Re: [Emc-users] Drilling holes in the back of a stepper motor

[TJoseph Powderly]

drill hole in and tap
or
glue screws on exterior, thread side out ?  ;=}
i read the force would be snall

outside the box   literally
tomp

On Sun, Jun 25, 2023 at 10:31 AM John Dammeyer  wrote:
>
> I want to add an encoder onto the back of this stepper motor.  I can install
> either a US Digital or a CUI since both mounting flanges can extend out near
> the edges of the back mounting plate.
>
>
>
> Is there any reason I can't clamp the motor in a vice and pop in two holes
> and tap them with a bottom tap at the spacing of the mounting flange?
>
> John
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] LinuxCNC did this too.

[TJoseph Powderly]

cool, thank you.
was this Linuxcnc ( gcode) or Hal ?
I think Hal can do a lot for animatronics and multimedia.
TomP

On Sun, Jul 7, 2019 at 9:10 PM Leonardo Marsaglia 
wrote:

> Bravissimo!
>
> El 7 jul. 2019 08:46, "Gene Heskett"  escribió:
>
> > On Sunday 07 July 2019 06:19:22 77...@tiscali.it wrote:
> >
> > >   hi all, just wanted to let you know another nice thing that Linuxcnc
> > > (2.9) have done.
> > > this is the World 30° Summer Universiade opening
> > > cerimony, and they asked me to make a burning ball fly to start the
> > > olympic fire. (well unfortunately it couldn't be a real fire, but the
> > > ball yes, it was!)
> > >
> > > You can watch this part of the show here:
> > >
> > >
> > > https://youtu.be/aTaBl4HJT2M
> > >
> > Neat!  Thanks.
> >
> > > hope you enjoy it.
> > >
> > > greetings, Davide
> > > D'Angelo.
> > >
> > >
> > > Con OpenStar hai Giga, SMS e i minuti che vuoi da 4,99€ al mese, per
> > > sempre. Cambi gratis quando e come vuoi e in più hai 6 mesi di
> > > INFINTY! http://tisca.li/myopen
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
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> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
> >  - Louis D. Brandeis
> > Genes Web page 
> >
> >
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> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
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Re: [Emc-users] LinuxCNC did this too.

[TJoseph Powderly]

Davide,
no worries, i read it just the same.

re: how to use hal directly
begin with John Kasunich's tutorial on Hal , from the Linuxcnc doc set.
see http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/hal/tutorial.html
The example uses parallel port for i/o but can use mesa i/o and raspberry
pi i/o etc.
In the example he makes real stuff work and he monitors it using meters and
scopes, all without linuxcnc.
He shows you how to write a .hal control file and 'run' it.
This beginning tutorial is great ( Thanks JMK )
Then search a bit to find pyvcp ( for beginning ) control panels that
interface to .hal files.
This way you can have standalone gui panels with .hal connections to real
worl hardware,
again without linuxcnc. ( I am not anti linuxcnc i am pro
whatevericanthinkof :-)

Using realtime is not needed for all projects.
Hal is an 'erector set', much simpler than linuxcnc.
I have not connected processing to Hal yet, can you show me how ;-)
hth
tomp

On Wed, Jul 10, 2019 at 6:13 AM Davide <77...@tiscali.it> wrote:

> I'm sorry Thomas, i think i've send my answer to your personal e-mail...
>
>
> Il 9 luglio 2019 16:51:41 CEST, Thomas J Powderly  ha
> scritto:
> >Hello Davide,
> >
> >On 7/9/19 9:21 PM, Davide wrote:
> >>
> >> Il 8 luglio 2019 05:46:51 CEST, TJoseph Powderly 
> >ha scritto:
> >>> cool, thank you.
> >>> was this Linuxcnc ( gcode) or Hal ?
> >>> I think Hal can do a lot for animatronics and multimedia.
> >>> TomP
> >> Sorry but, what do you mean by that?
> >
> >We can move mechanisms with Hal, without Gcode, without LinuxCNC.
> >
> >Hal can simply make motors move and use encoders and PIDs without
> >involving Gcode or Linuxcnc.
> >
> >You could have hundreds of motors moving, while linuxcnc can have 9
> >xyzabcuvw (usually)
> >
> >You can do linear circular helical and more interpolations in python
> >and
> >have hal to interface your hardware.
> >
> >Your flying ball could be accomplished in another way, thats all.
>
> these things you're talking about are something I have in my mind since
> years ago (emc2..) but i've never found info on how to implement that..
> do you have any suggestion on how to start?
>
> thank you.
> Davide
>
>
>
>
>
> >
> >>
> >> This setup was made by 4 joints (wires) and my kinematic module. A
> >three-axis-joystick was used to jog,home and set jog speed, and a gcode
> >path was generated by a software I've done in Processing.
> >ah! processing and hal is exciting.
>
> totally agree on that!
>
>
>
> >> A wonderful mesa 7i92 was used to send differential step/dir over a
> >max lenght of 220mt cat6 rj45 twisted-pair cable without problem. lines
> >where terminated with 100ohm resistor (without those i had problems..)
> >directly on the drivers, which accepted differential input.
> >oh i remember that conversation a bit. thats a lng wire!
> >>
> >> for the future I have to find a way to close the loop in a different
> >way, because with those hybrid drivers, if one gets alarmed, the system
> >continues to move until i stop it.
> >>
> >> maybe bringing an ethernet mesa card to every winch?
> >>
> >>
> >> I wanted to really thank you all for the help I've received in these
> >years from this community, that brought me to this point.
> >>
> >>
> >> Ciao,
> >>
> >> Davide D'Angelo.
> >>
> >
> >thank you for your work
> >
> >tomp
>
>
> Inviato dall'app Tiscali.it.
>
> Inviato dall'app Tiscali.it.
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Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc-application

[TJoseph Powderly]

Aram

additive machining using MIG is very interesting
I've seen laser welding used to repair expensive blisks for turbines.

I dont know about welding though,
but I see many people trying to achieve this.

these maybe of use:

Design And Development Of A Low-Cost 3D Metal Printer
https://jmerd.org.my/Paper/Vol.%2041%2C%20No.%203%20%282018%29/47-54.pdf

Additive Manufacturing Using MIG Welding
https://www.ijresm.com/Vol_1_2018/Vol1_Iss10_October18/IJRESM_V1_I10_137.pdf

simpler welder
https://reprap.org/wiki/Slicer_and_process_improvements_for_open-source_GMAW-based_metal_3-D_printing

btw: Michigan Tech's MOST projects have a few links that you may find
interesting.

your welds looks similar to what the universities achieved so don't be
disappointed!

hth
tomp

On Tue, Jul 30, 2019 at 1:49 AM a k  wrote:

> https://youtu.be/JJsCT81T4N8
>
> On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 7:04 PM a k  wrote:
>
> > https://youtu.be/3TBTOxNLo2E
> >
> > On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 6:53 PM a k  wrote:
> >
> >> https://youtu.be/YiT_CgO1-1w
> >>
> >> On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 6:50 PM a k  wrote:
> >>
> >>> here are some info about what my project.
> >>> combination of lcnc and welding need to see some problems .that i
> >>> have
> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TBTOxNLo2E
> >>>
> >>> On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 12:01 PM Gene Heskett 
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
>  On Sunday 28 July 2019 12:01:11 Jon Elson wrote:
> 
>  > On 07/27/2019 10:09 PM, a k wrote:
>  > > Hi
>  > > I am interesting if linuxcnc can host different groups , like
>  > > linuxcnc for application?
>  > >
>  > > Right now it is linuxcnc for lathe and mill.
>  > > Cutting process not under the any questions ,so only linuxcnc ...
>  > >
>  > > What about if lcnc does something more complex than simple metal
> etc
>  > > cutting?
>  >
>  > A variant of LinuxCNC called Machinekit is often used with
>  > the BeagleBone and CRAMPS board to run 3-D printers.  Some
>  > people are using it with 5-axis mills.  I know that several
>  > tube benders have been built.  One of my customers is in
>  > Brazil and uses LinuxCNC to run a screen printing machine
>  > (there's a YouTube video of it). Recently, some additions
>  > have been added to do reverse path for wire and sinker EDM.
>  > I've heard rumors of gear hobbing machines, too.
>  >
>  > Jon
>  >
>  I've never cobbled up a wire spooler, but I've done lots of EDM,
> mostly
>  burning out broken taps. But my threads when I'm done look a heck of a
>  lot better that that guy on you-tube who specializes removing broken
>  taps. He uses so much current he's arcing sideways and punching holes
>  in
>  the threads. I haven't automated the feed rate, mainly because I'm
>  usually operating in a blind hole, so I have to back out and clean the
>  electrolyte out of the hole, its got so much metal in it thats its
> gone
>  conductive. For that, I really should rig a small water pump, and rig
>  an
>  injector in the upper part of the electrode to feed distilled water
>  into
>  the slowly rotating brass tubing I use for an electrode. By that
> method
>  I could keep the hole clean enough to not have to stop and clean the
>  shorts out of the hole.
> 
>  As for dielectric fluid, I've found at the currants and voltages I
> use,
>  that distilled water works better than K2.
> 
>  There is not anything stopping LCNC from doing all sorts of odd jobs.
>  And
>  most importantly, you are in no way limited to what your CAD/CAM can
>  write but you'll never find out unless you learn to write your own
>  gcode. IMO, its even easier than Basic.
> 
>  Cheers, Gene Heskett
>  --
>  "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>  -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>  If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law
>  respectable.
>   - Louis D. Brandeis
>  Genes Web page 
> 
> 
>  ___
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>  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> 
> >>>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] EDM forms?

[TJoseph Powderly]

you ask for long lasting
that would be tungsten carbide
but
i suggest using easy to manufacture, easy to find, low cost
because it will wear anyway

so copper, with little lead ( often copper sold will be 'machineable' which
means lead which means higher wear )

for a key way you should be able to mill machine the electrodes
and use the largest face ( dont cut with small end of rectangular prism ,
cut with side )
( do the hokey pokey - put your big foot outi used to teach the
operators )
use LOTS of pecking, just get a sizzle and jump away

you dont have real edm equipment, just a hack so you gotta play safe

and set it up vertical and submerged if possible so the jump opens up to a
flood of the submerged fluid
pee down the cut from above and to the side, you want to see the black puff
out each jump

Negative polarity ( tool neg, work pos ) If you use an r/c pulse generator
then always negative tool.
Short ontimes and hi freq ( say 10to50uS on and 200 or more off , 2000 is
good for lash-up )

The exaggerated offtimes aid in letting the dielectric recuperate to non
conductive state.
The short cut times ( jump cycle ) aid in poor gap control, you actually
cut while ' in the zome'
but your system cant maintain the zone
So you get efficiency by 'drive by edm', you go thru the zone each jump
pass and get a little work done.
You jump away right away and reduce the heat build up ( because you likely
crashed into the work and shorted )

you're a scope kinda guy, try this...
reduce the gap using a resistor divider giving max 5v and watch the process
when you get more 'chairs' then you are cutting more
when you flat line, you're crashing
when its open voltage all the time you're missing
( old elox guys look for 'grass' like on a lawn ,
  there was a scope on all old elox generators,
  the 'grass' was due to slow scope )

hth
tomp



On Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 9:17 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> Greetings all;
>
> Like Jon said on the sheldon list. woodruff keys cut into a case hardened
> shaft are a bear. Carbide makes a mark, for about 5 seconds.
>
> So it appears I will have to dig the keyways by EDM.
>
> Because the electrode will go away too, what makes the longest lasting
> electrode material?
>
> And which polarity, if it makes a difference?
>
> Thanks all;
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] looking for help on the best way to implement a Latching E stop circuit

[TJoseph Powderly]

hello
i got too many hits with google "linuxcnc classicladder"
try ti out, theres docs, beginner tutorial, demos videos discussions
hth
tomp

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Re: [Emc-users] should I be laughing or crying?

[TJoseph Powderly]

Gene
I cant find units comp either, nor can google so far,
So write one
List all the pins connected to it ( by browsing .hal)
then look ar 
http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/config/python-interface.html#_linuxcnc_stat_attributes
especially
program_units (returns integer) - one of CANON_UNITS_INCHES=1,
CANON_UNITS_MM=2, CANON_UNITS_CM=3
if the comp only returns imperial/metric
this may be easy
hth
tomp

On Fri, Oct 18, 2019 at 8:50 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>
> On Fri, 18 Oct 2019 at 02:06, Phillip Carter 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > I think this is the units you are referring to: <
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Units <
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Units>>
>
>
> No., it's a HAL component. (his HAL is trying to "loadusr" it).
> I have no idea what it does.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Wedding rings vs R8 or ER42 collets.

[TJoseph Powderly]

I say Hello Mrs. Gene. Fan DI, Chok di ( sweet dreams and best luck ). tomp

On Mon, Nov 18, 2019 at 10:52 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> Greetings all;
>
> My wife, whose is slowly losing weight, down to the low 70 lbs, meaning
> shes a bag of fragile bones.
>
> And her wedding band has got so loose she's afraid of losing it.
>
> I suggested that the jewelers usually have an expandable tapered arbor,
> and a collet of sorts that can adjust a ring, cold, by about a size,
> more if heated.
>
> But what about my ER42 kit? It ought to be able to do this compression to
> restore a decent fit, or would I wreck the ER42's ball bearing nut
> trying to put that much squeeze on the ring?
>
> Its simple 18 carat gold, about .130" wide, and about 1/32" thick.
>
> What say you all?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 
>
>
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[Emc-users] 2020

[TJoseph Powderly]

Chok di pi mail!
Happy New Year to all.
TomP

On Mon, Dec 30, 2019, 11:59 PM Dave Matthews  wrote:

> For some reason I didn't get that to work.  Looking at what did work
> it should have.  I may not have hit save or something.
>
> I found this link on the LinuxCNC
> forumshttps://
> forum.linuxcnc.org/9-installing-linuxcnc/35839-updating-to-latest-version-of-2-8?start=20
>  and with a couple tweaks now have 2.8 installed.  His instructions
> have an error in Step 2.  The lines need to start with http://
>
> The machine is now happily running 2 instances of glxgears and
> streaming from Youtube.
>
> Latency test is showing max jitter of 45687 on Servo and 40422 on
> Base.  That is with the onboard video.  I may drop a card in and see
> if I can get it better but that is probably more than adequate for my
> Gatton CNC on a parallel port.  I am running it at 3200
> microsteps/inch and don't need over 100 ipm for my purposes.
>
> Dave
>
> On Sun, Dec 29, 2019 at 9:32 PM Phillip Carter 
> wrote:
> >
> > I am not sure when it will be released, it can't be too far away.
> >
> > You should be good to go using the 2.7-rtpreempt changed to
> 2.8-rtpreempt.
> >
> > You could also download the the latest package from
> http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/dists/stretch/2.8-rtpreempt/ <
> http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/dists/stretch/2.8-rtpreempt/> and install it
> directly.
> >
> > > On 30 Dec 2019, at 1:17 pm, Dave Matthews  wrote:
> > >
> > > I'll give it a try in the morning.  That page could use a bit of
> updating.
> > > I found a few other options to try also.  Any idea when 2.8 will be the
> > > default install?  It looks like it has been stable for quite a while.
> > >
> > > Dave
> > >
> > > On Sun, Dec 29, 2019, 21:11 Phillip Carter 
> wrote:
> > >
> > >> I think it may be sudo apt-get install linuxcnc-uspace
> > >>
> > >>> On 30 Dec 2019, at 12:53 pm, Dave Matthews  wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> On Mon, Dec 30, 2019 at 12:11 AM Phillip Carter <
> phillcarte...@gmail.com>
> > >> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > > I installed the dependency fail for the sudo apt-key adv
> --keyserver
> > > hkp://keys.gnupg.net --recv-key EF1B07FEE0EE663E step.  When I
> try to
> > > install the key I get:
> > > Executing: /tmp/apt-key-gpghome.RJo9NWtHgB/gpg.1.sh --keyserver
> > > hkp://keys.gnupg.net --recv-key EF1B07FEE0EE663
> > > gpg: "EF1B07FEE0EE663" not a key ID: skipping
> > >
> >  you are missing the "E" at the end
> > >>> Added the E and reran the command.  It worked.  I think I got it to
> > >>> work before that but blew it on the retry of the command.
> > >>>
> > 
> > 
> > > and there is no /etc/apt/sources.list.d/linuxcnc-buildbot.list
> created.
> > >
> > > I created the file and added the 2.7 entries and edited them to
> 2.8.
> > > That got me an install of the 2.8 docs but nothing else.
> > >
> > > I don't remember what incantations I did to install 2.8 on the old
> > > machine.  I think it was just pointing at repositories and using
> > > apt-get.
> > >
> >  if you created /etc/apt/sources.list.d/linuxcnc-buildbot.list then
> > >> check your /etc/apt/sources.list file and comment out any lines that
> > >> reference linuxcnc
> > >>>
> > >>> No references in /etc/apt/sources.list.  I tried commenting them out
> > >>> in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/linuxcnc-list but no change.
> > >>>
> > >>> I tried using the 2.7 entries replacing the 7 with 8 and also tried
> > >>> pointing to Master with no luck.
> > >>> deb http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ stretch master-rtpreempt
> > >>> deb-src http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ stretch master-rtpreempt
> > >>>
> > >>> cncuser@localhost:/etc/apt/sources.list.d$ cat linuxcnc.list
> > >>> deb http://linuxcnc.org/ stretch base
> > >>> #deb-src http://linuxcnc.org/ stretch base
> > >>> deb http://linuxcnc.org/ stretch 2.7-uspace
> > >>> #deb-src http://linuxcnc.org/ stretch 2.7-uspace
> > >>> #deb http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ stretch 2.7-rtpreempt
> > >>> #deb-src http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ stretch 2.7-rtpreempt
> > >>>
> > >>> cncuser@localhost:/etc/apt/sources.list.d$ cat linuxcnc.list
> > >>> deb http://linuxcnc.org/ stretch base
> > >>> #deb-src http://linuxcnc.org/ stretch base
> > >>> deb http://linuxcnc.org/ stretch 2.7-uspace
> > >>> #deb-src http://linuxcnc.org/ stretch 2.7-uspace
> > >>> #deb http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ stretch 2.7-rtpreempt
> > >>> #deb-src http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ stretch 2.7-rtpreempt
> > >>>
> > >>> cncuser@localhost:/etc/apt/sources.list.d$ sudo apt-get update
> > >>> Ign:1 http://ftp.debian.org/debian stretch InRelease
> > >>> Hit:2 http://security.debian.org/debian-security stretch/updates
> > >> InRelease
> > >>> Ign:3 http://linuxcnc.org stretch InRelease
> > >>> Ign:4 http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org stretch InRelease
> > >>> Hit:5 http://ftp.debian.org/debian stretch Release
> > >>> Hit:7 http://linuxcnc.org stretch Release
> > >>> Hit:8 http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org stretch Release
>

[Emc-users] Fwd: [Emc-developers] hal_pi_gpio.c rpi4 revision c03112

[TJoseph Powderly]

fwd to emc-user, sorry i only posted to emc-devs last night
this will allow purchasers of new rpi4 (c01112 rev) to use gpio wirh
software stepping.
-- Forwarded message -
From: Thomas J Powderly 
Date: Sun, Feb 16, 2020 at 11:06 PM
Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] hal_pi_gpio.c rpi4 revision c03112
To: 


I now have linuxcnc 2.9 with a good hal_pi_gpio.(doesnt break on
newest Pi revision code c03112 )

The driven pins scope out clean when running.

