[Cooker] XFree86 patch for bug 5906
I just want by this message to draw attention on the availability of a XFree86 approved patch for Bug 5906 (committed in XFree86 CVS tomorrow from the last news I got) Please see http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=5906 Regards, Hugues Fournier
[Cooker] [Bug 6003] [Hardware] New: usb drivers are not stable
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6003 Product: Hardware Component: Hardware Summary: usb drivers are not stable Product: Hardware Version: 9.2-0.7mdk Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P2 Component: Hardware AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] after installing, my radeon drivers did not work, so I tried to install them from the ati website. after that, i could not read my usb zip drive any longer. In the kernel log, it seems like the is an interrupt request problem: usb.c and usb-ehci.c are most frequently reported. In the usb view program, i get the error: cannot open /proc/bus/usb/devices -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
[Cooker] And next ?
It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? - How to have more contributors? And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. -- Warly
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Warly wrote: - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? Well maybe a bit too many problems with mirrors. And the mirror list could be improved a bit (new looks, new mirrors added, old ones removed) And it would be nice to get beta testers start testing earlier and not too late when the development is almost at the end. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. Eliminate problems with mirrors and get testers to participate earlier in the development process and more actively. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. Maybe people should get their username and password mailed right after they register. I have a feeling that Wiki is a little bit messy now and I guess it will get even messier when more content is added. So I think it would be a good idea to make it easier to find the information needed. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? I think this would be a good idea. Maybe at least one snapshot between two beta/RC releases. And there should be more snapshots before beta 1 so that people can try it and test it earlier. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? Support Mandrake Linux fan sites where people help end users if they have problems. There should also be some list of these sites so that new users know where they can get help (preferebly in their native language offcourse). And then we must help as much as we can. - How to have more contributors? I think that more people would contribute if they knew how simple it is to do that. So there should be a lot of information on how to do it and this should be easily reachable. And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Just keep being so open with development project (or even more) and thanks to all developers and beta testers and translators and artists for such a great distro.
[Cooker] [Bug 5864] [suspend-scripts] suspend is no longer available in gnome menu
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=5864 [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added Status|RESOLVED|REOPENED Resolution|FIXED | --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 12:29 --- fixed? with which package? I don't see it fixed... -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: REOPENED creation_date: description: The menu entry for suspend is no longer available in the GNOME menu. This might be caused by the rename of pmsuspend to pmsuspend2?
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
This is my first day and the first post in this list :) - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. I believe that in this actual GNU/Linux distros market, like any other market, only those with exclusive or catching features may get popular and eventually successful. MandrakeClub is already a plus for MdkLinux as well as the available support and information base. As MdkLinux user i would like to suggest some ideas for the upcoming releases: 1. For the download version, one-CD release for a basic installation of a standard desktop computer. This could include one WM (see 2), one Office package, etc. The idea is that with such a CD anyone could have a full featured desktop without messing drawning in thousands of RPMs. For first-time users, one CD might be less confusing and less time consuming (downloading and burning). The rest of packages would come in 2-3 extra CDs. 2. Using Xfce4 (or other light weight) as default WM. Almost all distros come with one WM in the default installation (KDE or Gnome). The adventages of using such a light weight WM are (IMO): 2.1 The space-saving of a light WM (ie Xfce4) could allow to fit all necessary packages in one-CD full featured installation (see 1). 2.2 Better GUI experience. An improved responsiveness and overall performance, compared to KDE and Gnome, for (almost) any computer configuration. Xfce4 offers enough eye candy and performance to charm many first-time users. 2.3 Mandrake might potentially offer a completely Mandrake-styled GUI. MdkGalaxy allows the use of KDE and Gnome applications with the same look, therefore, finally a coherent GUI. 2.4 Including Superkaramba plus some Mandrake-styled themes is a catching feature that many users will like, mostly the first-time ones. 3. Installation profiles. Sometime in the early installation process the program could ask the user whether he/she would like a expert or default installtion. The default option could show several installation profiles. Several profiles from minimum to full. In the full profile and expert mode options, the user would get asked how many of the CDs has so urpm can prepare the adecuate list of packages (i really miss this option from earlier Mdk versions). - What should we do to improve the Wiki. The only thing i can think of is advertising it in the MandrakeClub website. I bet not many users know of its existence. This would help to have it in several languages as well. I propose to include a permanent link in MandrakeClub´s site and send a notice to it so users will know of it.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Hi! On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 10:19:44 +0200 Warly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. - mdk seems to develop/change their own tools (Drak* - with the exception of urpmi and rpmdrake) just before the release, with sometimes major changes even after a release candidate. If this stuff would be finished earlier, it could be tested in cooker. - some mdk developers don't seem to use/like bugzilla?! - some packages have a maintainer who is not really the maintainer of this package (i.e. most changes are done by someone else), so a bug report isn't assigned to the correct person. A proposal how development/mdk could be a bit different: - change release cycle for full blown releases to about once a year - provide updates for packages (or group of packages) when ready (i.e. copy them into main if no bugs are left...) - maybe provide update CDs from time to time I guess this or similar things were proposed several times now, but distribution through MdkClub seems to be an option now. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. It would be nice if it could post change notifications not only once a day but at once. I also don't like the time consuming process to get an account for it. Everyone should be able to get one as easy as a bugzilla account. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? That would be similar to the above model - but it would give the normal user the advantage that those released packages are tested a bit... -- Michael Reinsch [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mr.uue.org pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
[Cooker] Re: And next?
Hi I will discuss drakconnect and my perceptions. This setup has two boxes, a firewall with Mdk 9.1 and a user box with different Linux distributions. Firewall setup. My firewall has a stable IP and many local DNS's. During setup I only have the right to setup one DNS server. The reason for more DNS servers might be justified as this is a university student LAN. = Mdk has minimized the Linux way of choice, for graphical reasons? When going to the next card I am giving the IP for eth1 as 192.168.1.1. But to my memory I am not asked for a 'local LAN name server' deposit. Thus two choices are hidden to me, if I want the router to know the names of the local LAN and, compared to Microsoft, if I want the router to have a per session cache for most visited URL's. As this setup does not function I have to visit 'drakconnect sharing', and find that the name on eth0 is given to eth1 as well, and that 192.168.1.1 is setup as DNS server for 192.168.1.252. Slackware advices its user to not allow 192.169.1.1 to be given as DNS server for speed reasons. This is what I call a communistic decission tree, which comes out as authoritarian in your view. That is to say the right way to do it has already been choosen. Thus the reason for the decission is the right one not a choosen one of many possible ones. This leads to a Linux specific question: Is the GUI interface used to hide or help a newbie? I have always thought that the hiding of a text boot to a newbie is stupid. As long as every decission taken is given a 'OK' then no newbie should have to be afraid of what a large enterprice a server is. Along this line I think that possible decissions should be shown and the position for the user to enlarge or widen his choice by a later come back should be adviced. Thus Mdk should have 'navigation plan' as in Navigare necesse est vivere non est necesse. To me this plan has to coincide with the plan from the user community, if you want them to cooperate in its fullfillment. Personally I have always found the Mdk boot structure stupid as it had no way to stop an installation and cleanly jump out. Thus you may have to go as RedHat, not mount and format until every choice by the user is done. regards guran -- Mandrake Linux Cooker 9.2 kernel-2.4.22.10mdk-1-1mdk VERSION:20030924 21:50 Only in a society that has 'a priori' defined what is the truth can the result from the evolution of life be defined false.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 10:19:44AM +0200, Warly wrote: - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? No. I don't need ISO's at all during development. 'rsync'ing to a local server and installing via net from there is cheap, fast and reliable. I would like to see more focus on Mandrake AutoInstall. Liebe Grüße, Nora. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] IM-NETZ Neue Medien, Berlin http://www.im-netz.de/ WWW von Frauen für Frauen, Hamburghttp://www.w4w.net/ Lesbian Computer Networks, Helsinki http://www.sappho.net/
Re: [Cooker] Re: And next?
söndagen den 28 september 2003 13.23 skrev guran: Thus Mdk should have 'navigation plan' as in Navigare necesse est vivere non est necesse. To me this plan has to coincide with the plan from the user community, if you want them to cooperate in its fullfillment. Here is a discussion 'navigation plan'. Assume the user and a community member to interested in the last and the fastest Linux box from Mdk. Thus the package selection should be directed to the user decissions and not to the usual Linux way of sorting packages. Tree: 1 a = newbie and b = fast, in b a possibility to choose a i686 kernel Tree: Multimedia, 2 a = standard and b = preemptive kernel. Tree: GUI, 3 a = standard KDE and b = everything from KDE c. Tree: Office, 4 a = OO suit b = KDE-office c = LyX regards guran -- Mandrake Linux Cooker 9.2 kernel-2.4.22.10mdk-1-1mdk VERSION:20030924 21:50 Only in a society that has 'a priori' defined what is the truth can the result from the evolution of life be defined false.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
What about a metadistro with a cdrom (in the future a dvdrom) runing Mandrake from the cd-driver? similar to Knoppix but with all the Mandrake goodies. Lot of people has started to use linux after a successfull Knoppix/Gnome-live cd experience. Regards Francisco Alcaraz Murcia (Spain)
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Am Sonntag, 28. September 2003 10:19 schrieb Warly: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - the mirror situation - the mailinglists were eating mails (on all lists, not just cooker) Its just time now, to do anything about it. - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. That would be cool imho. It saves time and bandwith to be able to focus on topics on is interested in. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. going further in the direction, we are moving :) - What should we do to improve the Wiki. More clear information, on how to participate. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? I think no. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? HowTos, Information, howtos. Fixing drakconnect. - How to have more contributors? Decreasing time consumption and power needed to participate. It was sometimes like fighting against windmills to get heared on the cooker list. Splitting up the lists could help here. And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Fix drakconnect. IMHO drakconnect is in a lot of ways the weakest point of mandrake. On the other hand it so hard to fix problems that drakconnect could cause, because the needed informations may be on the net, that you can't reach. So it has to be number one priority to make absolutly sure, that all net related things work flawless. I could count countless facts here, but there was allready a lot of discussion about it. The need is bigger to document them on the wiki (drakconnect, drakfirewall, drakgw ) Steffen
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sunday 28 September 2003 13:17, Michael Reinsch wrote: Hi! - some packages have a maintainer who is not really the maintainer of this package (i.e. most changes are done by someone else), so a bug report isn't assigned to the correct person. we all receive bugreport for all packages, but, this is right, this could be improved. A proposal how development/mdk could be a bit different: - change release cycle for full blown releases to about once a year no, because hardware change so often that 1 year is too long to have the hardware supported. 6 month allow people to have their new hardware without too much problem. This question has been so discussed that i think it should go in a FAQ on the wiki :) -- Michaël Scherer
Re: [Cooker] How to write a Mandrake HOWTO ?
On Fri, 26 Sep 2003 18:09, Austin wrote: Old corporate style is official and looks nice (use XML-related format or whatever), and can be edited with your favorite editor, but can't be transferred easily to the wiki, where most docs should reside IMHO. At the very least, it draws people to the wiki. New community style is to write the doc on the wiki. Problem is editing a large document in a web browser, no syntax highlighting, etc. Does anyone know of an editor for wiki markup? Also, the document is then not easily published elsewhere. Is there an easy way to convert wiki markup to pure HTML, or PDF, or some other publishing format? This is something that should be sorted out, as doc writing is an amazing source of free labour, and allows not-so-technical people to help out too. The alternative is to regularly update the formal doc from the Wiki, and occasionally browse the Wiki for new formal-doc candidates. Some effort required, but cut-and-paste isn't as hard as thinking up and typing the text in the first place. A first-pass Wiki-to-corporate translator script would probably be helpful. Cheers; Leon
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Hi! On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 14:22:14 +0200 Steffen Barszus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - How to have more contributors? Decreasing time consumption and power needed to participate. It was sometimes like fighting against windmills to get heared on the cooker list. Splitting up the lists could help here. I am against splitting up cooker list because I think nearly everyone will end up subscribing all/most of those lists. And another problem we will see: which list is the correct one for my question / proposal / discussion? So people will CC all lists which might be concerned which will bring us even more traffic. You might want to have a look at OpenOffice.org. They have several mailing lists for each sub project. This is (imho) quite confusing and you see a lot of CCs. -- Michael Reinsch [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mr.uue.org pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
[Cooker] Re: And next ?
Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? the mirror situation, of course Also, a lot of MDK developers got heavy into bugfixing the last couple weeks before release, and they weren't done when we cut the release. They should have started earlier. - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. As long as each sublist is available as a newsgroup (be it gmane or whatever). - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. I think for 9.3 we need to focus on bugfixing and polishing. The only major change should be the switch to the freedesktop.org menu system. Other than that, there shouldn't be any major innovations, or overhauls (yet again) of DrakX. One release cycle focusing on just making sure things work could go a long way to improve our image. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. good question - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? If they were only distributed with bittorrent, they wouldn't hurt anything. I wouldn't have a need for them, but if others could use them, go for it. I just wouldn't want too much additional load on the mirrors. One nice thing about doing it is it would for you to keep mkcd working ;o) - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? make it so things just work. - How to have more contributors? Better docs, and reaching out to the fedora people for some collaboration. And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Harness the power of the community to increase the visibility and support of contrib.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Le Dimanche 28 Septembre 2003 13:48, Nora Etukudo a écrit : On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 10:19:44AM +0200, Warly wrote: - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? No. I don't need ISO's at all during development. 'rsync'ing to a local server and installing via net from there is cheap, fast and reliable. This is not my opinion. Some problems are only found with a fresh install or an upgrade of a previous stable distribution. -- Pierre Jarillon - http://pjarillon.free.fr/ Vice-président de l'ABUL : http://abul.org/
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
- What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? - How to have more contributors? And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Way to much make it preety and not enough make it work. there should be a Wiki section on bugs for when bugzilla goes down Split into ? ( programs - bugzilla output - mandrake as a whole?) More documentation at each stage Expand it so that it becomes the Mandrake Bible/Grimore Yes IF AND AS THEY ARE SAFE TO INSTALL (99.9%) Make the distro better improve/ build current loopback distros
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 10:19:44AM +0200, Warly wrote: - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? I think the targets for a release should be set much earlier in the process. Especially targets for nr of major bugs in the software to be released. Focus more on a small set of features that should work perfectly and others that are nice to have but not critical. This should be clearly linked with how people use mandrake-linux. - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. I don't know, the only thing that can be annoying are the bugreports from bugzilla, but then again, they can trigger a response from a large group, which can lead to a quicker confirmation (or lack thereof). - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. be clearer in the goals and criteria for the target. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. separate development and use-guides - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? would be nice, but maybe another approach would be better: every week, freeze cooker so the mirrors can catch up. Make sure a network upgrade can be done without glitches and have a few days of testing of the current status. Fixes can then be added for the next freeze. (Not being a package developer, I have no idea whether this is feasible!) - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? reduce the amount of BUT arguments in the reviews by making sure the things that should work, just work! It is also important to know what should work and what is just a bonus. - How to have more contributors? respect! And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. the club needs an overhaul! Apart from the donation aspect I see no reason to join it. I hope this helps! Simon
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Le Dimanche 28 Septembre 2003 14:46, Michael Reinsch a écrit : Steffen Barszus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Decreasing time consumption and power needed to participate. It was sometimes like fighting against windmills to get heared on the cooker list. Splitting up the lists could help here. I am against splitting up cooker list because I think nearly everyone will end up subscribing all/most of those lists. And another problem we will see: which list is the correct one for my question / proposal / discussion? So people will CC all lists which might be concerned which will bring us even more traffic. I wish a split of the mailing list with a counterpart, a daily abstract of the activity of each list. This could be automaticaly made by a list of all new subjects with a link to http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ and all the new contributions to bugzilla with a link to http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/ The daily report (or shorter is traffic is high) should have 3 items: - number of occurences in the day - subject - link -- Pierre Jarillon - http://pjarillon.free.fr/ Vice-président de l'ABUL : http://abul.org/
[Cooker] Some apps for next mandrake
Hi ! I just want propose two apps for next mandrake. _Typo3_ This one is a full blown CMS. Its really nice, has a lot of possibilities. It has further some big references. http://www.typo3.org I have no clue how webapps are packaged. But it would be nice if one could just urpmi typo3 and start to work. There are too some plugins for it. (webshop etc.) _XFCE4 _ This one should be a good alternative to the big ones. A pitty that it was released to late. Hope i get around to test it in future. Steffen
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 09:19, Warly wrote: - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? The beta/RC process is flawed as heavy development continues during the beta/RC process. If Mandrake tools have to change (new features, fix incorrect behaviour, etc) then they should be changed based on a set of requirements for the release. These changes should be implemented before the test cycle starts. Also one of the very important step is the installation. From the 1st beta/alpha we should be using updated boot images so that early in the test cycle we catch hardware pbms. For example, 9.2 beta1 I believe was using boot images from 9.1... The mirrors were a pain in the backside... - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. Not sure spliting the ML will improve things. People will end up posting to all MLs raising the signal to noise ratio for all lists. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. - Complete all developments before the test cycle begins - Start with an alpha release (1w) - then beta1 (2w) - then beta2 (2w) - last chance to include new software releases - then beta3 (2w) - only bug, security fixes maybe a new software release (after approval) + polish - then RC1 (2w) - bug and security fixes only + polish - then RC2 (2w) - bug and security fixes only + polish RC status should be given when no major/blocker bugs remain in CVS. Period for beta/RC should be flexible from 1w to 3w. For each beta/RC it would be nice to have a summary of what bugs were fixed, how much remains etc... A nice changelog/errata to indicate what is known to not work. That may be a different subject but the MandrakeSoft web sites need a serious change of look... Can I say fedora and gentoo? - What should we do to improve the Wiki. Contains its messy spreading. Make sure the information is valid. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? If it allows some users to do more testing then why not. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? Show that the QA is top-notch by allowing sufficient time for the test cycle to change your strategy if/when more testing is required. Make sure that developers update bugzilla properly with indication of packages version where a fix was made so that we can re-test the fix. - How to have more contributors? And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. -- Frederic Soulier [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 03:05:48PM +0200, Pierre Jarillon wrote: This is not my opinion. Some problems are only found with a fresh install or an upgrade of a previous stable distribution. Well, I don't like upgrades, I do only fresh installs. Liebe Grüße, Nora. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] IM-NETZ Neue Medien, Berlin http://www.im-netz.de/ WWW von Frauen für Frauen, Hamburghttp://www.w4w.net/ Lesbian Computer Networks, Helsinki http://www.sappho.net/
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Michael Reinsch wrote: - some packages have a maintainer who is not really the maintainer of this package (i.e. most changes are done by someone else), so a bug report isn't assigned to the correct person. And sometimes they make gratuitous changes to the spec file without even testing that the package works after the modification (hint: a package that builds isn't equal to a package that builds *correctly* and works). Bye -- Que les importa a las viudas, a los huérfanos, a los desvalidos si las masacres se hacen en nombre del totalitarismo o en el sagrado nombre de la libertad y la democracia. Mahatma Gandhi (1869 - 1948) pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
[Cooker] Gigabyte Realtek Audio Controller (was Re: Boot images)
Of course, I was not thinking when I sent this out and did not include specifics of the problem with the sound. Testing with XMMS: ALSA: No output to speakers. OSS: Normal playback but with interspersed and frequent garbled sound. Artsd (with OSS selected as Audio I/O): Works perfectly (-wierd-). Artsd (autoselect I/O): Just loud static, no other sound. Testing with MPlayer: ALSA: Audio appears to be working, but Audio and Video go at ~1.2x speed. OSS: Works normally. Artsd (Any I/O setting): Loud static. Basically any use of Artsd results in a large amount of loud static and nothing else. Setting OSS as the Audio I/O seems to work for the first few outputs, then it reverts to the static. All of the below information still applies. Michael Altizer wrote: Thomas Backlund wrote: snip but when you use the blank.img you can't easily support any modules, or initrd, so you have to build a custom kernel, where you can use the above mentioned config as a start, but you have to remove is's module and initrd support...(chosing 'N' in the xconfig/menuconfig/config) and every h/w and fs you need to support during installation, has to be compiled in... (chosing 'Y' in the xconfig/menuconfig/config) Now, the next question is of course... why do you need to do all this? Doesn't the installerkernel support your system? Regards Thomas I was troubleshooting since I was having numerous problems when trying to install, but it turned out to be that my RAM was being run at .1V too low :). (Silly Gigabyte 8KNXP board defaults to 2.5V for memory modules.) I was still getting an error with network.img after fixing this, the installation exiting after downloading, it seems, only part of the second stage install (exits with error about not being able to execute /bin/installstage2 or somesuch), but I was able to install from newly burned RC2 CDs. On a semi-related note, has anyone found a way to use the integrated soundcard on a Gigabyte 8KNXP board? lspci reports: /00:1f.5 Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corp. 82801EB AC'97 Audio Controller (rev 02)/ Motherboard info says the chip is Realtek ALC655 CODEC (i875P) ALSA wants to use snd-intel8x0 module, but also appears to be loading up a number of oss modules. /snd-seq-oss 37088 0 (unused) snd-seq-midi-event 6592 0 [snd-seq-oss] snd-seq 49904 2 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event] snd-pcm-oss 46820 0 snd-mixer-oss15992 0 [snd-pcm-oss] snd-intel8x0 24004 0 snd-ac97-codec 50072 0 [snd-intel8x0] snd-pcm 89856 0 [snd-pcm-oss snd-intel8x0] snd-page-alloc 10068 0 [snd-intel8x0 snd-pcm] snd-timer 21092 0 [snd-seq snd-pcm] snd-mpu401-uart 5436 0 [snd-intel8x0] snd-rawmidi 19520 0 [snd-mpu401-uart] snd-seq-device 6300 0 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq snd-rawmidi] snd 45476 0 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq snd-pcm-oss snd-mixer-oss snd-intel8x0 snd-ac97-codec snd-pcm snd-timer snd-mpu401-uart snd-rawmidi snd-seq-device] soundcore 7236 0 [snd] / -Michael
[Cooker] [Bug 6004] [Installation] New: Installation locked changing sound driver at summary 9.2RC2
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6004 Product: Installation Component: Installation Summary: Installation locked changing sound driver at summary 9.2RC2 Product: Installation Version: 1.847 Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: blocker Priority: P2 Component: Installation AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] At the summary, change of the sound driver snd-emu10k1 by emu10k1 locks the installation. The summary screen remains blank. The sound card is a Soundblaster Live 1024 which does not work with the driver snd-emu10k1. The bug is a blocking one because harddrake does not register correctly the change of the sound driver. The installation bug exists stiil in 9.1, but nor the harddrake bug. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
Re: [Cooker] Re: And next?
Le Dimanche 28 Septembre 2003 13:23, guran a écrit : I will discuss drakconnect and my perceptions. I have a similar perception... The architecture of drakconnect must be rebuilt. I wish an extensive use of profiles. Examples: home eth0adslfirewall on 10.0.0.10 eth1lan firewall off192.168.33.1 internet-routed demo1 usb adslfirewall on eth0unused eth1lan firewall offdhcp demo2 modem56kfirewall on eth0lan firewall off192.168.0.2 eth1unused Each configuration is built on the name of the profile. The firewall on internet is different from the firewall on LAN. The IP addresses can change with the profile, the rules for the firewall too. It would be better to ask for a profile, an interface and ask what do you want to do with it ? -- Pierre Jarillon - http://pjarillon.free.fr/ Vice-président de l'ABUL : http://abul.org/
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Michael Reinsch wrote: Hi! On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 14:22:14 +0200 Steffen Barszus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - How to have more contributors? Decreasing time consumption and power needed to participate. It was sometimes like fighting against windmills to get heared on the cooker list. Splitting up the lists could help here. I am against splitting up cooker list because I think nearly everyone will end up subscribing all/most of those lists. And another problem we will see: which list is the correct one for my question / proposal / discussion? So people will CC all lists which might be concerned which will bring us even more traffic. You might want to have a look at OpenOffice.org. They have several mailing lists for each sub project. This is (imho) quite confusing and you see a lot of CCs. I agree with not splitting the list into subcatagories, but one thing that really should be done is splitting the bug reports to a different list, though replies should still go to the main cooker list. (Note: I just use a filter to move bug reports to their own folder for seperate reading, but to many who don't take the time to do so they may complain about the abundance of emails. Also this would be easier on the dialup crowd since Bugzilla emails make up ~33% of the received emails.) -Michael
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 09:19, Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? Similar to 9.1 - RC stage too early so loads of major stuff was fixed while in RC, poor communication from the managerial level of mdksoft, late introduction of big new features. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. Slightly longer freeze period, with more betas and fewer RCs - stick to the standard definition of an RC, i.e., something you really, truly believe could be released, not late beta as the MDKsoft definition seems to be. Releasing beta-quality release candidates hurts Mandrake's reputation, as people download RC1 expecting something close to final and find something quite buggy. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? IMHO, no - not official ones, anyway. I doubt many people use 'em, and if anyone wants to supply them they can always roll their own from a cooker mirror with the image creation tools. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? Hmm. Apart from our current role of covering up for the corporation's stuff-ups (see the advertising fiasco), can't think of a lot. - How to have more contributors? Make contrib more widely known about - it's hard to have contributors when people aren't even aware there's a place for their contributions to live... HTH. -- adamw
Re: [Cooker] kde-3.2-alpha2 for test.
