…   :^)   Actually, my slip neighbor has a Sabre 36, and it’s a 
beautiful boat.  I may go that way someday, too.


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Re: Stus-List Water heaters

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

I replaced mine with another Raritan.  The bottom of my old one rusted
out.  The new ones are plastic on the outside- won't rust.  I bought
mine from Columbia Marine Exchange in Portland.  Cheaper than Defender.
They can probably have it drop shipped to you.  Check out their web site,
and give Kim a call.  If you get a different brand, check the dimensions
carefully, or it may not fit through the hatch.

Alan Bergen
35 Mk 3 Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 8:10 AM, Glenn Gambel via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I am contemplating replacing my 6 gallon Raritan hot water heater with
> heat exchanger with an Atwood/Whale 6 gallon hot water heater with heat
> exchanger.  I could get a new Raritan for in the neighborhood of 800
> dollars or a new Atwood for around 300 dollars.  Wonder what other's
> experience in this area may be???  Would appreciate any feedback.
>
> Glenn Gambel
> Wind N Spirits, 1981 C&C 36
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.
> paypal.me_stumurray&d=DwICAg&c=clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN
> 0H8p7CSfnc_gI&r=9w3G7Cf8YfQnrjmtuNxwDJYr3JMv9f1pAfgAJ9xXYQQ&m=NmCF_
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> Fyv68ShAhs&e=
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>


-- 
Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR
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Re: Stus-List Water Heater

[Ted Drossos via CnC-List]

I have a new 6 gallon Raritan water heater listed in the event you want to 
replace yours with the same model.
https://sbo.sailboatowners.com/gear/gear.php?task=showad&id=6240


Ted Drossos
C&C 110
Lady in Red
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Stus-List Water tank replacement

[detroito91 via CnC-List]

Hello everyoneFinally able how to remove the port water tank on my 38 
landfall. The spray in foam held it secure. No to replace it. No repair since 
it had a 15" crack along the side.Question...does anyone happen to have the 
replacement number for this tank or other ideas.Thanks for all your knowledge 
this list gives me. Jim Schwartz 38 landfall SEA YA !washington nc 


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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[jackbrennan via CnC-List]

People on this list should be complimented that so many former C&C owners 
continue to lurk here.

I for one think it's the one of best sources of reliable information on the 
Internet for maintaining and upgrading sailboats. Dennis, Fred, Wally and many 
others have given me quite an education over the 16 years I've been reading 
their posts.

Other email sailing lists tend to be plagued by a scarcity of real experts, 
flamers, know nothings who believe they know it all, big personalities who 
argue at the drop of a hat and more. This list somehow tends to avoid all of 
that.

Besides, who knows, maybe someday we'll come back to the C&C fold. :) 

I know that if I could get some lingering health issues under control, I might 
be tempted by the right Landfall or a centerboard C&C for more extended 
cruising.

Jack Brennan
Former C&C 25
Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
Tierra Verde, Fl.








Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Tab®|PRO

 Original message 
From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List  
Date:09/18/2017  5:51 PM  (GMT-05:00) 
To: Frederick G Street via CnC-List  
Cc: Marek Dziedzic  
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none 

Fred,
 
Why are you suddenly so friendly? In the past non-C&C lurkers where threatened 
with keelhauling…
 
 
Marek
1994 C270 legato
Ottawa, ON
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
 
From: Frederick G Street via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 16:09
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Frederick G Street
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none
 
 
On Sep 18, 2017, at 2:00 PM, David Castor via CnC-List  
wrote:
 
Mostly lurk on this list since I bought a Sabre instead of C&C. 
 
We forgive you…   :^)   Actually, my slip neighbor has a Sabre 36, and it’s a 
beautiful boat.  I may go that way someday, too.


___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Stus-List Transmission position while sailing

[schiller via CnC-List]

OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With 
the Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he 
transmission into reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new 
Yanmar in Grace (C&C 35, Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to 
transmission selection after shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively 
put the transmission in reverse but can not find any Yanmar 
documentation as to what they recommend.


Neil Schiller
1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
"Grace"
White Lake, Michigan
Scheduled for haulout 6 October
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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Randy Stafford via CnC-List]

Hi Doug,

No noise whatsoever when I pushed the starter button.  It was as if there 
wasn’t enough current to activate the starter, but the batteries *did* have 
enough charge at the time.

Cheers,
Randy

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 3:08 PM, svpegasus38 via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Randy,
> Are you getting any noise out of starter (click) when trying to start? Even 
> if you are hydro locked you should hear a click at the starter solenoid if 
> electrics are good. 
> Check the coil for cracks, check points and condenser, or electronic pick-up, 
> ignition switch for loose/bad connections.  
> Good luck. 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
> Doug Mountjoy 
> POYC 
> Pegasus (for sale) 
> Lf38 
> Rebecca Leah LF39 
> 
>  Original message 
> From: Randal Stafford via CnC-List 
> Date: 9/18/17 07:29 (GMT-08:00)
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Randal Stafford 
> Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
> 
> Listers-
> 
> I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
> to share.
> 
> When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
> then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
> flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
> ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
> started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
> out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
> couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
> happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t 
> have enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though 
> my other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled 
> the batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 
> volts and 83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% 
> and 12.9 volts.
> 
> So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
> circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
> as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
> start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
> step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
> hypotheses.
> 
> Thanks in Advance,
> Randy Stafford
> S/V Grenadine
> C&C 301- #7
> Ken Caryl, CO
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Water tank replacement

[bwhitmore via CnC-List]

15" crack is not too long to weld if it is LDPE plastic.  If you're 
particularly worried,apply some stainless steel screen between layers.


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 Original message From: detroito91 via CnC-List 
 Date: 9/18/17  6:21 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: detroito91  Subject: Stus-List 
Water tank replacement 
Hello everyoneFinally able how to remove the port water tank on my 38 
landfall. The spray in foam held it secure. No to replace it. No repair since 
it had a 15" crack along the side.Question...does anyone happen to have the 
replacement number for this tank or other ideas.Thanks for all your knowledge 
this list gives me. Jim Schwartz 38 landfall SEA YA !washington nc 


Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device___

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Re: Stus-List Drawers for 1983 C&C 37

[Jeffrey Nelson via CnC-List]

Pretty much any cabinet maker in your area should be able to reproduce 
them.  If you can salvage the face off the drawers you'll
have a good match to the existing cabinetry.  If you can find someone 
take them the drawers and they can re-produce.