These pins controlled by software stepgen.

To do this , I installed a rip ( so I could make new .c components ).

I edited hal_pi_gpio.c , adding a case to rtapi_app_main()

int rtapi_app_main(void)
{
int n, retval = 0;
int rev, ncores, pinno;
char *endptr;

if ((rev = get_rpi_revision()) < 0) {
  rtapi_print_msg(RTAPI_MSG_ERR,
 "unrecognized Raspberry revision, see /proc/cpuinfo\n");
  return -EINVAL;
}
ncores = number_of_cores();
rtapi_print_msg(RTAPI_MSG_INFO, "%d cores rev %d", ncores, rev);

switch (rev) {
// adding this vv
case 6:
  rtapi_print_msg(RTAPI_MSG_INFO, "Raspberry4ver1.2\n");
  pins = rpi2_pins;
  gpios = rpi2_gpios;
  npins = sizeof(rpi2_pins);
  break;
// end additions ^^
case 5:
  rtapi_print_msg(RTAPI_MSG_INFO, "Raspberry4\n");
  pins = rpi2_pins;
  gpios = rpi2_gpios;
  npins = sizeof(rpi2_pins);
  break;

Then I touched one dependancy ( cpuinfo.c) and ran make, then sudo
make setuid, then tested.

It took me a lng time to discover that halcompile wasnt enough,
due to the dependancy cpuinfo.c

If i had known that, I'd be hours ahead.

NB: the RIP works , the installed linuxcnc will still fail "board
revision 6 not supported"

HTH

tomp


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Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture

[TJoseph Powderly]

niggley bits,

"To  avoid  this  problem, either  drive  loads  that  are  ground
referred, Use 3.3V as the VCC for VCC referred loads, or use open
drain mode."

Please change that capital U to u,
Also, beef up the a || b ||  c   logic with 'or use'.

"To  avoid  this  problem, either  drive  loads  that  are  ground
referred, or use 3.3V as the VCC for VCC referred loads,\ or use open
drain mode."

U makes readers think previous char was a period.
A period would destroy the meaning. it becomes an unfinished thought.

I had to copy the line into a text editor, not believing what I thought I saw.

Npotebooks with tiny characters make . and , damn similar.

and good luck on the Chinese translation.
I'm glad to see international cooperation at this time in history.

tomp

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 10:22 AM Peter C. Wallace  wrote:
>
> On Sun, 15 Mar 2020, Rafael Skodlar wrote:
> >
> > "... The outputs are push pull CMOS  that will drive to the output
> > supply rail of 3.3V. This is sufficient for TTL compatibility but may
> > cause problems with some types of loads.  For  example  when  driving
> > an  LED  that  has  its  anode  connected  to  5V,  in  such devices  as
> >  OPTO  isolators  and  I/O  module  rack  SSRs,the  3.3V  high
> > level  may  not completely  turn  the  LED  off"
>
> You left off a bit of the manual text:
>
> "To  avoid  this  problem, either  drive  loads  that  are  ground
> referred, Use 3.3V as the VCC for VCC referred loads, or use open
> drain mode."
>
> Peter Wallace
> Mesa Electronics
>
>
>
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[Emc-users] linuxcnc openlung ventilators

[TJoseph Powderly]

How can Linuxcnc people help with OpenLung?
https://gitlab.com/open-source-ventilator/OpenLung

tomp


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Re: [Emc-users] linuxcnc openlung ventilators

[TJoseph Powderly]

yes
you need to know what a ventilator does
how it is installed into a person
and about the tool used to test that the tube is in the correct position.
That tool BMV is usually just for test, and it _could_be used for
longer term with a little hacking.

I watched videos on how professional machines are used.
Then looked at how bag mask valves are used
the considered what i could do if manufacturing  them was needed here.
its 20 minutes for your fellow man.

You would likely help build , not put tubes down throats.

thanks for looking at the idea
tomp

On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 12:31 AM Ralph Stirling
 wrote:
>
> I think this is required reading before jumping on the diy medical device 
> bandwagon.
>
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-71FJTmI1Q1kjSDLP0EegMERjg_0kk_7UfaRE4r66Mg/edit?usp=drivesdk
>
> -- Ralph
>
> On Mar 23, 2020 6:08 AM, TJoseph Powderly  wrote:
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University email 
> system.
>
>
> How can Linuxcnc people help with OpenLung?
> https://nam05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgitlab.com%2Fopen-source-ventilator%2FOpenLung&data=02%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C664b8912e4524122347e08d7cf22d88b%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637205620886050273&sdata=EEcLtpgC9Gz1NFYuNqYDt%2Bu1lHcS1G5EAzzHeZXEPfQ%3D&reserved=0
>
> tomp
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Working on Pendant and debouncer PCBs, comments welcome.

[TJoseph Powderly]

Re pendant. The heidenhain controls use a box with strong magnets on rear.
Between the magnets is a deadman switch
(suitably runner dome covered for industrial use )
You can slap it onto any flat surface and the deaman is satisfied.
You can hold it in your hand,,, left hand... thumb on left side,
left forefinger on button, remaining fingers on right side.
On the front are keys and any lcd. On right is an estop
and a deeply dimpled wheel to turn an encoder for motion.
You put a fingertip in a dimple and lay a finger on the outside ribs,
the ribs give you a ergonomic detent very natural to use.
You can jog and handwheel as you like IF the deadman is satisfied.
hth
tomp

On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 11:02 AM Chris Albertson
 wrote:
>
> I am going to have JLPCB make some PCBs for me.  They cost only $2 each but
> DHL shipping from China is $25 so it makes sense to wait until I have
> several projects ready and give then a batch of designs.  They populate the
> board now for the price of the components, so it is a great deal.  They do
> all the SMT soldering for you.
>
> Two things might interest people here, a USB connected pendant and a
> hardware switch debouncer.
>
> The switch debouncer will handle 6 switches, it accepts a raw switch and
> outputs a reliably debounced signal.  It will use an RC lowpass filter and
> a 74HC014 Schmitt trigger. With an LED for each switch.  Yes, you can do
> the debounce in software but this will handle the noise with hardware.  I'm
> still deciding about connectors.  Screw terminals or JST?  Or both.
>
> The pendant is more complex and I'm not sure of the details but here are
> proposed features:
>
>- It will connect with USB.
>- There are three knobs.  All are of the continuous rotation type with
>A/B quadrature output.
>   - The main knob is a CNC "MPG" handwheel with 100 "clicks" per
>   revolution.
>   - The other two are much smaller with about 20 clicks per
>   revolution and also a push-button click operation, like on a car radio.
>   These two knobs replace the more common selector switches.
>   - There is a character-only LCD screen that can display four lines of
>text, 20 characters long
>- There are no labels printed on the front panel.  The current function
>of the two small knobs is displayed on the last line of the LCD
>
> The goal is first off a "clean look" with both low complexity and
> open-ended design.  I think using a character display and rotary controls
> does this.   This pendant could run a 6 axis robot arm or a lathe depending
> on the programming.
>
> *One question:Does a pendant need a "activate" button* on the side such
> that the controls are disabled if you don't hold the button down.  You
> don't want to jog a mill by accident if the wheel is bumped.
>
> I'm making this for myself but I'm designing this as if it were an actual
> product.   So I ask "What would be useful?
>
> I've decided I don't like the idea of a standard red E-Stop button because
> someone might confuse it with the hard-wired kind.  USB can not support
> that.  But I do want a way to quickly stop the machine.  I think pressing
> both small knobs at the same time will stop and re-set everything.  It will
> set the e-stop hal pin and reset the pendant to default.  (Yes e-stop could
> fail if there is a bug in the software)
>
> [image: Simple Pendant v2.jpg]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
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Re: [Emc-users] Working on Pendant and debouncer PCBs, comments welcome.

[TJoseph Powderly]

sorry that pic is not an hr33, this is

On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 11:02 AM Chris Albertson
 wrote:
>
> I am going to have JLPCB make some PCBs for me.  They cost only $2 each but
> DHL shipping from China is $25 so it makes sense to wait until I have
> several projects ready and give then a batch of designs.  They populate the
> board now for the price of the components, so it is a great deal.  They do
> all the SMT soldering for you.
>
> Two things might interest people here, a USB connected pendant and a
> hardware switch debouncer.
>
> The switch debouncer will handle 6 switches, it accepts a raw switch and
> outputs a reliably debounced signal.  It will use an RC lowpass filter and
> a 74HC014 Schmitt trigger. With an LED for each switch.  Yes, you can do
> the debounce in software but this will handle the noise with hardware.  I'm
> still deciding about connectors.  Screw terminals or JST?  Or both.
>
> The pendant is more complex and I'm not sure of the details but here are
> proposed features:
>
>- It will connect with USB.
>- There are three knobs.  All are of the continuous rotation type with
>A/B quadrature output.
>   - The main knob is a CNC "MPG" handwheel with 100 "clicks" per
>   revolution.
>   - The other two are much smaller with about 20 clicks per
>   revolution and also a push-button click operation, like on a car radio.
>   These two knobs replace the more common selector switches.
>   - There is a character-only LCD screen that can display four lines of
>text, 20 characters long
>- There are no labels printed on the front panel.  The current function
>of the two small knobs is displayed on the last line of the LCD
>
> The goal is first off a "clean look" with both low complexity and
> open-ended design.  I think using a character display and rotary controls
> does this.   This pendant could run a 6 axis robot arm or a lathe depending
> on the programming.
>
> *One question:Does a pendant need a "activate" button* on the side such
> that the controls are disabled if you don't hold the button down.  You
> don't want to jog a mill by accident if the wheel is bumped.
>
> I'm making this for myself but I'm designing this as if it were an actual
> product.   So I ask "What would be useful?
>
> I've decided I don't like the idea of a standard red E-Stop button because
> someone might confuse it with the hard-wired kind.  USB can not support
> that.  But I do want a way to quickly stop the machine.  I think pressing
> both small knobs at the same time will stop and re-set everything.  It will
> set the e-stop hal pin and reset the pendant to default.  (Yes e-stop could
> fail if there is a bug in the software)
>
> [image: Simple Pendant v2.jpg]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
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Re: [Emc-users] Health update

[TJoseph Powderly]

Gene
please take care
you are always full of surprises
and remember to take care of yourself so you can take care of the missus!
TomP

btw my old man got a 4way bypass and a handful of stints 20+ years
before he passed
.they used his legs as a plumbing supply!

On Thu, Jun 11, 2020 at 5:32 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> On Wednesday 10 June 2020 17:30:51 andy pugh wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 at 20:33, Gene Heskett 
> wrote:
> > > That would nice but I'm not 100% sure my bxa post could handle a 50
> > > lb chuck 2 feet out of balance.
> >
> > That's 100 ft.lb. A good heave on a long spanner. Would you expect
> > that to break your toolpost?
>
> No, but the top of the crossfeed on an 11" Sheldon is a pretty thin
> casting.  Might be a lot easier damaged than the identical part of a
> monarch of similar size.
>
> Falling over and landing to the compound crank split the compounds ways
> wide open, long before it followed me home in a cargo van.  But I didn't
> find that until after I'd gotten it unloaded and was looking for how
> best to cnc it.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Interesting GUI

[TJoseph Powderly]

If You are thinking of conversational, you might look at Fanuc Macro B
for ideas. Its a tool they had for conversational programming. Pretty
old school appearance but the idea of a macro dialog  interpreter
inside the control was very leading edge in the 80's/ I wrote dialogs
for fanuc 8 9 11 in those days. Its like Ray & Matt's CP1 for
LinuxCNC, sorta. Of course there is the Heidenhain Conversational
model, but thats the primary programming method, not an add-on.
tomp

On Fri, Sep 4, 2020 at 4:30 AM Chris Albertson
 wrote:
>
> The problem is not the touch screen.  That is easy and is very little
> different from a mouse.  Your code has to respond to input in the same way.
>
> The hard part, by far is designing a good conversational system.  Tormach
> ha "path pilot".  Something like that requires a lot of thinking and
> planning.  Writing the software is the easy part, the design is harder.
>
> On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 11:13 AM N  wrote:
>
> > > On Wed, 2 Sep 2020 at 22:42, Kirk Wallace 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Given enough development time and money, my guess is that a LinuxCNC
> > GUI
> > > > could be very similar. The only basically new feature is the swipe and
> > > > gesture touch feature, which Linux/LinuxCNC should be able to use. Or,
> > > > ... I may be way off base.
> > >
> > >
> > > No, I think it is absolutely possible. There may even be programmers
> > > out there who work on iPad apps who would look at that and say "yes,
> > > that's pretty simple".
> > > But I don't imagine it's any of us.
> >
> > Programming might be simple, to move 4-8 ton heavy machines without
> > spending to much money is harder and then they need a dry home with enough
> > power.
> >
> > Nicklas Karlsson
> >
> >
> > ___
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> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
>
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Re: [Emc-users] SPAM: Re: freecad, latest, starter tut?

[TJoseph Powderly]

Stop labelling messages as SPAM
HTH can we have topics labelled SPAM this and SPAM that?
Stop replying to threads SPAM* !
Who is playing Judge or God here fingering witches?
STOP
The topics and labels on this list are already _barely_ connected to OP.
tomp

On Tue, Sep 22, 2020 at 11:10 PM Chris Albertson
 wrote:
>
> I think the bottom line with FreeCAD is that is working fine if you need to
> make one part and 3D print it.  But it is not quite ready for complex
> machine design or making parts with subtractive machine tools (lathes and
> mills)   But it covers maybe 90% of hobbyist use cases.   This email list
> where (we assume) everyone has access to CNC is kind of the exception in
> the hobby/maker world.
>
> If you are making a living at this, just buy a license for a top-tier
> product.  Time is money.
>
> On Mon, Sep 21, 2020 at 10:42 PM Frank Tkalcevic <
> fr...@franksworkshop.com.au> wrote:
>
> > I was impressed that FreeCAD could import lots of different CAD formats.  I
> > tried to use the CAM (Path) on an old STEP file, but I couldn't work out
> > how
> > to orient my part, and set the origin to the bottom-left top corner of the
> > box stock.  Reading the forums, it seems that isn't possible (talk of local
> > coordinate systems, but no implementation).
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Todd Zuercher [mailto:to...@pgrahamdunn.com]
> > Sent: Tuesday, 22 September 2020 4:51 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] SPAM: Re: freecad, latest, starter tut?
> >
> > Generating g-code with Freecad is a bit of an arduous process.  Especially
> > for the first time.  After you've made your 3d model, you have to convert
> > that drawing into a part, then you have to create a Job amd set up your
> > tool
> > library, then add the tools to the Job, then configure the machine driver,
> > then create all of the machining tool paths (using the Path Workbench.)
> > Then only after you've created your tool paths, can you output g-code to a
> > file.  (The only g-code I've made with Frecad was using version 0.18.)
> >
> > Todd Zuercher
> > P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> > 630 Henry Street
> > Dalton, Ohio 44618
> > Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Gene Heskett 
> > Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2020 11:09 AM
> > To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > Subject: SPAM: Re: [Emc-users] freecad, latest, starter tut?
> >
> > [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.
> >
> > On Sunday 20 September 2020 10:04:48 Martin Dobbins wrote:
> >
> > > freecad has an export menu that claims to do gcode, but it does not
> > > create the code, nor does it report any error I understand when going
> > > thru the motions. freecad screenshot attached. A simple torus shape,
> > > 50mm in diameter, 35mm tall, with a 28mm center hole.
> > >
> > > Good morning Gene,
> > >
> > > I've looked through the midden heap of my drag knife folder and I have
> > > been unable to locate a file with g code.  This bugged me because I
> > > *know* I saw readable g code from that project, then i remembered how
> > > I had seen g-code (on screen) which is pretty much as described in
> > > this video:
> > >
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWU621P0gZk
> > >
> > > I know I expected to have human readable code at the end of this
> > > project (pity I didn't complete it) because I'm working on a desktop
> > > that is not connected to the CNC so I expected a text file at the end
> > > that I could edit and rename to a .ngc file to transfer to the CNC
> > > machine.
> > >
> > > If you can wait, I'll have a go at replicating the torus you made and
> > > see if I can send the g code.  If that works I will (try) to tell you
> > > how I did it.  Later today, I hope.
> > >
> > > Martin
> >
> > Not that big a hurry Martin, I don't have the motor in hand yet that I plan
> > on using. I have found it from other vendors so all is not lost.
> > This vendor I now recall burnt me several hundred dollars when I bought a
> > 6040 mill for my Christmas present almost 2 years ago. I had to ditch the
> > electronics and replace that whole box and its contents. Around $400 of an
> > $1200 purchase. Runs nicely now exceptfor an actual speed tally on the
> > water
> > cooled spindle which has no encoder, so its displaying the commanded speed
> > to the vfd. Ought to be an echo from the vfd, but I don't know how to
> > acquire it for linuxcnc.  Cheap clone vfd.
> >
> > In the meantime I've found that freecad treated my diameters as radii, so
> > the posted image is too big by 2x for xy.  Its a 50mm diameter pipe, 35mm
> > long, with a 28mm diameter bore.  Makes sense, but big dummy at work. :-)
> >
> > Thank you Martin.
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
> >  - Louis D. Brandei

Re: [Emc-users] Bed isn't flat on my 6040.