Le ven 26/09/2003 à 16:25, jokerman64 a écrit : On Friday 26 September 2003 14:16, FACORAT Fabrice wrote: Le jeu 25/09/2003 à 16:09, Laurent Montel a écrit : I compile all with --enable-debug=full = -g3 I don't know if this is related but quanta is pretty unusable ! I have a big 3000+ lines PHP file, and quanta eat 99% CPU, is sloo and when I write something it takes more than 10 seconds to write it in editor ( Athlon XP 1900+, 256Mo ). On top of that it forgets my old syntax highlighting settings. yeah, syntax highlighting is gone but i think it's cause you have to download them. Check out configure editor highlighting. There is a download button there that automatically download whichever highlighting schemes you select I did it and I had php and css highlighting but it was very very slow.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 09:19, Warly wrote: BTW, I guess this thread is a good place to bring this in. I now think I actually understand the whole Red Hat / Fedora situation - RH are basically cutting the consumer desktop loose as a supported segment, and making it more of a community-supported, low-key affair. Obviously this isn't going to be Mandrake's future, but what is MDK's response likely to be? Is there the potential to move to a system of rolling updates rather than monolithic releases, with most users following the Cooker method of continually updating, only obviously not as often for the stable tree? -- adamw
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 14:05, Pierre Jarillon wrote: Le Dimanche 28 Septembre 2003 13:48, Nora Etukudo a écrit : On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 10:19:44AM +0200, Warly wrote: - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? No. I don't need ISO's at all during development. 'rsync'ing to a local server and installing via net from there is cheap, fast and reliable. This is not my opinion. Some problems are only found with a fresh install or an upgrade of a previous stable distribution. Read the message you reply to more carefully. rsyncing from a Cooker mirror gives you a complete tree from which you can happily run an installation or upgrade. Indeed, the message actually says 'rsync'ing to a local server and installing via net from there... -- adamw
Re: [Cooker] screem-0.8.1
Le sam 27/09/2003 à 21:16, Charles A Edwards a écrit : If anyone should be interested in using 0.8.1 I have made avaiable http://www.eslrahc.com/screem-0.8.1-0.1mdk.cae.i586.rpm I don't have syntax color highlighting with a PHP and CSS files ... (screem:2637): Gtk-CRITICAL **: file ../../gtk/gtkwindow.c: line 2972 (gtk_window_resize): assertion `width 0' failed ** (screem:2637): CRITICAL **: file pango-color.c: line 952 (pango_color_parse): assertion `spec != NULL' failed ** (screem:2637): CRITICAL **: file pango-color.c: line 952 (pango_color_parse): assertion `spec != NULL' failed
Re: [Cooker] mplayer security problem
Am Samstag, 27. September 2003, 15:25:35 Uhr MET, schrieb Vincent Danen: Attached is the diff against the 0.91 version. This is all that is required to fix the problem? The only other diff between 0.91 and 0.92 is the changed version number. I'm afraid there could be more buffer overflow errors in mplayer, so please don't run it as root. -- What difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy? Mahatma Gandhi (1869 - 1948), Non-Violence in Peace and War
[Cooker] Status of the kernel 2.6 in contrib
Hi, I tryed to install the kernel 2.6 on a fresh cooker, everything were okay except : 2:kernel-2.6.0-0.test5.1mdk## No module aic7xxx found for kernel 2.6.0-0.test5.1mdk No module aic7xxx found for kernel 2.6.0-0.test5.1mdk Why the module is not built in the kernel ? Bug ? BR Laurent
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Le Dimanche 28 Septembre 2003 10:19, Warly a écrit : It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? Some problems with mirors mainly - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. And switch to mailman ? sympa is sometime buggy and die, so no mails are send, remember weekend :) - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? No, iso need work to have something runnable, so a short freeze should be necesary. I think, it's too must work, I wonder how many ppl create they own iso, or do a network install in contrast. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? better packaging and time to forget earlier errors :) - How to have more contributors? Give more visibility to contrib/ ppl doesn't know of easy they can create a rpm for mdk. A more easier way to add rpm in contrib would be nice too? Emmanuel
[Cooker] [Bug 6005] [harddrake] New: Change of sound driver efective in memory, but not on HDD
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6005 Product: harddrake Component: harddrake Summary: Change of sound driver efective in memory, but not on HDD Product: harddrake Version: 9.2-16mdk Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: blocker Priority: P2 Component: harddrake AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9.2RC2 Sound card Soundblaster Live 1024. Works only with OSS driver emu10k1. Changing the driver from snd-emu10k1 is effective in memory. The sound works. But after reboot, the old driver snd-emu10k1 comes in memory. It is a blocker bug because the installation fails when doing the driver change. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
Re: [Cooker] Suggestion for program inclusion
On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 02:50:04AM -0300, Damian Gatabria wrote: I think it makes a great addition to mkisofs and bchunk. Tarball (8.1Kb) can be downloaded at: http://gregory.kokanosky.free.fr/v4/linux/nrg2iso.en.html Of course, when i say inclusion, i'm referring to 9.3/10.0. ;oP packaged it at http://www.comedia.it/~bluca/cooker/misc/ if noone objects i would add it to contribs later L. -- Luca Berra -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Communication Media Services S.r.l. /\ \ / ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN XAGAINST HTML MAIL / \
[Cooker] [Bug 6006] [Bugzilla] New: No password was sent to my email address so I had to force it by
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6006 Product: Bugzilla Component: Bugzilla Summary: No password was sent to my email address so I had to force it by Product: Bugzilla Version: 2.17.4 Platform: Other OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P2 Component: Bugzilla AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] No password was sent to my email address when I created an account at MandrakeSoft Bugzilla. So I had to force it by submitting a request to change my password. That resulted in an immediately delivered email that I could use to activate my account. Either no email was sent to me when I created an account at MandrakeSoft Bugzilla or it never arrived at my email address or some other reason. vatbier -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
Re: [Cooker] Some apps for next mandrake
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 21:39, Steffen Barszus wrote:
I just want propose two apps for next mandrake.
_Typo3_
_XFCE4 _
KDE 3.2 ('tis gunna be _awesome_ :-)
Move NeverBall in from Contrib. Very addictive!
I'd personally like to shovel at least half of Contrib into the main
distro, but I can't see the 'Drakes being too happy about the extra
maintenance burden. (-:
Cheers; Leon
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Le dim 28/09/2003 à 14:30, Michael Altizer a écrit : Michael Reinsch wrote: Hi! On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 14:22:14 +0200 Steffen Barszus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - How to have more contributors? Decreasing time consumption and power needed to participate. It was sometimes like fighting against windmills to get heared on the cooker list. Splitting up the lists could help here. I am against splitting up cooker list because I think nearly everyone will end up subscribing all/most of those lists. And another problem we will see: which list is the correct one for my question / proposal / discussion? So people will CC all lists which might be concerned which will bring us even more traffic. You might want to have a look at OpenOffice.org. They have several mailing lists for each sub project. This is (imho) quite confusing and you see a lot of CCs. I agree with not splitting the list into subcatagories, but one thing that really should be done is splitting the bug reports to a different list, though replies should still go to the main cooker list. (Note: I just use a filter to move bug reports to their own folder for seperate reading, but to many who don't take the time to do so they may complain about the abundance of emails. Also this would be easier on the dialup crowd since Bugzilla emails make up ~33% of the received emails.) -Michael 100% agree. put bugzilla on its own ML. Having bugzilla on cooker ML is disturbing and on top of that you can't respond directly as you do with cooker. So this is really appart. People wanting to log bugs will join this special ML and everything will be fine. At this time I have 655 unread bugzilla mails ! I will take me more than a day to read everything ( and skip what I don't want ).
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Francisco Alcaraz wrote: What about a metadistro with a cdrom (in the future a dvdrom) runing Mandrake from the cd-driver? similar to Knoppix but with all the Mandrake goodies. # urpmi mklivecd # mklivecd livecd.iso # cdrecord dev=0,0,0 livecd.iso (of course, there is still some work to do, and you might want to change some defaults). I have a 195MB ISO with minimal KDE and grass + sample data that works quite well, just using this method. Hardawre detection is done by the hwdetect perl script (uses Mandrake hardware detection libraries - and needs some testing). Lot of people has started to use linux after a successfull Knoppix/Gnome-live cd experience. I agree, and I would like to see: - a semi-official live CD ISO (or CD placed in ProSuite boxes) - configurations ditributed for/with mklivecd that mimic some of the popular KNOPPIX-based distros. I have some work to do before I have an ISO that is better (easier to use, more GIS apps, much smaller ISO) than GIS-Knoppix. It would be nice to see someone contribute a GNOPPIX one, I will try and do a KNOPPIX-like one also, and some others are working on some other ones (surpise!). For more info, see http://minicd.berlios.de and http://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/minicd-scripts BTW, some constraints of a bootable distro will hopefully make for some improvements in Mandrake, as you are happy to change a setting once for an installation, but not every time you boot a live cd (in my case I want my display card to default to 16bit like it does on Knoppix instead of 24bit as on Mandrake which gives screen artefacts). Regards, Buchan -- |Registered Linux User #182071-| Buchan MilneMechanical Engineer, Network Manager Cellphone * Work+27 82 472 2231 * +27 21 8828820x121 Stellenbosch Automotive Engineering http://www.cae.co.za GPG Key http://ranger.dnsalias.com/bgmilne.asc 1024D/60D204A7 2919 E232 5610 A038 87B1 72D6 AC92 BA50 60D2 04A7 * Please click on http://www.cae.co.za/disclaimer.htm to read our e-mail disclaimer or send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] for a copy. *
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
(I sent it once, but i beleave it was lost too deep inside another thread). I always see Mandrake as a desktop distro, so my wishes are from that side. mcc: * bring back capabilities for changing the lilo/grub theme * real support for linmodems (even if the drivers will not be on the d/l edition) * in 8.2 it had themes, where did they go? * lirc mcc module mdk-kdm: * if could not bring X up, write a messages in console like gdm does * full screen greeter (again gdm like) * if no key pressed in X secs, log in as ... (again from gdm) * avility to run some program for changing the background (roottv for example) misc: * add the mouse cursors packages to main * l10n for Mozilla * l10n for OO.org * bring FireBird to main instead of Mozilla * use also apt-get (with the same repositories, IMHO this can be done no?), let the user which app use to install rpms. * bring sim to main * patch wine to be able to use mono's winforms * mono in mdk out of the box! (if sharp develop will run on mono bring it on baby!) IMHO gcc and glibc can stay at thecurrent version, unless the bugs in gcc will be fixed and glibc will not break anything like 2.3 did :) - diego , 28 2003, 11:19,Warly: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? - How to have more contributors? And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. -- diego, 3 Tishrey 5764 Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? I think compared to previous releases, there wasn't as much feature-planning (as in 9.0 and 9.1). This may just be my perception since I was involved in some planning for features in 9.0 ... - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. Please, this *must* be done. Why? Most people interested in the server development work will have production servers, and may not run cooker themeselves. Having the 95% of the traffic that is related to GUI stuff discourages people interested in improving server-side stuff from subscribing to cooker. I don't think Mandrake will be taken seriously on the server (though there is no reason why it shouldn't) unless you can get those running Mandrake servers in production involved in the development. Some have said that this will not be effective, but please tell me why a user will send a mail to a cooker-kde list for breakage in cyrus-imapd or apache or openldap. I think there should be a general list, that applies to Mandrake-specific software (DrakX, urpmi, drakxtools) and generic cooker issues. Then there should be lists for: -server software -KDE and KDE/Qt-based apps -GNOME and GTK-based apps -Other desktop software (OpenOffice.org, Mozilla etc) -Hardware (/kernel here too?) - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. One big issue is that users sometimes don't know if an issue that irritates them is a bug or a feature. The reason for this is that there is no documentation on the design of features. Also, since there is no documentation on the design of features, bug reports/suggestions/criticism can only be given when significant time has been invested in it. The aspect that is going to be used for many problems is going to be used again here: drakconnect. Some fundamentals are wrong, and by the time people used it/filed bugs on it, it was too late. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. Make it more visible on Mandrake web sites. Do more concept design work on the wiki. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? IMHO, no. I believe there should be a mini ISO specifically for hardware testing that any user can run without a large download or any risk of messing up any installation. Boot it, see if your hardware works for installation purposes, and some basic tools for reporting hardware problems. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? There it too little press on the community aspects of Mandrake. Redhat hasn't got a development community, but probably most non-Mandrake users would think they do. - How to have more contributors? We need clear documentation/instructions on how to contribute. At present, contributor status seems random (he who bugs Lenny the most gets an account). There are a number of contributors who don't have accounts yet (IMHO Luca Olivetti at least should have one), but no process for becoming a contributor. Also, some contributors aren't subscribed to the lists they should be (even though they have aksed to be subscribed). One thing that oculd be done would be to make more of the inrastructure of thow accounts etc work public, and possibly appoint community members who can add accounts or fix some things (yes, I know this could be a problem for Mandrakesoft, but you trust me not to trojan samba, so why would you not trust me to add accounts). Part of this may be due to ad-hoc setups for authentication etc, and I think Mandrake needs to sort these issues out using the tools that are provided in the distro (ie get single-sign-on across all mandrake websites, using ssl where appropriate, including logins on development machines). More official development status needs to be given to the ports, and we need to make it easy for contributors to fix bugs on arches they don't have access to (like at present the only tool I have to fix the samba3 build on amd64 is using slbd output which isn't used/supported by Mandrakesoft but by the development extranet). And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Mandrakesoft needs to find a market that is more profitable (I believe there is one), and ensure the next disto blows any other out-the water in this market). I believe that is in the corporate desktop, with totally integrated client/server solutions. Basically, Mandrakesoft should try and be the first to offer seemless authentication support using the tools in the distro. We can feasibly have authentication servers and setup tools supporting every client OS. A big issue here is managing large (5000) numbers f desktops. MS does this with AD-integration on the clients, which allows software installation, software settings etc etc to be managed by groups of machines
