How to build NetBeans with JDK >= 9 and get access to newer JDK APIs?

[Eirik Bakke]

Hi, netbeans-dev.

Normally I build NetBeans from sources by just running the command "ant" from 
the root of the repo.

While making some improvements to the platform\openide.util.ui\ImageUtilities 
class, I concluded I need to use the java.awt.image.MultiResolutionImage class, 
which only became available in JDK 9. With a plain "ant" build I get a "cannot 
find symbol" error when referencing it.

What build option do I need to set to build NetBeans on a newer Java version, 
and get access to the Java 9 APIs from the openide.util.ui module?

My JAVA_HOME environment variable is already pointing at Java 11.

(The specific use case here is to make SVG/HiDPI/Retina icons work in the main 
menu bar on MacOS, for my NetBeans Platform application. This requires use of 
the MultiResolutionImage class.)

-- Eirik

RE: Windows 11 Issues - Copy/Paste Failure

[Eirik Bakke]

Oh, that's a beautifully written test! I ran it a few times and with 25 
iterations but it didn't exhibit the bug, though. I left a comment reporting my 
results and will run the test again the next time I observe the bug in the wild.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2023 11:11 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Windows 11 Issues - Copy/Paste Failure

On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 at 06:26, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> But the problem remains, and I was never able to reproduce it reliably--it 
> was always intermittent.
>
> If anyone can manage to reliably reproduce the bug, that would probably go a 
> long way towards finding a fix.

Have you tried the robot-based test on the issue at
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/issues/3962#issuecomment-1664507172
?

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: Windows 11 Issues - Copy/Paste Failure

[Eirik Bakke]

Some more discussions of the issue are here:

https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/4572
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/4774

The latter PR from a year ago improved the situation a bit, as it made it 
possible to work around the issue by fiddling with Copy/Paste in NetBeans a few 
times, rather than by restarting the entire IDE. But the problem remains, and I 
was never able to reproduce it reliably--it was always intermittent.

If anyone can manage to reliably reproduce the bug, that would probably go a 
long way towards finding a fix. 

(I would not be surprised if the bug requires specific other applications to be 
running at the same time. On my own computer, for instance, I always have Excel 
and jEdit open, as well as another NetBeans Platform application.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Ernie Rael  
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2023 4:11 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Windows 11 Issues - Copy/Paste Failure

I too used windows for several years (linux now, it's wonderful and no more 
cygwin), I don't recall having seen this issue. But I use jVi which has it's 
own cut/paste handling that behaves like vim's (there's even a flavor so 
blockmode copy/paste works between vim/jVi). Otherwise clipboard interfacing is 
as simple as can be.

My experience would support legacy/ancient code being involved.

-ernie


On 23/08/29 6:57 AM, Scott Palmer wrote:
> The last time I looked into it, there seemed to be some workarounds in 
> NetBeans for ancient Swing clipboard issues that probably don't apply 
> anymore.  I think NB is doing something weird with the clipboard.
>
> I'm primarily developing on Linux now, so I'm spared from this issue.  
> But when I worked on Windows it happened all the time.  It was a 
> weekly annoyance.
>
> Scott
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 29, 2023 at 6:03 AM Neil C Smith  wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 at 01:14, Michael Bien  wrote:
>>> On 29.08.23 00:50, Kenneth Fogel wrote:
 I have mentioned this before, but the situation is getting worse. 
 More
>> often than not, I must cut the text, paste the text
>>> this issue is tracked here:
>> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/issues/3962
 I do have a question. How many people actively working on NetBeans 
 do
>> this in a Windows rather than Linux or MacOS operating system?
>>> I believe most NB maintainers are indeed not using windows as their 
>>> primary OS, those who are might not be able to reproduce it given 
>>> that it shows some symptoms of a race condition (but it could be 
>>> something
>> else).
>>
>> It's not just about who is working on Windows, either, but whether 
>> they can reproduce the problem.  While my primary development 
>> platform is Ubuntu, I've got development and testing machines on 
>> Windows and macOS.  I've tried multiple times to reproduce this, 
>> including using the automated test in that issue (Ken, please look at 
>> that too).  My system simply never shows the problem.
>>
>> I think Michael is right to suggest a race condition is in play here.
>> That enabling fine logging mitigates the issue for many would suggest 
>> timing.  However, the logging also has side effects, which eagerly 
>> acquires the data in the clipboard, which could also be affecting the 
>> outcome.
>>
>> Also, let's not assume that this is unique to NetBeans or even a bug 
>> in NetBeans itself!  https://youtrack.jetbrains.com/issue/JBR-5980/
>>
>> Best wishes,
>>
>> Neil
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>


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RE: reuse existing icon

[Eirik Bakke]

I think you'd need to copy the icon file from the NetBeans codebase and into 
your own module's resources folder, then reference it from iconBase. (Or 
perhaps you can reference the icon in the NetBeans module directly if your 
module has a direct dependency on the NetBeans module; I'm not sure how the 
classloader stuff works here.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung  
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2023 10:06 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: reuse existing icon

Hi
   I try to extends  the text/x-java and add a new multiview. How to reuse 
existing icon?

@MultiViewElement.Registration(
displayName = "#LBL_Java_Disasm",
//  iconBase = "hk/quantr/jcd/javaLogo16_16.png",   <--- what should i 
fill in here?
mimeType = "text/x-java",
persistenceType = TopComponent.PERSISTENCE_NEVER,
preferredID = "JavaVisual",
position = 22000
)


Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited 
https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 96554595)

RE: maven indexing tweaks

[Eirik Bakke]

> Also: if a lib is in your local .m2 folder already (even snapshots you 
> build), it is in a separate index for local repos - this one isn't 
filtered either. The index footprint there is also tiny (25 MB for a 4GB .m2 
folder in my case)

Thanks for explaining! It sounds like the potential problem I was imagining is 
not too relevant.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Michael Bien  
Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2023 10:37 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org; Eirik Bakke 
Subject: Re: maven indexing tweaks

On 18.03.23 14:41, Eirik Bakke wrote:
> - "sliding window" time filters, e.g drop all documents older than 2 
> years (aka: who uses old libraries?)
>
> Is "document" the same as "maven artifact" here?

yeah pretty much. A lucene document is somewhat comparable to a row in a db (i 
think). The experiments I ran so far filtered everything which had a 
modification date field, those should only be on documents which describe 
artifacts. I used a tool called Luke to inspect the index which I am not an 
expert in. The raw data is also 14 GB so you can't quickly look at it and know 
what is in it or what takes up most of the space.

Here are the fields which once were in the data, most aren't used anymore:

https://maven.apache.org/maven-indexer-archives/maven-indexer-LATEST/indexer-core/

e.g removing the sha1 field cut the lucene index almost in half, since those 
things don't compress very well or cause other overhead.


>   Perhaps an additional condition could be added, "older than 1 year _and_ 
> there are newer versions of this artifact in the cache".

the proposal upstream does not filter the "cache", that would be slow 
and would not have the desired effect of reduced on-disk footprint 
unless the index is rebuild (since lucene storage uses immutable files). 
It filters during extraction of the raw data of the remote index before 
it is put into a lucene index which represents the remote repository 
(e.g central but it works with any other too, apache or a 
company-internal one etc). (another advantage is that the filter would 
be a step in an already multi threaded extraction pipeline without extra 
steps)

So if you set the cutoff filter to 2 years, and use the same cache for 1 
year, there gonna be 3 years of artifact metadata in your index.

Also: if a lib is in your local .m2 folder already (even snapshots you 
build), it is in a separate index for local repos - this one isn't 
filtered either. The index footprint there is also tiny (25 MB for a 4GB 
.m2 folder in my case)

-mbien


>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Michael Bien 
> Sent: Friday, March 17, 2023 8:26 PM
> To: dev@netbeans.apache.org; Antonio 
> Subject: Re: maven indexing tweaks
>
> On 17.03.23 22:38, Antonio wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> These are impressive savings!
> yeah I am pretty happy about the results too. Esp the removal of the
> sha1 field had a great effect. Technically we do actually offer this as query 
> through the public API, however, it doesn't appear as anything is using it - 
> i have to take another look just to be sure. Even if something does we could 
> make it an option in the settings.
>
>
>>
>> Out of curiosity, we don't build the index incrementally using Maven's
>> IndexReader, do we? That's why we download the whole index, right?
> first use will download the whole copy, weekly updates are incremental.
> And yes it uses DefaultIndexReader (and the updater) of the maven-indexer 
> project.
>
> Which is the reason why we have to make some tweaks upstream to get more 
> flexibility (and filtering). For example some time in future we might want to 
> change where the temp extraction storage is, which maven-indexer uses, which 
> is also part of the proposed PR upstream right now.
>
> https://repo1.maven.org/maven2/.index/ has the compressed data for central, 
> (apache etc have their own locations but those indices are smaller so you 
> barely notice anything)
>
> Currently the lucene index isn't moved into new NetBeans config from old 
> caches. This is something we could take a look at too but things like this 
> are super annoying to test + risky since someone will find a way to import an 
> index from a 10 year old backup and report that something fails (just like 
> users who try to import nb-javac from NB 12.x which which breaks pretty much 
> everything).
>
> -mbien
>
>> Thanks,
>> Antonio
>>
>>
>> [1]
>>
>> https://maven.apache.org/maven-indexer/indexer-reader/apidocs/org/apac
>> he/maven/index/reader/IndexReader.html
>>
>>
>> On 17/3/23 11:06, Michael Bien wrote:
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> I experimented a bit with the maven index extraction process and got
>>&

RE: log4j

[Eirik Bakke]

Is there any reason to use log4j instead of java.util.logging these days? If 
log4j is only use in one place in the NetBeans codebase, it might be beneficial 
to get rid of it in any case--one less dependency, and fewer overlapping 
logging libraries.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Matthias Bläsing  
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2023 2:48 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: log4j

Hi,

Am Donnerstag, dem 23.03.2023 um 09:53 -0400 schrieb William Shackleford:
> Netbeans appears to include log4j even the most recent version.
> 
> in
> 
> netbeans/ide/modules/ext/log4j-1.2.15.jar
> 
> Our IT security group has flagged it and requires that it be removed 
> even though as it is version 1 it is not vulnerable to the most famous 
> issue as apparently there were other issues  and it is no longer supported.
> 
> What are the consequences of removing it?

If I saw it correctly, log4j is used by the html validator only.
Anything that calls into that might break. That also might happen indirectly.

> 
> How would I go about committing  or just suggestion a change to have 
> it removed from future versions

Have a look at the html.parser and html.validator modules. Both most probably 
need to be updated or might be patched not to carry log4j.
Patching html.validator might be the quickest way, updates to current version 
might be better in the long run.

The hard

> to avoid triggering our security team from telling everyone to delete 
> it and maybe all of netbeans with it?

The alternative is: Solve organisational problems inside the organisation. If 
the security team indeed has the misconception that "has log4j === is 
vulnerable", than you might need a new security team.

My status on the CVEs:

- CVE-2019-17571: SocketServer needs to be explicitly loaded, we are not 
vulnerable
- CVE-2020-9488: We don't use the SMTPAppender, we are not vulnerable
- CVE-2021-4104: We don't use the JMSAppender, we are not vulnerabe
- CVE-2022-23302: We don't use the JMSSink, we are not vulnerable
- CVE-2022-23305: We don't use the JDBCAppender, we are not vulnerable
- CVE-2022-23307: Apache Chainsaw is not used

Greetings

Matthias

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RE: [DISCUSS] tweak some defaults (round two)

[Eirik Bakke]

I rely heavily on Compile-on-Save for my own project, but don't mind it being 
off by default for new users. (Removing support for it altogether, though, 
would be a much bigger problem.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2023 6:46 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] tweak some defaults (round two)

On Sun, 19 Mar 2023 at 04:06, Michael Bien  wrote:
>   - disable compile on save (maven)

Let's deal with that first, as I'm mainly moving the discussion here as I was 
told to on https://github.com/apache/netbeans/issues/5260 :-)

+1 for having that off by default.  I think we have enough information
in the UI to prompt enabling, and a good warning message when enabling.  Using 
CoS has upsides and downsides that need to be understood by the user, and does 
occasionally introduce surprising bugs.  I never use it any more (too many past 
problems) and think it goes against the idea of NetBeans being a WYSIWYG 
interface to the build system.

My comment about new projects / disabling by default, is that in my opinion the 
logic in nb-configuration.xml should be reversed, so that the lack of that file 
(eg. in a new project or git checkout) means disabled.  That's potentially a 
bigger change than you're considering?

>   - enable 'view -> show versioning labels'

+1

>   - enable open tab next to current (default opens new tabs as last)

+0 - have to admit to never trying this one, so not sure of its benefits.

>   - bump number of search results (matching files currently capped to 
> 500)

+0 - UI up to it?

>   - enable "replace invalid characters in branch name" (see 
> screenshots in #3980, #4306)

+1

> - disable inline hints (again) 'view -> show inline hints' 
> (potentially find a hotkey for it? since that is how I use it by 
> toggling it on/off on demand)

+0.5 (+1 to a hotkey either way)

Had to answer too many queries in various places on how to turn this "annoying" 
feature off.

I think there is a wider issue to address here, as discussed elsewhere.  Our 
current release notes / download pages are simply not good enough.  With the 
release where this feature was enabled by default, there was no information on 
what it is, why it is, and where the off switch is.

With any highly visible changes like this, and some of the default changes you 
suggest above, we need to be much better at communicating to the end user 
what's changed and where the switches to the previous behaviour are!

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: maven indexing tweaks

[Eirik Bakke]

- "sliding window" time filters, e.g drop all documents older than 2 years 
(aka: who uses old libraries?)

Is "document" the same as "maven artifact" here? Perhaps an additional 
condition could be added, "older than 1 year _and_ there are newer versions of 
this artifact in the cache".

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Michael Bien  
Sent: Friday, March 17, 2023 8:26 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org; Antonio 
Subject: Re: maven indexing tweaks

On 17.03.23 22:38, Antonio wrote:
> Hi,
>
> These are impressive savings!

yeah I am pretty happy about the results too. Esp the removal of the
sha1 field had a great effect. Technically we do actually offer this as query 
through the public API, however, it doesn't appear as anything is using it - i 
have to take another look just to be sure. Even if something does we could make 
it an option in the settings.


>
>
> Out of curiosity, we don't build the index incrementally using Maven's 
> IndexReader, do we? That's why we download the whole index, right?

first use will download the whole copy, weekly updates are incremental. 
And yes it uses DefaultIndexReader (and the updater) of the maven-indexer 
project.

Which is the reason why we have to make some tweaks upstream to get more 
flexibility (and filtering). For example some time in future we might want to 
change where the temp extraction storage is, which maven-indexer uses, which is 
also part of the proposed PR upstream right now.

https://repo1.maven.org/maven2/.index/ has the compressed data for central, 
(apache etc have their own locations but those indices are smaller so you 
barely notice anything)

Currently the lucene index isn't moved into new NetBeans config from old 
caches. This is something we could take a look at too but things like this are 
super annoying to test + risky since someone will find a way to import an index 
from a 10 year old backup and report that something fails (just like users who 
try to import nb-javac from NB 12.x which which breaks pretty much everything).

-mbien

>
> Thanks,
> Antonio
>
>
> [1]
>
> https://maven.apache.org/maven-indexer/indexer-reader/apidocs/org/apac
> he/maven/index/reader/IndexReader.html
>
>
> On 17/3/23 11:06, Michael Bien wrote:
>> Hello everyone,
>>
>> I experimented a bit with the maven index extraction process and got 
>> some pretty good results (I think).
>>
>> There might be a way to filter the index during extraction without 
>> noteworthy overhead, which allows the following:
>>
>>   - "sliding window" time filters, e.g drop all documents older than
>> 2 years (aka: who uses old libraries?)
>>
>>   - we can drop fields we don't need from the index. Esp interesting 
>> for fields which don't compress well (looking at you, sha1 hash)
>>
>> some results for the time cutoff filter:
>>
>> full: 5.6 GB
>> 2y: 2.6 GB
>> 1y: 1.4 GB
>
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>
>
>


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RE: Lets talk about JDK 8 (new year edition)

[Eirik Bakke]

> Platform applications are not limited to using the platform cluster.
> There are multiple platform applications I'm aware of that use modules from 
> other clusters.  Including one, possibly soon two, of my own.

Same here--my NetBeans Platform application ( https://www.ultorg.com/ ) uses 
most, but not all, of the modules in the "platform" cluster, as well as various 
hand-picked modules from the "ide" cluster (e.g. editor functionality and 
Database Explorer).

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2023 4:07 AM
To: Michael Bien 
Cc: dev 
Subject: Re: Lets talk about JDK 8 (new year edition)

On Wed, 8 Feb 2023, 04:52 Michael Bien,  wrote:

> On 08.02.23 02:54, Neil C Smith wrote:
> > On Tue, 7 Feb 2023 at 21:39, Michael Bien  wrote:
> >> However, I got the feeling, sooner or later someone will want to 
> >> have the platform again at a lower bytecode level than the rest of the IDE.
> >> I hope I am wrong and this never happens again. If this happens we 
> >> can deal with this later, this isn't relevant for the immediate JDK 
> >> 11 step since it is supposed to finally sync everything.
> > Again?  That is not the situation now.
>
> now am confused...
>
> we have tests on 8 and 11. We build on 11 with bytecode level set to 8.
> Some modules set it to 11.


Yes. But there's nothing special about the platform cluster modules. All 
required modules (or dependencies of) across all clusters are built with max 
level 8. Optional modules, such as enhancing or overriding services, can 
specify 11. If running on 8 they should not enable and degrade cleanly.

IDE runtime requirements say JDK 11.


Well it is "officially supported" on JDK 11+. As we know it still technically 
runs on JDK 8, with a somewhat degraded experience. That was a requirement that 
led to the current arrangement - it wasn't platform vs rest of IDE.

What I hope from this discussion that there won't be any 8s in that
> paragraph above at some point in future. That is what I mean by "in sync".
>

Yes, me too! I'd like us to remove all 8s from that paragraph by NB19. And only 
commit to keeping any 11s in there until NB22.

Best wishes,

Neil

RE: Better release notes for NB17 - the Highlight label

[Eirik Bakke]

There was a top comment on the "Apache NetBeans 15" HackerNews post some months 
ago that seems relevant:

"None of the blog that is linked here, Netbeans github page, and the official 
NetBeans website have a single screenshot of what the application looks like. 
If you compare that to IntelliJ IDEA's website, it's filled with screenshots 
accompanying a writeup promoting the feature displayed in the screenshot."
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32835722

It would be good to address these concerns. But of course, this is all 
volunteer work for us, so it's up to whoever finds inspiration to make 
improvements...

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Michael Bien  
Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2023 3:23 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org; László Kishalmi 
Cc: Eirik Bakke 
Subject: Re: Better release notes for NB17 - the Highlight label

where to put it? Should we activate the wiki on github or how does this work?

Would be good to be able to copy github markup from PRs including 
screenshots without having to rehost anything.

-mbien

On 24.01.23 21:04, László Kishalmi wrote:
> Let's bring the "New and Noteworthy" page back! If we start now we 
> might have one ready by the time of the release!
>
> I'd do the Gradle section, I guess my ANTLR work in this release is 
> not that interesting for the public.
>
> On Tue, Jan 24, 2023 at 11:29 AM Michael Bien  wrote:
>
>> I had the same thought. But wasn't sure if that is a good idea since 
>> the compact nature of release notes can be a feature in itself.
>>
>> The release highlights (new-and-noteworthy as NB used to call the 
>> page) with screenshots and clips is more something for blogs/wikis I believe.
>>
>> -mbien
>>
>>
>> On 24.01.23 20:22, Eirik Bakke wrote:
>>> I think screenshots might help a lot in creating more appealing 
>>> Release
>> Notes. Often, screenshots from the PR can be reused. And we can 
>> always encourage people to attach screenshots in PRs when relevant.
>>> -- Eirik
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Neil C Smith 
>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2023 11:28 AM
>>> To: Michael Bien 
>>> Cc: dev@netbeans.apache.org
>>> Subject: Re: Better release notes for NB17 - the Highlight label
>>>
>>> On Tue, 24 Jan 2023 at 16:11, Michael Bien  wrote:
>>>> We can manually group the changes a bit better in the final release 
>>>> notes - just like Laszlo did with the Editor category of NB 16. 
>>>> Since its often that multiple PRs when taken together would create 
>>>> a noteworthy change.
>>> Agreed!  Although this is also how we (OK, mainly Geertjan! :-) )
>> highlight things on the download pages, blog posts, social media posts, etc.
>>> Compare eg. https://netbeans.apache.org/download/nb120/index.html 
>>> and
>> https://netbeans.apache.org/download/nb16/
>>> The former was definitely becoming burdensome, but the latter is
>> possibly not enough.
>>>> FlatLAF update PR quietly introduces a new theme (highlight label
>> worthy):
>>>> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/5298
>>> ...
>>>> (some?) PHP 8.2 support - but the PRs are already nicely grouped in 
>>>> that category
>>> Good list! :-)
>>>
>>>> but tbh as someone who is often going around and labels PRs, I am 
>>>> already glad when they are labeled at all :) I am not really 
>>>> thinking about release notes at this point in the dev cycle.
>>> Tell me about it!  That's kind of the issue, along with grouping, 
>>> where
>> maybe the highlight label is not the right way to do this?
>>> Best wishes,
>>>
>>> Neil
>>>
>>> 
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
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>>>
>>>
>>>
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RE: Better release notes for NB17 - the Highlight label

[Eirik Bakke]

I think screenshots might help a lot in creating more appealing Release Notes. 
Often, screenshots from the PR can be reused. And we can always encourage 
people to attach screenshots in PRs when relevant.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2023 11:28 AM
To: Michael Bien 
Cc: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Better release notes for NB17 - the Highlight label

On Tue, 24 Jan 2023 at 16:11, Michael Bien  wrote:
> We can manually group the changes a bit better in the final release 
> notes - just like Laszlo did with the Editor category of NB 16. Since 
> its often that multiple PRs when taken together would create a 
> noteworthy change.

Agreed!  Although this is also how we (OK, mainly Geertjan! :-) ) highlight 
things on the download pages, blog posts, social media posts, etc.

Compare eg. https://netbeans.apache.org/download/nb120/index.html and 
https://netbeans.apache.org/download/nb16/

The former was definitely becoming burdensome, but the latter is possibly not 
enough.

> FlatLAF update PR quietly introduces a new theme (highlight label worthy):
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/5298
...
> (some?) PHP 8.2 support - but the PRs are already nicely grouped in 
> that category

Good list! :-)

> but tbh as someone who is often going around and labels PRs, I am 
> already glad when they are labeled at all :) I am not really thinking 
> about release notes at this point in the dev cycle.

Tell me about it!  That's kind of the issue, along with grouping, where maybe 
the highlight label is not the right way to do this?

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: [FlatLAF] Initial value not fully set for NotifyDescriptor

[Eirik Bakke]

I've noticed that DialogDisplayer.getDefault() returns a different 
implementation when run from a plain main() class (standalone Java application) 
than when run in the context of a NetBeans Platfrom application. The standalone 
implementation has some problems, like not enabling/disabling the OK button in 
response to NotifyDescriptor.setValid.

Is the behavior you are reporting for the NetBeans Platform application case, 
or the standalone Java app case?

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Patrik Karlström  
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2022 1:05 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: [FlatLAF] Initial value not fully set for NotifyDescriptor

Den ons 17 aug. 2022 kl 16:23 skrev Patrik Karlström :

> The initial value/default button for a dialog created with 
> NotifyDescriptor is not activated when using FlatLAF.
> There is an indication around the button requested to be default, but 
> also some remaining indicator around the actual default button.
>
> FlatLAF works fine when manually creating a dialog with 
> JOptionPane.showOptionDialog.
> MetalLAF works fine with NotifyDescriptor.
>
> The following code displays the problem.
> Uncomment to use the workaround.
>
> var button1 = new JButton("1");
> var button2 = new JButton("2");
> var button3 = new JButton("3");
> var buttons = new JButton[]{button1, button2, button3};
>
> var d = new NotifyDescriptor(
> "Look at the buttons borders\nPress & hold ENTER",
> "Demo",
> DialogDescriptor.DEFAULT_OPTION,
> DialogDescriptor.WARNING_MESSAGE,
> buttons,
> button3
> );
>
> new Thread(() -> {
> try {
> Thread.sleep(100);
> } catch (InterruptedException ex) {
> Exceptions.printStackTrace(ex);
> }
>
> SwingUtilities.invokeLater(() -> {
> //button3.requestFocus();
> });
> }).start();
>
> System.out.println(DialogDisplayer.getDefault().notify(d));
>
> Patrik
>


Now I notice this in NetBeans 16 too.
When trying to copy/paste a class from one project to another the refactor 
dialog shows up with four buttons:
Preview, Refactor, Cancel, Help

The Refactor button has the background of a focused button while the Cancel 
button has the border of a focused button.

Hitting enter equals Cancel.

The Metal LAF has a similar visual defect but the correct behavior when hitting 
enter.

Is this reproducible by anyone else?

Patrik

RE: Copy Paste still an issue

[Eirik Bakke]

Yeah, this still does happen sometimes. The improvement is that it always now 
seems possible to get out of the broken state without having to restart the IDE.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Scott Palmer  
Sent: Monday, December 5, 2022 10:46 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Copy Paste still an issue

I’ve still had to paste into another application sometimes and then copy again 
to get NB 16 to recognize what I had copied from somewhere else so it would 
paste that instead of what it had internally. 

Scott

> On Dec 5, 2022, at 9:33 PM, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> 
> Yes, there was a patch here in NetBeans 15 which I think improved the 
> situation a lot. Now you can usually just Ctrl+C again, which so far 
> has always resolved the problem for me. (Instead of restarting the 
> IDE.)
> 
> The patch was https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/4774 , which was a 
> follow-up on https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/4572 . I kept a diary of 
> cut/paste problems and their resolution for several weeks.
> 
> -- Eirik
> 
> 
> Great! There was a patch in NetBeans 15 that made the copy/paste bug much 
> less of a problem.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Patrik Karlström 
> Sent: Monday, December 5, 2022 9:18 AM
> To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Copy Paste still an issue
> 
> There are a couple of threads on this by now and I'm not sure if the 
> following "semi-solution" has been posted.
> 
> A couple of weeks ago the clipboard went bust on me in NB 15.
> I tried a couple of things and I got it working again without restarting NB.
> 
> Today it happened again but this time in NB 16, this gave me a chance to 
> reduce and verify my steps.
> The only thing I needed to do to make the clipboard working again was
> 
> Hit CTRL-X in NB without any selection being made (cut the whole line).
> Perhaps CTRL-C works too.
> 
> Patrik
> 
> 
> Den lör 3 sep. 2022 kl 11:07 skrev Neil C Smith :
> 
>>> On Fri, 2 Sept 2022 at 18:45, Kenneth Fogel 
>>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> To reproduce try this:
>>> 
>>> Open NB and a project in NB. Open NotePad++ or Word.
>>> Copy just one line of a file from NB to NotePad++ or Word. It should
>> work. Try a few other lines but just a single line at a time.
>>> Now select and copy 20 or so lines from the NB file. **You will not 
>>> be
>> able to paste it**.
>> 
>> It would be easier if it was that easily reproducible!  Are you 
>> saying that you see this every time?  Other people have reported it 
>> happening after some time, some not seeing it.
>> 
>> Can you try setting some thing in netbeans.conf startup properties?
>> 
>> -J-Dorg.netbeans.NbClipboard.level=FINEST
>> 
>> Then check messages.  Anything odd?
>> 
>> Then try adding to that -
>> 
>> -J-Dnetbeans.slow.system.clipboard.hack=false
>> 
>> and
>> 
>> -J-DTopSecurityManager.disable=true
>> 
>> separately - not at the same time.
>> 
>> Do either/both affect the result?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Neil
>> 
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>> 
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>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 

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RE: Copy Paste still an issue

[Eirik Bakke]

Yes, there was a patch here in NetBeans 15 which I think improved the situation 
a lot. Now you can usually just Ctrl+C again, which so far has always resolved 
the problem for me. (Instead of restarting the IDE.)

The patch was https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/4774 , which was a 
follow-up on https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/4572 . I kept a diary of 
cut/paste problems and their resolution for several weeks.

-- Eirik


Great! There was a patch in NetBeans 15 that made the copy/paste bug much less 
of a problem.