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hi Gene
you can buy Prussian Blue oil paint tube from an art store or internet
you can get a pretty good surface plate from a cutout of a kitchen
sink granite top
you can measure the flatness with this old trick
takes 2 123 blocks a mag indicator stand and an indicator
mount indicator to stand and clamp stand onto large surface of 123
place both 123's on surface to check. You can 0 indicator onto the plain 123.
as you move the pair over the surface you are measuring the avg 123
area height to the other 123 area height. You make a map of the
results on paper.
This will show you how flat the surface is.
this is an independent measure ( the surface may not be parallel to
the x or y rails
but it is important to be able to what element is contributing what
part of error to the wkpc.

stay safe, god bless america

tomp

On Thu, Jan 7, 2021 at 7:08 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> On Wednesday 06 January 2021 18:45:11 Jon Elson wrote:
>
> > On 01/06/2021 04:30 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > > On Wednesday 06 January 2021 06:08:23 andy pugh wrote:
> > >> How far out of true is it?
> > >
> > > A good mm in some of the places I have checked. But now I need to
> > > stay at or below .1mm over a foot of travel for this box mod. I
> > > could reclamp it, and survey it with my throw away renasys(sp?), but
> > > am trying to get enough data I don't have to do it over for each
> > > piece I make.
> >
> > Well, there is always hand scraping.  I've never done it on
> > aluminum, but I'd guess it might
> > be very similar to cast iron.  But, of course, if putting
> > clamps anywhere distorts it more, then
> > it is kind of a losing battle.
> >
> > All you need is a known-flat reference surface like a
> > granite surface plate, some blue dye
> > and a scraping tool.  You can make scrapers out of large
> > carbide cutting inserts.  While
> > Dy-Kem Prussian Blue dye is the best, it is very messy, so I
> > recommend Canode spotting dye.
> > That is water-soluble.
>
> Never heard of Canode till now.  Msg marked, thanks Jon
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 
>
>
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[Emc-users] remora spi wiring Mks-Sbase V1.3

[TJoseph Powderly]

hello,
I have a Mks-Sbase V1.3
Where does the wire labeled 'px.x' go?
(refer to remora-docs.readthedocs.io/en/latest/har...e/SPI/Mks-Sbase.html
 figure 1 )
It comes from rpi gpio 25
thx  tjtr33


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Re: [Emc-users] Random quesion in regards to a gear sensor (maybe JonE)

[TJoseph Powderly]

a friend owns this company, i make nothing off its sale
but i think i should let people know about it as a resource

its designed for spindle speed control ( using little space )
and he has been successful selling it to oems in Taiwan

http://www.chiarey.com/products-en.html


  GUBOA IGS sensor  magnetic gear sensor

tomp


On 03/10/2016 01:26 AM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> Ideas:
>
> 1) How close to the motor is the sensor.  The motor might have a large
> external magnetic field.
>
> 2) I wonder if the shaft is magnetized while is spinning?  Is this reversed
> if the shaft spins the other way?
>
> 3)  Is the sensor powered from a reliable DC supply that is in no way
> connected or near the motor spindle power?
>
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 9, 2016 at 8:54 AM,  wrote:
>
>> We purchased some gear tooth sensors in hopes of using one of the gears in
>> the K&T for a spindle encoder.  Well - we ended up putting a shaft encoder
>> in the gearbox.
>>
>> http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en?keywords=620-1328-1-nd
>>
>> Well - move ahead a few years - We are putting a gear in the matsuura
>> spindle for an encoder.  the 2 sensors on the gear seem to work great for
>> quadrature signal.
>>
>> http://electronicsam.com/images/matsuura/sensors.jpg
>> http://electronicsam.com/images/matsuura/oscope.jpg
>>
>> (that is 6000rpm)
>>
>>
>> The issue is that we drilled about a .130 hole for the index but it acts
>> odd.  If you rotate the spindle one direction it will pass the index and
>> stay high until it passes the hole then you get a little index pulse low.
>> If you run it the other direction it goes low after passing the index - and
>> you get a positive index pulse at every passing of the hole.  I think it
>> should stay low (or high) no matter what direction the spindle is turning
>> (and get a pulse every pass of the index hole).
>>
>> clear as mud?
>> thanks
>> sam
>>
>>
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>
>

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Re: [Emc-users] Learning LinuxCNC Youtube Channel

[TJoseph Powderly]

jim thanks for the videos
i'm eyebrow deep in other things but have them on the todo list
tomp


On 03/11/2016 03:10 AM, Jim Craig wrote:
> On 3/10/2016 9:27 AM, John Alexander Stewart wrote:
>> Jim - thanks for progressing with these videos.
>>
>> I wonder if it might be an idea to get a mic that you clip to your clothes,
>> as in the intro there's a lot of echo.
>>
>> Keep going!  John.
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> John,
>
> My shop is covered in hard surfaces with not much to absorb echo so I
> fear that echo may be present in my future recordings. I have some soft
> surfaces in my garage where I did the probe videos so echo was not so
> prevalent there.
>
> I will see what I can do.
>
> Jim
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc on arm

[TJoseph Powderly]

555 ( hahaha in Thai )
no! use old hammond organ for that buzzy sound
reminds me of herbie hancock 'rockit'
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHhD4PD75zY
tomp

On 03/21/2016 01:50 AM, bari wrote:
> It sounds like it's more fun than practical. My Android phone hardly
> works as a phone. I can't imagine using it to control a VMC. I'd like to
> see an old 60's TV as a GUI with a re-purposed Calliope used for a
> keyboard or similar.
>
> On 03/20/2016 12:19 PM, Ralph Stirling wrote:
>> I don't think their immediate focus is lowering cost, but in reorganizing
>> the system for distributed modularity.  The  basic BBB implementation
>> is pretty low cost, though, and is in use by a lot of people for 3d printing.
>>
>> They have a gui running on Android devices, so you can have a $40 BBB,
>> a $70 "cape" that connects four stepper motors, and your phone for gui.
>> The step pulse generation is done by the PRU module in the BBB's ARM
>> processor.
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc on arm.contact reliability

[TJoseph Powderly]

i used to use a liquid chemical for hifi snobs called 'tweak'
http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?1652-Contact-Cleaning-The-Right-Stuff

but old dollar bills worked well too due to rag content ( does not apply 
to new plastic money )

i read once that connectors really only had single point contact
so (hehe) maybe solder your bus connectors?

btw use 90% alco not the cheap 70%
test for pcb cleaner: pour it on your hand.. dries invisible or white? = 
ok, else dont use it
hth tomp

On 03/24/2016 05:39 AM, ceen...@in-front.com wrote:
> There isn't a need to exchange parts once they are in place.  Board 
> manufacturers get by with flash gold plated connectors because they are lower 
> cost and the flash plating is only good for so many swipes before the 
> connector cannot meet its original spec of contact resistance, current 
> capacity, etc.  The spec for PCI connector plating Finish 4 is a mere 2 
> mating cycles.  If subject to any vibration like my pneumatic ATC exhibits on 
> the machine it wiggles the contact surfaces just a little and chafes a bit 
> more.  My pick and place accelerates its carriage to maybe 1-2m/s with 
> Sanmotion drives and servos.  You can feel vibration & movement on the frame 
> of the machine no matter how the 1600# machine is anchored down.
>
> My Bridgeport probably started having connector issues after 20 years of use. 
>  Now maybe once a month I get a servo amp fault or other random issue related 
> to the card cage.  I remove the cards and clean PCB fingers with alcohol then 
> insert the cards a number of times to get into fresh metal.  This works again 
> for a while.  I just need something I can count on without the machine 
> faulting.  Then I would make more parts.
>
>
> Dennis
>
>
> On Wed, 23 Mar 2016 15:11
>  wrote:
>
>>   
>>   Do you have to exchange your SATA and PCIe devices very often? I only do
>>   with my test systems. The controllers for machines might get a SATA or
>>   PCIe device swapped once in it's lifetime of several years.
> --
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Re: [Emc-users] RFID Tag or Barcode into LinuxCNC

[TJoseph Powderly]

interesting idea
i played with similar idea on sink edm
where each tool barely moved at a single position ( orbiting)
i thought
"why not program the tool instead of the machine?"
put position depth cutting parms on texas instrument tool chip ( like 
rfid or barcode )
then controller was point to point not contouring
this might make me try the idea again
thanks!
tomp
On 03/24/2016 04:20 PM, giorgio foga wrote:
>
>> To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> From: j...@gnipsel.com
>> Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 15:13:58 -0500
>> Subject: [Emc-users] RFID Tag or Barcode into LinuxCNC
>>
>> Anyone read a RFID tag or barcode and use that to run a subroutine in
>> LinuxCNC?
>>
>> JT
>>
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> No but is no so difficult. Mxxx code with bash code to read a specific 
> mybarcodefile.txt file ... after everery reading cancell all
> Read barcode with terminal bash routine and writing the output on 
> mybarcodefile.txt ... More automation is possible ... for example using a db 
> or file that convert every know barcode in a specific decimal number  (0, 
> 1, 2, 3 ...) your mxxx code in bash can read these number end convert it 
> in int value of switch case statement . you build a program that have 
> only switch case statement  every case correspond to soubroutine call 
> .
>   
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Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc on arm

[TJoseph Powderly]

wow! thx Jeff
tomp

On 03/25/2016 09:54 AM, Jeff Epler wrote:
> I dared myself to fix nml-over-tcp, and got it working this evening.
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Copying G code files from PC to PC

[TJoseph Powderly]

i wonder too
i got wifi sd cards from cameras to work for fujix picture xfers
this eliminated one nonstandard tiny usb cable (which doesnt fit other 
tiny nonstandard usb sockets)
tomp

On 03/25/2016 02:53 AM, Rick Lair wrote:
> I don't know, now you have me wondering,
>
> We do have some WiFi thumb drives, might have to play with that when
> they get off of the machine.
>
> Rick
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Coffecup EDM

[TJoseph Powderly]

hahaha thats great Nicklas.
the action at the gear tells me its real edm too!
thanks
tomp

On 06/19/16 04:08, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I have real machine but coffecup is more handy during development and at last 
> I got my coffecup EDM up and running.
>
> https://youtu.be/fBOl_pCkDFA
>
>
> Nicklas Karlsson
>
> --
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> patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are
> consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow,
> J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning
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Re: [Emc-users] Coffecup EDM

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas hello
some notes in line...

On 06/19/16 17:55, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I tried to tune parameters manually but most of the time is spent either in 
> short circuit or open circuit,
this is called 'hammering'
it actually works but for a poor reason.
if the tools is too far away, you are open
if the tool is too close, it is shorting
For a brief time in transit between these 2 states you DO achieve the 
proper position
and you get _some_ sparks.

the idea is to find the ideal position where sparks occur easily
yiu can find this if you can control the 'edm servo'.


>   see the attached picture. Almost white color is voltage in ADC units and 
> red is adaptive speed, machining is happening in the middle.
You attached the circuit , not a trace of the process inputs and outputs.
> I have no idea if this is normal or bad tuning.
please use a real oscilloscope and monitor your circuits output
and your cut's gap voltage

ignore vertical scale and observe that shorts ( on the gap volatge) very 
quickly create an outfeed command ( on your circuit )

observe open (no load voltages) create an infeed command
( this explanation assumes positive tool, neagtive work piece, copper or 
graphite tool,
and a pulse generator with on and off times , an rc generator look quite 
different )

you likely see opens and shorts but only brief sequences of cutting pulses
and so are unable to achieve a 'steady' process from your description.


I suggest that you observe the cutting on the oscilloscope:
look for signals that look like chairs , like an old straight backed 
wooden chair
these pulses are cutting, and inside a real cutting pulse is some 
information you need. On Sun, 19 Jun


see 
http://nopr.niscair.res.in/bitstream/123456789/13597/1/IJEMS%2018%286%29%20411-415.pdf

the important bit is the voltage level of the 'seat'
IF you tune your circuit to track (servo) near this value
THEN the process will stabilize

in my experience its near 30Vdc for Cu or Gr to Steel
so my circuits allow the user to choose the traget voltage (near 30 for 
the smart operators)
and my circuit finds the ERROR of the real process to the chose target value
That error is fed to drive the motors,

When the system see no error, it does not request any motion
But the error is based on the ideal, not 0 not 100Volts, but the 
_natural discharge value_
of the materials and dielectric in use!

HTH
tomp tjtr33

( theres lots of explanations of this on the web
the best i know was Hr. Schumacher ex- of AGie
its been stolen and copied by most edm manufacturers in their books.
once you see the original you can recognize all the bad copies ;-)
its a series of the different stages of one spark
the magnetic phase, the thermal phase, hydraulic phase,,,
quite a good explanation without needing words.
sorry i cant find a web copy right now
nope 1/2 hr and no originals found, sorry
oh this is pretty good
http://edmtechman.com/about.cfm?pg=2&chap=2#a1


2016 07:19:59 +0700 TJoseph Powderly  wrote:
>> hahaha thats great Nicklas.
>> the action at the gear tells me its real edm too!
>> thanks
>> tomp
>>
>> On 06/19/16 04:08, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>>> I have real machine but coffecup is more handy during development and at 
>>> last I got my coffecup EDM up and running.
>>>
>>> https://youtu.be/fBOl_pCkDFA
>>>
>>>
>>> Nicklas Karlsson
>>>
>>> --
>>> What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic
>>> patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are
>>> consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow,
>>> J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity 
>>> planning
>>> reports. http://sdm.link/zohomanageengine
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>>
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>> patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are
>> consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow,
>> J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity 
>> planning
>> reports. http://sdm.link/zohomanageengine
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Re: [Emc-users] Coffecup EDM

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas hello'
could you do another screenshot, but add the oscillator ( on & off 
command signal )?
it would be easier to interpret
thanks tomp tjtr33

On 06/20/16 00:07, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>> On 06/19/16 17:55, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>>> I tried to tune parameters manually but most of the time is spent either in 
>>> short circuit or open circuit,
>> this is called 'hammering'
>> it actually works but for a poor reason.
>> if the tools is too far away, you are open
>> if the tool is too close, it is shorting
>> For a brief time in transit between these 2 states you DO achieve the
>> proper position
>> and you get _some_ sparks.
>>
>> the idea is to find the ideal position where sparks occur easily
>> yiu can find this if you can control the 'edm servo'.
> Then I now how it should look. I didn't expect something good with my Lego 
> prototype without proper tuning and to low ignition voltage at the first run.
>
>> ...
> You provided exactly the information I needed, thanks!
>
>
> Regards Nicklas Karlsson
>
>
> --
> What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic
> patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are
> consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow,
> J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity planning
> reports. http://sdm.link/zohomanageengine
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Coffecup EDM

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas
regarding 'start of period to count'
there is a concept in EDM that was branded ISOpuls and more genericly 
iso-energetic

it is a method concerning WHEN to begin the on-time count.

to make each spark have same energy
the duration of current flow must be equal
so a circuit to detect the drop from OpenVoltage to DischargeVolatge is used
to trigger the timer for on time.

refer to the previous pdf to see when the 'back of the chair' falls to 
the 'seat of the chair'
that is when the current begins to flow

IF there is no back to the chair, there is a problem
the oil is too conductive ( too thin[shorted/too close] or too dirty or 
too conductive )
IF there is no seat to the chair, there is NO vconduction and you are 
too far or the
oil is too resistive

tap water, de-ionized water, thin automotive oil (0-5-10W)  and kerosene 
all work fine

i used peanut oil once for a medical application where the fda claimed 
the oil based
fluid contaminated the recast layer.

you do use a fairly open voltage (60-80V=) so that will make the oil 
quality more important

if you refer to the previous pdf files you will see the researchers 
BEGIN counting on-time
when the voltage drops

can you see any sparks?
10 ma at 150 was used in AGie L series generator for a decade, so you 
are not far off

you can see sparks and hear what Dave Engvall talks about in this
https://videobin.org/+8ku/bfq.html
the white line below oil is sparks, not bubbles

you could try kerosene ( easy to get, stinks and is flammable, tho i use 
it without fear )

i do not understand the 'spark extinguishing voltage' could you say this 
another way?

the ratio of ignitions to attempts to ignite can be a measure of efficiency
( and an indication of the correctness and stability of the edm servo 
tracking )

regards
TomP

On 06/25/16 15:37, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I investigated further and it seems to matter at which voltage level start of 
> period start to count. As is now current is on during wait for ignition and 
> hence this period may be elongenated with a lover voltage level. Low enough 
> and on time will not start until a sparc happen.
>
> I actually think either ignition current of 10mA is to low or resistance in 
> EDM fluid is to low.
>
> I should finnish of the protocol before running more:
>1. Off and on times. Sparc extinguishing voltage. Start of period voltage.
>2. Measure current and voltage. Count number of sparc and ionization 
> events.
>
>
> Regards Nicklas Karlsson
>
>
>
> On Fri, 24 Jun 2016 18:15:03 -0700
> dengvall  wrote:
>
>> I've not played with EDM for quite  a while.  > 10 years so I've
>> forgotten most of what I knew.
>> I know of people that used hardware store lantern oil as EDM fluid. If
>> it sounds like frying bacon
>> you are in the right range.
>> Sounds (npi)  like  fun. :-)
>>
>> Dave
>>
>> On 06/19/2016 10:07 AM, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
 On 06/19/16 17:55, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I tried to tune parameters manually but most of the time is spent either 
> in short circuit or open circuit,
 this is called 'hammering'
 it actually works but for a poor reason.
 if the tools is too far away, you are open
 if the tool is too close, it is shorting
 For a brief time in transit between these 2 states you DO achieve the
 proper position
 and you get _some_ sparks.

 the idea is to find the ideal position where sparks occur easily
 yiu can find this if you can control the 'edm servo'.
>>> Then I now how it should look. I didn't expect something good with my Lego 
>>> prototype without proper tuning and to low ignition voltage at the first 
>>> run.
>>>
 ...
>>> You provided exactly the information I needed, thanks!
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards Nicklas Karlsson
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and traffic
>>> patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and protocols are
>>> consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for NetFlow,
>>> J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity 
>>> planning
>>> reports. http://sdm.link/zohomanageengine
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
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>> present their vision of the future. This family event has something for
>> everyone, including kids. Get more information and register today.
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Re: [Emc-users] Tool offset

[TJoseph Powderly]

is the part moving or the kerf filling with swarf
thus affecting the size?
tho i cant picture how the part gets larger
maybe in some direction and not overall?
or some sort of stress relief is ocurring
if the above, try glue-stops or tabs
else, i dunno
(fiddler on the roof said.
you want to know why?
I'll tell you..
I dont know )
tomp
tjtr33

On 06/30/16 22:52, Eric H. Johnson wrote:
> I have been looking at several other possibilities, including that. The odd 
> thing is that it only happens with the one material. The densest of the 
> materials we are running.
>
> Thanks,
> Eric
>
>
> On June 30, 2016 11:21:03 AM EDT, Todd  Zuercher 
>  wrote:
>> Just a thought, is there a chance you have an imperfection in your head
>> assembly or the kinimatics, that is causing your cut to be offset
>> slightly?  In other words are the pieces the same size if you cut them
>> out in the opposite direction?
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Eric H. Johnson" 
>> To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2016 11:18:39 AM
>> Subject: [Emc-users] Tool offset
>>
>> All,
>>
>>
>>
>> I am cutting a dense mat material with an ultrasonic knife. It appears
>> that
>> when the fibers are cut I get a small amount of expansion so the part
>> to be
>> inset ends up just a little too large, even though it is cutting
>> exactly the
>> same size as the base in which it is to be inset. I was looking at tool
>> compensations to see if I can adjust the tool path by a very small
>> amount
>> (0.005" - 0.01") to make the inset part just a little bit smaller,
>> following
>> the example here:
>>
>> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.5/html/gcode/tool_compensation.html
>>
>>
>>
>> The pattern runs entirely CW, so G41 should compensate in the
>> appropriate
>> direction.
>>
>>
>>
>> The example shows:
>>
>> G10 L1 P1 R0.25 Z1
>>
>>
>>
>> Does Z1 have any meaning in compensating only in X and Y?
>>
>>
>>
>> If I set the compensation for the entire file, do I have to deal with
>> individual lead-ins?
>>
>>
>>
>> And of course, is there an easier way to accomplish this?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Eric
>>
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Re: [Emc-users] Coffecup EDM

[TJoseph Powderly]

hi nicklas
some dielectric info
http://www.guiacnc.com.br/maquinas-em-geral/eletroerosao-caseira/?action=dlattach;attach=30033

basically the gap distance is goverened by the fluids 'dielectric 
breakdown strength'
a measure of the distance at which a given voltage will allow a 'spark' 
to jump the gap

BP ( british petroleum used to have a wonderful book on this
but i cannot find a web link to the 100+ page large format booklet

the formula is only distance and voltage, current does no matter
the distance is in practice < 0.3mm ( practice says the open voltage is 
300Vdc or less )

the clarity of the oil DOES affect the conducting quality
if filthy, it conducts at 20mm!
if dead clean, NO DIRT AT ALL, you will get hammering cuts
( read you need SOME dirt, not enought to see, but SOME particulate matter )
this is because the 1st phase of the s[park is MAGNETIC, where the field 
between the
anode and cathode builds up and attracts dirt to form the bridge that 
the current crosses
and which you see FLASH )

kerosene for heaters works well
teeny hair sized tools use brownian motion in a drop of oil to flush
matchstick sized tools need light flow ( dribble ) and likely 
intermittent cutting
(like peck drilling )
large tools ( like transmission cases ) benefit from flush holes thru 
electrode
to a pressurized supply line, the outflow is not intense, but a good 
rainfall.