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. How about creating newsgroups instead? It seems that the mandrake mailing list is so high volume list that sometimes it is really hard to follow the discussion in the list. I for example needed to create own mail server to my home in order to follow mandrake mailing list. Earlier I had always problems with the quota because the list is so active. I believe that the requirement to subscripe restrict the amount of users who want to participate to the discussion. (or report from the problems) - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. More small but important details and cleaning for the configuration tools: Drakconnect - Problems with the PCMCIA cards with drakconnect should be fixed Firewall Configuration a) One should be able to configure firewall for all ethernet cards he has in the system separately. (I for example would allos only ssh and apache to eth0 connected to internet but I would not want to restrict traffic going on via eth1 to intranet in my home) b) More predefined values to firewall configuration. There should be separate items normal web server (port 80), secure web server (81), mail server (143), secure mail server (993). Actually users should be able to add ports with tittles to the list easily. (I know that you can specify ports via advanced label but it would be helpful if one could also add tittle for each port opened) c) in addition to the names like ftp, samba, etc the real port opened should be shown. Something like ssh (23), ftp (21), sftp (22)... Sound driver configuration - Possibility select whether to use sound card drivers from ALSA or OSS Monitor configuration - I would like to see my current horizontal frame rate in the monitor configuration (maybe the functionality in the monitor configuration and xfdrake could be put into single tool) Mount point configuration - I would like to define somehow that only users belonging to group mount users could have access to my mounted NTFS partitions CD Burner - Why everybody owning CD burner must go manually to edit kernel booting parameters to add lines like hdc=ide-scsi hdd=ide-scsi. Either add this as a default for every cd device or help to make cd burning softwares to work without these definitions well. PDA syncronization tools - I have menu item for PDA connectivity but I bet that it wont be able to connect to my SonyEricsson P800. (or synchronize calendar email, and contacts with a KKroupware available in the contrips...) Ie much more work is needed with a this kind of tools. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. Add links to mandrake menus pointing to Wiki pages. So that users could find them easily. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? It would be nice to have one or two snapshots before jumping to beta wagon. Not neccessary, but mkcd tool should be fixed. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? - Be at least as open as you are right now. - How to have more contributors? - You could more cleanly add somewhere the list of tools you would like to see in the mandrake but you do not have yourself power to maintain. Maybe you could have mandrake configuration tools in a similar kind of site than how tigris org has managed tools. ( http://www.tigris.org/) Ie there could be own projects for the drakconnect, cd burning software, etc. And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. - I really would like to be able to byu Mandrake Linux t-shirts :-) - Could you start selling Linux games via net? Mika
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Diego Iastrubni wrote: (I sent it once, but i beleave it was lost too deep inside another thread). I always see Mandrake as a desktop distro, so my wishes are from that side. mcc: * bring back capabilities for changing the lilo/grub theme * real support for linmodems (even if the drivers will not be on the d/l edition) LTmodem support is in Drakxtools, it *should* work if the ltmodem packages are included. I have provided packages and tested them (drakconnect still does some weird things but a reboot fixes it at least), and mailed the relevant people at Mandrakesoft, but have not heard anything on this. HCF/HSF linmodems are apparently supported. * in 8.2 it had themes, where did they go? Option removed from the menu AFAIK. * lirc mcc module IMHO, joystick configuration is more important. mdk-kdm: * if could not bring X up, write a messages in console like gdm does IMHO, if X doesn't come up, XFdrake should be launched (possibly in some mode where it doesn't even look at the current XF86Config* files, since this caused problems with 9.1 if a bad config file were written after an X crash in the installation). And, IMHO, this is not mdkkdm specific, it should be handled by prefdm/startx. * full screen greeter (again gdm like) In the works for KDE3.2 * if no key pressed in X secs, log in as ... (again from gdm) I don't think this is a good idea, IMHO autologin stuff should not be encouraged too much (Windows now always requires a login). * avility to run some program for changing the background (roottv for example) KDE3.2's kdm should have screensaver support, but it might be cool to have other things running, but also has potential security risks misc: * add the mouse cursors packages to main It's quite big as it is ... and some users have reported problems when using cursor themes which could be memory leaks in Xcursor (these haven't been debugged). * l10n for Mozilla Fred includes all l10n on the official l10n locations on the Mozilla FTP server - if you want more l10n, get your l10n team to publish their l10n stuff correctly. * l10n for OO.org I think similar issues apply as to Mozilla. * bring FireBird to main instead of Mozilla Please don't have a premature move of mozilla. It is one of the best mail clients at present, and Thunderbird isn't ready for primetime. This will happen anyway with Mozilla-1.6, when it would be acceptable (I don't want to be without an officially supported Mozilla until the mozilla team is happy with Firebird/Thunderbird). * use also apt-get (with the same repositories, IMHO this can be done no?), let the user which app use to install rpms. IMHO it just wastes mirror space ... how many use apt? * bring sim to main * patch wine to be able to use mono's winforms Suply the patch and I am sure someone can take a look. * mono in mdk out of the box! (if sharp develop will run on mono bring it on baby!) Supply packages/patches, and I am sure someone will take a look. Regards, Buchan -- |Registered Linux User #182071-| Buchan MilneMechanical Engineer, Network Manager Cellphone * Work+27 82 472 2231 * +27 21 8828820x121 Stellenbosch Automotive Engineering http://www.cae.co.za GPG Key http://ranger.dnsalias.com/bgmilne.asc 1024D/60D204A7 2919 E232 5610 A038 87B1 72D6 AC92 BA50 60D2 04A7 * Please click on http://www.cae.co.za/disclaimer.htm to read our e-mail disclaimer or send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] for a copy. *
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sunday 28 Sep 2003 9:19 am, Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? For me, it was the relative closeness of it all. It would be nice to add something to Bugzilla to indicate that a developper has looked at the bug (amthg like being processed...). Also, how about having each user entering a bug report their configuration (a la Mandrakeexpert) - surely that would make it easier fo you guys. - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. Aye - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. A more specific timeline available on Wiki. I.e. a lot of testers found that they did not know when cooker entered a frozen state etc... Why not have some rounds e.g. -Suggestion round -Features round -Packages round (in accordance with the Club, of course) etc... so that user know when their opinion will be heard. At the moment, the whole oh i think this package should be added or this feature would be cool at a RC1 stage is very messy. Providing the users with a time frame (2-3 months) in which they can submit their ideas for features would be good. Also, I love Mandrake and I really would like to help with the development (I think I have a few good ideas - especially regarding drakconnect) but unfortunately my PhD is taking most of my time and I don't have time to write software. It would be nice if a group of testers could be linked to one or more developpers and work with them on the project - that way you increase the number of people working on something (and it makes thing a lot tidyer). - What should we do to improve the Wiki. c.f. above - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? Don't mind since I have broadband (thank you Uni) but it is true that having a time reference to the bugs would be good (e.g. this bug is valid in cooker-20030707 etc...) - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? C.f. my next post (when I have time to write it) - How to have more contributors? c.f. above And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 10:19:44AM +0200, Warly wrote: - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? I think the targets for a release should be set much earlier in the process. Especially targets for nr of major bugs in the software to be released. Focus more on a small set of features that should work perfectly and others that are nice to have but not critical. This should be clearly linked with how people use mandrake-linux. - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. I don't know, the only thing that can be annoying are the bugreports from bugzilla, but then again, they can trigger a response from a large group, which can lead to a quicker confirmation (or lack thereof). - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. be clearer in the goals and criteria for the target. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. separate development and use-guides - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? would be nice, but maybe another approach would be better: every week, freeze cooker so the mirrors can catch up. Make sure a network upgrade can be done without glitches and have a few days of testing of the current status. Fixes can then be added for the next freeze. (Not being a package developer, I have no idea whether this is feasible!) - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? reduce the amount of BUT arguments in the reviews by making sure the things that should work, just work! It is also important to know what should work and what is just a bonus. - How to have more contributors? respect! And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. the club needs an overhaul! Apart from the donation aspect I see no reason to join it. I hope this helps! Simon
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
, 28 2003, 20:46,Buchan Milne: * real support for linmodems (even if the drivers will not be on the d/l edition) LTmodem support is in Drakxtools, it *should* work if the ltmodem packages are included. I have provided packages and tested them (drakconnect still does some weird things but a reboot fixes it at least), and mailed the relevant people at Mandrakesoft, but have not heard anything on this. HCF/HSF linmodems are apparently supported. I have build linmodem drivers for intel and pctel modems, soon to make also 9.2 packages. http://iglu.org.il/pub/Hebrew/diego/linmodems/mandrake/ * lirc mcc module IMHO, joystick configuration is more important. both, are important. mdk-kdm: * if could not bring X up, write a messages in console like gdm does IMHO, if X doesn't come up, XFdrake should be launched (possibly in some mode where it doesn't even look at the current XF86Config* files, since this caused problems with 9.1 if a bad config file were written after an X crash in the installation). And, IMHO, this is not mdkkdm specific, it should be handled by prefdm/startx. the dialog will ask for root password and will run XFrdake if needed. * if no key pressed in X secs, log in as ... (again from gdm) I don't think this is a good idea, IMHO autologin stuff should not be encouraged too much (Windows now always requires a login). YES SURE USE WINDOWS AS A REFERENCE IN SEQUERITY! LOL! mistake... :( I miss this from gdm. It should not be enabled by default, but for home users it's the best. I dont see a reason why my mom and I will need to supply a password. Most people will start thinking about disabling password completely which is much worst as you may already know. This is intended only for home usage, in offices and stuff you are right, it should not be used. * avility to run some program for changing the background (roottv for example) KDE3.2's kdm should have screensaver support, but it might be cool to have other things running, but also has potential security risks need to test the thing (I do have kde from cvs here). * l10n for Mozilla Fred includes all l10n on the official l10n locations on the Mozilla FTP server - if you want more l10n, get your l10n team to publish their l10n stuff correctly. * l10n for OO.org I think similar issues apply as to Mozilla. when my i10n will be available (both mozilla and OO i will make a bug report for them to be included in next version). * use also apt-get (with the same repositories, IMHO this can be done no?), let the user which app use to install rpms. IMHO it just wastes mirror space ... how many use apt? no... the same dir will also have the config for apt-get. at most 5 MB wasted. freedom dud... choose whatever you like. * bring sim to main * patch wine to be able to use mono's winforms Suply the patch and I am sure someone can take a look. the patch is found here: http://openlinksw.com/mono/index.html read also: http://go-mono.com/winforms.html http://www.nullenvoid.com/mono/wiki/index.php/MonoWinePackages * mono in mdk out of the box! (if sharp develop will run on mono bring it on baby!) Supply packages/patches, and I am sure someone will take a look. sorry, for this we just need to sit on our ass and wait :( (I may have a c# course next simester, so I would this to use mono here) -- diego, 3 Tishrey 5764 Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? I wasn't aware of it soon enough. Was the first beta announced on the expert list? If so, I missed it. Stop using the term RC. Recent rc versions are nothing but late betas, not even close to suitable for release. Go to beta 4, 5, 6, or even 7 if necessary. Maybe use the term rc one time on a discretional basis if there is one single outstanding unresolved major issue. - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. I vote no. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. Switch it to an 8 (subversion changes: 9.2-9.3) or 9 (major version changes: 9.2-10) month release cycle. Yes, one year is too long, but not only does a 6 month cycle cramp the process, it keeps new Mandrake releases on the same schedule, which routinely of late is always just missing being able to include new releases of major apps, such as Mozilla (1.5), Samba (3.0) or OpenOffice (1.1 final). I would like the beta processes to not use the same portions of the year every year. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? Yes. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? Boxes on the store shelves, and included at least as an option with far more new PC's. Did you notice what Lindows just did? Lindows is now installed on all new Seagate HD's, almost like all those 500, 700 1000 free hour AOL CD's we in the US don't seem to be able to avoid. And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Package management in the GUI (not necessarily good in console either) is horrid: 1-The main menu should say software management or install/remove/update programs instead of packaging. Packaging is preparing a product for distribution and sale, but installation is installation, not packaging. 2-Software management should open one panel with 5 options instead of a submenu with 5 options. It should be an integrated suite, if not one simple app. 3-Configure media is incomprehensible, and needs to be rebuilt with a design a windoze convert (or any non-geek) can understand. It should automatically initialize the usual mirror selection, so that messages about nothing to install would never happen on a system that has never been updated before. It needs to be much smarter about deciding where to look for what is actually available. Users don't care about hdlists.cz errors, only whether they can do what they want, which is find, add, remove or update a program. They shouldn't need to see a main list that specifies the location of each installation CD, particularly since they typically were all located on the save device. 4-Installation from network or HD without having to extract the contents of ISO files first. If install can ever set up a loopback to do CD1, it ought to be able to do any case. 5-A usable normal boot and/or rescue floppy should be at least offered for creation during install. After install, creating a boot and/or rescue floppy should actually be possible on any system. Barring that, the creation process that fails should offer some guidance on what to change in order to enable success on future tries. 6-Time. /var/log/boot.log shouldn't start a boot at 13:00, then back up 4 hours to 09:00 for several startup items, then jump back to 13:01 to finish up. If configuration is that the system clock is set to local time, then all entries should be based upon that clock, and not adjusted to anything else for any reason at any time. When a new system is installed, no directory should be time stamped 4 hours before the install started, which is the case now. 7-rc ordering is dumb. If the system is configured to start in runlevel 5, it nevertheless should finish init on runlevel 3 first. No one should have to wait to get a prompt on vc[1-6] until substantially after the X login manager has appeared, which is the case now. Services that can't be used in runlevel 2 shouldn't be started before all runlevel 2 services have had their init. 8-Back to the old way with the installer. Used to be able to go back to any particular step just by clicking on the item in the left column. That was brilliant, and is missed. 9-NUMLOCK I very much appreciate having this package installed by default, as it makes me insane that any OS kernel feels compelled to switch NUM off when in the BIOS it is set to ON. That said, I have to guess there is a more efficient way to do it than with an rpm package, as SuSE has the same functionality, but without a package named numlock. I don't know how they do it, but I do know it is configured through /etc/sysconfig/keyboard, which is 2509 bytes and has, among others, the following settings on my SuSE 8.1 machine: KBD_RATE=20.0 KBD_DELAY=250 KBD_NUMLOCK=bios In contrast, this same file in 9.1 and cooker is all of 36 bytes, and has
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Many of these ideas have been brought up, but I'm going to express my opinions with no regard for possible repetition. On 09/28/2003 04:19:44 AM, Warly wrote: - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? Too much change to kernel and drak tools during the rc phase. This happens every time. What were the weakest points of 9.1? Kernel and drak tools I'd say. Let's hope it's not the case for 9.2. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. 1. Get more constant daily cooker testers, especially who use cooker as a desktop. While the constant bitching and moaning of cooker folks can get a bit annoying, it keeps us on our toes, finds bugs more quickly, and reduces the work required during beta season. Personally, I need more people to test my contrib apps. I believe that publicising the wiki will attract more possible cooker users. 2. Get more contibutors. If I wasn't maintaining like 200 RPMs, I'm sure I could do a better job of it. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. 1. Clean it up. Make it easier to navigate. It is currently hard to find things. Find someone who does this kind of thing for a living, and have them redo the layout/linking/menus/etc. 2. Tell the press about it. Link to it. Advertise it. I feel that the wiki's most important purpose will be to tell potential new cooker helpers that it's fun and easy to help out. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? Help us work on the live CD's maybe? Knoppix has done VERY well, and it has attracted a lot of people to linux, and to debian in particular. A few specialized Mandrake-based live CDs could be a HUGE marketing boom, since advertising this kind of thing is essentially free (distrowatch, pclinuxonline, slashdot, etc.). Problem is, we will need mirror space/ bandwidth, and some sort of unofficial name/connection to Mandrake. - How to have more contributors? 1. Publicise the wiki. 2. Update the cooker page on www.mandrake.com... it way out of date. 3. Make a clear list of who maintains what, let us change it ourselves, and keep it up to date. Make it easier to know what has to be done, who's working on what, and who to report to as a new packager/translator/artist/whatever. 4. Have someone dedicated to organizing the volunteers. Lenny and Warly kinda share this now, but they are both too busy too separate from each other. 5. Document the process better. 6. Press, press, press. Can we get more press? And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Don't slack off on keeping it easy to use. The drak tools are key, but they seem to be neglected lately. Stay on top of hardware detection and new drivers (in other words, follow Thomas Backlund's every move). Redo some of the shoddier tools (draksound, drakfont...). XFdrake used to have more options... bring them back. Can we make it easier to install NVidia drivers? Libranet does, and they are based on free software only as well. Drakconnect has sucked for a long time. Make sure it's easy to setup wireless networking. Rethink the way the kernels are maintained. Communication must improve with the 'kernel team'. Having kernels in contribs sucks; can we avoid it? Make contribs more visible. When people want RPMs, they still go to rpmfind. net or whatever. Let's fix that. Who cares if contribs are unofficial! At least let people know they exist. We work hard on them, and people really want them. Make networking setup a priority. Make sure it's painless for a semi-newbie to set up a cups server/client, a samba server/client, work on ldap, appletalk, whatever. Buchan can preach about this better than I. Okay, that's enough. By the way, 9.2 will kick ass, the community-oriented development model is working very well, Mandrake Linux has a bright future, and props to everyone who worked on 9.2 (employees and volunteers alike). Austin -- Austin Acton Synthetic Organic Chemist, Teaching Assistant, Ph.D. Candidate Department of Chemistry, York University, Toronto MandrakeLinux Volunteer Developer, homepage: www.groundstate.ca
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
* use also apt-get (with the same repositories, IMHO this can be done no?), let the user which app use to install rpms. IMHO it just wastes mirror space ... how many use apt? it doesn't matter, apt is patched to use hdlist in mdk :) -- Michaël Scherer
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On 09/28/2003 01:11:01 PM, Buchan Milne wrote: I have some work to do before I have an ISO that is better (easier to use, more GIS apps, much smaller ISO) than GIS-Knoppix. It would be nice to see someone contribute a GNOPPIX one, I will try and do a KNOPPIX-like one also, and some others are working on some other ones (surpise!). We will take over the world with a handful of CDs! Everyone will bow in reverence. Live CD distros will fear our wrath and dominance, and regular distros will long for our popularity. Feel it, people... Fell it. Austin
[Cooker] [Bug 6007] [kdeadmin] New: SysV-Init Editor crashes with KUniqueApplication DCOP communication error
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6007 Product: kdeadmin Component: program Summary: SysV-Init Editor crashes with KUniqueApplication DCOP communication error Product: kdeadmin Version: 3.1-8mdk Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P2 Component: program AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mandrake Linux 9.1: KDE3.1: kdeadmin-3.1-8mdk:ksysv An editor for System V startup schemes: SysV-Init Editor Could someone check whether this problem also exist in Cooker? Warning you may be lucky that it works on your system, but that doesn't mean it's fixed. SysV-Init Editor crashes everytime when I want to start it up. When I start it in Konsole i get this error message ERROR: KUniqueApplication: DCOP communication error! I remember having this problem also in ML8.2, but then some day SysV-Init Editor in ML8.2 started working and still works without problem in ML8.2. But in ML9.1 the problem is persistent. I searched with Google but have no solution found, this bug has also been reported at http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=37123 but no solution yet. In Mandrake Linux drakxservices is used to set the services, but I liked the program SysV-Init Editor to compare the different runlevels. vatbier -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
[Cooker] [Bug 6008] [Hardware] New: Logitech QuickCam PRO 4000 USB webcam not workin in 9.2 RC2
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6008 Product: Hardware Component: Hardware Summary: Logitech QuickCam PRO 4000 USB webcam not workin in 9.2 RC2 Product: Hardware Version: 9.2-0.7mdk Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P2 Component: Hardware AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] If the camera is plugged during boot, the PC will reboot right after the pwc modules has failed to load. If I remove the camera, the PC loads sucessfully. By inserting the camera again, the PC will reboot. No panic, just black screen... -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
[Cooker] [Bug 4721] [devfsd] Officejet won't print
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=4721 [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added Status|UNCONFIRMED |RESOLVED Resolution||FIXED --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 18:18 --- Works in latest. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: RESOLVED creation_date: description: Added my Officejet d135 using printerdrake. lpq shows the test page is in the queue, but nothing is printing. System log shows the following: Aug 13 10:27:49 axon devfsd[120]: error calling: unlink in GLOBAL Aug 13 10:27:49 axon devfsd[120]: error copying: /dev/ptal-printd to /lib/dev-state/ptal-printd Aug 13 10:27:49 axon ptal-mlcd: SYSLOG at ExMgr.cpp:652, dev=mlc:usb:officejet_d_series, pid=6019, e=2, t=1060784869 ptal-mlcd successfully initialized. Aug 13 10:27:49 axon ptal-printd: ptal-printd(mlc:usb:officejet_d_series) successfully initialized using /var/run/ptal-printd/mlc_usb_officejet_d_series*. This could possibly be a problem with devfs, but I thought I'd throw it to you first, Till.
[Cooker] [Bug 6009] [evolution] New: Dropdown date selectors crash evolution
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6009 Product: evolution Component: evolution Summary: Dropdown date selectors crash evolution Product: evolution Version: 1.4.4-8mdk Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: major Priority: P2 Component: evolution AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Opening the dropdown date selectors crashes evolution. To reproduce: Start evo. Select task view. Click the start date box to set a start date for a task. The calendar date selector starts to render, then evo crashes and goes away. Console output shows (evolution:3187): e-table-CRITICAL **: file e-table-item.c: line 1045 (eti_unfreeze): assertion `eti-frozen_count 0' failed repeated about twelve times. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
[Cooker] [Bug 5038] [Hardware] Officejet only prints in color
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=5038 --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 18:27 --- Will try this on Monday. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: UNCONFIRMED creation_date: description: (That's not entirely true.) When I print using my Officejet D135, it only uses the color cartridge to print. It's supposed to autodetect by the paper type and I'm using plain old inkjet paper. Expected behavior: A mixed text and graphic page should use the black cartridge for solid black (text) and the color cartridge for color. Actual behavior: If the page is only black, the driver uses the black cartridge, but if the page has any color, the driver uses only the color cartridge.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? Too many major bugs remained in the betas before rc's were started. IMHO, betas need to start a little bit earlier with priority given to the installer, the various means of installing and urpmi. One of the major problems was mirrors, as most everyone will agreed, and anything that can be done to improve that situation should be done. - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. This is an absolute *must*. I believe that Buchan has the right idea here and would love to see it implemented. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. Share with the community the broad outline of what Mandrakesoft wishes to achieve with the next release. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. I confess that I haven't used the wiki enough to form an opinion:-) - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? A single CD with basic functionality such as whats being done now, is more than enough. Cooker is moving too fast for dialup and anyone with high speed broadband has many ways to install and update. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? There is plainly not enough done for the corporate user. All I ever hear from businesses here on the West Canadian coast is when is there going to be a *usable* Linux desktop. For the most part, everything is basicly available but polishing is needed and *all* related apps need to work *out-of-the-box*. - How to have more contributors? There *must* be a better way for contributors to gain a klama account. With the dramatic increase in packages and contributors, poor Lenny must be snowed under. I *almost* feel guilty bugging him:-) And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Mandrakesoft has a large and very dedicated community. We all come from a huge variety of occupations and the pool of talents and skills is outstanding. It has pleased me greatly to see the increase in dialog between Mandrakesoft and the community and I can only hope that by working closer together greater rewards can be had be both sides
Re: [Cooker] And next ? - cooperation with major disk vendor?