If you just need hardware...www.leevalleytools.com has an extensive 
drawer hardware section.


--
Cheers,
    Jeff Nelson
    Muir Caileag
    C&C 30
    Armdale Y.C.
    Halifax

On 9/18/2017 6:29 PM, Tom Jacobs via CnC-List wrote:
Does anyone have a source for the three small galley drawers that are 
in the galley of the C&C. An expanding foam OOPS has made ours semi 
usable. Looking for full drawers or parts or information on a source 
to build new drawers.






Best regards,
Tom Jacobs
(972) 849-4730  (Cell) AT&T
+886 978-291-624 (Cell) TW
Tom J (Line)
Jacobstom (Skype)
Mail to: t...@yankeecreek.camp 

/The information contained in this e-mail message is intended only for 
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this communication in error, please delete the original message and 
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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Jeffrey Nelson via CnC-List]

Might try checking the ground on the engine.  Mine had that problem a 
number of years ago, taking it off and cleaning it up
solved the problem.  Of course mine is a diesel and yours is gas, but I 
would expect that the ground would be wired similarly.

Food for thought.


On 9/18/2017 8:15 PM, Randy Stafford via CnC-List wrote:

Hi Doug,

No noise whatsoever when I pushed the starter button.  It was as if 
there wasn’t enough current to activate the starter, but the batteries 
*did* have enough charge at the time.


Cheers,
Randy

On Sep 18, 2017, at 3:08 PM, svpegasus38 via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Randy,
Are you getting any noise out of starter (click) when trying to 
start? Even if you are hydro locked you should hear a click at the 
starter solenoid if electrics are good.
Check the coil for cracks, check points and condenser, or electronic 
pick-up, ignition switch for loose/bad connections.

Good luck.



Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
Doug Mountjoy
POYC
Pegasus (for sale)
Lf38
Rebecca Leah LF39

 Original message 
From: Randal Stafford via CnC-List >

Date: 9/18/17 07:29 (GMT-08:00)
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Randal Stafford >

Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

Listers-

I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some 
thoughts to share.


When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as 
always.  But then she cut out heading away from the marina.  
Initially I suspected a fuel flow problem, as the petcock on the tank 
has become difficult to turn.  After ensuring the petcock was in the 
open position and the tank was full, she started right up again and 
ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut out again, and 
wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a couple 
hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries 
didn’t have enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous 
cranking, though my other electronics were running fine.  So I docked 
under sail power, pulled the batteries, and brought them home to 
charge.  They both tested at 12.7 volts and 83% charge when I put 
them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% and 12.9 volts.


So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty 
starter circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having 
the same effect as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get 
into the lazarette and start tracing the wiring and testing with a 
multimeter, but that’s my next step.  I thought I’d write the list 
first to see if anyone has any quick hypotheses.


Thanks in Advance,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C&C 301- #7
Ken Caryl, CO
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--
Boat_Sig Cheers,
    Jeff Nelson
    Muir Caileag
    C&C 30
    Armdale Y.C.
    Halifax


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Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

Fixed prop=neutral. Folding/ feathering neutral or reverse
Joel

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 7:16 PM schiller via CnC-List 
wrote:

> OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With
> the Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he transmission
> into reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new Yanmar in Grace
> (C&C 35, Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to transmission
> selection after shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively put the
> transmission in reverse but can not find any Yanmar documentation as to
> what they recommend.
>
> Neil Schiller
> 1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
> "Grace"
> White Lake, Michigan
> Scheduled for haulout 6 October
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Danny Haughey via CnC-List]

I joined the sabre group when shopping for our current boat.   They let me stay 
even though I bought a tartan!  Awesome group!  Tartan group is really great 
too!   They are both as friendly knowledgeable and helpful as this group just 
not as many in number! 
I would love to combine all 3!


Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
 Original message From: jackbrennan via CnC-List 
 Date: 9/18/17  7:10 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: jackbrennan  Subject: Re: 
Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none 
People on this list should be complimented that so many former C&C owners 
continue to lurk here.
I for one think it's the one of best sources of reliable information on the 
Internet for maintaining and upgrading sailboats. Dennis, Fred, Wally and many 
others have given me quite an education over the 16 years I've been reading 
their posts.
Other email sailing lists tend to be plagued by a scarcity of real experts, 
flamers, know nothings who believe they know it all, big personalities who 
argue at the drop of a hat and more. This list somehow tends to avoid all of 
that.
Besides, who knows, maybe someday we'll come back to the C&C fold. :) 
I know that if I could get some lingering health issues under control, I might 
be tempted by the right Landfall or a centerboard C&C for more extended 
cruising.
Jack BrennanFormer C&C 25Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30Tierra Verde, Fl.







Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Tab®|PRO

 Original message 
From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List  
Date:09/18/2017  5:51 PM  (GMT-05:00) 
To: Frederick G Street via CnC-List  
Cc: Marek Dziedzic  
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none 



Fred,
 
Why are you suddenly so friendly? In the past non-C&C lurkers where threatened 
with keelhauling…
 
 
Marek 
1994 C270 legato
Ottawa, ON 
Sent from 
Mail for Windows 10
 

From: Frederick G Street via CnC-List

Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 16:09

To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com

Cc: Frederick G Street

Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

 
 



On Sep 18, 2017, at 2:00 PM, David Castor via CnC-List  
wrote:

 


Mostly lurk on this list since I bought a Sabre instead of C&C. 




 


We forgive you…   :^)   Actually, my slip neighbor has a Sabre 36, and it’s a 
beautiful boat.  I may go that way someday, too.










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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Marek — with the exception of the occasional “RTFM” comment ("read the f@%*ing 
manual”…), I tend to be a friendly kind of guy…   :^)

I think the Sabres of the mid- to late-1990’s and early to mid 2000’s are what 
C&C could have been if they had been able to stay in business and stable.  
They’re nice to look at, well-designed down below, and sail pretty darn well.  
I love the fact that the 36 my slip-neighbor owns has the head at the bottom of 
the companionway (with a separate shower stall).  The rest of the boat is great 
down below as well, and the build quality is outstanding.

