RE: The lists are closing
Wendy, All that subscribing to a forum will do for you is that you'll get an email telling you that someone has replied to something on the forum. The email will NOT contain the posting, nor any reference short of the subject line to the previous post. In short, all communication from the U2UG site will be encouraging you to return to the web site to view each individual thread. If, like me, you have no access to the net at work, then, like me, you are stuffed! The forum is of absolutely no use to me. The only way I can partake of anything is if it works the way Clif's list works: I have to receive all information by email I have to be able to interact by email That's it. No other way. Incidently, I actually learn a lot from posts made to other groups, eg UniData (I'm on UniVerse), SB+ (I'm on original SB)... Having to subscribe to individual forums and hop from one to the other is a tad time-consuming. Basically, without the list I'm left high and dry. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wendy Smoak Sent: 29 March 2004 06:23 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: RE: The lists are closing Lee Leitner wrote: The archives for the lists (which go back to the mid-90's) would remain for now at http://www.indexinfocus.com. Is there a general opinion that the email lists should continue? How can we avoid then having two separate, disconnected places for information -- the list and the U2UG forums? For me it has to be email or newsgroup. I will not be as active in a forum that requires using a web browser as I will in an email list or newgroup. However, it looks like you can subscribe to the forums on u2ug.org, which I hope means that forum postings will arrive via email. If that's true, then if you have only email access at work, you should still be able to participate once you join and subscribe. Thanks, Clif, for hosting these lists. Without them, I never would have gotten all of my UniObjects for Java stuff working, nor been able to help so many other people get started. -- Wendy Smoak Application Systems Analyst, Sr. ASU IA Information Resources Management -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Listen, Will the blind, deaf and possibly dumb Johnson Are you hearing nothing? There are those of us who don't live in the land of the mighty dollar. We have to pay for our traffic, we have employment contracts that forbid us from internet access during the day, yet we still need access to U2 info. What do _you_ suggest we do? I've subscribed to your glorious forum, I get wee posties saying there are people talking about juicy thangs, but I cannot get to see these. What do _you_ suggest I do? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2004 09:03 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing 1) We DO want to leave the archives at indexinfocus. 2) We DONT want to replicate the archives onto u2ug 3) We DONT want the lists to continue Go to the web site, and enter each forum you are interested in and click on SUBSCRIBE this will make all responses come to your email box just as they do now. You can register, but if you dont SUBSCRIBE you wont be seeing nothing Will -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
What do we do? It looks like the answer may well be wait and your prayers will be answered :-) I'm getting vibes (so no promises here!) that there may well soon be a forum to email gateway. How usable it will be I don't know, but other people have the same problem on other sites, and it sounds like something is being done ... Just a pain the lists are set to disappear well before this thing is likely to become reality :-( Cheers, Wol -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis Bartlett Sent: 30 March 2004 11:19 To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' Subject: RE: The lists are closing Listen, Will the blind, deaf and possibly dumb Johnson Are you hearing nothing? There are those of us who don't live in the land of the mighty dollar. We have to pay for our traffic, we have employment contracts that forbid us from internet access during the day, yet we still need access to U2 info. What do _you_ suggest we do? I've subscribed to your glorious forum, I get wee posties saying there are people talking about juicy thangs, but I cannot get to see these. What do _you_ suggest I do? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2004 09:03 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing 1) We DO want to leave the archives at indexinfocus. 2) We DONT want to replicate the archives onto u2ug 3) We DONT want the lists to continue Go to the web site, and enter each forum you are interested in and click on SUBSCRIBE this will make all responses come to your email box just as they do now. You can register, but if you dont SUBSCRIBE you wont be seeing nothing Will -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users *** This transmission is intended for the named recipient only. It may contain private and confidential information. If this has come to you in error you must not act on anything disclosed in it, nor must you copy it, modify it, disseminate it in any way, or show it to anyone. Please e-mail the sender to inform us of the transmission error or telephone ECA International immediately and delete the e-mail from your information system. Telephone numbers for ECA International offices are: Sydney +61 (0)2 9911 7799, Hong Kong + 852 2121 2388, London +44 (0)20 7351 5000 and New York +1 212 582 