-Original Message-
From: Patrik Karlström  
Sent: Monday, December 5, 2022 9:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Copy Paste still an issue

There are a couple of threads on this by now and I'm not sure if the following 
"semi-solution" has been posted.

A couple of weeks ago the clipboard went bust on me in NB 15.
I tried a couple of things and I got it working again without restarting NB.

Today it happened again but this time in NB 16, this gave me a chance to reduce 
and verify my steps.
The only thing I needed to do to make the clipboard working again was

Hit CTRL-X in NB without any selection being made (cut the whole line).
Perhaps CTRL-C works too.

Patrik


Den lör 3 sep. 2022 kl 11:07 skrev Neil C Smith :

> On Fri, 2 Sept 2022 at 18:45, Kenneth Fogel 
> 
> wrote:
> > To reproduce try this:
> >
> > Open NB and a project in NB. Open NotePad++ or Word.
> > Copy just one line of a file from NB to NotePad++ or Word. It should
> work. Try a few other lines but just a single line at a time.
> > Now select and copy 20 or so lines from the NB file. **You will not 
> > be
> able to paste it**.
>
> It would be easier if it was that easily reproducible!  Are you saying 
> that you see this every time?  Other people have reported it happening 
> after some time, some not seeing it.
>
> Can you try setting some thing in netbeans.conf startup properties?
>
> -J-Dorg.netbeans.NbClipboard.level=FINEST
>
> Then check messages.  Anything odd?
>
> Then try adding to that -
>
> -J-Dnetbeans.slow.system.clipboard.hack=false
>
> and
>
> -J-DTopSecurityManager.disable=true
>
> separately - not at the same time.
>
> Do either/both affect the result?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Neil
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>

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RE: actual problem of non-ASCII path

[Eirik Bakke]

There's a patch for this now, which probably will go into NetBeans 17.

https://github.com/apache/netbeans-native-launchers/pull/4

-- Eirik

From: name name2 
Sent: Sunday, November 6, 2022 2:01 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: actual problem of non-ASCII path

Hello

If NB running not from ASCII path any user get an error message about it. In 
some old versions this problem was fixed, but after it back again.

https://github.com/apache/netbeans/issues/4314
Problem is actual, checked on NB 15

[cid:ii_la5q00cw0]

RE: [DISCUSS] tweak some defaults for NB17?

[Eirik Bakke]

> small toolbar icons:
> I still use 1080p screens since they simply don't want to break. Which  is 
> why one of the first things I change is to switch to small toolbar icons.
> The big ones always remind me on Toys-R-Us. Are the small icons useable  on 
> 4k? Should we make this the default?

One advantage of activating "Small Toolbar Icons" by default is that every icon 
would be 16x16 logical pixels everywhere by default. The large toolbar icons 
have a rather odd 24x24 size, which means some actions (e.g. Undo/Redo) 
currently appear with (slightly) different icon art in the toolbar and the menu 
bar.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Michael Bien  
Sent: Wednesday, November 2, 2022 2:16 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: [DISCUSS] tweak some defaults for NB17?

Hi devs,

I have a list of options I usually change when setting up NetBeans. If other 
devs are doing the same, maybe we could set some by default.


Lets see:

grouped tab list (tools -> options -> appearance -> doc tabs -> and 
check "Sort opened documents list by project")

This feature got some fixes recently and there are also more PRs 
pending: #4792


"New document opens next to active document tab" (same setting panel as 
above):

I found this fairly useful when there are a lot of tabs open since it 
keeps recent opened tabs closer together.

Firefox can do that too, but its off by default - might be an argument 
to leave it off if it is not intuitive enough.


small toolbar icons:

I still use 1080p screens since they simply don't want to break. Which 
is why one of the first things I change is to switch to small toolbar icons.

The big ones always remind me on Toys-R-Us. Are the small icons useable 
on 4k? Should we make this the default?


view -> show versioning label:

Super useful. Shows the [branch] next to the project name/files.


Git -> Show History... could show more items by default. Since 
everything is local. No good reason to paginate this starting with 10 items.


bump max file size editor open warning:

Editor asks before opening large files, this value can be probably 
increased a bit given that hardware improved. (basically every second 
log file will cause this warning)


this one might be controversial since its about tabs:

switch tab size default from 8 to 4 (tools -> options -> editor -> 
formatting -> tab size). (java files only?)

Most shell editors still use 8 spaces to represent a tab character, but 
everything on the web these days uses 4 by default (e.g github, i think 
gitlab too). You can see in PRs who doesn't change that setting :)


show no transfer progress for maven artifact downloads (tools -> options 
-> java -> maven -> execution)

--no-transfer-progress flag set in global execution options

The output window doesn't handle displaying the download progress very 
well. It only adds to the noise in most cases.


lets concentrate on the uncontroversial, and lets not change too much at 
once :)

that is all I had in my notes - more suggestions welcome of course,

best regards,

michael



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RE: nb-javac for building NetBeans itself

[Eirik Bakke]

> Right now, when we build NetBeans, we’re using the javac from the JDK that 
> we’re using to do the build — so that we’re dependent on the JDK team, which 
> can decide to drop features.

Does the JDK ever drop features? Are we currently dependent on unofficial or 
experimental JDK features relating to the official javac?

I think Michael Bien answered this: "btw javac has actually a public API, it 
won't simply disappear from one release to the other without warning"

I agree with Michael Bien here:
> I would approach this from a different POV and ask why NB requires nb-javac 
> in the first place, instead of trying to find more stages in the NB life 
> cycle where we can add it.

Much better to keep NetBeans building with the standard JDK.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Michael Bien  
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2022 4:27 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org; Ernie Rael 
Subject: Re: nb-javac for building NetBeans itself

On 24.10.22 22:15, Ernie Rael wrote:
> On 22/10/24 8:58 AM, Michael Bien wrote:
>> On 24.10.22 17:27, Ernie Rael wrote:
>>> The link to apache's guidelines for voting was clarifying for me. 
>>> I'd like to see a more technical discussion.
>>
>> for me too, I withdrew the -1 vote the moment I realized that this 
>> could qualify as veto since this discussion would fall into the 
>> code-change category.
>>
>> Luckily withdrawing vetos is legal, which is useful since I didn't 
>> even intend to veto anything :)
>>
>>
>>> And I have to mention one thing that really bugged me: a lot of the 
>>> discussion seemed to have the assumption that it's easy for users to 
>>> use the latest JDK; I think that's just not accurate (but again 
>>> don't have hard data). For me, I have to use Gradle 6.8.x so I can 
>>> not use the latest JDK. If it's true in general that many/most users 
>>> can not use the latest JDK, that seems like an extremely important 
>>> data point.
>>
>> Yes I heard about this issue. We should take a look if this can be 
>> somehow solved. Its certainly not optimal to be required to change 
>> the runtime JDK of the IDE when switching between projects which use 
>> different gradle versions.
>>
>> lets try to solve this without nb-gradle if possible.
> I only brought that up as an example of a situation where can't use 
> the latest JDK. I wouldn't be surprised if most users have 
> restrictions on which JDK can be used and/or targeted.

This doesn't influence the target JDK at all. Java 8 shops don't swap out the 
build-in JDK 11 of android studio if they write an app. It is just the runtime 
of android studio, it has no other viral effects or influences your support 
contracts with specific vendors.

-mbien


>>
>> best regards,
>>
>> michael
>>
>>
>>>
>>> -ernie
>>>
>>>

 Maybe a straight vote on this is the way forward, and we live with 
 the consequences either way?!

 Best wishes,

 Neil

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>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
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Problems with all-layers.dat after moving NetBeans directory

[Eirik Bakke]

Hi, dev.

I'm investigating this old bug, where moving the NetBeans installation 
directory, seemingly only on Windows, causes various problems on startup:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-1914

Deleting the cache directory, or more specifically "all-layers.dat", seems to 
fix the problem. Examining the existing all-layers.dat file does reveal various 
references to the old NetBeans path.

Are there any NetBeans veterans who might have suggestions for the best way to 
fix this problem, without requiring the cache dir to be manually deleted?

(Since I don't see the problem on MacOS, I was hoping there might be partially 
working code already somewhere that attempts to invalidate the cache when the 
NetBeans directory has changed.)

--  Eirik

RE: Test Netbeans PR on Mavenized NB Platform application

[Eirik Bakke]

Here are the commands I use myself to build custom NetBeans builds for my 
NetBeans Platform application: 

===
# With the current directory being a checkout of the netbeans GitHub repo:
ant
ant build-nbms
ant build-source-zips
ant build-javadoc
USE_BUILD_VERSION=RELEASE150-MYVERSION4
mvn org.apache.netbeans.utilities:nb-repository-plugin:1.7:populate \
-DforcedVersion=$USE_BUILD_VERSION \
-DnetbeansInstallDirectory=nbbuild/netbeans \
-DnetbeansNbmDirectory=nbbuild/nbms \
-DnetbeansSourcesDirectory=nbbuild/build/source-zips \
-DnetbeansJavadocDirectory=nbbuild/build/javadoc
===

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Mathieu Bastian  
Sent: Saturday, October 8, 2022 9:22 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Test Netbeans PR on Mavenized NB Platform application

Hi folks,

I was called out in a recent PR
 to test 
it with my NB Platform application. I'm willing to do so but I need some 
guidance.

My application is mavenized. What is the simplest way to test this PR locally 
with the dev version of Netbeans? For instance, can I create a 
"RELEASE160-SNAPSHOT" version locally via a command? If I had this, I could 
easily switch my application's NB Platform version to this dev version and test 
the change.

Much appreciated!

Mathieu

RE: Sudden File Lock Freeze

[Eirik Bakke]

One possibility--perhaps less likely than a bug in NetBeans, but still worth 
considering--is a failing hard drive or SSD drive. It might be a good time to 
take a backup of your files, just in case.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Ömer Halit Çizmeci  
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2022 2:50 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Sudden File Lock Freeze

I only encountered this while editing .java files but I am not sure if it is 
file type specific. It is part of a Java Web Application project file and I can 
guarantee that the file is not opened in any other application. I don't have 
any antivirus program other than Windows Defender and I don't have a virus on 
my computer.

On Tue, Sep 13, 2022, 4:58 AM Laszlo Kishalmi 
wrote:

> One of the most important information is missing.
>
> What type of file are you editing?
>
> On 9/12/22 17:01, Ömer Halit Çizmeci wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have been having this problem I think since NB13 and it occurs in 
> > NB14 and NB15. The application suddenly freezes entirely with no 
> > response at
> all
> > when I hit CTRL+S to save a file. There is no pattern I could figure 
> > out but when this happens, it is extremely hard to revert it back to normal.
> > Restarting NetBeans does not help. Restarting my PC does not help.
> Whenever
> > I save on that specific file, NetBeans freezes immediately and the 
> > only
> way
> > is to force close in task manager.
> >
> > After this incident repeat so many times, I had to look for a workaround.
> > The only way I was able to resume NetBeans without having to force 
> > close was to navigate to the file via file explorer and rename that 
> > specific file. Then NB would pop-up the file modified outside of NB 
> > and ask if I want to reload. After this point, NB continues to run 
> > as normal but if I hit CTRL+S again on that file, NB will freeze. 
> > And restarting Windows or NetBeans does not help.
> >
> > After a long time of investigating, I was able to find a way to fix 
> > it
> for
> > that moment. I'd open that specific file in Notepad and make a 
> > slight modification and save it. Then NetBeans is able to save on 
> > that file and runs normally until this random bug appears. It is 
> > like the file is
> locked
> > by another process and NetBeans cannot get hold of that file and freezes.
> > This happens randomly with random files.
> >
> > This happens in Windows 10 and Windows 11 using NB15 with Java 17.
> >
> > What else should I provide to contribute to this?
> >
>
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>
>
>

RE: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes

[Eirik Bakke]

Thanks for the screenshot! What's strange to me is that the text look the same 
size in the left and right screenshot, but the icons are of a different size 
e.g. "Projects" in the sidebar to the left.

Might you have "--fontsize" or other custom settings defined somewhere?

Perhaps try temporarily with a clean user directory?

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 4:33 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes

I re-read your post which reminded me I did import from 14 environment.

On a side  note, when importing, the start page did show What’s New view which 
previously was unable to load the screen following and import.

Eric

On Sun, Aug 28, 2022 at 3:29 PM Eric Bresie  wrote:

> Away from computer at the moment so will have to get back after I try 
> the suggestion…
>
> If you are on the Telegraph Netbeans channel, I posted picture with a 
> comparison of 14 vs 15 rc here.
>
> https://t.me/apache_netbeans/5314
>
> Eric
>
> On Sun, Aug 28, 2022 at 1:45 PM Eirik Bakke  wrote:
>
>> I tried netbeans-15-rc4 (running netbeans64.exe) on Windows 11 on 
>> OpenJDK Temurin 17.0.4.1+1, with 250% scaling on one monitor, and 
>> everything seems sized correctly on my machine.
>>
>> Perhaps you have old compatibility settings set on NetBeans? Try 
>> right-clicking netbeans64.exe, then Properties->Compatibility->Change 
>> High DPI Settings. Make sure neither of the checkboxes are selected?
>>
>> Sometimes it is necessary to sign out of windows and back in again 
>> after changing HiDPI settings.
>>
>> A screenshot might be useful--I'm curious.
>>
>> -- Eirik
>>
>> Product Version: Apache NetBeans IDE 15-rc4
>> Java: 17.0.4.1; OpenJDK 64-Bit Server VM 17.0.4.1+1
>> Runtime: OpenJDK Runtime Environment 17.0.4.1+1
>> System: Windows 11 version 10.0 running on amd64; Cp1252; en_US (nb) 
>> User directory: C:\Users\ebakke\AppData\Roaming\NetBeans\15-rc4
>> Cache directory: C:\Users\ebakke\AppData\Local\NetBeans\Cache\15-rc4
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Eric Bresie 
>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 12:31 PM
>> To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes
>>
>> Windows 11.
>>
>> Default LAF
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 28, 2022 at 10:56 AM Eirik Bakke  wrote:
>>
>> > Is this on Linux? Gnome or KDE?
>> >
>> > What LAF are you using?
>> >
>> > > most of the dialogs appear to be extremely small
>> >
>> > Only some of them? What about the main window?
>> >
>> > On Linux, if your system scaling is set to exactly 200%, NetBeans 
>> > should detect it and set GDK_SCALE=2 automatically. (Since
>> > https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3113 )
>> >
>> > Otherwise you'd have to set GDK_SCALE=2 manually.
>> >
>> > -- Eirik
>> >
>> > -Original Message-
>> > From: Eric Bresie 
>> > Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 9:38 AM
>> > To: Netbeans Developer List 
>> > Subject: Re: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes
>> >
>> > Forgot to mention, running with
>> >
>> > openjdk 17.0.4 2022-07-19
>> > OpenJDK Runtime Environment Temurin-17.0.4+8 (build 17.0.4+8) 
>> > OpenJDK 64-Bit Server VM Temurin-17.0.4+8 (build 17.0.4+8, mixed 
>> > mode,
>> > sharing)
>> >
>> > Eric Bresie
>> > ebre...@gmail.com
>> >
>> >
>> > On Sun, Aug 28, 2022 at 8:26 AM Eric Bresie  wrote:
>> >
>> > > I was trying out the recent Netbeans 15 release candidate and 
>> > > noticed something on startup that most of the dialogs appear to 
>> > > be extremely small.  From first glance this included the "import 
>> > > dialog", the "Starting dialog", and the "Welcome" view.
>> > >
>> > > I suspect this may be a side effect of the screen resolution as I 
>> > > am on a high resolution setting (3840x2160) and scaling to 250%.
>> > >
>> > > Eric Bresie
>> > > ebre...@gmail.com
>> > >
>> >
>> --
>> Eric Bresie
>> ebre...@gmail.com
>>
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>>
>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>>
>>
>>
>> --
> Eric Bresie
> ebre...@gmail.com
>
--
Eric Bresie
ebre...@gmail.com

RE: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes

[Eirik Bakke]

I tried netbeans-15-rc4 (running netbeans64.exe) on Windows 11 on OpenJDK 
Temurin 17.0.4.1+1, with 250% scaling on one monitor, and everything seems 
sized correctly on my machine.

Perhaps you have old compatibility settings set on NetBeans? Try right-clicking 
netbeans64.exe, then Properties->Compatibility->Change High DPI Settings. Make 
sure neither of the checkboxes are selected?

Sometimes it is necessary to sign out of windows and back in again after 
changing HiDPI settings.

A screenshot might be useful--I'm curious.

-- Eirik

Product Version: Apache NetBeans IDE 15-rc4
Java: 17.0.4.1; OpenJDK 64-Bit Server VM 17.0.4.1+1
Runtime: OpenJDK Runtime Environment 17.0.4.1+1
System: Windows 11 version 10.0 running on amd64; Cp1252; en_US (nb)
User directory: C:\Users\ebakke\AppData\Roaming\NetBeans\15-rc4
Cache directory: C:\Users\ebakke\AppData\Local\NetBeans\Cache\15-rc4

-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 12:31 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes

Windows 11.

Default LAF

On Sun, Aug 28, 2022 at 10:56 AM Eirik Bakke  wrote:

> Is this on Linux? Gnome or KDE?
>
> What LAF are you using?
>
> > most of the dialogs appear to be extremely small
>
> Only some of them? What about the main window?
>
> On Linux, if your system scaling is set to exactly 200%, NetBeans 
> should detect it and set GDK_SCALE=2 automatically. (Since
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3113 )
>
> Otherwise you'd have to set GDK_SCALE=2 manually.
>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Eric Bresie 
> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 9:38 AM
> To: Netbeans Developer List 
> Subject: Re: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes
>
> Forgot to mention, running with
>
> openjdk 17.0.4 2022-07-19
> OpenJDK Runtime Environment Temurin-17.0.4+8 (build 17.0.4+8) OpenJDK 
> 64-Bit Server VM Temurin-17.0.4+8 (build 17.0.4+8, mixed mode,
> sharing)
>
> Eric Bresie
> ebre...@gmail.com
>
>
> On Sun, Aug 28, 2022 at 8:26 AM Eric Bresie  wrote:
>
> > I was trying out the recent Netbeans 15 release candidate and 
> > noticed something on startup that most of the dialogs appear to be 
> > extremely small.  From first glance this included the "import 
> > dialog", the "Starting dialog", and the "Welcome" view.
> >
> > I suspect this may be a side effect of the screen resolution as I am 
> > on a high resolution setting (3840x2160) and scaling to 250%.
> >
> > Eric Bresie
> > ebre...@gmail.com
> >
>
--
Eric Bresie
ebre...@gmail.com

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RE: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes

[Eirik Bakke]

Is this on Linux? Gnome or KDE?

What LAF are you using?

> most of the dialogs appear to be extremely small

Only some of them? What about the main window?

On Linux, if your system scaling is set to exactly 200%, NetBeans should detect 
it and set GDK_SCALE=2 automatically. (Since 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3113 )

Otherwise you'd have to set GDK_SCALE=2 manually.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2022 9:38 AM
To: Netbeans Developer List 
Subject: Re: Netbeans 15 rc - Startup Dialog Sizes

Forgot to mention, running with

openjdk 17.0.4 2022-07-19
OpenJDK Runtime Environment Temurin-17.0.4+8 (build 17.0.4+8) OpenJDK 64-Bit 
Server VM Temurin-17.0.4+8 (build 17.0.4+8, mixed mode,
sharing)

Eric Bresie
ebre...@gmail.com


On Sun, Aug 28, 2022 at 8:26 AM Eric Bresie  wrote:

> I was trying out the recent Netbeans 15 release candidate and noticed 
> something on startup that most of the dialogs appear to be extremely 
> small.  From first glance this included the "import dialog", the 
> "Starting dialog", and the "Welcome" view.
>
> I suspect this may be a side effect of the screen resolution as I am 
> on a high resolution setting (3840x2160) and scaling to 250%.
>
> Eric Bresie
> ebre...@gmail.com
>

RE: NetBeans 15 performance improvements

[Eirik Bakke]

This is great--thank you to Michael Bien, Michael Zucchi, Matthias Blaesing and 
others for these improvements!

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Josh Juneau  
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2022 10:15 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: NetBeans 15 performance improvements

Great work to everyone who contributed!  Looking forward to the performance 
improvements.  

Josh Juneau
juneau...@gmail.com
http://jj-blogger.blogspot.com
https://www.apress.com/us/search?query=Juneau

> On Jul 30, 2022, at 12:46 PM, Michael Bien  wrote:
> 
> Hello devs,
> 
> NetBeans 15 is coming with some performance improvements, it should be easy 
> to see by comparing a NB 15 release candidate with NB 14 side by side (if you 
> know where to look).
> 
> 
> maven related:
> 
>  - the index folder should be smaller (by almost 1 GB last time I checked) 
> #3558
> 
>  - indexing of local repos should be about 20% faster (although the main 
> bottleneck is the extraction/indexing of the (remote) central index which is 
> still slow and makes the improvement not very noticeable) #4095
> 
>  - completion in maven poms for artifacts, group ids and versions should all 
> be faster (sometimes significantly faster). There is one exception, the first 
> query for group ids (specifically) might be a little slower, but subsequent 
> queries should be at least as fast again. #3558 #4136
> 
>  - this applies to all kinds of index queries, but completion will be 
> probably most noticeable
> 
> java editor:
> 
>  - Michael Zucchi contributed an optimization which improves the performance 
> of a core utility class. This improves completion performance significantly 
> on classes with a lot of fields (as sometimes seen in OpenGL/Vulkan and other 
> library bindings). Since this is part of utilities used by other features, it 
> might also improve performance elsewhere too.  #4142
> 
>  - Michael (not me) also improved the output window performance of ant 
> projects #4180
> 
> javascript:
> 
>  - Matthias tagged two javascrpt PRs with performance #4324, #4313, but I 
> wasn't really involved there so I don't know the details or where to look to 
> notice a difference.
> 
> php tests (honorable mention):
> 
>  - php editor tests run more than twice as fast now (~2h -> ~40min) and are 
> no longer the slowest CI job #4284
> 
> 
> list of integrated performance PRs:
> 
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/issues?q=label%3Aperformance+is%3Aclosed+milestone%3ANB15
> 
> 
> (also keep in mind that NetBeans 14 and 15 can both already run on JDK 18, so 
> you can get a little bit of free performance out of this just by keeping your 
> JDK up2date)
> 
> best regards,
> 
> michael
> 
> 
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> 
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> 
> 
> 

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RE: FlatLAF tab style discussion

[Eirik Bakke]

> My question is: shouldn't this be changed upstream?

The window system tabs are not actually part of the upstream FlatLAF 
library--they are in the FlatLAF customization module inside the NetBeans 
codebase. So it's easy to change.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Michael Bien  
Sent: Friday, June 24, 2022 2:59 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org; Neil C Smith 
Subject: Re: FlatLAF tab style discussion

On 24.06.22 17:11, Neil C Smith wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Jun 2022 at 10:46, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
>> With FlatLAF becoming the default look & feel since NetBeans 13, the tab 
>> components in the window system (over editors and sidebars) no longe 
>> resemble tabs, and are somewhat difficult to see. The proposed PR fixes 
>> this, by introducing a new look for the tabs that shows the selected tab as 
>> a proper tab while leaving a simplified flattened look for unselected tabs.
> To be clear, considering my -0, I totally agree with the visibility 
> point.  This needs fixing, and I think the tabbed pane UI in FlatLaf 
> has an accessibility issue here anyway.  I just don't think that 
> changing the design of the tabs (particularly making them not flat) is 
> the way to fix it.  I think the colour palette needs more contrast / 
> accenting.  You can see this in some of the other software screenshots 
> you shared there.  You can also see it in menus, option categories, 
> etc.

I believe the problem with the tabs is more than the gradients/colors. 
The active tab looks like it is not attached to the editor due to the separator 
line. It doesn't look as if it would be on the same "3d level", which lets me 
intuitively second guess if the active tab is actually the active tab. (I am 
not saying the colors should not be changed too)

But since even intelliJ moved that line up, everything indicates that more 
share the same opinion / have a problem with it.

My question is: shouldn't this be changed upstream? Because this sounds like an 
issue which might be potentially changed upstream. To avoid having to revert 
this we should check If there is no desire to provide the option or change it 
upstream, if there isn't - we should merge IMO (I really like it as i already 
said on the PR).

regarding on or off:

good defaults are important. So we should try to set it to the most popular 
option so that only few have to change the default (I hope enabled is the most 
popular option ;)).

best regards,

michael


>
> I would also say I do think the PR should probably be merged.  I was 
> hoping Karl might have some thoughts on fixing some of the issues in a 
> way that more aligns with other areas of FlatLaf, but we can always 
> tweak further afterwards ...
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
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>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>


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RE: FlatLAF tab style discussion

[Eirik Bakke]

> I just don't think that changing the design of the tabs (particularly making 
> them not flat) is the way to fix it.  

Well, one question to consider is: Why are the window system tabs flat in the 
first place? They always looked like proper tabs until NetBeans 13. Is the 
"flat" design really better?

One source of confusion may be due to the fact that "FlatLAF" has "flat" in its 
name. But a lot of the advantages we get from FlatLAF--it's high level of 
polish, customizability, cross-platform yet native-looking feel--are unrelated 
to the look of the window system tabs in particular. 

Another point: I did a survey of other IDE-like apps that have tabs in their 
window systems (see screenshots in https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3115 
) , and the current NetBeans style resembles only one of them, namely IntelliJ. 
Which makes sense, since FlatLAF was originally meant to mimic the IntelliJ 
theme. But now that NetBeans uses FlatLAF as its default, it is less desirable, 
from a branding perspective, to try to copy the visual style of a "competing" 
IDE.

--- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Friday, June 24, 2022 11:12 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: FlatLAF tab style discussion

On Fri, 24 Jun 2022 at 10:46, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> With FlatLAF becoming the default look & feel since NetBeans 13, the tab 
> components in the window system (over editors and sidebars) no longe resemble 
> tabs, and are somewhat difficult to see. The proposed PR fixes this, by 
> introducing a new look for the tabs that shows the selected tab as a proper 
> tab while leaving a simplified flattened look for unselected tabs.

To be clear, considering my -0, I totally agree with the visibility point.  
This needs fixing, and I think the tabbed pane UI in FlatLaf has an 
accessibility issue here anyway.  I just don't think that changing the design 
of the tabs (particularly making them not flat) is the way to fix it.  I think 
the colour palette needs more contrast / accenting.  You can see this in some 
of the other software screenshots you shared there.  You can also see it in 
menus, option categories, etc.

I would also say I do think the PR should probably be merged.  I was hoping 
Karl might have some thoughts on fixing some of the issues in a way that more 
aligns with other areas of FlatLaf, but we can always tweak further afterwards 
...

Best wishes,

Neil

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FlatLAF tab style discussion

[Eirik Bakke]

Hi, dev.

There's a discussion on https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3115 about 
changing the default "look" of window system tabs in NetBeans. See the 
before/after screenshots there.

With FlatLAF becoming the default look & feel since NetBeans 13, the tab 
components in the window system (over editors and sidebars) no longe resemble 
tabs, and are somewhat difficult to see. The proposed PR fixes this, by 
introducing a new look for the tabs that shows the selected tab as a proper tab 
while leaving a simplified flattened look for unselected tabs. Other kinds of 
tabs, e.g. in dialog boxes, or nested tabs in the Output pane, retain the more 
flat "blue underline" style.

1) Would people like this new style to become the default on NetBeans? (See 
screenshots in the PR above.)
2) Should there be an option to switch back to the old style?

-- Eirik

RE: State of proxy server auto-detection in NetBeans? (PAC scripts, Nashorn/Rhino/GraalVM etc.)

[Eirik Bakke]

Thanks, Lars!

I started looking into this, and even set up a sample PAC script and proxy 
server to test it (pasted below for future reference). This is on Java 17, 
Windows 11, and a custom build of NetBeans Platform 13.0.

In my NetBeans Platform app, I added a dependency on a new JAR wrapper module, 
which in turn contains dependencies on org.graalvm.js:js and 
org.graalvm.js:js-scriptengine. This makes the NetBeans proxy server code work 
on Java 17, using GraalVM.

(It's a 22MB dependency to parse a 12-line configuration file, but it works! :-)

So my conclusion is that the NetBeans proxy server detection code in NetBeans 
13 works perfectly on Java 17, so long as GraalVM is included. On the IDE 
distribution, this seems to work as well (confirmed with 
-J-Dorg.netbeans.core.network.proxy.level=FINEST as suggested), with the 
org.netbeans.libs.graaljs module providing the same dependenices.