There’s been a 42 recently down in Florida that I’ve been drooling over… I 
wonder if she’s still afloat after Irma…

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 4:51 PM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Fred,
>  
> Why are you suddenly so friendly? In the past non-C&C lurkers where 
> threatened with keelhauling…
>  
>  
> Marek

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Water tank replacement

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Jim — look at the following PDF.  I’m pretty sure the tanks you need are on 
page 11 — the 4071 and 5139 model:

www.postaudio.net/webserver/Kracor_water_and_holding_tanks.pdf 


Kracor is located in Wisconsin, and as far as I know, they can still supply 
these.

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 5:21 PM, detroito91 via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Hello everyone
> Finally able how to remove the port water tank on my 38 landfall. The spray 
> in foam held it secure. No to replace it. No repair since it had a 15" crack 
> along the side.
> Question...does anyone happen to have the replacement number for this tank or 
> other ideas.
> Thanks for all your knowledge this list gives me. 
> Jim Schwartz 
> 38 landfall 
> SEA YA !
> washington nc 

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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Jerome Tauber via CnC-List]

Just sailed to Newport for the boat show. No Sabre, Hunter or C&C sailboats. 
One Catalina.  One J.  Two Tartans.  U.S. sailboat industry going the way of 
Canada's.  Jerry 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 18, 2017, at 8:05 PM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I joined the sabre group when shopping for our current boat.   They let me 
> stay even though I bought a tartan!  Awesome group!  Tartan group is really 
> great too!   They are both as friendly knowledgeable and helpful as this 
> group just not as many in number! 
> 
> I would love to combine all 3!
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
> 
>  Original message 
> From: jackbrennan via CnC-List 
> Date: 9/18/17 7:10 PM (GMT-05:00)
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: jackbrennan 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none
> 
> People on this list should be complimented that so many former C&C owners 
> continue to lurk here.
> 
> I for one think it's the one of best sources of reliable information on the 
> Internet for maintaining and upgrading sailboats. Dennis, Fred, Wally and 
> many others have given me quite an education over the 16 years I've been 
> reading their posts.
> 
> Other email sailing lists tend to be plagued by a scarcity of real experts, 
> flamers, know nothings who believe they know it all, big personalities who 
> argue at the drop of a hat and more. This list somehow tends to avoid all of 
> that.
> 
> Besides, who knows, maybe someday we'll come back to the C&C fold. :) 
> 
> I know that if I could get some lingering health issues under control, I 
> might be tempted by the right Landfall or a centerboard C&C for more extended 
> cruising.
> 
> Jack Brennan
> Former C&C 25
> Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
> Tierra Verde, Fl.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Tab®|PRO
> 
> 
>  Original message 
> From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List 
> Date:09/18/2017 5:51 PM (GMT-05:00) 
> To: Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
> Cc: Marek Dziedzic 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none 
> 
> Fred,
> 
>  
> 
> Why are you suddenly so friendly? In the past non-C&C lurkers where 
> threatened with keelhauling…
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Marek
> 
> 1994 C270 legato
> 
> Ottawa, ON
> 
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
> 
>  
> 
> From: Frederick G Street via CnC-List
> Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 16:09
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Frederick G Street
> Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> On Sep 18, 2017, at 2:00 PM, David Castor via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
>  
> 
> Mostly lurk on this list since I bought a Sabre instead of C&C. 
> 
>  
> 
> We forgive you…   :^)   Actually, my slip neighbor has a Sabre 36, and it’s a 
> beautiful boat.  I may go that way someday, too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing

[Jake Brodersen via CnC-List]

Neil,

 

I keep my transmission in reverse after setting my folding prop.  This holds 
the shaft in place.  I have heard and read that Yanmar does not recommend using 
reverse.   Perhaps that only applies to the fixed prop, like Joel mentions.

 

Jake

 

Jake Brodersen

C&C 35 Mk-III “Midnight Mistress”

Hampton VA



 

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of schiller via 
CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 19:15
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: schiller 
Subject: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing

 

OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With the 
Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he transmission into 
reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new Yanmar in Grace (C&C 35, 
Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to transmission selection after 
shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively put the transmission in reverse but 
can not find any Yanmar documentation as to what they recommend.

Neil Schiller
1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
"Grace"
White Lake, Michigan
Scheduled for haulout 6 October

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Re: Stus-List Riggers in Annapolis

[Michael Cotton via CnC-List]

 About 10 years ago I used Annapolis rigging in Herrington harbor North. It was 
a very negative experience.
On Monday, September 18, 2017, 1:30:51 PM MDT, Brian Fry via CnC-List 
 wrote:  
 
 I got 3 quotes for standing rigging replacement (rod),  mast and boom strip 
and paint. 2 were for 19000, 1 was for 12000. M Yachts, Annapolis Rigging, and 
the Rigging Company, not in that order.Any experience with any of the three?

S/V La Neige
1993 C&C 37/40 XL
Havre de Grace , MD
FB blog : thenext14years
Brian and Manon___

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  ___

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Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Story that I have heard is with folding prop put in reverse but fixed let free 
wheel

Mike
Persistence
Halifax

From: CnC-List [cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] on behalf of schiller via 
CnC-List [cnc-list@cnc-list.com]
Sent: September 18, 2017 8:15 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: schiller
Subject: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing

OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With the 
Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he transmission into 
reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new Yanmar in Grace (C&C 35, 
Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to transmission selection after 
shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively put the transmission in reverse but 
can not find any Yanmar documentation as to what they recommend.

Neil Schiller
1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
"Grace"
White Lake, Michigan
Scheduled for haulout 6 October

___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Michael Cotton via CnC-List]

 I had an ignition coil fail on  my A4. It would start and run then cut out. 
Sometimes restart sometimes not.  A coil replacement corrected the problem. 
On Monday, September 18, 2017, 5:38:28 PM MDT, Jeffrey Nelson via CnC-List 
 wrote:  
 
  
Might try checking the ground on the engine.  Mine had that problem a number of 
years ago, taking it off and cleaning it up
 solved the problem.  Of course mine is a diesel and yours is gas, but I would 
expect that the ground would be wired similarly.
 Food for thought.
 
 
 On 9/18/2017 8:15 PM, Randy Stafford via CnC-List wrote:
  
 
 Hi Doug, 
  No noise whatsoever when I pushed the starter button.  It was as if there 
wasn’t enough current to activate the starter, but the batteries *did* have 
enough charge at the time. 
  Cheers, Randy 

 On Sep 18, 2017, at 3:08 PM, svpegasus38 via CnC-List  
wrote: 
  
 Randy, Are you getting any noise out of starter (click) when trying to start? 
Even if you are hydro locked you should hear a click at the starter solenoid if 
electrics are good.  Check the coil for cracks, check points and condenser, or 
electronic pick-up, ignition switch for loose/bad connections.   Good luck.  
  