2333. *** -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Is it just me that thinks a yahoo group would be good.. or am I missing something, it seems to provide what everyone is asking for ? doesn't it? Kevin King moderates the sbsolutions group.. see his comments below... snip While Yahoo groups hasn't been the best or most consistent host in the world, there is no plan at the time to move our sbsolutions folks over to u2ug. Not to be a stick in the mud, but things are working really well over there and there's no compelling reason to move at this point in time. Besides, the moderation is simple, every user can elect either a web or email experience, and it's just easy. And the ads haven't gotten too heinous (yet). --Kevin [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PrecisOnline.com /snip -Original Message- From: Anthony Youngman To: U2 Users Discussion List Sent: 30/03/04 05:19 Subject: RE: The lists are closing What do we do? It looks like the answer may well be wait and your prayers will be answered :-) -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
Perhaps if IBM or whomever is sponsoring the U2UG.org site is listening to the feedback of the current members of this list that they will respond in a 'customer-oriented' kinda way. That's why it's called SOFTware. It can change to meet the needs of its customers. I agree with the reduction of efficiency that the new method will cause. Hopefully IBM can cause a change to accomodate the high level of service the oliver list provided. my 1 cent. - Original Message - From: Dennis Bartlett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 5:18 AM Subject: RE: The lists are closing Listen, Will the blind, deaf and possibly dumb Johnson Are you hearing nothing? There are those of us who don't live in the land of the mighty dollar. We have to pay for our traffic, we have employment contracts that forbid us from internet access during the day, yet we still need access to U2 info. What do _you_ suggest we do? I've subscribed to your glorious forum, I get wee posties saying there are people talking about juicy thangs, but I cannot get to see these. What do _you_ suggest I do? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2004 09:03 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing 1) We DO want to leave the archives at indexinfocus. 2) We DONT want to replicate the archives onto u2ug 3) We DONT want the lists to continue Go to the web site, and enter each forum you are interested in and click on SUBSCRIBE this will make all responses come to your email box just as they do now. You can register, but if you dont SUBSCRIBE you wont be seeing nothing Will -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Except that IBM has precious little to do with U2UG. Okay, they want to help us, but there's that little matter of being beholden to your sponsor, which we are not and we most definitely do not want to become. U2UG is OF the users, BY the users, and FOR the users. It has nothing to do with IBM apart from the fact that we see it as our mutual self-interest to work together. Cheers, Wol -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Johnson Sent: 30 March 2004 14:06 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing Perhaps if IBM or whomever is sponsoring the U2UG.org site is listening to the feedback of the current members of this list that they will respond in a 'customer-oriented' kinda way. That's why it's called SOFTware. It can change to meet the needs of its customers. I agree with the reduction of efficiency that the new method will cause. Hopefully IBM can cause a change to accomodate the high level of service the oliver list provided. my 1 cent. *** This transmission is intended for the named recipient only. It may contain private and confidential information. If this has come to you in error you must not act on anything disclosed in it, nor must you copy it, modify it, disseminate it in any way, or show it to anyone. Please e-mail the sender to inform us of the transmission error or telephone ECA International immediately and delete the e-mail from your information system. Telephone numbers for ECA International offices are: Sydney +61 (0)2 9911 7799, Hong Kong + 852 2121 2388, London +44 (0)20 7351 5000 and New York +1 212 582 2333. *** -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
UGH. For the last ()%#*#(^ time IBM is not sponsoring U2UG.org it is an *independent* non-profit user group. So IBM will not be causing a change to accomodate anything. u2ug.org doesn't have *customers*, it has *members*. Go to the site, read, and then comment. So if *you* want to influence change, become a *member* and change it. Donald Verhagen 1690 S Congress Avenue, Suite 210 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Delray Beach, FL 33445 USA Tandem Staffing Solutions, Inc. Voice Phone: 561.454.3592 Senior Programmer Fax Phone: 561.454.3640 --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8:06:11 AM 03/30/2004 Perhaps if IBM or whomever is sponsoring the U2UG.org site is listening to the feedback of the current members of this list that they will respond in a 'customer-oriented' kinda way. That's why it's called SOFTware. It can change to meet the needs of its customers. I agree with the reduction of efficiency that the new method will cause. Hopefully IBM can cause a change to accomodate the high level of service the oliver list provided. my 1 cent. - Original Message - From: Dennis Bartlett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 5:18 AM Subject: RE: The lists are closing Listen, Will the blind, deaf and possibly dumb Johnson Are you hearing nothing? There are those of us who don't live in the land of the mighty dollar. We have to pay for our traffic, we have employment contracts that forbid us from internet access during the day, yet we still need access to U2 info. What do _you_ suggest we do? I've subscribed to your glorious forum, I get wee posties saying there are people talking about juicy thangs, but I cannot get to see these. What do _you_ suggest I do? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2004 09:03 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing 1) We DO want to leave the archives at indexinfocus. 2) We DONT want to replicate the archives onto u2ug 3) We DONT want the lists to continue Go to the web site, and enter each forum you are interested in and click on SUBSCRIBE this will make all responses come to your email box just as they do now. You can register, but if you dont SUBSCRIBE you wont be seeing nothing Will -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
- Original Message - From: Anthony Youngman [EMAIL PROTECTED] [snip] U2UG is OF the users, BY the users, and FOR the users. [snip] Cheers, Wol If this statement is true it sounds like someone wasn't listening or asking the users if they were even interested in this forum idea. It seems to have been done without the input of the very people it is supposed to serve. For the record, I have unlimited internet access both at work and at home but I think the forum idea sucks. I want my list info via email so I can filter it and read it offline at a time that is convenient for me and my employer. I have subscribed to U2UG but I don't expect to spend much time there. Ron White --- [ Eckel certifies this E-mail to be virus free. ] -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
I think the fora were meant to be in addition to the lists. A lot of people apparently DO want the fora. The problem is that a *different* lot of people seem also to want the mailing list. And bear in mind that the lists are actually run by an organisation that is a commercial concern, and neither IBM nor u2ug. Cheers, Wol -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ron White Sent: 30 March 2004 16:14 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing - Original Message - From: Anthony Youngman [EMAIL PROTECTED] [snip] U2UG is OF the users, BY the users, and FOR the users. [snip] Cheers, Wol If this statement is true it sounds like someone wasn't listening or asking the users if they were even interested in this forum idea. It seems to have been done without the input of the very people it is supposed to serve. For the record, I have unlimited internet access both at work and at home but I think the forum idea sucks. I want my list info via email so I can filter it and read it offline at a time that is convenient for me and my employer. I have subscribed to U2UG but I don't expect to spend much time there. Ron White --- [ Eckel certifies this E-mail to be virus free. ] -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users *** This transmission is intended for the named recipient only. It may contain private and confidential information. If this has come to you in error you must not act on anything disclosed in it, nor must you copy it, modify it, disseminate it in any way, or show it to anyone. Please e-mail the sender to inform us of the transmission error or telephone ECA International immediately and delete the e-mail from your information system. Telephone numbers for ECA International offices are: Sydney +61 (0)2 9911 7799, Hong Kong + 852 2121 2388, London +44 (0)20 7351 5000 and New York +1 212 582 2333. *** -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
There seems to be much confusion here. Let me take a shot at straightening it out: 1. The U2 lists have been run by Clif Oliver for a very long time. Clif has no direct ties to IBM or any of the companies who owned the U2 products before hand. 2. Clif has been running the lists on his own time; a very big undertaking. I think we are all very grateful to Clif for doing such an excellent job at this task for so long (I know I certainly am!) 3. Clif's decision to stop running the lists is his own. It was not a decision of U2UG or IBM - it was Clif's decision; a decision that is well within his rights (see #2 above). 4. One reason Clif decided to stop running the lists is that U2UG is moving toward filling the same need. Clif was looking at duplicate work coming along and decided that this was a good time to get out (if I read Clif's intentions correctly). 5. U2UG, which has no DIRECT ties to IBM either, is a nascent users' organization with plans to represent the interests of the U2 community with IBM. We're just now getting off the ground. We have our third or fourth meeting coming up tomorrow night. 6. The U2UG web site has U2 fora as the means of communication, something which people have been asking for for a long time. The decision to start the fora was made when the lists were also available so it was then considered as something in addition to, not instead of, the lists. 