Re: [Repeater-Builder] Moto Micor 123.0 Vibrasender
At 09:30 AM 09/07/10, you wrote: Anyone help me out with this part? Terry wx3m.te...@gmail.com What model number? There are several different physical packages. If you don't know the reed number, can you tell us what radio? Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Unidentified part in msf5000 vhf station
At 08:10 PM 09/05/10, you wrote: I just aquired a second msf5000 to make a 2 meter repeater our of and it has a part not present in the first station. I suspect it could be a rx preamp due to the fact it has coax input and output and it is wired in series between the duplexer rx port and the receiver rf input. It appears to be an aluminum block rack mounted just below the power supply and is about 1.5 thick and about 8 or 9 inches wide. I did not see any electrical connections so if it is a preamp it must get power from the coax into the receiver. I am not familiar with this device. My other station did not have this part. Perhapps it is sopme kind of filter? Both stations are the digital capable models which I program with the rib and old laptop. Any ideas please! Pictures on request if needed. Is there a Moto part number on it? Either a multi-digit, something like 01V12345A01, or one with three letters and 4 digits, something like TLD, possibly with a trailing letter? Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] master 3 narowband?
At 05:47 PM 09/04/10, you wrote: can the uhf master 3 radios be programmed narrowband in compliance with the new fcc rules or should I take it to a ham swapmeet? wb5oxq Depends on the vintage of the receiver and exciter modules. Are there any numbers on them? Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Circular polarization for VHF repeaters?
There is one local UHF group that has a back-to-back 6m repeater just for range extension. The Scom 7330 makes the parallel/separate link on/off mode real easy (and for up to 3 ports). At 02:10 AM 09/02/10, you wrote: Gordon, something worth trying might be low-band. About 20 years ago, I lived in an area where hams did course communications for rally events in very mountainous terrain. I remember experimenting one night about 2am with my partner at the other end of a heavily wooded course, about 12 miles end-to-end. 444 MHz simplex, 5 watts, colinear mobile whip - no copy. 146 MHz simplex, 5 watts, 5/8-wave mobile whip - no copy, but would barely break the carrier squelch. 29.6 MHz simplex, 4 watts, FM CB conversion, 1.3m helically-wound mobile whip - full quieting and S9+. Antennas might be a bit of a trick for portables on 10m, and a repeater might have to be crossband, but worth a shot. 73, Paul, AE4KR - Original Message - From: mailto:zl...@nzart.org.nzGordon Cooper To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 02, 2010 1:51 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Circular polarization for VHF repeaters? Our repeater runs 5 watts output, needs to run three or four days off a gelcell, and most importantly has to fit into a backpack to be carried to a convenient hilltop. Fortunately, the split is 3 MHz so that the duplexer is of a reasonable size. The problem is getting reasonable coverage. Sure the search areas are fairly small but usually encompass several ridges and deep valleys. We use vertical polarisation with a 5/8 whip on the repeater and the search teams have flexible dipoles that fit into their backpacks. Sharp ridges and steep slopes contribute to coverage problems. Would circular polarization help?? I think not. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3107 - Release Date: 09/01/10 11:34:00
Re: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Running a Mastr II Repeater QRP
I've used these and they work real well: http://www.escalera.com/stairclimbing/index.htm When you are moving something heavy like a repeater cabinet a powered dolly is worth every penny of the rental expense. The 700 lb capacity model costs about $1700 new, and a couple of the local specialty rental companies have them. If you are going to rent one make sure it has the retractable load support option. Mike WA6ILQ At 05:05 PM 08/31/10, you wrote: WE did about the same thing but the cabinet was in the basement and it had to go up a circular staircase. Plus we did not have enough room to keep it away from the wall. So we spent a lot of time taking it apart and then going back together was easier. Much lighter with out everything in it. Butch, KE7FEL/r On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 10:21 AM, mailto:dmur...@verizon.netdmur...@verizon.net wrote: Installed a MSTR II VHF repeater in a six foot cabinet on top of a 17 story building. The elevator got me to the 14th floor but it took 4 of us to get it the other 3 flights. It is possible to haul without a hoist. Next time I do something like this I'm going to remove the repeater and power supply and carry the parts, not the whole repeater. ..._._ Aug 31, 2010 01:14:00 AM, mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com wrote: On 8/30/2010 7:01 PM, Paul Plack wrote: I already know I'd love to have a MII, and the bulk won't be an issue getting it home or storing it, but the proposed site is on a rooftop. That part could get interesting. I may need to devise a truss...and something to hoist the repeater, too! (Rimshot.) LOL! Especially if you're using the MASTR II power supply. Be aware that the M2 PS will draw quite a bit of current even at idle... if you're paying the power bill, or care about someone who does... I have one on in my basement for a link all the time, and live with it... :-) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3104 - Release Date: 08/30/10 23:34:00
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Duplexers
Theory: http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/thoughts-on-isolation.html Applications: http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/separation.html Mike WA6ILQ At 05:36 PM 08/30/10, you wrote: Chris, You do not have to use a duplexer, but it makes building a repeater SO much easier! Keep in mind that antenna separation usually means vertical separation, not horizontal separation. Moreover, the same isolation provided by 1000 feet of horizontal separation might be provided by 10 feet of vertical separation. The amount of isolation you need is based generally on the transmit power, frequency separation between TX and RX, and the sensitivity of the receiver. The receiver bandwidth and antenna types also play a factor. 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mackey Sent: Monday, August 30, 2010 4:44 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Duplexers Our club was recently given a 220 repeater. We have two seperate antennas. We do not have a duplexer. My question is do we have to have a duplexer? How can we keep the transmitter from desensitizing the receiver? The antennas are apart but can be moved farther. Thanks Chris Kg4bek Yahoo! Groups Links No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3103 - Release Date: 08/30/10 11:34:00
Re: [Repeater-Builder] ariels
At 02:34 AM 08/29/10, you wrote: using two radios as a repeator with two ariels. how far appart would the ariels be best. thanks antony Theory: http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/thoughts-on-isolation.html Applications: http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/separation.html Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] dumb question: what is purpose of lock on Mitrek?
At 09:09 AM 08/29/10, you wrote: Hi, I know it's a dumb question, but after scouring the internet for info, I find everything about locks and replacement keys for Motorolas and other radios, but I still don't know what locking the Mitrek actually does. Does it kill all power to the radio, or disable certain functions? I'm asking because I just acquired a low-band Mitrek that I need to power up and verify its working condition. It doesn't have a control head, so I need to use the front panel pins, but if the radio is locked, I may end up getting nowhere and still not know if it's either the radio that is bad, it is locked out, or I wired it wrong. This is the first Mitrek I've had. Thanks for any help. Jeff KP3FT http://www.repeater-builder.com/keyspage/keyspage-index.html Please don't solder to the front connector pins. Get hold of a matching connector and solder to that. Please go to this web page at http://www.repeater-builder.com/mitrek/mitrek-index.html and scroll down to the Low Band section and read the articles on 6m mods. Then scroll down to the Non-RF section and read the two articles titled Interfacing the Mitrek mobile radio to your repeater controller and Karl AK2O and the Spokane Repeater Group have a different take on converting the Mitrek. Both have good info on interfacing (i.e. connecting to the radio) and mounting/cooling. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] MSR 2000 VHF Base Station questions
At 03:41 PM 08/29/10, you wrote: Just acquired a MSR 2000 VHF base station at a Hamfest. It had a problem in the PA Deck (intermittent duty 100 watt version) but I have fixed that already (bad solder joint on one of the output transistors). It is a two receiver carrier squelch only model. Probably looks a lot like the one at the top of the web page at http://www.repeater-builder.com/msr2000/msr2000-index.html I found a copy of the RF manual on the net to download, The files that members of the repeater-builder mailing list scanned and I put on that page have been ripped off by several other web sites. but have not been able to find a copy of the control deck manual yet. Moto still sells it so we can't scan it and PDF it yet. Most of the cards are identical to those in a Micor except for the connector and the paint. Many of the interfacing articles for Micor stations apply. Does anyone know where I can get a PDF copy? Not from repeater-builder.com Has anyone used one of these to build a two meter repeater? Lots of folks. A while back the Canadian govt surplused about 600 of the ones that were factory built on 136-150 MHz. Most went into ham repeater use. Will the Intermittent duty PA survive at half power? No. Most of the time it gets dirty at about 50%. Run it at about 60% and use fans. See the comments on that web page. Any help would be appreciated. Start reading the web page. The machine is set up for wireline tone 2 frequency right now. There are interfacing articles on the page so you don't need to reinvent the wheel. If you do come up with a different type of wheel or a different way to retread the tire please write another article. Thanks, Dan Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: MSR-2000 Alignment Metering
At 05:46 PM 08/29/10, you wrote: Re: MSR-2000 Alignment Metering Probably looks a lot like the one at the top of the web page at http://www.repeater-builder.com/msr2000/msr2000-index.html There's an error on the above mentioned web page. In other words, YOU CANNOT USE A MODERN DVM TO PROPERLY TUNE AN MSR2000. I don't agree, in fact it's much easier for me to use my Fluke DMM to detect some of the very small meter peaks and dips. There is no rule or requirement the metering points have to be loaded by a 50uA movement. Erratic metering with low cost Digital Multi Meters is probably the result of the price you paid. If it's a good meter, it must be a Fluke. cheers, s. I heard it on TV as If it works it must be a Fluke. Mine is a Fluke 73 type III. What wording would you suggest? I wrote that the way I did because I have always had better results with either a Moto test set or a analog VOM (i.e. Simpson 260 or Triplett 630). Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] dumb question: what is purpose of lock on Mitrek?
I have an MRCA key, and have never heard of the RCA1 Can I get a photo of each side of your RCA1 for the Keys Page? http://www.repeater-builder.com/keyspage/keyspage-index.html Mike? At 06:19 PM 08/29/10, you wrote:  It didn't share the same key, the RCA key was the same general shape as the CH-751 but would not work. The RCA key was called an RCA1 key. 73 everybody Mike KB5FLX - Original Message - From: mailto:w6...@pacbell.netBill Hudson To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 9:57 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] dumb question: what is purpose of lock on Mitrek? I didnât know that RCA shared the CH751 key with the Cabinet key for Motorola Outdoor cabinets. This could be an error. Bill Hudson W6CBS Any of these keys can be duplicated at your local locksmith. From: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Pointman Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 6:07 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] dumb question: what is purpose of lock on Mitrek? Ah yes...the old BF-10aI have one.. a little beat up, would love to have a pristine one, just in case. KM3W From: MCH m...@nb.net To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sun, August 29, 2010 4:52:58 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] dumb question: what is purpose of lock on Mitrek? GE = BF10A RCA = CH751 Joe M. Pointman wrote: Like most of the commercial stuff of that era, the unit was locked into a car or truck instead of bolted in. It made for an easier repair to just unlock it rather than unbolting everything. It sat in a cradle with the locking mechanism that WAS bolted to the car body. GE and RCA also had their keys...GE's was a B210/810? Maybe..? its been a while since I handled any of that old stuff KM3W -- *From:* Chuck Kelsey mailto:wb2edv%40roadrunner.comwb2...@roadrunner.com *To:* mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Sun, August 29, 2010 12:50:18 PM *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] dumb question: what is purpose of lock on Mitrek? It simply locks the cover in place. You'll want a key anyway. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: KP3FT mailto:kp3ft%40yahoo.comkp...@yahoo.com mailto:kp3ft%40yahoo.com To: mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 12:09 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] dumb question: what is purpose of lock on Mitrek? Hi, I know it's a dumb question, but after scouring the internet for info, I find everything about locks and replacement keys for Motorolas and other radios, but I still don't know what locking the Mitrek actually does. Does it kill all power to the radio, or disable certain functions? I'm asking because I just acquired a low-band Mitrek that I need to power up and verify its working condition. It doesn't have a control head, so I need to use the front panel pins, but if the radio is locked, I may end up getting nowhere and still not know if it's either the radio that is bad, it is locked out, or I wired it wrong. This is the first Mitrek I've had. Thanks for any help. Jeff KP3FT Yahoo! Groups Links -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.comwww.avg.com http://www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3100 - Release Date: 08/29/10 02:34:00 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3101 - Release Date: 08/29/10 11:34:00
[Repeater-Builder] Looking for a manual (Moto Australia, New Zealand, or Philippines)
I'm looking for a manual, part number 68P64115B01 according to a friend of mine, but I think there's a digit missing somewhere. It's the english language service manual for a GM950 mobile model M08MHF6AA2A. It is a 64 channel, 25 watt Radius mobile made by Moto Australia for the Asian market (specifically the Philippines). Moto USA never stocked the radio or the manual so I'm hoping that one of the 60+ list members that lives in AU or the 10+ that lives in NZ has one or can get one for me. Or does someone know someone that works at a 2-way shop in the Philippines ? Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Adding capacitors to lower electric bill
And actually the DC distribution system was more common than you think. I recently was up at the Mt. Wilson observatory and was inside the 100-inch telescope dome. ALL of the controls for the telescope, the dome slit motors (the ones that slide the panel open the telescope to look through), the dome rotation motor (which is surprisingly small for the load), everything but the overhead lighting is 120v DC. And has been since about 1918. Even the ballast tubes for the control are original carbon filament bulbs. I have alot of photos/ Mike WA6ILQ At 02:13 AM 08/24/10, you wrote: We had our fill of those here, too. The hot side of the AC line (if you were lucky, polarized plugs were rare in those days) was connected directly to a 35W4 or some such half wave rectifier tube and later to a selenium half wave rectifier with the other side of the AC line being connected as the negative lead (fortunately NOT to the chassis). Usually, there were a couple of 0.01uf capacitors from each side of the line to the chassis, however. Doubt I need to explain the joys one could experience with that arrangement! And, to top it off, each and every one of those radios proudly bore our UL stamp of approval! They used to call them AC/DC radios because, if you lucked out and got the polarity right, the radio didn't care what the source was as long as it was somewhere near 100 volts DC or RMS. Tom --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Gordon Cooper zl...@... wrote: Another quirk. Sixty plus years ago in England, power factor was not the main concern. Many of the domestic radio receivers were transformerless and used half-wave rectification to obtain D.C. for the tubes. A consequence was a fair dose of D.C. flowing in the street power mains. Gordon ZL1KL Tauranga N.Z. Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] URL refresh
The members.aol web server has been shut down since november of 2008. You must have found it somewhere else (and I'd like to see it as well). Mike WA6ILQ At 07:16 PM 08/22/10, you wrote: Is there a refreshed URL for the site regarding Maxtrac conversions to 222 MHz? I thought I surfed to the site a few weeks ago but didn't bookmark it. Thanks Mike / W5JR Take a look at this link http://members.aol.com/w8ak/maxtrac222.htm I ran into Glenn, W8AK out at Dayton back in May.. He had a couple of these Maxtracs set up as a repeater on 224 mhz and seemed to work real nice.. I have not tried the conversion myself but it looks like it would be a nice way to link on 222 mhz if someone wanted to give it a try.. Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Low Band Antenna for both 6 10 meters.
At 07:49 PM 08/20/10, you wrote: skipp025 wrote: The Catholic Church says only the rhythm method is allowed. I SOMEHOW don't think that 'method' will help us in this situation. Although that's how my third child came along. (3 of 3) A BOY BTW! (Yea, Me!!) P.S. I do have a copy of Motorola 68-80100W86 - Diplex Antenna Manual. This document is written for use with standard base-loaded mobile antennas only. Is it scanned into or available in a PDF file format? I'd really like to see a copy if it's available and easily Emailed. Always nice to see how others do things... I thought the above was pretty much common knowledge. Please see the attached PDF file. (Note to Mike Wa6ILQ: Please add to the RB site.) Been there since mid-2006, or maybe before that. Go to teh Antennas page, scroll down to the bottom, and look in the mobile section. I was warned that this document seems to be backwards in that the length of cable that it says is supposed to go to the higher frequency antenna, actually goes to the lower frequency antenna and vice-versa. It's designed as a 1/2 wave that disconnects the wrong antenna. I can see how it might be perceived as backwards. I would LOVE to know some of the theory behind this method. I was hoping to use this on a remote base antenna with 'Station' type antennas, but I don't think that will work since it clearly states that Only standard base-loaded antennas are used Comments? Suggestions? Theory? Scott Scott Zimmerman Amateur Radio Call N3XCC 474 Barnett Road Boswell, PA 15531 Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Low Band Antenna for both 6 10 meters.