  
   Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device Doug Mountjoy  POYC  Pegasus (for sale)  
Lf38  Rebecca Leah LF39  
    Original message  From: Randal Stafford via CnC-List 
  Date: 9/18/17 07:29 (GMT-08:00)  To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com  Cc: Randal Stafford   
Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out  
   Listers-
 
 I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
to share.
 
 When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
ensuring the petcock was in the open  position and the tank was full, she 
started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
couple hours anyway.  When I tried to start her to come back in, nothing 
happened when I pressed the starter button.  I assumed my batteries didn’t have 
enough amperage for the starter, after all the previous cranking, though my 
other electronics were running fine.  So I docked under sail power, pulled the 
batteries, and brought them home to charge.  They both tested at 12.7 volts and 
83% charge when I put them on my charger.  Now they’re both at 100% and 12.9 
volts.
 
 So I now suspect a faulty ignition circuit, and possibly a faulty starter 
circuit.  Perhaps a loose connection or broken wire is having the same effect 
as pushing in the ignition switch.  I’ve yet to get into the lazarette and 
start tracing the wiring and testing with a multimeter, but that’s my next 
step.  I thought I’d write the list first to see if anyone has any quick 
hypotheses.
 
 Thanks in Advance,
 Randy Stafford
 S/V Grenadine
 C&C 301- #7
 Ken Caryl, CO
 ___
 
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to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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 All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
 ___
 
 This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 
 All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
 
 
  
 ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
 
 
 -- 
 Boat_SigCheers,
     Jeff Nelson
     Muir Caileag
     C&C 30
     Armdale Y.C.
     Halifax
  

|  | Virus-free. www.avast.com  |

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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List]

Hello all,
I think I would reiterate what a few have said here, but the diagnostics are as 
follows:
1).  If the engine is making no noise whatsoever when the pushbutton switch is 
depressed, check the switch first.  You should be able to do this by jumping 
the contacts momentarily.  I had a switch fail, and its pretty easy to find a 
replacement.  Based on your description, I would not expect a hydrolock, but of 
course, its best to close the seacock until you can get the engine running so 
you don't suck water into the engine.  Jump other places as needed to confirm 
the issue.  

2).  As for it dying there are two issues to suspect.  First is the coil.  When 
the get hot, they can fail, and then allow you to restart at another time.  
That has nothing to do with the engine not turning over, though (of course).  
The second, and also very high on potential failure issues is the combination 
of points & condenser.  After 10+ years of owning our 1977 C&C 27 MKIII, I 
converted it to electronic ignition by ordering the parts from Moyer Marine.  
When I got done adding up the cost of points, condenser, cap & rotor, a couple 
changes and it almost equaled the cost of the Moyer conversion.  It was VERY 
easy to install, and the reliability of the motor jumped 100%.  No more 
overheated coils, burned distributor caps, and even the plugs ran a lot 
cleaner.  Just the ability to rely on the engine to a much greater extent was 
worth the money.  Crank the engine with a plug out, stuck in the plug wire cap 
and grounded to the engine, and if you don't have spark, its definitely an 
ignition issue.  If the coil is oily on the outside (or is cracked), then 
definitely replace the coil as a first step.  By the way the coils and even the 
points & condensers can normally be found at an auto parts store - look up the 
conversions online, or if you can't find them, email me and I can probably get 
them for you.  

3).  Dying can also be caused by a carburetor problem, most likely a clogged 
jet.  The carburetor is again, VERY easy to overhaul, and if you are gentle 
taking it apart, you can probably do it without replacing any of the gaskets in 
a pinch.  I did so for years, and never had to buy new gaskets, but of course 
others here might criticize me for not doing so.  Again, this would have 
nothing to do with the engine not turning over.
Don Moyer's A-4 manual is also highly recommended.  It's not cheap, but between 
the well written descriptions and the photos, its a real lifesaver (much better 
than the Yanmar manufacturer manuals IMHO).
Feel free to drop me an email directly or call my number below if you need more 
info.
Kindest Regards, 
 Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net


  From: Michael Cotton via CnC-List 
 To: Jeffrey Nelson via CnC-List  
Cc: Michael Cotton 
 Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 8:40 PM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
   
 I had an ignition coil fail on  my A4. It would start and run then cut out. 
Sometimes restart sometimes not.  A coil replacement corrected the problem. 
On Monday, September 18, 2017, 5:38:28 PM MDT, Jeffrey Nelson via CnC-List 
 wrote:  
 
  Might try checking the ground on the engine.  Mine had that problem a number 
of years ago, taking it off and cleaning it up
 solved the problem.  Of course mine is a diesel and yours is gas, but I would 
expect that the ground would be wired similarly.
 Food for thought.
  
 On 9/18/2017 8:15 PM, Randy Stafford via CnC-List wrote:
  
 
 Hi Doug, 
  No noise whatsoever when I pushed the starter button.  It was as if there 
wasn’t enough current to activate the starter, but the batteries *did* have 
enough charge at the time. 
  Cheers, Randy 

 On Sep 18, 2017, at 3:08 PM, svpegasus38 via CnC-List  
wrote: 
  
 Randy, Are you getting any noise out of starter (click) when trying to start? 
Even if you are hydro locked you should hear a click at the starter solenoid if 
electrics are good.  Check the coil for cracks, check points and condenser, or 
electronic pick-up, ignition switch for loose/bad connections.   Good luck.  
  
  
   Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device Doug Mountjoy  POYC  Pegasus (for sale)  
Lf38  Rebecca Leah LF39  
    Original message  From: Randal Stafford via CnC-List 
  Date: 9/18/17 07:29 (GMT-08:00)  To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com  Cc: Randal Stafford   
Subject: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out  
   Listers-
 
 I’m having a problem with my Atomic 4, and hoped you might have some thoughts 
to share.
 