One thing I saw which could enhance the availablilty of Mandrake was to make an alliance with a major disk vendor, eg. Maxtor, to preinstalle mandrake on a number of disks - free of charge. I think this is what Lindows have done with Seagate for their 40 GB disks, and I see quite some potential for that kind of arrangement. Best regards keld
[Cooker] [Bug 6010] [apache2-common] New: ApacheBench does not work
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6010 Product: apache2-common Component: program Summary: ApacheBench does not work Product: apache2-common Version: 2.0.47-6mdk Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P2 Component: program AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have upgraded it to the latest version, and ApacheBench (/usr/sbin/ab) does not work anymore. It seems it can't connect to any socket. For example : ** [EMAIL PROTECTED] data]# /usr/sbin/ab -v 5 -n 1 http://127.0.0.1/; This is ApacheBench, Version 2.0.40-dev $Revision: 1.121.2.1 $ apache-2.0 Copyright (c) 1996 Adam Twiss, Zeus Technology Ltd, http://www.zeustech.net/ Copyright (c) 1998-2002 The Apache Software Foundation, http://www.apache.org/ Benchmarking 127.0.0.1 (be patient)...INFO: POST header == --- GET / HTTP/1.0 User-Agent: ApacheBench/2.0.40-dev Host: 127.0.0.1 Accept: */* --- apr_poll: The timeout specified has expired (70007) [EMAIL PROTECTED] data]# /usr/sbin/ab -v 5 -n 1 http://www.mandrakelinux.com/; This is ApacheBench, Version 2.0.40-dev $Revision: 1.121.2.1 $ apache-2.0 Copyright (c) 1996 Adam Twiss, Zeus Technology Ltd, http://www.zeustech.net/ Copyright (c) 1998-2002 The Apache Software Foundation, http://www.apache.org/ Benchmarking www.mandrakelinux.com (be patient)...INFO: POST header == --- GET / HTTP/1.0 User-Agent: ApacheBench/2.0.40-dev Host: www.mandrakelinux.com Accept: */* --- apr_poll: The timeout specified has expired (70007) *** Of course, the Web sites are perfectly reachable using a browser. Also, directly telnetting the header lines mentionned by ApacheBench works too. Endly, the Apache 2 server itself does work, only /usr/sbin/ab is broken. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
[Cooker] [Bug 6011] [kdebase-progs] New: Konqueror : bad rendering
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6011 Product: kdebase-progs Component: program Summary: Konqueror : bad rendering Product: kdebase-progs Version: 3.1.3-79mdk Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P2 Component: program AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi, The rendering of http://www.netgear.fr/forum is incorrect : looks as if headers were included multiple times, so the page is very long and the interesting stuff is at the very bottom. Rendering is ok with Mozilla, Epiphany, Galeon. Thanks Berthy -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On September 1993 plus 3679 days Michael Reinsch wrote: Hi! On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 14:22:14 +0200 Steffen Barszus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - How to have more contributors? Decreasing time consumption and power needed to participate. It was sometimes like fighting against windmills to get heared on the cooker list. Splitting up the lists could help here. I am against splitting up cooker list because I think nearly everyone will end up subscribing all/most of those lists. Agreed. Tho, since we are talking about the mailing listscould we *please* get rid of sympa and start using mailman or any other *decent* mailing list software? Sympa has proved over and over and over again that it can't deal with the mandrake mailing lists and that it should be shot. So...can we please get a good mailing list software managing the lists? Vox, who abhors sympa -- Think of the Linux community as a niche economy isolated by its beliefs. Kind of like the Amish, except that our religion requires us to use _higher_ technology than everyone else. -- Donald B. Marti Jr. pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 02:39:33PM -0400, Felix Miata wrote: Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. Stop using the term RC. Recent rc versions are nothing but late betas, not even close to suitable for release. Go to beta 4, 5, 6, or even 7 if necessary. Maybe use the term rc one time on a discretional basis if there is one single outstanding unresolved major issue. My understanding is that RC indicates feature freeze, and at least there is a need to indicate feature freeze in some way. keld - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? Boxes on the store shelves, and included at least as an option with far more new PC's. Did you notice what Lindows just did? Lindows is now installed on all new Seagate HD's, almost like all those 500, 700 1000 free hour AOL CD's we in the US don't seem to be able to avoid. Yes, good idea. And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Package management in the GUI (not necessarily good in console either) is horrid: Yes, about a month or so there was some discussion on rpmdrake and apt that you could take into consideration. 1-The main menu should say software management or install/remove/update programs instead of packaging. Packaging is preparing a product for distribution and sale, but installation is installation, not packaging. 2-Software management should open one panel with 5 options instead of a submenu with 5 options. It should be an integrated suite, if not one simple app. 3-Configure media is incomprehensible, and needs to be rebuilt with a design a windoze convert (or any non-geek) can understand. It should automatically initialize the usual mirror selection, so that messages about nothing to install would never happen on a system that has never been updated before. It needs to be much smarter about deciding where to look for what is actually available. Users don't care about hdlists.cz errors, only whether they can do what they want, which is find, add, remove or update a program. They shouldn't need to see a main list that specifies the location of each installation CD, particularly since they typically were all located on the save device. yes, good ideas 4-Installation from network or HD without having to extract the contents of ISO files first. If install can ever set up a loopback to do CD1, it ought to be able to do any case. Good idea, I think if you can install from one cd image, it should also be easy to loopback open the other two iso9660 images too in a network or hd install. Best regards Keld
[Cooker] [Bug 6010] [apache2-common] ApacheBench does not work
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6010 --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 18:44 --- Ok a little ethereal dump. I launch Ethereal on the ADSL interface and then try to ApacheBench www.mandrakelinux.com. Here it is : [EMAIL PROTECTED] data]# tethereal -i ppp0 Capturing on ppp0 0.00 213.41.184.237 - 62.4.16.70 DNS Standard query www.mandrakelinux.com 0.056048 62.4.16.70 - 213.41.184.237 DNS Standard query response 0.056724 213.41.184.237 - 62.4.16.70 DNS Standard query www.mandrakelinux.com 0.118136 62.4.16.70 - 213.41.184.237 DNS Standard query response 0.118704 213.41.184.237 - 62.4.16.70 DNS Standard query A www.mandrakelinux.com 0.180441 62.4.16.70 - 213.41.184.237 DNS Standard query response A 80.67.180.164 A 80.67.180.174 A 212.43.244.30 0.181076 213.41.184.237 - 80.67.180.164 TCP 33618 http [SYN] Seq=2705115576 Ack=0 Win=18276 Len=0 0.244214 80.67.180.164 - 213.41.184.237 TCP http 33618 [SYN, ACK] Seq=1726074699 Ack=2705115577 Win=5792 Len=0 0.244260 213.41.184.237 - 80.67.180.164 TCP 33618 http [ACK] Seq=2705115577 Ack=1726074700 Win=18276 Len=0 30.189336 213.41.184.237 - 80.67.180.164 TCP 33618 http [FIN, ACK] Seq=2705115577 Ack=1726074700 Win=18276 Len=0 30.256868 80.67.180.164 - 213.41.184.237 TCP http 33618 [FIN, ACK] Seq=1726074700 Ack=2705115578 Win=5792 Len=0 30.256912 213.41.184.237 - 80.67.180.164 TCP 33618 http [ACK] Seq=2705115578 Ack=1726074701 Win=18276 Len=0 It seems the HTTP request isn't actually sent as the TCP payload is always 0 (Len = 0), indicating no HTTP data is sent on the wire. Hence the ApacheBench timeout after 30 seconds. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: UNCONFIRMED creation_date: description: I have upgraded it to the latest version, and ApacheBench (/usr/sbin/ab) does not work anymore. It seems it can't connect to any socket. For example : ** [EMAIL PROTECTED] data]# /usr/sbin/ab -v 5 -n 1 http://127.0.0.1/; This is ApacheBench, Version 2.0.40-dev $Revision: 1.121.2.1 $ apache-2.0 Copyright (c) 1996 Adam Twiss, Zeus Technology Ltd, http://www.zeustech.net/ Copyright (c) 1998-2002 The Apache Software Foundation, http://www.apache.org/ Benchmarking 127.0.0.1 (be patient)...INFO: POST header == --- GET / HTTP/1.0 User-Agent: ApacheBench/2.0.40-dev Host: 127.0.0.1 Accept: */* --- apr_poll: The timeout specified has expired (70007) [EMAIL PROTECTED] data]# /usr/sbin/ab -v 5 -n 1 http://www.mandrakelinux.com/; This is ApacheBench, Version 2.0.40-dev $Revision: 1.121.2.1 $ apache-2.0 Copyright (c) 1996 Adam Twiss, Zeus Technology Ltd, http://www.zeustech.net/ Copyright (c) 1998-2002 The Apache Software Foundation, http://www.apache.org/ Benchmarking www.mandrakelinux.com (be patient)...INFO: POST header == --- GET / HTTP/1.0 User-Agent: ApacheBench/2.0.40-dev Host: www.mandrakelinux.com Accept: */* --- apr_poll: The timeout specified has expired (70007) *** Of course, the Web sites are perfectly reachable using a browser. Also, directly telnetting the header lines mentionned by ApacheBench works too. Endly, the Apache 2 server itself does work, only /usr/sbin/ab is broken.
[Cooker] [Bug 5556] [kdeartwork] No screensavers are installed in 9.2rc2
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=5556 --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 18:54 --- For #7 I have tried with a fresh installation of 9.2 RC2, and retry after update to cooker and update to cooker. But they disspaear when switching back to Mandrake Menu, in both cases. When you launch KDE control center when Mandrake menu is selected there no screensaver in Kscreensaver module. Then selected another modules in KControlpanel, switching to original menu and return to Kscreensaver modules screensaver appear, and stay here when selecting another KControlpanel modules then switching back to Mandrake menu. But when restarting Kcontrolpanel, they dissapear again. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: NEW creation_date: description: By default, my install of 9.2rc2 had no screensavers installed, so I installed the kdeartwork package (kdeartwork-3.1.3-4mdk). There are still no screensavers installed.
[Cooker] [Bug 6012] [rpmdrake] New: rpmdrake doesn't finish sorting package names
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6012 Product: rpmdrake Component: program Summary: rpmdrake doesn't finish sorting package names Product: rpmdrake Version: 2.1-35mdk Platform: All OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P3 Component: program AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Package names are listed (the flat listing) in an almost-sorted order, with many entries scattered up to a few dozen positions from where they should be, and the odd one or two at the other end of the list. Frozen cooker as fetched from planetmirror today. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Le dim 28/09/2003 à 21:38, Spencer a écrit : Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? Too many major bugs remained in the betas before rc's were started. IMHO, betas need to start a little bit earlier with priority given to the installer, the various means of installing and urpmi. One of the major problems was mirrors, as most everyone will agreed, and anything that can be done to improve that situation should be done. I do like the way it is done for Eclipse: http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/development/eclipse_project_plan_3_0.html A milestone could be built every 6 weeks. isos could be provided for each milestone. Daniel
[Cooker] [Bug 6010] [libapr0] ApacheBench does not work
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6010 --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 19:04 --- After reverting to the version of libapr0 found on the Mandrake 9.1 CD (2.0.44-11mdk), it works. So I guess the bug is rather related to the APR library. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: UNCONFIRMED creation_date: description: I have upgraded it to the latest version, and ApacheBench (/usr/sbin/ab) does not work anymore. It seems it can't connect to any socket. For example : ** [EMAIL PROTECTED] data]# /usr/sbin/ab -v 5 -n 1 http://127.0.0.1/; This is ApacheBench, Version 2.0.40-dev $Revision: 1.121.2.1 $ apache-2.0 Copyright (c) 1996 Adam Twiss, Zeus Technology Ltd, http://www.zeustech.net/ Copyright (c) 1998-2002 The Apache Software Foundation, http://www.apache.org/ Benchmarking 127.0.0.1 (be patient)...INFO: POST header == --- GET / HTTP/1.0 User-Agent: ApacheBench/2.0.40-dev Host: 127.0.0.1 Accept: */* --- apr_poll: The timeout specified has expired (70007) [EMAIL PROTECTED] data]# /usr/sbin/ab -v 5 -n 1 http://www.mandrakelinux.com/; This is ApacheBench, Version 2.0.40-dev $Revision: 1.121.2.1 $ apache-2.0 Copyright (c) 1996 Adam Twiss, Zeus Technology Ltd, http://www.zeustech.net/ Copyright (c) 1998-2002 The Apache Software Foundation, http://www.apache.org/ Benchmarking www.mandrakelinux.com (be patient)...INFO: POST header == --- GET / HTTP/1.0 User-Agent: ApacheBench/2.0.40-dev Host: www.mandrakelinux.com Accept: */* --- apr_poll: The timeout specified has expired (70007) *** Of course, the Web sites are perfectly reachable using a browser. Also, directly telnetting the header lines mentionned by ApacheBench works too. Endly, the Apache 2 server itself does work, only /usr/sbin/ab is broken.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Mon, 2003-09-29 at 05:34, Buchan Milne wrote: On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Warly wrote: - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. Please, this *must* be done. Why? Most people interested in the server development work will have production servers, and may not run cooker themeselves. One thing to think about in some businesses / organisations is that the amount of e-mail recieved by an individual is monitored. Hence it is impossible for some to subscibe to a list like cooker at work because the volume is truly massive. Hence if you want to include the folks who use Mandrake as a server at work, for instance, splitting the lists along sensible lines would remove that particular barrier. Best wishes, Damon
[Cooker] [Bug 6013] [urpmi] New: unable to force urpmi.update
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6013 Product: urpmi Component: program Summary: unable to force urpmi.update Product: urpmi Version: 4.4-37mdk Platform: PC OS/Version: All Status: UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P2 Component: program AssignedTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ReportedBy: [EMAIL PROTECTED] It seems that urpmi.update doesn't work, even with -f, if MD5SUM file on the server is not up to date, or at last older than hdlist.cz. I was unable to get the hdlist.cz file on ftp.club-internet.fr, dated Sep 27 because the MD5SUM was generated on Sep 24. I tried to remove my local MD5SUM but didn't work. I had to remove and recreate my Cooker and Contrib source to get it. Thanks Berthy -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
There *must* be a better way for contributors to gain a klama account. With the dramatic increase in packages and contributors, poor Lenny must be snowed under. I *almost* feel guilty bugging him:-) and all official and contrib files should be signed... It is a little bit scary situation to install packages with --no-verify-rpm. Now basically anybody hacking access to ftp mirror can replace packages too easily with the evil code. Mika
[Cooker] [Bug 6011] [kdebase-progs] Konqueror : bad rendering
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6011 --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 19:13 --- this bug is related to konqueror itself, not mandrake. Please close this bug here and open a new one at bugs.kde.org, provide your URL. You can add by the same time that le bug is present with an old cvs version (mid july) from konqueror -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: UNCONFIRMED creation_date: description: Hi, The rendering of http://www.netgear.fr/forum is incorrect : looks as if headers were included multiple times, so the page is very long and the interesting stuff is at the very bottom. Rendering is ok with Mozilla, Epiphany, Galeon. Thanks Berthy
Re: [Cooker] screem-0.8.1
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 16:46:52 + FACORAT Fabrice [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't have syntax color highlighting with a PHP and CSS files ... Can you try with http://www.eslrahc.com/screem-0.8.1-0.2mdk.cae.i586.rpm Charles -- Dyslexia means never having to say that you're ysror. - Mandrake Linux 9.2 on PurpleDragon Kernel-2.4.22-10.tmb.4mdkenterprise http://www.eslrahc.com - pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
[Cooker] [Bug 6011] [kdebase-progs] Konqueror : bad rendering
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6011 [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added Status|UNCONFIRMED |RESOLVED Resolution||WONTFIX --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 19:31 --- Not a Mandrake concern :Bug closed and moved to bugs.kde.org -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: RESOLVED creation_date: description: Hi, The rendering of http://www.netgear.fr/forum is incorrect : looks as if headers were included multiple times, so the page is very long and the interesting stuff is at the very bottom. Rendering is ok with Mozilla, Epiphany, Galeon. Thanks Berthy
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 19:39, Felix Miata wrote: 2-Software management should open one panel with 5 options instead of a submenu with 5 options. It should be an integrated suite, if not one simple app. Oh, for crying out loud, PLEASE STOP TROLLING THIS. It's not going to happen, the reasons why have been explained at tedious length, just drop it already. -- adamw
[Cooker] [Bug 6013] [urpmi] unable to force urpmi.update
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6013 --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 19:49 --- MD5SUM file management has not been linked to -f option, which is problably a bad idea in fact. You can use --no-md5sum added to avoid mirror problems related to md5sum values. -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: UNCONFIRMED creation_date: description: It seems that urpmi.update doesn't work, even with -f, if MD5SUM file on the server is not up to date, or at last older than hdlist.cz. I was unable to get the hdlist.cz file on ftp.club-internet.fr, dated Sep 27 because the MD5SUM was generated on Sep 24. I tried to remove my local MD5SUM but didn't work. I had to remove and recreate my Cooker and Contrib source to get it. Thanks Berthy
[Cooker] Re: newsgroup (was And next ?)