At 09:27 PM 08/20/10, you wrote: skipp025 wrote: (big chunk cut out) Put Great in front of your name yelled out loud and people in a movie house will often throw toilet paper across the room. (It's OK if you don't get the reference and those of you who do, please seek professional help). Hmmm, seems like more than one of us have been spinning the globe at too many midnight movies... And don't forget the unbuttered toast, the bell and the cards. http://www.rockyhorror.com/news/article.php?p=2007122701 I went to the Rialto about a dozen times... the audience (and performers) were nuttier and funnier than the flic... It showed the RHPS every Saturday night midnight from January 1978 to August 2007... 29 years... about 1,400 performances. And it's still run once a month... And the performers are still there. http://findlocal.latimes.com/south-pasadena/home/movie-events/rocky-horror-picture-show-movie-event-4 s. Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Tait T296 PSU Circuit
At 06:44 PM 08/13/10, you wrote: can i pls have a copy of it, even if need be http://yousendit.comyousendit.com to me Go to www.repeater-builder.com then to Tait then right click on it and download it.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Sorry everyone
At 09:20 PM 08/11/10, you wrote: - Original Message - From: Tim Sawyer tisaw...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 10:29 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Sorry everyone Was your machine on while you were away? If so you may have gotten a virus or spyware. Sounds like your wife got it too. Spamers like to infect machines just to get control of them for sending spam. The really bad news is that most free spyware removal software is spyware itself. A really good PC guy might be able to remove it. Good luck man! -- Tim :wq Nonsense! Spybot Search Destroy, Ad-Aware, Malwarebytes Anti-Malware, and SuperAntiSpyware are all EXCELLENT free anti-spyware programs. I routinely use all 4 of them to clean up infections for people. No spyware in ANY of them and, between the four programs, I have yet to run into something I couldn't clean. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 Add Hijack This! to your toolkit. Excellent for clearing crud out of hijacked browsers. I keep a copy in my virus removal toolkit - and the copy is named iexplore.exe so that the malware that does filename checks lets it run (like some blackmail-ware). Add Mike Lin's Startup Control (the single file exe version, not the installed version) as it helps resolve issues with programs that start when the system starts up. I have all my antivirus tools on a SD card that is in a USB flash drive reader. Why an SD card? Because the card has a write protect switch. Load the card, flip the switch, and it can't be written to like a regular flash drive can. Other than write protection I treat it just like any other flash drive. See http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/SDR-1/SD-CARD-READER/WRITER-USB-2.0/1.html The reader costs $4. A 4gb card is under $20. Naturally larger cards are more expensive. The SD card and matching reader is cheap protection for the antivirus / malware remover part your computer toolkit. The only complaint I have is that the All Electronics reader is a bit fat and blocks the adjacent USB jack on some systems. A 3 inch USB extension cord fixes that. Lastly - never use a flash drive / thumb drive / pen drive as your permanent storage - only as a secondary or transit storage device. I've seen too many die with no notice, and be irrecoverable. One client's daughter lost a three week vacation / honeymoon worth of photos. Another lost several hundred photos of a Grand Canyon raft trip. Both my 16bg regular toolkit and my 4gb antivirus toolkit have a backup copy as a folder on a raid-protected server and as a folder on my laptop. If the flash drive dies (and it has twice in three years) I just buy a new one, load it up and use it. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Can a KLN 6210A vibrasender be substituted for a KLN 6209A vibrasponder?
Late Mitrek boards still SPECIFIED different reeds, but I agree that they seemed interchangeable. In every case I saw no difference between TLN6824s, KLN6209s and KLN6210s. Just as a test I removed the reed hold down post on a Mitrek board and plugged in a TLN8381 fat decode reed into the decode socket and saw no change in performance. I've found that except for the old big copper cased reeds that most small reeds are very interchangeable. Yes, some combinations have sensitivity issues and a few result in situations where it just doesn't work. You aren't going to break anything or burn anything up by plugging in the wrong reed. And if you are paralleling decode reeds (to get an OR situation on tone decode) sometimes you need to change a resistor value or two. One weird thing is, with some reed / board combinations I've found that you can get big jumps in decode sensitivity just by rotating the decode reed 180 degrees in the socket, and sometimes you can get a reduction in distortion of the encode tone by rotating the encode reed in the socket. Since I discovered this phenomena I always rotate the decode reed in it's socket and leave it in whichever position that has best decode sensitivity. While the receiver is on the bench (in carrier squelch mode) just reduce the signal to maybe 8 to 10 db quieting SINAD, then enable the tone decoder and raise the PL tone level until it just decodes and note the level. Then rotate the reed and do the same check again, and leave the reed in the better spot. This doesn't happen in every case so don't be disappointed if the two numbers are the same. Measuring encode tone distortion is a bit more difficult for the average ham, but I used to key the transmitter, lower the tone encode level until it just dropped out, rotate the reed and key it again. The position that allowed the lower level is where I left it. Then I reset the level. And before I got good test equipment I'd do that check on the air and just listen full duplex. I don't know why some reeds (ore reed / board combinations) do that, they just do. No, I'm not advocating using this trick to reduce encode levels. If you have a decent high pass filter (i.e. PL cut filter) in the receiver then you aren't going to hear 600 Hz (or even 900 Hz) of PL deviation. I am advocating getting the best performance on PL decode sensitivity and encode distortion, especially when the only cost is a minute of your bench time, or less, to rotate a reed and twist a level control. Mike WA6ILQ At 04:24 AM 08/10/10, you wrote: Sorry, maybe. It's heavily application dependent. While senders *tend* to be higher level lower loss devices, that difference diminished over time. On some newer devices it seemed like the only difference was the label. The very alst applicaitons before Motorola caved adn went all electronic used one device type in all applications. Late Mitrek PL boards are an example. On 8/10/2010 6:20 AM, Captainlance wrote: Sorry, NO. A sender will not work as a sponder. - Original Message - From: mailto:wb6...@verizon.netEric Lemmon To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 9:13 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Can a KLN 6210A vibrasender be substituted for a KLN 6209A vibrasponder? Brian, Yes, probably. The coils have different impedances, and the armatures have different masses, but they are close enough that in most cases they are interchangeable. That said, Motorola did make them different for a reason- most likely that one was more sensitive as a vibrasponder, and the other worked better as a vibrasender. I recommend that you use the specified part for optimum performance. 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Brian J. Henry Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 11:34 AM To: mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Can a KLN 6210A vibrasender be substituted for a KLN 6209A vibrasponder? I have an MSR 2000 repeater that I want to change the PL frequency on. Does anyone know if a KLN 6210A vibrasender will work in place of a KLN 6209A vibrasponder on the MSR 2000 PL board? Curiously, Brian Henry, WB6QED -- mailto:o...@ozindfw.netmailto:o...@ozindfw.net Oz POB 93167 Southlake, TX 76092 (Near DFW Airport)
RE: [Repeater-Builder] (unknown)
Well, in the source address (in the header) is Dave E Stephens Sr kf6...@yahoo.com and he's been a group member since april of 2008. I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt and not ban him, but in case someone's hacked his password he's now on moderation, BTW, I know you folks (now over 4800 as of yesterday) probably don't realize it, but this group is set up to place every new member on automatic moderation. It takes deliberate action by a moderator to change that status to unmoderated. The new user doesn't get to regular status until we (the moderators) see just what kind of stuff they post. If I see a ham callsign it's 1 or 2, if not, more. And just to give you all an idea of the c...@p you don't see, in the last 5 days alone I've rejected 5 messages (i.e. spam) and banned 4 email addresses (spammers). These days for every 10 new legit members we ban 1 or 2. At the moment there are almost 300 that have been banned. One gentleman has been banned at email addresses belonging to three different ISPs. Mike WA6ILQ At 05:06 PM 08/10/10, you wrote: Who knows? When I see someone spamming a bunch of Yahoo groups, it can't be good, and I definitely won't click on a link in the message. Richard, N7TGB www.n7tgb.net The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money --Margaret Thatcher
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Pager interference
At 11:38 AM 08/07/10, you wrote: Hi, I've got a new pager issue that has come up on a tower where we have a VHF repeater. It's about 400 watts erp and 15 feet horizontal distance and 4.3 and 4.7 MHz away (it switches). I'm thinking of using one bp/br can that will have the notch wide enough to cover both channels and one pass can on our RX freq. I can also add more pass cans or something like the DCI window filter. The real question is where to these can go and in what order. We have a standard Q-202 duplexer that worked fine before the pager was put in. I'm thinking that the pager cans will go on the RX side of the duplexer, but does it matter if the pass goes on the duplexer side or the RX side of the bp/br can? I'm kinda thinking that it doesn't matter, but want to do it right in case it does. Dwayne Kincaid WD8OYG Is this a situation where the paging transmitter is a new install, or a situation where the paging company consolidated two transmitters, each a single frequency, into one that switches, or a new ham system install? If it's a new paging transmitter install, then 400 watts erp and 15 feet horizontal distance, is too damn close. Your antenna is broadside to its antenna and you have a nice coupling situation. It reminds me of a repeater that was located at an FM broadcast site, and we saw 35 (or so) watts of 90.7 MHz coming DOWN the ham feedline. The ham duplexer was nice and warm... If it's a consolidation I'll bet that the paging transmitter has no pass cavity, or any other filtering - if it ever had any it was probably removed in the consolidation. Digital paging transmitters use square wave modulation and are DIRTY when they have no filtering and local stories have it that the FCC has cited several consolidated transmitter systems. Paging companies are notorious for running overpower. One local situation had a license for 90w and they were found to be running 350w. They were cited, changed transmitters, and a year and a half later the interference returned. A no-notice visit from the FCC found then running 500w. Don;t order that DCI box yet - the first thing I'd do is reduce the antenna-to-antenna coupling. If the master site agreement has a no-interference clause perhaps you can get them to relocate an antenna, or go back to the two transmitters with filtering installed. Look at http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/separation.html Depending on your antenna gain I'd be very surprised if you are getting even 15db of isolation. Once you have reduced the coupling as best as you can, I'd then re-evaluate the situation by jacking a spectrum analyzer into your antenna and getting some hard numbers, a screen shot (even a digital photo of the CRT) posted here, etc. Then we can help a lot more. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Pager interference
The widow filter on the paging transmitter or on your repeater? DCI will do custom designs for special situations, and yours certainly qualifies. If the DCI is going on yours, make sure and plan ahead - I was told about a guy who had to add a DCI box to his system to keep out a new-to-the-site NOAA transmitter and since he wasn't paying for it he made sure to include in the specs that it would not affect anything in 144-148 Mhz rather than just his 2m pair - just in case he had to change frequencies down the road or he wanted to sell it. Another thought - any chance of inverting one of the antennas? (i.e. let the paging antenna sit above the crossmember and you suspend below the crossmember). Just getting your pattern a few feet below his might make enough dBs of difference and avoid the insertion loss of the DCI, and a few feet won't cost you THAT much coverage. One local system had a piece of pipe center-mounted to the tower, with the 440 antenna mounted to the top of it and going up, and the 2m antenna mounted to the bottom of it and going down. A high power 460 repeater was added and ended up on the adjacent tower position. The cure was to exchange the antenna positions - the 2m took the broadside and the 440 was below the pattern. Problem solved. Mike WA6ILQ At 01:33 PM 08/08/10, you wrote: Hi Mike, Excellent information. It's a new pager and it's a two channel system, no cans. We're the ham guys and have been there for about 5 years, but only as guests. Yes, there is a non-interference clause, but we do not want to go that route. We're all on good speaking terms (tower owner, ham group and pager guy) and since we're the guests, we'd like to help solve the problem (rather than just point fingers). The pager transmitter is running 100 watts to a 9 db antenna that points away from our 6db omni. I agree that we're probably getting only 10 to 15 db of isolation at 15 feet (yes, already checked the RB site). Moving either of the antennas is not really an option. It's only 170 feet and we both want the top (in flat-land Maryland). The DCI box on the pager looks like it will give about 40 db to our rx freq and we'll add a notch (40db) and a pass (30 db) to get the total to just over 100. We added the pass and notch last week and it work on all but the weak signals. So we're thinking a little window filter will take care of it. Dwayne Kincaid WD8OYG --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Mike Morris wa6...@... wrote: At 11:38 AM 08/07/10, you wrote: Hi, I've got a new pager issue that has come up on a tower where we have a VHF repeater. It's about 400 watts erp and 15 feet horizontal distance and 4.3 and 4.7 MHz away (it switches). I'm thinking of using one bp/br can that will have the notch wide enough to cover both channels and one pass can on our RX freq. I can also add more pass cans or something like the DCI window filter. The real question is where to these can go and in what order. We have a standard Q-202 duplexer that worked fine before the pager was put in. I'm thinking that the pager cans will go on the RX side of the duplexer, but does it matter if the pass goes on the duplexer side or the RX side of the bp/br can? I'm kinda thinking that it doesn't matter, but want to do it right in case it does. Dwayne Kincaid WD8OYG Is this a situation where the paging transmitter is a new install, or a situation where the paging company consolidated two transmitters, each a single frequency, into one that switches, or a new ham system install? If it's a new paging transmitter install, then 400 watts erp and 15 feet horizontal distance, is too damn close. Your antenna is broadside to its antenna and you have a nice coupling situation. It reminds me of a repeater that was located at an FM broadcast site, and we saw 35 (or so) watts of 90.7 MHz coming DOWN the ham feedline. The ham duplexer was nice and warm... If it's a consolidation I'll bet that the paging transmitter has no pass cavity, or any other filtering - if it ever had any it was probably removed in the consolidation. Digital paging transmitters use square wave modulation and are DIRTY when they have no filtering and local stories have it that the FCC has cited several consolidated transmitter systems. Paging companies are notorious for running overpower. One local situation had a license for 90w and they were found to be running 350w. They were cited, changed transmitters, and a year and a half later the interference returned. A no-notice visit from the FCC found then running 500w. Don;t order that DCI box yet - the first thing I'd do is reduce the antenna-to-antenna coupling. If the master site agreement has a no-interference clause perhaps you can get them to relocate an antenna, or go back to the two transmitters with filtering installed. Look at http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/separation.html
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola RKR1225
At 08:55 AM 08/08/10, you wrote: I have (or should I say had) an exellent 440 repeater running using an RKR1225. Then one day not too long ago it quit running. Cracking open the case, I found an extremely well built mouse nest sitting atop the transceiver compartment (right beside my add-on NHRC controller). Well it looks like the rats built there outhouse on top of the controller, with overflow running down into, and across the floor of the main compartment. The fur balls made quite a mess of the cabinet, and most of the galv compound has rotted away. Except for the controller, I should be able to salvage the transceiver and power supply and charge module, but the cabinet is shot (aka looks like rat poop). Anyone know where I can buy a new cabinet for an RKR1225 ? Maybe someone out there has a rig thats been zapped by lightining with little damage done to the cabinet ? Let me know offline ... Mext time I'll cover all the holes with little screens to keep the rats out. Best regards, You have my sympathies. Been there, done that, have photos somewhere. In your shoes, I'd gut the cabinet, and get it painted. Don't bother with a galv compound unless you are near salt water (like a costal city). Just take it to a couple of local sandblasters and a couple of local auto body shops and get quotes. If there is a custom motorcycle shop near you check with them as well - they usually know of folks that handle painting of weirdly shaped items (watch American Chopper some thursday night on TLC)... Note that sandblasters is an outdated term, and they use a number of different compounds these days, among the materials are crushed walnut shells and glass beads of differing sizes. Just tell them that you need the cabinet striped to bare metal. Let them decide what material to use. Make sure you get a time quote as well as a money quote, and point out that you will need to schedule things so that it comes out of sandblasting and into paint before it can start rusting. So you will need to do some scheduling and a commitment from them that they will keep to the schedule. In my case i was after cheap rather than quick (like most hams), and the body shop guy made a good case for waiting and running piggy pack on someone else paying for the mixing of the paint and setting up of the spray guns. The body shop knew that one of his other locations had the business for a local company truck fleet that used a light brown / dark tan color that was a very close match to my cabinet's color (the old Motrac Tan). I set things up so that they'd call me when they got a truck in that needed body work and paint. I'd call the sandblasters and give them a heads up, then take the cabinet down to them the next day, and have the blasted and bare metal cabinet ready to take into the paint booth the day the truck went in (i.e. minimal time for the cabinet to start rusting). I ended up waiting about 9 weeks, but got the call one thursday afternoon that someone had caved in the side of a pickup - right at the firewall. It would be going into the paint booth on tuesday or so. The cabinet was at the sandblasters on thursday, I picked it up on monday, it was in paint on wednesday, and back in my hands on friday evening. Total cost was $50 for the sandblasting and a case of Bud for the body shop (I offered him cash, but that's what he asked for). Note this was in the early 80s and prices have no doubt gone up. Since your RKR is black, the body shop probably has that in the spray gun a lot more often than a color like sandy brown. Get some quotes and decide what you want to do. you may decide to get is blasted and paint it yourself with a few cans of spray paint... Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Mastr II drift problem
It's on the page that I've posted the link to three times hoping that Steve would look at it. See this article http://www.repeater-builder.com/ge/m2icoms.html Read the whole thing, and look for the paragraph that starts There is one way to cheat Mike WA6ILQ At 09:38 PM 08/07/10, you wrote: modified the plug that goes in to the exciter by putting two resistors and a jumper on the plug to enable the compensate line. Gerald, AA4YQ told me about this. Could you please pass along the details of this mod, or point to a link online? Thanks... Steve sbjohns...@aol.com http://www.wd8das.net/ Radio is your best entertainment value. Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] RE:Mastr II drift problem