 When I went out for a sail yesterday, she started right up, as always.  But 
then she cut out heading away from the marina.  Initially I suspected a fuel 
flow problem, as the petcock on the tank has become difficult to turn.  After 
ensuring the petcock was in the open position and the tank was full, she 
started right up again and ran smoothly for a good 10 minutes.  Then she cut 
out again, and wouldn’t start back up after some cranking.  I sailed for a 
c

Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Folding and feathering props can stay open if you don't stop the shaft by
putting it in reverse.  With a fixed prop you can reduce drag by "trailing
the shaft" and leaving it in neutral.  The problem is that some
transmissions don't get properly lubricated in this condition (IIRC:
paragon?)  Reverse should always be fine no matter what engine/transmission.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD

On Sep 18, 2017 7:16 PM, "schiller via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With
> the Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he transmission
> into reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new Yanmar in Grace
> (C&C 35, Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to transmission
> selection after shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively put the
> transmission in reverse but can not find any Yanmar documentation as to
> what they recommend.
>
> Neil Schiller
> 1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
> "Grace"
> White Lake, Michigan
> Scheduled for haulout 6 October
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing - Yanmar

[Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List]

Hi Josh,
I was really curious when I read about the proper position of the shifter, and 
found multiple references of the following advisory purportedly from Yanmar as 
follows"
And for Yanmar/Kanzaki:

Advisory Number: MSA08-003:

DATE February 8, 2008 Dealers and OEMs
TO: All Marine Distributors
SUBJECT: Gear in Neutral While Sailing All MODELS:

All Sailboat Engines

We continue to get questions regarding the correct gear position while sailing 
with the engine OFF. This advisory is issued as a reminder; Yanmar requires 
that if sailing with the engine OFF (not running) the transmission shifter must 
be in the neutral position or internal damage to the gear or sail-drive will 
result. This damage will not be covered by Yanmar’s Limited Warranty. Please 
instruct customers and dealers who deliver the sailboat to the customer, of the 
correct (Neutral) position for the marine gear while sailing.

If the customer desires that the propeller shaft not spin while sailing, either 
a folding propeller, shaft break, or other suitable device may be used. 
However, Yanmar accepts no responsibility for the selection, installation, or 
operation of such devices. Please also refer to Marine service advisory 
“MSA07-001_Yanmar Sail Drive Propeller Selection” for additional information.

If you have any questions regarding this advisory please contact a Customer 
Support representative."


The reason for failure mode, as was describe to me, is that in reverse the 
clutch cones can chatter, quiver or vibrate against one another causing wear 
which eventually leads to slippage and a gear box re-build. Many already know 
how difficult a Kanzaki can be to get out of reverse after sailing with it 
locked.

Here's a quote from the SBO forums:
Quote:
Originally Posted by glengreyUnfortunately I can attest to the proper Yanmar 
gear position. In the summer of 2008 my transmission (Kansaki on a 3GM30F 
engine) started slipping. Engine had 440 hours. always placed gear in reverse 
when sailing. After considerable discussion with Yamnar they advised they would 
not consider warranty (was passed the hours for that anyway). Upshot is new 
transmission. They advised that the cone clutch does "quiver" (my term) even 
though locked into reverse, producing wear and eventually slippage.
I don't like believing everything I read on the internet, but I kept coming 
across this advisory.
Hope this helps, 
Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net


  From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
 To: C&C List  
Cc: Josh Muckley 
 Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 9:12 PM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing
   
Folding and feathering props can stay open if you don't stop the shaft by 
putting it in reverse.  With a fixed prop you can reduce drag by "trailing the 
shaft" and leaving it in neutral.  The problem is that some transmissions don't 
get properly lubricated in this condition (IIRC: paragon?)  Reverse should 
always be fine no matter what engine/transmission.
Josh MuckleyS/V Sea Hawk1989 C&C 37+Solomons, MD
On Sep 18, 2017 7:16 PM, "schiller via CnC-List"  wrote:

  OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With the 
Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he transmission into 
reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new Yanmar in Grace (C&C 35, 
Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to transmission selection after 
shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively put the transmission in reverse but 
can not find any Yanmar documentation as to what they recommend.
 
 Neil Schiller
 1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
 "Grace"
 White Lake, Michigan
 Scheduled for haulout 6 October
  
__ _

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  https://www.paypal.me/ 
stumurray

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Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Michael Brown via CnC-List]

Hi Randy,

  a common wiring configuration has a positive wire coming from the starter stud
to the ignition switch in. The ignition switch out feeds the ignition coil, 
starter button
and gauges. If you pull the ignition switch on it should move the fuel gauge, 
ignition
off might return the gauge to empty.

  If so that will confirm power is getting to and through the ignition switch.

Michael Brown
Windburn
C&C 30-1


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2017 17:15:08 -0600 
From: Randy Stafford  
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Subject: Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out 
Message-ID: <8f1bd72a-bd6e-4e04-b0a3-4e09edff3...@comcast.net> 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" 
 
Hi Doug, 
 
No noise whatsoever when I pushed the starter button.  It was as if there 
wasn?t enough current to activate the starter, but the batteries *did* have 
enough charge at the time. 
 
Cheers, 
Randy 
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

With a Max-prop, the transmission should be put in reverse, while the boat
is moving forward,  This feathers the prop, and keeps it from turning past
the feathered position.  Good for all engines.

Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 5:29 PM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Neil,
>
>
>
> I keep my transmission in reverse after setting my folding prop.  This
> holds the shaft in place.  I have heard and read that Yanmar does not
> recommend using reverse.   Perhaps that only applies to the fixed prop,
> like Joel mentions.
>
>
>
> Jake
>
>
>
> *Jake Brodersen*
>
> *C&C 35 Mk-III “Midnight Mistress”*
>
> *Hampton VA*
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of 
> *schiller
> via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Monday, September 18, 2017 19:15
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Cc:* schiller 
> *Subject:* Stus-List Transmission position while sailing
>
>
>
> OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With
> the Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he transmission
> into reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new Yanmar in Grace
> (C&C 35, Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to transmission
> selection after shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively put the
> transmission in reverse but can not find any Yanmar documentation as to
> what they recommend.
>
> Neil Schiller
> 1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
> "Grace"
> White Lake, Michigan
> Scheduled for haulout 6 October
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.
> paypal.me_stumurray&d=DwICAg&c=clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN
> 0H8p7CSfnc_gI&r=9w3G7Cf8YfQnrjmtuNxwDJYr3JMv9f1pAfgAJ9xXYQQ&m=8IrJGVHR_
> O6pHH5TnKiOsyw6SEr0INRwNhDJt647Riw&s=DpjnL3lGutkgWvUTD1GiPZo7dDzHGp
> y_Idte5BtrY6g&e=
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>


-- 
Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR
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Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing - Yanmar

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

I stand corrected.  Well done Bruce.  I'm still going to be putting mine in
reverse.  DAMN THE TORPEDOS!