flushing is an art, well at least a  craft/skill
but for you, simply flowing nearby with generous off time (D% < 30%) 
should work
was there a video of the cut?

buildup on end of tool is swarf ~welded back onto tool.
flushing, jumping, and low duty cycles will help

? try advancing to workpiece at 1um steps till discharge occurs
then wait till discharges dissappear ( even when you thump the table )
THEN advance 1um till you spark again

tomp
tjtr33


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Re: [Emc-users] User Report: Rockhopper output to 11x17 paper

[TJoseph Powderly]

PosteRazor?
svg -> bitmap -> poster(multi-page PDF)

tomp

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Re: [Emc-users] OT Hand Held CNC

[TJoseph Powderly]

hahaha
bring the mountain to muhammad
cool!
tjtr33

On 07/15/16 08:03, Marshland Engineering wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxQ_NH4bj9o
>
> and in this one a guy uses it to cut out an adapter plate to put a new
> encoder on an axis motor for his Bridgeport Boss CNC mill, Skip 2 minutes.
>
> https://youtu.be/q8GFpSCK6Jk
>
> Pretty cool stuff.
>
> Cheers Wallace
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Slightly_OT

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hi Dave
I'd say from bottom to top but just my 2c

I'd suggest you look into heat exchangers

they are passive and do not let outside air in
nor inside air out

both airs hit a heat sink barrier on the cabinet wall

inside air temp is affected by the heatsinks temp
but no air passes from inside to outside

i use them on the edm's as the outside air is oily sticky carbon filled
plus whatever other cruft is in the shop air

keeps insides dead clean and cool enough for electrics ( not cold, just 
nice )

again my 2c

tjtr33 tomp

On 07/15/16 01:06, dave wrote:
> I'm trying to bring my Mazak V5 back online.
> Is usual practice to blow the cooling air up thru the unit or suck it
> down and out?
> Both ends have gravel strainers (:-)) on them so that is no help.
> TIA
>
> Dave
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Slightly_OT

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hi Dave,
I'd suggest bot to top ( dont blow down a chimney, heat rises etc )
just my 2c

and i'd suggest looking into heat _exchangers_
passive cooling systems that dont let outside air in
nor inside air out

fans and heatsink on inside circulate internal air
fans and heatsinks on outside circulate ambient air

heat transfers, dirt dont

like these ( no affiliation, just 1st google hit)
http://wangqg0530.en.made-in-china.com/product/nbOQVEfYoaRm/China-Telecom-Cabinet-Heat-Exchanger-HRUC-E-120-D-.html

( at least put furnace filters held on by magnets over gravel strainers ;-)

tjtr33 tomp

On 07/15/16 01:06, dave wrote:
> I'm trying to bring my Mazak V5 back online.
> Is usual practice to blow the cooling air up thru the unit or suck it
> down and out?
> Both ends have gravel strainers (:-)) on them so that is no help.
> TIA
>
> Dave
>


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM with continuous wire?

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hello Gene
Using copper tools to cut steel ( all other variable untouched )
Positive tool is lower wear & slower cut & rougher finish
Negative tool is higher wear & faster cut & finer finish
hth
tomp
tjtr33

http://connection.ebscohost.com/c/articles/66135144/effect-tool-polarity-machining-characteristics-electric-discharge-machining-silver-steel-statistical-modelling-process

http://edmtechman.com/about.cfm?pg=2&chap=8

On 07/21/16 06:27, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Wednesday 20 July 2016 14:14:21 andy pugh wrote:
>
>> On 20 July 2016 at 18:29, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>>> I don't have a mill spindle with the torque enough to turn one of
>>> those at a good enough feed rate to keep it cutting clean, and slow
>>> enough it won't burn dull in seconds.
>> You could use the lathe, I suspect.
> But for edm, I can't turn it so the electrode disk is well covered with
> k2.  EDM leaves no burrs to trim off.  Sitting in a dishwasher soap
> packet container is just right for a nearly 3" disk.
>
> So one final Q for the list, whats the best polarity? I don't recall
> reading that on the wikipedia pages, but I'll go look again. No, it
> doesn't make any polarity assumptions, so I guess I'll go get started.
>
> All I am needing now is to make a wire wrapper for the spindle shank,
> ditto the work piece. Strip 2+ inches, spread it in two and wrap the
> disks arbor shank with one, and the part with the other lead.
>
> Thanks and I'll be back later.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM with continuous wire?

[TJoseph Powderly]

dont spin too fast
SFM is pretty low ( compared to regular grinding )
if too fast you hear the sparking get weak
(try slower to test quick )
the spark can get 'blown out' ( as in candle ) if you move too fast

AGie EDM grinders were used to slot sewing machine carbide plates
and the wheel was 12"dia and near 120 rpm
thats was back in 1970 at Union Special ( mfctr )
my deep mem is not so good ;-(

tomp tjtr33

On 07/21/16 06:35, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Wednesday 20 July 2016 14:30:43 dave wrote:
>
>> Hi gene,
>> I may have come in too late: i.e.
>> Day late and a dollar short. Welcome to the real world.
>> IIUC you want a slot. EDM and a copper disk should do this
>> quite nicely. Hope you get something working.
>>
>> Dave
> I should have it in progress in another 15 minutes.  But the disk
> is .03125" brass I made and arbor for, and in case things are a little
> warped, I ran it at about 300 and set the edge down of a skate bearing
> hard enough to just barely bend it, then ran it back up the post very
> slowly, which should result in it running dead true.  And I can't find
> the small cap, so the discharge is going to be REAL as the cap is a 10
> UF oil filled paper.  Noisy as hell too. So we should be able to see if
> its going to work yet tonight,
>
> Take care Dave.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM with continuous wire?

[TJoseph Powderly]

Gene
once again your post title ran me off as i took it to be correct
your post is titled  'continuous wire'
not disk, hahaha

if you wanted continuous wire
( reciprocating versus single direction, using capstan windlass rewinder)
then look at

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoV8UXtLYmE

Andre has a few linuxcnc videos

the wire is tungsten, it is fed very fast, then REWOUND and the path 
continues
if the wire breaks, it immediately fills the room with a tangle
the machines are cheap ( compared to normal single use wire types ),
the dielectric is milling machine cutting fluid dribbled onto top guide
the wire can be reused a LOT
the machines use a lathe spindle-like feed and rewinder
a cnc coping saw for steel ;-)
tomp
tjtr33

On 07/21/16 06:35, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Wednesday 20 July 2016 14:30:43 dave wrote:
>
>> Hi gene,
>> I may have come in too late: i.e.
>> Day late and a dollar short. Welcome to the real world.
>> IIUC you want a slot. EDM and a copper disk should do this
>> quite nicely. Hope you get something working.
>>
>> Dave
> I should have it in progress in another 15 minutes.  But the disk
> is .03125" brass I made and arbor for, and in case things are a little
> warped, I ran it at about 300 and set the edge down of a skate bearing
> hard enough to just barely bend it, then ran it back up the post very
> slowly, which should result in it running dead true.  And I can't find
> the small cap, so the discharge is going to be REAL as the cap is a 10
> UF oil filled paper.  Noisy as hell too. So we should be able to see if
> its going to work yet tonight,
>
> Take care Dave.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM with continuous wire?

[TJoseph Powderly]

Gene
in this vid

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccYE0ICp5F8
he shows a better pyvcp panel ( and shows he's likely using a parport)
AND hahaha hes using an old AGie 60L generator for power
AND a home-made 'crossbow' wire feed on a stock sinker
( with linuxcnc moving the slides )

got a Polish friend? he's done a boatload of work on this.
the webpage shows a lot more info

Imea & Istema ( edm tooling mfctrs now defunct, bought out by Georg 
Fischer )
both made 'crossbows' to mount on sink edms
the wire moved from left spool to right spool
cutting direction was in YZ plane, the wire tool aligned with X

Andre's setup is more like a coping saw than cross bow

tomp tjtr33

On 07/21/16 06:35, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Wednesday 20 July 2016 14:30:43 dave wrote:
>
>> Hi gene,
>> I may have come in too late: i.e.
>> Day late and a dollar short. Welcome to the real world.
>> IIUC you want a slot. EDM and a copper disk should do this
>> quite nicely. Hope you get something working.
>>
>> Dave
> I should have it in progress in another 15 minutes.  But the disk
> is .03125" brass I made and arbor for, and in case things are a little
> warped, I ran it at about 300 and set the edge down of a skate bearing
> hard enough to just barely bend it, then ran it back up the post very
> slowly, which should result in it running dead true.  And I can't find
> the small cap, so the discharge is going to be REAL as the cap is a 10
> UF oil filled paper.  Noisy as hell too. So we should be able to see if
> its going to work yet tonight,
>
> Take care Dave.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM with continuous wire?

[TJoseph Powderly]

sounds great gene
yes you were 'negative polarity'
( in usa the old elox company called this standard )
brass works fine too, more forgiving
if the tool gets black you are getting closer to lo wear
tho low wear for brass is like high wear for graphite
you're using an rc generator... so dontworryaboutit (james caan)
everythings relative ;-)
1/32 slot? automatic? sweet.
movies at noon?
tomp tjtr33

On 07/21/16 11:51, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Wednesday 20 July 2016 22:34:00 TJoseph Powderly wrote:
>
>> Hello Gene
>> Using copper tools to cut steel ( all other variable untouched )
>> Positive tool is lower wear & slower cut & rougher finish
>> Negative tool is higher wear & faster cut & finer finish
>> hth
>> tomp
>> tjtr33
> No copper flashing handy, so I used a thin sheet of brass. I made an
> arbor to hold a disk, then cut out a 3" disk which I ran against a skate
> wheel bearing hard on the down face, enough to bend it slightly, then
> followed the demag procedure and lifted it back off the bearing slowly
> so it would stop bending at the point  where it ran dead true. But the
> 1/8" center hole and a 3mm0.5 retainer screw were off center just enough
> it took an hour to burn the edge concentric, but once that was done I
> could, for shade tree edm, march it right along at about 30 minutes a
> slot.  Burn current about 1/2 amp average. I had glued with some si
> glue, a nut to the far end so I could lay it down on the flat, but the
> GO2 wasn't fully set, so the K2 screwed the adhesion enough the nut fell
> off just now. I have one more slot to cut, so I'll see if any of my
> superglue is usable tomorrow.
>
> In resuscitating  my previously built edm power supply, I found I'd put a
> dpdt switch so I could reverse it, but the way I hooked it up, the dvm
> said I had + on the workpiece. It seemed to work ok considering the
> voltage was only in the 30 something range. That would match up with
> your - on the tool.
>
> Thanks Tomp.
>
>> http://connection.ebscohost.com/c/articles/66135144/effect-tool-polari
>> ty-machining-characteristics-electric-discharge-machining-silver-steel-
>> statistical-modelling-process
> I bookmarked this one. good discussion.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM with continuous wire?

[TJoseph Powderly]

tungsten moly wire is used for those reciprocating wedm's
not a loop, but unwound slow thru cut, then rapid rewound during a pause
when feed spool is sensed to be low
tiny stuff but tough and re-usable
all tools have pros & cons
this stuff is triangular, tough and hell on guides (carbide pins )
cheap because of tool life
and great with cheap labor that can untangle the break
and rewind it onto the spool ( read Chinese/Indian workers )
or American DIY types ( 0 pay levels ;-)
tjtr33
tomp

On 07/21/16 12:16, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Thursday 21 July 2016 00:00:12 TJoseph Powderly wrote:
>
>> Gene
>> once again your post title ran me off as i took it to be correct
>> your post is titled  'continuous wire'
>> not disk, hahaha
>>
> My bad Tomp, I thought about it, but understood quickly that such a
> machine was way above my pay grade.  I was wondering if something
> using just a couple feet of wire, butt welded like a bandsaw blade,
> might be possible. Or would the wire, flooded for coolant, still burn up
> rapidly?
>
> Thanks Tomp.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM with continuous wire?

[TJoseph Powderly]

Jon hello

On 07/21/16 21:32, Jon Elson wrote:
> On 07/21/2016 12:16 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> On Thursday 21 July 2016 00:00:12 TJoseph Powderly wrote:
>>
>>> Gene
>>> once again your post title ran me off as i took it to be correct
>>> your post is titled  'continuous wire'
>>> not disk, hahahathe rewind was fast
>>> only
>> My bad Tomp, I thought about it, but understood quickly that such a
>> machine was way above my pay grade.  I was wondering if something
>> using just a couple feet of wire, butt welded like a bandsaw blade,
>> might be possible. Or would the wire, flooded for coolant, still burn up
>> rapidly?
>>
>>
> Robert Langlois (wrote a book on EDM that was published by Village
> Press) showed a wire EDM at the old NAMES shows.  He used a molybdenum
> wire that ran back and forth between large rollers.  So, he probably had
> something like 20 feet of wire in the machine, and it reversed when it
> neared either end.  The rate of the wire movement was not very fast,
> maybe a few feet per minute.
I did not know Langlois had a reciprocating wedm.
On these chinese/taiwanese/indian machines only the rewind was fast
the forward rate was slow, as moly has little wear
in normal wedm the feet/min is high to keep the damage to the wire (wear)
spread over a larger length.
>   Jon
thx tomp tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] I did hit a lick today

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hi Gene
some reports on ATS-667
" What I found is that the polarity of the output is not the same when 
the unit is powered with a tooth in sensing range as it is when a tooth 
is not there! "

http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=131&t=45528

and suggests a similar product from Honeywell
http://sensing.honeywell.com/1gt101dc-hall-effect-gear-tooth-sensor-88720-sep91-install.pdf

or this one from taiwan
http://www.chiarey.com/products-en.html
look for Guboa HiSpeed sensors

just fyi
tomp

On 07/22/16 11:43, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Thursday 21 July 2016 23:54:31 Gene Heskett wrote:
>
>> Greetings all;
>>
>> Just for S&G I stopped at the place that still has that old Porter
>> lathe he wanted $500 for a couple years ago. About a 16"er, 6 foot or
>> more bed, but no motor.  It would have been at least a year at my pace
>> to bring it back to life.
>>
>> But that wasn't the surprise.  That was in the form of an old air
>> compressor he had taken as junk from the local horsepistol in a
>> remodel/upgrade of some sort. One big horizontal tank, with two
>> overhead pads on it, each of which held a single cylinder, 1 hp
>> compressor, and each had its own 1HP 3 phase 230 volt Dayton motor
>> that spun very freely and had no endplay, so since the bearing numbers
>> were on the label, I have to assume ball bearing. I offered him 50
>> bucks for both of them.
>>
>> Next thing I knew, he was dragging out the cutting torch because the
>> bolts were rusted and hard to get to, so both are sitting on my garage
>> floor right now.
>>
>> I have company, 2 of my boys will be in Sunday thru Tuesday this next
>> week, so we'll have to make a trip, maybe two, to the rifle range, but
>> if I can find a round tuit before then, I'll have both of them
>> clipleaded to that 1.5 HP rated inverter & see how they like running a
>> bit faster than 60 hz for 1750 revs.
>>
>> In other words, I found a motor, and with luck a spare that I can run
>> with linuxcnc for rigid tapping and such on this Sheldon.  One more
>> problem solved, although I may have to build a lock pin of some sort
>> to keep from unscrewing the chuck with a quick reverse.  And now I
>> need to find where to put an encoder on it.  More shade tree
>> engineering I think.
>>
>> So things are looking up at a bit better angle. ;-)
>>
>> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> I just went out and stared at it for a couple minutes, and something
> along the lines of Jon's Bridgeport and the hall effect sensors Jon
> Elson used looks doable.  But with this motor potentially having the
> ability to do 8k rpms with this inverter, and the big gear on the
> spindle right behind the front bearing looks like a good candidate, but
> this motor has the ability to turn the spindle well above the 1300 it
> can do now (faster than I'd be comfy standing in line with it) and thats
> about 10EE20 teeth a minute gong by a hall when its throwing lube oil 20
> feet.  So my question is, since that gear must have at least 100 teeth,
> are the halls that fast?
>
> I just pulled the allegro ATS-667 datasheet to see if I can get any
> schmardter. Looking at that, 10u-s on delay, sub-microsecond off delay,
> So it should to twenty kilohertz. So it should work up to anything I'd
> be comfy around. I'll have to eyeball some more for an index trigger
> though.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] Q:Using threading tools to do the initial tapering operation.

[TJoseph Powderly]

On 07/29/16 16:07, andy pugh wrote:
> On 29 July 2016 at 02:49, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>> There does appear to be a flat on
>> the tip, perhaps a thou wide.
> Should there be?
>
> What exactly, is this tapered thread?

is it a pipe thread? maybe for a pipe plug common on molds for water lines?

> Note that in the US there is a flat on the thread, but the flat size
> is modified to eliminate the spiral leak path:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_pipe_thread
>
> In the rest of the world the thread-form is Whitworth, with rounded
> peaks and troughs:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Standard_Pipe
>
> To add to the fun, one is 60 degrees and the other is 55 degrees.
>
tjtr33 tomp

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Re: [Emc-users] Ubuntu Lucid package server

[TJoseph Powderly]

set your apt tool to KEEP any downloads
occasionally dupe the cache
you will end up with a local set of debs to install
googling 'install downloaded debs'
gets you...
"""
You can *install* it using apt-get *install* package_name . But first 
move your *deb* file to /var/cache/apt/archives/ directory. After 
executing this command, it will automatically *download* its 
dependencies. *Install* gdebi and open your .*deb* file using it 
(Right-click -> Open with).
"""
theres many more ways to do this
but
“/God bless the child/ that's got his /own"
/billie holiday

tomp tjtr33

On 08/06/16 20:07, John Thornton wrote:
> Change your /etc/apt/sources.list to the following, the linuxcnc deb
> should not be changed
>
> deb http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ lucid main restricted
> universe multiverse
> deb http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ lucid-updates main restricted
> universe multiverse
> deb http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ lucid-security main
> restricted universe multiverse
> deb http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ lucid-backports main
> restricted universe multiverse
>
> JT
>
>
> On 8/6/2016 5:52 AM, Marius Liebenberg wrote:
>> Does anyone know of a package server for Ubuntu 10.04 Lucid that is
>> still up and running. Since the support for Lucid was dropped I cannot
>> update or install any packages on my PathPilot machine. I had to
>> reinstall the machine as it dropped the hard drive. Now with no support
>> for Lucid I cannot get any packages.
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Regards / Groete
>>
>> Marius D. Liebenberg
>> +27 82 698 3251
>> +27 12 743 6064
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Re: [Emc-users] EDM gap control

[TJoseph Powderly]

  Hello Nicklas,

On 08/17/16 00:40, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I have tried to use voltage to control EDM gap distance but are not sure this 
> is the correct method. I found a paper there someone suggested gap resistance 
> is a non linear function of gap distance.
the gap resistance is used indirectly..
first the dielectric constant of the fluid is 'like' a resistor ( untill 
a plasma spark is let thru it)
so, the voltage across this resistor can be a measure of the gap distance

>
> They also stated ignition delay time depend on gap distance.
if the ignition delay beocmes low, it indicates the tool is too close or 
the gap fluid resistance has changed ( read 'dirty', and therefore less 
resistance )

so it is not an analog a method as teh gap resistance,
more like a boolean saying "get back & wait longer between sparks!"