One question: I see that the org.netbeans.libs.graaljs module also includes 
dependencies on js-launcher, regex, graal-sdk, truffle-api, launcher-common, 
and icu4j. Do you think I need any of these if I just want my NetBeans Platform 
app to be able to parse PAC scripts? (I didn't see any errors from omitting 
them.)

Thank you very much to Lars, Jaroslav, and others who were involved with 
keeping this code up to date and working!

-- Eirik
=== Example PAC File =
function FindProxyForURL(url, host) {
if (isInNet(host, '127.0.0.1', '255.255.255.255')) {
  return "DIRECT";
}

if (dnsDomainIs(host, "slashdot.org")) {
  return "SOCKS localhost:1081"; // Will fail.
} else {
  // Do some arithmetic to confirm that a JavaScript interpreter is really 
running.
  return "SOCKS localhost:" + (1000 + 80);
}
}
 Example SSH Command to Set Up A Proxy Server ==
ssh -ND 1080 some_server_you_can_ssh_into.com
 Dependencies in pom.xml === ==
  

  org.graalvm.js
  js
  22.1.0


  org.graalvm.js
  js-scriptengine
  22.1.0

  
===


-Original Message-
From: Lars Bruun-Hansen  
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2022 3:38 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: State of proxy server auto-detection in NetBeans? (PAC scripts, 
Nashorn/Rhino/GraalVM etc.)

Hi Eirik
From memory: It was only like 6 months after my Rhino-->Nashorn update/rewrite 
was integrated into the NB code base that Oracle announced that Nashorn would 
eventually be removed from the JDK.
Jarouslav Tulach kindly took upon him to make sure NB would use a more robust 
approach where Graal's Javascript engine is used if available and Nashorn is 
the fallback.

Have a look:
   
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/blob/master/platform/core.network/src/org/netbeans/core/network/proxy/pac/impl/NbPacScriptEvaluator.java#L348

With a log level of FINE you should be able to see exactly which Javascript 
engine is in use in your own case:
  
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/blob/master/platform/core.network/src/org/netbeans/core/network/proxy/pac/impl/NbPacScriptEvaluator.java#L284

So you can start your IDE with something like this:
-J-Dorg.netbeans.core.network.proxy.level=FINEST


to see what is in effect. However, you'll not see anything related to PAC 
evaluation unless NetBeans actually discovers a PAC file in the network.

Kind regards

Lars



On Mon, May 9, 2022 at 10:42 PM Eirik Bakke  wrote:
>
> Hi, NetBeans friends.
>
>
>
> Back in NetBeans 9.0, Lars Bruun-Hansen integrated a brand new proxy 
> server auto-detection system [1], based on the earlier netbeansproxy2 
> project(?)
>
>
>
> Does this still work in Java 17?
>
> In NetBeans Platform applications, are there dependencies that need to be 
> bundled beyond OpenJDK, in order for this to work?
>
>
>
> I have heard about Nashorn, Rhino, and GraalVM, one of which seem to have 
> been required to execute proxy server PAC configuration scripts (which are 
> apparently pieces of JavaScript). Which of these three are we using these 
> days? Is the JavaScript engine a part of OpenJDK, or must it be bundled 
> externally?
>
>
>
> -- Eirik
>
> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-96
>
>

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State of proxy server auto-detection in NetBeans? (PAC scripts, Nashorn/Rhino/GraalVM etc.)

[Eirik Bakke]

Hi, NetBeans friends.

Back in NetBeans 9.0, Lars Bruun-Hansen integrated a brand new proxy server 
auto-detection system [1], based on the earlier netbeansproxy2 project(?)

Does this still work in Java 17?
In NetBeans Platform applications, are there dependencies that need to be 
bundled beyond OpenJDK, in order for this to work?

I have heard about Nashorn, Rhino, and GraalVM, one of which seem to have been 
required to execute proxy server PAC configuration scripts (which are 
apparently pieces of JavaScript). Which of these three are we using these days? 
Is the JavaScript engine a part of OpenJDK, or must it be bundled externally?

-- Eirik
[1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-96

RE: Netbeans platform support for MacOS M1

[Eirik Bakke]

Same here--I have a NetBeans Platform app (https://www.ultorg.com/ ) which runs 
natively on Apple Silicon via the Zulu distribution of OpenJDK (now Java 17, 
but until recently Java 11).

You may need to notarize your app, though. See 
https://developer.apple.com/documentation/security/notarizing_macos_software_before_distribution

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: John Yeary  
Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2022 1:54 PM
To: todd.steven...@imail.org
Cc: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Netbeans platform support for MacOS M1

I am currently using Azul Zulu Java for M1 projects on Java 8.

https://www.azul.com/downloads/?package=jdk


John Yeary

   
  





"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though 
checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither 
enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows 
not victory nor defeat."
-- Theodore Roosevelt


On Tue, Mar 29, 2022 at 1:30 PM Todd Stevenson 
wrote:

> I support an NetBeans platform application that we deploy to windows 
> and MacOS.  I'm getting complaints from MacOS M1 customers that they 
> can't get the application to run.  It starts up and nothing is 
> displayed. My application was built with Java 8.
>
> What can I tell my customers?  Do I  need to upgrade Java to version 
> 11 or 14?  Is there a specific version of the JDK/JVM that runs 
> correctly on the
> M1 platform?
>
> Any help would be appreciated.
>
> Todd Stevenson
> todd.steven...@imail.org
>
>
>
> NOTICE: This e-mail is for the sole use of the intended recipient and 
> may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not 
> the intended recipient, you are prohibited from reviewing, using, 
> disclosing or distributing this e-mail or its contents. If you have 
> received this e-mail in error, please contact the sender by reply 
> e-mail and destroy all copies of this e-mail and its contents.
>

RE: [Discuss] Netbeans 13 macOS Installer

[Eirik Bakke]

One question: Is there a technical reason why we provide an executable 
"Installer" file (pkg file) on MacOS, rather than an application bundle that 
the user can drag to the Applications folder? The latter seems to be the 
standard way that applications are distributed on MacOS.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Wednesday, March 9, 2022 5:02 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: [Discuss] Netbeans 13 macOS Installer

On Wed, 9 Mar 2022 at 09:10, John Mc  wrote:
> Another option, which Neil recommended to me but I'll admit has taken 
> me a while to see how much better it might be(too much going on 
> elsewhere) is to create a second distpreparation zip file, and include that 
> in the vote.

Actually, that wasn't what I suggested, but I think it sounds better.
I'd suggested just a zip with the changed files and instructions.

Having an updated version of the distpreparation.zip as a whole sounds better.  
There's nothing compiled in there, right?  And it's everything required to turn 
the binary zip into the installer?

Any option that works with the already released zip and doesn't require doing a 
new source release as a whole gets my vote.  If we do that, we end up with 
different implementation versions in the macOS installer.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: Jira or github?

[Eirik Bakke]

Are we doing GitHub Issues instead of JIRA for the 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans-mavenutils-nbm-maven-plugin and other 
"netbeans-*" repos as well?

The readme at https://github.com/apache/netbeans-mavenutils-nbm-maven-plugin 
currently says "Bugs should be reported to 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/projects/NETBEANSINFRA/issues/ using the 
component MU - Apache NetBeans NBM maven plugin".

(I added https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANSINFRA-263 "NetBeans 
Module plugin fails to wrap Java 17 JARs", but I can refile as a GitHub issue 
if preferred.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2022 9:08 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Jira or github?

On Fri, 4 Feb 2022 at 17:24, Neil C Smith  wrote:
> On Fri, 4 Feb 2022 at 16:57, Michael Bien  wrote:
> > asking can't hurt. If there is a flag we can set they know it for 
> > sure, if there isn't we would have to ask anyway :)
>
> True!  Have asked them to proceed anyway -
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-22839

I'm still waiting on infra@ about this, but will chase up.  In the meantime, 
I've put up the notice that goes with it at
https://issues.apache.org/jira/projects/NETBEANS/issues/NETBEANS-6470

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Great--I sent a Zoom invite to you and Venus.

Anyone else who'd like to join, just let me know, and I'll send you the invite.

-- Eirik

From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 10:25 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Venus Chung 
Cc: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
Thanks for your time, how about HKT sat 9am please?


Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)


From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 11:20 PM
To: Peter Cheung ; Venus Chung 
Cc: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


Saturday morning HK time is fine with me! If you pick a time I can send an 
invite.



(Apologies to those in other time zones who were interested in joining--it's 
always night in one of Europe, US East Coast, or Hong Kong. I'll send out a 
summary of the meeting afterwards like the previous time.)



Thanks again!



-- Eirik



From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 8:37 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Venus Chung 
Cc: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Hi

   Can we do sat morning?



Thanks

Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited)



寄件者: Eirik Bakke 
寄件日期: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 8:30:43 PM
收件者: Peter Cheung ; Venus Chung 
副本: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
主旨: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Excellent work, Venus and Peter! Looks great! I can help review and adjust a 
few pixel alignment issues, but this work will definitively be usable.



I could do another Zoom chat most days 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for instance. 
(I'm on US east coast time now.)



-- Eirik



From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 4:19 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Venus Chung 
Cc: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Hey Eirik and All

Please check the attachment. Is the designs good? Sorry i was so busy. Have 
a sync up meeting?



Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)



From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2022 12:48 AM
To: Venus Chung 
Cc: Peter Cheung ; Apache NetBeans ; 
Peter Cheung ; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



In case it is helpful, I made a quick screencast video showing the icon drawing 
process I used in the past, in Adobe Illustrator:



https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/667860571



-- Eirik



From: Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 9:35 AM
To: Eirik Bakke 
Cc: Venus Chung ; Peter Cheung ; Apache 
NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



No worries, thanks for the update!



Le mer. 19 janv. 2022 à 14:35, Eirik Bakke 
mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>> a écrit :

Sorry about that--thank you for your help with this project! Happy to answer 
any questions, or to do a screen sharing session.



(When I was drawing icons myself, it took me many hours to figure out the right 
tools to use in Illustrator to get the right result. But it goes faster after a 
few icons!)



There is also a style guide at 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 .



-- Eirik



From: Venus Chung mailto:ve...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 1:34 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; Peter Cheung 
mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: 回覆: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear All,



I made a mistake,I designed the wrong icon, it needs to be redesigned, please 
give me more time.



Best Regards,
Venus

____

寄件者: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
寄件日期: 2022年1月18日 下午 11:11
收件者: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
副本: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>; Venus Chung 
mailto:ve...@quantr.hk>>
主旨: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Hi, Peter.



Thank you so much for these efforts!! Could we see what the icons look like 
without Pixel Preview enabled? (View->Pixel Preview in Illustrator)



Might you also send the latest version of the Illustrator file? I'd love to 
have a look at grid alignments, and see the new icons against the background 
layer with the old bitmap icons, and at different resolutions etc.



Happy to meet next week. I could do anytime 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for 
instance. Feel free 

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Saturday morning HK time is fine with me! If you pick a time I can send an 
invite.

(Apologies to those in other time zones who were interested in joining--it's 
always night in one of Europe, US East Coast, or Hong Kong. I'll send out a 
summary of the meeting afterwards like the previous time.)

Thanks again!

-- Eirik

From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 8:37 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Venus Chung 
Cc: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi
   Can we do sat morning?

Thanks
Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited)

寄件者: Eirik Bakke 
寄件日期: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 8:30:43 PM
收件者: Peter Cheung ; Venus Chung 
副本: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
主旨: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


Excellent work, Venus and Peter! Looks great! I can help review and adjust a 
few pixel alignment issues, but this work will definitively be usable.



I could do another Zoom chat most days 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for instance. 
(I'm on US east coast time now.)



-- Eirik



From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 4:19 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Venus Chung 
Cc: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Hey Eirik and All

Please check the attachment. Is the designs good? Sorry i was so busy. Have 
a sync up meeting?



Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)



From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2022 12:48 AM
To: Venus Chung 
Cc: Peter Cheung ; Apache NetBeans ; 
Peter Cheung ; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



In case it is helpful, I made a quick screencast video showing the icon drawing 
process I used in the past, in Adobe Illustrator:



https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/667860571



-- Eirik



From: Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 9:35 AM
To: Eirik Bakke 
Cc: Venus Chung ; Peter Cheung ; Apache 
NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



No worries, thanks for the update!



Le mer. 19 janv. 2022 à 14:35, Eirik Bakke 
mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>> a écrit :

Sorry about that--thank you for your help with this project! Happy to answer 
any questions, or to do a screen sharing session.



(When I was drawing icons myself, it took me many hours to figure out the right 
tools to use in Illustrator to get the right result. But it goes faster after a 
few icons!)



There is also a style guide at 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 .



-- Eirik



From: Venus Chung mailto:ve...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 1:34 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; Peter Cheung 
mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: 回覆: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear All,



I made a mistake,I designed the wrong icon, it needs to be redesigned, please 
give me more time.



Best Regards,
Venus

____

寄件者: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
寄件日期: 2022年1月18日 下午 11:11
收件者: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
副本: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>; Venus Chung 
mailto:ve...@quantr.hk>>
主旨: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Hi, Peter.



Thank you so much for these efforts!! Could we see what the icons look like 
without Pixel Preview enabled? (View->Pixel Preview in Illustrator)



Might you also send the latest version of the Illustrator file? I'd love to 
have a look at grid alignments, and see the new icons against the background 
layer with the old bitmap icons, and at different resolutions etc.



Happy to meet next week. I could do anytime 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for 
instance. Feel free to pick a day.



Thanks again very much to Venus and you!



-- Eirik

(Now on US east coast time.)



From: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 1:45 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear Eirik & All

Let's have a wrap-up meeting next week?



Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)

________

From: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18,

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Excellent work, Venus and Peter! Looks great! I can help review and adjust a 
few pixel alignment issues, but this work will definitively be usable.

I could do another Zoom chat most days 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for instance. 
(I'm on US east coast time now.)

-- Eirik

From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 4:19 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Venus Chung 
Cc: Apache NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hey Eirik and All
Please check the attachment. Is the designs good? Sorry i was so busy. Have 
a sync up meeting?


Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)


From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2022 12:48 AM
To: Venus Chung 
Cc: Peter Cheung ; Apache NetBeans ; 
Peter Cheung ; Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


In case it is helpful, I made a quick screencast video showing the icon drawing 
process I used in the past, in Adobe Illustrator:



https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/667860571



-- Eirik



From: Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 9:35 AM
To: Eirik Bakke 
Cc: Venus Chung ; Peter Cheung ; Apache 
NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



No worries, thanks for the update!



Le mer. 19 janv. 2022 à 14:35, Eirik Bakke 
mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>> a écrit :

Sorry about that--thank you for your help with this project! Happy to answer 
any questions, or to do a screen sharing session.



(When I was drawing icons myself, it took me many hours to figure out the right 
tools to use in Illustrator to get the right result. But it goes faster after a 
few icons!)



There is also a style guide at 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 .



-- Eirik



From: Venus Chung mailto:ve...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 1:34 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; Peter Cheung 
mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: 回覆: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear All,



I made a mistake,I designed the wrong icon, it needs to be redesigned, please 
give me more time.



Best Regards,
Venus

____

寄件者: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
寄件日期: 2022年1月18日 下午 11:11
收件者: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
副本: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>; Venus Chung 
mailto:ve...@quantr.hk>>
主旨: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Hi, Peter.



Thank you so much for these efforts!! Could we see what the icons look like 
without Pixel Preview enabled? (View->Pixel Preview in Illustrator)



Might you also send the latest version of the Illustrator file? I'd love to 
have a look at grid alignments, and see the new icons against the background 
layer with the old bitmap icons, and at different resolutions etc.



Happy to meet next week. I could do anytime 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for 
instance. Feel free to pick a day.



Thanks again very much to Venus and you!



-- Eirik

(Now on US east coast time.)



From: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 1:45 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear Eirik & All

Let's have a wrap-up meeting next week?



Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)

________

From: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 11:36 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear all

Please see the last three rows, is the style matched?



Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)



From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 1:17 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>; Peter Cheung 
mailto:pe...

RE: Copy and Paste Wrong from NB Output

[Eirik Bakke]

> Looking at my Display Settings, HiDPI looks to be turned off.

Could you double-check this? The HiDPI scaling is set per-monitor in the 
"Display" pane in the Windows 10 control panel, under the "Scale" dropdown. For 
a 3840x2160 monitor (same as mine, actually) it is likely to be set to 150% by 
default.

> Where in the code base would one look to focus on this?

Perhaps look at o.n.core.output2.OutputEditorKit/WrappedTextView. That's my 
first guess at where the relevant rendering/text measurement happens. Note that 
the output pane does not seem to share any logic with the main code editor.

This is a long-standing, annoying bug--a fix would be very welcome!

-- Eirik


-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Saturday, January 29, 2022 9:49 AM
To: Netbeans Developer List 
Subject: Re: Copy and Paste Wrong from NB Output

That does some like the issue.  I am on Windows.  Looking at my Display 
Settings, HiDPI looks to be turned off.

Where in the code base would one look to focus on this?

I have seen this with Windows 10, with netbeans 13-rc2

openjdk version "11.0.13" 2021-10-19
OpenJDK Runtime Environment Temurin-11.0.13+8 (build 11.0.13+8) OpenJDK 64-Bit 
Server VM Temurin-11.0.13+8 (build 11.0.13+8, mixed mode)

I may be in HiDP (my Display Resolution indicates 3840 x2160) but not sure how 
that aligns to HiDP in other context and OS



Eric Bresie
ebre...@gmail.com


On Sat, Jan 29, 2022 at 8:08 AM Eirik Bakke  wrote:

> Are you on Windows, MacOS, or Linux? Do you have HiDPI scaling enabled?
>
> It could be this bug: 
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-585
>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Eric Bresie 
> Sent: Friday, January 28, 2022 3:16 PM
> To: Netbeans Developer List 
> Subject: Copy and Paste Wrong from NB Output
>
> Not sure if this could be a Java copy/paste issue,  but while trying 
> out 13-rc2, I was trying to build something which resulted in some 
> errors showing in the Output window.  I selected the text from the 
> window, right clicked, selected Copy and pasted in the web browser to search.
>
> However  the copied text "org.tukaani" when pasted became "n, org.tuka"
>
> Anyone else have similar issues or ideas?  If so then I can raise an issue.
>
> Eric Bresie
> ebre...@gmail.com
>

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RE: Copy and Paste Wrong from NB Output

[Eirik Bakke]

Are you on Windows, MacOS, or Linux? Do you have HiDPI scaling enabled?

It could be this bug: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-585

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Friday, January 28, 2022 3:16 PM
To: Netbeans Developer List 
Subject: Copy and Paste Wrong from NB Output

Not sure if this could be a Java copy/paste issue,  but while trying out 
13-rc2, I was trying to build something which resulted in some errors showing 
in the Output window.  I selected the text from the window, right clicked, 
selected Copy and pasted in the web browser to search.

However  the copied text "org.tukaani" when pasted became "n, org.tuka"

Anyone else have similar issues or ideas?  If so then I can raise an issue.

Eric Bresie
ebre...@gmail.com

RE: How to get output of System.out.println() in NB Output view?

[Eirik Bakke]

> the problem is the "64-bit VM" detection in the ant script that expects the 
> old Java <9 installation directory.
> I found this a while ago but didn't found time to create a proper PR, sorry.

I remember fixing a similar bug a while back, for the maven NetBeans Platform 
app runner. If it's any help, here's the code I ended up using for detecting 
32-bit vs. 64-bit Java installations:

https://github.com/mojohaus/nbm-maven-plugin/pull/46
https://github.com/apache/netbeans-parent/pull/1

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Jens Hofschröer  
Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2022 8:15 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: How to get output of System.out.println() in NB Output view?

Hi

the problem is the "64-bit VM" detection in the ant script that expects the old 
Java <9 installation directory.

set jvm.arch.string=64 on CLI or in your private.properties and you will see 
the output again.

The problem is in harness/run.xml (search for "architecture of jvm on which app 
will run"). I found this a while ago but didn't found time to create a proper 
PR, sorry.

Jens

Am 20.01.2022 um 13:27 schrieb Karl Tauber:
> that's what I expect, but it does not show up in the Output window.
> 
> When I create a simple Ant project app, it works.
> But when running NetBeans IDE from NetBeans, it does not.
> 
> Karl
> 
> 
> Am 1/20/2022 um 12:18 PM schrieb Michael Bien:
>> it won't show up in the log view, however, if you start the platform 
>> application or module with netbeans (e.g run project), it should be 
>> visible in the output window (of the IDE, not from the app).
>>
>> -mbien
>>
>> On 20.01.22 10:26, Karl Tauber wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> while working on improvements/fixes for FlatLaf support in NetBeans, 
>>> I'd like to temporary add some System.out.println() to NetBeans core 
>>> modules and see its output in the NetBeans Output view. But it does 
>>> not show up.
>>>
>>> The printlns are compiled. I've checked it with the debugger.
>>>
>>> -J-Dnetbeans.logger.console=true did not help.
>>>
>>> The last lines in the Output view are:
>>> debug:
>>> nbbuild.tryme-debug:
>>> Searching for JARs in D:\Java\netbeans-apache\nbbuild\netbeans, this 
>>> may take a moment...
>>> nbbuild.tryme-setup-debug-args:
>>> nbbuild.tryme:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm using NetBeans 12.6 with Java 11
>>>
>>> Any ideas?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Karl
>>>
>>> 
>>> - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>>>
>>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>>
>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
> 
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> 
> 
> 

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For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

In case it is helpful, I made a quick screencast video showing the icon drawing 
process I used in the past, in Adobe Illustrator:

https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/667860571

-- Eirik

From: Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 9:35 AM
To: Eirik Bakke 
Cc: Venus Chung ; Peter Cheung ; Apache 
NetBeans ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

No worries, thanks for the update!

Le mer. 19 janv. 2022 à 14:35, Eirik Bakke 
mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>> a écrit :
Sorry about that--thank you for your help with this project! Happy to answer 
any questions, or to do a screen sharing session.

(When I was drawing icons myself, it took me many hours to figure out the right 
tools to use in Illustrator to get the right result. But it goes faster after a 
few icons!)

There is also a style guide at 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 .

-- Eirik

From: Venus Chung mailto:ve...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 1:34 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; Peter Cheung 
mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: 回覆: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear All,

I made a mistake,I designed the wrong icon, it needs to be redesigned, please 
give me more time.

Best Regards,
Venus
____
寄件者: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
寄件日期: 2022年1月18日 下午 11:11
收件者: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
副本: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>; Venus Chung 
mailto:ve...@quantr.hk>>
主旨: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


Hi, Peter.



Thank you so much for these efforts!! Could we see what the icons look like 
without Pixel Preview enabled? (View->Pixel Preview in Illustrator)



Might you also send the latest version of the Illustrator file? I'd love to 
have a look at grid alignments, and see the new icons against the background 
layer with the old bitmap icons, and at different resolutions etc.



Happy to meet next week. I could do anytime 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for 
instance. Feel free to pick a day.



Thanks again very much to Venus and you!



-- Eirik

(Now on US east coast time.)



From: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 1:45 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear Eirik & All

Let's have a wrap-up meeting next week?



Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)

________

From: Peter Cheung mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 11:36 AM
To: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear all

Please see the last three rows, is the style matched?



Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)



From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 1:17 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA mailto:arafat...@gmail.com>>; Peter 
Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>; Peter Cheung 
mailto:pe...@quantr.hk>>
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



I think I understand your goal, and this thread now has a good summary of pros 
and cons.

Again, this is really up to whoever does the icon drawing work. Myself, I have 
just contributed the icons that happened to be used in my NetBeans Platform app.

Would you be interested in participating in the actual icon drawing process, by 
the way? Or is the use of Adobe Illustrator a deal-breaker for you? My company 
could pay for a license.

Alternatively we could try to work out an Inkscape process, if someone wants to 
commit to drawing a significant number of icons in it (separate from the ones 
Peter Cheung is working on). Although the lack of an Artboards feature in 
Inkscape could be a problem.

-- Eirik
[1] 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith mailto:neilcsm...@a

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Sorry about that--thank you for your help with this project! Happy to answer 
any questions, or to do a screen sharing session.

(When I was drawing icons myself, it took me many hours to figure out the right 
tools to use in Illustrator to get the right result. But it goes faster after a 
few icons!)

There is also a style guide at 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 .

-- Eirik

From: Venus Chung 
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 1:34 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Peter Cheung ; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: 回覆: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear All,

I made a mistake,I designed the wrong icon, it needs to be redesigned, please 
give me more time.

Best Regards,
Venus

寄件者: Eirik Bakke 
寄件日期: 2022年1月18日 下午 11:11
收件者: Peter Cheung ; dev@netbeans.apache.org 

副本: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Venus Chung 
主旨: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


Hi, Peter.



Thank you so much for these efforts!! Could we see what the icons look like 
without Pixel Preview enabled? (View->Pixel Preview in Illustrator)



Might you also send the latest version of the Illustrator file? I'd love to 
have a look at grid alignments, and see the new icons against the background 
layer with the old bitmap icons, and at different resolutions etc.



Happy to meet next week. I could do anytime 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for 
instance. Feel free to pick a day.



Thanks again very much to Venus and you!



-- Eirik

(Now on US east coast time.)



From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 1:45 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear Eirik & All

Let's have a wrap-up meeting next week?



Thanks

>From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
>96554595)



From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 11:36 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; dev@netbeans.apache.org 

Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear all

Please see the last three rows, is the style matched?



Thanks

>From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
>96554595)

____

From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 1:17 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Peter Cheung 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



I think I understand your goal, and this thread now has a good summary of pros 
and cons.

Again, this is really up to whoever does the icon drawing work. Myself, I have 
just contributed the icons that happened to be used in my NetBeans Platform app.

Would you be interested in participating in the actual icon drawing process, by 
the way? Or is the use of Adobe Illustrator a deal-breaker for you? My company 
could pay for a license.

Alternatively we could try to work out an Inkscape process, if someone wants to 
commit to drawing a significant number of icons in it (separate from the ones 
Peter Cheung is working on). Although the lack of an Artboards feature in 
Inkscape could be a problem.

-- Eirik
[1] 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith 
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 11:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Wed, 12 Jan 2022 at 15:48, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> Sorry, to clarify: The point about the color palette was my own. My argument 
> is that the existing NetBeans icon style is not very well-suited for 
> assigning logical colors. In order to designate a meaningful, configurable, 
> "accent color", for example, we would have to change the overall color 
> palette of the entire icon set. And that's something that's easier to do 
> after-the-fact than up-front (see my earlier explanation for why).

This is where I somewhat disagree, although I think we're talking about 
different things.

Take 3 different icons - folder, warning, and lightbulb (not sure we have one, 
but ...)

They might all be the same shade of yellow.  However, maybe you want the folder 
icons to take on the accent colour of a look and feel, while a dark theme might 
want to make the shades of the other two a darker yellow, or just the warning 
to match other things in the theme.

Maybe we want to edit the icon files later - this could apply there as much as 
in icon loading.

The point was that to have the icons encode the context of a fill colour (eg. 
CSS class), as well as the colour itself, is potentially useful in multiple 
ways.  And as far as I'm aware, easier to define upfront in a template for all 
icons, than later.  At least in Inkscape (I'

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Hi, Peter.

Thank you so much for these efforts!! Could we see what the icons look like 
without Pixel Preview enabled? (View->Pixel Preview in Illustrator)

Might you also send the latest version of the Illustrator file? I'd love to 
have a look at grid alignments, and see the new icons against the background 
layer with the old bitmap icons, and at different resolutions etc.

Happy to meet next week. I could do anytime 8am-11am Hong Kong time, for 
instance. Feel free to pick a day.

Thanks again very much to Venus and you!

-- Eirik
(Now on US east coast time.)

From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 1:45 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik & All
Let's have a wrap-up meeting next week?


Thanks

>From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
>96554595)


From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 11:36 AM
To: Eirik Bakke ; dev@netbeans.apache.org 

Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear all
Please see the last three rows, is the style matched?


Thanks

>From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
>96554595)

____
From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 1:17 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Peter Cheung 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

I think I understand your goal, and this thread now has a good summary of pros 
and cons.

Again, this is really up to whoever does the icon drawing work. Myself, I have 
just contributed the icons that happened to be used in my NetBeans Platform app.