Josh



On Mon, Sep 18, 2017, 9:18 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi Josh,
>
> I was really curious when I read about the proper position of the shifter,
> and found multiple references of the following advisory purportedly from
> Yanmar as follows"
>
> And for Yanmar/Kanzaki:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *Advisory Number: MSA08-003: DATE February 8, 2008 Dealers and OEMs TO:
> All Marine 
> Distributors SUBJECT: Gear in Neutral While Sailing All MODELS: All
> Sailboat Engines We continue to get questions regarding the correct gear
> position while sailing with the engine OFF. This advisory is issued as a
> reminder; Yanmar requires that if sailing with the engine OFF (not running)
> the transmission shifter must be in the neutral position or internal damage
> to the gear or sail-drive will result. This damage will not be covered by
> Yanmar’s Limited Warranty. Please instruct customers and dealers who
> deliver the sailboat to the customer, of the correct (Neutral) position for
> the marine  gear
> while sailing. If the customer desires that the propeller
>  shaft not spin
> while sailing, either a folding propeller, shaft break, or other suitable
> device may be used. However, Yanmar accepts no responsibility for the
> selection, installation
> , or operation
> of such devices. Please also refer to Marine service
>  advisory
> “MSA07-001_Yanmar Sail Drive Propeller Selection” for additional
> information. If you have any questions regarding this advisory please
> contact a Customer Support representative." *
>
> The reason for failure mode, as was describe to me, is that in reverse the
> clutch  cones can
> chatter, quiver or vibrate against one another causing wear which
> eventually leads to slippage and a gear box re-build. Many already know how
> difficult a Kanzaki
>  can be to get out
> of reverse after sailing with it locked.
>
> Here's a quote from the SBO forums
> :
> Quote:
>
> Originally Posted by *glengrey*
> *Unfortunately I can attest to the proper Yanmar gear position. In the
> summer of 2008 my transmission (Kansaki on a 3GM30F engine) started
> slipping. Engine had 440 hours. always placed gear in reverse when sailing.
> After considerable discussion with Yamnar they advised they would not
> consider warranty (was passed the hours for that anyway). Upshot is new
> transmission. They advised that the cone clutch
>  does "quiver" (my
> term) even though locked into reverse, producing wear and eventually
> slippage.*
>
> I don't like believing everything I read on the internet, but I kept
> coming across this advisory.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Bruce Whitmore
>
> (847) 404-5092 (mobile)
> bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net
>
>
> --
> *From:* Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
> *To:* C&C List 
> *Cc:* Josh Muckley 
> *Sent:* Monday, September 18, 2017 9:12 PM
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing
>
> Folding and feathering props can stay open if you don't stop the shaft by
> putting it in reverse.  With a fixed prop you can reduce drag by "trailing
> the shaft" and leaving it in neutral.  The problem is that some
> transmissions don't get properly lubricated in this condition (IIRC:
> paragon?)  Reverse should always be fine no matter what
> engine/transmission.
>
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
>
> On Sep 18, 2017 7:16 PM, "schiller via CnC-List" 
> wrote:
>
> OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With
> the Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he transmission
> into reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new Yanmar in Grace
> (C&C 35, Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to transmission
> selection after shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively put the
> transmission in reverse but can not find any Yanmar documentation as to
> what they recommend.
>
> Neil Schiller
> 1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
> "Grace"
> White Lake, Michigan
> Scheduled for haulout 6 October
>
> __ _
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/
> stumurray 
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
> ___
>
> This list is sup

Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing - Yanmar

[John McKay via CnC-List]

I put the transmission in reverse. Have a folding prop. If not in reverse you 
can hear the prop and there is a vibration.
John on EnterpriseKomoka Ont.
 

On Monday, September 18, 2017 9:31 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
 wrote:
 

 I stand corrected.  Well done Bruce.  I'm still going to be putting mine in 
reverse.  DAMN THE TORPEDOS! 
Josh


On Mon, Sep 18, 2017, 9:18 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List 
 wrote:

Hi Josh,
I was really curious when I read about the proper position of the shifter, and 
found multiple references of the following advisory purportedly from Yanmar as 
follows"
And for Yanmar/Kanzaki:

Advisory Number: MSA08-003:

DATE February 8, 2008 Dealers and OEMs
TO: All Marine Distributors
SUBJECT: Gear in Neutral While Sailing All MODELS:

All Sailboat Engines

We continue to get questions regarding the correct gear position while sailing 
with the engine OFF. This advisory is issued as a reminder; Yanmar requires 
that if sailing with the engine OFF (not running) the transmission shifter must 
be in the neutral position or internal damage to the gear or sail-drive will 
result. This damage will not be covered by Yanmar’s Limited Warranty. Please 
instruct customers and dealers who deliver the sailboat to the customer, of the 
correct (Neutral) position for the marine gear while sailing.

If the customer desires that the propeller shaft not spin while sailing, either 
a folding propeller, shaft break, or other suitable device may be used. 
However, Yanmar accepts no responsibility for the selection, installation, or 
operation of such devices. Please also refer to Marine service advisory 
“MSA07-001_Yanmar Sail Drive Propeller Selection” for additional information.

If you have any questions regarding this advisory please contact a Customer 
Support representative."


The reason for failure mode, as was describe to me, is that in reverse the 
clutch cones can chatter, quiver or vibrate against one another causing wear 
which eventually leads to slippage and a gear box re-build. Many already know 
how difficult a Kanzaki can be to get out of reverse after sailing with it 
locked.