> I am not totally sure if there is a correlation between gap distance and have 
> not seen it in my measurements.

  

  Regards Nicklas Karlsson

--

some edm models use it i'll try to dig some up pretty technical but you 
seem to handle these data fine ;-) here:
*http://tinyurl.com/h4p32ny* checkout Rig in section 3.2 "Ignition 
Phase" """ The gap voltage is refers to the voltage through resistor Rig 
which is become a voltage divider between resistors Rig and Rshunt. """ 
Rig is the resistance to the inition ( the gap resistance ) Rshint is 
the current limiting resistor in a classic transistiorized generator. 
This article makes no determination of distance according to the result, 
getting a number is not the way an electronic (non-math) servo works. an 
electrical servo balances the voltage you want to the voltage you got. 
distance is just a by-product, outside of the servo. do you want a 
number? if so, why? also here: 
http://www.wseas.us/e-library/transactions/systems/2009/29-363.pdf and 
at http://documents.tips search for Modeling and adaptive control of EDM systems
(good paper by Dr Rajakur at Uni Nebraska , he's prolific in these papers)

you'll have to wade thru 'gotchas' and other cruft but no signup, no 
fee, no tracking

hth tomp tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] A question on relays.

[TJoseph Powderly]

Gregg,
take a look at the poster pdf from bosch

http://br.bosch-automotive.com/media/parts/electrical_systems_accessories__auto_parts/relays_magnets__e_s_a/downloads_7/MKG3_Relaisposter_de_GZ.pdf

and look at the terminal numbers
then look at the


  DIN 72552

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DIN_72552

thats as much of a standard as i know
not specific to the physical plug arrangement
but a step in the right dir

(note to self #30 is direct to battery ;-)

hth
tomp tjtr33

On 08/19/16 07:53, Gregg Eshelman wrote:
> Is there an industry standard designation for the contact arrangement on the 
> common 12 volt DC relay that has five spade lugs like this one?
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0010ADJIE/
>
> I want to find a 12 volt relay for that style socket with the highest amp and 
> heat rating available, but without knowing exactly what that base type is 
> called, I keep getting results for huge numbers of relays that are 
> incompatible.
> What would be ideal is a solid state "ice cube" relay of that same external 
> dimensions, without a mounting tab, and able to handle 15~20 amps at elevated 
> temperature. That's quite likely a unicorn...
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Re: [Emc-users] EDM gap control

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hello Nicklas,

On 08/21/16 23:08, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
  Hello Nicklas, On 08/17/16 00:40, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>>> I have tried to use voltage to control EDM gap distance but are not sure 
>>> this is the correct method. I found a paper there someone suggested gap 
>>> resistance is a non linear function of gap distance.
>> the gap resistance is used indirectly..
>> first the dielectric constant of the fluid is 'like' a resistor ( untill
>> a plasma spark is let thru it)
>> so, the voltage across this resistor can be a measure of the gap distance
> I measure voltage in the middle of the plasma sparc and guess this is wrong.

nothing wrong with sampling in midlle of discharge
you know the discharge rate is much faster than your machine can react
so even an average discharge volatge is ok
(like a smaple and hold gated by on-time)

> I will try time to measure ionization time instead this is also inline with 
> what I have also seen somewhere in scientefic papers.
the ionization time is less suited to driving the servo
it is more suited to a safety strategy for when gap control is lost
read more, i think  the papers say it is not the primary servo loop input

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tomp
tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] Wat OT: Question about injection molding of PVC

[TJoseph Powderly]

if the picture is the final product...
why not air weld 4 strips together?

chamfer the mating edges and fill with 'rod' of same material

google 'weld pvc' for more

this is used on plastic window sets as example

parts of Linuxcnc Hal and tricks from machinekit/reprap extruders can be 
used to automate this

( plus a jig ;-)

HTH
tjtr33/tomp

On 10/16/16 07:12, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:
> e pictureHello to all.
>
> I'm sure here I'm going to find good answers so I decided to start from
> here.
>
> I'm planning to do some thermoforming production work but the sheet plastic
> I need to use is rectangular with a rectangular hole in the middle (I
> attached a picture so you can see). So to use regular PVC sheet would imply
> a lot of waste.
>
> I came up with the idea of injecting the PVC using a manual clamped mould
> and injecting it with a screw driven piston. The difficult part comes here,
> I need to inject almost 3 kg of PVC. The moulds are going to be pretty
> simple as you can see but I would like to know if there's any good source
> to determine the approximate power I would need to drive the screw that
> moves the piston.
>
> There's the possibility of using two pistons one on each side to make
> things easier. Off course I would need to reduce the motors with worm and
> gear and then connect the gear to the screw that drives the piston. But my
> main concern is if this approach is correct or if I should forget about it.
>
> I didn't even consider the hydraulic pump because the cost would be a lot.
> Also take into account that I'm not intending to make lots of these
> injections per hour, so injection times could be slower than the industry
> standard.
>
> I hope I've been clear about my doubts and I would be thankful if you can
> point me to any source of info about this, or help me to be more sure about
> the dimensions of what I need to do.
>
> Thanks as always!
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit? --> LinuxCNC computer

[TJoseph Powderly]

Andrew
yes,many variants available, many bundles available

check closely the sata specs, its not so hot,

i liked the onboard wifi but see warnings about linux and the wifi chip

so, maybe i try the 9$ 'one' and the 'plus2' at 49$ still cheap :-)

damn i just looked into the drawer fulla dinosaur controller boards :-(

anybody wannabuy some ? :-p

bari...
hiya, did you pick the 'one' as the best of the litter?

tomp tjtr33


On 10/23/16 17:35, Andrew wrote:
> Right, now I see that they have a lot of models. Top model Plus 2 even
> supports SATA, but it's $49 and needs a special $4 SATA cable.
>
> I wonder why they don't sell similar boards with small LCD touchscreens.
> There are 5" smartphones for $50, now I would like it without SIM and
> battery but with HDMI, LAN etc.
>
> Andrew
>
> 2016-10-23 12:58 GMT+03:00 Gregg Eshelman :
>
>> Looks like 4 or 5 models on the website. If one can handle a touchscreen,
>> and can somehow be interfaced to the thermostats etc. in a cooktop and
>> oven, I'd be interested in modifying and old GE P7 range to replace the
>> mechanical clock/timer on the front with an LCD. I'd also replace the
>> burner control knobs with flat things that have an LED ring to indicate
>> their settings, operated via the touchscreen.
>>
>>
>>From: Andrew 
>>   To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
>>   Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2016 2:43 AM
>>   Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit? --> LinuxCNC computer
>>
>> Note that there are two versions of Orange Pi: PC (1GB RAM, more
>> connectors) for $15 and One (512MB and less connectors) for $10.
>> I think I'd prefer 1GB. I'd buy immediately but I already have a spare Pi 2
>> )
>> Anyways, incredible prices!
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>> 2016-10-23 1:06 GMT+03:00 Dave Cole :
>>
>>> I went to the orangepi.org page and clicked on sellers and it can be
>>> bought for $9.99!  Wow.. crazy! 8-)
>>> The cords will cost more than the computer!
>>> I think I need to raid the spare change jar and buy a few computers.
>>> Dave
>>>
>>>
>>> On 10/22/2016 3:52 PM, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
 Seems like a cheap good LinuxCNC computer, maybe a split between user
>>> interface and real time is not needed. If I get it correct software is
>>> stored in flash and then I guess it also boot fast.

 On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 13:44:47 -0500
 bari  wrote:

> The Orange pi is ~$15 and uses the Allwinner H3.
>
> http://www.orangepi.org/orangepione/
> http://linux-sunxi.org/H3
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Orange-Pi-PC-linux-and-
>>> android-mini-PC-Beyond-Raspberry-Pi-2/32448079125.html
> It has native Ethernet (not over USB) so it can use hm2_eth with Mesa
> 7i92 FPGA.
>
> Axis runs pretty smoothly at HD res using llvmpipe since it has 4
>> cores.
> Runs without anything TI or Machinekit.
>
> -Bari
>
> On 10/19/2016 11:26 PM, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>>> ...
>>> While I use many BeagleBones to control various machines exactly the
>>> way you describe (using an HDMI monitor and KB/Mouse connected to
>> the
>>> BBB), it is not nearly the same user experience as running on an x86
>>> PC.  Everything is noticeably slower on the BBB, and graphics
>>> performance is particularly horrid (to the point that the 3D preview
>>> display is essentially unusable).
>> Sound like the real time stuff on Raspberry or BBB and an ordinary
>>> computer for user interface is the way to go for all systems with an
>>> ordinary user interface.
>> 
>>> --
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>>> _

Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit?

[TJoseph Powderly]

for orange pi et al
7" lcd with touch screen
and some notes on what the plus2 lacks
in this discussion:

http://www.orangepi.org/orangepibbsen/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=192&extra=&page=3


tjtr33 tomp


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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit? --> LinuxCNC on arm

[TJoseph Powderly]

grazie molto
io ho3 floppyper il test
tomp tjtr33

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[Emc-users] good tools was Re: An observation on digital calipers

[TJoseph Powderly]

maybe non-machinists/new-machinists could use a list of good tools
maybe a wiki page?
whats your goto tools?

mine
Starret 6" pocket scale decimal inches
Helios vernier ( not even dial ;-)
NSK 1-2-3 mike set with standards
Starret  deep mike ( blade type for mold ribs)
Indicol and Noga indicator holders
Tesa and Compac geneve indicators
Suburban angle plates, vises, and parallels
KantTwist clamps
Bear  (norton) round flat stone to clean table
Arkansas White stone for HScutters

good tools aint cheap, instead they are good ;-)

maybe suggest...not the best stuff, but the middle ground good bang for 
the buck stuff
regards
tomp tjtr33

On 10/31/16 19:03, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:
> 2016-10-31 8:28 GMT-03:00 andy pugh :
>
>> My little digital caliper is playing up. It could just be a low
>> battery, it has been flashing the LCD for at least a year.
>> (As an aside, why do they run normally for about a week then flash the
>> display for about a year?)
>> Anyway, moving the slider very slowly it goes from 0.3995" straight to
>> 1.200", then acts a bit random until it switches from 1,499 to a
>> (correct) 0.800"
>> Which surprised me, I had assumed that the basic units of the scale
>> were metric.
>>
> Is this a Mitutoyo one? I have one of these that was purchased in 1993 and
> it works quite well except when there's a lot of humidity and you have to
> clean the travel surface because it starts to jump numbers giving
> ridiculous readings. This also happens when the battery is low.
>
> I also tried a cheap chinesse one but it's was a disaster. Then I found
> these Mitutoyo that are extremely cheap and come from China but I don't
> know what to think.
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mitutoyo-500-196-20-30-300mm-12-Absolute-Digital-Digimatic-Vernier-Caliper-/331999662209?hash=item4d4cb8d081:g:jRQAAOSw-CpYAH26
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] armbian vs raspian Q

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hello Gene
I have just mounted heatsinks on a new OPI+2e ( lapped and siliconed 
with crazy glued corner dots )

will you be using  armbian jessie desktop version?

Armbian_5.20_Orangepiplus2e_Debian_jessie_3.4.112_desktop.7z
downloaded from https://www.armbian.com/orange-pi-plus-2e/

or

Lubuntu_1404_For_OrangePi_Plus2E_v0_8_0.img.xz
you can find the Lubuntu img by logging into google drive then searching 
for that exact text
i'm dloading that now incase you are using Lubuntu instead of Armbian

dloading from the chinese sights is difficult , the web pages are hard 
to follow and the dload often aborts
with a direct url i cant wget or rsync :-) so its try try again
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Re: [Emc-users] armbian vs raspian Q

[TJoseph Powderly]

Last nite booted lubuntu on OPI+2e
heat sinks and a good 3a5v supply are neccesary

slow boot but great desktop, lotsa apps and very slow screen refresh
i knew this would happen so I am not disheartened

i ran some apps and web browsing on chromium and firefox, both were slow
slow meaning it was often difficult to tell if the system was hung or 
just busy

i shut it all down and will now read up on llvmpipe
www.mesa3d.org/llvmpipe.html

thanks bari

btw:
the user experience is same as on cubieboard when using any image other 
than supplied android
i did not try the built in os on the OPI+2e yet

btwbtw:
i do not expect Chinese to speak English as well as I
so i do not expect their websites to work as well as western sites
i do not expect the default buttons to mean _my_ perception of  'yes or 
no', 'submit or cancel'
there are _very_ basic differences in mindsets at work

Thinking things 'must be' just   Does Not Work (tm)

tomp tjtr33



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Re: [Emc-users] OT: Mazak turret clamp problem

[TJoseph Powderly]

i dont have an emc solution
i dont have a solution specific to your machine
but we used a system and a plc that may be an idea

(we integrated a load of toolchangers from different companies to 
Heidenhain and Fanuc controls)

1st we used a pressure sensor for the entire system,
  we didnt attempt tool change if pressure was low
  this idea can be used on the line where

"""the electrovalve keeps blowing until I turn off """

valves can be used to isolate the line in question and test for backpressure

and for the good/bad clamp issue
we had a solenoid with a line and another pressure sensor
it fed a tiny hole on the clamping surface
IF the tool seated well, it would stop air flow after a short ( 100mS ) 
time , pressure would rise
IF the tool was NOTSEATED the code could try again a few times before 
aborting and signalling, pressure would NOT rise
IF the tool was NOT UNCLAMPED we could also try to re-release in the PLC

by using 'backpressure' we could evaluate the seating/releasing of the tool

HTH
tom tjtr33

On 11/25/16 02:28, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:
> Hello to all.
>
> I have a little problem (I hope it's a little one) with the claping on the
> turret of the Mazak QT20.
>
> The clamping works with a hydropneumatic system and by looking at it, it
> has some amplificators of force on the back of the charriot.
>
> The problem is, the turret won't unclamp sometimes, and if it does it takes
> a little while. Then when it clamps again sometimes I can see it's not a
> soft and natural clamping. We checked and replaced the o-rings on the
> turrent side, and I checked the electrovalves on the back. The valves
> seemed to be a little sticky on the return stroke but I cleaned and
> lubricate them and by hand the worked ok. I don't know if that could cause
> the erratic problem.
>
> Another thing that happens when the turret doesn't want to unclamp, is that
> the air relief on the electrovalve keeps blowing until I turn off the
> machine or until I press the clamp button again. (When this happens the
> turret doesn't even want to unclamp).
>
> I can't find any docs about the circuit, and I don't have schematics about
> the hydropneumatic circuit on the manuals I have. So I came to the only
> place I know I will have the best answers :)
>
> Thank as always!
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] another update, the r-pi 3b is running it all!

[TJoseph Powderly]

for whoever got the odroid,
have a look at
https://github.com/jepler/u3-7i90
and
https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/QzWVEFEG

i just stumbled upon that link and it may require the odroid xu4 now

the rpi3b looks like it may have a larger following and therefore 'support'
but the odroid looked promising to some devs for some time

tomp tjtr33

On 11/30/16 05:01, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Greetings all;
>
> The latest raspian kernel is a 4.4 something, so I re-downloaded the full
> image, copied off some of what was on the sd card that I would need
> later, then wrote the whole 4.3Gb image to the u-SD card. Then before I
> ever plugged it into the 3b, I went into the install and made myself
> user 1000, renamed the home dir, and made sure I had the apt source.list
> up to date. Had a minor battle with network-mangler, but finally made
> enough of the network stuff immutable so N-M couldn't screw it up.
> Biggest nuisance so far is that the PIXEL x server is "smoothing" the
> mouse motions, a fancy  way of saying theres a big, second or so lag
> when you move the mouse, very distracting.  But uspace-linuxcnc is
> running, gfx and all, on the R-Pi 3b, smoothly enough for this picky old
> man.  So I'll have to find another place to use the odroid64-c2.
>
> I'm trying not to break my arm patting myself on the back. ;-)
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas congratualtions
of course I would test
I am off this morning for a week
but would look at the new year
Merry Christmas & Happy New Year to you & all the developers of Linuxcnc
tomp tjtr33

On 12/20/16 03:11, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> Finally I have all the necessary hardware parts, some are still on desktop 
> not connected to machine but they are tested to work: servo drives, digital 
> IO, spark generator.
>
> Right now I start to think about user interface and as I remember someone 
> started work on this earlier.
>
>
> If anyone is interested I could share hardware drawings or others. I also 
> changed a few rows in drivers so that positions are sent instead of speed and 
> put control loop local.
>
>
>
> Regards Nicklas Karlsson
>
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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas hello

2 basic motion types are useful ( at least 2 )

1 is jumping, a way to remove debris,
  the debris generated in erosion needs to be removed,
it lowers the conduction of the environment and disturbs a voltage drop 
based control
  flushing thru the tool is very good but it is difficult to put small 
flushing holes thru the tool
  these holes need to be so small that the overcut is slightly larger 
than the radius
  when such a small hole is used, there is no 'pin' left in the hole
  a pin is easily thermally deformed and shorts the tools and disturbs 
the control
  a large pin is strong but needs to be removed mechanically afterwards 
( extra machining )

  so, without these holes,the motion of jumping is used.
  no holes are made in the tool
  the method is to cut for a while, then retract some distance and 
return to the cut
  this action 'pumps' clean fluid in and dirty fluid out
  it is very effective and the user does not need tiny deep holes thru 
the tool
  (I've drill many feet of .012" holes thru graphite electrodes)
  really high speed jumping will even remove carbon deposits on the 
tools ( these deposits change the conduction too )
  ( this carbon is not from the tool but from the electrical splitting 
of the oil into hydrogen and carbon )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNSh_OL035E
  jumping is a great aid in cutting and even in arc prevention

2 is orbiting
  orbiting is a motion related to cutter compensation
  the tool size can be exagerrated by motion, and the exaggeration is 
programmable

  the tool is smaller than the desired form by an amount that is suited 
to the roughing power settings
  after roughing, the same tool can be used to finish despite it's 
energy envelope is smaller
  the smaller energy envelope would not 'reach' the work surface UNLESS 
the tool is moved off center
  the tool is moved to make it describe a larger tools volume.