Would you be interested in participating in the actual icon drawing process, by 
the way? Or is the use of Adobe Illustrator a deal-breaker for you? My company 
could pay for a license.

Alternatively we could try to work out an Inkscape process, if someone wants to 
commit to drawing a significant number of icons in it (separate from the ones 
Peter Cheung is working on). Although the lack of an Artboards feature in 
Inkscape could be a problem.

-- Eirik
[1] 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith 
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 11:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Wed, 12 Jan 2022 at 15:48, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> Sorry, to clarify: The point about the color palette was my own. My argument 
> is that the existing NetBeans icon style is not very well-suited for 
> assigning logical colors. In order to designate a meaningful, configurable, 
> "accent color", for example, we would have to change the overall color 
> palette of the entire icon set. And that's something that's easier to do 
> after-the-fact than up-front (see my earlier explanation for why).

This is where I somewhat disagree, although I think we're talking about 
different things.

Take 3 different icons - folder, warning, and lightbulb (not sure we have one, 
but ...)

They might all be the same shade of yellow.  However, maybe you want the folder 
icons to take on the accent colour of a look and feel, while a dark theme might 
want to make the shades of the other two a darker yellow, or just the warning 
to match other things in the theme.

Maybe we want to edit the icon files later - this could apply there as much as 
in icon loading.

The point was that to have the icons encode the context of a fill colour (eg. 
CSS class), as well as the colour itself, is potentially useful in multiple 
ways.  And as far as I'm aware, easier to define upfront in a template for all 
icons, than later.  At least in Inkscape (I'm a libre graphics person! :-)) I 
would set up the common stylesheet / palette first, then apply to each shape.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: Log4J and its consequences for NetBeans and open source in general

[Eirik Bakke]

> When I see out of nowhere e-mails arriving here from addresses that we've 
> never heard of, with domain names that are clearly large multinational 
> enterprises, who we never hear of except now that there is potentially a 
> security hole in the software they've been freeloading without contributing 
> anything to, well, it's unacceptable.

One possible response is: "My company, Foobar LLC, specializes in NetBeans 
development, and can offer to do a security review of NetBeans wrt. the 
aforementioned log4j vulnerability. This will cost $1,500 and can be completed 
by Tuesday."

There are some companies that   will actually pay for these things. (See e.g. 
https://www.sqlite.org/purchase/license )

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2022 6:07 AM
To: dev 
Subject: Log4J and its consequences for NetBeans and open source in general

Hi all,

Some interesting reading:

https://www.theregister.com/2022/01/13/opensource_apacheplc4x_payment/

https://www.theregister.com/2021/12/14/log4j_vulnerability_open_source_funding/

As established thus far, there is no impact on NetBeans for the log4j situation 
in terms of attack vectors, since NetBeans doesn't use v2 and the
v1 scenario doesn't apply to NetBeans.

However, there are other issues involved here, as described in the links above.

When I see out of nowhere e-mails arriving here from addresses that we've never 
heard of, with domain names that are clearly large multinational enterprises, 
who we never hear of except now that there is potentially a security hole in 
the software they've been freeloading without contributing anything to, well, 
it's unacceptable. And we never hear from those e-mail addresses again after 
calming their concern, until the next time, etc.

For me personally, I may be arriving at a situation where I'm going to be 
ignoring e-mails clearly coming from corporations and (to avoid those people 
switching to gmail accounts) to people not participating at all other than 
raising issues and demanding immediate assistance and asking for help in one 
way or another.

The choices you have are simple: pay money to a commercial provider or pay time 
to the open source projects you're using. Time does not mean filing an issue 
and it does not mean writing a mail voicing your frustration. It means 
responding to other people when they have questions and at least investigating 
the issue you're reporting since after all you're a developer on all of 
NetBeans is on GitHub for you to investigate.

I'm not writing this on behalf of the PMC but just under my own name and title. 
:-)

Gj

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

I think I understand your goal, and this thread now has a good summary of pros 
and cons.

Again, this is really up to whoever does the icon drawing work. Myself, I have 
just contributed the icons that happened to be used in my NetBeans Platform app.

Would you be interested in participating in the actual icon drawing process, by 
the way? Or is the use of Adobe Illustrator a deal-breaker for you? My company 
could pay for a license.

Alternatively we could try to work out an Inkscape process, if someone wants to 
commit to drawing a significant number of icons in it (separate from the ones 
Peter Cheung is working on). Although the lack of an Artboards feature in 
Inkscape could be a problem.

-- Eirik
[1] 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 11:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Wed, 12 Jan 2022 at 15:48, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> Sorry, to clarify: The point about the color palette was my own. My argument 
> is that the existing NetBeans icon style is not very well-suited for 
> assigning logical colors. In order to designate a meaningful, configurable, 
> "accent color", for example, we would have to change the overall color 
> palette of the entire icon set. And that's something that's easier to do 
> after-the-fact than up-front (see my earlier explanation for why).

This is where I somewhat disagree, although I think we're talking about 
different things.

Take 3 different icons - folder, warning, and lightbulb (not sure we have one, 
but ...)

They might all be the same shade of yellow.  However, maybe you want the folder 
icons to take on the accent colour of a look and feel, while a dark theme might 
want to make the shades of the other two a darker yellow, or just the warning 
to match other things in the theme.

Maybe we want to edit the icon files later - this could apply there as much as 
in icon loading.

The point was that to have the icons encode the context of a fill colour (eg. 
CSS class), as well as the colour itself, is potentially useful in multiple 
ways.  And as far as I'm aware, easier to define upfront in a template for all 
icons, than later.  At least in Inkscape (I'm a libre graphics person! :-)) I 
would set up the common stylesheet / palette first, then apply to each shape.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

> Yes, I realise it's some work to set up the styles. But it'll be a lot 
> smaller amount of work to consider now than later. And I don't see much of a 
> maintenance issue. It was only a request to consider it in the discussions.

Noted! I think this really becomes up to whoever decides to continue work on 
drawing the icons. Right now we have Peter Cheung working on a first batch, 
delegating to his graphic designers, who are experienced with Adobe 
Illustrator. Perhaps let's see where that goes first.

> This has nothing to do with single accent colours, changing the default 
> palette or platform applications
(from https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3445 :)
> at no point have I suggested switching to duotone icons in order to integrate 
> with this change

Sorry, to clarify: The point about the color palette was my own. My argument is 
that the existing NetBeans icon style is not very well-suited for assigning 
logical colors. In order to designate a meaningful, configurable, "accent 
color", for example, we would have to change the overall color palette of the 
entire icon set. And that's something that's easier to do after-the-fact than 
up-front (see my earlier explanation for why).

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Sunday, January 2, 2022 10:06 AM
To: dev 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Sun, 2 Jan 2022, 14:57 Eirik Bakke,  wrote:

> > Relying on colour filtering of the rasterized icons for eg. dark 
> > themes
> makes no sense when we can style the SVG data before rasterization 
> with semantic information intact.
>
> The motivation is just that it's less work. Even things like picking 
> names for the color classes is work. And then we're stuck with 
> maintaining and supporting those classes, like maintaining an API.
>

Yes, I realise it's some work to set up the styles. But it'll be a lot smaller 
amount of work to consider now than later. And I don't see much of a 
maintenance issue. It was only a request to consider it in the discussions. But 
if they're added, I'm happy to look at the loading code support.

Best wishes,

Neil

RE: Problems with Copy & Paste NetBeans 12.6 - OpenJDK 17 - Windows 10

[Eirik Bakke]

I keep seeing this myself, specifically copying text from the NetBeans source 
editor to other external applications. It's intermittent, and I haven't really 
tried to debug it.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Benjamin Asbach  
Sent: Wednesday, January 5, 2022 12:38 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Problems with Copy & Paste NetBeans 12.6 - OpenJDK 17 - Windows 10

Hi,

I wonder if I'm the only one encountering problems with Copy & Paste not 
working after some IDE usage. After I restart NetBeans it's working again.

As far as I can remember some time ago there was a jdk bug regarding copy & 
paste.

As I'm using a quite exotic dev environment Linux (NixOS) -> Citrix -> Windows 
10 I cannot exclude that this combination is causing trouble somehow.

Thanks
Benjamin

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

> Relying on colour filtering of the rasterized icons for eg. dark themes makes 
> no sense when we can style the SVG data before rasterization with semantic 
> information intact.

The motivation is just that it's less work. Even things like picking names for 
the color classes is work. And then we're stuck with maintaining and supporting 
those classes, like maintaining an API.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Sunday, January 2, 2022 3:52 PM
To: dev 
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Sun, 2 Jan 2022, 14:22 Eirik Bakke,  wrote:

> > What I mean is I assume you want a limited consistent set of colours
> (pallette) across all icons?
>
> The existing bitmap icons already have a good color scheme that does 
> this (designed by Leos Tronicek [1]). But it doesn't lend itself well 
> to the concept of a single "accent" color that can be changed 
> arbitrarily, since the icons are colorful rather than monotone or 
> duetone. Personally, I think that's fine, and a good contrast to the IntelliJ 
> style.
>

I think you're missing my point. This has nothing to do with single accent 
colours, changing the default palette or platform applications.

I'm asking to try and have semantic classes for all colourings in the SVGs.
Relying on colour filtering of the rasterized icons for eg. dark themes makes 
no sense when we can style the SVG data before rasterization with semantic 
information intact. After rasterization nothing tells you why a particular part 
of the icon is red or yellow. We can then style icons far more easily from a 
central point.

I always wanted to switch to logical icons managed in a central way, along the 
lines of the xdg spec, but at least having one place to alter the palette is an 
improvement.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

> What I mean is I assume you want a limited consistent set of colours 
> (pallette) across all icons? 

The existing bitmap icons already have a good color scheme that does this 
(designed by Leos Tronicek [1]). But it doesn't lend itself well to the concept 
of a single "accent" color that can be changed arbitrarily, since the icons are 
colorful rather than monotone or duetone. Personally, I think that's fine, and 
a good contrast to the IntelliJ style.

But I understand that others might prefer a different aesthetic. The choice to 
keep the existing style is mostly a pragmatic one. If you're thinking of 
changing the color scheme, e.g. for use in a NetBeans Platform app like 
PraxisLIVE, another alternative would be to change the colors from Illustrator 
and regenerate the SVGs for your own use. (I can document the process.) I know 
a lot of programmers don't like Adobe Illustrator, but it does have the 
advantage of showing all the icons side-by-side, in named artboards, which is 
extremely helpful when you're trying to make many different icons look 
consistent.

Perhaps let's see how Peter Cheung and his designers fare with their first 
batch of icons. They were continuing where Pete Whelpton and I left off, and 
might have opinions on the workflow.

-- Eirik
[1] See Geertjan's history in the old email thread "NetBeans GUI icons, who 
drew them?"

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Saturday, January 1, 2022 6:33 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Sat, 1 Jan 2022 at 14:49, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> That's true for the old bitmap icons, but the new SVG icons are drawn without 
> shadows, specular highlights/gradients, and bevel borders. This should avoid 
> the depth inversion problem.

Yes, they're certainly better, but I'm not sure they entirely remove the 
problems.

> To understand--what do you mean by accent and logical colors here, in terms 
> of the existing NetBeans icons? Could you take a look at the following 
> screenshot (left side), which shows the most commonly seen NetBeans icons, 
> and say what the "accent" color would be, and give some examples of what you 
> mean by "logical" colors?
>
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210
> 604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png
>
> (I know there are other icon styles where the icons are mostly 
> grayscale + single accept color, like in IntelliJ. But the NetBeans 
> icons have a multi-color style. And I think this is actually a nice 
> point of differentiation for NetBeans.)

Yes, sorry, not particularly well described maybe.  I'm not talking about the 
single accent colour approach like that, even if personally I'd prefer it over 
the multi-colour style.  Quite understand you want to keep that, although with 
this suggestion we could even support both.

What I mean is I assume you want a limited consistent set of colours
(pallette) across all icons?  But there are also different reasons for the 
colours, and I guess I'd add natural to accent and logical.  And maybe accent 
should be theme or laf?

eg.

red (logical) - stop / error / close
yellow (logical) - warning

yellow (accent / theme) folders / arrows grey (accent / theme) area select

blue / green (natural) - world icon
grey (natural) - wastebasket

If the SVG files add CSS style classes for the various distinct uses, as well 
as the default fill colour, we have the option to support override via LAF 
provided stylesheets at icon loading later?

So, folders and arrows could follow LAF colouring, and other colours could be 
adjusted to work better with dark themes, all without having to change the 
icons themselves.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

> Your linked image looks somewhat better than the dark metal implementation, 
> but value invert is hit and miss - eg. it inverts depth perception.

That's true for the old bitmap icons, but the new SVG icons are drawn without 
shadows, specular highlights/gradients, and bevel borders. This should avoid 
the depth inversion problem.

> Catch 22! I'll put work into implementing this as soon as we have icons that 
> support it.
> But the icons already have accent and logical colours. It's whether we choose 
> to expose them.

To understand--what do you mean by accent and logical colors here, in terms of 
the existing NetBeans icons? Could you take a look at the following screenshot 
(left side), which shows the most commonly seen NetBeans icons, and say what 
the "accent" color would be, and give some examples of what you mean by 
"logical" colors?

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png

(I know there are other icon styles where the icons are mostly grayscale + 
single accept color, like in IntelliJ. But the NetBeans icons have a 
multi-color style. And I think this is actually a nice point of differentiation 
for NetBeans.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Saturday, January 1, 2022 2:09 PM
To: dev 
Cc: Arafat BOUCHAFRA ; Peter Cheung 
; Peter Cheung 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Sat, 1 Jan 2022, 12:05 Eirik Bakke,  wrote:

> > Yes, I know, it's horrible!
>
> I thought it looked quite nice :-)
>

Your linked image looks somewhat better than the dark metal implementation, but 
value invert is hit and miss - eg. it inverts depth perception.

>
>
> My general point is that redrawing the icons is a massive task--there 
> are thousands of unique icons in NetBeans,


Yes, I know, hence suggesting ensuring a standardised colour palette that has 
potential to style from one place. It's a little extra work at the beginning 
that should simplify the massive task a bit?

There's also the YAGNI principle--don't pre-architect for functionality we
> won't yet implement.
>

Catch 22! I'll put work into implementing this as soon as we have icons that 
support it.


> I also happen to think that the existing icon color scheme is actually 
> a good one, and that animations should be avoided. Accent colors are a 
> good idea,
>

I agree on existing palette and animations. But the icons already have accent 
and logical colours. It's whether we choose to expose them.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

> Yes, I know, it's horrible!

I thought it looked quite nice :-)

My general point is that redrawing the icons is a massive task--there are 
thousands of unique icons in NetBeans, and many hundreds that are seen 
frequently. We really need to keep the process as simple as possible, to have a 
chance to get it done. The main goal here--for my own work at least--is to make 
NetBeans look good on Retina displays (all MacBooks) and other HiDPI displays 
(on both Windows and Linux).

> It's probably less work to consider this now than retrofit them all later?
No, I think retrofitting is actually easier--it could be done in one big batch 
operation. It would have to be part of a general effort to change the color 
scheme, which requires seeing all the ready-drawn icons side-by-side. There's 
also the YAGNI principle--don't pre-architect for functionality we won't yet 
implement.

I also happen to think that the existing icon color scheme is actually a good 
one, and that animations should be avoided. Accent colors are a good idea, but 
can be limited to other parts of the LAF, such as selection highlights.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Saturday, January 1, 2022 12:38 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Sat, 1 Jan 2022 at 11:29, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> For Dark Mode, one can apply a color filter that inverts the brightness 
> without changing the hues.

Yes, I know, it's horrible!

> Other color scheme changes would probably be best to do once a substantial 
> number of icons have been vectorized.

I wasn't suggesting otherwise, just asking to consider future proofing the SVGs 
now with CSS classes (or other mechanism) so this can more easily be done 
later. It's probably less work to consider this now than retrofit them all 
later?

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

For Dark Mode, one can apply a color filter that inverts the brightness without 
changing the hues. I.e. so red stays red but black becomes white etc. Here's an 
example (inverting the L channel in LAB color space):

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13038140/220101%20Updated%20Dark%20Filter%20Test.png

ImageUtilities actually has support for pluggable color filters already.

Other color scheme changes would probably be best to do once a substantial 
number of icons have been vectorized. Otherwise there will be old bitmap icons 
with the old color scheme next to new icons with the new color scheme. But once 
the icon shapes are drawn, changing the color scheme later should be quite 
easy. It's drawing the actual shapes and bezier curves etc. that take up most 
of the time.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 6:30 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Peter Cheung ; Peter Cheung ; 
Arafat BOUCHAFRA 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

On Tue, 28 Dec 2021 at 12:26, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> Other topics discussed:
> * Arafat proposed more ambitious changes to NetBeans' look & feel, and we 
> exchanged ideas. Eirik mentioned the recent discussion thread that ended up 
> making FlatLAF the default LAF on NetBeans.
> * Arafat also mentioned possible approaches to get support for animated icons.

All sounds exciting!

While discussing SVG features, a bigger one than animation might be CSS?  Or at 
least, at this stage, could we ensure icons have classes for a small range of 
accent colours?  Obviously, certain things like "stop" you might want always to 
be red.  Whereas other accent colours might be better to pick up from the look 
and feel.  And it would be great to never have to rely on the _dark suffix for 
svg icons.

Obviously there's a need to look at changes in the icon loading to allow 
specifying the right stylesheet via Batik too.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Peter Cheung, Arafat Bouchafra, and me (Eirik Bakke) just had a Zoom video chat 
today, following up on this thread. The three of us are all software developers 
and long-time users of NetBeans.

Icon drawing project summary:
* Peter's company has two designers who work with Photoshop and Illustrator, 
and he may be willing to allocate some of their time to continue the icon 
drawing process that is tracked in 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 . Peter will communicate 
with the designers.
* Eirik has shared with Peter an Illustrator template file containing the first 
50 SVG icons and artboards/bitmap templates for the next ~167 icons to be 
prioritized (also attached to 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 ). We did a screen sharing 
where Peter had a look at the file, layers, artboards etc.
* Peter's designer will try to draw a small batch of ~10 icons in the 
Illustrator template. Then we'll discuss progress. Eirik can help turn this 
next batch of icons into a Pull Request, or walk Peter through how to do this. 
(Exporting the SVG files, adding license headers, copying SVGs into the right 
locations in the NetBeans repo etc.)

Resources:
* Style guide to be used for new SVG icons, consistent with earlier merged PRs: 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617
* List of artboards in the Illustrator file, and notes on each icon: 
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U_pj-I3hk9Wj_7lvHcUDsZfFfBSyCkSGqBuv0qt_qXw/edit#gid=812179705
 

Other topics discussed:
* Arafat proposed more ambitious changes to NetBeans' look & feel, and we 
exchanged ideas. Eirik mentioned the recent discussion thread that ended up 
making FlatLAF the default LAF on NetBeans. 
* Arafat also mentioned possible approaches to get support for animated icons.
* Arafat inquired about whether there still exists a "NetBeans Certified 
Engineer Course". He has been teaching Computer Science courses himself. We 
looked at 
https://netbeans.apache.org/wiki/NetBeansCertifiedEngineerCourse.asciidoc , but 
this seems like an old page.
* Eirik suggested sending out a separate email to dev@netbeans.apache.org to 
discuss bigger or more controversial ideas. (Since decision-making in the 
NetBeans project is based on open discussion on the mailing list and in GitHub 
Pull Requests, rather than in meetings or private sub-groups.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-----
From: Eirik Bakke  
Sent: Saturday, December 25, 2021 2:24 PM
To: Peter Cheung ; Peter Cheung 
Cc: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Great! I sent invites to the people already in this thread.

Merry Christmas!

-- Eirik

From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Saturday, December 25, 2021 2:21 PM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Peter Cheung 
Cc: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Thanks, accepted your request. Merry Xmas too


Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)

____
From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Saturday, December 25, 2021 9:18 PM
To: Peter Cheung 
Cc: Peter Cheung ; dev@netbeans.apache.org 

Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


10.00 (10am) UTC on Tue December 28 works.



For anyone who'd like to join, please respond with your email address in this 
thread, and I can send you a Zoom meeting invite.



-- Eirik



From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Thursday, December 23, 2021 6:02 PM
To: Eirik Bakke 
Cc: pe...@quantr.hk; dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear Eirik

Sorry late reply. Shall we do next tue 10 UTC ? thanks



Thanks

From Peter



____

From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2021 10:35 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



At the moment, anytime 10.00-22.00 UTC Tuesday or Wednesday would work, for 
instance. Just let me know which time slot you prefer.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2021 7:06 PM
To: Geertjan Wielenga ; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
May I know what time you ok for a net meeting next week? I ask my designers 
(Noel & Venus) to reserve time. It doesn't have to be hong kong day time, just 
any time that fit you is ok.

Thanks Geertjan too


Thanks
From Peter

From: Geertjan Wielenga 
Sent: Monday, December 6, 2021 4:00 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Cc: mcheun...@hotmail.com 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


Great, progress! Yes, a report to this mailing list would be great to keep 
everyone informed.

Gj

On Mon, 6 Dec 2021 at 07:27, Eirik Bakke 
mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>> wrote:
Sure! Are you in Hong Kong? This week I'm on US east coast time and could do an 
evening call (US time) later in the week. December 15t

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Great! I sent invites to the people already in this thread.

Merry Christmas!

-- Eirik

From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Saturday, December 25, 2021 2:21 PM
To: Eirik Bakke ; Peter Cheung 
Cc: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Thanks, accepted your request. Merry Xmas too


Thanks

From Peter (System Architect, Quantr Limited https://www.quantr.hk , Mobile : 
96554595)


From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Saturday, December 25, 2021 9:18 PM
To: Peter Cheung 
Cc: Peter Cheung ; dev@netbeans.apache.org 

Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


10.00 (10am) UTC on Tue December 28 works.



For anyone who'd like to join, please respond with your email address in this 
thread, and I can send you a Zoom meeting invite.



-- Eirik



From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Thursday, December 23, 2021 6:02 PM
To: Eirik Bakke 
Cc: pe...@quantr.hk; dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



Dear Eirik

Sorry late reply. Shall we do next tue 10 UTC ? thanks



Thanks

From Peter





From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2021 10:35 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted



At the moment, anytime 10.00-22.00 UTC Tuesday or Wednesday would work, for 
instance. Just let me know which time slot you prefer.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2021 7:06 PM
To: Geertjan Wielenga ; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
May I know what time you ok for a net meeting next week? I ask my designers 
(Noel & Venus) to reserve time. It doesn't have to be hong kong day time, just 
any time that fit you is ok.

Thanks Geertjan too


Thanks
From Peter

From: Geertjan Wielenga 
Sent: Monday, December 6, 2021 4:00 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Cc: mcheun...@hotmail.com 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


Great, progress! Yes, a report to this mailing list would be great to keep 
everyone informed.

Gj

On Mon, 6 Dec 2021 at 07:27, Eirik Bakke 
mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>> wrote:
Sure! Are you in Hong Kong? This week I'm on US east coast time and could do an 
evening call (US time) later in the week. December 15th through January 7 I'll 
be on central Europe time.

I can show the current workflow I've been using for vectorizing NetBeans icons 
so far, and give you an idea of the work involved.

If others are interested in joining, feel free to chime in. (We can write a 
summary for the mailing list afterwards.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Sent: Sunday, December 5, 2021 12:15 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
We have read the google sheet. Do you have time to have a zoom this week? 
So we can have a jump start 


Thanks
From Peter
____
From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2021 1:11 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter.

Fantastic! I'm happy to join a chat--it would be good to include anyone else on 
this list who is interested as well.

For actual decision-making, discussions should happen on the email list, so 
that everyone can follow along. But a Zoom meeting might be good for a quick 
overview.

The style guide that was used for the first 50 icons is described on 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 . The original discussion 
around this can be found at https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2387 . (If 
helpful, I could add some example images to the style guide and perhaps pull it 
out of the JIRA issue and into a separate Confluence page.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 9:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi Eirik
We definitely want to help out for the icons. What style you want? How 
about I line up our designers with you for a meeting?
Thanks
From Peter

From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 1:50 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter!

There is one big theme-related task which is pending, which is to create new 
SVG versions of various bitmap icons in the IDE, for modern Retina/HiDPI 
screens. I did the first 50 (in Adobe Illustrator), and pi

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

10.00 (10am) UTC on Tue December 28 works.

For anyone who'd like to join, please respond with your email address in this 
thread, and I can send you a Zoom meeting invite.

-- Eirik

From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Thursday, December 23, 2021 6:02 PM
To: Eirik Bakke 
Cc: pe...@quantr.hk; dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
Sorry late reply. Shall we do next tue 10 UTC ? thanks

Thanks
From Peter


From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2021 10:35 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

At the moment, anytime 10.00-22.00 UTC Tuesday or Wednesday would work, for 
instance. Just let me know which time slot you prefer.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2021 7:06 PM
To: Geertjan Wielenga ; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
May I know what time you ok for a net meeting next week? I ask my designers 
(Noel & Venus) to reserve time. It doesn't have to be hong kong day time, just 
any time that fit you is ok.

Thanks Geertjan too


Thanks
From Peter

From: Geertjan Wielenga 
Sent: Monday, December 6, 2021 4:00 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Cc: mcheun...@hotmail.com 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


Great, progress! Yes, a report to this mailing list would be great to keep 
everyone informed.

Gj

On Mon, 6 Dec 2021 at 07:27, Eirik Bakke 
mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>> wrote:
Sure! Are you in Hong Kong? This week I'm on US east coast time and could do an 
evening call (US time) later in the week. December 15th through January 7 I'll 
be on central Europe time.

I can show the current workflow I've been using for vectorizing NetBeans icons 
so far, and give you an idea of the work involved.

If others are interested in joining, feel free to chime in. (We can write a 
summary for the mailing list afterwards.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Sent: Sunday, December 5, 2021 12:15 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
We have read the google sheet. Do you have time to have a zoom this week? 
So we can have a jump start 


Thanks
From Peter
____
From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2021 1:11 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter.

Fantastic! I'm happy to join a chat--it would be good to include anyone else on 
this list who is interested as well.

For actual decision-making, discussions should happen on the email list, so 
that everyone can follow along. But a Zoom meeting might be good for a quick 
overview.

The style guide that was used for the first 50 icons is described on 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 . The original discussion 
around this can be found at https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2387 . (If 
helpful, I could add some example images to the style guide and perhaps pull it 
out of the JIRA issue and into a separate Confluence page.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 9:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi Eirik
We definitely want to help out for the icons. What style you want? How 
about I line up our designers with you for a meeting?
Thanks
From Peter

From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 1:50 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter!

There is one big theme-related task which is pending, which is to create new 
SVG versions of various bitmap icons in the IDE, for modern Retina/HiDPI 
screens. I did the first 50 (in Adobe Illustrator), and picked out the next 
ones to be prioritized, as you can see here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U_pj-I3hk9Wj_7lvHcUDsZfFfBSyCkSGqBuv0qt_qXw/edit#gid=812179705
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617

If you are interested in helping with the icon drawling effort, I'd be happy to 
help coordinate.

As for the Look & Feel, I think NetBeans will now be switching to FlatLAF as 
the default on all 3 operating systems (Windows, Linux, MacOS). I just 
transitioned my own NetBeans Platform application to FlatLAF, and it's a very 
good basis

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

At the moment, anytime 10.00-22.00 UTC Tuesday or Wednesday would work, for 
instance. Just let me know which time slot you prefer.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung  
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2021 7:06 PM
To: Geertjan Wielenga ; 
dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
May I know what time you ok for a net meeting next week? I ask my designers 
(Noel & Venus) to reserve time. It doesn't have to be hong kong day time, just 
any time that fit you is ok.

Thanks Geertjan too


Thanks
From Peter

From: Geertjan Wielenga 
Sent: Monday, December 6, 2021 4:00 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Cc: mcheun...@hotmail.com 
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted


Great, progress! Yes, a report to this mailing list would be great to keep 
everyone informed.

Gj

On Mon, 6 Dec 2021 at 07:27, Eirik Bakke 
mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>> wrote:
Sure! Are you in Hong Kong? This week I'm on US east coast time and could do an 
evening call (US time) later in the week. December 15th through January 7 I'll 
be on central Europe time.

I can show the current workflow I've been using for vectorizing NetBeans icons 
so far, and give you an idea of the work involved.