Here's a quote from the SBO forums:
Quote:
Originally Posted by glengreyUnfortunately I can attest to the proper Yanmar 
gear position. In the summer of 2008 my transmission (Kansaki on a 3GM30F 
engine) started slipping. Engine had 440 hours. always placed gear in reverse 
when sailing. After considerable discussion with Yamnar they advised they would 
not consider warranty (was passed the hours for that anyway). Upshot is new 
transmission. They advised that the cone clutch does "quiver" (my term) even 
though locked into reverse, producing wear and eventually slippage.
I don't like believing everything I read on the internet, but I kept coming 
across this advisory.
Hope this helps, 
Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net


  From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
 To: C&C List  
Cc: Josh Muckley 
 Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 9:12 PM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing
  
Folding and feathering props can stay open if you don't stop the shaft by 
putting it in reverse.  With a fixed prop you can reduce drag by "trailing the 
shaft" and leaving it in neutral.  The problem is that some transmissions don't 
get properly lubricated in this condition (IIRC: paragon?)  Reverse should 
always be fine no matter what engine/transmission.
Josh MuckleyS/V Sea Hawk1989 C&C 37+Solomons, MD
On Sep 18, 2017 7:16 PM, "schiller via CnC-List"  wrote:

  OK, gang.  I know this has been discussed before but help me out.  With the 
Universal M-25XPB in Corsair, the manuals said to shift he transmission into 
reverse after shut down while sailing.  Withe the new Yanmar in Grace (C&C 35, 
Mark III), what is the prevailing wisdom as to transmission selection after 
shutdown while sailing.  I instinctively put the transmission in reverse but 
can not find any Yanmar documentation as to what they recommend.
 
 Neil Schiller
 1983 C&C 35, Mark III, #028
 "Grace"
 White Lake, Michigan
 Scheduled for haulout 6 October
  
__ _

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  https://www.paypal.me/ 
stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Actually, there is no FEDERAL chart carriage requirement (in the US) for 
recreational boats. There may be a requirement is some states, but I’m not 
aware of any.

 

For a US vessel carrying paying passengers, you must have paper charts (Unless 
you have a really elaborate and expensive electronic charting system like those 
approved for large commercial vessels like cruise ships.), and the charts must 
be updated to the latest Local Notice to Mariners (LNM). Keeping a set of 
charts up to date every week can be a big drain on time; trust me I used to do 
it. The real problem was keeping all the other stuff you need to carry, like 
the Light List & Coast Pilot, on a passenger vessel up to date.

 

The way we kept up to date charts on the schooner of which I was Master was to 
periodically print a set of NOAA Booklet Charts for the area in which we did 
trips. NOAA now has a page on the chart website where you check the date of the 
most recent changes to a chart if you know the chart number, which makes 
printing a current Booklet Chart a fairly easy proposition. 

 

And at least in District 5, having a current Booklet Chart satisfies the 
carriage requirement for the USCG Certificate of Inspection so I assume it 
would also satisfy the requirement for an Uninspected Passenger Vessel (6 Pack) 
as well. 

 

Rick Brass

Washington, NC

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh Muckley 
via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2017 12:27 PM
To: C&C List 
Cc: Josh Muckley 
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

 

Even the ones that NOAA gives away aren't officially authorized for navigation. 
 The exception is when a certified chart printer is used to print the charts 
from the free files.  Obviously there is a charge for such services.

 

Josh 

 

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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

I agree with Dennis about not keeping batteries in the handheld GPS. This 
spring I threw away a Garmin Etrex and an older Magellan GPS that I had been 
keeping for the ditch bag. The batteries leaked and ruined the two GPSs.

 

Rick Brass

Washington, NC

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2017 10:46 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic 
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

 

Denis,

 

If you keep the GPS without the batteries, it would take longer to get the 
first fix. Since the 76 is a fairly old device (I have a 76s for 12 years; if I 
remember, it has only 24 MB of memory!) that first fix can take 15 minutes.

 

There is always a compromise.

 

Marek

 

 

 

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Water tank replacement

[Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List]

If you can’t find what you need from Kracor, try Ronco.  They have a lot of 
tank sizes and shapes to choose from (including the unique holding tank from a 
34).  Shipping costs are a bit of an issue because they come from California. 

From: Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 8:15 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Frederick G Street 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Water tank replacement

Jim — look at the following PDF.  I’m pretty sure the tanks you need are on 
page 11 — the 4071 and 5139 model: 

www.postaudio.net/webserver/Kracor_water_and_holding_tanks.pdf

Kracor is located in Wisconsin, and as far as I know, they can still supply 
these.

— Fred


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

  On Sep 18, 2017, at 5:21 PM, detroito91 via CnC-List  
wrote:

  Hello everyone
  Finally able how to remove the port water tank on my 38 landfall. The spray 
in foam held it secure. No to replace it. No repair since it had a 15" crack 
along the side.
  Question...does anyone happen to have the replacement number for this tank or 
other ideas.
  Thanks for all your knowledge this list gives me. 
  Jim Schwartz 
  38 landfall 
  SEA YA !
  washington nc 




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___

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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out

[Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List]

Good point, Michael.  There is a significant difference that I failed to 
mention between the in/out ignition switch and the push button, and in 
retrospect it may have been the push/pull that I replaced - It's been a lot of 
years, and I just replaced a different type of silver pushbutton switch on my 
37/40+.  

Good insights from all, 
 Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net


  From: Michael Brown via CnC-List 
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Michael Brown 
 Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 9:21 PM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
   
Hi Randy,

  a common wiring configuration has a positive wire coming from the starter stud
to the ignition switch in. The ignition switch out feeds the ignition coil, 
starter button
and gauges. If you pull the ignition switch on it should move the fuel gauge, 
ignition
off might return the gauge to empty.

  If so that will confirm power is getting to and through the ignition switch.

Michael Brown
Windburn
C&C 30-1


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2017 17:15:08 -0600
From: Randy Stafford 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List A4 Cutting Out
Message-ID: <8f1bd72a-bd6e-4e04-b0a3-4e09edff3...@comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Hi Doug,

No noise whatsoever when I pushed the starter button.  It was as if there 
wasn?t enough current to activate the starter, but the batteries *did* have 
enough charge at the time.

Cheers,
Randy

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

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   ___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

I’ve been thinking about upgrading the Garmin 541S (5”) plotter at the helm of 
Imzadi to a larger display (Old Eyes, I freely admit) so I’ve been looking at 
the alternatives from Garmin. I think all of those I’ve looked at come with 
Bluechart G2 charts for the entire US plus coastal Canadian waters.

 

Rick Brass

Washington, NC

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G 
Street via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 10:15 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Frederick G Street 
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

 

Oh, and I forgot to mention: as far as electronic charts go, all of the 
Raymarine plotters can be ordered with Navionics+ North America chips at a very 
reasonable cost; these charts are complete for BOTH US and Canadian waters, 
both coastal and inland.  I think the new Axiom 7” plotters from Raymarine are 
a particularly good value; fast new processors, the latest operating software 
and very attractive prices.