At 10:00 AM 08/05/10, you wrote: I was told that I should be using 5C for receive and transmit but the 5C will NOT fit on my PLL exciter. Any ideas? Steve W4SEF See this article http://www.repeater-builder.com/ge/m2icoms.html It has photos of the EC, 5C and 2C wide and narrow ICOMs. You apparently have a wide EC transmit and a narrow receive element. The EC is a slave element, and the 5C is a master. The 2C and 1C stand alone - they do not receive or generate the compensation voltage. Without a 5C in the transmitter, the compensation line in your transmitter is floating and as such the transmitter is drifting. As I see it you can do one of three things: 1) Jumper the receive compensation line over to the transmitter. This slaves your EC to the 5C in the receiver. This is quick, cheap and will work. If you have a high RF level at your site (like at a busy 2-way site or at a TV station transmit site), then use a small coax like RG174 as the jumper and ground the shield to an adjacent ground pin.. 2) Get a wide 5C (on ANY frequency) and stuff into an open element connector in the transmitter. You DON'T add a jumper to enable the element, just plug it in. It's only use is as a compensation voltage generator (as the master to the EC slave). 3) The most expensive, but the right way, would be to get a wide 2C element and have International rock it up on your frequency, then replace the EC with the 2C. All of this is covered in that article. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Mastr II drift problem
At 03:33 PM 08/03/10, you wrote: Hello all, I have having a severe drift problem on my GE Mastr II 2 meter repeater. The transmit freq will drift nearly 2 KHZ over a 5-10 minute period. I have changed exciters and used a different ICOM but no improvement. The building that I am in is not ventilated and is very very hot. I put a high/low thermometer in and one day the high temp in the building was 114 degrees. Is this the problem? Thanks for any help. Steve W4SEF Can you elaborate on the situation? Is it an FM exciter or a phase mod exciter? Is it an EC, a 5C, or 2C Icom? Have you read http://www.repeater-builder.com/ge/m2icoms.html especially the paragraph that starts with Any voltage change on the +10vDC power supply line will change the frequency on the Icom... ?? You will also what to read the page at http://www.repeater-builder.com/tech-info/temperature-compensation.html. An idea on cooled down a building before you set the frequency... I once took a couple of cheapie box fans and setting one to blow in (at floor level) and the second stacked above it to blow out (at the top of the door level), and with a piece of cardboard in between them as an air dam. The cardboard was cut from the side of a large cardboard box that was used to ship a washing machine (ask for one at any appliance store). You could do something similar for the time period needed to set the frequency - your target is 75 to 80 degrees F for about an hour. Look at page 5 of this: http://www.repeater-builder.com/ge/lbi-library/lbi-38505a.pdf Yes, it's a receiver LBI, and you have a drifting transmitter, but the temperature notes apply. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: question for commercial radio shops
Didn't Lloyd Bridges work that one to death in Airplane ? At 07:43 PM 07/13/10, you wrote: Nothing if you're name is roger. Smile emoticon From: mailto:llhorl...@gmail.comLarry Horlick Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 10:02 PM To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: question for commercial radio shops Hey, what's wrong with a roger beep?'beep' On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 9:56 PM, skipp025 mailto:skipp...@yahoo.comskipp...@yahoo.com wrote: If a person whom you knew and is involved in a number of church youth camps activities asked you to program FRS frequencies into a 4w UHF HT type accepted for LMR would you do so ? It would only be for extended range at camp. If the radio power can be reduced, turn it down and program the FRS frequencies in. If the power can't be reduced, put the radios on GMRS Frequencies. Many of the Kenwood Portables I sell allow power level programming per channel so the FRS gets low and the other stuff gets the nominal rated power. FRS Radios are sold cheap at the big box stores... try to find the ones that allow you to turn off the $...@%@*% stupid roger beeps s. inline: 1130f514.gif
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: question for commercial radio shops
Both. There was a transmitter on beep (that almost nobody heard), and there was a transmitter off beep that everyone heard - with about 100Hz difference in the two tone frequencies. Read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quindar_tones What it doesn't mention is that there was an audio notch filter that took out the beep from the audio fed to the actual transmitter. Mike WA6ILQ (who worked at NASA -JPL in the 1970s, plus two additional contract gigs, one in the 80s and one in the 90s) At 08:02 PM 07/13/10, you wrote: Meant a lot to the First Astronauts with Communications that is how it got started I think , I forget if it was a Pre or after Transmission Don KA9QJG Nothing if you're name is roger. Smile emoticon From: mailto:llhorl...@gmail.comLarry Horlick Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 10:02 PM To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: question for commercial radio shops Hey, what's wrong with a roger beep?'beep' On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 9:56 PM, skipp025 mailto:skipp...@yahoo.comskipp...@yahoo.com wrote: inline: 113874e1.gif
Re: [Repeater-Builder] showing our age (old HT's)
At 08:19 AM 07/28/10, you wrote: GE PR36, shudder! A brick with wires that easily broke when the case was opened or shut. Not a nice radio to have on the bench. I ran a Portamobile 1 on 52.525 about 10 years ago, guess I'll have to dig it out of the storage and see what shape it's in these days. Moving slightly off topic, I recently came across a Motorola mobile mic with the cast metal housing. A real favorite of the cops back in the day; it had many uses, only one of which had anything to do with communicating via voice. Other uses had to do with communicating, but were more non-verbal in nature and directed at the jerk in the back seat of the cruiser. Milt N3LTQ On alternate means of communication... Ten to fifteen years ago there was a gentleman that used to be seen at every last-saturday-of-the-month electronics / ham radio swap meet... Always wore the same baseball cap, and always was looking for only one thing. All he'd buy were the old cast metal-case microphones, and he'd buy them in any condition, as long as the case was intact and undented. One day I commented on him to one of the guys that ran the swap meet .. and was told that it had taken a year or so to figure the guy out. It seemed that he wouldn't tell anybody why he was buying just microphones, but finally he was seen selling at another swap meet, in a hispanic part of town on one saturday and an oriental part of town another saturday. Apparently the gentleman in question bought the mics for a dollar or two, he'd take them home, strip them and bead-blast the cases, then chrome most of them and powder coat the rest of them. They'd get new mic elements, PTT switches, and cords. The guy would sell the new mics to taxicab drivers - apparently the hispanic drivers loved the chrome and the oriental drivers loved the powder coat... He was selling the chromed ones outright, with your choice of GE or Moto connectors, and taking orders with up-front deposits for your choice of color powder coat and connector type. It seems that a metal case mic is NOT considered an offensive weapon by police investigators... but makes a dandy defensive one when swung at the end of a few inches of mic cord... it would quiet down any unruly customer. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Digest Number 7357
At 06:51 AM 07/28/10, you wrote: You guys will have to find a picture of that. It sounds hysterical! It was. It looked like a stock mobile microphone off a Motrac. He had a belt clip that normally held a HT, but the hangup button from the mic fit into it just fine. He'd have the end of mic cord stuck in his pocket. Some one would call him on the HT radio, and he'd answer on the mobile mic, and people thought he had a transmitter in his pocket. But if he pulled on the mic just right the cord would pop out of his pocket - and it still worked! I assume Mr. McKay built the transmitter right into the mic, no? Yes. Dick McKay K6VGP is an old-time 2m pioneer in the Los Angeles area - and despite being a career pilot with United (now retired) he's an exceptionally good engineer (a future project of his is a complete rebuild of a Beech Staggerwing). In the late 1960s when I first met Dick he had a 2m repeater that grew to six receive sites and two transmit sites, and a 440 repeater that functioned as a control channel and as an intercom among the dozen or so control operators. The two channels could be tied together or run separately. The system also had a HF remote base that could be accessed from either side, and normally lived on 20 meters. He can tell you stories about the Old Farts on 20 meters trying to describe the problem his SSB radio had with the strange sounding audio and the funny sound at the end of his transmissions... (the squelch tail) You've got a funny oscillation in your microphone was one such comment... At one point you could move around the band with the DC motor worm drive on the VFO knob. A quick tap on star or pound would bump you around 200hz. For may LA area hams that started out on 2m that system was their first exposure to DXing - occasionally you'd hear DIck working DX (like Pitcarin Island) while he sitting in a restaurant and talking on a handheld. The mobile mic transmitter was basically a modulated oscillator / quintupler that used a 29.38 MHz rock, and was powered by a 9v battery. The shield of the microphone curly-cord was the antenna. It probably ran 25-50 milliwatts. At SAROC he was receiving on an HT100 that he had modified from 2 channels to 6 (the HT100 was a real Moto product that was made from slimiline HT220 less the final transistor, and in a very short case that had the battery mounted behind the radio. In stock configuration the HT100 ran about 250-300 mW and was intended for low power applications like a stage crew radio. Due to the price it was not a popular radio, I've only seen one other than the one that Dick has. Some photos of Dick's radio are at http://www.repeater-builder.com/wa6ilq/ht100 Yes, the antenna on HT200s, HT220s, MT500s and HT100s collapsed into the case. He still has the HT100, and if he has the trick microphone, it probably still works. One toy of his that I saw only at SAROC was the hip flask he built from an intrinsically safe HT200 case (complete with collapsed Dixie cups stashed in the battery compartment). It looked like a stock radio until he popped the top cap off of the antenna and poured out the beverage. And you will have to excuse me, but what is a 94? Today you'd describe a repeater that received on 146.22 and transmitted on 146.82 as being on 146.82 and down 600. In the early days of 2M FM you'd say it was on 22-82 since the only frequencies available to repeaters was the range of 146-148. A repeater that was on 147.18 would be said to be on 78-18. The terminology started to get unwieldy when the splinter channels were developed (like 146.625 / 025) and when repeaters were allowed in the 145 area, That's when the current terminology became popular. So someone operating on 94 was on 146.94 simplex. I myself don't have stories like this because I am a child of the 80's, but I love hearing about it and am know amongst my friends as the keeper of old things. This is why you all keep getting questions from me regarding the Genesis radios. Keep the stories and good advice coming. -Albert --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, tony dinkel tonydinke...@... wrote: I remember that too Ken! I miss SAROC! And for your SoCal types.. I remember seeing Dick McKay walking around the Sahara in Vegas, talking into a Motorola mic (with just the coil cord hanging down) and listening on '94. This was during SAROC in the 70's Ken
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Motorola R-2200A User Manual
There's a 2mb version of it at repeater-builder. Go to the Test Equipment page, then Motorola. If yours is a cleaner / better/ more complete version let me know. I'll replace it with yours. Mike WA6ILQ At 01:30 AM 07/28/10, you wrote: And you are so correct my friend :-) Just found a place that James (KC9KTV) was able to upload it for me in pdf. Hey Kevin I have it on Mediafire site right now. Not sure if you would want this for the website manuals section or not (hold your request for it until we see what Kevin sez ;-) It is Communications Service Monitor OPERATORS' MANUAL R-2200/ R-2400 68P81069A79-B. Could send you the password for you to download. It is a 42meg download though. 73 and thanks everyone, Robert KD4YDC --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Eric Lemmon wb6...@... wrote: Robert, Perhaps we are stuck on semantics here. There are only two manuals ever published for the R2200-series monitors- the two I mentioned. The Operator's Manual is the one you seek. 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 7:32 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Motorola R-2200A User Manual Thanks for the reply Eric, I have the Maintenance Manual. Did they make a How To type of manual? I know a little bit, but really not sure how to navigate around it. Anyone? Robert KD4YDC --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com , Eric Lemmon wb6fly@ wrote: Robert, I have good news and bad news. The bad news is that the R2200-series Operator's Manual 6881069A79 is out of print and is NLA. The good news is that the R2200A Maintenance Manual 6991069A76 is still available from Motorola Parts, for about $58. 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Robert Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 5:25 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola R-2200A User Manual Does anyone have a link to this? Would love it if this was in pdf as well ;-) 73, Robert KD4YDC Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: 420Mhz Radio for Voter?
Look at W6KGBs article on moving 450-470 Mastr IIs to 420-450. It's on the GE Mastr II page at repeater-builder. You could use a Mastr II UHF mobile with the receiver, exciter and IPA converted to 420, then use the receiver in an aux receiver chassis at the voter site. You wouldn't need to convert the PA, the IPA (driver) and a beam would be enough for a point-to-point link. Bob Meister WA1MIK did an article on converting the multiplier chains so that the UHF Micor receivers could hear down as low as 435 MHz (where the front ends run out of tuning range). Mike WA6ILQ At 05:10 PM 07/27/10, you wrote: Thanks Jeff, I'll keep looking around for those low split UHF Micor receivers. What about the transmit side? Maybe I should look for a unified chassis low split UHF repeater. Swap out the UHF receiver for a VHF high band receiver and use that for my remote receiver site. Then use the low split UHF receiver on the other end of the link. That make sense? --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Jeff DePolo j...@... wrote: When you say low split, are you talking about the Motorola TRE1201/TRE8031 406-420 Mhz receivers? I don't have a manual in front of me, but yes, 406-420 receivers, they'll work fine well into the mid 430's without mods. What Canadian sources might have these? Well, Spantek comes to mind as a dealer. CW Wolfe used to get a lot of stuff out of Canada, but I haven't talked to Bud in quite a few years, not sure if he's still in business. This list is probably the best resource. eBay as an alternative. If you get desperate I still have a few dozen low-split Micors in the warehouse, but really don't have the time (or patience) to deal with packing and shipping radios for what few dollars I'd get out of them (i.e. value of my time $value of radio). But if you just wanted a receiver, you can consider me a last resort if you strike out everywhere else... --- Jeff WN3A --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com , Jeff DePolo jd0@ wrote: What is a good radio for building a one way 420 link? The link will be for a remote receiver and will not need to be duplex... RX at the voter and TX at the remote receiver. The link RX has to live on a noisy hill. Thanks for your advice. My preferences, in no particular order, would be Micor/SpectraTAC (low split), Mastr II (77 split), and Delta-S (low-split). MVP/Exec II (again, 77 split) would be fine too. All have excellent front ends. They can be found if you look a bit, especially check Canadian sources; they're not as easy to find stateside as 450-470 radios, but they're not unobtainium either. --- Jeff WN3A Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: GMRS License Help
Absolutely true. And that's only the start of it. Look up NPRM 10-119 in Google. Mike At 12:54 PM 07/28/10, you wrote: we are hearing that the fcc is going to limit output power to 2 watts in the gmrs service that would preclude all repeaters and implies handheld use only --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Andy agrimm0...@... wrote: I just applied for my GMRS license yesturday evening. I got a confirmation email saying that I did pay my 85.00 bucks. How do I know what my call sign is and all my license information. Will I get another email when all the data is processed by the FCC and everything is confirmed. Will they mail my license to me in the mail??
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Service monitor newbie questions, Determining RX sensitivity with HP 8924C at 12db sinad
At 07:55 PM 07/26/10, you wrote: Hello group, I have been playing with repeaters for quite some time and now I finally own a real piece of test equipment. An HP 8924c, before almost dumping more money into one more, one function, piece of equipment, a spectrum analyzer, I found these 8924c's on eBay... Shopped for about 6 months and found a 100W version for less then a K so I'm very pleased. The manual for this unit is not designed to walk you through any of the analog test procedures or setup. I've figured some of the simple stuff out. Duplex tests, spectrum analyzer/tracking gen ect. and I love this thing so far. Right now before I start dabbling with my first full on GE Mastr RX alignments I'd like to make some sensitivity tests (the right way). There's a lot of bells and whistles on this HP and I think there's some built in sinad measurement tools. I also would like to know how to make the old standard 20db reff test as well as the 12db sinad. Is there any information I missed about using this 8924c's for it's analog functions, setup and test procedures??? Also I plan on building a sampler slug for my bird43 other then that what else is really needed in the tool box for this unit. I plan on using it for TX/RX alignments, band-pass, notch filter adjustments, duplexer isolation, antenna and feed line analysis. Sorry for this very noob of a question but elmers around here with any knowledge of this unit just don't exist. And my friend with an ifr1200 tried to get me started on the sinad testing but I think there is an easier procedure for this HP 8924.c. Thanks for your time RB's Regards Ross kc7rjk http://www.kc7rjk.netwww.kc7rjk.net There's a slew of docs on the 892x series on repeater-builder. Go to www.repeater-builder.com, scroll down to test Equipment, then HP / Agilent then scroll down to the 892x stuff. In fact the last item on the page is HP 8924C CDMA Mobile Station Test Set Reference Guide (Firmware Version A.07.04 and above) And if you want to write A newbies introduction to the 8924 feel free to... we'll put it on the web site...
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Recommendations for a Voter Link
At 09:24 AM 07/27/10, you wrote: Mike Morris wa6...@... wrote: But there are ways around it. The simple method: Have a local 1950 oscillator at the voter site. It can be done with a 88mh toroid, a few resistors and caps, and a single transistor. Can't think of the last time I saw an 88mh Toroid for sale in any obvious location but I'm sure they're out there somewhere like Ebay. I found some of the newer one-chip GE Status Tone Encoders on Ebay a few months back and they were cheaper than I could have easily built them for. Sure. And I've also seen a status tone encoder made from a LM386. Naturally you'd want to use some high grade resistors and caps when building it. It drove an audio transformer... I have no idea where the guy found a transformer that eight 600 ohm windings... Have a SPDT reed relay driven by the link receiver RUS (or COR). Links can be on 420Mhz, 438-439Mhz, 900Mhz, or 1200 Mhz. ... and if you're creative some other places. The NC contact on the relay has 1950hz. NO contact has link receiver audio. Armature feeds voter card audio input. When channel is idle, card sees 1950hz and is happy. When channel is unsquelched card sees link receiver audio and votes. Wonder if the relay pole contact transition time contributes to any type of glitch, hunt, delay or erratic event that might otherwise not be there if you simply (resistance as an example) mixed and removed the Status Tone? Probably no more than the EM switching on a microwave shot. Reed relays last a long time - I've had used ones last 12 years, and new ones last 20, but you can use CMOS audio switches if you want. CD4053 and use the diagram from an ACC RC-85 Repeater Controller as your basic guide. Absolutely. Documentation on both vintages of the GE voter (grey paint is early, black paint is late) is on the GE LBI page at repeater- builder. Mike WA6ILQ The Spectra Tac Voter Manuals pop up on Ebay every so often as to the GE Version Manuals. If the manual is NLA from Moto we can scan it and post it. If you fool the status tone decoder with a local oscillator, keep in mind the level of the Status Tone also plays into the actual performance. It's not just a tone present or tone not present function. That's very true. But it's is one way to avoid 24/7 link duty cycle. Another is to configure the voter channel for EM and then drive the E leads with COR contacts. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Anybody have a clue ?