If others are interested in joining, feel free to chime in. (We can write a 
summary for the mailing list afterwards.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Sent: Sunday, December 5, 2021 12:15 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
We have read the google sheet. Do you have time to have a zoom this week? 
So we can have a jump start 


Thanks
From Peter
____
From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2021 1:11 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter.

Fantastic! I'm happy to join a chat--it would be good to include anyone else on 
this list who is interested as well.

For actual decision-making, discussions should happen on the email list, so 
that everyone can follow along. But a Zoom meeting might be good for a quick 
overview.

The style guide that was used for the first 50 icons is described on 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 . The original discussion 
around this can be found at https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2387 . (If 
helpful, I could add some example images to the style guide and perhaps pull it 
out of the JIRA issue and into a separate Confluence page.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 9:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi Eirik
We definitely want to help out for the icons. What style you want? How 
about I line up our designers with you for a meeting?
Thanks
From Peter

From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 1:50 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org> 
mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>>
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter!

There is one big theme-related task which is pending, which is to create new 
SVG versions of various bitmap icons in the IDE, for modern Retina/HiDPI 
screens. I did the first 50 (in Adobe Illustrator), and picked out the next 
ones to be prioritized, as you can see here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U_pj-I3hk9Wj_7lvHcUDsZfFfBSyCkSGqBuv0qt_qXw/edit#gid=812179705
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617

If you are interested in helping with the icon drawling effort, I'd be happy to 
help coordinate.

As for the Look & Feel, I think NetBeans will now be switching to FlatLAF as 
the default on all 3 operating systems (Windows, Linux, MacOS). I just 
transitioned my own NetBeans Platform application to FlatLAF, and it's a very 
good basis for making NetBeans look good in the future. It's also very 
configurable, so I think alternative themes can be implemented by means of 
configuring and improving FlatLAF, rather than by creating a completely new 
Swing LAF.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz mailto:christian.l...@gmx.net>>
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2021 11:31 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org>
Subject: AW: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hey Peter,

great to have you on board already. We are discussing to add the Flat LaF as a 
default theme to NetBeans which is already implement

RE: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted (JavaFX)

[Eirik Bakke]

Better to use FlatLAF themes for this--no big re-architecting necessary. I 
spent a weekend theming my own NetBeans Platform app using FlatLAF, and it was 
a quite pleasant experience.

(There's probably a million lines of Swing code in NetBeans... "transitioning" 
to JavaFX would be akin to deloping an entirely new IDE. Even IntelliJ is all 
Swing.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Tuesday, December 7, 2021 7:58 AM
To: Netbeans Developer List 
Subject: Re: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted (JavaFX)

I know this is a grander, not a short term thing, and a little out of scope 
here but would transition the UI of Netbeans from Swing to JavaFX based with 
its own (css) theme paradigm be of value?

Eric Bresie
ebre...@gmail.com (mailto:ebre...@gmail.com)

> On December 6, 2021 at 2:00:47 AM CST, Geertjan Wielenga 
>  (mailto:geertjan.wiele...@googlemail.com.invalid)> wrote:
> Great, progress! Yes, a report to this mailing list would be great to 
> keep everyone informed.
>
> Gj
>
> On Mon, 6 Dec 2021 at 07:27, Eirik Bakke  (mailto:eba...@ultorg.com)> wrote:
>
> > Sure! Are you in Hong Kong? This week I'm on US east coast time and 
> > could do an evening call (US time) later in the week. December 15th 
> > (x-apple-data-detectors://6) through January 7 (x-apple-data-detectors://7) 
> > I'll be on central Europe time.
> >
> > I can show the current workflow I've been using for vectorizing 
> > NetBeans icons so far, and give you an idea of the work involved.
> >
> > If others are interested in joining, feel free to chime in. (We can 
> > write a summary for the mailing list afterwards.)
> >
> > -- Eirik
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Peter Cheung  > (mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com)>
> > Sent: Sunday, December 5, 2021 12:15 PM
> > To: dev@netbeans.apache.org (mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org)
> > Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted
> >
> > Dear Eirik
> > We have read the google sheet. Do you have time to have a zoom this 
> > week? So we can have a jump start 
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> > From Peter
> > 
> > From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com)>
> > Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2021 1:11 AM
> > To: dev@netbeans.apache.org (mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org) 
> > mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org)>
> > Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted
> >
> > Hi, Peter.
> >
> > Fantastic! I'm happy to join a chat--it would be good to include 
> > anyone else on this list who is interested as well.
> >
> > For actual decision-making, discussions should happen on the email 
> > list, so that everyone can follow along. But a Zoom meeting might be 
> > good for a quick overview.
> >
> > The style guide that was used for the first 50 icons is described on
> > https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 . The original 
> > discussion around this can be found at
> > https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2387 . (If helpful, I could 
> > add some example images to the style guide and perhaps pull it out 
> > of the JIRA issue and into a separate Confluence page.)
> >
> > -- Eirik
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Peter Cheung  > (mailto:mcheun...@hotmail.com)>
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 9:18 AM
> > To: dev@netbeans.apache.org (mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org)
> > Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted
> >
> > Hi Eirik
> > We definitely want to help out for the icons. What style you want? 
> > How about I line up our designers with you for a meeting?
> > Thanks
> > From Peter
> > 
> > From: Eirik Bakke mailto:eba...@ultorg.com)>
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 1:50 AM
> > To: dev@netbeans.apache.org (mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org) 
> > mailto:dev@netbeans.apache.org)>
> > Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted
> >
> > Hi, Peter!
> >
> > There is one big theme-related task which is pending, which is to 
> > create new SVG versions of various bitmap icons in the IDE, for 
> > modern Retina/HiDPI screens. I did the first 50 (in Adobe 
> > Illustrator), and picked out the next ones to be prioritized, as you can 
> > see here:
> >
> >
> > https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_2
> > 10604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png
> >
> > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U_pj-I3hk9Wj_7lvHcUDsZfFfBSy
> > CkSGqBuv0qt_qXw/edit#gid=812179705
&g

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Sure! Are you in Hong Kong? This week I'm on US east coast time and could do an 
evening call (US time) later in the week. December 15th through January 7 I'll 
be on central Europe time.

I can show the current workflow I've been using for vectorizing NetBeans icons 
so far, and give you an idea of the work involved.

If others are interested in joining, feel free to chime in. (We can write a 
summary for the mailing list afterwards.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung  
Sent: Sunday, December 5, 2021 12:15 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear Eirik
We have read the google sheet. Do you have time to have a zoom this week? 
So we can have a jump start 


Thanks
From Peter

From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2021 1:11 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter.

Fantastic! I'm happy to join a chat--it would be good to include anyone else on 
this list who is interested as well.

For actual decision-making, discussions should happen on the email list, so 
that everyone can follow along. But a Zoom meeting might be good for a quick 
overview.

The style guide that was used for the first 50 icons is described on 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 . The original discussion 
around this can be found at https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2387 . (If 
helpful, I could add some example images to the style guide and perhaps pull it 
out of the JIRA issue and into a separate Confluence page.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung 
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 9:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi Eirik
We definitely want to help out for the icons. What style you want? How 
about I line up our designers with you for a meeting?
Thanks
From Peter

From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 1:50 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter!

There is one big theme-related task which is pending, which is to create new 
SVG versions of various bitmap icons in the IDE, for modern Retina/HiDPI 
screens. I did the first 50 (in Adobe Illustrator), and picked out the next 
ones to be prioritized, as you can see here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U_pj-I3hk9Wj_7lvHcUDsZfFfBSyCkSGqBuv0qt_qXw/edit#gid=812179705
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617

If you are interested in helping with the icon drawling effort, I'd be happy to 
help coordinate.

As for the Look & Feel, I think NetBeans will now be switching to FlatLAF as 
the default on all 3 operating systems (Windows, Linux, MacOS). I just 
transitioned my own NetBeans Platform application to FlatLAF, and it's a very 
good basis for making NetBeans look good in the future. It's also very 
configurable, so I think alternative themes can be implemented by means of 
configuring and improving FlatLAF, rather than by creating a completely new 
Swing LAF.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz 
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2021 11:31 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hey Peter,

great to have you on board already. We are discussing to add the Flat LaF as a 
default theme to NetBeans which is already implemented, but we need to switch 
to it.

What I can say what we need is a designer for maybe new UI components. Some 
components in NetBeans can be combined into one for example Input + button to 
search for paths etc.
Some other parts need a redesign and also proposals. So let us know, what you 
think to change in NetBeans and show us some examples and let us discuss about 
it .


Cheers

Chris

Von: Peter Cheung
Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. November 2021 04:38
An: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Betreff: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear All
 My name is Peter, from Quantr Limited. I love Netbeans and have been 
developed few plugins for it. This proves my ambition in Netbeans.

https://gitlab.com/quantr/toolchain/netbeans-verilog
https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/netbeans-quick-outline
https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/MavenRunner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDFkhrHxHMw

Many people said VSCode and intelliJ looks fancier than Netbeans. We want 
to contribute our power to theme the netbeans, my company has two designers. 
Below are some of their artworks I have experience in java swing styling, I did 
developer a L ten years ago https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/peter-swing

Netbeans is very complex piece of code, we want team members to

  1.  Guide us, instruct us
  2.  Comment the style
  3.  Help us when we meet trouble in code
  4.  Coding


https://xd.adobe.com/view/9d702288-c88d-4253-

RE: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

[Eirik Bakke]

> We need more options for that.

More options is fine--in the existing Options dialog! I was just pointing out 
that it shouldn't be in a dialog on startup.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz  
Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2021 5:05 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

Ans also at the end, if we can’t find a solution, just ask the community about 
where we should add it with a vote.

Von: Christian Lenz
Gesendet: Sonntag, 28. November 2021 11:03
An: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Betreff: AW: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

Defaults are not working for everyone. Everyone is different as we can see in 
the discussions. Everytime they say: yes we make them as default, a lot of 
people are complaining and didn’t get heard. We need more options for that. And 
for this discussion we already have options, now we need to check where does it 
make sense. We are talking about developer experience and yes the installer ist 
not the right place, because we already have portable NetBeans as a zip archive 
w/o any installer and it should work the same.

Von: Eirik Bakke
Gesendet: Samstag, 27. November 2021 16:20
An: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Betreff: RE: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

I'd say, avoid customization in both the installer and on startup. It's a lot 
better to have a robust discussion about defaults here, and then stick to 
whatever we decide.

There are hundreds of options that can be customized, and there is real 
value-add in _not_ requiring the user (especially new users) to know about or 
touch them.

We also don't want a situation where we end up having two different user 
interfaces for setting the same options. A user that changed the LAF from a 
startup dialog or installer would then have to find and use a _different_ user 
interface (the Options dialog) to change it again later.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith 
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2021 4:53 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

On Sat, 27 Nov 2021 at 08:32, Jaroslav Tulach  wrote:
> NetBeans IDE was always keen on to work "out of the box" - e.g. as 
> little dialogs on 1st start as possible. If you want prior launch 
> customization, put it into installer.

But what is the difference?

In general, I agree with you.  This thread has gone on a bit of a tangent, 
which is about a default that works better out of the box.  I don't think we 
need a dialog for this option.  I do think we need to fix up the current 
dialogs, and probably look at putting some of this stuff on a revamped start 
page.

However, the problem with putting options in the installers is the assumption 
that everyone uses them.  And that there's a one-to-one relationship between 
installation and userdir.  Neither applies.
Whatever we do should work however people get hold of and run the IDE.

I also think NBI either needs a lot of work or replacing.  I'm in the latter 
camp, obviously! :-)

Best wishes,

Neil

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org

For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists

RE: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

[Eirik Bakke]

I'd say, avoid customization in both the installer and on startup. It's a lot 
better to have a robust discussion about defaults here, and then stick to 
whatever we decide.

There are hundreds of options that can be customized, and there is real 
value-add in _not_ requiring the user (especially new users) to know about or 
touch them.

We also don't want a situation where we end up having two different user 
interfaces for setting the same options. A user that changed the LAF from a 
startup dialog or installer would then have to find and use a _different_ user 
interface (the Options dialog) to change it again later.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2021 4:53 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

On Sat, 27 Nov 2021 at 08:32, Jaroslav Tulach  wrote:
> NetBeans IDE was always keen on to work "out of the box" - e.g. as 
> little dialogs on 1st start as possible. If you want prior launch 
> customization, put it into installer.

But what is the difference?

In general, I agree with you.  This thread has gone on a bit of a tangent, 
which is about a default that works better out of the box.  I don't think we 
need a dialog for this option.  I do think we need to fix up the current 
dialogs, and probably look at putting some of this stuff on a revamped start 
page.

However, the problem with putting options in the installers is the assumption 
that everyone uses them.  And that there's a one-to-one relationship between 
installation and userdir.  Neither applies.
Whatever we do should work however people get hold of and run the IDE.

I also think NBI either needs a lot of work or replacing.  I'm in the latter 
camp, obviously! :-)

Best wishes,

Neil

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org

For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Hi, Peter.

Fantastic! I'm happy to join a chat--it would be good to include anyone else on 
this list who is interested as well.

For actual decision-making, discussions should happen on the email list, so 
that everyone can follow along. But a Zoom meeting might be good for a quick 
overview.

The style guide that was used for the first 50 icons is described on 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 . The original discussion 
around this can be found at https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2387 . (If 
helpful, I could add some example images to the style guide and perhaps pull it 
out of the JIRA issue and into a separate Confluence page.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Peter Cheung  
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 9:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi Eirik
We definitely want to help out for the icons. What style you want? How 
about I line up our designers with you for a meeting?
Thanks
From Peter

From: Eirik Bakke 
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2021 1:50 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org 
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter!

There is one big theme-related task which is pending, which is to create new 
SVG versions of various bitmap icons in the IDE, for modern Retina/HiDPI 
screens. I did the first 50 (in Adobe Illustrator), and picked out the next 
ones to be prioritized, as you can see here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U_pj-I3hk9Wj_7lvHcUDsZfFfBSyCkSGqBuv0qt_qXw/edit#gid=812179705
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617

If you are interested in helping with the icon drawling effort, I'd be happy to 
help coordinate.

As for the Look & Feel, I think NetBeans will now be switching to FlatLAF as 
the default on all 3 operating systems (Windows, Linux, MacOS). I just 
transitioned my own NetBeans Platform application to FlatLAF, and it's a very 
good basis for making NetBeans look good in the future. It's also very 
configurable, so I think alternative themes can be implemented by means of 
configuring and improving FlatLAF, rather than by creating a completely new 
Swing LAF.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz 
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2021 11:31 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hey Peter,

great to have you on board already. We are discussing to add the Flat LaF as a 
default theme to NetBeans which is already implemented, but we need to switch 
to it.

What I can say what we need is a designer for maybe new UI components. Some 
components in NetBeans can be combined into one for example Input + button to 
search for paths etc.
Some other parts need a redesign and also proposals. So let us know, what you 
think to change in NetBeans and show us some examples and let us discuss about 
it .


Cheers

Chris

Von: Peter Cheung
Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. November 2021 04:38
An: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Betreff: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear All
 My name is Peter, from Quantr Limited. I love Netbeans and have been 
developed few plugins for it. This proves my ambition in Netbeans.

https://gitlab.com/quantr/toolchain/netbeans-verilog
https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/netbeans-quick-outline
https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/MavenRunner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDFkhrHxHMw

Many people said VSCode and intelliJ looks fancier than Netbeans. We want 
to contribute our power to theme the netbeans, my company has two designers. 
Below are some of their artworks I have experience in java swing styling, I did 
developer a L ten years ago https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/peter-swing

Netbeans is very complex piece of code, we want team members to

  1.  Guide us, instruct us
  2.  Comment the style
  3.  Help us when we meet trouble in code
  4.  Coding


https://xd.adobe.com/view/9d702288-c88d-4253-96b8-e81013f51b1d-c823/
https://xd.adobe.com/view/3327f9a4-7128-4181-80ca-f276843f48ad-6674/
https://xd.adobe.com/view/daef7604-73a6-47c8-8f6f-d1888e1038f9-8fbc/

Hope to see a reply !!!

Thanks
From Peter

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Credit correction--I did not do the first 50 SVG icons alone--Pete Whelpton 
also did a bunch in the editor toolbar! =D

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eirik Bakke  
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2021 12:51 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hi, Peter!

There is one big theme-related task which is pending, which is to create new 
SVG versions of various bitmap icons in the IDE, for modern Retina/HiDPI 
screens. I did the first 50 (in Adobe Illustrator), and picked out the next 
ones to be prioritized, as you can see here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U_pj-I3hk9Wj_7lvHcUDsZfFfBSyCkSGqBuv0qt_qXw/edit#gid=812179705
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617

If you are interested in helping with the icon drawling effort, I'd be happy to 
help coordinate.

As for the Look & Feel, I think NetBeans will now be switching to FlatLAF as 
the default on all 3 operating systems (Windows, Linux, MacOS). I just 
transitioned my own NetBeans Platform application to FlatLAF, and it's a very 
good basis for making NetBeans look good in the future. It's also very 
configurable, so I think alternative themes can be implemented by means of 
configuring and improving FlatLAF, rather than by creating a completely new 
Swing LAF.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz  
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2021 11:31 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hey Peter,

great to have you on board already. We are discussing to add the Flat LaF as a 
default theme to NetBeans which is already implemented, but we need to switch 
to it.

What I can say what we need is a designer for maybe new UI components. Some 
components in NetBeans can be combined into one for example Input + button to 
search for paths etc.
Some other parts need a redesign and also proposals. So let us know, what you 
think to change in NetBeans and show us some examples and let us discuss about 
it .


Cheers

Chris

Von: Peter Cheung
Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. November 2021 04:38
An: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Betreff: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear All
 My name is Peter, from Quantr Limited. I love Netbeans and have been 
developed few plugins for it. This proves my ambition in Netbeans.

https://gitlab.com/quantr/toolchain/netbeans-verilog
https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/netbeans-quick-outline
https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/MavenRunner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDFkhrHxHMw

Many people said VSCode and intelliJ looks fancier than Netbeans. We want 
to contribute our power to theme the netbeans, my company has two designers. 
Below are some of their artworks I have experience in java swing styling, I did 
developer a L ten years ago https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/peter-swing

Netbeans is very complex piece of code, we want team members to

  1.  Guide us, instruct us
  2.  Comment the style
  3.  Help us when we meet trouble in code
  4.  Coding


https://xd.adobe.com/view/9d702288-c88d-4253-96b8-e81013f51b1d-c823/
https://xd.adobe.com/view/3327f9a4-7128-4181-80ca-f276843f48ad-6674/
https://xd.adobe.com/view/daef7604-73a6-47c8-8f6f-d1888e1038f9-8fbc/

Hope to see a reply !!!

Thanks
From Peter

RE: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

[Eirik Bakke]

Hi, Peter!

There is one big theme-related task which is pending, which is to create new 
SVG versions of various bitmap icons in the IDE, for modern Retina/HiDPI 
screens. I did the first 50 (in Adobe Illustrator), and picked out the next 
ones to be prioritized, as you can see here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13026411/13026411_210604+Icons+Overview+Cropped.png
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U_pj-I3hk9Wj_7lvHcUDsZfFfBSyCkSGqBuv0qt_qXw/edit#gid=812179705
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617

If you are interested in helping with the icon drawling effort, I'd be happy to 
help coordinate.

As for the Look & Feel, I think NetBeans will now be switching to FlatLAF as 
the default on all 3 operating systems (Windows, Linux, MacOS). I just 
transitioned my own NetBeans Platform application to FlatLAF, and it's a very 
good basis for making NetBeans look good in the future. It's also very 
configurable, so I think alternative themes can be implemented by means of 
configuring and improving FlatLAF, rather than by creating a completely new 
Swing LAF.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz  
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2021 11:31 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Hey Peter,

great to have you on board already. We are discussing to add the Flat LaF as a 
default theme to NetBeans which is already implemented, but we need to switch 
to it.

What I can say what we need is a designer for maybe new UI components. Some 
components in NetBeans can be combined into one for example Input + button to 
search for paths etc.
Some other parts need a redesign and also proposals. So let us know, what you 
think to change in NetBeans and show us some examples and let us discuss about 
it .


Cheers

Chris

Von: Peter Cheung
Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. November 2021 04:38
An: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Betreff: New theme for netbeans, team member wanted

Dear All
 My name is Peter, from Quantr Limited. I love Netbeans and have been 
developed few plugins for it. This proves my ambition in Netbeans.

https://gitlab.com/quantr/toolchain/netbeans-verilog
https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/netbeans-quick-outline
https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/MavenRunner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDFkhrHxHMw

Many people said VSCode and intelliJ looks fancier than Netbeans. We want 
to contribute our power to theme the netbeans, my company has two designers. 
Below are some of their artworks I have experience in java swing styling, I did 
developer a L ten years ago https://gitlab.com/mcheung63/peter-swing

Netbeans is very complex piece of code, we want team members to

  1.  Guide us, instruct us
  2.  Comment the style
  3.  Help us when we meet trouble in code
  4.  Coding


https://xd.adobe.com/view/9d702288-c88d-4253-96b8-e81013f51b1d-c823/
https://xd.adobe.com/view/3327f9a4-7128-4181-80ca-f276843f48ad-6674/
https://xd.adobe.com/view/daef7604-73a6-47c8-8f6f-d1888e1038f9-8fbc/

Hope to see a reply !!!

Thanks
From Peter

RE: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

[Eirik Bakke]

Perhaps simpler than a dialog would be to just switch to FlatLAF Light for any 
user who has not explicitly touched the LAF setting in the past.

Alternatively, we could switch unconditionally to FlatLAF Light for everyone, 
once only--i.e. leave a flag in the user directory that shows that the forced 
switch has been made and should not be attempted again in the future.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2021 4:44 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

On Tue, 23 Nov 2021 at 02:16, Laszlo Kishalmi  wrote:
> What would be the conclusion of this topic?

Well, my conclusion is that we should be looking to make FlatLaf Light the 
default for everyone with NB 13.  At least judging from comments, and 
(something I think is important) what we seem to be using ourselves.  The only 
-1 here seems to have become a +1 now?

If anyone wants to argue against that reading, please do so.

> Is there someone willing to implement this feature?

I was planning to look at it, which was why I kicked off the discussion.  
Discussions where the person instigating is proposing to do the work are always 
good, although my NetBeans available time has been a bit tied up over the last 
few weeks to follow up! :-)

> If anyone would be interested, probably the best place to implement is
> in: nb/o.n.upgrader

That's an interesting one.  I've already looked at a few places this could be 
implemented, but not even looked at that one.  Why there?  If in terms of an 
initial dialog, then I think we should consider startup options as a different 
task - bit chicken and egg.

I think there's a question whether this should be in the platform or nb cluster 
too?  If in the former, need to make sure it's optional still though.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

[Eirik Bakke]

> There is also almost no use of native system-L anymore - every single app 
> looks different these days.

This is actually true--not even Microsoft Office follows the standard scheme 
with e.g. checkboxes and buttons. MacOS does have its own distinct design, 
though it frequently changes as new OS versions come out. And I just upgraded 
to Windows 11, and saw several things in the Windows LAF that would need 
tweaking (too dark scrollbars, hard-to-see checkbox checkmarks).

I'm now convinced that FlatLAF is the way to go for all platforms. It'll be a 
lot easier to do improvements and tweaks to FlatLAF, since it's very 
configurable and maintained by a NetBeans committer (Karl Tauber/DevCharly). 
And it's one LAF to maintain instead of three or four. And dark mode was never 
going to work with the Aqua or Windows LAFs from JDK in any case.

I also looked at DevCharly's latest FlatLAF developments, and behold, there's 
already a patch to make certain components look more platform-appropriate: 
https://github.com/JFormDesigner/FlatLaf/pull/414

I think this is the way to go--use FlatLAF on all platforms, but (eventually) 
introduce a few specific tweaks and configuration changes to blend in with the 
local OS.

So I think now:
+1 to change NetBeans' default to FlatLAF (on all platforms)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Josh Juneau  
Sent: Tuesday, November 2, 2021 6:42 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Cc: Ernie Rael 
Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

+1…I still use Darcula on OS X, but the flatlaf dark is also nice.  

Josh Juneau
juneau...@gmail.com
http://jj-blogger.blogspot.com
https://www.apress.com/us/search?query=Juneau

> On Nov 2, 2021, at 5:23 PM, Michael Bien  wrote:
> 
> the dialog would have to restart NB after the theme selection. I think it 
> would look better if the main window wasn't opened yet.
> 
> 
> -michael
> 
>> On 02.11.21 17:39, Ernie Rael wrote:
>> How about the Start Page, aka Welcome Screen, for basic/initial/beginner 
>> configuration and pointers; and it's always available via "Menu > Help > 
>> StartPage".
>> 
>> -ernie
>> 
>>> On 11/1/2021 5:53 PM, Eric Bresie wrote:
>>> Would it be worth allowing selection of LAF at install time?  Maybe 
>>> a wizard with other customization (plugins, language, fonts, 
>>> formatting, etc.)?  This may take a page from Intellij but maybe..,
>>> 
>>> On Mon, Nov 1, 2021 at 6:02 PM Mark Eggers 
>>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
 I just played around with FlatLaf Light on Ubuntu 20.04 and 
 NetBeans 12.5
 
 The fonts look much clearer than they have been.
 
 It's "bright", but then I suppose that's what the light version is 
 supposed to be. I'll see how tired my eyes get after a day or so of using.
 
 I can always revert.
 
 It looks reasonable, and I didn't see any color issues that were 
 too bad (maybe a little light on XML comments).
 
 The colors in FlatLaf dark still end up being too "muddied" for day 
 to day use in the editor. That's the curse of being red/green color 
 deficient.
 
 +0 for me.
 
 . . . just my two cents
 /mde/
 
 On 11/1/2021 11:04 AM, Mark Eggers wrote:
> -0 on this.
> 
> I am red/green color deficient. I've tried using FlatLaf several 
> times, and I just could not get the color selection to work where 
> everything was different and yet easy for me to read.
> 
> I'll try again on 12.5, but for now I've stuck with the Windows 
> LAF for my Windows systems and Nimbus (don't laugh) for my GtK 
> systems due to some font scaling issues.
> 
> I'll try FlatLaf with 12.5 on Ubuntu 20.04 to see how it goes, but 
> Nimbus seems to work fine for me at the moment.
> 
> Changing the default is not an issue with me since I currently do 
> it anyway. About the only issue with changing away from FlatLaf is 
> that I have to change the editor LAF separately from the IDE LAF 
> (last time I tried).
> 
> I'm mostly a systems admin / architect these days so my NetBeans 
> usage centers around proof of concepts and tracking down memory 
> leaks in Java web applications.
> 
> In short, I'm more of a casual user at this point.
> 
> . . . . just my two cents
> /mde/
> 
> Thanks for a great platform, and hopefully one day soon I'll 
> actually be able to contribute.
> 
> On 11/1/2021 7:56 AM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
>> +1 on this one. Maybe if we could even the installer should be on
>> FlatLaf (right now on GTK with dark schema, the license agreement 
>> text is white over white, need to select it to be able to read 
>> that.)
>> 
>> I use FlatLaf Light for the release versions and FlatLaf Dark on 
>> the dev builds.
>> 
>> On 11/1/21 07:01, Neil C Smith wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> So, now we've branched off 12.6, and we know that the next 
>>> release will 

RE: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

[Eirik Bakke]

Perhaps if there's a lot of people who prefer the platform-specific LAFs, other 
than myself. But otherwise I'd say just go with FlatLAF, and leave the 
customization to the Preferences dialog.