7. As Clif is pulling out of running the lists, the fora become the only game in town. But this is not the end of the world. There exists the possibility that mail lists can continue with someone else running them. 8. The MAJOR topic of discussion at tomorrow's U2UG board meeting will be the future of U2 communication technology. Clif is expected to be present at the meeting and will probably be willing to share his accumulated wisdom in this area, provided we don't provoke him too much in our ongoing discussions of the past, present and future of communication in the U2 community. Dana Baron System Manager Smugglers' Notch Resort -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Dennis Bartlett wrote: All that subscribing to a forum will do for you is that you'll get an email telling you that someone has replied to something on the forum. The email will NOT contain the posting, nor any reference short of the subject line to the previous post. In short, all communication from the U2UG site will be encouraging you to return to the web site to view each individual thread. This is not true. I am subscribed to several U2UG forums and I am receiving the entire message bodies via email. There may be a notification option as well, I didn't go looking since that's not what I wanted. What is not _yet_ available is the ability to reply to a posting, or to start a new thread, via email. Kevin is looking into it, and I have no doubt that he'll get it figured out shortly. -- Wendy Smoak Application Systems Analyst, Sr. ASU IA Information Resources Management -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Thanks, Dana. Your explanation makes sense. Seems like the issues here relate to the suddenness of the lists closing. I'll really miss the free-flowing conversations. Then again, Clif more than deserves a vacation, and the tight deadline has focused this discussion wonderfully. And many, many thanks, Clif, for all your hard work in making this list *the* place for U2 info and support for so many years. Regards, Tom -Original Message- From: Dana Baron [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tue 3/30/2004 11:02 AM To: U2 Users Discussion List Cc: Subject: RE: The lists are closing There seems to be much confusion here. Let me take a shot at straightening it out: snip - This e-mail and any attachments may contain CONFIDENTIAL information, including PROTECTED HEALTH INFORMATION. If you are not the intended recipient, any use or disclosure of this information is STRICTLY PROHIBITED; you are requested to delete this e-mail and any attachments, notify the sender immediately, and notify the LabCorp Privacy Officer at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or call (877) 23-HIPAA / (877) 234-4722. -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
LOL - Ron - where were you while they were BEGGING for people to become members and attend conference call meetings to decide how to set up the user's group and forum area? It was MONTHS ago that they asked for input, but probably got just enough to realize they'd have to wing it... And in reality, for a totally NON-funded, volunteer effort, all I can say is **WOW**... GOOD JOB!! I look at it like this: If you had to do it yourself, honestly, could you have done a better, more professional job? And if so, why didn't you volunteer to assist?!? They would have LOVED to have more help I'm sure!! Be glad people who are willing to do labors of love are here, and willing to share... I look forward to the group pushing forward - perhaps the forum software in use will have to ability to support email posts, but then again, that's when the spam messages start hitting! g Clif - thanks for the work over the ages - This email forum has been one of my 'must do' areas - just to stay abreast of where people are taking the software - even places IBM and others probably never imagined - the resources have been incredible... David W. snip If this statement is true it sounds like someone wasn't listening or asking the users if they were even interested in this forum idea. It seems to have been done without the input of the very people it is supposed to serve. For the record, I have unlimited internet access both at work and at home but I think the forum idea sucks. I want my list info via email so I can filter it and read it offline at a time that is convenient for me and my employer. I have subscribed to U2UG but I don't expect to spend much time there. Ron White snip -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Wo... Lighten up, please. We're all trying to figure this out. And its not too late to start helping out. After tomorrow's meeting of the U2UG board (an all-volunteer board, so far; we haven't gotten around to having elections yet), we may be able to put forward some ideas as to where we're going and how YOU can help. snip I look at it like this: If you had to do it yourself, honestly, could you have done a better, more professional job? And if so, why didn't you volunteer to assist?!? They would have LOVED to have more help I'm sure!! Be glad people who are willing to do labors of love are here, and willing to share... Dana Baron System Manager Smugglers' Notch Resort -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