  orbiting can be 2 or 3D in motion and 2 or 3D in undersize.
http://www.edm.kd-solution.com/en_edm11.html
  the big reason to orbit is to reduce the cost of making the electrodes
  in most cuts you need multiple electrodes to make a single form
  because there is wear on the tool when it is used
  and
  each tool has to be replaced onto the tool holder in _exactly_ the 
same position, orientation, and shape
  in old non-orbited sink edm different sized tools of the _same_ shape 
were made and this was very expensive and time consuming
  these tools were the rougher pre-finisher and finishing electrodes
  with orbiting AND good tooling, only a single form has  to be produced 
(say 3 to 5 times for high precision cavity )

  so you can make a 1" cube cavty with a .990 cube rougher and .996 
prefinisher and .998" finisher
  OR
  make 3 pcs .990" cube   see its just easier to maintain precision
  also
  orbiting lets you adjust the final size ( you can make the tool too 
small and still egt the right final form and precision

  the tool MUST be made with the orbit used in mind
  the cnc edm will 'unwrap' the undersized that is 'warpped' onto the 
electrode

  there are limitationa and tradeoffs to be considered ( generated 
corner radii, cutting times, and more )

so jumping ( esp high speed jumping ) is really a flushing technique
and
orbiting is a way to make precision cavities with better control over 
production and cost


in general, edm is only used of neccesary and modern high speed mills 
have reduced the need for most sink edm work
but the are forms that the mills can NOT do
sharp inside blind corners
and
thin deep ribs

in these operations sink edm has a strong position, and needs good 
strategies to remove stock efficiently
orbiting and jumping are basic strategies that are proven to make money 
for tool makers

theres a load to this
I have written edm orbting routines on Fanuc System 8 thru 11 and for 
Heidenhains 306/406/416 series
the orbits always communicate to the erosion power settings databases to 
determine the new 'radius' of expansion
so its a lot like cutter comp being used for roughing then finishing passes

regards
tomp tjtr33

On 12/20/16 20:50, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> Yes I am retrofitting an old EDM machine. It have been a year two before I
> started but finally I have  all the needed hardware. As is now I am
> starting to think about user interface and could vaguley remember somebody
> talked about it earlier, worst problem is probably I am not totally sure
> what is exactly needed and then it come to motions basically have very
> little knowledge what moves might be useful.
>
> 2016-12-20 13:04 GMT+01:00 Sarah Armstrong :
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas
'ram' is another way to say 'sink' eroding, the kind that uses a shaped tool
'wire' is for cutting thru a plate
'tube' or 'drill' or hole popper' for holes
'grinder' for for open surfaces

multiple solenoids can be used to control flow
if a series of ports are on a single feeding pipe
then the output of 1 has most pressure and least flow
and
when 6 ports of same size are open, the result is more flow and less 
pressure
i think monitoring/sensing flow is more useful than pressure
in my experiance low flushing pressure with 'enough' flow reduces wear
and high pressure increases wear
i have used radically high pressure on rib cuts and got high removal 
rates ( high penetration speeds )
but always had high wear, and even risked deforming the thin long tool. 
(jumpin is more practical IMO )

in some machines, we had a variable flow control
it was essentially a dc motor connected to simple garden valve
there was a limit switch set to indicate when the valve was closed
software control of flow was simple
if you wanted a new flow rate...
close the valve ( turn motor in one direction till switch closed )
then back the motor off N plc cycle periods ( this opened the valve 
proportional to the time )
a flow gauge was used to set the levels , so each machines' plumbing 
variations didnt matter to the lookup table

tomp tjtr33

On 12/20/16 23:21, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I do not know if it is called ram, it is four axis: x,y,z,c. There is 
> some backward reverse run functionality in another branch I tried on 
> EDM spark generator a few months ago. I also have a wire EDM machine 
> but this will come later on. I started to look towards gladevcp 
> yesterday. In first instance I am unsure how user interface should 
> look and the which commnands/motions are useful. There is a row 
> solenoids connected to flow and I guess it is useful to have these in 
> user interface and commands but have no idea how this use to be done? 
> Anybody have a picture?


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Re: [Emc-users] strange problem loading linuxcnc

[TJoseph Powderly]

Gene merry Christmas


On 12/23/16 00:49, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Thursday 22 December 2016 11:13:04 andy pugh wrote:
>
>> On 22 December 2016 at 16:05, W. Martinjak 
> wrote:
>>> 'can give an all-clear for 2.8.0-pre1-277.
>>> It works flawlessly here.
>> Could you clone that SD card and send Gene the image?
> great idea Andy, but this isp I have would bounce it, too big.
some sub stick and sd cards gave me problems, esp going from ext formats 
to fat and back

wiping the card helped on every device so far
dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/SD/Card/Path

re the large file... can you send it to cloud storage and give andy access?
> What I really need is a new recipe.  Or a dpkg thats capable of just
> silently over writing an existing file. I have renamed or deleted  every
> last file in trying to put a good copy of the rt kernel on this card,
> and I have the card so screwed up I doubt if it would reboot now.
>
> This is bullshit, why the hell can't it just overwrite the goddamned
> file?
>
> I'm going to dd me another sd card and start all over.
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
regards
tomp tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface, g-code, fork on repository

[TJoseph Powderly]

Merry Christmas Nicklas

On 12/23/16 05:12, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> User interface seems rather simple although I have some problem with widgets 
> to get numbers into linuxcnc. I almost got something useful to test machine 
> manually but for real machining programming is needed.
>
> Happen to know any more or less g-codes for these motions? g-codes for 
> control of flush? g-codes for control of EDM power source?
>
i think Mcodes are more suited to machine functions,
gcodes are for motion
mcodes can be scripts and easily managed
i uploaded mcodes before with python commands to change edm generator 
on/off/current/polarity
a python script can be very powerful, it can issue hal commands and 
alter hardware
> As soon as user interface start to be more useful it is also time to create 
> som kind of fork so I could upload it to the repository. I guess the the same 
> will also happen with the g-codes then I start to look at them.
great! i am anxious to look at it
>
> Regards Nicklas Karlsson
>
>
regards
Tomp Tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface, g-code, fork on repository

[TJoseph Powderly]

Sarah Hello



On 12/23/16 18:24, Sarah Armstrong wrote:
> Merry Christmas to all
>
> Iam presuming we could use the probe sequencing as a way to find centre of
> a hole , or find an edge
> in the same way as a mill , just inhibit any power or in the case of a wire
> keep it stationary
edm machines can do all the edge center middle sensing operations
its easy for edm machines as they basicly know about the tool touching 
the work
  ( about voltage drop from tool to workpiece )
so macros to do inside outside middle surface edge and angle measurement 
are easy ( lotsa code but easy )
> is their any edm machines actually using gcode / m codes? perhaps we can
> use the same if theirs a common
> trend , i presume there will be .
>
Fanuc makes sink edms, most dont make it out of Japan now but loads came 
in from 1970-1995
and they do use g & m codes
there is a 'mode' code ( istr it was an mcode ) that is turned on
it says, for all gcode past here, the velocity is determined by a gap sensor
another code says ' all gcode past here uses the F and Fover knob for 
velocity'
it has loops ( for while)  and variables (Qnnn ) and system variables 
(#  things like present position, metric/inch, offset system, etc )

mcodes and even gcodes can be user written,
and supplied codes can be overwritten ( user codes have priority over 
manufacturer )
i wrote a boatload of macros for fanuc system 12 11 8 & 6

the big thing missing is a autosequencing power selection
but Pet Knowles ( now US president of Hirschmann EDM supplies ) wrote such
and I re-wrote and maintained them

autosequencing means something like

  cut 1" cavity with 17 VDI finish using medium grade graphite into S7 
steel using a circular orbit with tool of .011" undersize

versus non-auto
which is like

  choose technology for medium grade graphite and S7 steel
  set undersize as .011/side
  lookup the correct undersize for technology
  save a copy of the tech size error
  position tool to retract plane
  select the roughin channel in the tech
  read the overburn for that setting
  ask the desired cavity depth
  calculate the correct depth ( print - overburn + teschSizeError )
  allow jumping whle roughing
  turn on flush
  turn on MODE-EDM
  g01 WhateverAxisIsUsed to (startposn + #calculatedDepth)
  g0 to posnWherePowerWasTurnedOn
  ---
  repeat every one of the above steps until all the power settings 
needed are executed depthwise and orbitwise
  ---
  return to start point
  remove EDM mode
  turn off flush
  i likely forgot a lot of steps ;-)

in general these macros let the user get into position and pull the 
trigger for the entire process in a single macro call, a single line of code

again, the uploaded samples can be a programming aid or model or just be 
of interest
> Niklas
> regarding your speed widget , it could be that the speed widget is not
> loaded at the time your looking to find the pin
> so changing the order of loading might help ,
>
> Sarah
>
>
> On 23 December 2016 at 11:07, Nicklas Karlsson > wrote:
>> I will look for the mcodes you uploaded. With g-codes I more or less
>> thought about all the different letters although which letter to use is
>> rather important.
letters are used in parameter passing for Fanuc
in Linuxcnc you get 2 letters
in my examples you can use the 2 letters,
  1st letter to identify a technology table file,
  2nd letter to identify a row in that technology table file

each row can have as many data as you like,
and you can use python and hal to set hardware to these values

mcodes in python can get argv argc
so i suppose a load of variables can be set there too , (maybe some 
magic comment trickery so its in text form inside the ngc file)

maybe all the data isnt important for linuxcnc to know about, if hal 
knows it may be sufficient
regards
tomp tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface, g-code, fork on repository

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas,
i think i presume too much edm experience, sorry

for positioning, most edm systems use a low power sensing circuit
really low, like 12 V at 100ma is plenty

if you are positioning, this low power sense circuit is always in operation
if you are cutting, the spark generator is in operation

one or the other is connected to the toolholder and the worktable at all 
times

when positioning:
so if you are positioning, then something like 12 volts at 100 mA is 
seen between the tool and the work
if the tool touches the work, the voltage drops, and you have contact
if the voltage appears you are free to move about

when cutting:
if you are cutting, the spark generator supplies a pulsed voltage to the 
tool and work
this voltage is integrated, and the integrated value is evaluated
if this voltage is seen to be high, the system moves 'fast'
if this voltage is low, the system stops forwards motion and reverses 
direction
in between there is an ideal voltage that the servo system tries to maintian
the speed varies from 0 ( when sensed voltage = programmed voltage )
to maximum in positive motion ( when sensed voltage is 'high')
to maximum in negative value ( when sensed voltage is 0)

in between maximums , the velocity is proportional

so a simple voltage drop is used to 'touch', the entire machine acts 
like a switch ( open or closed )

the code to switch from positioning to cutting simple selects the proper 
guide voltage

hth
tomp tjtr33

On 12/24/16 03:06, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>> Merry Christmas to all
>>
>> Iam presuming we could use the probe sequencing as a way to find centre of
>> a hole , or find an edge
>> in the same way as a mill , just inhibit any power or in the case of a wire
>> keep it stationary
> The sparc generator have the potential to sense the voltage and I guess there 
> might be some close up effect like capacitance or maybe even a change in 
> voltage depending on distance. To keep it stationary is probably not of much 
> use but if carefully moved around a little bit it might be possible to sense 
> the edge of the hole.
>
>> Niklas
>> regarding your speed widget , it could be that the speed widget is not
>> loaded at the time your looking to find the pin
>> so changing the order of loading might help ,
>>
>> Sarah
> Will try give changing the order of loading a try.
>
>
> Nicklas
>
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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, g-code

[TJoseph Powderly]

the edm gcodes are _usually_ fanuc like while the machines position
the mcodes are _not_ similar , these are machine design specific, there 
are similar functions but the codes will be different characters and 
different devices

especially the codes related to the edm power settings ( current voltage 
on off times )
usually these are encoded

for example 12 amperes of current
can be "1/2 channel' in Charmilles
or 4 in AGie ( 3 amps per transistor)
or 12 in my Heidenhain control ( i like to be literal )

for example a single surface finish
would be VDI in european machines
and Ra in Asian machines
and RMS in USA machines ( really silly to use average on a random surface )

what I'm saying is the units of measure vary from manufacturer to 
manufacturer
and the methods used to 'turn them on' varies ( not always gcode nor 
mcode, sometimes a mark in a table on screen!)
and some units of measures are invented by the manufacturer

making sense of the babel of technology CAN be done
in order to make my own technology
i would have to cut thousands of combinations to prove my values were 
true to some curve
i took years to discover that all edm technologies were really the same
just presented in each manufacturere's own specialized terminology
i formulated power curves ( joules ) for each material combination, 
polarity, open voltage
then compared mine to these manufacturers to see if the curves match
they do
so you can predict the overburn and surface finish
given the 'real meaning' of a manufacturer when they say
on time was 0.2a, off time was 22%, current was 1a+2.3
which really meant
on time 12.5uS, off time was 7uS, current was 6.5 amperes in dead short
These simple real data along with the no-load voltage can determine the 
joules of energy dispersed in a good discharge
the joules determine the diameter and depth of crater in a given material
the frequency ( derived from on & off times ) determine the ideal 
removal rate and wear rate (Vw & Ve )

the best technologies for easy understanding are from Handsvedt ( real 
units of measure )
the best explanations are from AGie ( tho older docs use Tau, the 
inverse of duty cycle )
the most convoluted, obfuscated (imo) is Mitsubishi ( everything is 
coded to some scale or lookup table )

so, the gcodes are simple when you dont cut
when cutting, they are connected to databases that are highly localized 
dialects

in the end,
knowing how one manufacturer turns on 1.2bar of flushing, or turns on 
hi-speed jump, or adjusts his anti-arc device
does you no good
understanding that he does control it is useful, the magic words he uses 
it only benifits him

dont work too hard on this database,
learning a few other machines is good experience, but the codes wont 
work on your machine
and wont really help a user to use your machine

its better to do LOTS of cutting
for example: you wont understand the code to increase the gain of the 
position control loop ( very common) untill you see it in action
 you wont understand the adjustment of offtime or 
duty cycle till it bites you with a big flash!

in years of teaching edm machines ( fanuc gcode to heidenhain 
conversational to asian fill-in-the-blank screen systems )
i saw operators who were unwilling to learn a new machine, but quickly 
learn my new machine in just hours or at most a couple days.
people is clever!

i just built linuxcnc-sim on this chromebook and will look at you screen 
controls
please tell us more of what you try to control with all those flushing 
controls!
it seems there is magnitude of flush, and type of flush(pressure / 
vacuum), and tank fill and dump
the area 'Settings' could be anything from on & off time to 
cuttime/jumpdistance/frequency.
the 'Command' area is understandable
regards, & merry Christmas
tomp tjtr33
On 12/25/16 21:54, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>>> Happen to know any more or less g-codes for these motions? g-codes 
>>> for control of flush? g-codes for control of EDM power source? 
>> ... i uploaded mcodes before with python commands to change edm 
>> generator on/off/current/polarity 
> I could remember I god some g-code suitable for EDM and are looking 
> for them right now. I have entered g-code for Linuxcnc and Sodick wire 
> EDM in a database, there a problem with a few codes. The database 
> could be rather useful if filled in for more machines and put on the 
> web. I have never machined run a machine and think it could be a good 
> start to read thru which codes are available. 
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Re: [Emc-users] g-code database

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas

On 12/25/16 23:30, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> Then trying to figure which g-codes or more precise *-codes in general could 
> be useful for EDM I started to write a database of codes for different 
> machines. I currently covered Linuxcnc and Sodick wire EDM. PDF-file is 
> attached and I may send openoffice database file if anobody want.
>
> A database is useful because it could be viewed in several "directions" and 
> searched. Storage is not yet perfect but then it is I guess it would be good 
> to have among the documentation.
>
>
> I have a few m-codes suitable for EDM machining but they are all in the user 
> defined area M100-M199. It would be good to use more or less standard codes. 
> I also have N-codes for old Agiecut.
>
> Could anyone point towards *.codes for other machines?
ask at cnc-zone
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/archive/index.php/f-644.html
>
> Nicklas Karlsson
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, g-code

[TJoseph Powderly]

interesting AGie stuff
please look at
http://www.gfms.com/content/dam/gfac/proddb/edm/die-sinking/en/agiecharmilles-form-200-ms_en.pdf
for a bit more screenshots
remember, this is for a proprietary machine, and will be of limited use
what is good though, is they actualy asked users to evaluate the user 
interface before forcing it onto all the users
GF is George FIscher, the auto body company, ( and a lot more)
they bought up AGie Charmilles Elox and other edm mfctrs over the years
(the borg of edm, so they have acquired a LOT of edm knowledge )

i was head of AGie sink edm for a while back in the day, sort of by default,
no one else knew what the hell those machine were, and they only wanted 
to play on wedm anyway
(eeew its oily and dirty eeeow)

regards
TomP tjtr33
On 12/26/16 19:46, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>> ...
>> please tell us more of what you try to control with all those flushing
>> controls!
>> it seems there is magnitude of flush, and type of flush(pressure /
>> vacuum), and tank fill and dump
> The flushing controls are coils I found inside the machine and I have not yet 
> figured out how to use them. I added a button so I could turn them off/on, 
> there are also a few LEDs with no use. I think lubrification should be 
> started then machine is enabled?
>
> It is possible to adjust tOff/tOn time and a meter for gap voltage, there are 
> few buttons left over from example. I spent a just a few hours on the user 
> interface and are right now thinking about how it should look and more or 
> less standard *-codes for parameters for generator, I also have found m-codes 
> you sent earlier.
>
>
> I have found Charmilles have a new standard user interface 
> http://www.mfgnewsweb.com/archives/4/37497/Controls-dec12/New-Standard-User-Interface-for-Sinker-EDM-Machines.aspx
>
>
>> the area 'Settings' could be anything from on & off time to
>> cuttime/jumpdistance/frequency.
>> the 'Command' area is understandable
>> regards, & merry Christmas
>> tomp tjtr33
>> On 12/25/16 21:54, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> Happen to know any more or less g-codes for these motions? g-codes
> for control of flush? g-codes for control of EDM power source?
 ... i uploaded mcodes before with python commands to change edm
 generator on/off/current/polarity
>>> I could remember I god some g-code suitable for EDM and are looking
>>> for them right now. I have entered g-code for Linuxcnc and Sodick wire
>>> EDM in a database, there a problem with a few codes. The database
>>> could be rather useful if filled in for more machines and put on the
>>> web. I have never machined run a machine and think it could be a good
>>> start to read thru which codes are available.
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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining --> EDM generator signals

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas
are you using theses abbreviation meanings?
.u = umschaltung  or Voltage
.i = current
.t = time

re: edm.u.Sparc , is this a flag meaning the spark generator is active, 
or what?
re: edm.t.On & Off , are these integer microseconds or floats?
re: edm.u.Ionization, is this a flag meaning ionization occured? ( 
threads are not fast enough fpr that, ionization from initialization is 
submicrosecond)
re: emd.u.Seat, is this the discharge voltage, is this also the servo 
target?
re: edm.u.Open, is this the ignition voltage ( usually less that 3 
amperes, and for example AGie 60L is 100 150 200 270 selectable )?
   or the actual cutting supply no-load voltage (neccesarily > discharge 
voltage and often 60-120volts, 115 in my system)

re: edm.i  , i think this is current,
when I talked about ipkval it refered to the maximum (peak) current 
available is a dead short
   in a normal discharge, the reactance of the spark gap acts sort of 
like a resistor, the Actual current will be less
   the joules delivered is (ontime-ionizationTime ) * (dischargeVoltage) 
* (actualCurrent )

re: edm.ionizationCount .sparcCnt  these are very fast changing data,
   too fast for threads,
   but outside hardware (i used PICs) can report running averages
   these data can be used to evaluate process quality and can lead to 
adjusting the offtime , flush, cut duration of jumping strategy

re: old mcodes, they are just models, they can be changed easily, likely 
individual codes for individual parameters is better
   the M110 can be moved and can be broken into individual set_on & set_off
   the M112 sets the supplied peak current, and since my interface was 
binary, had special code for that
   the M199 was a position limit number, a position that constrained the 
Hal motion
( i did not use linuxcnc gcodes tho i operated inside linuxcnc)
the tool was not allowed to exceed this position.
It is related to M198 which is a timer.
Edm process is not complete as soon as the tool arrives to the 
programmed position,
as the surface is not completely cut yet.
So, i wait for the tool to maintain the final position until the gap 
voltage rises
THEN wait an additional security time (M198 monitors this)
THEN the system is ready to proceed to next step.
   This is similar to linuxcnc exactStopMode extreme!

in general a wedm user interface is different than sink edm

wedm is a path, like a mill
  the wedm cuts while along a path
  wedm uses cutter comp a lot, to change the path from roughing ( far 
away from the path ) to finishing ( close to the path )
sink edm is like a cnc punch press
  the sink edm gets into position then cuts with very small motion in a 
single location
  sink edm moves around each location , first achieving th enet shape 
during rough stage then about the location ( orbiting ) while refining 
the surface

so the user interface may be very different

i will look into the user interface also
you still have the coffeecup edm for testing?

regards
tomp tjtr33

On 12/26/16 23:40, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> In the m-codes you sent.
>M110 set onVal and offVal while I use edm.t.off and edm.t.on
>M112 set ipkval while I did not have
>M198 set AtMinTix and AtMaxTix while I do not have
>M199 set AdvLimVal and RetLimVal while I do not have
>
> Output signals:
>edm.t.Off
>edm.t.On
>edm.u.Ionization
>edm.u.Sparc
>
> Input signals:
>edm.u.Open
>edm.u.Seat
>edm.i
>edm.ionizationCnt
>edm.sparcCnt
>
> I think it would be good if it is possible to use more or less standard or at 
> least common *-code for EDM generator. Then I think standard signal names 
> must be defined for the *-code or how do they find the correct 
> signal-/pin-name?
>
>
> Suitable parameters for control of spindle have been figured out a long time 
> ago
> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/motion.9.html
>
>
> On Mon, 26 Dec 2016 21:50:36 +0700
> TJoseph Powderly  wrote:
>
>> interesting AGie stuff
>> please look at
>> http://www.gfms.com/content/dam/gfac/proddb/edm/die-sinking/en/agiecharmilles-form-200-ms_en.pdf
>> for a bit more screenshots
>> remember, this is for a proprietary machine, and will be of limited use
>> what is good though, is they actualy asked users to evaluate the user
>> interface before forcing it onto all the users
>> GF is George FIscher, the auto body company, ( and a lot more)
>> they bought up AGie Charmilles Elox and other edm mfctrs over the years
>> (the borg of edm, so they have acquired a LOT of edm knowledge )
>>
>> i was head of AGie sink edm for a while back in the day, sort of by default,
>> no one else knew what the hell those machine were, and they only wanted
>> to play on wedm anyway
>> (eeew its oily and dirty eeeow)
>>
>> reg

Re: [Emc-users] Noise problem found, but not fixed.