Thanks for all the info. Now I know what to put on the Test Equipment page for that wattmeter. Mike
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Recommendations for a Voter Link
The idle marker tone system was designed for wirelines and adapted to microwave shots. But there are ways around it. The simple method: Have a local 1950 oscillator at the voter site. It can be done with a 88mh toroid, a few resistors and caps, and a single transistor. Have a SPDT reed relay driven by the link receiver RUS (or COR). Links can be on 420Mhz, 438-439Mhz, 900Mhz, or 1200 Mhz. The NC contact on the relay has 1950hz. NO contact has link receiver audio. Armature feeds voter card audio input. When channel is idle, card sees 1950hz and is happy. When channel is unsquelched card sees link receiver audio and votes. Reed relays last a long time - I've had used ones last 12 years, and new ones last 20, but you can use CMOS audio switches if you want. The GE voter performance has the Doug Hall beat hands down. Documentation on both vintages of the GE voter (grey paint is early, black paint is late) is on the GE LBI page at repeater-builder. Mike WA6ILQ At 07:34 PM 07/25/10, you wrote: I'm in the exact same boat working on a remote receiver. I don't want the link keyed 24-7 either. I now there are some voters out there that don't require 1950hz and some that don't need it present 100% of the time to keep that voter port active. But are there any other voters in the used or DIY market that's in the HAM budget. That do not require the 1950hz tone at all. Here one I found on RB but I will need eventually 3 ports. http://www.repeater-builder.com/rbtip/wb2whc.htmlhttp://www.repeater-builder.com/rbtip/wb2whc.html Can one more port be added and has anyone had good success with this unit? Thanks All, Ross kc7rjk -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim - WD6AWP Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2010 3:19 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Recommendations for a Voter Link I'm going to start working on building a link for a remote receiver. I already have a voter and I'll be using a VHF Micor receiver strip for the remote. A couple of mobiles that tune down to 420 might be good as I don't have a lot room. I'm thinking the link transmitter will be keyed 7x24 with tone signaling. However the duty cycle requirement is a problem for mobiles. A microwave system might be possible if I knew what and where to get. Wireline is probably out. I'd like to hear your ideas on how to put this together. Thanks, Tim P.S. Sorry if this post is a dup. The first one did seem to come through this morning.
[Repeater-Builder] Anybody have a clue ?
Photo here: www.repeater-builder.com/wa6ilq/Motorola-S-1350-C-WATT-METER-with-500W-500-1000-MHZ.jpg Anybody know who made the watt meter in the photo for Moto ? Did that company market it under their own name? The HT220 switch handle on the right side is the forward-reverse selector switch. Did Moto actually use that know/handle as a stock item? Or has someone along the line lost the original knob? Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] adding a 3/4meter repeater to my site?
At 10:42 PM 07/23/10, you wrote: Mike Morris wrote: And watch the frequencies - don't have a 147.18 output and try and run it with a 441 input. Or a 146.64 output and try and run it with a 439 link channel. All it takes is one third harmonic to ruin your whole day. Try 441.300 and 441.900 outputs at a site that also has a 2m repeater with a 600 kHz input offset... Matthew Kaufman Yep. Nasty. San Diego has KOGO AM on 600 KHZ Los Angeles has KMNY AM (100% Chinese) on 1.6 MHz. And in Texas somewhere there is or was a very nice and tall commercial tower with two FM stations on it, exactly 5 MHz apart. I forget the details, it's been 20-plus years since I was told about it. Supposedly Motorola offered both stations any reimbursement of expenses plus a large bonus payment if either one of them would move at least 300 kilohertz - Moto wanted to be able to put some UHF commercial repeaters on the tower. Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] NSN 6054A 12W speaker schematic ?
At 01:19 PM 07/23/10, you wrote: Hey Guys. I was looking at the schematic for the above mentioned speaker (thank you repeater builder site) and I had a few questions. If anybody's interested it's here: http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/genesis/pdfs/nsn6054a-68p81108c39-o.pdf First, does anyone know where to find a replacement for the 5184320A99 dual op-amp labeled U1? I'd look in the National Semiconductor products manual that covers automotive audio products. That schematic resembles what I saw in an early 1980s app note for a car stereo receiver. LM187something. Secondly, Is this op-amp basically being used as a buffer, preamp, and inverter? Both halves are being used strictly as an inverting buffer for out-of-phase audio. Look carefully at the schematic and remember that nothing in the input circuit is ground referenced - the audio input (from the radio) is balanced audio (both are sides hot, 180 degrees out of phase with each other, and there's an implied / virtual audio ground) in the middle. Each side of the circuitry driving the speaker is a mirror image of the other, just like the incoming audio is a mirror image compared to the virtual ground. Thirdly, what on earth are pins 3, 4, 5 and pins 10, 11, 12 doing? I have never seen so many pins on an op-amp tied together. If that chip is the one I'm thinking of its capable of about 2 watts per channel on it's own. That takes some heat sinking. Probably a heat sink for the final transistors inside the opamp. And if you look closely, pin 1 is audio ground, and pins 3,4,5, 10, 11 and 12 are power ground - and those are switched to ground by Q3, which is driven by the squelch circuit in the radio. Thanks! Albert Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] adding a 3/4meter repeater to my site?
And watch the frequencies - don't have a 147.18 output and try and run it with a 441 input. Or a 146.64 output and try and run it with a 439 link channel. All it takes is one third harmonic to ruin your whole day. Mike At 06:14 AM 07/23/10, you wrote: John, You will get as many positive answers as you will negative. That said, the proper way would be 2 antennas and 2 runs of coax. If you already have the dual band antenna and want to go that route there are several things to watch out for. What is the power rating of your antenna? If you have 2 repeaters putting out 100 watts into an antenna rated at 100 watts, you will damage the antenna. At the ground end, you will need a diplexer to split the single run of coax into one for each repeater. The diplexer will have the same power restrictions as the antenna. Without keeping these two restrictions in mind, you may spend more $$ the second time around. Jim - Original Message - From: John fritzej...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 08:49 Subject: [Repeater-Builder] adding a 3/4meter repeater to my site? I am sure this is a stupid question, or it seems so to me, but I can't find the answer anywhere. I am thinking about putting a 440 Mhz repeater (or link) for Packet at my 2M repeater site. Can I use the same coax and antenna (multi band) or do I need a complete seperate run? Hoping to save a chunk of change ;-) Of course I'll need seperate cavities and /or duplexer. Thanks, John K2QY Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Controller recommendations
Controllers are like religion - everyone has their own one true way. In many cases you can track a personal preference back to the first controller that they were introduced to - I know folks that grew up with Link RLCs, understand them and won't touch anything else. Ditto on others and Computer Automation Technologies (CAT Auto). There's a list of controller manufacturers on this page: http://www.repeater-builder.com/rbtip/supplyindex.html Mike WA6ILQ At 07:13 AM 07/16/10, you wrote: Hello all. I'm looking at replacing an MSR2000 and homebuilt controller with a Quantar and commercially built controller. Last controller I played with was an RC96 so it's been a while. The repeater setup is pretty simple. VHF MSR2000 with a simple courtesy beep and CW id'er. Two 5 DTMF digit commands allow us to turn the repeater on and off. The controller acknowledges the commands with a simple CW R. There's a UHF link (MCX100) down to a hub repeater which allows linking to other repeaters. The VHF repeater can be linked from the local side or the UHF link side. Two 3 digit commands allow us to turn the link on or off. The link has a 5 minute inactivity timer that takes the link down if nobody is using it from the local VHF side. Two additional 5 digital DTMF commands allow us to make the link permanent and remove it. This is used during Canwarn operations. The courtesy beep changes to a boop during local activity while the link is up. During linkup, the last 3 letters of the callsign are sent on the link and the local side as an acknowledgement the link is up. That's it. Pretty simple system that has been in use about 10 years now. The only reason to change it out at this point is to add another P25 capable repeater to the area. I'd like to keep the current functionality and possibly add a Weather Alert function. I have a remote serial port available at the site for programming. Some sort of command line interface would be best. I've looked at some of the Link Communications products and I've heard good things about them. Any other recommendations? Thanks, -- Steve steve.jones at rogers.com VE3XF
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Repeater Control Operator via Other-Than-Phone-Line
At 05:58 AM 07/09/10, you wrote: Kenneth, Can you elaborate on the programming piece? I'm hung up on the fact that to program the CAT-1000 via serial port, you've got to first activate the CAT-1000 serial port via the DIP switch. (I'm thinking there may be a DTMF command to activate the serial port as well, but don't have my manual handy.) 73, Mike WM4B Basically you cross-connect a serial port from the IRLP computer to the CAT controller. Then you remote into the IRLP computer, and you can program the CAT just as if you were local to it. And the serial cable from the IRLP box to the CAT will have to cross over the transmit and receive data lines. I've never used a CAT controller, so have no idea how the remote programming is done. If serial won't work for you , then you can always use the DTMF send feature of the IRLP software to send DTMF strings to one of the receiver audio inputs of the CAT. I helped out on one repeater where the owner had AUX 3 output of the IRLP card wired to a reed relay coil. One armature of the relay was wired to the receiver audio in connection on the repeater controller , the normally closed contact was wired to the repeater receiver audio, the normally open contact was wired to the IRLP sound card output. With AUX3 off the system worked normally, with AUX 3 on it allowed remote programming. As to the serial port on the CAT being active, well, you will have to handle that as a separate project. As I said above, I've never seen a CAT controller in person. Do you have to flip the switch between operating and programing, or can you leave it in the programming enabled position and still have the system usable?? Worst case, use the above idea and use a multiple pole relay, with one pole across the particular section of the DIP switch? Then flip the DIP switch remotely with an AUX output? Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] carrier operated relay
At 05:28 AM 07/06/10, you wrote: Greetings, Can anybody help me to make a makeshift repeater, I need a schematic diagram for carrier operated relay or COR for two radio transceivers to be converted into a repeater. Thanx to anyone who can help on this. Manny , ( mrj12...@yahoo.com ) Some radios are easier to interface to a repeater controller than others. Transmitters are not hard - audio and PTT. Receivers are another case - you need to find a carrier sense point and a tone decode sense point. What radios are you going to be using? And don't forget duty cycle - the average mobile radio transmitter is 10 to 20% (look at the spec sheet for the particular radio). In mobile service the mobile transmitter is used rarely. In a repeater it's used for ALL user transmissions, one after the other. In some cases it may be on 80% of the time - and the average mobile will meltdown in that situation... Mike WA6ILQ
[Repeater-Builder] Reminder - GMRS NPRM
Just an FYI reminder on FCC Docket NPRM 10-119 that totally restructures GMRS and wipes it out as we know it. Replies are due the 7th. That's TOMORROW. If you have a personal dog in that fight it's time to get moving. Major points: GMRS channels become more FRS channels. Power goes up to 2 watts on all channels. Drop all licensing and age limits (can you say 27 Mhz CB-type mess ?) Any experience you have with unsupervised small children playing with FRS radios and how that would destroy what GMRS now is would be helpful. No licensing also would mean the end of the limits on commercial businesses usurping or taking over GMRS for business band use. One of the major points in the Docket is that there will be no more repeaters - this is a major point to anyone that uses a GMRS repeater. Everything will be simplex. - and it's a well known fact that UHF ground-level simplex is useless at over about 30-40 miles due to the RF horizon and earth curvature. Back in the 60s the US Army experimented with troposcatter at VHF and UHF, and discovered that VHF would work, but UHF would not, even with 10kw at UHF. No licensing would also result in the end of any meaningful way to regulate or limit who uses a repeater. If you operate a GMRS repeater, or if you are part of a group that sponsors a GMRS repeater this could destroy your ability to control who uses your system. It's vital to make the FCC aware of the absolute necessity for licensing for shared use of repeaters. Both call signs and any identification would be eliminated under the proposed new rules. But the FCC would still expect GMRS users to cooperate in the selection and use of channels, including limiting communications to the minimum practicable time, to reduce interference, and to make the most effective use of the facilities. [Proposed rule 95.103(a).] Yeah, right. You need to explain to the Commission that coordinating with others in the absence of any identification is completely unworkable and totally impractical. (Note that in paragraphs 19 and 20, the FCC recognizes the importance of facilitating user cooperation by proposing to continue specifically disallowing voice scrambling.) Drop all existing type acceptance - you will have to buy all new radios. Docket 10-119 discusses somewhat that the development of cellular telephone has lessened the need for GMRS. You need to explain to the FCC the types of communications that GMRS is used for , and can not carry out with cellular or any cellular-like system. (For example communications between 3 or more units at a time or in areas where cellular coverage is poor or non existent - like after a disaster. It's a well known fact to everybody but the Washington DC bureaucrats that cell phones DO NOT WORK in a disaster.) More talking / writing points at http://home.provide.net/~prsg/issues10-119.txt Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: More on GMRS - Fwd: FCC NPRM proposes complete part 95 rewrite
Sounds to me that you have the perfect opportunity to make a major point if you reply to that NPRM - chaos will rule without active enforcement (just like on CB and FRS). In the NPRM they want to drop all licensing - even license-by rule. And we have seen just how well license-by-rule works on FRS. One of the major points I am making is that there is no visible enforcement effort on GMRS and there needs to be. At 01:25 PM 07/06/10, you wrote: From real lfe experience, Does it really make a difference what rules are promulgated? GMRS in NY is nothing but a waste of spectrum. Foul mouthed, profane, and down right illegal use is the norm now. Add to that, groups that own their channel with the apparent blessing of the FCC who will not do anything to stop these practices. Make them all bubble pak radios, it will not matter one bit. Lance /N2HBA - Original Message - From: mailto:corwinmo...@att.netcorwinmoore To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, July 04, 2010 7:58 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: More on GMRS - Fwd: FCC NPRM proposes complete part 95 rewrite --- In mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, George Henry ka3...@... wrote: The comment period for the NPRM ends July 7. ... The 30-day period for public cmment on this important FCC proposal will begin on the date of publication in the Federal Register. That has not yet happened. (We expect it any day now.) For more definitive information (including the issues involved, and the confusion surrounding the licensing fees and term), go to: http://www.provide.net/~prsghttp://www.provide.net/~prsg - Corwin Moore (PRSG Administrative Coordinator)
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Death of a Service Monitor
At 05:27 PM 07/02/10, you wrote: i fully agree, a perfect waste of good equipment, that motorola system analyser costed around 50g 10 years ago here in New Zealand And even if it was not working it would have fetched a decent price on ebay. i am really amased at the IQ levels of some people world wide My dad used to joke that the global IQ is constant, but the global population is increasing. Marcus Mike On Fri, Jul 2, 2010 at 9:26 AM, skipp025 mailto:skipp...@yahoo.comskipp...@yahoo.com wrote: Ted Bleiman K9MDM - MDM Radio k9...@... wrote: Idiotic waste of time and band width So I broke down (no pun intended) and had a look. Really sad to see that happen while thinking I know where I could have gotten that Service Monitor Refurbished. s. From: Joe k1ike_m...@... Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Death of a Service Monitor To: mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 30, 2010, 10:36 AM Worth watching if a service monitor ever caused you frustration. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nXbBS3lVXUhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nXbBS3lVXU
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Attn: Mike Morris
Replied by private email with phone numbers. At 02:21 PM 07/02/10, you wrote: Mike - Please contact me off list, LaRueComm at gmail dot com. I have a few things for you and need to discuss them with you as well. Tried regular email, but no response. Thank you! John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 http://tinyurl.com/2dtngmnhttp://tinyurl.com/2dtngmn
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Converting the Kenwood TKR-820 to use with D-STAR
An acquaintance of mine worked at one of the laserdisk manufacturing plants for about a year. He told me that while he was there the yield was never over 19%. That means that at least 80 out of every 100 pressed were tossed into a dumpster. They were hauled away and ground up into plastic chunks, melted down (that was part of the deal) and used to make drinking glasses. At 11:58 AM 06/29/10, you wrote: Easy with the laserdisk now ;) I still have a nice collection here. Kb0wlf -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater- buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of nj902 Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 1:50 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Converting the Kenwood TKR-820 to use with D-STAR --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, David Jordan wa3...@... wrote: ... I think D-STAR will end up like Quadraphonic sound.just a matter of time. .. Agreed. D-Star had the misfortune to roll out just ahead of the economic downturn. D-Star may trudge on much like LaserDisk did - Pioneer was pretty much the only one backing it just as D-Star has one major backer. LaserDisk survived until a better format won acceptance so it will be interesting to see where amateur VHF/UHF digital voice winds up. This quote from the Wikipedia LaserDisk article may fit D-Star in a couple of years: ...the format was poorly received in North America. In Europe and Australia, it remained largely an obscure format. It was, however, much more popular in Japan ... Yahoo! Groups Links No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.439 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2962 - Release Date: 06/29/10 06:35:00 Yahoo! Groups Links
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Converting the Kenwood TKR-820 to use with D-STAR
The biggest problem with multimode systems you describe (including the quantar) is that you have two separate user pools on a single box on a single channel. The DStar users don't have any idea of what is happening on the conventional side and the conventional folks have no idea what is going on the digital side. This is not what you want on an event - be it a city parade or a multi-injury traffic accident or a Katrina. You want to promote communications, not build walls. And a little trick - the URL (link) won't break with word wrap if you put and characters around it (and if it does, your mail reader is broken). Like this http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/photos/album/613821601/pic/list Mike WA6ILQ At 09:54 AM 06/28/10, you wrote: John, I currently am Trustee for a TKR-820 operating on 444.5500. I wonder - is this conversion dual-mode capable, meaning, can it be accessed BOTH via D-STAR and analog radios, or does it render analog access unusable? I do not want to do this if it eliminates analog access, since this is an Emergency Management-affiliated repeater and many users in my area are not D-STAR capable. As such, I'd have to maintain a dual-mode system, similar to those using Motorola QUANTAR repeaters for digital (APCO 25) as well as analog access. Next questions is, my machine is a multi-receive site (read: SpectraTAC) system - is the D-STAR processing done on the FINAL received signal before being passed to the transmitter, or would I need to convert all the receivers in the system to be compatible? In my system, I do not use the internal receiver in the TKR-820 - I feed a voted signal in from the comparator for repeat. Photos of my system (with one receiver configured) can be seen at the Repeater-Builder Yahoo group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/photos/album/613821601/pic/li st Look at those associated with WW9AE If it can be configured for a dual-mode/multi-RX site configuration, I might seriously consider adapting our machine. Thanks! Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of John My conversion project is at: http://k7ve.org/blog/2010/06/converting-the-kenwood-tkr-820-to-use-with-d-st ar/ 73 de K7VE Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Coax shielding
At 08:40 AM 06/28/10, you wrote: Ian Wells kerin...@... wrote: Currently I have no filters between the link transmitter and its antenna. The next question in our Top Twenty Radio Hits - Countdown List is do you have any spare or available cavities to try a few things we might suggest? Selection B Are any extra or available to test with Cavities configured as band-pass, notch or some combination there of? s. Selection C Would you know the next winning 6 numbers for the Wednesday Evening California Supper Lotto? forget Selection C One of my friends supports a number of client sites. Once a week or so he has to call a tech support line to get an answer - anyone from Dell to HP to a software vendor. Once the system is back up he occasionally plays with the people on the telephone tech support lines... some companies script require the tech support person close with the line Is there anything else I can help you with? He always says Yes, in fact, six winning numbers. Most of the time that line gets a good laugh, followed by anything from Sorry, me first, on down. Only once in the last six months has he had a Huh?