 

— Fred


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(

 

 

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Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

I see you used to be on Sailing Anarchy, too.

 

Rick Brass

Imzadi  C&C 38 mk2 #47

la Belle Aurore  C&C 25 mk1 #225

Washington, NC

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of jackbrennan 
via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 7:11 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: jackbrennan 
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

 

Other email sailing lists tend to be plagued by a scarcity of real experts, 
flamers, know nothings who believe they know it all, big personalities who 
argue at the drop of a hat and more. 

 

Jack Brennan

Former C&C 25

Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30

Tierra Verde, Fl.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Tab®|PRO



 Original message 
From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List 
Date:09/18/2017 5:51 PM (GMT-05:00) 
To: Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
Cc: Marek Dziedzic 
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none 

Fred,

 

Why are you suddenly so friendly? In the past non-C&C lurkers where threatened 
with keelhauling…

 

 

Marek 

1994 C270 legato

Ottawa, ON 

Sent from Mail   for Windows 10

 

From: Frederick G Street via CnC-List  
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 16:09
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com  
Cc: Frederick G Street  
Subject: Re: Stus-List GPS, Chart Plodders and Technology when there is none

 

 

On Sep 18, 2017, at 2:00 PM, David Castor via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

 

Mostly lurk on this list since I bought a Sabre instead of C&C. 

 

We forgive you…   :^)   Actually, my slip neighbor has a Sabre 36, and it’s a 
beautiful boat.  I may go that way someday, too.






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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing - Yanmar

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

The proper gear for sailing will depend on the transmission in the boat… and 
probably on the type/brand of propeller.  (My Gori prop suggests shifting to 
reverse to close the prop and then going to neutral. The old Martec needed to 
be in reverse to keep it closed.)

 

Bruce has answered the question for the Yanmar/Kanzaki combination. The manual 
for the Hurth transmission behind my Universal engine says it is best left in 
neutral, but reverse is OK. The Allison transmission on the schooner said to 
keep it in neutral  (as being in gear would damage the clutch discs) but 
strongly recommended a shaft brake to stop the fixed prop from windmilling. (It 
seems counterintuitive, but the manual said a non-rotating fixed blade prop - 
particularly one with 2 blades in a vertical orientation behind the keel - 
generated less drag than a windmilling prop.) Someone already pointed out that 
a Paragon doesn’t get lubricated if the engine is not running. I don’t know 
what a ZF or other transmission might require.

 

But I’m pretty sure that the transmission manufacturer web site or tech support 
will tell you what is correct for your particular combination of prop and 
transmission.

 

Rick Brass

Washington, NC

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh Muckley 
via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 9:31 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Josh Muckley 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Transmission position while sailing - Yanmar

 

I stand corrected.  Well done Bruce.  I'm still going to be putting mine in 
reverse.  DAMN THE TORPEDOS! 

 

Josh

 

 

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017, 9:18 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Hi Josh,

 

I was really curious when I read about the proper position of the shifter, and 
found multiple references of the following advisory purportedly from Yanmar as 
follows"

 

And for Yanmar/Kanzaki:

Advisory Number: MSA08-003:

DATE February 8, 2008 Dealers and OEMs
TO: All Marine   
Distributors
SUBJECT: Gear in Neutral While Sailing All MODELS:

All Sailboat Engines

We continue to get questions regarding the correct gear position while sailing 
with the engine OFF. This advisory is issued as a reminder; Yanmar requires 
that if sailing with the engine OFF (not running) the transmission shifter must 
be in the neutral position or internal damage to the gear or sail-drive will 
result. This damage will not be covered by Yanmar’s Limited Warranty. Please 
instruct customers and dealers who deliver the sailboat to the customer, of the 
correct (Neutral) position for the marine 
  gear while sailing.

If the customer desires that the propeller 
  shaft not spin while 
sailing, either a folding propeller, shaft break, or other suitable device may 
be used. However, Yanmar accepts no responsibility for the selection, 
installation  , or 
operation of such devices. Please also refer to Marine service 
  advisory 
“MSA07-001_Yanmar Sail Drive Propeller Selection” for additional information.

If you have any questions regarding this advisory please contact a Customer 
Support representative."


The reason for failure mode, as was describe to me, is that in reverse the 
clutch   cones can 
chatter, quiver or vibrate against one another causing wear which eventually 
leads to slippage and a gear box re-build. Many already know how difficult a 
Kanzaki   can be to get 
out of reverse after sailing with it locked.

Here's a quote from the SBO forums 
 :

Quote:

 

Originally Posted by glengrey 

Unfortunately I can attest to the proper Yanmar gear position. In the summer of 
2008 my transmission (Kansaki on a 3GM30F engine) started slipping. Engine had 
440 hours. always placed gear in reverse when sailing. After considerable 
discussion with Yamnar they advised they would not consider warranty (was 
passed the hours for that anyway). Upshot is new transmission. They advised 
that the cone clutch   
does "quiver" (my term) even though locked into reverse, producing wear and 
eventually slippage.

 

I don't like believing everything I read on the internet, but I kept coming 
across this advisory.

 

Hope this helps, 

Bruce Whitmore

(847) 404-5092 (mobile)
bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net  

 


  _  


From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> >
To: C&C List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > 
Cc: Josh Muckley mailto:muckl...@gmail.com> >
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 9:12 PM
Subject: Re: Stu

Re: Stus-List Water tank replacement

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

I’m guessing it is a 5064 or 5068 on page 30 of the catalog. The 5064 comes in 
a port & starboard configuration, but 61” seems too long to me.  Jim and I can 
measure the old tank in the morning.

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G 
Street via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 8:15 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Frederick G Street 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Water tank replacement

 

Jim — look at the following PDF.  I’m pretty sure the tanks you need are on 
page 11 — the 4071 and 5139 model:

 

www.postaudio.net/webserver/Kracor_water_and_holding_tanks.pdf 
 

 

Kracor is located in Wisconsin, and as far as I know, they can still supply 
these.

 

— Fred


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

 

On Sep 18, 2017, at 5:21 PM, detroito91 via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

 

Hello everyone

Finally able how to remove the port water tank on my 38 landfall. The spray in 
foam held it secure. No to replace it. No repair since it had a 15" crack along 
the side.

Question...does anyone happen to have the replacement number for this tank or 
other ideas.

Thanks for all your knowledge this list gives me. 

Jim Schwartz 

38 landfall 

SEA YA !

washington nc 

 

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