[TJoseph Powderly]

I'll second the meanwell p/s
but the name is just so ...   apologetic :-)
mine have sticker 'finely made in taiwan'
tomp
On 12/29/16 11:49, Danny Miller wrote:
> I can tell you this with confidence- the reliable, quality brand is
> "Meanwell".
>
> They all look pretty much the same, they're not.
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mean-Well-MW-5V-3A-15W-AC-DC-Switching-Power-Supply-NES-15-5-/351760561983?hash=item51e690373f:g:NbMAAOSwepJXYhR4
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/GENUINE-MEAN-WELL-POWER-SUPPLY-ADAPTER-ES18A05-050-5V-3A-15W-max-100240v-/112229820233?hash=item1a216b2749:g:nssAAOSwA3dYGUnC
>
> Meanwell isn't even notably more expensive.
>
> Danny
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Noise problem found, but not fixed.

[TJoseph Powderly]

at lawrence livermore
my clearance wasnt good enuf but they needed the machine fixed
the workaround was a bag over my head, stuffed into a jeep ( i think )
then an armed guard outside the room
but sheets over most of the machine
i had to pee but just waited
:-)

On 12/30/16 13:03, Jon Elson wrote:
> On 12/29/2016 10:47 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> Yup that too. Chances are such places were a union shop & lots of those
>> places are busy protecting the crane operators job.
>>
>>
> No, that place is NOT union, and the real crane operator
> thinks it is totally crazy, too, and will tell you so.
> But, "rules are rules..."
>
>
> Now, at Oak Ridge, which is union, many years ago, we almost
> cause a job action by soldering a wire.
> My boss ended up packing the gear in a box and taking it to
> his hotel room to fix.  Later, we seemed to get lucky and
> the place was always on strike when we went there.  Then, we
> could do anything we wanted without interference.
>
> Jon
>
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[Emc-users] tiny edm integrator circuit

[TJoseph Powderly]

Kicklas, Sarahet al

happy new year
always something new on interweb ;-)
http://www.scielo.org.mx/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S1665-7381201400015
many others but those with linuxcnc & a circuit come first
tomp tjtr33

re: the ui.
tabs a coll but too dang small
i now have 3 panels that open
i have not figgered how to make them small at first, but they all have 
the "up" arrow icon, so the facility is there
maybe not accessable from gladevcp tho
regards
tomp tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] tiny edm integrator circuit

[TJoseph Powderly]

and oel-held re-issued thier edm booklet
the best visuals about the spark process
from Dr. Schumaker ???sp??? of AGie circa 1975
http://www.oelheld.com/fileadmin/content/pages/Prospekte_pdf/Prospekte_en/oh_Important_facts_about_spark_erosion_en.pdf

Bernardtomp tjtr33

its really important in EDM
that you builda mental picture of whats happening
and test real results against it daily
else you cant tell the cruft fromthe truth
  or near truth in these publications

much less whats spelled correctly ;-)
tomp tjtr33


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining --> EDM generator signals

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hello
video of early iteration of edm panel in use
https://videobin.org/+fe8/jab.html
i think an example of reading the db file needs to be done soon
but a working model is better than just thinkin'
thanks
tomp tjtr33



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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining --> EDM generator signals

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas hello
everybody is a novice in EDM, its just full of surprises ;-)

'interpolated position mode' ...doesthis mean position loop in hardware?

regards
Tomp tjtr33

On 01/03/17 01:34, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> Me is novice on EDM but it seems you know what you are doing. I got digital 
> outputs connected on machine this weekend and will probably be able to test 
> this weekend.
>
> I have made my own servo drivers with interpolated position mode, response is 
> fast even though I have not yet perfected control loop. I read thru books 
> right now to get control loop as good as possible.
>
> If anyone else want interpolated position mode I could help modify linuxcnc 
> protocol, modification is simple.
>
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining --> EDM generator signals

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas, hello


On 01/03/17 04:17, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I made local change to the hostmot2 stepper drivers to both send and receive 
> absolute position encoder style. Behaviour could be changed with 
> configuration parameter.
do i think correctly ? the stepper gets position commands, not step & dir ?
> The change is simple but I am still thinking about protocol because with 
> interpolated position mode there is a need to set parameters. I read Profibus 
> use same protocol on all media but it may be a little bit to complex and I do 
> not know about parameters.
does 'interpolated position mode' mean the position commands are delta? 
dx dy dz commands
> CANopen have a dictionary which may be used for parameters and PDOs for real 
> time data but I do not know if it is a good idea to use on other media. Via 
> TCP/IP telnet may actually be a simple method to implement set parameters or 
> a web server but a standard industrial protocol used with ordinary 
> configuration tools are probably better.
>
new type drivers using 'standard ... protocols.. . with ordinary 
configuration tools' is of benefit to larger non-edm audience


thanks
tomp tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining --> EDM generator signals

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklashello
the time from voltage turn-on until the voltage dropis the ionization time
this can be used as an indication of the gap 'clean'.

the idea is that IF the gap is very clean ,
and constantly clean,
each ignition delay time measured will be uniform
and will be a 'standard' value for comparison.

as the cut progresses and more debris is generated,
this time measure will change and  decrease
because the debris will reducethedielectric quality (the anti-conducting 
quality).
( we taught users that the dirt was like stepping stones for the 
lighting bolt of the spark )

IF the time is too small,
then the gap is dimensionally too small ( too close )
or too dirty ( needs 'peck' cycle )
or more fluid flow ( sweep up the dirt )
or more offtime or a combination of these

this ionization monitor cause & effect loop should be faster than 100mS
you cant change flow rates that quickly but you can add offtime to 
subsequent pulses
other strategies are in scientific papers

re: The sparc counter
not sure what the count deal with yet
it sounds like you could get a number related to (sparcs_attempted / 
sparcs_actual) = sparc_efficiency
and then see if adjusting edm servo target voltage or offtime would 
increae that ratio

adaptive control in edm is a great idea
BUT
make sure the adaptive control can be turned off!
many times in AGie and Elox and Mitsubishi cutting, we found that 
turning the autopilots off was neccesary
( let ME drive the damn thing!)

research often calls these devices  'pulse discriminators' <<<--- google 
that for more

http://reza.hoseinnezhad.com/papers/Kotler_MST_preprint.pdf

there was a good one by Prof Rajurkar at Univ Nebraska but i cant find it
we built one with FORTH NMIS boards, and our Taiwan machines used a tiny 
PEEL and a PIC microcontroller to measure ionization time
of course there were resistor dividers to reduce the 100+Volts and a 
diode bridge to make sure the polarity sampled was correct
then some unity gain OPs then level sensing ladder to sort out digital 
info about Volatge level at what time during the attempted pulse
some was too fast for the PIC so the logic of the PEEL was needed

tomp tjtr33

On 01/06/17 04:41, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I am thinking about the ionization and sparc counters. These counters might 
> be useful to calculate how well the process work and maybe adjust parameters?
>
> On Mon, 2 Jan 2017 23:53:55 +0700
> TJoseph Powderly  wrote:
>
>> Hello
>> video of early iteration of edm panel in use
>> https://videobin.org/+fe8/jab.html
>> i think an example of reading the db file needs to be done soon
>> but a working model is better than just thinkin'
>> thanks
>> tomp tjtr33
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining --> EDM generator signals

[TJoseph Powderly]

On 01/06/17 15:55, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
>> Nicklashello
>> the time from voltage turn-on until the voltage dropis the ionization time
>> this can be used as an indication of the gap 'clean'.
>>
>> as the cut progresses and more debris is generated,
>> this time measure will change and  decrease
>> because the debris will reducethedielectric quality (the anti-conducting
>> quality).
> Time for a peck cycle?
no the ionization time decreases as the conductivity increases ( due to 
debris in the oil, makes it more conductive )
>
>> IF the time is too small,
>> then the gap is dimensionally too small ( too close )
>> or too dirty ( needs 'peck' cycle )
>> or more fluid flow ( sweep up the dirt )
>> or more offtime or a combination of these
>>
>> this ionization monitor cause & effect loop should be faster than 100mS
>> you cant change flow rates that quickly but you can add offtime to
>> subsequent pulses
>> other strategies are in scientific papers
>>
>> re: The sparc counter
>> not sure what the count deal with yet
>> it sounds like you could get a number related to (sparcs_attempted /
>> sparcs_actual) = sparc_efficiency
>> and then see if adjusting edm servo target voltage or offtime would
>> increae that ratio
> Yes "ionizations attempted"/"sparcs", then to high a peck cycle is needed?
well, the ionization time is a better indication that peck cycle is needed
and
ionizations attempted / sparcs  ( a low percentage ) can be used to 
indicate
   offtime needs to be increased
and/or
   gap distance needs to be increased

if changing offtime or gap distance has no appreciable effect, its 
usually best to return to previous values
no effect indicates the system is tuned well enough already



>
>> adaptive control in edm is a great idea
>> BUT
>> make sure the adaptive control can be turned off!
>> many times in AGie and Elox and Mitsubishi cutting, we found that
>> turning the autopilots off was neccesary
>> ( let ME drive the damn thing!)
> I wait with adaptive control until I figured out how it works but to present 
> some kind of average seems like a good idea.
>
> There is:
>Number of ionizations.
>Number of sparc.
>Some theorethical numbers.
>It might also be possible to measure some times like time to ionization or 
> other if this provide some useful information.
i thought you were measuring time to ionize already, so i am not clear 
on what the 'number of ionizations' vs 'number of sparcs' means
one ionization to me is   [ a rise of voltage towards Uopen, then a drop 
towards Udischarge ]
i think you must have a different event for one count, like just the rise
a rise ( without a fall ) will occur when tool is too far away from work 
to sparc

yes, get some experience before tackling adaptive control system
watch a lot of sparcs! they are quite interesting visually, on voltage 
scope, on current scope, on frequency domain scope

just for interest
the auto jump is very important for thin deep slots ( called 'ribs' )
and heres a paper with a pulse discriminator, and auto jump circuit 
description ( no schematic or CPLD code :-(((
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/251896377_Control_Strategy_for_High_Speed_Electrical_Discharge_Machining_Die-sinking_EDM_Equipped_with_Linear_Motors

HTH
tomp tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining --> EDM generator signals --> Ready to go

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hello Nicklas

On 01/06/17 21:32, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:
> I am better do some real machining and research first. Good news is I am 
> basically ready to go. Yesterday graphics card freeze the screen and Eclipse 
> refused to work but now everything is good.
>
> EDM machine is located in cold garage and temperature is to low this weekend 
> so I postpone test run but next weekend look more promising.
>
> As use my own hardware run on Micro controllers I have been thinking a bit 
> suitable protocol or more exact message format for protocol since it would be 
> good if messages could be sent over several different medias: Ethernet, maybe 
> RS-485, UART, SPI. CANopen might be a choice since it have both PDO and a 
> dictionary for parameters.
do i understand correctly? your idea is to use (maybe) canopen protocol 
but on ethernet or rs-485 etc hardware?
and do i get the name right... PDO is Process Data Object ( exists in 
CanOpen )?
and 'dictionary for parameters' as in python where there is a pair 'key' 
and 'value' ?

i can see an advantage to a standard 'language' over a variety of 
communication hardwares

regards
tomp tjtr33


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining --> EDM generator signals

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas
i found
http://www.siegels.us/HomeAutomation/CANOpen_Node_SGS/Tutorial.pdf
to learn about canopen pdo
very interesting idea you have
tomp tjtr33


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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface, increments

[TJoseph Powderly]

a lot of the pyvcp widgets suffered from update problems
i dont know about gladevcp widgets, but it sounds similar.
how to fix in gladevcp, i dont know. i have not looked at the widget 
code yet
i will set up some oscillating value for a glade meter to follow and 
experiment
I understand the need for scaling the meters, sort of zoom to look 
closer at the process
in real machines, we had a switch on the ammeter to change the shunt, 
and a switch on the voltmeter changing resistor divider
an electro-mechanical solution so we could watch low voltages and low 
current better
we had no solution to watch midrange values closer
regards
tomp tjtr33

On 01/11/17 04:51, Chris Morley wrote:
> That sounds like a bug...wheel or mouse should move it the same.
>
> - Reply message -
> From: "Nicklas Karlsson" 
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
> Subject: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface, increments
> Date: Tue, Jan 10, 2017 1:35 PM
>
>
>
> In sort of the delta scale is a little bit slippery. It slip while using the 
> mouse wheel and only graphics is moving but no update of value. Then left 
> mouse button is held down and dial is moved by moving mouse pointer both 
> graphics and value is updated.
>
>
> On Tue, 10 Jan 2017 20:45:24 +
> Chris Morley  wrote:
>
>> Hal dial has a pin called delta scale I think. Then changing the scale (by 
>> clicking) only changes the scale of future dial moments, which is what I 
>> think you want.
>> Chris M
>>
>> - Reply message -
>> From: "Nicklas Karlsson" 
>> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
>> Subject: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface, increments
>> Date: Tue, Jan 10, 2017 12:34 PM
>>
>>
>>
>> I discovered the limitations of the hal inputs, what is needed is:
>>min
>>max
>>scale
>>increment value
>>increment value change from GUI
>>A choice to between actual or scaled value
>>
>> None of the do it all.The hal dial may change the scale but what is really 
>> needed is possibility to change increment value for fine tuning.
>>
>> Despite these small limitations I still think glade user interface designer 
>> is really good. Since source code is available it is also possible change, 
>> if anybody could give me a hint maybe I could look into it but I better 
>> start with the unfinished g-code database, I think where will be  few hours 
>> for it this weekend.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 20 Dec 2016 12:04:05 +
>> Sarah Armstrong  wrote:
>>
>>> Ni⁣cklas,
>>> Could you give me details etc, and I can get up to date, and join the 
>>> discussion
>>>
>>> Sarah
>>>
>>> Sent from BlueMail ​
>>>
>>> On 19 Dec 2016, 20:16, at 20:16, Nicklas Karlsson 
>>>  wrote:
 Finally I have all the necessary hardware parts, some are still on
 desktop not connected to machine but they are tested to work: servo
 drives, digital IO, spark generator.

 Right now I start to think about user interface and as I remember
 someone started work on this earlier.


 If anyone is interested I could share hardware drawings or others. I
 also changed a few rows in drivers so that positions are sent instead
 of speed and put control loop local.



 Regards Nicklas Karlsson

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Re: [Emc-users] EDM machining, user interface, increments

[TJoseph Powderly]

Nicklas, Sarah and all interested in EDM
i found this resource
unlike most tech sites , the papers are free :-)
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/journal/22128271/42/supp/C
regards, tomp tjtr33

btw: lots more than edm here!