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola radios and Zetron 37 controller
At 02:53 AM 06/22/10, you wrote: We have 2 repeaters that are more or less the same. One is on 2 meters and the other is on 440. They both exhibit the same problem, they lockup after a while and then need to be power cycled. They ran for years without issue. We have the Instruction manual for the Zentron controller, but nothing on the radios. The 440 radios are Motorola M44GM29C3AA's back to back. That's the only model number on the radios. Does anyone have any information on them? A Google search shows 2 Chinese sites having them for sale on e-bay, that's it. Seems strange. Any information would be greatly appriciated, Joe Loucka -- AG4QC You missed one letter in the model number. That may be one reason that you are having problems with locating info. And it's not Zentron, it's Zetron. The correct number is either M44GMC29C3AA or M44GMR29C3AA For all the info you want, and more, go to www.repeater-builder.com - just click Motorola, then MaxTrac, Radius and GM300 series Information and Modifications. There are number of articles on the radios, and make sure you read the Introductory Information about the MaxTrac, Radius, GM300, etc radios page. And Zetron has it's own page at repeater-builder.com I'll bet that the lockups are in the Zetrons. I've resolved some by unplugging and plugging in all the socketed chips. Mike WA6ILQ
[Repeater-Builder] Astron RS50 Power Supply (a new thread)
In looking at the scan we have of the RS-50M supply it looks pretty sick. The one we have is dated January 2000. If anyone has a good clean paper original and would scan it for us I'll be happy to make a PDF of it and post it in place of the one we have. If you have a different date we'd like to add that scan to our collection. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Astron RS50 Power Supply
At 08:57 PM 06/20/10, you wrote: Thanks to all who replyed to my question on the Astron. Mike, I did not check the box on the 404 Error, but Chuck sent me a copy of the schematic and when I returned to the site they all opened. Thanks for the heads up on the Astron Page, I am re-reading as I don't think I have the Cap. you mentioned.I also have to check to see if Negative Stud is insulated from the case. I replaced the 1000 Uf Electrolytic and it took off. Any of the suggestions, i.e. Loose Screw on the filter Cap. or a Bad filter Cap after 20 years could have been the problem. Again thank you all for the information. Now to fine tune it before I cover it up again. 73 JIM KA2AJH Wellsville, NY You're welcome. I suggest you go down the mod list on the introductory page. At a minimum I'd: 1) put split (lock) washers on the pass transistors and on the filter caps. 2) Verify that the power cord green wire is grounded to the case. Put a star washer between the lug and the case and tighten it snugly so the edges of the points of the stars bite into the case and into the lug. This is a safety issue and your survivors will thank you. 3) Make sure the power cord and the fuse holder is wired so that the hot (black) wire in the cord goes to the power switch and then to the center pin of the fuse holder. The barrel (the outer sleeve) of the of the fuse holder (nearest the case) goes to the transformer. This is another safety issue. I am not the only person who has been zapped because the AC hot wire had been wired to the sleeve of the fuse holder. The issue is that when you pull a good fuse out of the holder the tip of the fuse will touch the sleeve contact in the holder and if your other hand is on the case of the equipment... ZAP ! 4) Add the compensation cap. Just remove the 723 chip from it's socket and solder it across the back of the board, then reinstall the chip. 5) Float the negative side of the supply off the case. None of these five changes cost significant time or money. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Astron RS50 Power Supply
At 05:40 AM 06/21/10, you wrote: With all the excitement I missed something. Can you explain this for me? 4) Add the compensation cap. Just remove the 723 chip from it's socket and solder it across the back of the board, then reinstall the chip. What is the compensation cap? It's a capacitor that the Astron designer left out as a cost cutting measure. Go to the Astron page at repeater-builder, then to the introductory article. It's all explained there. BTW: I've never been able to find a good clear copy of the astron schematic. They are always fuzzy whae you blow them up where you can print it off. We offer for download what we are given. Some schematics are better than others. A lot of folks don't know that the scanning programs that offer compression on JPGs do it by throwing away detail. ZIPping the file shrinks it for emailing without loss of detail. We'd rather have the large file ZIPped and emailed to us and let us shrink it as we make a PDF out of it. William Brown KG4AQH Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Astron RS50 Power Supply
At 11:22 AM 06/20/10, you wrote: Hi Guys, I am trying to download a schematic on this site for the RS50M Power Supply and keep getting a 404 Error on each attempt on all the supplies. Any ideas? Did you use the email link on the 404 page to tell the guys at repeater-builder? I just checked the RS50 links and they all seem to work... Let me know which link doesn't work and I'll fix it. You might want to read the repair and modification notes on the Introductory Information page. At the least you should add the missing compensation cap and the missing lock washers. Make sure the negative side of the supply is NOT connected to the case. Eric WB6FLY posted a informative note about that a while back. It's reproduced on the Introductory Information page. According to the schematic the main diodes in the RS-50 is the 1N1184A. International Rectifier calls it a 40 amp diode. What brand is in your unit? I rebuilt an RS50 a couple of years ago and used a pair of the 1N2129A (60 amp diode). If I were to do it over again I'd use a 100a diode like the 1N3288 that I use in the RS-70. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Astron RS50 Power Supply
At 06:21 PM 06/20/10, you wrote: Hey you still owe me 3 # bucks for sending you a Uniden key! Hope the whole world knows know! you just blew me off?!!! it was over a year ago at least! sent you several emails. guess if you can't afford a couple bucks then you should not to try to make yourself out to mister want to be!Which for a couple bucks is nothing!!!Guess you can't be trusted! Mr. Mike Morris! Wa6ilg, so impressed, no code! wannabie!!! yes you are!!! You don't even remember that you asked for $2.50, not $3. Here's your original message: Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 18:16:35 -0800 (PST) From: kevin valentino kevinvalent...@sbcglobal.net Subject: Re: Uniden Key (off-list message) To: Mike Morris WA6ILQ wa6...@gmail.com Mike, dont know if you saw the post on the repeater builder site, any way i got a key cut toot sweet just like last time, only this time i asked him how he did it. anyway i will mail you the key tomorrow. if it works you owe me $2.50 kevin 1) I sent you $5 CASH the day after the key arrived, return receipt requested, and I got the receipt back. 2) No code? I doubt it. I've been involved with commercial 2-way since the early 70s. I got my amateur license in 1975, I finally got around to actually getting my commercial in 1984. When did you get yours? If you go to http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/searchLicense.jsp and run just Valentino you get back 41, and the only Kevin is WQKH982. Running the FRN of 0018791582 shows NO other licenses. By the way, Mr. Valentino, I just checked and you are on permanent moderation (and I didn't put you there). Be nice, calm, respectful and take your meds. Your postings might be approved (if someone else doesn't delete you and ban you first). Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] WTB Motorola VHF repeater
At 07:41 PM 06/13/10, you wrote: I am looking for a Motorola repeater maybe a MCS2000 that I can get down into the 147.105/705 range. I have been told there where a lot of these at Dayton this year. Sadly I wasn't there. If you have something, drop me a note. Thanks, N0FJP The MCS-2000 is a mobile radio. The MSF5000 is a repeater, as is the MSR2000 and the MTR2000. The MSR is loosely based on the Mitrek mobile radio and is covered here: http://www.repeater-builder.com/msr2000/msr2000-index.html It is not synthesized. The MTR2000 is synthesized and has a couple of gotchas as far as buying a used or surplus unit. It is covered here: http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/mtr2k/mtr-index.html Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] SM-120 Assy. connection clarification
At 11:29 AM 06/13/10, you wrote: With no power connected, on the Accessory connection in the back of the unit, which is Ground? Sm-120 reference information states that pin 7 is ground. On my unit, on the Accessory connection in the back of the unit, pin 4 is at ground. I have programmed the Accessory for pin 4 to be COR + PL., pin 9 PTT, pin 11 Rx audio , and pin 3 Tx audio. I noticed that the information on the SM-120 web page stated, in the front, the RJ-45 pin 4 is at ground. Could someone explain, or correct the Accessory connection. Thanks,73's, JimKh6jkg. http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/sm50/sm50.html about 2/3 of the way down.; Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: MOVs for power supply primary
At 06:15 AM 06/11/10, you wrote: On 6/10/2010 8:03 PM, Eric Lemmon wrote: A Gas Tube Arrestor is better suited to telephone lines and RF coaxial cables than to 120 VAC AC power lines. If used on AC power lines, when fired, they will produce a bolted short and cause a great deal of current to flow. This is not a good thing! Some computer accessory suppliers vigorously market surge arrestors as a must-have accessory, and the American public is being brainwashed. In fact, most computer circuits do not benefit from surge arrestors, and some power strips that include surge arrestors are banned by many large companies as being prone to catch fire. The gray plastic, half-moon-shaped power strip made by APC is known to be a fire hazard, and my employer (Boeing) banned them after the second fire incident. In each incident, the MOV spontaneously overheated and melted the plastic case, which then caught fire. Fortunately, the damage was limited to the wooden shelf it was sitting on in one case, and some scorched carpet in the other. As a result of these two incidents, the CPSC recommended that any power strip be made of metal rather than plastic, and further, that the plug strip containing a surge suppression device always be placed upon a non-combustible surface. A word to the wise... 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY u.how come the fuse/circuit breaker didn't trip? Sounds like the problem is a defective breaker to me! Nope, the breaker did just as the designer intended. The power strip is designed to carry 7 to 10 amps and the breaker is sized for that. The MOV went into avalanche mode and conducted - pulling several amps. Now do the math, 120v AC times, oh - pick a number - 3 amps, is 360 watts of heat generated by a device the size of a large disk ceramic capacitor. You don't think that 300+ watts of concentrated heat isn't going to do some damage? And hot enough to melt a plastic housing? And maybe char an area of carpet? Or catch the melted plastic on fire? (remember, most inexpensive plastic housings are made from petroleum-based plastics). Remember that 3 amps is a lot less than the trip point of ANY power strip fuse or breaker. And it could be 5, 10 or more if it's a 15 amp breaker. Mike WA6ILQ
[Repeater-Builder] More on GMRS - Fwd: FCC NPRM proposes complete part 95 rewrite
Date: Tue, 08 Jun 2010 20:06:17 - Subject: FCC NPRM proposes complete part 95 rewrite Just released FCC NPRM proposing a complete rewrite of the entire Part 95 Rules: NPRM FCC-10-106A1 The FCC NPRM requests comment and discussion of their proposed changes, which, among other things, propose to end the requirement for licensing in GMRS, LOWER the power allowed (to 2 watts for portables), potentially remove repeaters, firmly prohibit scrambling of any kind, and perhaps, prohibit use of radios dual/type accepted for part 90 and 95! http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-10-106A1.pdf or, in doc form: http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-10-106A1.doc or, simple .txt: http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-10-106A1.txt
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Spectra
At 07:41 AM 06/03/10, you wrote: I'm trying to find out the spec's on a model# TA9FW+079W. Contact me of line at kc...@cox.net John That's the new format model number, and I've never seen a Rosetta Stone for it. I suggest that you ask the person for the ID number from the same model tag. It has some useful info. See this article: http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/motorola-suffixes.html and scroll down a little more than half way - you will see photos of seven different model tags. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Astron RS50 regulator board
At 07:01 AM 06/05/10, you wrote: I have a really old Astron RS50 power supply and have seen where with age certain parts can deteriorate. Since I am currently repairing my repeater I figured it wise to upgrade the power supply and am looking for a new regulator board. Any one have one they might be willing to sell? please e-mail direct to k...@arrl.net 73 John K2QY Go to http://www.repeater-builder.com/astron/astron-index.html and read the Astron Introductory Information article. There is info on a replacement regulator board, plus some learned-from-experience modification suggestions. Mike WA6ILQ
RE: [Repeater-Builder] OT - Triplett 310
Thanks for the lead to those items. I have a email in to sales at Pomona Mike WA6ILQ At 01:22 PM 06/02/10, you wrote: Mike, Pin plugs appear to be .080 in diameter and miniature banana plugs are .090 in diameter at the Pomona Electronics web site http://www.pomonaelectronics.com/index.php?i=prodmaingetDetails=0parent=HWAREhttp://www.pomonaelectronics.com/index.php?i=prodmaingetDetails=0parent=HWARE I could be wrong, but I found this at Pomona web site: http://www.pomonaelectronics.com/pdf/D5936.pdfhttp://www.pomonaelectronics.com/pdf/D5936.pdf and http://www.pomonaelectronics.com/pdf/d3548_1_01.pdfhttp://www.pomonaelectronics.com/pdf/d3548_1_01.pdf Browse around as they may have what you really need. -- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mike Morris Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 12:38 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] OT - Triplett 310 Anybody know what they call the size of plugs that go into a Triplett 310 meter? See the photo at http://www.repeater-builder.com/wa6ilq/triplett-310.jpghttp://www.repeater-builder.com/wa6ilq/triplett-310.jpg The jacks are smaller than a bananna plug and bigger than a pin plug. I'd really like to find a set - this is too nice a meter to leave in a desk drawer only becasue there are no probes. If I can make it usable it will go great in my go-bag. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna separation question
A local tried that years ago. It works, sometimes. You have to be very careful about passive intermod. But nothing helps if you don't do the math... Like 147.03 transmit and 441.075 or 447.100 receive... Mike WA6ILQ At 10:12 AM 06/02/10, you wrote: Thansk for the input. That is almost exactly what I'm going to put on the air as far as cans go. I'll have a Hamtronics exciter and receiver amped up by a 110 Watt Micor base amplifier. Just about the same heights too. Antennas are both staion masters. but I like knowing that what I have been thinking about will actually work. One other question someone may know. Is it possible to run say a VHF and a UHF repeater off a dual band antenna with a diplexer or is there going to be issues. Thanks Wade KC0MLT --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ross Johnson kc7...@... wrote: That's exactly what I'm doing. VHF GE mastrII at 100 watts goes through 2 8 Sinclair pass cavities set at .5db gives 80 watts to the antenna. 4 bay exposed dipole at 75' The receiver and preamp goes through only one 8 Wacom also set at .5db then up to the collinear receive antenna at 100' Very very little desense almost undetectable. Also with the pass cavity on the receiver side preamps seem to be much more usable and effective in the real world. This machine hears very very well! More can be seen from my website. www.kc7rjk.net http://www.kc7rjk.net/ ~Ross -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kc0mlt Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2010 10:28 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Antenna separation question Ok just kicking this idea around the other day and the question came up about antenna separation. I know the basic 2 meter antenna separation is 50ft. (I am thinking 60ft to be safe) But is it possible to get them closer if I place some cavities on either the receive or transmit sides. Sounds dumb from some certian points of view, but I am waiting on the arrival of a decent duplexer (could be some time out though)so in the mean time I would like to get this up and going with a split antenna system for now. I was thinking maybe a 30ft separation... Would this idea work? If so does it need to be modified from what I was thinking? Yahoo! Groups Links
[Repeater-Builder] OT - Triplett 310
Anybody know what they call the size of plugs that go into a Triplett 310 meter? See the photo at http://www.repeater-builder.com/wa6ilq/triplett-310.jpg The jacks are smaller than a bananna plug and bigger than a pin plug. I'd really like to find a set - this is too nice a meter to leave in a desk drawer only becasue there are no probes. If I can make it usable it will go great in my go-bag. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Chassis Question
At 11:01 AM 06/01/10, you wrote: Gentlemen - (And Ladies) I have a Micor Unified Chassis here model TCN1187A. Am I right in confirming that this Chassis is not frequency dependent? There are no channel elements in this unit so I cannot confirm what frequency is would work for. Can anyone shed some detailed light on this unit for me please? Thanks! John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 http://tinyurl.com/2dtngmnhttp://tinyurl.com/2dtngmn Most any frequency dependent part in a Micor (actually most any Moto radio) is marked with a part number in the format of three letters and 4-digits, possibly followed with a revision code... Like TLD8272B1... The secret is the third letter. The text below is cut and pasted from http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/aaa-numbering-scheme.html Mike WA6ILQ A Under 25 MHz B 25-54 MHz (yes, the table in the buyer's guide included 10 meters and 6 meters) C 72-76 MHz (see note 1) D 144-174 MHz (see note 2) E 406-470 MHz (see note 3) F 890-960 MHz N Not frequency dependent (like an audio-squelch board, or a power supply) (see note 4) NOTES: [1]: C was limited to the 72-76 MHz USA assignment (one split) until Motorola started making land mobile equipment for the European 66-88 MHz band (which usually required two splits). Some books say that the so-called mid band is 60-99 MHz. There is no 30-50 MHz low band in Europe, when they refer to low band they are referring to 66-88 MHz. In the USA, 60-66 MHz is television channel 3, 66-72 MHz is TV channel 4, the 72-76 MHz frequencies are used as Operational Fixed / Repeater frequencies (essentially commercial point-to-point links), 76-82 MHz is TV channel 5, 82-88 MHz is TV channel 6, and 88-108 MHz is commercial FM broadcast. One rumor is that as part of the HDTV conversion in the USA the FCC and the military want to eliminate TV channels 4, 5 and 6 then reassign the 66-88 MHz range as a military band that aligns with the rest of the world (i.e. for joint operations and exercises). [2]: D was redefined downwards to 136 MHz at some point. There are high band equipment models specified as 136-174 MHz, and others that are 150-174 MHz. [3]: E was redefined downwards to 390 MHz in the early 70s and then to 360 MHz in the early 80s for certain military, government and spook equipment. It was expanded upwards to 490 MHz and later to 512 MHz as the 470-494 MHz then 494-512 MHz frequencies were allocated. A 1990s salesmans order book has the UHF band listed as going from 400 MHz to 520 MHz. There has also been some interesting equipment found on frequencies as high as 550 MHz. [4]: N is still used as a Not frequency dependent identifier even when there is some difference between wideband and narrowband equipment (like in the audio recovery circuitry in an IF / discriminator board). Most of the time a variation like that is handled in the final letter suffix (i.e. a TLNA1 might be wideband and a TLNA2 might be narrowband), but there are exceptions. The four numbers after the three letters are simply a design sequence number. One or two letters after the numbers are a version, variation or revision identifier (the term used depends on which book you read). Almost all assemblies have one letter after the sequence number (i.e. the first shippable design is dubbed version A), some have two characters, a few have three (i.e. TLNA1A).