There's something nice about NetBeans working "out of the box" for beginners, 
with carefully chosen defaults. And the seasoned users are going to visit the 
Preferences in any case.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Monday, November 1, 2021 8:53 PM
To: Netbeans Developer List 
Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

Would it be worth allowing selection of LAF at install time?  Maybe a wizard 
with other customization (plugins, language, fonts, formatting, etc.)?  This 
may take a page from Intellij but maybe..,

On Mon, Nov 1, 2021 at 6:02 PM Mark Eggers 
wrote:

> I just played around with FlatLaf Light on Ubuntu 20.04 and NetBeans 
> 12.5
>
> The fonts look much clearer than they have been.
>
> It's "bright", but then I suppose that's what the light version is 
> supposed to be. I'll see how tired my eyes get after a day or so of using.
>
> I can always revert.
>
> It looks reasonable, and I didn't see any color issues that were too 
> bad (maybe a little light on XML comments).
>
> The colors in FlatLaf dark still end up being too "muddied" for day to 
> day use in the editor. That's the curse of being red/green color deficient.
>
> +0 for me.
>
> . . . just my two cents
> /mde/
>
> On 11/1/2021 11:04 AM, Mark Eggers wrote:
> > -0 on this.
> >
> > I am red/green color deficient. I've tried using FlatLaf several 
> > times, and I just could not get the color selection to work where 
> > everything was different and yet easy for me to read.
> >
> > I'll try again on 12.5, but for now I've stuck with the Windows LAF 
> > for my Windows systems and Nimbus (don't laugh) for my GtK systems 
> > due to some font scaling issues.
> >
> > I'll try FlatLaf with 12.5 on Ubuntu 20.04 to see how it goes, but 
> > Nimbus seems to work fine for me at the moment.
> >
> > Changing the default is not an issue with me since I currently do it 
> > anyway. About the only issue with changing away from FlatLaf is that 
> > I have to change the editor LAF separately from the IDE LAF (last 
> > time I tried).
> >
> > I'm mostly a systems admin / architect these days so my NetBeans 
> > usage centers around proof of concepts and tracking down memory 
> > leaks in Java web applications.
> >
> > In short, I'm more of a casual user at this point.
> >
> > . . . . just my two cents
> > /mde/
> >
> > Thanks for a great platform, and hopefully one day soon I'll 
> > actually be able to contribute.
> >
> > On 11/1/2021 7:56 AM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
> >> +1 on this one. Maybe if we could even the installer should be on
> >> FlatLaf (right now on GTK with dark schema, the license agreement 
> >> text is white over white, need to select it to be able to read 
> >> that.)
> >>
> >> I use FlatLaf Light for the release versions and FlatLaf Dark on 
> >> the dev builds.
> >>
> >> On 11/1/21 07:01, Neil C Smith wrote:
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> So, now we've branched off 12.6, and we know that the next release 
> >>> will be NetBeans 13, require JDK 11+, and hopefully ship with 
> >>> nb-javac included .. is it time we changed (improved?! :-) ) how 
> >>> NetBeans looks out of the box too?
> >>>
> >>> Should we consider FlatLaf (light or dark) as the default look and 
> >>> feel from NetBeans 13?
> >>>
> >>> This is partly prompted by working through a few JIRA tickets with 
> >>> HiDPI issues resolved by switching, a few snarky social media 
> >>> comments about NetBeans' appearance I've seen recently where the 
> >>> go-to replies seem to just be to tell people to switch to FlatLaf 
> >>> .. and the fact I'm constantly switching even when debugging 
> >>> because the GTK theme on Ubuntu is borderline unusable.
> >>>
> >>> So, what do you think?  For or against?  Maybe also add what you 
> >>> do use, and light or dark, in a reply - it might make some sense 
> >>> if we defaulted to what the majority of us use in practise?
> >>>
> >>> Best wishes,
> >>>
> >>> Neil
>
> --
Eric Bresie
ebre...@gmail.com

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RE: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

[Eirik Bakke]

> I’m on windows.
Did you see the latest Windows LAF updates? They tidy up a lot of the remaining 
cruft that made the Windows LAF look dated--borders, toolbar draggers, window 
system tabs, default font etc.

> I liked the UI (not the UX) from IntelliJ from the very first time.

Other things aside, I think FlatLAFs resemblence to IntelliJ is a branding 
problem for NetBeans. If FlatLAF becomes the default LAF for NetBeans (or de 
facto default when people post screenshots etc.), then we should try to modify 
it so that NetBeans does not appear to merely copy IntelliJ. The proposal at 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3115 achieves some of this (see 
separate discussion there).

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz  
Sent: Monday, November 1, 2021 4:09 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

I’m on windows. I like flat design so in general the FlatLaF  is exactly what I 
wanted. I liked the UI (not the UX) from IntelliJ from the very first time. I 
also switched to FlatLaF due to the nice dark FlatLaF because we don’t have a 
good default dark one. Foe me all the default NetBeans themes look ugly (not 
nice, etc.). But as I said, it is a matter of taste and not everyone likes flat 
design or material design or fluent design (New one with Windows 10/11).

Von: Eirik Bakke
Gesendet: Montag, 1. November 2021 20:57
An: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Betreff: RE: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

> as Neil said, a lot of people don’t like the Default theme for Windows or mac 
> (me either).

Are each of you on Windows, MacOS, and/or Linux?

The Windows LAF was just overhauled, so more time may be needed to collect 
feedback:
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2967
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3114

(Some recent MacOS/Aqua LAF rendering improvements as well: 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2970 )

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz  
Sent: Monday, November 1, 2021 3:25 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

+1 to make FlatLaF as default. You Always can switch back, if you want, but as 
Neil said, a lot of people don’t like the Default theme for Windows or mac (me 
either). At the end it is a matter of taste. I like dark most but I’m for 
making light Default and you can switch to dark if you want.

I know there was a discussion about to add a dialog at the very first start of 
NetBeans to make some simple stuff like change the LaF to light/dark and some 
other stuff like what IntelliJ do. But I also can create a plugin for this.


Cheers

Chris

Von: Neil C Smith
Gesendet: Montag, 1. November 2021 15:01
An: dev
Betreff: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

Hi,

So, now we've branched off 12.6, and we know that the next release will be 
NetBeans 13, require JDK 11+, and hopefully ship with nb-javac included .. is 
it time we changed (improved?! :-) ) how NetBeans looks out of the box too?

Should we consider FlatLaf (light or dark) as the default look and feel from 
NetBeans 13?

This is partly prompted by working through a few JIRA tickets with HiDPI issues 
resolved by switching, a few snarky social media comments about NetBeans' 
appearance I've seen recently where the go-to replies seem to just be to tell 
people to switch to FlatLaf .. and the fact I'm constantly switching even when 
debugging because the GTK theme on Ubuntu is borderline unusable.

So, what do you think?  For or against?  Maybe also add what you do use, and 
light or dark, in a reply - it might make some sense if we defaulted to what 
the majority of us use in practise?

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

[Eirik Bakke]

> as Neil said, a lot of people don’t like the Default theme for Windows or mac 
> (me either).

Are each of you on Windows, MacOS, and/or Linux?

The Windows LAF was just overhauled, so more time may be needed to collect 
feedback:
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2967
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3114

(Some recent MacOS/Aqua LAF rendering improvements as well: 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2970 )

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz  
Sent: Monday, November 1, 2021 3:25 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

+1 to make FlatLaF as default. You Always can switch back, if you want, but as 
Neil said, a lot of people don’t like the Default theme for Windows or mac (me 
either). At the end it is a matter of taste. I like dark most but I’m for 
making light Default and you can switch to dark if you want.

I know there was a discussion about to add a dialog at the very first start of 
NetBeans to make some simple stuff like change the LaF to light/dark and some 
other stuff like what IntelliJ do. But I also can create a plugin for this.


Cheers

Chris

Von: Neil C Smith
Gesendet: Montag, 1. November 2021 15:01
An: dev
Betreff: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

Hi,

So, now we've branched off 12.6, and we know that the next release will be 
NetBeans 13, require JDK 11+, and hopefully ship with nb-javac included .. is 
it time we changed (improved?! :-) ) how NetBeans looks out of the box too?

Should we consider FlatLaf (light or dark) as the default look and feel from 
NetBeans 13?

This is partly prompted by working through a few JIRA tickets with HiDPI issues 
resolved by switching, a few snarky social media comments about NetBeans' 
appearance I've seen recently where the go-to replies seem to just be to tell 
people to switch to FlatLaf .. and the fact I'm constantly switching even when 
debugging because the GTK theme on Ubuntu is borderline unusable.

So, what do you think?  For or against?  Maybe also add what you do use, and 
light or dark, in a reply - it might make some sense if we defaulted to what 
the majority of us use in practise?

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

[Eirik Bakke]

+1 for changing the default LAF to FlatLAF on Linux
-1 for changing the default LAF to FlatLAF on Windows and MacOS.

We have very good Windows and MacOS LAFs that match the native look of GUI 
widgets (buttons, text fields, toolbars, tabs etc.). This is a big advantage of 
NetBeans compared to IntelliJ and Eclipse.

The Windows and MacOS LAFs also now support HiDPI/Retina screens well, 
including fractional scalings such as 150% on Windows. See the long list of 
related improvements on 
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/HiDPI+%28Retina%29+improvements
 .

One Linux, however, FlatLAF seems to be strictly better than the default GTK 
LAF. In particular, the GTK LAF does not support HiDPI screens well.

There are also some further improvements to FlatLAF proposed on 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3115 , which makes the tabs easier to 
see, and more consistent with other main window borders. (These changes also 
makes NetBeans look less like IntelliJ, which is probably a good thing from a 
brand differentiation perspective. But usability was the main motivation here.)

(Be sure to consider the latest versions--there have been lots of improvements 
in all three LAFs over the past few releases--FlatLAF, Windows, and MacOS. I 
also see that the GTK LAF has had recent changes, e.g. 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-5862 .)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Mark Eggers  
Sent: Monday, November 1, 2021 2:05 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Default to FlatLaf in NetBeans 13?

-0 on this.

I am red/green color deficient. I've tried using FlatLaf several times, and I 
just could not get the color selection to work where everything was different 
and yet easy for me to read.

I'll try again on 12.5, but for now I've stuck with the Windows LAF for my 
Windows systems and Nimbus (don't laugh) for my GtK systems due to some font 
scaling issues.

I'll try FlatLaf with 12.5 on Ubuntu 20.04 to see how it goes, but Nimbus seems 
to work fine for me at the moment.

Changing the default is not an issue with me since I currently do it anyway. 
About the only issue with changing away from FlatLaf is that I have to change 
the editor LAF separately from the IDE LAF (last time I tried).

I'm mostly a systems admin / architect these days so my NetBeans usage centers 
around proof of concepts and tracking down memory leaks in Java web 
applications.

In short, I'm more of a casual user at this point.

. . . . just my two cents
/mde/

Thanks for a great platform, and hopefully one day soon I'll actually be able 
to contribute.

On 11/1/2021 7:56 AM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
> +1 on this one. Maybe if we could even the installer should be on
> FlatLaf (right now on GTK with dark schema, the license agreement text 
> is white over white, need to select it to be able to read that.)
> 
> I use FlatLaf Light for the release versions and FlatLaf Dark on the 
> dev builds.
> 
> On 11/1/21 07:01, Neil C Smith wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> So, now we've branched off 12.6, and we know that the next release 
>> will be NetBeans 13, require JDK 11+, and hopefully ship with 
>> nb-javac included .. is it time we changed (improved?! :-) ) how 
>> NetBeans looks out of the box too?
>>
>> Should we consider FlatLaf (light or dark) as the default look and 
>> feel from NetBeans 13?
>>
>> This is partly prompted by working through a few JIRA tickets with 
>> HiDPI issues resolved by switching, a few snarky social media 
>> comments about NetBeans' appearance I've seen recently where the 
>> go-to replies seem to just be to tell people to switch to FlatLaf .. 
>> and the fact I'm constantly switching even when debugging because the 
>> GTK theme on Ubuntu is borderline unusable.
>>
>> So, what do you think?  For or against?  Maybe also add what you do 
>> use, and light or dark, in a reply - it might make some sense if we 
>> defaulted to what the majority of us use in practise?
>>
>> Best wishes,
>>
>> Neil

RE: Broken refactoring operations

[Eirik Bakke]

Usually I do a clean build of everything after first starting the IDE (mvn 
clean install), and subsequently I rely on Compile-on-Save (using nbjavac until 
recently, but using vanilla javac going forward now). The problems I have seen 
are all after indexing has finished.

Yesterday I actually saw a case again where Go to Symbol failed to find a 
class. I manually opened the java file for the class, and saw a red line under 
the class name "Bundle" in the following code excerpt (indicating that the 
generated Bundle class could not be found):

==
@NbBundle.Messages("CTL_RefreshDerivatives=Refresh Derived Properties")
public void runViewUpdater() {
  mutate(Bundle.CTL_RefreshDerivatives(), false, true, (MutableView view) -> { 
});
}
==

I've had problems like this with NetBeans annotations such as 
@NbBundle.Messages for many years (see 
https://bz.apache.org/netbeans/show_bug.cgi?id=221781 ). Normally the problem 
happens when the annotation is changed and the file saved via compile-on-save, 
but every now and then the failure occurs when the java file for the class is 
changed in other ways, or even when the java file isn't changed at all. In any 
case, whenever this happens, I have to do a clean maven build.

So perhaps the indexing/refactoring problems are actually a result of other 
bugs like the one above, which cause classes to not compile correctly. I bet 
there are several such bugs--not just the one above. For example, I bet bugs 
like https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-531 and 
https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8024694 might also cause background 
indexing to fail in the same way.

> I.e. sometimes some project dependencies aren’t compile yet resulting in some 
> related projects to have unfound class dependencies and shows with red errors

Yeah, I've seen that too. Whenever there are classes with red error badges on 
them--legitimate or not--I would expect indexing to be messed up as well. But I 
believe I have seen cases where indexing was not working even when no errors 
where indicated in the project tree. I'll watch more carefully for these badges 
in the future.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2021 12:06 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Broken refactoring operations

Did the complete projects get built (and index) fully yet?

I recall in some cases (like the whole Netbeans projects) if everything has 
been built and indexed yet (stale state) sometimes things don’t work out 
cleanly (I.e. sometimes some project dependencies aren’t compile yet resulting 
in some related projects to have unfound class dependencies and shows with red 
errors).  Could this be happening here?


On Sun, Aug 29, 2021 at 12:21 PM Eirik Bakke  wrote:

> Nowadays I clear my cache directory frequently, and always use "Go to 
> File" instead of "Go to Symbol", so it's been a few releases since I 
> have observed these bugs. But I can start looking out for them again, 
> and report more detailed information.
>
> There are also some issues with the order in which results are shown 
> in Go to Symbol, which I reported here:
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-3808
> (Should be easy to fix, but I never got around to it. I wonder if 
> something changed with the Go to Symbol action... I seem to remember 
> it worked perfectly in NetBeans 8.2.)
>
> I'm working with maven-based NetBeans Platform modules, a few thousand 
> classes spread over ~25 modules. In some cases there are NetBeans 
> Platform annotations to register actions and such.
>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Eric Bresie 
> Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2021 12:56 PM
> To: Netbeans Developer List 
> Subject: Re: Broken refactoring operations
>
> What is configuration is in use for this (i.e. Netbeans version, Java 
> version, Netbean...About) ?
>
> What project are you using (i.e. how big is it)?  Not sure if maybe 
> this requires a larger project to trigger more indexing behavior but...
>
>1. Running with 12.5 Beta2...
>2. Created a very basic gradle java class with a HelloMain and a
>dependency HelloWorld class with an execute call defined and used
>elsewhere.
>3. Selected the execute method and used "Find Usage" and it seems to
>work.  ..
>4. Refectored (renamed)  "execute" method to "run" method and it seems
>to work
>5. Created a very basic maven java class, copied the HelloWorld class
>from gradle to maven project which open Refactor dialog
>6. Refactor preview showed what was to occur (i.e. change package from
>old to new)
>7. Do Refactor executed successfully
>8. Shift-Alt-O opens dialog and starts looking

RE: Broken refactoring operations

[Eirik Bakke]

Nowadays I clear my cache directory frequently, and always use "Go to File" 
instead of "Go to Symbol", so it's been a few releases since I have observed 
these bugs. But I can start looking out for them again, and report more 
detailed information.

There are also some issues with the order in which results are shown in Go to 
Symbol, which I reported here:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-3808
(Should be easy to fix, but I never got around to it. I wonder if something 
changed with the Go to Symbol action... I seem to remember it worked perfectly 
in NetBeans 8.2.)

I'm working with maven-based NetBeans Platform modules, a few thousand classes 
spread over ~25 modules. In some cases there are NetBeans Platform annotations 
to register actions and such.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Bresie  
Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2021 12:56 PM
To: Netbeans Developer List 
Subject: Re: Broken refactoring operations

What is configuration is in use for this (i.e. Netbeans version, Java version, 
Netbean...About) ?

What project are you using (i.e. how big is it)?  Not sure if maybe this 
requires a larger project to trigger more indexing behavior but...

   1. Running with 12.5 Beta2...
   2. Created a very basic gradle java class with a HelloMain and a
   dependency HelloWorld class with an execute call defined and used
   elsewhere.
   3. Selected the execute method and used "Find Usage" and it seems to
   work.  ..
   4. Refectored (renamed)  "execute" method to "run" method and it seems
   to work
   5. Created a very basic maven java class, copied the HelloWorld class
   from gradle to maven project which open Refactor dialog
   6. Refactor preview showed what was to occur (i.e. change package from
   old to new)
   7. Do Refactor executed successfully
   8. Shift-Alt-O opens dialog and starts looking for "HelloWorld" which
   shows both projects versions of it.

Possible Unrelated documentation issues,

   1. When selected Find Usage on a given class, the dialog shows the below
   2. Find out more" takes to
   
https://netbeans.apache.org/wiki/Find_Usages_in_Compiled_Dependencies.asciidoc
   (not html version) and the pages does not exist.
   3. Not sure if the site didn't get built correctly recently, the page is
   no longer available or the dialog needs to be updated to someplace else.


Warning: Disclaimer: Searching for usages in compiled dependencies has certain 
limitations. Find out more.
<http://wiki.netbeans.org/Find_Usages_in_Compiled_Dependencies>

Eric Bresie
ebre...@gmail.com


On Fri, Aug 27, 2021 at 3:42 PM Eirik Bakke  wrote:

> (Starting a new thread as suggested by Geertjan...)
>
> I have seen broken refactoring operations as well. Most notably, "Find 
> Usages" on a Java method will sometimes miss call sites. I have also 
> seen methods and classes missing when searching from the Go to Symbol dialog.
> Probably the same underlying cause. I don't know how to reproduce 
> this, however.
>
> For comparison, NetBeans 8.4 (pre-Apache, and with Java 8) was always 
> completely reliable.
>
> Exiting the IDE, deleting the cache directory, and starting the IDE 
> again have always fixed these problems for me. So I suspect indexing 
> errors are the cause.
>
> I used to see a lot of error messages relating to the IDE not being 
> able to parse a java file, although in later releases things have 
> gotten a lot better. I also have high hopes that the new "vanilla 
> indexing" system (Java indexing without the nb-javac plugin) may improve 
> things.
>
> All of my projects are Maven-based NetBeans Platform module projects, 
> with Compile-on-Save enabled.
>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Geertjan Wielenga 
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2021 10:12 AM
> To: dev 
> Subject: Re: VSCode
>
> Start a new thread on it and point to the specific issues, or create 
> new ones with steps to reproduce (I use NetBeans regularly including 
> refactoring, would like to see these issues), let's get it fixed.
>
> Gj
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Ty Young 
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2021 10:09 AM
> To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
> Subject: Re: VSCode
>
> Just going to point out that refactoring(renaming methods, others) on 
> Netbeans is still broken... as it has been for years.
>

Broken refactoring operations

[Eirik Bakke]

(Starting a new thread as suggested by Geertjan...)

I have seen broken refactoring operations as well. Most notably, "Find Usages" 
on a Java method will sometimes miss call sites. I have also seen methods and 
classes missing when searching from the Go to Symbol dialog. Probably the same 
underlying cause. I don't know how to reproduce this, however.

For comparison, NetBeans 8.4 (pre-Apache, and with Java 8) was always 
completely reliable.

Exiting the IDE, deleting the cache directory, and starting the IDE again have 
always fixed these problems for me. So I suspect indexing errors are the cause.

I used to see a lot of error messages relating to the IDE not being able to 
parse a java file, although in later releases things have gotten a lot better. 
I also have high hopes that the new "vanilla indexing" system (Java indexing 
without the nb-javac plugin) may improve things.

All of my projects are Maven-based NetBeans Platform module projects, with 
Compile-on-Save enabled.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Monday, August 16, 2021 10:12 AM
To: dev 
Subject: Re: VSCode

Start a new thread on it and point to the specific issues, or create new ones 
with steps to reproduce (I use NetBeans regularly including refactoring, would 
like to see these issues), let's get it fixed.

Gj

-Original Message-
From: Ty Young  
Sent: Monday, August 16, 2021 10:09 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: VSCode

Just going to point out that refactoring(renaming methods, others) on Netbeans 
is still broken... as it has been for years.

RE: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

[Eirik Bakke]

I experienced some other deadlocks in NetBeans 12.4 before, but only on 
startup. After examining the thread dumps I can't immediately see if they are 
the same bug or not (they could very well be a separate bug). In any case, I 
uploaded those thread dumps here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-5914

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2021 5:20 PM
To: dev 
Subject: Re: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

>
> Whenever I see an intermittent bug like this, though, my instinct is 
> to avoid changing my configuration, in case the bug stops being reproducible.
> Then I will never know what caused it, or when it will return...
>

Very interesting perspective. Never thought of it like that -- though it would 
help if it could be narrowed down some other way though.

Gj


On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 5:17 PM Eirik Bakke  wrote:

> > However, I'm still of the view that trying to reproduce with a
> non-distro JDK build is useful.  I've had distro builds that behave 
> differently, crash in odd places, and even manage to run more than one 
> EDT at the same time.
>
> Ah, OK. I can see that it would be ideal to see thread dumps with the 
> crash from a "vanilla" OpenJDK or Zulu distribution.
>
> Whenever I see an intermittent bug like this, though, my instinct is 
> to avoid changing my configuration, in case the bug stops being reproducible.
> Then I will never know what caused it, or when it will return...
>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Neil C Smith 
> Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2021 4:25 PM
> To: dev 
> Subject: Re: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1
>
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 15:09, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
> >
> > But if the problem goes away with a different JDK, that doesn't mean 
> > the
> bug is in the JDK--it just means the bug cannot be reproduced.
> >
> > For example, if two different NetBeans threads acquire nested locks 
> > in opposite order, that would be a deadlock bug-
>
> True, and pointed out one possible sign of that happening already.
>
> However, I'm still of the view that trying to reproduce with a 
> non-distro JDK build is useful.  I've had distro builds that behave 
> differently, crash in odd places, and even manage to run more than one EDT at 
> the same time.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>

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RE: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

[Eirik Bakke]

> However, I'm still of the view that trying to reproduce with a non-distro JDK 
> build is useful.  I've had distro builds that behave differently, crash in 
> odd places, and even manage to run more than one EDT at the same time.

Ah, OK. I can see that it would be ideal to see thread dumps with the crash 
from a "vanilla" OpenJDK or Zulu distribution.

Whenever I see an intermittent bug like this, though, my instinct is to avoid 
changing my configuration, in case the bug stops being reproducible. Then I 
will never know what caused it, or when it will return...

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2021 4:25 PM
To: dev 
Subject: Re: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 15:09, Eirik Bakke  wrote:
>
> But if the problem goes away with a different JDK, that doesn't mean the bug 
> is in the JDK--it just means the bug cannot be reproduced.
>
> For example, if two different NetBeans threads acquire nested locks in 
> opposite order, that would be a deadlock bug-

True, and pointed out one possible sign of that happening already.

However, I'm still of the view that trying to reproduce with a non-distro JDK 
build is useful.  I've had distro builds that behave differently, crash in odd 
places, and even manage to run more than one EDT at the same time.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

[Eirik Bakke]

But if the problem goes away with a different JDK, that doesn't mean the bug is 
in the JDK--it just means the bug cannot be reproduced. 

For example, if two different NetBeans threads acquire nested locks in opposite 
order, that would be a deadlock bug--but the actual deadlock would only occur 
if those two critical sections happen to run at exactly the same time. But it 
would be a bug which should be fixed in NetBeans in any case.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2021 3:58 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

To exclude it from the equation, especially since the problem can’t be 
localized thus far.

Gj

On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 15:56, Eirik Bakke  wrote:

> Why is it useful to try a different JDK here? See my earlier comment.
>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Geertjan Wielenga 
> Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2021 3:29 PM
> To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
> Subject: Re: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1
>
> Could you, please, see if the problem continues to occur when you use 
> a few different JDKs?
>
> Gj
>
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 15:24, Chris Wareham 
> wrote:
>
> > Hi Geertjan,
> >
> > None of my projects use Micronaut, they are all Spring Boot based. 
> > If I do a:
> >
> > mvn -DincludeScope=runtime dependency:tree
> >
> > Then no Micronaut dependencies are showing up.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Chris
> >
> > On 11/08/2021 12:13, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > > Looks like you’re doing something with Micronaut?
> > >
> > > Gj
> > >
> > > On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 13:08, Neil C Smith 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 11:28, Chris Wareham 
> > >> 
> > >> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> OK, I've just had another lock up. I wasn't able to get a thread 
> > >>> dump with jstack, even using the -F flag, but succeeded with 
> > >>> VisualVM. I've created a Jira issue and attached both the thread 
> > >>> dump and log file to
> > >> it:
> > >>>
> > >>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-5913
> > >>
> > >> Can you describe (here and/or in issue) roughly what you were 
> > >> doing at the moment it locked up?
> > >>
> > >> This seems curious ?
> > >>
> > >> "AWT-EventQueue-0" #21 prio=6 os_prio=0 cpu=7380.14ms 
> > >> elapsed=307.91s
> > >> tid=0x7f5c54163000 nid=0x22b2 waiting on condition 
> > >> [0x7f5c60441000]
> > >> java.lang.Thread.State: WAITING (parking)
> > >>  at 
> > >> jdk.internal.misc.Unsafe.park(java.base@11.0.12/Native
> > Method)
> > >>  - parking to wait for  <0x00070dd6c7b0> (a
> > >> java.util.concurrent.locks.ReentrantLock$FairSync)
> > >>  at
> > java.util.concurrent.locks.LockSupport.park(java.base@11.0.12
> > >> /LockSupport.java:194)
> > >>  at
> > >>
> > java.util.concurrent.locks.AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.parkAndCheckIn
> > te
> > rrupt(java.base@11.0.12
> > >> /AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.java:885)
> > >>  at
> > >>
> > java.util.concurrent.locks.AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.acquireQueued(
> > ja
> > va.base@11.0.12
> > >> /AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.java:917)
> > >>  at
> > >>
> > java.util.concurrent.locks.AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.acquire(java.b
> > as
> > e@11.0.12
> > >> /AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.java:1240)
> > >>  at
> > java.util.concurrent.locks.ReentrantLock.lock(java.base@11.0.12
> > >> /ReentrantLock.java:267)
> > >>  at
> > >>
> > org.netbeans.modules.parsing.impl.TaskProcessor.runUserTask(TaskProc
> > es
> > sor.java:170)
> > >>  at
> > >>
> > org.netbeans.modules.parsing.api.ParserManager.parse(ParserManager.j
> > av
> > a:81)
> > >>  at
> > >>
> > org.netbeans.api.java.source.JavaSource.runUserActionTaskImpl(JavaSo
> > ur
> > ce.java:452)
> > >>  at
> > >>
> > org.netbeans.api.java.source.JavaSource.runUserActionTask(JavaSource
> > .j
> > ava:423)
> > >>  at
> > >>
> > org.netbeans.modules.micronaut.hyperlink.MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvi
>

RE: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

[Eirik Bakke]

Why is it useful to try a different JDK here? See my earlier comment.

-- Eirik 

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2021 3:29 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

Could you, please, see if the problem continues to occur when you use a few 
different JDKs?