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 20:47:45 +0300, lamikr_mdk wrote: Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. How about creating newsgroups instead? It seems that the mandrake mailing list is so high volume list that sometimes it is really hard to follow the discussion in the list. Check out www.gmane.org, a mailing list to newsreader portal, just point your favorite news reader at news.gmane.org. You can read the list without being subscribed, sending requires either subscrition or replying to a confirmation email. I use this setup for all the mailing lists i'm interested in. Frej Rasmussen Mika
[Cooker] [Bug 5979] [rpm] urpmi problem--strange output
http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=5979 [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added AssignedTo|[EMAIL PROTECTED] |[EMAIL PROTECTED] Component|urpmi |program Product|urpmi |rpm Version|4.4-37mdk |4.2-18mdk --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-28-09 19:53 --- This problem should not be related to urpmi but with rpm itself. The main question is how do you get this ? If this is reproducible, we can do something trying to fix it. Can you try rpm -q gpg-pubkey and give us output ? Can you try rpm -V gpg-pubkey and give us output ? Does you have other rpm errors message ? -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. --- Reminder: --- assigned_to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] status: UNCONFIRMED creation_date: description: the following output is repeated (10-20 lines) when using urpmi to upgrade packages: rpmdb: /var/lib/rpm/Pubkeys: unexpected file type or format this does not prevent upgrade/install, but is rather disconcerting
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 01:19, Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? Warly While the people here can help in answering this question for sure. It's also one that should go out to the expert list as well. Some of the people here are on both yes, but there is a group there that has dedicated itself to helping make things work the way all of you intended. I think the input from there would be of value. - How to have more contributors? A bugzilla (or similar product) for the release version? Seems strange I know but if you hook people on the concept as users with a smaller bug number (hopefully) in a release version you could well spark the interest needed (as well as hone the skills needed) for working in here. Seems an odd angle I realize but since people keep saying. I don't program so they won't want me around. Maybe something of this nature will help in showing people that they can contribute. Of course in my case not being in the middle of a Paycheck major release at the same time would help, but that's a personal problem grin And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro.
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Le Dimanche 28 Septembre 2003 10:19, Warly a écrit : - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? Friday and saturday, ABUL, our LUG, participated in an exhibition, I have shown how to install and use Mandrake 9.1 to people who are only PC users, afraid by a command line and who don't understand english. They have found KDE, the default Desktop rather good and easy to use. The installation (they did not try drakconnect) was easy and they understand how to resize windows and make partitions for linux. Everything seems good except one : they don't understand what packages are useful and comply to their needs. I ask for i10n and i18n for the description of packages. A complement is to make a data base of packages by user profiles. I mean a more accurate thing that Multimedia - Sound and music For example : professionnal recording studio, composer, general user... each package can belong to several usages with a class: Recommended, Alternative, Why not, Deprecated. Abstract: People want to be helped in their own language to find the software they need. -- Pierre Jarillon - http://pjarillon.free.fr/ Vice-président de l'ABUL : http://abul.org/
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
My $0.02 and no offence ! Best so far. Unfortunatelly I'm not in position to offer much but I'm a Mandrake user ( fan ). My $0.02, this, as all the projects, would need a champion / dictator willing to work 24h / day AND say what is included and what is not, what is ready and what is not, etc. Again, at current situation I just don't have time for anything else but to give some ideas ( mostly useless ) but 30+ years on big projects, and Mandrake is a big project, only the real successful have been where you have one and only one person taking the full responsibility - think Linux ! On other hand, I would like to see something fixed on current developement level I can install and test - home ! In work I just don't have time for testing - everything has to work out of the box or I will problems with management ( mostly MS fans ). have a nice day. On Sunday 28 September 2003 12:34, Buchan Milne wrote: On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? I think compared to previous releases, there wasn't as much feature-planning (as in 9.0 and 9.1). This may just be my perception since I was involved in some planning for features in 9.0 ... - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. Please, this *must* be done. Why? Most people interested in the server development work will have production servers, and may not run cooker themeselves. Having the 95% of the traffic that is related to GUI stuff discourages people interested in improving server-side stuff from subscribing to cooker. I don't think Mandrake will be taken seriously on the server (though there is no reason why it shouldn't) unless you can get those running Mandrake servers in production involved in the development. Some have said that this will not be effective, but please tell me why a user will send a mail to a cooker-kde list for breakage in cyrus-imapd or apache or openldap. I think there should be a general list, that applies to Mandrake-specific software (DrakX, urpmi, drakxtools) and generic cooker issues. Then there should be lists for: -server software -KDE and KDE/Qt-based apps -GNOME and GTK-based apps -Other desktop software (OpenOffice.org, Mozilla etc) -Hardware (/kernel here too?) - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. One big issue is that users sometimes don't know if an issue that irritates them is a bug or a feature. The reason for this is that there is no documentation on the design of features. Also, since there is no documentation on the design of features, bug reports/suggestions/criticism can only be given when significant time has been invested in it. The aspect that is going to be used for many problems is going to be used again here: drakconnect. Some fundamentals are wrong, and by the time people used it/filed bugs on it, it was too late. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. Make it more visible on Mandrake web sites. Do more concept design work on the wiki. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? IMHO, no. I believe there should be a mini ISO specifically for hardware testing that any user can run without a large download or any risk of messing up any installation. Boot it, see if your hardware works for installation purposes, and some basic tools for reporting hardware problems. - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? There it too little press on the community aspects of Mandrake. Redhat hasn't got a development community, but probably most non-Mandrake users would think they do. - How to have more contributors? We need clear documentation/instructions on how to contribute. At present, contributor status seems random (he who bugs Lenny the most gets an account). There are a number of contributors who don't have accounts yet (IMHO Luca Olivetti at least should have one), but no process for becoming a contributor. Also, some contributors aren't subscribed to the lists they should be (even though they have aksed to be subscribed). One thing that oculd be done would be to make more of the inrastructure of thow accounts etc work public, and possibly appoint community members who can add accounts or fix some things (yes, I know this could be a problem for Mandrakesoft, but you trust me not to trojan samba, so why would you not trust me to add accounts). Part of this may be due to ad-hoc setups for authentication etc, and I think Mandrake needs to sort these issues out using the tools that are provided in the distro (ie get single-sign-on across all mandrake websites, using ssl where appropriate, including logins on development machines). More official development status needs to be given to the ports, and we need to make it easy for contributors to fix bugs
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, James Sparenberg wrote: - How to have more contributors? A bugzilla (or similar product) for the release version? Seems strange I know but if you hook people on the concept as users with a smaller bug number (hopefully) in a release version you could well spark the interest needed (as well as hone the skills needed) for working in here. Seems an odd angle I realize but since people keep saying. I don't program so they won't want me around. Maybe something of this nature will help in showing people that they can contribute. Of course in my case not being in the middle of a Paycheck major release at the same time would help, but that's a personal problem grin http://bugs.mandrakelinux.com/ # drakbug (I don't know how much this will be advertised and if it is all working and tested ... but note that bugs will probably treated more harshly than in bugzilla - where reporters are sometimes given usage tips when they have filed a non-bug) Regards, Buchan -- |Registered Linux User #182071-| Buchan MilneMechanical Engineer, Network Manager Cellphone * Work+27 82 472 2231 * +27 21 8828820x121 Stellenbosch Automotive Engineering http://www.cae.co.za GPG Key http://ranger.dnsalias.com/bgmilne.asc 1024D/60D204A7 2919 E232 5610 A038 87B1 72D6 AC92 BA50 60D2 04A7 * Please click on http://www.cae.co.za/disclaimer.htm to read our e-mail disclaimer or send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] for a copy. *
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sunday, Sep 28, 2003, at 13:34 US/Eastern, Buchan Milne wrote: On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Warly wrote: - How to have more contributors? We need clear documentation/instructions on how to contribute. At present, contributor status seems random (he who bugs Lenny the most gets an account). There are a number of contributors who don't have accounts yet (IMHO Luca Olivetti at least should have one), but no process for becoming a contributor. Also, some contributors aren't subscribed to the lists they should be (even though they have aksed to be subscribed). I second this. Count me in as one of the clueless contributers. After over 50 packages contributed in the past couple years, I do not even know that one may be given an *account*. Typically, I upload the source rpm to the ftp site's incoming directory, email contrib, and cc to cooker as outlined in the howto. Is there a better way? One thing that baffles me at times is that some packages contributed seem to never see the light of the day. This discourages me from contributing. If they were rejected for some reason, it would be helpful to have some feedback. Pete
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Hi, Le Dimanche 28 Septembre 2003 10:19, Warly a écrit : It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? As indicated, mainly the mirror process - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. I am not sure it is important as we acn all make the plit locally. But if it is possible a better presentation for the bug report would be a real plus. Indeed, now, for my point of view it is very difficult with Kmail to follow the bug report because all the information are mixed and poorly presented. I propose the following presentation (took the bug #6011 for example) : [Cooker] [Bug 6011] [kdebase-progs] New: Konqueror : bad rendering Please see : http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6011 Hi, The rendering of http://www.netgear.fr/forum is incorrect : looks as if headers were included multiple times, so the page is very long and the interesting stuff is at the very bottom. Rendering is ok with Mozilla, Epiphany, Galeon. Thanks Berthy - Additionnal informations : Summary: Konqueror : bad rendering o Product: kdebase-progs Version: 3.1.3-79mdk o Component: program Platform: PC OS/Version: All -Staus : UNCONFIRMED Severity: normal Priority: P2 -- Configure bugmail: http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email --- You are receiving this mail because: --- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. -- And the comments shall be include on the bottom of this email as per usual email behavior - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. Make a status page with the following information : - status of the update (broken-okay) - status of a fresh installation (including the net, cdrom, ) - revision and patch include in the last cooker, for example the base kernel revision, the kde revision, ... to help debug - a list of the confirmed severe bug we may have in cooker - What should we do to improve the Wiki. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? - How to have more contributors? Ease the fabrication of a specfile with a special tool, why not a specdrake ? And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. Get up good work BR Laurent
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
, 28 2003, 21:44,Michael Scherer: * use also apt-get (with the same repositories, IMHO this can be done no?), let the user which app use to install rpms. IMHO it just wastes mirror space ... how many use apt? it doesn't matter, apt is patched to use hdlist in mdk :) does it mean i CAN use apt in mdk? will it be able to recompile packages? howto? manuals? -- diego, 3 Tishrey 5764 Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
What about a metadistro with a cdrom (in the future a dvdrom) runing Mandrake from the cd-driver? similar to Knoppix but with all the Mandrake goodies. there are a couple mandrake related projects to do exactly that. Maybe Mandrakesoft could adopt one of them and or start a wiki node with the needed info? Doing Knoppix MIB with Mandrake files would KILL. (this project boots from cd and then mounts a flash memory key with an encrypted loopback filesystem that is used for the user home)
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
No. I don't need ISO's at all during development. 'rsync'ing to a local server and installing via net from there is cheap, fast and reliable. This is not my opinion. Some problems are only found with a fresh install or an upgrade of a previous stable distribution. and lets not forget the problems with 1 time is money | data is more important than money 2 not if you have sub megabit access ON THE MACHINE YOU ARE UPGRADING 3 and how many bugs have been around the network install? (total and just the 9.* series) And what if the bug is in the cdrom installer?