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Heavy Duty Antenna question....
We closed my dad's photo studio in 1981, so it would have been before that. I have nothing that old in my personal photo collection - I had to off load a LOT of stuff when I lost my house in the mortgage crash (imagine compressing a 3 bedroom house into a mobile home. Something has to give). I'd ask Scala if they have any engineering drawings on the design you'd be interested in. The design that my friend was interested in was a 4-bay corner reflector. You could look in the ARRL antenna handbook or any of the other antenna engineering books for corner reflectors. All they are is a dipole carefully spaced in a 90 degree reflector. Then extend the design to a reflector 4 (or even 8) dipoles high and put 4 dipoles in the appropriate positions. Mike WA6ILQ At 10:49 AM 06/01/10, you wrote: You still have those photos? I wouldnt mind looking into building my own kc7rjk Ross -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mike Morris Sent: Monday, May 31, 2010 7:43 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Heavy Duty Antenna question At 10:07 AM 05/31/10, you wrote: well, i tried to search, but.. alas, sorting thru 1400+ posts just isn't going to work. i need actual use facts on high altitude (11k feet), severe duty antenna selection... i've always been a stationmaster (fiberglass) antenna guy - and never had a problem... but...i've never put an antenna up at this height. i am going to need something good for 150+ MPH winds, ICE, etc. Open to ideas. One word: Scala. They are in Medford, Oregon. Phone 541-779-6500 Email is communications at kathrein dot com Kathrein-Werke KG of Germany bought them but everyone I know of still calls them Scala. The Cal Tech Seismo Lab has a bunch of radio linked seismographs and one is on Mt Whitney at 14,500 feet. Another is on Mount San Antonio (also known as Mt Baldy) at over 10,000 feet. Those plus a lot more seismographs at lower altitudes all use Scala beams. Now those are beams but I've seen Scala Omni antennas as well. They are TOUGH. In short, Scala make antennas that survive, but they are not cheap. http://www.kathrein-scala.com/http://www.kathrein-scala.com/ main web site http://www.kathrein-scala.com/vhf-high.htmhttp://www.kathrein-scala.com/vhf-high.htm VHF High Band http://www.kathrein-scala.com/uhf-mobile.htmhttp://www.kathrein-scala.com/uhf-mobile.htm UHF Despite the words uhf mobile they make UHF station antennas as well. I'd get their catalog, as well as the ones from Sinclair and Telewave and maybe even Bogner. Just be sitting down when you get to pricing out your new toy. Years ago a friend could not afford the Scala he wanted, so he took lots of photos of one that was already in place at a different site. Those photos were blown up to 8x10s (I had access to an enlarger and a darkroom then) and he took them over to his brother-in-law the welder. A couple of weeks later he had a homebrew copy of a Scala VHF Omni with a reflector (think 8 foot tall corner reflector) A trip to the galvanizers and then to the mountaintop resulted in a very LOUD system Mike WA6ILQ
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Heavy Duty Antenna question....
Same answer Mike At 11:36 AM 06/01/10, you wrote: You still have those photos? I wouldnt mind looking into building my own kc7rjk Ross -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mike Morris Sent: Monday, May 31, 2010 7:43 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Heavy Duty Antenna question At 10:07 AM 05/31/10, you wrote: well, i tried to search, but.. alas, sorting thru 1400+ posts just isn't going to work. i need actual use facts on high altitude (11k feet), severe duty antenna selection... i've always been a stationmaster (fiberglass) antenna guy - and never had a problem... but...i've never put an antenna up at this height. i am going to need something good for 150+ MPH winds, ICE, etc. Open to ideas. One word: Scala. They are in Medford, Oregon. Phone 541-779-6500 Email is communications at kathrein dot com Kathrein-Werke KG of Germany bought them but everyone I know of still calls them Scala. The Cal Tech Seismo Lab has a bunch of radio linked seismographs and one is on Mt Whitney at 14,500 feet. Another is on Mount San Antonio (also known as Mt Baldy) at over 10,000 feet. Those plus a lot more seismographs at lower altitudes all use Scala beams. Now those are beams but I've seen Scala Omni antennas as well. They are TOUGH. In short, Scala make antennas that survive, but they are not cheap. http://www.kathrein-scala.com/http://www.kathrein-scala.com/ main web site http://www.kathrein-scala.com/vhf-high.htmhttp://www.kathrein-scala.com/vhf-high.htm VHF High Band http://www.kathrein-scala.com/uhf-mobile.htmhttp://www.kathrein-scala.com/uhf-mobile.htm UHF Despite the words uhf mobile they make UHF station antennas as well. I'd get their catalog, as well as the ones from Sinclair and Telewave and maybe even Bogner. Just be sitting down when you get to pricing out your new toy. Years ago a friend could not afford the Scala he wanted, so he took lots of photos of one that was already in place at a different site. Those photos were blown up to 8x10s (I had access to an enlarger and a darkroom then) and he took them over to his brother-in-law the welder. A couple of weeks later he had a homebrew copy of a Scala VHF Omni with a reflector (think 8 foot tall corner reflector) A trip to the galvanizers and then to the mountaintop resulted in a very LOUD system Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Heavy Duty Antenna question....
At 10:07 AM 05/31/10, you wrote: well, i tried to search, but.. alas, sorting thru 1400+ posts just isn't going to work. i need actual use facts on high altitude (11k feet), severe duty antenna selection... i've always been a stationmaster (fiberglass) antenna guy - and never had a problem... but...i've never put an antenna up at this height. i am going to need something good for 150+ MPH winds, ICE, etc. Open to ideas. One word: Scala.They are in Medford, Oregon. Phone 541-779-6500 Email is communications at kathrein dot com Kathrein-Werke KG of Germany bought them but everyone I know of still calls them Scala. The Cal Tech Seismo Lab has a bunch of radio linked seismographs and one is on Mt Whitney at 14,500 feet. Another is on Mount San Antonio (also known as Mt Baldy) at over 10,000 feet. Those plus a lot more seismographs at lower altitudes all use Scala beams. Now those are beams but I've seen Scala Omni antennas as well. They are TOUGH. In short, Scala make antennas that survive, but they are not cheap. http://www.kathrein-scala.com/ main web site http://www.kathrein-scala.com/vhf-high.htm VHF High Band http://www.kathrein-scala.com/uhf-mobile.htm UHF Despite the words uhf mobile they make UHF station antennas as well. I'd get their catalog, as well as the ones from Sinclair and Telewave and maybe even Bogner. Just be sitting down when you get to pricing out your new toy. Years ago a friend could not afford the Scala he wanted, so he took lots of photos of one that was already in place at a different site. Those photos were blown up to 8x10s (I had access to an enlarger and a darkroom then) and he took them over to his brother-in-law the welder. A couple of weeks later he had a homebrew copy of a Scala VHF Omni with a reflector (think 8 foot tall corner reflector) A trip to the galvanizers and then to the mountaintop resulted in a very LOUD system Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Retuning a UHF Motorola Micor without a deviation meter or signal generator ?
At 08:31 PM 05/29/10, you wrote: I will apologize in advance, as I am an extreme newby in the world of repeater building / operation. No apology needed. We've all had to start somewhere. We've been donated a UHF Motorola Micor system. The system has documentation that shows that it once ran at 78W out in commercial service. Is that on the Power Set sticker, or do you actually have a station logbook? (very rare). Being an amateur radio operator without a commercial or well-stocked test bench, I do not have ready access to a deviation meter or signal generator. Nobody does when they get started. But both can be faked. Is it possible to retune these things down to the amateur radio 440 band without these two pieces of test equipment? Yes, but it is more difficult without them. Where is the station now (i.e. frequency) ? Where are you going? (i.e. frequency) ? Do you have a coordination there? A peak deviation meter can be faked with a DC coupled oscilloscope and a discriminator based receiver, You offset the transmitter + and - 5khz and adjust the gain so that the display shifts + and - 5 lines on the scope face. Then you run enough audio into the transmitter to saturate the audio stages (i.e. force it into limiting) and set for 4.8 KHz. Set this way nothing is going to go beyond that point. Then you adjust the level from the repeater controller for a 1:1 repeat gain. There's more to it than that but that will get you started. A signal generator can be faked with a programmable scanner (you use the local oscillator / multiplier as an uncalibrated radiating source). There was a comment thread on that topic not long ago, you might want to check the list archives. How likely is it that I will run into significant performance issues without these pieces of equipment? You might want to say where you are. This mailing list has almost 5,000 members worldwide, mostly in the USA, and we might have someone local to you that would be willing to Elmer. And retuning the station only has to be done once. When I was getting started I would take the receiver and transmitter chassis over to a friends 2-way shop, we'd tune them up, and I'd take them back home and do the rest of the work there. Thanks! Brian, WW9A Your license comes back to Columbus, Indiana which is south of Indianapolis. Is that where you are located? Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 duplexers
Chucks right on the money. Do the next guy a favor and remove the useless junk from the tower. See this article: http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/cracking.html Mike WA6ILQ At 05:42 AM 05/28/10, you wrote: I understand the move and money issue. Be aware that any loose hardware and/or damaged antenna can, and often does, generate noise all on it's own when hit with an RF source - your repeater or some other nearby transmitter. Good luck with the move. And you got very lucky if you land a cell tower location for a good price. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: mailto:wa2...@taconic.netStan To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, May 28, 2010 8:36 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 duplexers Hi Chuck, The tower is 150' up and I keep forgetting my binoculars. But I think the elements are simply blown away. The cable appears to be still intact. AND we are expecting to move over to a new Cell Tower location soon and don't want to put a lot of work and money into the current tower. And I shut the 220 repeater down so it will not create any noise. Thanks Stan From: mailto:wb2...@roadrunner.comChuck Kelsey Sent: Friday, May 28, 2010 8:14 AM To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 duplexers I never like the idea of leaving a known bad antenna on a tower. It will eventually become a noise generator. Yes, sometimes you can get away with it, but it's a real gamble. And if there are other services nearby, you could be bothering them and not know it. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: mailto:wa2...@taconic.netStan To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, May 28, 2010 8:04 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 duplexers The bad antenna is the Rx antenna. It won't hear beyond about a mile after a heavy wind storm. So swapping is not an option. Stan -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.819 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2901 - Release Date: 05/28/10 02:25:00
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Maxtrac for cw beacon
At 01:46 PM 05/28/10, you wrote: Is it possible to mod a maxtrac for cw operation for a ham 6 meter repeater. If not maxtrac what about other Motorola or GE Radios. Gordon N4LR I'm not understanding something. The subject line says CW beacon, the body of your message refers to CW operation and a repeater. Last I knew, most repeaters do voice... Can you clarify? Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Radio or Duplex watts
Actually a duplexer does have a wattage - it has a power LIMIT. The small chinese duplexers use a tiny, low voltage capacitor inside each stage and the have a limit of 35-40 watts. I have a small duplexer here that has a limit of 50 watts and a large rack mount unit that has a limit of several hundred watts. Things aren't pretty when a duplexer arcs over internally. You have half a chance of repairing the ones that are bolted together. The ones that are welded together make halfway decent doorstops. Mike At 11:24 PM 05/26/10, you wrote: A Duplexer has no wattage as it is neither a Transmiter nor Reciever i am trying to understand your 35 watts point Marcus On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 6:00 PM, kf7eec mailto:michaelh...@gmail.commichaelh...@gmail.com wrote: If I would to use 2 HT radios that are 4 watts each and a duplexer that is 35 watts to build a portable repeater, would my repeater be 4 watts or 35 watts? Thanks! Michael KF7EEC
Re: [Repeater-Builder] OT Looking for service manual Kenwood TM-733A
At 08:10 AM 05/20/10, you wrote: Looking for service manual for the TM-733A radio in paper(preferred)or electronic format. B51-8264-00 original or B51-8264-10 revised Document is NLA from Kenwood Thanks Milt N3LTQ Google is your friend. I typed in the following and found four sources in 2 minutes. kenwood tm-733 manual I put the best/clearest of the four on the Kenwood page at repeater-builder. It's a 13.8 MB download. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Verizon Tarif
At 11:30 AM 05/18/10, you wrote: Some people have successfully fought their local phone company, using the argument that amateur radio is specifically NOT a business (citing Part 97), and gotten residential or other cheaper rates than the business line rate. OTOH, some phone companies have refused to accomodate hams, stating that the tower location is obviously not a residence. This mighthelp: http://www.repeater-builder.com/pix/Pacific-Bell-autopatch-press-release.JPG but it's about 20 years old. If you have internet at the site, I'd use a Grandsteream Handytone 286 VOIP adapter and a BYO hardware VOIP vendor. The Grandstream is a black box with three connections on it - power in, ethernet and RJ11 and is 4x2.5x1.5 inches. It sells for about $30-35. It uses a +5vDC wall wart for power, has a built in web server for configuration, and gives you an RJ11 to connect to your autopatch. I got mine from http://www.voipsupply.com/grandstream-gs-286 Disclaimer - not connected to them, just a satisfied customer. Depending on your network environment you might want to use the http://www.voipsupply.com/grandstream-gs-486 as it can prioritize the traffic... Or bring the phone in via a duplex link channel. See this: http://www.repeater-builder.com/tech-info/remotepatch.html If you are line of site from the repeater to a residence, just put the patch (a Heathkit HD15 is cheap) on a couple of Hamtronics boards on 420 and 439 MHz at your house, and a matching set at the site. Use a PL tone on the uplink to indicate ring signal, and a PL on the downlnk to control off-hook. Been there, done that, have the Pacific Bell logo baseball cap. Try contacting your nearest ARRL volunteer counsel... he might try writing a carefully drafted letter on your behalf. Letters from lawyers often get better results than letters from Joe Ham... So true. An acquaintance years ago had a travel trailer behind the office building of his dad's company parking lot. The only reason he was able to get a residential line was that he had a bed, stove and TV in the trailer despite that he used the toilet and shower in the office building (those three items were what Pac Bell used as a go / no go test). Ma Bell actually sent out a person to inspect the trailer. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: mrs2000
What's an MRS2000 ? (from the subject line) As to the Code Plug Too New message go here: http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/rss/rss-index.html and read the Background Information I article. At 01:12 PM 05/16/10, you wrote: I'm not sure, i will have to check tomorrow when i get to work. How do you get sofeware updates? --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Chris Carruba chris.carr...@... wrote: It means you need a higher software version RSS What version are you using? Best Regards, Chris Carruba Co-Admin irc.spidernet.org CompuTec Data Systems Custom Written Software, not all software is created equal! Networking, Forensic Data Recovery From: Randy rwrodger...@... To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 7:50:46 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] mrs2000 I'm trying to program a mrs2000 radio through the mic connector with ms dos, this is a trunk mounted radio with remote head, the code plug down loads to the pc but has a message that says the code plug is too new for this application. what does this mean? other employees say that they have programmed these radios in the past with this pc with dos.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] UHF System Budget Example
Tait mobiles have had it for years. Don't know about portables. At 05:15 AM 05/15/10, you wrote:  Is this a feature found on both mobiles and portables? What about Kenwood and Harris (M/A-Com)? Chuck - Original Message - From: mailto:gare...@es.co.nzGareth Bennett To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 11:35 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] UHF System Budget Example  Yep, most manufactures market a voting portable in one shape or another. Motorola Waris series, Some Icom, HYT, Tait and Vertex Standard (I developed the Voting software for the VX-820 series). Hope this helps Gareth Bennett RadioSystems P.O. Box 5202 Dunedin 9024 New Zealand DDI: (03) 489 1101 FAX: (03) 489 1151 MOB: (0224) 588 377 mailto:gare...@radsys.co.nzgare...@radsys.co.nz - Original Message - From: mailto:wb2...@roadrunner.comChuck Kelsey To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, May 15, 2010 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] UHF System Budget Example  Thanks for the info. I wonder if any radios here in the U.S. have that feature available??? Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: mailto:gare...@es.co.nzGareth Bennett To: mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 8:25 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] UHF System Budget Example  Voting and talk around are two completely separate things, Think of voting as scanning that selects the best (usually Strongest) signal and forces the radio over to that channel, in this case the radio will be looking at two frequencies (Repeater Output, AND base/mobile output) and comparing them for best signal. obviously if two users are working closely in a basement for instance, it ensures seamless switching of the users portables, and eliminates untrained users selecting the wrong channel. Talk around or Talk around scanning just stops on the first channel with valid carrier (Or noise). Done right, Voting is seamless and invisible to the user. Gareth Bennett RadioSystems P.O. Box 5202 Dunedin 9024 New Zealand -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.819 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2874 - Release Date: 05/14/10 14:26:00
RE: [Repeater-Builder] UHF System Budget Example
Eric is right on the money here, with a few additions / comments. 1) Your warranty does not include wear and tear or physical damage on the radios, externals speakers or microphones (the last two are for mobiles more than handhelds). I've heard horror stories about customers wanting free replacements for some of the weirdest reasons. 2) Make sure that the end-users understand that the rechargeable batteries have a finite life. People that have rarely used cell phones and charge them every third or fourth or even fifth day have some unreasonable expectations about handhelds. They need to understand that they have a finite life and a finite number of charge/recharge cycles. They also need to understand that they can't just toss them into the desktop chargers and ignore them for nine months, then pull them out and expect then to have full life. An acquaintance is the office manager at a convalescent hospital and they have four Moto XTN handhelds in desktop chargers. One is used by the handyman, a second by the receptionist, the other two have never left the chargers. The receptionist pulls the radio out of the charger, uses it for 10-30 seconds and puts it back in. I wonder just how much life those radios will have when they are really needed. They also need to that they need to budget for new batteries periodically. Depending on the usage profile of the individual radio it could be as soon as 18 months or as long as 3 years. 3) Make sure that you understand the users expectations. You may be talking to the administrator (who has one set of expectations), but the guys that are going to actually use the radios may have totally different expectations. For example, one local organization has a campus site that the maintenance people had expectations that they would be able to use the radios from the basements of one buildings to the basement of any other building. The radios system turned out to be a trunking system and the nearest site was 15 miles away. The expectations of that group of users were not met. A repeater that needs to cover a area with a radius of less than 1500 feet doesn't need much power - but two big questions need to be asked: What is the building construction type and Do any of the buildings have basements? It may need the power to penetrate more than to cover an area. You may chose to lower the antenna so that the taller buildings are in the pattern rather than below it. Locally we have a hospital with the rent-a-cop repeater on the top of the highest building. The radio system works great on the far side of town, but doesn't cover worth a damn on the campus. Several people have tried to years to get the administrator to move the 60 watt repeater from the top of the tower building to the top of the 2 story building at the center of the campus. Years ago I saw an interesting solution to fully penetrating a downtown high-rise office building... Radiax in a stairwell, with a ground plane antenna on the roof to terminate it. The coverage was enough to saturate the building and also extend for several blocks around so that the rent-a-cops could walk to the nearest bar and grill for lunch. So make sure that you understand what is a wish list and what is an ACTUAL requirement. Mike WA6ILQ At 09:24 AM 05/14/10, you wrote: Although the 60 foot building is certainly tempting to use as the repeater location, you should first ensure that there isn't a bunch of HVAC equipment on the roof. The sheet-metal ducting and enclosures of rooftop HVAC installations are often prolific sources of passive intermodulation interference. Since radio equipment cannot be installed in an elevator machine/control room, you should plan on putting the repeater in an area where you have a cable pathway to the antenna that does not use the elevator hoistway. You should be able to purchase a used GR1225 or similar UHF and narrow-band capable repeater for less than $1,000. A new basic UHF antenna, mount, and feedline might run around $600 or so. Simple four-channel UHF portable radios, such as the Motorola CP200, will run you around $300 each, and the programming software and cable will run another $500 or so. If I were to buy this system new, I would look at a Motorola CDR700 desktop repeater, with two CDM750 radios inside, for about $2,800. The HVN9025 programming software and RIBless cable will run another $400 or so. Simple, four-channel radios in the Professional line, such as the HT750 with a NiMH battery, will run around $400 each, and the RIBless programming cable costs about $200. The advantage of using these Motorola radios is that the repeater and the portables use exactly the same programming software. I urge you to NOT mix and match a bunch of used radios of various brands, since they may not have compatible reverse-burst squelch-tail elimination formats. If you buy your portables new, you have all fresh batteries of the same part number, the same chargers, and a warranty.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] How About This One?