David, Don't put 'volunteer' in the past tense. We will be looking for SIG leaders soon, we will be looking for forum moderators soon, and we will be transitioning to an elected board. There's always work for more hands in an organization of this type. If IBM keeps growing the U2 market (and it seems to be growing as we speak) then there will only be more need in the future, not less. - Charles I Volunteered Barouch David Wolverton wrote: LOL - Ron - where were you while they were BEGGING for people to become members and attend conference call meetings to decide how to set up the user's group and forum area? It was MONTHS ago that they asked for input, but probably got just enough to realize they'd have to wing it... And in reality, for a totally NON-funded, volunteer effort, all I can say is **WOW**... GOOD JOB!! I look at it like this: If you had to do it yourself, honestly, could you have done a better, more professional job? And if so, why didn't you volunteer to assist?!? They would have LOVED to have more help I'm sure!! Be glad people who are willing to do labors of love are here, and willing to share... I look forward to the group pushing forward - perhaps the forum software in use will have to ability to support email posts, but then again, that's when the spam messages start hitting! g Clif - thanks for the work over the ages - This email forum has been one of my 'must do' areas - just to stay abreast of where people are taking the software - even places IBM and others probably never imagined - the resources have been incredible... David W. snip If this statement is true it sounds like someone wasn't listening or asking the users if they were even interested in this forum idea. It seems to have been done without the input of the very people it is supposed to serve. For the record, I have unlimited internet access both at work and at home but I think the forum idea sucks. I want my list info via email so I can filter it and read it offline at a time that is convenient for me and my employer. I have subscribed to U2UG but I don't expect to spend much time there. Ron White snip -- Sincerely, Charles Barouch www.KeyAlly.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Good point!! I currently sit on a Volunteer Board (Treasurer no less) - and as anyone who does this will likely attest - there is nothing like working on a volunteer Board to make you fear for (or despise g) humanity in general! The number of after-the fact non-volunteers pointing out what we *should* have done is always staggering... But I'm sure my turn will come for service to the U2 community... Until then, let me tell you what you *should* have done... g DW snippers Don't put 'volunteer' in the past tense. We will be looking for SIG leaders soon, we will be looking for forum moderators soon, and we will be transitioning to an elected board. There's always work for more hands in an organization of this type. If IBM keeps growing the U2 market (and it seems to be growing as we speak) then there will only be more need in the future, not less. - Charles I Volunteered Barouch snip snip -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
In a message dated 3/30/2004 5:18:37 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Listen, Will the blind, deaf and possibly dumb Johnson Are you hearing nothing? Please don't start insulting me you ignorant fat slob. Will -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
In a message dated 3/30/2004 11:02:13 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 6. The U2UG web site has U2 fora as the means of communication, something which people have been asking for for a long time. The decision to start the fora was made when the lists were also available so it was then considered as something in addition to, not instead of, the lists. It is possible to setup forums in such a way that: 1) You can respond in the forum OR 2) You can respond via email I am subscribed to some genealogy lists that work exactly this way. We get postings via emil (if subscribed) on every post that goes into the forum. You can respond to the email directly OR you can click a link and go back to the forum and respond in the forum. So there Will Johnson -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Now Will... we don't know that he's fat -- Dave Walker ¸..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:- -:¦:-¸.·´ .·´¨¨)) ((¸¸.·´ ..·´ -:¦:- ((¸¸.·´ * Peace -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 2:39 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: The lists are closing In a message dated 3/30/2004 5:18:37 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Listen, Will the blind, deaf and possibly dumb Johnson Are you hearing nothing? Please don't start insulting me you ignorant fat slob. Will -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
Your not just going to lay there and take that are you? Scott Stir the pot Thompson In a message dated 3/30/2004 5:18:37 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Listen, Will the blind, deaf and possibly dumb Johnson Are you hearing nothing? Please don't start insulting me you ignorant fat slob. Will -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
Don't forget the 80/20 rule. 80% of the work gets done by 20% of the people. Eugene - Original Message - From: David Wolverton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 11:33 AM Subject: RE: The lists are closing Good point!! I currently sit on a Volunteer Board (Treasurer no less) - and as anyone who does this will likely attest - there is nothing like working on a volunteer Board to make you fear for (or despise g) humanity in general! The number of after-the fact non-volunteers pointing out what we *should* have done is always staggering... But I'm sure my turn will come for service to the U2 community... Until then, let me tell you what you *should* have done... g DW snippers Don't put 'volunteer' in the past tense. We will be looking for SIG leaders soon, we will be looking for forum moderators soon, and we will be transitioning to an elected board. There's always work for more hands in an organization of this type. If IBM keeps growing the U2 market (and it seems to be growing as we speak) then there will only be more need in the future, not less. - Charles I Volunteered Barouch snip snip -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing - REPRIEVE