Gj

On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 15:24, Chris Wareham  wrote:

> Hi Geertjan,
>
> None of my projects use Micronaut, they are all Spring Boot based. If 
> I do a:
>
> mvn -DincludeScope=runtime dependency:tree
>
> Then no Micronaut dependencies are showing up.
>
> Regards,
>
> Chris
>
> On 11/08/2021 12:13, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > Looks like you’re doing something with Micronaut?
> >
> > Gj
> >
> > On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 13:08, Neil C Smith 
> wrote:
> >
> >> On Wed, 11 Aug 2021 at 11:28, Chris Wareham 
> >> 
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> OK, I've just had another lock up. I wasn't able to get a thread 
> >>> dump with jstack, even using the -F flag, but succeeded with 
> >>> VisualVM. I've created a Jira issue and attached both the thread 
> >>> dump and log file to
> >> it:
> >>>
> >>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-5913
> >>
> >> Can you describe (here and/or in issue) roughly what you were doing 
> >> at the moment it locked up?
> >>
> >> This seems curious ?
> >>
> >> "AWT-EventQueue-0" #21 prio=6 os_prio=0 cpu=7380.14ms 
> >> elapsed=307.91s
> >> tid=0x7f5c54163000 nid=0x22b2 waiting on condition 
> >> [0x7f5c60441000]
> >> java.lang.Thread.State: WAITING (parking)
> >>  at jdk.internal.misc.Unsafe.park(java.base@11.0.12/Native
> Method)
> >>  - parking to wait for  <0x00070dd6c7b0> (a
> >> java.util.concurrent.locks.ReentrantLock$FairSync)
> >>  at
> java.util.concurrent.locks.LockSupport.park(java.base@11.0.12
> >> /LockSupport.java:194)
> >>  at
> >>
> java.util.concurrent.locks.AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.parkAndCheckInte
> rrupt(java.base@11.0.12
> >> /AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.java:885)
> >>  at
> >>
> java.util.concurrent.locks.AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.acquireQueued(ja
> va.base@11.0.12
> >> /AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.java:917)
> >>  at
> >>
> java.util.concurrent.locks.AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.acquire(java.bas
> e@11.0.12
> >> /AbstractQueuedSynchronizer.java:1240)
> >>  at
> java.util.concurrent.locks.ReentrantLock.lock(java.base@11.0.12
> >> /ReentrantLock.java:267)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.modules.parsing.impl.TaskProcessor.runUserTask(TaskProces
> sor.java:170)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.modules.parsing.api.ParserManager.parse(ParserManager.jav
> a:81)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.api.java.source.JavaSource.runUserActionTaskImpl(JavaSour
> ce.java:452)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.api.java.source.JavaSource.runUserActionTask(JavaSource.j
> ava:423)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.modules.micronaut.hyperlink.MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvide
> r.getPropertyName(MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvider.java:151)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.modules.micronaut.hyperlink.MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvide
> r.resolve(MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvider.java:122)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.modules.micronaut.hyperlink.MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvide
> r.getHyperlinkSpan(MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvider.java:85)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.modules.micronaut.hyperlink.MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvide
> r.isHyperlinkPoint(MicronautJavaHyperlinkProvider.java:79)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.lib.editor.hyperlink.HyperlinkOperation.findProvider(Hype
> rlinkOperation.java:266)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.lib.editor.hyperlink.HyperlinkOperation.performHyperlinki
> ng(HyperlinkOperation.java:224)
> >>  at
> >>
> org.netbeans.lib.editor.hyperlink.HyperlinkOperation.keyPressed(Hyperl
> inkOperation.java:382)
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> Neil
> >>
> >> ---
> >> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
> >>
> >> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> -
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>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>

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RE: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

[Eirik Bakke]

> I've been using 12.5 Beta 1 for a couple of days, and I'm experiencing 
> occasional lock ups.

Do these lockups occur only during startup (e.g. when loading projects and the 
like), or long after the IDE was first started?

> I've found distro packaged JDK's a little flaky at times, at least with 
> Ubuntu.  

When a deadlock occurs, it's probably more likely to come from a bug in 
NetBeans rather than a bug in the JDK. If changing the JDK appears to make the 
bug go away, I'd suspect it's just due to race conditions being affected by 
random timing changes (e.g. due to different garbage collection settings). So 
for debugging purposes it's better to keep using the JDK that reproduced the 
bug.

I find the thread dump from VisualVM to be useful for debugging deadlocks.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Monday, August 9, 2021 10:26 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: How to diagnose lock up with 12.5 Beta 1

Also:

https://foojay.io/pedia/thread-dump/

Gj

On Mon, 9 Aug 2021 at 22:25, Ernie Rael  wrote:

> The following post covers several ways to get a thread dump
>
> https://www.baeldung.com/java-thread-dump
>
> -ernie
>
> On 8/9/2021 1:06 PM, Ernie Rael wrote:
> > Lock up can usually be diagnosed with a java thread dump. Create the 
> > dump (search for how to, it's based on OS), attach it to a bug 
> > report, post a message in this list that the dump is available. 
> > Sometimes multiple dumps can be useful, add them to the bug report 
> > as you get them. NetBeans log attached to the bug report can also be useful.
> >
> > -ernie
> >
> > On 8/9/2021 4:01 AM, Chris Wareham wrote:
> >> Hi folks,
> >>
> >> I've been using 12.5 Beta 1 for a couple of days, and I'm 
> >> experiencing occasional lock ups. There doesn't seem to be any 
> >> particular interaction on my part that is triggering it, and the 
> >> memory usage appears to be stable with plenty of free space.
> >>
> >> Is it possible to attach to the running process and get a stacktrace?
> >> I'm not seeing anything log file entries that could help me 
> >> understand the problem.
> >>
> >> My system is:
> >>
> >> Product Version: Apache NetBeans IDE 12.5-beta1
> >> Java: 11.0.12; OpenJDK 64-Bit Server VM 11.0.12+7-post-Debian-2
> >> Runtime: OpenJDK Runtime Environment 11.0.12+7-post-Debian-2
> >> System: Linux version 5.10.0-8-amd64 running on amd64; UTF-8; en_GB 
> >> (nb)
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Chris
> >>
> >> ---
> >> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
> >>
> >> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > 
> > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
> >
> > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> -
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>
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>
>
>
>

New "trimStackTrace" default in surefire, breaks stack traces in Test Results

[Eirik Bakke]

In recent versions of the maven-surefire-plugin, stack traces are "trimmed" by 
default. This breaks past behavior in the NetBeans Test Results pane, where you 
could double-click lines in the stack trace to jump to that part of the code. 
It also makes the stack traces rather useless in the console output.

In case anyone else bumped into this problem, the fix is to set 
trimStackTrace=false in pom.xml:


  org.apache.maven.plugins
  maven-surefire-plugin
  3.0.0-M5
  
false
 


This is not a NetBeans bug, but still I wonder if something should be done from 
the NetBeans side to alert users to this.

(Searching the Apache JIRA for "trimStackTrace" shows several "disable 
trimStackTrace" type issues in various unrelated Apache projects... this new 
default seems to baffle everyone.)

-- Eirik

RE: "Test Results" spurious clearing, shows success despite failure (worked fine in NB12.1)

[Eirik Bakke]

This issue is now fixed in https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/3072 --thank 
you, Dusan Balek for a very quick fix! 

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eirik Bakke  
Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2021 2:56 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: "Test Results" spurious clearing, shows success despite failure 
(worked fine in NB12.1)

At some point after NetBeans 12.1, the "Test Results" pane stopped working 
properly, as described here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-5863

When tests are running (maven-based project with surefire and JUnit), the "Test 
Results" pane will randomly get cleared, and may end up saying e.g. "Tests 
passed: 100.00 %" even though there were failing test. See these screenshots:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13030802/Failure%20became%20success%21.png

This happens in NetBeans 12.4 but not in 12.1. Did something change in this 
area in the latest releases?

-- Eirik


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"Test Results" spurious clearing, shows success despite failure (worked fine in NB12.1)

[Eirik Bakke]

At some point after NetBeans 12.1, the "Test Results" pane stopped working 
properly, as described here:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-5863

When tests are running (maven-based project with surefire and JUnit), the "Test 
Results" pane will randomly get cleared, and may end up saying e.g. "Tests 
passed: 100.00 %" even though there were failing test. See these screenshots:

https://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/13030802/Failure%20became%20success%21.png

This happens in NetBeans 12.4 but not in 12.1. Did something change in this 
area in the latest releases?

-- Eirik

RE: NetBeans Jira issues are not indexed by search engines

[Eirik Bakke]

One idea: Add a mailing list, with a public (plain-text) archive just like this 
one, that just subscribes to all NetBeans JIRA issues...

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2021 9:34 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: NetBeans Jira issues are not indexed by search engines

Is this something we can do as Apache NetBeans or something that should be done 
on the level of the Apache Software Foundation?

Gj

On Wed, 21 Jul 2021 at 21:32, Benjamin Asbach  wrote:

> Actually I'd just allow bots to index the issues. Tbh I cannot image 
> that indexer would heavily increase the server Jira server load. But I 
> don't manage a Jira instance that big. But it's still hard to believe.
>
> Alternatively we could do some kind of an mirror or export of - at 
> lease the NetBeans issues - to a place where indexer bots are allowed 
> to index it.
>
> Thanks
> Benjamin
>
> On 21.07.2021 13:25, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > What is the solution you’re proposing?
> >
> > Gj
> >
> > On Wed, 21 Jul 2021 at 20:58, Benjamin Asbach  wrote:
> >
> >> I wonder what your thoughts are on that topic: Currently Apache 
> >> Jira is configured so that search engines are discouraged to index 
> >> Jira issues.
> >>  From my point of view this leads to a scenario where 
> >> users/developers don't find the right bugs, cannot contribute 
> >> valuable information, are encouraged to create duplicates and in 
> >> the end might switch to another IDE because of a combination of all these 
> >> points.
> >>
> >> I created a issue[1] for that which was closed immediately.
> >>
> >> I think it's crucial that the community of a community driven 
> >> project should be able to find resources of a project in the most 
> >> convenient way (which is google).
> >>
> >> just wanted to raise awareness of this issue and like to know your 
> >> thoughts about that.
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >> Benjamin
> >>
> >> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-22096
> >>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
> >>
> >> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
> -
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>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>

RE: preparing for 12.5

[Eirik Bakke]

With https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2967 ("Modernize tab controls in 
the Windows LAF") already merged, it would be good to have the following two 
PRs merged as well, as they have all have been tested together:

https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2965 Various LAF/HiDPI improvements on 
Windows
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2966 HiDPI-scalable "spinner" icon for 
window system tabs

I think they're both in a mergeable state. Thanks for your consideration!

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Barboni  
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 12:32 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: preparing for 12.5

Hi folks,

 

Thanks for the job done so far on PR. The following PR are targeted to 12.5 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/milestone/13. Take time to review and merge 
if complete.

 

I encounter an issue with build system and version check will try to fix that 
before I can feature freeze.

 

All the best

 

Eric


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RE: OpenJDK Quality Outreach

[Eirik Bakke]

Here are a couple of Windows LAF bugs that could be mentioned as impacting 
NetBeans (as well as most other Swing applications):

https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8211715 (JCheckBox HiDPI scaling fails 
when main display is external non-HiDPI monitor)
https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8241561 (Borders are sometimes painted 
too thick on HiDPI screens with Windows-LAF)

I added workarounds for these in https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/1777 
and https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2965 , but there are still cases 
where a proper fix at the OpenJDK level would look better.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Tuesday, June 8, 2021 1:02 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: OpenJDK Quality Outreach

JEP 411 explicitly mentions NetBeans as one of the projects making use of the 
SecurityManager.

So, they knew, all along, of course, but just not the extent to which we’d 
fight for it.

Gj

On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 at 18:44, Kenneth Fogel 
wrote:

> I will reach out to Rory to learn the details. I suspect we might have 
> caught the JEP 411 issue much sooner if we participated in this.
>
> Ken
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Geertjan Wielenga 
> Sent: June 8, 2021 12:41 PM
> To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
> Subject: Re: OpenJDK Quality Outreach
>
> Great, make it happen. :-)
>
> Gj
>
> On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 at 18:36, Kenneth Fogel 
> 
> wrote:
>
> > It was discussed just now and they are encouraging more 
> > participation, we just reach out to Rory.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Geertjan Wielenga 
> > Sent: June 8, 2021 12:33 PM
> > To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: OpenJDK Quality Outreach
> >
> > Yes, we should, how?
> >
> > Gj
> >
> > On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 at 18:29, Kenneth Fogel 
> > 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I am in the public JCP EC meeting and Rory O'Donnell is talking 
> > > about the OpenJDK Outreach program. Currently 161 FOSS groups are 
> > > contributing to this by testing their project on EA versions of Java.
> > > I did not notice Apache NetBeans on the list though it was not on 
> > > the
> > screen for very long.
> > >
> > > Are we in this program? If we are not should we join it?
> > >
> > > Ken
> > >
> > >
> >
>

RE: Profiler crash on Windows (was: [NOTICE] Last PRs for Apache NetBeans 12.4 Beta)

[Eirik Bakke]

I would have loved to help here, but I have a big deadline coming up...

> Now I intend to merge my own PR-2700 even though I'm not sure that is proper 
> etiquette?
Seeing as PR-2700 builds on the work done by Peter Hull, then that means there 
has already been "two pairs of eyes" on this code. So the code review part can 
probably be considered done.

And as you say, the actual testing of the compiled binaries would be the topic 
of the next PR in the series. So as long as the build tests still pass, it 
would seem good to get PR-2700 merged.

Thanks again to Lars and Peter for your work on this!

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Lars Bruun-Hansen  
Sent: Thursday, April 1, 2021 11:19 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Profiler crash on Windows (was: [NOTICE] Last PRs for Apache NetBeans 
12.4 Beta)

PR-2700  (making the Profiler work on Windows with JDK 9+)   must not
be forgotten, IMO.

I've called for Linux and MacOS folks to test in a previous thread. No 
response. Now I intend to merge my own PR-2700 even though I'm not sure that is 
proper etiquette?

In any case, merging PR-2700 will not make the bug fix into the IDE 
distribution. After merge of PR-2700 someone with permission will need to take 
the ZIP artifact it produces and upload the ZIP into 
https://netbeans.osuosl.org/binaries/. (naming the file 
"profiler-external-binaries-ASF.zip"). Then, yet another PR needs to be created 
which changes the Ant script as explained in PR-2700. This follow-up PR is 
where the real integration takes place and essentially this is where you should 
put your foot down if you believe the new native libs are not working. I'll be 
happy to do the follow-up PR as well.
Can we do all that in 24 hours? Not sure, but let's try.

This problem, that the Profiler crashes on Windows with JDK9+, has been going 
on too long.
Please help me in moving it along.

/Lars


On Thu, Apr 1, 2021 at 11:45 AM Geertjan Wielenga  wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Your brave release managers (the undersigned and Neil C. Smith), will 
> according to our schedule tomorrow put together a Beta release for 
> 12.4, including a vote thread once the sources and convenience 
> binaries are available.
>
> That means that, please:
>
> 1. This is a last call for PRs to be included in Beta.
>
> 2. Tomorrow we'll stop merging while release124 branch is created.
>
> 3. The current delivery branch will be deleted and a new one will be 
> created on feature freeze.
>
> Feel free to respond with any concerns or questions or any PRs that 
> are not merged yet that need to not be forgotten about.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gj

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RE: System Clipboard issues

[Eirik Bakke]

Same here, on Windows 10. I tend to be pasting between NetBeans, Chrome, jEdit 
(another Java app), and Microsoft Word. But it's a bug I see only once a month 
or so, so it's never been much of a problem in my case.

> When NB copy/paste gets stuck I try some random combo between these 3 apps 
> and it works again.
Yup, that's what I usually do. Sometimes I end up restarting NetBeans.

Feel free to open a JIRA issue for this.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Damian Carey  
Sent: Wednesday, February 3, 2021 10:46 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: System Clipboard issues

Hi Scott,
Yes. Several times a week. I'm still on NB8.2 and it's always happened.
Win10 Pro FWIW.
Across 3 screens I'll normally have NB82, IntelliJ, and Notepad++. When NB 
copy/paste gets stuck I try some random combo between these 3 apps and it works 
again.
I've never recognised a rhyme or reason and it's only NB that has had the issue.
I'm so used to this behaviour it's just a quirk I am near immune to.

Thanks,
-Damian



On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 at 14:29, Scott Palmer  wrote:

> Has anyone else noticed that sometimes NetBeans refuses to paste text 
> from the system clipboard and instead pastes the last thing copied 
> from within NetBeans?
>
> It seems to be stuck like that until I copy something different within 
> NetBeans.  In this last case after I copied the path to the user dir 
> from the about dialog, pasted it in explorer.exe (and accidentally 
> also a NetBeans editor).  I then I went back and copied the original 
> value that wouldn’t paste into NetBeans (but did paste into VSCode) 
> and it started working again.
>
> I was copying plain text, no formatting, colours, or anything like that.
> I can’t figure out what triggers it, as most of the time it doesn’t 
> happen.  It’s just very frustrating when it does happen.
>
> Just happened again.. copying some code from StackOverflow and I try 
> to past into NetBeans but instead it pastes some old thing I copied 
> when in NetBeans.  Pasting into other apps give the correct text.  I 
> even pasted into notepad and copied it out of notepad to ensure it was 
> plain text, still NetBeans pastes the old data.
>
> Copying something in the NetBeans editor doesn’t fix it. Pasting in 
> NetBesns will paste that new content from NB, but when I copy the text 
> from an external app NB still pastes what it last copied from within 
> the NB editor instead.  Then I open the NB About dialog and copy 
> something from that. Paste it, then copy from the external app... now it 
> works.
>
> It also seems that what is copied from within NetBeans doesn’t make it 
> to the system clipboard as I can’t copy from a NetBeans editor and 
> paste into another app.  Copying from non-editor sources in NB works 
> for pasting in other apps.
>
> I didn’t find anything in JIRA that looks like this issue, which 
> surprised me as this isn’t the first time I’ve encountered it. (Sorry 
> for no bug report those other times .. just can’t figure out how to 
> trigger it)
>
> Regards,
>
> Scott
> -
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>
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> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>

RE: Profiling on 64bit Windows

[Eirik Bakke]

Build issues aside, I think the code in the PR actually needs at least a 
cursory review from someone else than the original author. Others, like myself, 
have passed by and tested the fix or left other comments, but I'm not sure 
anyone sat down and reviewed it all in one sitting.

( https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2021 )

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Ernie Rael  
Sent: Monday, January 11, 2021 12:34 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Profiling on 64bit Windows

On 1/11/2021 6:53 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> What needs to be done? Can you provide a PR?

Sadly no. I suspect that someone who knows their way around a distribution 
would have that knowledge. I could be wrong, but I suspect it's simple.

If it is simple and it hasn't been done in two years, I'd guess it's more a 
lack of will or willingness to just check in the binaries.

-ernie


>
> Gj
>
> On Mon, 11 Jan 2021 at 15:33, Ernie Rael  wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> There's been a fix for the 64 bit windows profiling problem for over 
>> two years.
>>
>>  https://github.com/pedro-w/netbeans/releases/tag/v0.1-alpha
>>  https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-1428
>>
>> AFAICT, it hasn't been integrated. There's some discussion every few 
>> months or so on how to get the binaries to be automatically built as 
>> part of the general build. An answer hasn't been found, so the 
>> problem remains. These binaries have been around and in use for quite a 
>> while.
>>
>> This issue seems stuck in the /Perfectionism is the enemy of 
>> progress/ trap.
>>
>> Can't the binaries be checked in and included, while the 
>> investigation for a solution proceeds?
>>
>> -ernie
>>
>>
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>>
>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>>
>>
>>
>>


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RE: VSNetBeans, future of NetBeans and personal words

[Eirik Bakke]

> A couple of times I have wanted to fix a bug/annoyance, looked in the code, 
> and asked a question here about why something was implemented the way it was, 
> only to not get a response.

I usually go through the repo's git history to figure these things out, e.g. 
with "git blame -M". Emilian Bold helpfully gathered all of the pre-Apache 
history into another repo at 
https://github.com/emilianbold/netbeans-releases.git . Often you'll need to 
look up bug numbers in the old bugzilla archive as well ( 
https://bz.apache.org/netbeans/ ).

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Pete Whelpton  
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 8:18 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: VSNetBeans, future of NetBeans and personal words

Apologies in advance for the long email.

I can only speak for myself as to why I don't contribute more - if we could 
resolve some of these, I would:

1. Organisation
There are thousands of JIRA tickets, many of them just stacktraces. Finding 
issues that I can fix within my NB knowledge / skillset is difficult.  It 
doesn't feel like working towards any particular goal.

A while back it was suggested to have Tribes, similar to those used in Netcat 
(e.g. for Core Java, JavaEE, HTML/CSS/JS, Database etc.).  I think this is a 
great idea - especially if each tribe has a Tribe Leader, who is one of the 
Netbeans veterans (see below).  Tickets / feature requests could then be 
assigned to each Tribe, and contributors with an interest in those areas of 
Netbeans could easily find / pick them up and more importantly get support from 
their Tribe Leader.  We could have some shared milestones to work towards.


2. Lost knowledge
A couple of times I have wanted to fix a bug/annoyance, looked in the code, and 
asked a question here about why something was implemented the way it was, only 
to not get a response.

I appreciate that this is because many of the talented people that worked on 
Netbeans in the past are no longer in the community.

It would be good to get an idea of who the NB veterans are, what NB modules 
they have a deep understanding of, and some way to provide easier access 
to/organise/share that knowledge (e.g. Tribes, above).


3. Documentation / Barrier to Entry
The barrier to entry for submitting anything more than simple bugfixes is 
really high - I think largely due to the documentation / learning trails.

E.g. last year for fun (and because I'm a saddo), I started working on a 
Lexer/Parser implementation using ANTLRv4 as the upstream lexer & parser.
After much frustration and reading the Lexer SPI Javadoc 20 times, I realised 
that what it was saying was that the NB Lexer can restart from anywhere, so if 
you use Modes in your ANTLR grammar file, you need deal with this and to 
override state() in the NB lexer so that it starts in the correct ANTLR mode, 
not the default

None of our learning trails for ANTLR integration seem to mention Modes...


4. Not using Netbeans at work
After a brief stint in a .NET shop, I'm back in a job where I get to write a 
bit of Java & PHP (thanks a lot COVID-19!).  I'm using Netbeans for PHP as the 
core PHP support is still really up-to-date, but not for my Java work.

I have also have a small jHipster application I'm building. Netbeans should be 
the obvious choice of tool as on paper there is support for Java, Spring Boot, 
Angular, Typescript, HTML & CSS all in one application!  But so many of those 
facets are buggy / out-of-date, so I'm actually using IntelliJ for backend Java 
and VSCode for all front-end work. Constantly switching between the two is 
driving me nuts :(

It's a cycle: the more Netbeans falls behind -> the less I am inclined to use 
NB at work -> the less I am inclined to contribute to Netbeans as I'm not using 
it


5. Appreciation
I'm not someone who needs constant pats on the back, but I do think there is a 
lack of courtesy / respect to those people that do contribute to NB, no matter 
how small.  Chris has made contributions to the NB codebase, but it feels to me 
that Chris got dogpiled in this thread for stating what are some valid concerns.

Likewise, I feel that I got pretty much jumped upon because I dared to mention 
that I used Illustrator for the .svg icons I've submitted.

How do you think that makes me feel about creating / submitting more .svg icons 
(or contributions in general)?


I like to end on a positive - there *have* been some big steps forward in 
recent memory:
 - Excellent Gradle support
 - Ongoing PHP support for latest language features
 - HiDPI support / SVG Support / UI improvements
 - LSP support

Regards,

P

RE: VSNetBeans, future of NetBeans and personal words

[Eirik Bakke]

> https://www.jetbrains.com/idea/whatsnew/

Here is a slightly different perspective. Successful applications that have 
been around for more than 15 years, such as Photoshop, Microsoft Word/Excel, 
GMail, or indeed the NetBeans IDE, are pretty much "feature complete", and do 
not need a lot of new features to be useful. It's a lot more important that the 
features that are already there are maintained and polished, and that bugs are 
fixed.

"What's new" pages are still useful from a marketing perspective--but you don't 
actually need a lot of grand new features to produce them. They can highlight 
features that have been around for many years, but which recently had an 
important bug fixed or some other small improvements made. We already do this 
when a new Java version is supported, for example.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Christian Lenz  
Sent: Thursday, December 3, 2020 5:51 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: AW: VSNetBeans, future of NetBeans and personal words

No I’m not happy with that. We are not a sect to act like that. Again there is 
no Innovation directly coming from NetBeans where developers say: Wow this is 
why NetBeans is great. It is just, yeah another IDE has this.

I will send you the last what’s new in IntelliJ and WebStorm.

https://www.jetbrains.com/idea/whatsnew/ and 
https://www.jetbrains.com/webstorm/whatsnew/ and I can send you the last whats 
new from the last years and I can tell you for sure, that there are hundrets of 
stuff implemented that have wow effects because they are thinking about how 
they can make the work for our developers better and better. There are just 
maybe 1% that NetBeans already have and this is not worth to talk about. It was 
more just a question of time when they implemented this missing feature.

So as I can see you talking about NetBeans as a tool for everything to hype it 
where there is no hype at all, you don’t care About users of NetBeans. It is 
like use it or not and if there is smth missing, create it by your own or use 
another tool. There is no plan, no vision, no strategy where we want to see 
NetBeans in the next 5 or 10 Years.


Cheers

Chris



Von: Geertjan Wielenga
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 3. Dezember 2020 11:39
An: dev
Betreff: Re: VSNetBeans, future of NetBeans and personal words

T

RE: DEFAULT_CACHEDIR_ROOT not propagating to platform application

[Eirik Bakke]

Ah, interesting. The "userdir/var/cache" location is a default location that is 
used if no cache dir is specified, I think. And previously the launch script 
did not propagate the cache dir setting properly, so it always ended up there. 

The same behavior occurs on MacOS, where the cache directory ends up being 
~/Library/Caches/appname/dev (when run from the IDE).

When running from the IDE it would probably be best to keep it under the 
"target" directory somewhere, yes, so that it is properly cleaned during a 
clean build. Though at least I think it still uses the "dev" folder.

Are you using Maven or Ant to run your app? (I'm using Maven myself.) Probably 
somewhere in the IDE platform app running actions (maven plugin?) the cachedir 
for IDE runs should be set explicitly, like the userdir is. (I won't have time 
to work on this now, but feel free to investigate.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Patrik Karlström  
Sent: Tuesday, December 1, 2020 10:48 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: DEFAULT_CACHEDIR_ROOT not propagating to platform application

Hi Eirik,
I just noticed that when using RELEASE121 the cache dir is no longer where it 
used to be when starting the application from the IDE.
On Linux it used to be "application/target/userdir/var/cache/" but since
RELEASE121 it's /home/pata/.cache/appname/.
On Windows it's still "application/target/userdir/var/cache/" for RELEASE121.

I think this is related to my original post but I'm not sure.

Den lör 23 maj 2020 kl 20:01 skrev Eirik Bakke :

> And here's a pull request for this...
>
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2153
>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Eirik Bakke 
> Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 1:44 PM
> To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
> Subject: RE: DEFAULT_CACHEDIR_ROOT not propagating to platform 
> application
>
> I created JIRA issue 
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-4367
> for this.
>
> -- Eirik
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Patrik Karlström 
> Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 4:16 AM
> To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
> Subject: DEFAULT_CACHEDIR_ROOT not propagating to platform application
>
> The following is done with NB Platform 11.3 and Java 11 on Kubuntu 20.04.
>
> While I was about to use the cache dir logic provided by the platform 
> I ran into this problem.
>
> My cache dir is in
> ${HOME}/.${APPNAME}/var/cache
> and not as expected,
> ${HOME}/.cache/${APPNAME}
>
> The app.conf contains
> default_userdir="${DEFAULT_USERDIR_ROOT}/dev"
> default_cachedir="${DEFAULT_CACHEDIR_ROOT}/dev"
>
> Did some echoing in the bin/appname and DEFAULT_CACHEDIR_ROOT was set 
> ok, but not picked up by the application.
>
> When specifying --cachedir it gets picked up by the application.
>
> I created a simple testapp and this problem is there too.
>
> So I guess the question is, Is this related to my doing or the platform?
>
> /Patrik
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
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>
>
>
>

RE: Regarding Netbeans IDE development on MacOS .

[Eirik Bakke]

There are already new builds being made of OpenJDK for Apple Silicon. So 
NetBeans should soon be able to run natively on Apple's new ARM-based processor 
architecture, without relying on the "Rosetta" compatibility layer.

The OpenJDK port for Apple Silicon is being contributed by Microsoft(!) and 
Azul. ARM processors were already supported by OpenJDK on Linux, and Microsoft 
has already contributed an ARM port for Windows. Now they are contributing an 
ARM port for MacOS as well. Relevant info:

Latest updates:
* Microsoft's Java team: "Our work on #JEP391, and our partnership with 
@AzulSystems is showing great progress. Following the #AppleEvent, we are 
pleased to share an EA build of #OpenJDK Port for #MacOS on #AppleSilicon." 
https://twitter.com/JavaAtMicrosoft/status/1326830251289178112
* Bruno Borges, PM for Java at Microsoft: "Even Swing works, although not with 
this EA. We will push a new binary in the coming weeks. ... We [at Microsoft] 
have big Java teams on Mac laptops who intend to move to M1 as future laptop 
upgrades." https://twitter.com/brunoborges/status/132683053077621
* Azul's press release: "Azul has been leading the OpenJDK community effort 
(JEP 391) initiated in August 2020, to add support for Apple Silicon, Arm-based 
Macs in future versions of OpenJDK. ... Azul's Java runtimes power Microsoft 
Azure" 
https://www.azul.com/press_release/azul-announces-support-of-java-builds-of-openjdk-for-apple-silicon/

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Geertjan Wielenga  
Sent: Friday, November 13, 2020 5:13 AM
To: dev 
Subject: Re: Regarding Netbeans IDE development on MacOS .