At 10:31 AM 05/11/10, you wrote: Not sure what this is either. The part numbers turn up nothing in google. Not sure if its even a Motorola product. Has no Moto stamping. Might be something else that someone may be familiar with. The number on the side thats etched in reads 15B84073D01. Thanks for your help! John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 http://tinyurl.com/2dtngmnhttp://tinyurl.com/2dtngmn How about a photo of the entire unit? All I'm seeing is a 3DB label. The 15 at the front of the part number translates to Housing, Cases and Covers (formed) according the table in the old parts book. See http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/numerical-parts-categories.html Given that the one port in the photo is 3db down from the input I can't see, I'll betcha it's a 2-receiver coupler - used when you have a dual receiver mobile (i.e. dispatch and tactical channels). I've also seen one in a voting receiver site cabinet where one one rooftop antenna fed two independent receivers on separate channels (feeding two wirelines back to the main voter location). But in that situation, personally, I would have used an amplified receiver splitter. And it's not trash - if you can stand the 3db loss it's a handy way to run two receivers on one antenna. Especially in a mobile environment where your performance is liable to be limited by the RF environment. Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: license-free radios
At 04:34 AM 05/01/10, you wrote: While this one is not a huge problem, it happens too. Visitors come to Las Vegas from a lot of foreign countries. People in the UK have whats called PMR radios. It's their FRS service. The radios are all simplex, 8 channels on 6.25Khz splinter channels starting at 446.000 Yep! if you scan those channels here you DO hear activity on them! For the record, most countries in EU have license-free radios in 3 frequency ranges: - LPD (Low Power Device), 10mW, 433.075 - 434.775, 68 channels in 25 kHz raster. Not so polular beacuse 10mW doesn't get far in cities - PMR (Public Mobile Radio), 500 mW, 446.000-446.100, 8 channels in 12.5 kHz raster: 1 446.00625 2 446.01875 3 446.03125 4 446.04375 5 446.05625 6 446.06875 7 446.08125 8 446.09375 These radios generally have PL support. Note that in EU, the 70cm band is 430.440 MHz so it is out of our bands here. These things are VERY popular - recently bought 2 radios for $35 together with charger and NiMh cells! - Digital PMR, 500 mW, 446.100-446.200, This is like the analog PMR but uses digital voice (this is what ICOM developed D-STAR for) Note that the American FRS/GMRS radios are simply illegal here, as these frequencies were used by law enforcement till recently (so not a good choice even to chance it). You indeed might want to take this into account when setting up repeater frequencies. Hope this helps, Geert Jan PE1HZG Sounds like 446.01-446.200 is a good place to put Dstar or P25 repeater outputs, or point-to-point 9600 baud packet links... Just out of curiosity what are the USA FRS and GMRS frequencies used for now? (you said until recently...) Mike WA6ILQ
[Repeater-Builder] New GE files on repeater-builder.com
As I mentioned on Tuesday the 27 on the repeater-builder yahoogroup I received a CD in the mail from Eric WB6FLY with 35 PDF files on it. The most recent batch I uploaded to the web site are 18 LBI files, mostly of MVP and Exec/Exec II hardware. All are full-width scans of excellent quality. Thanks to Eric Lemmon WB6FLY for scanning them. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: New Micor files on repeater-builder.com
At 04:43 AM 04/28/10, you wrote: --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Mike Morris WA6ILQ wa6...@... wrote: I've also been promised a DVD with a complete 1st-to-last issue of 73 magazine, and another of Ham Radio (i.e. hr magazine). No, I'm not going to put them up for download, but there are a few issues from each that are worth posting once repeater-builder gets copyright permission. Mike, Since you brought up posting old publications I was wondering if anyone had any copies of The Cronicals of 76. As I recall they were done by some early repeater builders in the 60's in 6 land. They usually had technical and sometimes funny articles. Wayne, WA5LUY At one point in time I actually had an archive copy of the original manuscript in my hands... I was over at WA6KLAs house and my Motrac was on his bench Neil commented see that box on top of the file cabinet? as he pointed at a box the size of a single ream of copier paper Open it and start reading. An hour later I had read the whole thing, and my Motrac was singing a healthy tune... (I didn't have a spectrum analyzer then, and the radio was throwing a spur on 147.765 when I keyed down on 146.46... all it took was a 5 degree twist on a particular multiplier slug, but a picture tube certainly helps find which one...) Anyway, supposedly the original got mailed off to Mike Vand Den Branden for publication, one archive copy ended up with Neil, another with Ken Sessions. I lost track of Ken after he left 73. Unless it got pitched his copy is still out there somewhere. As I understand it when Neil moved from Los Angeles to Portland his copy was in one of the 8 or so file cabinets he took with him along with his collection of Moto / GE / RCA / Dumont / Fairchild / Comco / etc manuals. If you can find someone with a set of both FM Magazine and FM Bulletin you'd have a compleat a set as anyone is going to have. And if anyone has a set and wouldn't mind scanning them... well... we certainly have the server space. The Chronicles is a piece of FM history that really should not be lost... along with It Happened In Chocaga. I'm still a little pissed at my mom, and she's been gone for over 25 years... I worked one summer at the Xerox RD building in Pasadena and had a 8x10 color photo of the Puffin project team (the first really good color laser printer). I was one of the summer interns. She was housecleaning and pitched a bunch of stuff. That photo was in one of the boxes - along with my Teletype model 14, 15 and 33 repair manuals. Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Lampkin type 107c
I hate it when that happens. I had a typo in the name the file was named /test-equipment/pdfs/lampkin-107bc.pdf It's fixed. Mike At 08:29 AM 04/28/10, you wrote: --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Mike Morris wa6i...@... wrote: Did you look at the Test Equipment page at www.repeater-builder.com ? Mike WA6ILQ - 404 Not Found The requested URL /test-equipment/pdfs/lampkin-107b-c.pdf does not exist. Yahoo! Groups Links
[Repeater-Builder] New Micor files on repeater-builder.com
I received a CD in the mail from Eric WB6FLY with 35 PDF files on it. All will be uploaded to repeater builder over the next several days. At the moment it takes hand editing the web pages to add new content. I've also been promised a DVD with a complete 1st-to-last issue of 73 magazine, and another of Ham Radio (i.e. hr magazine). No, I'm not going to put them up for download, but there are a few issues from each that are worth posting once repeater-builder gets copyright permission. Unfortunately until I find regular work, my computer time does not have a predictable schedule as I take work when I can get it - and I'm on call to two different companies 24*7. Anybody know anyone in the southern california area that needs a really good full time junior engineer / senior tech, LMR tech, network engineer or 3rd teir desktop support geek? Or junior tech writer? Anyway, last night I added the Micor Station Control and Applications manual (the non-RF side of the Micor station), the Micor UHF station manual (the RF side of the UHF Micro station), and the Community Repeater supplement and the Micor PURC Control and Applications manual. In the queue is: ht600-brochure.pdf p200-brochure.pdf radius-mobile-brochure.pdf syntor_x9000e-brochure.pdf lbi-30032j.pdf lbi-30060h.pdf lbi-30147f.pdf lbi-30151e.pdf lbi-30152d.pdf lbi-30163j.pdf lbi-30164d.pdf lbi-30393b.pdf lbi-30394a.pdf lbi-30395d.pdf lbi-30858a.pdf lbi-31118b.pdf lbi-31128b.pdf lbi-32636.pdf lbi-32772a.pdf lbi-32792r.pdf lbi-32793.pdf micor-base-station-accessories-multiple-tone-pl-options-68p81106e30-b.pdf msr2000-vhf-manual-6881061e50-c.pdf which consists of msr2000-vhf-manual-Part 1 - Installation and Description.pdf msr2000-vhf-manual-Part 2 - Station Maintenance.pdf msr2000-vhf-manual-Part 3 - Receiver.pdf msr2000-vhf-manual-Part 4 - Transmitter.pdf msr2000-vhf-manual-Part 5 - Power Supplies.pdf msr2000-vhf-manual-Part 6 - Accessories.pdf syntor-x9000-vhf-manual-68p80102w05-o.pdf syntor-x9000-vhf-uhf-supplement-68p80100w94-o.pdf uhf-msy-community-repeater-manual-68p81056a35-c.pdf Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Lampkin type 107c
At 06:00 PM 04/27/10, you wrote: Anyone have a manual and schematic for a service monitor called a Lampkin type 107c Did you look at the Test Equipment page at www.repeater-builder.com ? Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] MTR2000 CTCSS
At 07:37 AM 04/26/10, you wrote: I am brand new to this group. I am setting up a MTR2000 with an ARCOM RC210 controller. All is going well until I get to the CTCSS encode/decode. How do you set this up? There is a pin on the MTR called Rx Un-squelched. Is that where I should get the CTCSS audio out from the MTR? Then what? Thanks Stan Did you see this? http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/mtr2k/mtr-index.html Especially this - which specifically addresses your question... http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/mtr2k/mtr-interfacing/mtr2000-interfacing.html Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] AC buzz on VHF
At 07:23 AM 04/26/10, you wrote: Hello all, I am in the process of putting up a 2M repeater on what I would consider a pretty vacant site. There is only one other machine (70cm Repeater) currently out there. My concern is with an AC (60Hz) buzz that comes across on the VHF band. It doesn't have a signal to it that will key uip a radio, but when you receive an actuall signal you can here it. We have heard this on both handhelds and mobiles. This site is unique as it is a duel tower with old (unused)Microwave panels and drums on the bridge at the top of the two towers. The microwave equipment is no longer hooked up. We have had the power company totally unhook the power to the site and the buzz was still present. The nearest high voltage lines are about 1.5 to 2 miles away. You can not hear the buzz on any AM reciever. Does anybody have a clue as to what this could be and what we could to do prevent it? We have some thoughts on the grounding of the guy wire being a cause but we are unsure of that. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated! Thanks Wade KC0MLT The way I'm reading this is that you are hearing an AC buzz (60hz) on a FM receiver listening to ANY VHF frequency at a site that has only one UHF repeater, and it's there even when the AC feeder to the site is totally dead, right? Look for a arcing insulator on a power pole. And it might be a rural cross-country high tension tower that is MILES away from any pavement. I had one of those a number of year ago, and it took using an AM receiver on the highest frequency we could monitor (initially the aircraft AM band. We got an initial bearing at the repeater site, and it pointed into a national forest !!! We went to other sites several miles away with the intent of getting cross bearings and couldn't hear it. So we fell back to plan B ... A friend was a pilot bit we could not figure out how to get a directional antenna onto an airplane, and we quickly figured out that the one airplane that had a loop antenna wasn't going to cut it... first, it was a twin and not only was the plane rental out of sight, but out pilot wasn't multi-rated, plus we couldn't afford to feed the twin radial engines. So we fell back to plan C. Look at this photo - it's somethign like what we used... http://www.ultralightnews.ca/sunfun02/images/lilbreeze.jpg We mounted a VHF beam under the fuselage.. The pilot (a ham) started at about 1500 feet over the repeater site and on an idle aircraft channel, then flew a circle to get an initial bearing, then flew towards the noise. By the way, the real initial bearing was about 20 degrees off of what we had from ground level at the repeater site. The noise peaked over a power line over 7 miles from the site the source but could have been any one of two dozen towers. He then switched to a PRO-43 handheld scanner set to AM and pretuned to the top of it's coverage range) and shielded so it was directional. The scanner was in a piece of plastic pipe lined with foil and grounded to the chassis. The tube was duct-taped to the ultralight frame and pointed downwards at about 30 degrees. Crude, but you could point it like a bazooka and get a noise peak. He was able to ID the individual power tower by flying over the power line until the noise peaked, then turning away and coming back at it from right angles to it and flying over each individual tower until he found which tower had that same peak. He bombed the ground near the particular tower with a bag of flour, then flew the access road to where it met the highway and noted where that was (anybody remember Sky King flour bombing from the Songbird? that's where he got the idea). All during this time he was in contact with us, the chase crew. We drove to the maintenance road access gate, drove to the tower, and could HEAR the arcing and zapping above us - no electronics needed ! We copied the tower ID number - and didn't take any chances, we used both pencil and paper and a 35mm camera! (Southern California Edison has a 10-character ID number on each tower) and reported it. SCE had WA6FQG (now SK) as their in-house RFI guy since the 1960s... and for many years he had a tech session at every ARRL Southwestern Division convention... one of us had his business card from one of those sessions. A couple of weeks later we met FQG and his tower crew at the gate and followed them in, and watched while they changed the insulator. Problem solved. As I re-read what I've written above, it sounds like it took one flight - it didn't - it took three Saturdays across eight weeks as we had scheduling problems with the ultralight, the pilot, and we had to figure out the mounting for the 2m beam, and we had to build the bazooka tube for the scanner. And the overall attitude was SAFETY - we were not going to duct-tape a beam to the airplane, and we couldn't (and wouldn't) drill any holes. The keys to finding power line interference: 1) A directional AM
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Attn: Eric Lemmon
At 12:06 PM 04/19/10, you wrote: Hi Eric - I found a note that you replied to through a Google search regarding a GE MASTR II Exec. Someone was curious about a package number, and they needed info on the Comb number which you provided. I have a similar unit and I was wondering if I could have a copy of the COMB number breakdown sheet that you used, if you have one in PDF form? The comb number again is DVR15MS. Hall Electronics (My principle source of GE Nomenclature sheets) did not have one on this product line. Basically put, its a GE MASTR II Exec UHF Mobile with a VHF Second Receiver. Thanks for your help and time! :-) John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 GE calls it a mobile repeater, but it's really a handheld extender. It is designed to couple a handheld radio into an existing mobile radio. A google search on DVR15MS comes back with 3 hits, the first of which is very relevant. Look here http://www.mail-archive.com/repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com/msg44246.html Unfortunately we do not have most of the applicable LBIs in PDF form. If any readers of this list happen to have a clean and complete original hard copy of one or more of those LBIs, please contact repeater-builder. For future reference, Go to www.repeater-builder.com, then click on General Electric / Ericsson. Use the in-page jump to get to Exec II Info. The last line is significant. Or use the in-page jump to get to Technical Info, LBIs Manuals Click on The Mastr list of LBIs Scroll down to the Product Code Index Files Click on PC82. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola R-1013A sinad meter manual posted to the files section
At 03:53 PM 04/14/10, you wrote: I have just posted a copy of this manual to the files section. Given that the file space at this group is limited, I will leave the manual here for a few days and then remove it. There is a request for it on the Repeater Builder web site, but I was unable to get any response from the folks there. Hopefully one of them will grab it. HTH and 73 John KC0G It's been up on the Motorola page since mid-March. I added it to the test equipment page just recently. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 link equipment
At 08:16 AM 04/12/10, you wrote: I'm making plans to link my 2-meter repeater to a 220 mhz hub repeater. What type of transceiver, radios, etc is best for a 220 link ? Thanks ! One big question is what's your duty cycle going to be? Another is what is your potential desense going to be? Back before we lost 220-222 one system in an area that used in-high and out-low on UHF was going to use a couple of low end channels as inbound link frequencies until he did the math... There was no way he could make a 250w system near 441.750 live with a receiver near 220.800. He ended up using 900 Mhz for the links. After we lost 220-221 he was happy he had gone that route. It would be interesting to do a survey of 220-222 and see just how used it is. It might be worth filing the FCC paperwork to get it back. Mike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Radius P50