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Re: [Emc-users] Need some education

[TJoseph Powderly]

I don't mean to muddy the waters but I saw today some hacks to measure rpm
using audacity to find the audible Hz of spindles. Too cool to keep secret.
Same trick was used to balance propellers and discriminate which prop on an
RC heli was causing vibration. I can imagine a slow non-rt speed control
loop. HTDC ( hope that doesn't confuse :-) tomp tjtr33

On Jan 20, 2017 3:42 PM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:

> On Thursday 19 January 2017 19:20:26 andy pugh wrote:
>
> > On 19 January 2017 at 23:29, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > > The pdf docs don't mention it.
> >
> > Hostmot2 manpage does, though.
> >
> > http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#pwmgen
>
> Thanks Andy. Thats a whole class in cnc science all by itself.
>
> I think I'll see how it runs in PDM.  That mode sounds interesting, and
> would lend itself to CCS speed control a bit smoother. I'm also trying
> to setup a spindle-at-speed signal based on the i/o diff of a lowpass
> filter.  Theory being that if the i and o values being a close enough,
> the spindle is at whatever speed command was issued. But that will need
> a minimum speed detector. Doable, put everything in low gear and feed
> the motor 20hz and see what the tach says. My hal file is growing. :)
>
> I've not figured out how to set the pdm frequency yet, but I'm sure its
> in there.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] Need some education

[TJoseph Powderly]

On 01/20/17 19:14, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Friday 20 January 2017 06:09:09 TJoseph Powderly wrote:
>
>> I don't mean to muddy the waters but I saw today some hacks to measure
>> rpm using audacity to find the audible Hz of spindles. Too cool to
>> keep secret. Same trick was used to balance propellers and
>> discriminate which prop on an RC heli was causing vibration. I can
>> imagine a slow non-rt speed control loop. HTDC ( hope that doesn't
>> confuse :-) tomp tjtr33
>>
> It doesn't google, tomp.  Got a link?
http://diyworkplace.com/42-how-to-rpm.html
http://hackaday.com/2015/03/07/dirt-cheap-motor-balancing-and-vibration-analysis/
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?1996241-Balancing-130X-rotors-using-spectral-analysis
theres others too
tomp tjtr33

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Re: [Emc-users] ECM (Electrochemical Machining)

[TJoseph Powderly]

Hello
I have not used ecm myself, i use edm a lot.
I've seen ecm machines working on blisks at factories working for engine 
manufacturers

I know about high current discharges, but ecm is different.
edm is efficient up to 4"^2 work area at up to 350/400 amperes,
ecm can handle much larger areas and much larger currents

the gap control strategies are similar from what i've read

theres not a lot of info for DIY

this may be of use (old US gov work at MIT )
http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/659004.pdf

and I'd suggest beginning with a used machine and viewing running machines
if you can get a scope on one it would be really help your understanding

from academia ( yes you have to sign up but they havent been a spammer 
for me )
http://www.academia.edu/1407899/Development_of_Electrochemical_Micromachining_Table_Top_Machine_Set_Up
in the paper he does document a small avr based ecm machine (stepper 
driven, 555 pulse timing... ), so
its not a commercial quality but a good beginner system example

the actual docs and prints or a commercial machine may be very hard to 
get, and very hard to interpret.
all manufactures directly or indirectly obfuscate the how-to part.
their intent was never to let you build your own ;-)

a service man from emag could tell you a lot!
http://www.emag.com/technologies/ecm-electro-chemical-machining.html

regards
tomp tjtr33
.


a
On 01/25/17 05:35, Peter Weuta wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> I did follow the interesting discussion about retrofitting EDM machines
> closely .
>
> Is there anybody out there having experience with retrofitting of ECM
> machines (Electrochemical Maching) ?
> This processing technology does seem to be alot less common compared to
> EDM, some basics of the process are mentioned here:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrochemical_machining
> http://electrochemicalmachining.com/technology/process-overview
>
> Compared to EDM there are quite some advantages:
> - very low surface roughness achievable
> - no recast layer or heat affected zone
> Therefore a nice technology to process advanced alloys as for example
> Inconel 718 or alike .
>
> We are developing high performance gas turbines. In order to keep BLISK
> (/Blade on a disc/) manufacturing in house we are planning to acquire
> and retrofit an ECM machine.
> My questions:
> - has this been done by anybody on this list so far ?
> - any recommondation concerning potential machines to choose from ?
> (Machines should have an obsolete control system in order to follow the
> usual justification for conducting a retrofit.)
> - an alternative might be using an EBM machine as the basis and
> converting this to ECM. However this would involve quite significant
> modifications in the field of electrolyte processing, gas cleaning and
> safety issues (H2 is formed during the process)
>
>
>
> Thanks alot for your comments in advance + Best Regards,
> Peter
>
> Am 14.01.2017 um 11:58 schrieb Nicklas Karlsson:
>> It would be good with links like this on the linuxcnc home page and of 
>> course even better with files themselves if there are no copyright 
>> restrictions.
>>
>> I have attachad a pdf-file which is interesting.
>>
>> On Sat, 14 Jan 2017 09:08:03 +0700
>> TJoseph Powderly  wrote:
>>
>>> Nicklas, Sarah and all interested in EDM
>>> i found this resource
>>> unlike most tech sites , the papers are free :-)
>>> http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/journal/22128271/42/supp/C
>>> regards, tomp tjtr33
>>>
>>> btw: lots more than edm here!
>>>
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Re: [Emc-users] Raspberry Pi PREEMPT-RT --> Scheduling and message passing in general

[TJoseph Powderly]

re
"The programming software has a mode where yu can call up a library
of old 74LSxxx parts and drop them on a canvas and draw lies between pins
"
You talkin bout Cypress's PSoC Creator, Willis?
;-)
It doesnt sound like Xilinx or Altera's tools.
tomp


On Mon, Jun 25, 2018 at 9:43 AM, Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> Maybe we've gone full circle.  I just bought an $11 part on eBay.  I it is
> a CPLD.  Like an FPGA but smaller and much less expensive and easier to
> use.   The programming software has a mode where yu can call up a library
> of old 74LSxxx parts and drop them on a canvas and draw lies between pins.
> They have other functional blocks too, just see of them have the old 7400
> numbers.I did something silly wired a bunch some LEDs to a 4-bit
> counters and watch in count in binary.   The 7400 series versions "Hello
> World" but now I can do that with just one chip.The little CLPD can
> simulate maybe 100 7400 type chips and they can be clocked at 50MHz
>
> SO it is the one chip solution that you wanted but the old SSI based
> solution that engineer wanted t build.
>
> My use for it was counting encoder pluses up to about 1MHz. but I found I
> could do that with a microcontroler for 1/3rd the cost and size.
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jun 24, 2018 at 4:05 PM John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > > What we have is the result of historic accident.   EMC and machine
> > control
> > > in general got its start when computers where EXPENSIVE.  You design
> > > differently when you parts for five digit price tags than when you
> parts
> > > are nearly free.  If computers cost $2 and two of them could fit on
> your
> > > thumbnail then you might just be inclined to use more of them.
> >
> > I remember having arguments with an engineer about using micro-processors
> > (with EPROM) to do simple logic.  He was adamant that TTL was a better
> > solution because the processor was too expensive.  My point was that
> > processors were coming down in price and there were now single chip ones
> > with EEPROM windows (before onboard flash) and that one chip would do the
> > job of a large number of discrete devices.
> >
> > At the same time I was wire-wrapping up an S-100 board with an NED u7220
> (I
> > think that was the number) video controller and the rest of the logic was
> > all 74S series.  He was wrong of course.  Many projects don't need 20 TTL
> > or
> > CMOS chips and an Arduino is an ideal replacement.  But only to a limit.
> >
> > > Combine the high-reduction cycloidic drive with a small low cost BLDC
> > > motor
> > > and you have a point for a robot arm (or leg) or a machine tool axis.
> > > Here is a model of one of these motor and all -- please try the
> "explode"
> > > button to see the insides of the drive.  (The button turns the drawing
> > into
> > > a parts diagram) https://a360.co/2KhamaI
> > >
> > Very cool!
> >
> >
> > > OK back to real-time...
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> --
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>
>
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> Redondo Beach, California
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] no news any more?

[TJoseph Powderly]

OK here in Penang, My.
I check almost everyday.
Must be local problem

On Sun, Jul 8, 2018, 12:06 Peter Blodow  wrote:

> How come I have not read any news for 5 days now? Is there something
> wrong with servers etc., or are there really no problems around??
> Peter
>
>
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[Emc-users] interesting power transmission

[TJoseph Powderly]

I've seen roller racks before but this is circular.

something says to me "Bridgeport belt replacer"

other voices says "hmm, weak force transfer"

but a beautiful disk and interesting programming problem

TomP


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9gQ1KRhesM



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[Emc-users] frank hermann xatc exteremely simple automatic tool changer

[TJoseph Powderly]

I have not seen this mentioned on the list.
Its interesting enough, esp after i tried opening and closing my collets
with quarter turn.

"people is so clever"

https://hackaday.com/2016/06/20/hackaday-prize-entry-diy-automatic-tool-changer/

i dont think i'll use the wifi web socket esp/arduino connection though
a remap may suffice for testing

boohoo, the gif is 2.7 meg, else i'd attach it

tomp
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[Emc-users] buildbot web page

[TJoseph Powderly]

the page at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/
lists an armhf build available for jessie scratch

Jessie (uspace: realtime with RT-Preempt, and simulation)
architectures: amd64, armhf, i386

deb http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ jessie scratch-rtpreempt
deb-src http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ jessie scratch-rtpreempt


arm build only exist in wheezy and jessie
there are no arm anything files in newer or older builds
i think I can edit this webpage
but the maintainers ought to know it just doesnt exist

tomp
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Re: [Emc-users] buildbot web page

[TJoseph Powderly]

wow
thanks seb, looking at it now.
"Index of /~buildmaster/dists/jessie/scratch-sim/binary-armhf"
(I'm glad I didnt mangle the web page :-) )

tomp

On Mon, Jul 23, 2018 at 10:54 PM, Sebastian Kuzminsky <
seb.kuzmin...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sun, Jul 22, 2018 at 11:10 PM TJoseph Powderly 
> wrote:
> >
> > the page at
> > http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/
> > lists an armhf build available for jessie scratch
> >
> > Jessie (uspace: realtime with RT-Preempt, and simulation)
> > architectures: amd64, armhf, i386
> >
> > deb http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ jessie scratch-rtpreempt
> > deb-src http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ jessie scratch-rtpreempt
> >
> > arm build only exist in wheezy and jessie
> > there are no arm anything files in newer or older builds
> > i think I can edit this webpage
> > but the maintainers ought to know it just doesnt exist
>
> That's a bug in the buildbot webpage, thanks for the bug report.
>
> The debs exist, but the URLs are wrong.  They should end with
> "scratch-sim", not "scratch-rtpreempt".
>
> I've updated the buildbot webpage with the correct URLs.
>
> --
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>
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] buildbot web page

[TJoseph Powderly]

Well the first attempts to use had lots of hangs,
so i put the rpi in the 'ton yen' ( ice box)
to see if it would run longer than 10 minutes.

But,when I brought it out,
it beaded up with so much,
that I didnt try using it untill it was really dry again.
I found a big floor fan works well.
The unit has 3 heat sinks already.

Humidity here is 3x a day showers
and 3x a day changes of clothes
( peeling off t-shirts is a real exercise )

The humidity may help
but I'll keep the air circulating a lot.

tomp

On Tue, Jul 24, 2018 at 7:51 PM, andy pugh  wrote:

> On 24 July 2018 at 09:30, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> >> they really need the cooling, its hot and humid here, rainy season ,
> >> near 38C daily
> >
> > Ahh, then yes, lots of cooling.
>
> Unless the heat-sink relies on sweating to work I very much doubt that
> the humidity matters to the Pi.
> In fact it probably helps: https://bit.ly/2LEMh1H
>
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
>
> 
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[Emc-users] adding linuxcnc repos to rpi

[TJoseph Powderly]

how to add linuxcnc repos to my raspian jessie rpi3B+ ?

i installed raspbian jessie from 
http://downloads.raspberrypi.org/raspbian/images/raspbian-2017-07-05/2017-07-05-raspbian-jessie.zip
then built rt kernel from https://github.com/raspberrypi/linux -b 
rpi-4.14.y-rt


I rebooted and checked that I was running rt-preempt
pi@raspberrypi:~ $ uname -a
Linux raspberrypi 4.14.59-rt37-v7+ #1 SMP PREEMPT RT Mon Aug 20 12:47:16 
+07 2018 armv7l GNU/Linux


then found linuxcnc deb at 
http://linuxcnc.org/jessie/2.7uspace/binary-armhf/linuxcnc-uspace_2.1.14_armhf.deb

thats a real easter egg!

I was worried about the deps needed by the install, so
in synaptic, i added repo    deb http://linuxcnc.org/  jessie base
then exited synaptic
then ran sudo apt-get update and got

"Failed to fetch htt://linuxcnc.org/dists/jessie/Release
unable to find expected 'base/binary-armhf/Packages'
in Release file ( wrong source.list or malformed file )"

I was lucky that gdebi could install the deps
sudo gdebi linuxcnc-uspace_2.1.14_armhf.deb worked a treat

but how do i use synaptic in the future?
the apt-get update error has me worried.

thx tomp

btw: 83.4uS max latency-histogram --nobase 1mS thread  4 glx gears  
isolcpus=2,3   3693secs  ssh'd in over eth0


will let it cook overnight but looks pretty good

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[Emc-users] Fwd: [Machinekit] Re: RPI gipo help

[TJoseph Powderly]

Seb hello,

1) sorry to hear Jeff's change of plans,

best of luck to him,

he's been enormous in the linuxcnc development.

2) i been working on the hal_gpio for linuxcnc and

i got this email this morning (thailand 28 aug 2018)

i can loadrt already it and will test asap.
(
i dont have the changes made to the src yet,
i do know i cant compile as is.
I know it calls macros that specifically say they are not for userspace.

(hahaha i hand wrote out the whole code to try to find why it would not 
build,

 and had the notebook out when the email arrived :-)

tomp


 Forwarded Message 
Subject:[Machinekit] Re: RPI gipo help
Date:   Mon, 27 Aug 2018 19:36:53 -0700 (PDT)
From:   KL Chin 
To: Machinekit 



Hi Tim,

I still testing both.

1) LinuxCNC had already 2.8 but MachineKit still based on 2.6.
2) The StepConf was so slow with MachineKit.
3) The Gui sample works on LinuxCNC

BTW. I had attached the hal_gpio.so for LinuxCNC, may be you can try it.
Just copy to LinuxCNC rtlib folder. I just change few lines of the 
hal_gpio.c.


Regards,
KL Chin

On Tuesday, 28 August 2018 03:42:31 UTC+8, Timothy March wrote:

   KL Chin why are you using LinuxCnc instead of Machinekit? The
   hal_gipo only works with Machinekit there is no gipo driver for
   LinuxCnc.

   Tim

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Description: Binary data
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Re: [Emc-users] sim still broken

[TJoseph Powderly]

and you can get all the parts for Little Giant Pumps.
( rotors, seals, brushes, motors.)
That makes any investment easier to swallow.
tomp tjtr33
Merry Merry! Happy Happy!

On Mon, Dec 24, 2018 at 1:28 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Sunday 23 December 2018 09:10:50 Bruce Layne wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 22 Dec 2018 at 23:50, Gene Heskett 
> wrote:
> > > The only thing I could not find with any
> > > search terms was a 1/2 to 1 gallon water tank to bury the water pump
> > > in.
> >
> > I have a Chinese water cooled spindle on two different home built CNC
> > routers.  I used a 5 gallon plastic bucket for the coolant tank on
> > each.  They were free with a cat litter purchase.  The plastic snap on
> > top is hinged.  The back 1/3 stays snapped in place and the front 2/3
> > can be hinged open in case I ever need to dump the coolant, add to it,
> > etc.  The lid keeps dust and debris out of the closed loop coolant
> > system.  A small pump is submerged in the coolant and the power cord
> > for the pump and the coolant inlet and outlet hoses are routed through
> > the back third of the lid that remains snapped onto the top of the
> > bucket.
> >
> > You don't need a big pump regardless of the size of the spindle
> > motor.  I use a small Little Giant pump that's often sold for
> > fountains, hydroponics, etc.  I get the best version they make and
> > it's still inexpensive.  Good brands include Superior and the upper
> > end versions of Little Giant.  Here are a couple of possible examples.
> >
> > https://www.ebay.com/itm/362400850664
> >
> > https://www.ebay.com/itm/233055122922
> >
> > I like the magnetic drive submersible pumps for reliability.  I'd pay
> > a little more for a long power cord to get any electrical splices well
> > away from the coolant and a pipe thread outlet port so you can easily
> > find a fitting to connect to the weird metric sized very flexible hose
> > that connects to the spindle motor.
> >
> > These small pumps don't produce much head pressure (aka "lift").  On
> > the larger CNC router, I tried to hide the coolant pump under the
> > enclosure and route the coolant lines on top of the enclosure and then
> > down to the spindle motor.  That didn't work because the pump couldn't
> > push the coolant that high.  I tried a much larger pump trying to
> > power my way through the problem and the head pressure was marginal.
> > It barely worked, most of the time, but the pump is cooled by the
> > coolant and the coolant temperature rose quickly.  The coolant was
> > cooling the pump more than it was cooling the spindle. I finally gave
> > up, went back to the smaller pump, and put the coolant tank on top of
> > the CNC router's enclosure so it was pumping down to the spindle motor
> > and back up to the coolant tank.  The pump only needs enough head
> > pressure to clear the top of the coolant tank.  A possible down side
> > is that a coolant leak could siphon most of the coolant out of the
> > coolant tank, but I used good hose and it hasn't been a problem.  On
> > the small CNC router, I placed the coolant tank on a shelf behind the
> > CNC router, and it also pumps down to the spindle motor.
> >
> > I continue to be impressed with the Chinese water cooled spindle
> > motors.  The quality is very good.  They brag about the precision
> > "German" bearings and they are very smooth and have a very precise
> > feel, certainly much better than a Porter Cable or Bosch wood working
> > router, even though I suspect that "German" is the deliberately
> > deceptive name of a company or town in China.  Still, good is good.
> >
> Like comparing a Portor-Cable 692 to a Hitachi MV12, The Hitachi is about
> another 50 bucks, and worth every penny. Soft start, dead smooth at any
> speed. Too much gingerbread on its outer though.
>
> > Using four gallons of coolant allows the larger CNC router to run
> > pretty much indefinitely now that the garage shop is air conditioned.
> > When it was hot in the summer, the coolant would get a bit warm in the
> > summer after five hours of hard use of the spindle motor.
>
> Which is probably 4x longer than it would get run here. This panel with
> all the bells enabled is 66 minutes on the 5 to 10 ipm HF toy. With a
> faster spindle 30 minutes.
>
> > Less coolant means it will get hotter sooner.  More coolant is an
> > easier and cheaper solution than adding a radiator.
>
> And I have one or two of those buckets. The square ones I might be able
> find room for, behind the mill, but will probably have to make a
> table/cabinet for the whole thing as I'd think its too tall to fit under
> the operator console as it only clears the floor about 48". Somebody
> mention 55 kg but I've not been able to find the weight. With free
> shipping, ebay doesn't tell you. 55kg = 121lbs. I'd best put castors on
> the back and and levelors on it, the shop floor sags with nearly half a
> ton in the middle of the floor now. And its been there close to 20
> years. Only treated 4x4's on 24" ce

[Emc-users] parameters passed to hal comps

[TJoseph Powderly]

I read in several comp.c sources that functions in the comps get passed 
(void *arg, long period).


I have not found docs explaining this,

but guess *arg is the 'config string',

and that period is the period of the thread the comp is attached to.

is this correct?

Thanks TomP

examples:

boss_plc.c             Plc_Refresh(void *arg, long period)

counter.c             static void capture(void *arg, long period)

debounce.c         static void debounce(void *arg, long period)

etc



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[Emc-users] mechanical animation resources Disney

[TJoseph Powderly]

i've come across links to this and had not reported it

i think it may be of interest ( or at least entertaining)


Disney has software to generate gear linkage systems for ~arbitrary paths

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfznnKUwywQ


and to put icing on top of this cake

read Corey Doctorow's sci-fi about the animator engineer hackers at



Down and Out in the Magic Kingdom - Wikipedia 



*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Down_and_Out_in_the_Magic_Kingdom*


( i read the book years ago, before i found the disney papers

i think it was an audio book, at least i can hear it in my head ;-)


tomp




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Re: [Emc-users] Conversational Mode

[TJoseph Powderly]

in general

http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_LinuxCNC_G-Code_Generators#Other_G_Code_Generators 



specific conversational

http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Cp1

thanks Ray! thanks Matt, and thanks Lawrence

I remember using it to create code for a Heidenhain TNC,

sort of an offline programming since Heidenhains can be conversational.

a smop

tomp



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[Emc-users] linuxcnc brain surgery

[TJoseph Powderly]

https://ciis.lcsr.jhu.edu/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=courses:446:2016:446-2016-18:project_18_main_page
but where does the LinuxCNC Rocket Science class meet?
pretty cool kins too
tomp



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