Wow, if that works, then that's a good workaround.

Gj

On Fri, Nov 13, 2020 at 10:43 AM Rami Swailem 
wrote:

> Workaround:
>
> Run NetBeans from the terminal:
>
> /Applications/NetBeans/Apache\ NetBeans\ 
> 12.1.app/Contents/Resources/NetBeans/netbeans/bin/netbeans
>
>
>
> On 2020/11/13 08:15:55, HEMANT KUMAR 
> 
> wrote:
> > Sir
> >
> > This email is regarding the application development regarding macOS 
> > ,
> Apache netbeans is widely used IDE for java development in schools .
> > I an also the user of Netbeans IDE since 2018 , but few months ago ,
> apple had launched it’s brand new Mac Operating system called macOS 
> Big Sur version OS 11 , previously known as OSX Catalina (10.15) , .
> >
> > New OS had been developed to adapt the New Apple Silicon arm
> architecture Environment and OS is also developed for that , but the 
> Market having intel Mac , on which macOS Big Sur is running and 
> created for Both intel and arm , but your netbeans are not running on 
> macOS Big Sur on intel processor , which is not good sign .
> >
> > So kindly fix it .
> >
> > Regards
> > Hemant Kumar
> > 
> > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
> >
> > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> -
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> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>

RE: IDE Icon Registry (The SVG Story Continues) (AKA What about to clean up some mess)

[Eirik Bakke]

What's wrong with the idea of caching rasterized PNG files the first time an 
SVG icon is loaded? (Also timboudreau's idea, from 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/1278 .)

> could result in much smaller files than either XML, or PNG/GIF

Note that icons will end up being rasterized in memory in any case (for 
compatibility with ImageIcon etc.). So in terms of memory consumption, you 
won't beat the cached PNG approach.

Aside: Did I manage to convince Jaroslav that XML loading infrastructure will 
be loaded in the NetBeans no matter what, and can thus be considered "free" 
from the point of view of increased startup time? (Since editor color settings, 
editor keybindings, and other things must be loaded from XML files before the 
IDE can do anything useful?)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Tim Boudreau  
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2020 8:41 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: IDE Icon Registry (The SVG Story Continues) (AKA What about to 
clean up some mess)

I have thought long ago that if we wanted to have svg icons in NetBeans, we 
would be better off “compiling” them to a binary format that encapsulates the 
drawing instructions (could result in much smaller files than either XML, or 
PNG/GIF) - there are not many necessary bytes of information in “move to x,y; 
set the color to...; draw a line to a,b”.

I wouldn’t turn them into classes - how many icons do we have, and what’s the 
footprint of one in the perm gen multiplied by that number?

FWIW, I have the classes you’d need to do this “compiling” of svg - part of 
imagine, which I use for the “native” file format for vector layers.

-Tim

On Wed, Sep 23, 2020 at 6:58 AM Jaroslav Tulach 
wrote:

> XML is bad. Does it mean that SVG is bad as well?
>
>
>
> XML, as implemented in Java with Xerces parser is a massive piece of 
> software.
>
> It composes of about three thousand of classes. Does our current
>
> infrastructure for rendering SVG uses Xerces? That means we need to 
> load all
>
> the infrastructure when drawing first SVG icon. That obviously has to 
> slow
>
> NetBeans startup down.
>
>
>
> Once upon time an XML parser was necessary to start NetBeans (think of
>
> `layer.xml` files, of `config/Modules/*.xml` files, etc.). However 
> when I was
>
> working on the NetBeans performance team, we eliminated all of that 
> with
>
> caches. The goal was: No XML parsing on (second and subsequent) startup.
>
>
>
> Now, when we are switching to SVGs, we are reintroducing the Xerces 
> overhead
>
> again. Can we avoid it?
>
>
>
> Here is a plan which, by a chance, also addressed the IDE Icon 
> registry
>
> problem. Let's process the SVG icons during compile time and turn them 
> into
>
> Java classes. Such technologies (based on Batik) exist (for example 
> http://
>
> ebourg.github.io/flamingo-svg-transcoder/) and it is just a matter or
>
> integrating them into our build system. Let's imagine an annotation 
> processor
>
> to process @SVG annotation:
>
>
>
> ```
>
> @SVG(resource="resources/wait.svg", className="GenericIcons")
>
> @SVG(resource="resources/wait-too-long.svg", className="GenericIcons")
>
> package org.openide.util;
>
> ```
>
>
>
> That would generate a class like
>
>
>
> ```java
>
> public GenericIcons {
>
>   private GenericIcons() {}
>
>   public static ImageIcon wait() {...}
>
>   public static ImageIcon waitTooLong() { ... }
>
> ```
>
>
>
> The class would contain all the instructions `fillRect`, `arc`, 
> `lineTo`, etc.
>
> in the form of Java code. The SVG files would be removed from our JARs.
> E.g. we
>
> would immediately solve the problem of comments, long meta-data and 
> XML
>
> parsing. All the icons would be available as Java code, ready to run 
> and ready
>
> to be GCed once no icon from a generated class is in use.
>
>
>
> In addition to that this class would hook into existing resource 
> oriented API,
>
> so all icons could be referred via their location. Moreover we could 
> also
>
> implement Tim's suggestion to hook into UIDefault resources with
>
>
>
> ```java
>
> @SVG(uid={"wait-icon"})
>
> ```
>
>
>
> The `GenericIcons` class could be in private packages, or it could be 
> placed
>
> into public packages. Then it would form an API other modules can 
> use[1] and
>
> could avoid the duplication of icons.
>
>
>
> Would that work? If so, and we can eliminate all the XML parsing on 
> startup,
>
> I'd be in support of some form of SVG icon registry.
>
>
>
> Best regards.
>
> -jt
>
>
>
> PS:  There is `@StaticResource` annotation currently, so there is no 
> need to
>
> copy `wait` icon 30 times at various places even now...
>
>
>
> Dne úterý 22. září 2020 8:15:28 CEST, Laszlo Kishalmi napsal(a):
>
> > Dear all,
>
> >
>
> > We have about 4200 icons/images in the repository. most probably 
> > many of
>
> > them are duplicates, triplicates, multiplicates copied to different
>
> > locations.
>
> >
>
> > Just in a recent PR, Eirik added 34 new svg icons to 192 places.
>
> > 

RE: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

[Eirik Bakke]

> The crucial point in the past was, that the email had to be selected as 
> "Public email" in the "Profile" section of the settings.

I just used the "Squash and Merge" feature to merge 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2410 , and can confirm that the author 
information that ended up in the NetBeans git repository is the full name (not 
GitHub username) and email address which is listed on the PR author's public 
github profile.

So as long as these two pieces of information show up correctly on the PR 
author's public github profile, it seems safe to use the "Squash and Merge" 
feature.

(And if erroneous info has already been committed, I agree with Mathias' point 
about using "git revert" rather than force push to master.)

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Matthias Bläsing  
Sent: Sunday, October 11, 2020 3:09 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

Hi,

Am Samstag, den 10.10.2020, 10:32 -0700 schrieb Laszlo Kishalmi:
> It seems it is still an issue on github squash and merge. Just did a 
> merge. I've checked the email on the individual commits which seemed 
> to be right and valid, then ended up in the master as
> 72509841+adrie...@users.noreply.github.com
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/commit/7990cee5aa9d8460b563d7ad44d7
> 43843c6c064a
> 
> Now what would be the best option? Remove the top of master by force 
> (not a really nice thing to do) or create a revert PR? Well the first 
> would resolve the issue commit with the wrong email in the repo, the 
> later one would be just a corrective one.
> 

we can't force push into master. That would be a problem for all users already 
on latest master, as their repository state becomes invalid.
I'm also not sure how the github <-> asf sync infrastructure would take it. We 
should have very good reasons to change history for a public branch, which I 
would only see for security issues.

I suggest to revert the commit with the normal git mechanic (revert commit 
references reverted commit, possible adding a reasoning). After that a cleaned 
version can be applied.

HTH

Matthias


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RE: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

[Eirik Bakke]

In my case I'm using git on Windows with WSL, which unfortunately is very slow 
when working with the NetBeans repository. Stashing my own changes, switching 
branches, rebasing to squash etc. turns merging someone else's PR into a 
30-minute operation. It's a lot easier, for me at least as a reviewer, if the 
original PR author configures their github with the right info so that "Squash 
and Merge" will just work correctly.

-- Eirik


-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Friday, October 9, 2020 1:37 PM
To: dev 
Subject: Re: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

On Fri, 9 Oct 2020 at 18:00, Matthias Bläsing  wrote:
> 1. Ask the author to update his author information and squash the 
> commits and force push the updated commit 2. Do it yourself locally 
> and update the author information
>
> From a "good for future" perspective, I would prefer (1).

A reminder from email above that if doing (2) you can force push to the 
author's PR branch, which any committer can do by default, then get the author 
to check if necessary, and merge as normal.

That way we don't bypass PR statuses, etc.

Best wishes,

Neil

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RE: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

[Eirik Bakke]

Thank you... will ask the PR author to do this and then do "Squash and Merge", 
and verify that it ends up correct.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Matthias Bläsing  
Sent: Friday, October 9, 2020 1:09 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

Am Freitag, den 09.10.2020, 17:06 +0000 schrieb Eirik Bakke:
> > 1. Ask the author to update his author information and squash the 
> > commits and force push the updated commit
> 
> If the author puts his proper email on his Github profile, will the 
> "Squash and Merge" button work? Or will he still have to do the manual 
> squash and force push?

The crucial point in the past was, that the email had to be selected as "Public 
email" in the "Profile" section of the settings.

Matthias


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RE: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

[Eirik Bakke]

> 1. Ask the author to update his author information and squash the commits and 
> force push the updated commit

If the author puts his proper email on his Github profile, will the "Squash and 
Merge" button work? Or will he still have to do the manual squash and force 
push?

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Matthias Bläsing  
Sent: Friday, October 9, 2020 1:01 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

Hi Eirik,

actually not sure if github improved, but I looked at the profile of the author:

https://github.com/MKuettner

and there is a real name (great), but no email address. Looking at the commits 
(locally), I see a valid email address, but the real name part is not complete.

I see two options:

1. Ask the author to update his author information and squash the commits and 
force push the updated commit 2. Do it yourself locally and update the author 
information

From a "good for future" perspective, I would prefer (1).

HTH

Matthias

Am Freitag, den 09.10.2020, 16:26 + schrieb Eirik Bakke:
> What's the status on "Squash and merge"?
> 
> I'd like to merge the PR at
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2410 , but I can't remember 
> how to verify that "Squash and merge" won't put in bogus author 
> information.
> 
> -- Eirik
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Neil C Smith 
> Sent: Sunday, August 9, 2020 8:43 AM
> To: dev 
> Subject: Re: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)
> 
> On Thu, 12 Dec 2019 at 20:41, Matthias Bläsing < 
> mblaes...@doppel-helix.eu> wrote:
> > 14. Switch back to master
> > 
> >git checkout master
> > 
> > 15. Merge (commit hash from above):
> > 
> >git merge c20b63503c98
> > 
> > 16. Push
> > 
> >git push
> > 
> > 
> > Do this multiple times with test sets, then its _very_ easy. The 
> > alternative is of course to ask the author to do the squash himself, 
> > he can update the PR (requires a forced push)
> 
> Just following up on this.  I've had a few of these come up during
> 12.1 so far.  I'm also not entirely a fan of bypassing the PR system 
> or direct pushes to upstream master (I have push-url set to disabled 
> by default).
> 
> As well as the author squashing the PR, it is also possible for any 
> committer to force push the PR branch (by default anyway) if the 
> author cannot for some reason.  I did this with eg.
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2023  And I think all is fine 
> with the git history on this.
> 
> Matthias, could you have a quick check on that?  I used your 
> instructions roughly up to where to push to.  But this has the benefit 
> of linking back to original PR / closing, allowing the author to check 
> over, and running CI tests again before merging.  Thoughts on pros / 
> cons of updating instructions to recommend this?
> 
> Thanks and best wishes,
> 
> Neil
> 
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org
> 
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -
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> 
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> 
> 
> 


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RE: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

[Eirik Bakke]

What's the status on "Squash and merge"?

I'd like to merge the PR at https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2410 , but 
I can't remember how to verify that "Squash and merge" won't put in bogus 
author information.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Neil C Smith  
Sent: Sunday, August 9, 2020 8:43 AM
To: dev 
Subject: Re: Merging on github (aka Squash and Merge is broken)

On Thu, 12 Dec 2019 at 20:41, Matthias Bläsing  
wrote:
> 14. Switch back to master
>
>git checkout master
>
> 15. Merge (commit hash from above):
>
>git merge c20b63503c98
>
> 16. Push
>
>git push
>
>
> Do this multiple times with test sets, then its _very_ easy. The 
> alternative is of course to ask the author to do the squash himself, 
> he can update the PR (requires a forced push)

Just following up on this.  I've had a few of these come up during
12.1 so far.  I'm also not entirely a fan of bypassing the PR system or direct 
pushes to upstream master (I have push-url set to disabled by default).

As well as the author squashing the PR, it is also possible for any committer 
to force push the PR branch (by default anyway) if the author cannot for some 
reason.  I did this with eg.
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2023  And I think all is fine with the 
git history on this.

Matthias, could you have a quick check on that?  I used your instructions 
roughly up to where to push to.  But this has the benefit of linking back to 
original PR / closing, allowing the author to check over, and running CI tests 
again before merging.  Thoughts on pros / cons of updating instructions to 
recommend this?

Thanks and best wishes,

Neil

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RE: Status of converting icons to SVG

[Eirik Bakke]

> Do we have already considered solutions like Nucleo or Streamline, Icons8, 
> FluentIconsByMicrosoft?

See 
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/HiDPI+%28Retina%29+improvements
 :

"[Option 2:] Find replacement icons in an existing icon font library. Emilian 
Bold tried this approach and documented it at 
https://jaxenter.com/netbeans/netbeans-retina . Some manual work is included, 
but not as much as drawing new icons from scratch. The downside is that (1) 
quite a few NetBeans icons will have no suitable replacement in an existing 
font library, (2) icon font libraries yield monochromatic icons only, 
sacrificing the color of the old icons for an improvement in resolution, and 
(3) the style of new icons would appear mismatched next to old ones."

The approach we have now started (with 
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2387 ) is to start redrawing a subset 
of NetBeans icons in SVG using the existing bitmap icons as a base--keeping the 
basic shapes and color scheme with some modernizations, according to the style 
guide at https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/NETBEANS-2617 .

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: David Schulz  
Sent: Friday, October 9, 2020 5:31 AM
To: Christian Lenz ; dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: RE: Status of converting icons to SVG

Thanks for adding me to the discussion @Christian Lenz, and hello into the 
void!  
 
Do we have already considered solutions like Nucleo or Streamline, Icons8, 
FluentIconsByMicrosoft?
We could use one of them as a base layer for new icons. If something isn't 
included, we could quickly build a new one based on the existing assets and 
individual needs. 

All the best,
Dave

--

uxactly GmbH | raiken.de
system design thinking 

Kurfürstendamm 28
10719 Berlin

Tel: 0174 933 85 36
Mail: da...@uxact.ly
Skype: rai...@live.de
 
LinkedIn | Xing

From: Christian Lenz
Sent: Donnerstag, 17. September 2020 13:07
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org; David Schulz
Subject: AW: Status of converting icons to SVG

I know a good UX and UI guy, it is david who created the logo for us. But yes I 
don’t think that he will do it for free. But to have a single designer for the 
Icons and the overall stuff is better than to have 10 designer for the same 
thing. https://www.raiken.studio/ 


Cheers

Chris


Von: Eirik Bakke
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 16. September 2020 19:16
An: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Betreff: RE: Status of converting icons to SVG

> I still fail to see the difference between repetetive work on the code base 
> working on source code and repetetive work on graphics.

The problem is that if 10 different people are involved in the effort, each 
redrawing 70 icons (perhaps 40 hours of work), then there will be 10 different 
icon styles. Ideally there should be a single designer. But no single 
individual will volunteer to do, say, 300 hours of mostly repetitive work.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Matthias Bläsing 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 3:02 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: Status of converting icons to SVG

Hi,

I still fail to see the difference between repetetive work on the code base 
working on source code and repetetive work on graphics.

I worked for a company where the graphics designers were the only ones using 
mac OS systems. Reasoning was, that their work could only be done on these 
machines. They were special somehow and I still don't grasp it. At that time 
other OSes could run their software and other OSes could be color calibrated.

I see this again: Now graphics designers need "their" software to work, the one 
available to all potential contributors is not good enough. Now graphics 
designers need to be paid, contrary to other contributors.

I will pull out of this discussion - I said what I had to say and it would be 
great if other people say what they think.

Greetings

Matthias

Am Dienstag, den 08.09.2020, 19:19 + schrieb Eirik Bakke:
> Yeah, the crowdfunding approach will only work if there's enthusiastic 
> support for it. Alternatively, there are benefits to having 4-5 
> committers "trained" in the art of making icons for the future. It's 
> worth going through the crowdfunding discussion once, though.
> 
> > What makes graphics design different from programming? Why not do a 
> > crowdfound efford to get feature X in NetBeans?
> 
> Main differences:
> * This is a task where, for stylistic and efficiency reasons, ideally 
> a single person should do the artwork for _all_ the icons. While I'm 
> sure we have several people here who could do a good job with 20-30 
> icons, none of us will have time to do 6-700 of them.
> * The task is repetitive and predictable. We can say to the designer, 
> "Here are 160 bitmap icons that we want SVG versions of. Here are 20 
> examples that we have already converted. You get paid when you have 
> finished the remaining 140 to the

RE: Hacktoberfest opt-in

[Eirik Bakke]

Just beware that there has been some problems with "spam" PRs around 
Hacktoberfest--e.g. people submitting nonsense PRs to get T-shirts:

https://twitter.com/dan_abramov/status/1311692006775758853?s=20

So we should just make sure to review these properly as usual before merging.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Eric Barboni  
Sent: Monday, October 5, 2020 7:46 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: RE: Hacktoberfest opt-in

Hi
Let's merge before November then :D
Best Regards
Eric

-Message d'origine-
De : Matthias Bläsing  Envoyé : dimanche 4 octobre 
2020 18:19 À : dev@netbeans.apache.org Objet : Re: Hacktoberfest opt-in

Hi,

I read this as:

- the projects adds the topic
- interested participants mark the PR appropriately
- digital ocean give out prices
- we don't need to special case the PRs

Correct?

I don't see a problem indicating, that we accept related PRs.

Greetings

Matthias

Am Sonntag, den 04.10.2020, 11:28 +0200 schrieb Hector Espert:
> This year I'm trying to participate into the Hacktoberfest:
> https://hacktoberfest.digitalocean.com
> 
> The participation rules have recently changed and only the projects 
> that want to participate are valid in the PR count.
> 
> *We’re making Hacktoberfest opt-in only for projects – which 
> maintainers
> > can do simply by adding the ‘hacktoberfest’ topic to a repository.*
> > 
> 
> The topic hacktoberfest could be added to the project to allow people 
> participate in the Hacktoberfest with the Netbeans project.
> 
> I created this PR to add the topic if we decide to participate:
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/2420
> 
> Best Regards
> Hector


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RE: Running NetBeans in a window-editing mode?

[Eirik Bakke]

Found it... this mode is invoked by using the "New" wizard and selecting 
"Layout of of Windows" (see 
https://dzone.com/articles/netbeans-71-review-nbplatform ).

-Original Message-----
From: Eirik Bakke  
Sent: Saturday, October 3, 2020 2:51 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Running NetBeans in a window-editing mode?

I remember there was some way to run a NetBeans Platform app in a special mode 
that let you customize the window system defaults (placements of property 
sheet, output pane etc.), without manually editing the XML files.

Does anyone remember how to do this?

-- Eirik

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Running NetBeans in a window-editing mode?

[Eirik Bakke]

I remember there was some way to run a NetBeans Platform app in a special mode 
that let you customize the window system defaults (placements of property 
sheet, output pane etc.), without manually editing the XML files.

Does anyone remember how to do this?

-- Eirik

RE: IDE Icon Registry (The SVG Story Continues) (AKA What about to clean up some mess)

[Eirik Bakke]

> Not really. You can connect to DB without parsing XML. You can open a 
> TypeScript project without parsing XML. You can open a Gradle project without 
> parsing an XML.

Aren't NetBeans database connections stored in XML files? And editor color 
settings? And editor keybindings?

> Can you cache PNGs at compile time?

Compile time is tricky since we don't know the target scaling. We could do 2x 
and scale down at runtime for other scalings (e.g. 1.5x), but I don't think it 
will look as good as when you render directly for the correct scaling. And 
larger scalings (e.g. 3x, which is supported on Windows) would not look good.

timboudreau's suggestion was to render at runtime, but cache rendered icons in 
the NetBeans cache directory, so the next time NetBeans runs, loading of the 
Batik libraries, at least, could be delayed further.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Jaroslav Tulach  
Sent: Saturday, September 26, 2020 12:28 AM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: Re: IDE Icon Registry (The SVG Story Continues) (AKA What about to 
clean up some mess)

Eirik wrote:
> > Sooner or later, the XML parsing architecture will be loaded anyway, no?
> > Before the user can do anything useful with NetBeans?

Not really. You can connect to DB without parsing XML. You can open a 
TypeScript project without parsing XML. You can open a Gradle project without 
parsing an XML.

While on performance team we fought hard to avoid - let's load all my 
functionality on startup attitude - no user of NetBeans is using all NetBeans 
functionality.

True, when working with Maven, one needs to load the XML in anyway.

> Well I like the idea of using annotation processing to define SVG-s 
> and place them inside a generated catalog.

Just like there are public/private classes/package, there shall be public/ 
private icons. The fact that some module has an icon doesn't mean other modules 
can use it. One has to export that icon explicitly.

> The implementation detail, whether we shall create some cached png-s 
> in compile time or, compile them into Java Graphich2D calls is 
> indifferent to me, probably it would just depend how much effort we can put 
> into this.

Recording/replaying Graphics2D calls has been done in the past by numerous 
projects. It's just a matter of which one to choose. Btw. Can you cache PNGs at 
compile time? As Eirik wrote:

> > It would be much easier to just generate PNG images from the SVGs, 
> > the first time they are used. On any given computer, only one or two 
> > scalings are going to be in use (e.g. 2x on all MacOS machines, and 
> > perhaps 1x for an external monitor).

and that seems to me like request to cache the PNGs at runtime. That would be a 
different story.


> The one problem with @StaticResource is currently it does not take
> account the module dependencies. I do not know if that's a feature or
> just a shortcoming of the implementation.

@StaticResource verifies that a resource is on your compilation classpath. That 
means it takes into account module dependencies. What exactly is the problem?

-jt

> It could be also fine for me if we do not move the existing images  to a
> central catalog by altering the ImageUtilities.getIcon(). We update the
> module to use the catalog whenever we find the time for that.
> 
> On 9/23/20 9:13 AM, Eirik Bakke wrote:
> >> SVG is a huge language, which incorporates large portions of CSS. No way
> >> you can get all SVGs to display properly this way.> 
> > OK, I take that back, you could intercept calls at the Graphics2D API
> > level. But *so* much easier, and more reliable, to just cache PNG
> > versions...
> > 
> > E
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Eirik Bakke 
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 12:04 PM
> > To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
> > Subject: RE: IDE Icon Registry (The SVG Story Continues) (AKA What about
> > to clean up some mess)> 
> >> That obviously has to slow NetBeans startup down.
> > 
> > Sooner or later, the XML parsing architecture will be loaded anyway, no?
> > Before the user can do anything useful with NetBeans?
> > 
> > Isn't it a lot better to have loading happen during startup, while the
> > user is already checking their email, fetching their cup of coffee etc.?
> > Isn't this why we have "warmup" tasks running to initialize the editor
> > infrastructure and so on early, before the user actually starts
> > interacting with the IDE?> 
> >> Let's process the SVG icons during compile time and turn them into Java
> >> classes.> 
> > It would be much easier to just generate PNG images from the SVGs, the
> > first time they are used. On any given computer, only one or two scalings
> > are going to b

RE: The stae of SVG in NetBeans

[Eirik Bakke]

Most of these points have been discussed already, but I can summarize...

> I thought that it was quite clear that this would take a long time to sort 
> out and not just a matter of redrawing icons in SVG format.

The redrawing effort can proceed entirely independently of any effort to clean 
up the naming scheme etc. One effort does not need to block the other, and 
different people can work on these two things.

If you want to draw some icons, I can give you a list of prioritized ones to 
work on, and you won't have to deal with the duplicates, naming scheme etc.

> Why are we considering using SVG file types at all? They aren't really 
> appropriate for the proposed purpose.
> Now, I get the potential problem with HiDpi/retina displays but surely that 
> too can be dealt with by images prepared at the right scale.

On Windows, graphics need to scale at 1x, 1.25x, 1.5x, 1.75x, 2x, 2.5x, 3x etc. 
of their "logical" resolution, depending on the user's display settings. On 
MacOS, they need to scale to either 2x (for retina screens) or 1x (for 
non-retina external monitors etc.). SVG icons solve this problem. And you can 
generate PNG files from SVGs, but not the other way around.

> Furthermore, why is the handling of icons so complex in NetBeans? I don't 
> understand why you would go to the bother of creating compound images in the 
> code when the simple solution is to have a separate image already created on 
> hand.

I assume you are referring to ImageUtilities.mergeImages? You'd end up with a 
huge number of possible cobinations. In any case, it's been there for years and 
it already works with HiDPI icons... not something that's likely to change in 
the future.

-- Eirik

-Original Message-
From: Jeremy Cavanagh  
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2020 1:07 PM
To: dev@netbeans.apache.org
Subject: The stae of SVG in NetBeans

Hi All,

I've had a few days away from email, etc., because I over did it last week and 
was very tired, then, of course Le Mans was on at the weekend. 
You won't get any sense out of me on a Grand Prix weekend. However, for Le Mans 
you just won't get anything.

I have been back at it again only to discover an awful lot of discussion that I 
have yet to read completely.

Did everyone miss my emails. I thought that it was quite clear that this would 
take a long time to sort out and not just a matter of redrawing icons in SVG 
format.

Slow down guys, there is plenty of time to play graphic designer. But now is 
not the time.

I have a source download of 12.1 on my system and I am working through what has 
actually been happening.

Briefly:

There is a lot of duplication both of names and graphics.

There are an awful lot of alternatives to some of the graphics.

A naming convention does not exist, anything goes leading to very unreadable 
names, and why have some people added 'icon' to the name that's not really 
necessary.

The graphic images should be stored in a separate folder from other resources 
for clarity.

Then of course there is the biggest question mark of all. Why are we 
considering using SVG file types at all? They aren't really appropriate for the 
proposed purpose.

The majority of icons currently sit in the following sizes: 8x8, 16x16,
24x24 and 32x32. But, to be honest this is not always the case when you look at 
some, they are not the size stated on the packet... Anyway, at these sizes SVG 
offers no benefit.

Furthermore, why is the handling of icons so complex in NetBeans? I don't 
understand why you would go to the bother of creating compound images in the 
code when the simple solution is to have a separate image already created on 
hand.

Now, I get the potential problem with HiDpi/retina displays but surely that too 
can be dealt with by images prepared at the right scale. Maybe we just need to 
extend the base 8 series to 40x40 and 48x48 or whatever is necessary to 
accomodate these hires screens.

We need to complete the analysis before we get creative, surely you are all 
aware that you have to do the research first. Then decide on the most efficient 
and effective approach (one of which is to give proper structure to the icons, 
and, as important meaningful names) neither of which are currently available.

I could go on but even I'm getting bored.

Regards to all

Jeremy

Stay Home, Stay Safe and above all Stay Healthy.

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