At 10:46 AM 04/09/10, you wrote: Sorry, bursting your bubble was truly not my intent. I suffer from occasional CRS :-) Seriously though lookin for a handheld with 4 channels to do 2 meters for a friend in a home. If you come across somethin(cheap, cheap, real cheap) let me know. The state is paying for his care. He got hit by a driver w/ no insurance and no assets to attach. He gets around pretty well though, no bedpans or cute nurses have to hold his antenna for him. :-) In my experience, anything cheap, cheap, real cheap ends up being fragile or of limited usability or both. If you can afford $70 then look at ebay item 160385922879 Yes, a 16-channel VHF MT1000 in your hands for $50 plus a battery (or you can re-cell the battery yourself). Or 300415916872 puts one in your hands for $70 including a battery. The MT is much more durable than most of the HTs out there, and no more hassle to program than any other Moto radio. You program the transmit frequency, transmit PL tone/DPL code, receive frequency, receive PL tone/DPL code all as separate fields on each of 16 channels. Maximum versatility. See http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/genesis/genesis-index.html The only mod I do is that I add an AC power on/off switch to the chargers. The stock configuration has no AC power switch and the internal 24v DC supply runs 24/7. Disclaimer: I have no relation to the sellers, or to the particular radios. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Problems reaching the RB website sigh
Do you know which photo in which article? Mike WA6ILQ At 11:53 AM 04/08/10, you wrote: According to the why page: Malicious software is hosted on 1 domain(s), including imgdownloads.com/. Sounds like its angry because of a picture in an article is hosted there. On a related note our 8e6 web filter here at the shop 8e6 also classifies imgdownloads as malicious/virus
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Micor Part TCN1383A
A = under 25mhz... the first I ever saw was a carrier current in-plant paging system at around 60KHz. B=25-50, usually 30-50 but I've seen a few radios in the 26mhz range. C=66-88, originally 72-76Mhz D=132-174, originally 136-172, but some product lines were limited to 150.8-172 or 174 E=395-525, originally 406-420 and 450-470. F=800 and 900MHz I don't know what they are using for 700mhz. Mike WA6ILQ At 09:07 AM 04/08/10, you wrote: Good suggestion, I might try that. I was under the impression that the part number starting with TLF was indicative of an 800MHz part. Now Im gonna need to try to confirm whether its 800 or UHF. :) John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 - Original Message - From: DCFluX dcf...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 9:02 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Micor Part TCN1383A They appear to be tripler / 2W amplifier sections from the Micor station. Possibly UHF. If its like the 2W UHF version you can disconnect and sweep the filter that is attached to the lid with a spectrum analyzer and that will tell you what frequency it is for. On Thu, Apr 8, 2010 at 8:23 AM, La Rue Communications laruec...@gmail.com wrote: Not sure if the pics will show up on the Group List, but here goes. John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 - Original Message - From: wd8chl wd8...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 1:42 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Micor Part TCN1383A On 4/7/2010 4:31 PM, DCFluX wrote: Lets get some pictures Well, TLF would indicate 800 MHz... On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 1:12 PM, La Rue Communications laruec...@gmail.comwrote: Eric, No results as the Parts Department says they're obsolete. Duh tell me something I dont know. I was not able to get any info on the remote chassis, and two triplers that I have. TLF1053A and TLF1332A. Sorry I could not report better news. I will just keep scavaging unless someone else on the RB list has a similar model and can share what they know... Anyone? Bueller? Bueller? John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 - Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Micor Part TCN1383A
I never said Micor, John, you did a nice job of jumping to conclusions. The comment thread diverged to a generic discussion of part number prefixes, and I said A (as in TLA-) was under 25mhz and then I said that the first I ever saw was a carrier current tone-and-voice in-plant paging system at around 60KHz. To be complete, the RF sections inside the HF SSB Micom radios are also A series part numbers. I saw the carrier current system in the late 1960s or early 1970s. It was a B30something built in the early 1950s, housed in a black crackle finish rack cabinet with forced air cooling for the forest of tubes, a bank of over 90 large copper tone reeds, and multiple stepper switches for tone selection and lots of plug-in relays, and some plug-in-timer relays. The final looked like push-pull 6L6s. It was tied to the in-plant phone system (which was rotary, naturally) as an extension, and the operation was simple, and really cute. You'd dial extension 247 and it would ring one full ring, plus a little more (adjusted with the screwdriver adjust on an Agstat pneumatic timer) then answer. You'd dial the pager number using the rotary dial on your in-plant phone, and you'd hear the steppers follow the dialing (i.e. dial the first digit and you'd hear clunk, dial the second digit and hear clunk-ching). Then you'd hear the two audio tones corresponding to that pager number, then you'd hear a 2175 Hz tone (yet another reed) for about a half-second, then a click. At that point you had 9-10 seconds (another adjustable time delay relay) to speak your message, then you'd hang up (or it would hang up on you). These days you could do the whole thing in a box the size of a japanese multiband mobile, including the RF. One Atmel CPU and lots of code... Mike WA6ILQ At 02:03 PM 04/08/10, you wrote: A Micor for carrier current paging at about 60 KHz?? never heard of such a thing. Please tell more??? -- Original Message -- Received: Thu, 08 Apr 2010 12:12:04 PM PDT From: Mike Morris WA6ILQ wa6...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Micor Part TCN1383A A = under 25mhz... the first I ever saw was a carrier current in-plant paging system at around 60KHz. B=25-50, usually 30-50 but I've seen a few radios in the 26mhz range. C=66-88, originally 72-76Mhz D=132-174, originally 136-172, but some product lines were limited to 150.8-172 or 174 E=395-525, originally 406-420 and 450-470. F=800 and 900MHz I don't know what they are using for 700mhz. Mike WA6ILQ At 09:07 AM 04/08/10, you wrote: Good suggestion, I might try that. I was under the impression that the part number starting with TLF was indicative of an 800MHz part. Now Im gonna need to try to confirm whether its 800 or UHF. :) John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 - Original Message - From: DCFluX dcf...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 9:02 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Micor Part TCN1383A They appear to be tripler / 2W amplifier sections from the Micor station. Possibly UHF. If its like the 2W UHF version you can disconnect and sweep the filter that is attached to the lid with a spectrum analyzer and that will tell you what frequency it is for. On Thu, Apr 8, 2010 at 8:23 AM, La Rue Communications laruec...@gmail.com wrote: Not sure if the pics will show up on the Group List, but here goes. John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 - Original Message - From: wd8chl wd8...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 1:42 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Micor Part TCN1383A On 4/7/2010 4:31 PM, DCFluX wrote: Lets get some pictures Well, TLF would indicate 800 MHz... On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 1:12 PM, La Rue Communications laruec...@gmail.comwrote: Eric, No results as the Parts Department says they're obsolete. Duh tell me something I dont know. I was not able to get any info on the remote chassis, and two triplers that I have. TLF1053A and TLF1332A. Sorry I could not report better news. I will just keep scavaging unless someone else on the RB list has a similar model and can share what they know... Anyone? Bueller? Bueller? John Hymes La Rue Communications 10 S. Aurora Street Stockton, CA 95202 - Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: MSR 2000 to 220 conversion?
I saw one several years ago - the guy started with a MSR base station that had been toasted after the antenna was struck by lightning (i.e. toasted the PA deck and the receiver front end transistor). He converted the receiver and exciter to 220, and I don't have the conversion information (if I did there would be a 220 Mitrek / 220 MSR conversion article). The technique is the same as a Mitrek mobile since the MSR receiver and exciter are essentially each a half of a Mitrek main board. The MSR PA deck heat sink was stripped and three 220MHz power bricks bolted to it. The first one took the exciter output and amplified it enough to drive a Wilkinson power divider, which drove two bricks. He used teflon circuit board and etched the divider tuned lines onto it. The two bricks drove a Wilkinson divider in reverse (i.e. a combiner) which drove the RF output jack. There was a shared receive antenna (three separate 220 systems used it) at 100 feet and a dedicated transmit antenna at about 40 feet. There was a single 220 MHz cavity between the exciter and the PA deck, and I don't know if it was to clean up the exciter or for some other reason (perhaps notching out a bit of grunge on the receiver input?). The modified unit was re-labeled as a C73 1/2 GRB - that was an inside joke as Motos model number definition system used a 3 for high band and a 4 for UHF, so a 3 1/2 had to be 220 Mhz. The converted base station played on 220 for years and ran totally solid. It was connected to one port of an RC850 with a 2m and 440 remote base on another port. I lost track of the unit when the owner passed away and a couple of months later it evaporated from the building. So somewhere out there is a 220mhz MSR2000. Mike WA6ILQ At 08:43 PM 04/05/10, you wrote: If it can be done with a VHF MSR I would like to know, since I have two of them sitting around doing nothing. ;) --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, WA2RJP jlang...@... wrote: Has anyone attempted or succeeded in converting a VHF MSR2000 to 220? I'd rather not reinvent the wheel if someone already has done or tried. tnx, Jim
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Fwd: access gate accident
Look in the files section for the folder titled Access Gate Incident. Mike WA6ILQ At 08:08 PM 03/31/10, you wrote: Hate to be a party pooper, but can you post these photos in an appropriate section? They don't come thru in digest mode. --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Mike Morris WA6ILQ wa6...@... wrote: From an acquaintance. Worth reading. The driver of the vehicle in these photos had a real wake-up call. Mike WA6ILQ At 02:02 AM 02/26/10, anonymous wrote: Most of us have to drive through access gates to back country radio sites at some point of our amateur radio repeater careers. A local wildlife refuge has had numerous incidents with gates swinging in the wind and hitting vehicles. This guy caught a gate that was probably hidden by the tree line as he rounded the corner. Share the following pictures as you see fit with your work groups. Look at all four pictures to see how lucky this guy really was. I'll bet that the first thing the gentleman driver checked was to see if Mr. Wiggles and his two neighbors were still there. Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Maxtrac Channel Control
As far as I know the early Maxtrac did not implement Channel Steering (Motos' name for binary channel selection). You needed to use a late Maxtrac (more precisely one with the late logic board), a Radius LRA series or a GM300 to get that feature, and then you had to do some very careful programming of the radio to get 4 bits of channel steering, a RUS pin, and a transmit PL encoder on/off pin. Be careful what you program into your remote base even if you are the only one at a site. I found out the hard way that 147.51 takes out a repeater with a 442.525 input (do the math). If you have a busy site it gets even worse. Radios with plastic cases (i.e. leaky synthesizers) have gotten a few friends in hot water with various site managers. Remember that something that passes spec for type acceptance can still leak enough to be heard in an adjacent rack. Mike WA6ILQ At 11:04 PM 03/25/10, you wrote: Hello everyone, Wondering if anyone has been able to implement a Motorola Maxtrac as a frequency agile remote base on a repeater. What I would like to do is have a 16 channel VHF mobile hooked to our repeater, and be able to select a channel at will. I'm sure it can be done, i'm just overlooking something here. Our controller has a 4 pin hex output that I think could do the necessary stuff to make it work, just not sure about how it needs hooked to the radio. Has anyone done something similiar to this? I was looking at NO6B's RBI, and that would fit the bill, just wondering if I could make it work with our controller (MCC RC-100) or would I have to get a different controller (CAT or LinkCom)? Thanks all! Steve KD8BIW KD8BIW/R 224.580 N8IHI/R 147.105 W3YXS/R 146.745 KD8JBF/R 444.325 Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Squelch crash on a MSR2000
At 06:10 PM 03/23/10, you wrote: At 3/23/2010 03:05, you wrote: Are you aware of the old GE and RCA technique that was given the derogatory name of chicken burst ?? It's how everybody avoided a patent infringement lawsuit from Moto Legal in the 60s and 70s. I never heard a G.E. radio do that (drop tone before dropping TX). You never listened to a Mastr-Pro or a Prog? I have both MVP (Versatone, which respond to G.E. reverse burst) Mastr Pro RXs (don't respond to reverse burst) uplink RXs in my system, so I added a delay to my Mastr II uplink TX in order to get reverse burst followed by about half a second of unmodulated carrier before TX drop. So you _are_ familiar with the Mastr-Pro receiver needing chicken burst... and therefore the Mastr-Pro transmitter had to send it. Bob NO6B
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Squelch crash on a MSR2000
At 01:15 AM 03/23/10, you wrote: Hello again. I have a UHF MSR2000 up and running now. Most of my radios have the reverse burst in them. But just about all ham grade radios do not. Is there a way to get rid of the squelch crash from the repeater when a non commercial grade radio is used? Repeater is stock, and would like to try and keep it that way. Hoping there is maybe a jumper setting or a trick that someone might know. Single PL tone card in the repeater, card number trn073app on back, trn5073 on front. thanks Encoding reverse burst ifs a function of the transmitter, responding to it requires a receiver that has a tone decoder that is designed to respond to it. Many electronic decoders never see the reverse burst and continue to decode the phase-delayed tone until it goes away (when the transmitter PTT drops). An electronic decoder has to be specifically designed to respond to reverse burst (and almost all of the current crop are microprocessor based... detecting and responding to a phase shift is easy to do in software) Are you aware of the old GE and RCA technique that was given the derogatory name of chicken burst ?? It's how everybody avoided a patent infringement lawsuit from Moto Legal in the 60s and 70s. This article may be of interest... A Historical and Technical Overview of Tone Squelch Systems - A primer on tone systems, with a little on digital systems. http://www.repeater-builder.com/tech-info/ctcss/ctcss-overview.html Chicken Burst is when you shut the tone off, then drop the PTT a quarter second or so later. The decode reed coasts to a stop instead of slamming to a stop with reverse burst. It works with any decoder, be it reed or electronic, except the Alinco DR-series design (which takes as much as two seconds to mute the audio after the tone goes away) and the Yaesu VX1 that is broken from the beginning (it functions like a tone burst decoder). Years ago I had a UHF Micor repeater that came out of IMTS service (i.e. it started out life as a carrier squelch station). I had added a stock PL decoder board to it but the transmitter had no factory PL encoder. We wired the exciter to a leftover TS32 that was being used as an encoder only. The PTT line from the controller was cabled to a 200ms time delay that was implemented with a 555 chip. When the controller PTT was activated the timer activated the TS32 and the transmitter PTT line immediately, when it was released the TS32 shut off and it delayed the PTT for about 200ms. This gave dead carrier for 200ms after the tone encoder went away. Everybody was happy. No squelch tails anywhere. Hope the above description helps. Your implementation may vary. You may chose to use a timer in the repeater controller, or you may decide to build a small timer like I did. The Scom 7K has a audio gate circuit that is specifically designed to mute the PL encoder... you could route your encoder audio out of the station, through the 7K and back into the station and to the transmitter and everything else is set up in the controller programming... from looking at the schematics and programming options you'd swear that the designer had chicken burst from the repeater transmitter in mind... I've not looked at the MSR schematics in several months, but you might be able to modify the encoder on the PL card to turn off the tone completely instead of going into reverse burst (on the TRN5075A you'd ground the base of Q8 to shut off the tone), then change the cap that holds the transmitter on to a larger value (probably on the station control card). Mike WA6ILQ PS - have your users pressure the Kenwood, Icom and Yaesu reps at every hamfest ... have each user tell the reps in their own words that the factory should start using the commercial tone encode/decode circuits and firmware code that they are using in their commercial radio product lines and have been for years. It would be nice to get reverse burst, tone, DPL, and split tones/codes in ham rigs.