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On 09/28/2003 06:26:43 PM, Diego Iastrubni wrote: áéåí øàùåï, 28 áñôèîáø 2003, 21:44, ðëúá òì éãé Michael Scherer: * use also apt-get (with the same repositories, IMHO this can be done no?), let the user which app use to install rpms. IMHO it just wastes mirror space ... how many use apt? it doesn't matter, apt is patched to use hdlist in mdk :) does it mean i CAN use apt in mdk? will it be able to recompile packages? howto? manuals? This is madness. Why the hell would anyone want to use apt instead of urpmi with Mandrake. Austin -- Austin Acton Synthetic Organic Chemist, Teaching Assistant, Ph.D. Candidate Department of Chemistry, York University, Toronto MandrakeLinux Volunteer Developer, homepage: www.groundstate.ca
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Felix Miata wrote: 5-A usable normal boot and/or rescue floppy should be at least offered for creation during install. After install, creating a boot and/or rescue floppy should actually be possible on any system. Barring that, the creation process that fails should offer some guidance on what to change in order to enable success on future tries. IMHO, there is very little need for this as every installation media allows the rescue boot. 6-Time. /var/log/boot.log shouldn't start a boot at 13:00, then back up 4 hours to 09:00 for several startup items, then jump back to 13:01 to finish up. If configuration is that the system clock is set to local time, then all entries should be based upon that clock, and not adjusted to anything else for any reason at any time. When a new system is installed, no directory should be time stamped 4 hours before the install started, which is the case now. And how is this supposed to be determined before any user interaction? Should thelog files be re-interpreted after changing the timezone? 7-rc ordering is dumb. If the system is configured to start in runlevel 5, it nevertheless should finish init on runlevel 3 first. No one should have to wait to get a prompt on vc[1-6] until substantially after the X login manager has appeared, which is the case now. We have to wait for everything else. Making the dm start later only makes you wait longer for a graphical login, it doesn't make much difference to console logins. Services that can't be used in runlevel 2 shouldn't be started before all runlevel 2 services have had their init. Run level has nothing to do with it, but if you have issues with certain packages, file bugs on them. IMHO, we need a more intelligent init (like serel or the make-based on recently shown on IBM's developer site). 8-Back to the old way with the installer. Used to be able to go back to any particular step just by clicking on the item in the left column. That was brilliant, and is missed. Pixel said this introdced many bugs which were difficult to fix. 9-NUMLOCK I very much appreciate having this package installed by default, as it makes me insane that any OS kernel feels compelled to switch NUM off when in the BIOS it is set to ON. Well, I am sure the kernel developers will take patches to reliably detect the numlock setting and handle it intelligently. That said, I have to guess there is a more efficient way to do it than with an rpm package, as SuSE has the same functionality, but without a package named numlock. I don't know how they do it, but I do know it is configured through /etc/sysconfig/keyboard, which is 2509 bytes and has, among others, the following settings on my SuSE 8.1 machine: KBD_RATE=20.0 KBD_DELAY=250 KBD_NUMLOCK=bios Does this (KBD_NUMLOCK=bios) work reliably in all settings for numlock? In contrast, this same file in 9.1 and cooker is all of 36 bytes, and has nothing in it that explains what any of its three lines are for. Also, it needs to be fixed so that if enabled, it is in the ON state for the X login manager so that I can use the NUM pad for password entry without having to think hmmm, is the NUM light on?. AFAIK, all VTs take the default setting set by numlock. (BTW, numlock on by default is very annoying on laptop keyboards, *especially* on login screens ... so this *must* be avoided) Regards, Buchan -- |Registered Linux User #182071-| Buchan MilneMechanical Engineer, Network Manager Cellphone * Work+27 82 472 2231 * +27 21 8828820x121 Stellenbosch Automotive Engineering http://www.cae.co.za GPG Key http://ranger.dnsalias.com/bgmilne.asc 1024D/60D204A7 2919 E232 5610 A038 87B1 72D6 AC92 BA50 60D2 04A7 * Please click on http://www.cae.co.za/disclaimer.htm to read our e-mail disclaimer or send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] for a copy. *
[Cooker] Attn: Juan - Kernel srpm
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Juan, I haven't dug through the spec file to see exactly where the problem is, but if I rebuild the current kernel source, it doesn't respect --without up or - --without enterprise. After long arguments about the proper way to build a recent kernel on an old version of mandrake, the conclusion seems to be that I must use the srpm, as kernel-source has glibc dependencies because of the prebuilt build tools. With the current kernel, I have to wait through several hours of kernel building to get a new kernel-source package. Please fix :) Rocco -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE/d2hZSCmJfrlriowRAsY/AKDGT34X8BtTc4oyLYOmBOjOar21mwCdHXJf RQiow1RHsCDP3ab4JiUTR6U= =A0fW -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Robert L martin wrote: What about a metadistro with a cdrom (in the future a dvdrom) runing Mandrake from the cd-driver? similar to Knoppix but with all the Mandrake goodies. there are a couple mandrake related projects to do exactly that. Maybe Mandrakesoft could adopt one of them and or start a wiki node with the needed info? No need. # urpmi mklivecd # mklivecd livecd.iso # cdrecord dev=0,0,0 livecd.iso # reboot See http://minicd.berlios.de for more info. Doing Knoppix MIB with Mandrake files would KILL. I am looking at doing something like this now ... but I'm not sure if I have access to such a version of Knoppix (is it in standard knoppix yet, or still a remastered version?). (this project boots from cd and then mounts a flash memory key with an encrypted loopback filesystem that is used for the user home) Ideally, it would be compatible with the pam_mount method so you can use the same $HOME on non-livecd machines. Regards, Buchan -- |Registered Linux User #182071-| Buchan MilneMechanical Engineer, Network Manager Cellphone * Work+27 82 472 2231 * +27 21 8828820x121 Stellenbosch Automotive Engineering http://www.cae.co.za GPG Key http://ranger.dnsalias.com/bgmilne.asc 1024D/60D204A7 2919 E232 5610 A038 87B1 72D6 AC92 BA50 60D2 04A7 * Please click on http://www.cae.co.za/disclaimer.htm to read our e-mail disclaimer or send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] for a copy. *
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sunday 28 September 2003 09:39, Luca Olivetti wrote: Michael Reinsch wrote: - some packages have a maintainer who is not really the maintainer of this package (i.e. most changes are done by someone else), so a bug report isn't assigned to the correct person. And sometimes they make gratuitous changes to the spec file without even testing that the package works after the modification (hint: a package that builds isn't equal to a package that builds *correctly* and works). Bye Oh how true that is. I had hell last time trying to build optimized 9.1 rpms for my athlon. Some of the spec files needed modifications which weren't added which a rookie would be clueless about. thank god for #mandrake (and here too kinda)
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sunday 28 September 2003 09:38, Nora Etukudo wrote: On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 03:05:48PM +0200, Pierre Jarillon wrote: This is not my opinion. Some problems are only found with a fresh install or an upgrade of a previous stable distribution. Well, I don't like upgrades, I do only fresh installs. Liebe Grüße, Nora. but if updates worked better you'd probably do them wouldn't you?
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
Doing Knoppix MIB with Mandrake files would KILL. I am looking at doing something like this now ... but I'm not sure if I have access to such a version of Knoppix (is it in standard knoppix yet, or still a remastered version?). (this project boots from cd and then mounts a flash memory key with an encrypted loopback filesystem that is used for the user home) Ideally, it would be compatible with the pam_mount method so you can use the same $HOME on non-livecd machines. I think MIB is a remaster still but most of the diff is in the crypto don't know about pam_mount but it could be done if the machine had ELBfs and usb disk support. part of MIB is the Im not using Windows?? Could you say that again and LOOK HERE PLEASE thing
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 01:19, Warly wrote: It may be a good idea, before cooker opens again, to take these days to have some brainstorm. May you give your opinion on : - What was wrong in 9.2 development process? - We though a bit late in the 9.2 developement process to split cooker ml, we should do it now. - What could we do to improve 9.3/10.0 development. - What should we do to improve the Wiki. - Should we have cooker snapshot ISOs? - What could we do, as a community, to increase the acceptance of mandrakelinux? - How to have more contributors? And anything related to the mandrakelinux distro. In answer to all of the above. How about splitting the development along 2 lines. Mandrake tools and packages. The idea here from my thought is that these really are two separate areas, with separate goals. The next step would be to make the development of tools a continues project rather than a point/major release function. Create a fourth area called testing on the mirrors. This area differs from updates in that it isn't a bug fix but a known alpha product that is based on a stable release (in this case 9.2) and those power users who chose to can participate in the continuous testing of new ideas and directions. PLF and Ranger showed that a new Disk 1 can be created to allow testing of just the installer with an existing set of disks. (There used to be, and may still be, an iso you could download of all of the PLF rpms. You would boot from it and begin the install instead of from the normal disk 1.) This would allow testing of MDK's tools in a stable and isolated environment. Then, when the next release cycle began the beta stage, MDK could decide what from this arena would become the tool set for the next release. We could then concentrate on just the package area for heavy debugging. This would also allow for the testing of what if's a lot more so that MDK would have a better idea of what flies and what doesn't as far as usability goes. The tools and installers from 9.0 to 9.x for example should remain pretty consistent anyway since it is a point release. Parallel attempts at usability could be tried (debug statements left in and operational etc.) Users would have to specifically chose to use the area called testing so that, hey, if it breaks your box... sorry. So no one would be able to complain beyond bug reports. (if you don't like it don't try it.) We also wouldn't have to waste so much time discussing things like the UI change in MCC etc. Then if MDK monitored the experts and newbie lists and kept seeing everyone recommend a certain tool to solve a problem they'd know for sure they have a winner. Finally when the MDK team chooses the final tool set from updates and this area, they become the tool set for the next release and then the crunch time would be able to concentrate on packages. Overall it would yield a much more stable release process IMHO. James
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 15:07, Buchan Milne wrote: On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, James Sparenberg wrote: - How to have more contributors? A bugzilla (or similar product) for the release version? Seems strange I know but if you hook people on the concept as users with a smaller bug number (hopefully) in a release version you could well spark the interest needed (as well as hone the skills needed) for working in here. Seems an odd angle I realize but since people keep saying. I don't program so they won't want me around. Maybe something of this nature will help in showing people that they can contribute. Of course in my case not being in the middle of a Paycheck major release at the same time would help, but that's a personal problem grin http://bugs.mandrakelinux.com/ # drakbug (I don't know how much this will be advertised and if it is all working and tested ... but note that bugs will probably treated more harshly than in bugzilla - where reporters are sometimes given usage tips when they have filed a non-bug) Regards, Buchan Buchan, thanks I know that Vincent had/has been working on this... Is it ready for prime time? If so I know a number of folks on the expert list that would be willing to assist via this tool. But I'd rather let Vincent make the announcement, since most of it will be in his lap, so to speak. James
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sunday 28 September 2003 01:18 pm, Diego Iastrubni wrote: * use also apt-get (with the same repositories, IMHO this can be done no?), let the user which app use to install rpms. I don't understand the continued romanticism with apt when urpmi has matured so nicely. It even takes two fewer keystroke to type urpmi vs apt-get. IMO, apt does not belong in Mandrake. -- /g Outside of a dog, a man's best friend is a book, inside a dog it's too dark to read -Groucho Marx
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sunday 28 September 2003 06:07 pm, Buchan Milne wrote: http://bugs.mandrakelinux.com/ Very Cool. Thanks Vincent -- /g Outside of a dog, a man's best friend is a book, inside a dog it's too dark to read -Groucho Marx
Re: [Cooker] And next ?
On Sunday 28 September 2003 05:36 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: Warly While the people here can help in answering this question for sure. It's also one that should go out to the expert list as well. Some of the people here are on both yes, but there is a group there that has dedicated itself to helping make things work the way all of you intended. I think the input from there would be of value. This is an excellent point JS. I wholeheartedly agree. On second thought, maybe it's not such a good idea, the simple fact that somebody from MandrakeSoft would post a message to expert asking for feedback would cause several long-time subscribers to drop over dead from a heart attack ;-) -- /g Outside of a dog, a man's best friend is a book, inside a dog it's too dark to read -Groucho Marx