Oh, my. When I misread a situation, I do a bang up job of it, don't I? It was never my intent to throw the community into such an uproar. I still intend to quit being the list host and moderator. But it appears that not only is U2UG not sure how/if/when they could take on the load, but I didn't know there would be such resistance. I will keep the lists running as they are through the end of the month of April. I want to give U2UG and any other parties interesting in continuing this more time to figure out if/how/when. That should take some of the pressure off. *HOWEVER*, I am going to stick to the time commitments I have made to myself and my other projects, so I will not be actively moderating the list posts. It is up to all of you to try to regain your decorum. Dana did a great job in this post (what a job as my ghostwriter? :-). So I will embed commentary below. 1. The U2 lists have been run by Clif Oliver for a very long time. Clif has no direct ties to IBM or any of the companies who owned the U2 products before hand. That is correct. IBM is one of my clients. So was Vmark/Ascential/Informix, Prime Computer, ADDS, and other manufacturers. But I am not an employee, receive no funding from IBM for this list, no official sponsorship, etc. Heck, last time I asked, I couldn't even get them to give me an IBM shirt for my collection. Something about consultants and the Legal Department grin. 3. Clif's decision to stop running the lists is his own. It was not a decision of U2UG or IBM - it was Clif's decision; a decision that is well within his rights (see #2 above). Also correct. I'll share some of those reasons later. But U2UG had no part in this decision. I didn't consult them, and I certainly did not ask for their approval. This is my own choice. 4. One reason Clif decided to stop running the lists is that U2UG is moving toward filling the same need. Clif was looking at duplicate work coming along and decided that this was a good time to get out (if I read Clif's intentions correctly). You read my intentions exactly correct. For a variety of reasons, I have been contemplating shutting down for a couple of years. It was just that U2UG was formed, they had official IBM recognition (NOT ownership or control), and when the site went live, there were parallel forums that duplicated everything the list tried to provide. So I thought the time was here that I could bow out of this particular role without feeling like I was abandoning the U2 Community. Just make an announcement and let everyone shift over to a group and method already setting there, idling, waiting for users. I don't need to recap what has happened since I hit the [Send] button on that message. 7. As Clif is pulling out of running the lists, the fora become the only game in town. But this is not the end of the world. There exists the possibility that mail lists can continue with someone else running them. Hopefully by providing the lists through April, I've relieved the pressure on this situation. 8. The MAJOR topic of discussion at tomorrow's U2UG board meeting will be the future of U2 communication technology. Clif is expected to be present at the meeting and will probably be willing to share his accumulated wisdom in this area, provided we don't provoke him too much in our ongoing discussions of the past, present and future of communication in the U2 community. I'll be there. Now let me add some additional points. There has been some misunderstanding about U2UG's role in this, even with the Board. U2UG is not the rightful heir to the lists. *IF* they, or another party, want to take up the hosting of the list it will be with a clear statement and ongoing commitment that the contents of the list are free of any intellectual property restrictions. What gets posted to the list is free (as in freedom) for anyone to use as they see fit. They must also commit to providing this list, or alternative to it, for free (as in beer), that is, no charge. (Yes, I favor the BSD license over the GPL--how did you guess?) In addition, I will give a two week notice on the list if a new someone is going to host it. That will give everyone who does not want to participate a chance to unsubscribe. That way their address will not be in the transfered database. I hope that clears up that discussion, as far as privacy and ip issues are concerned. Some of the reasons I am bowing out of this role: 1. I've been doing it for what 8, 10 years? It has been so long, I forget. I simply want to spend the time working on some other things. I don't have enough time to do both. And I strongly feel that if you are going to host and moderate a list, you must take it seriously, and put your very best work into it. I'd like to spend that time pusuing other interests. 2. E-mail has gotten onerous. Behind the scenes, I spend from 1/2 an hour to a couple of hours per day dealing with bounce messages, misdirected messages, virus issues,
RE: The lists are closing - REPRIEVE
Just let me be the first to say - YEA!!! Thanks for the last minute reprieve, Gover... er, Clif. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 4:43 PM To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: RE: The lists are closing - REPRIEVE snippage I will keep the lists running as they are through the end of the month of April. I want to give U2UG and any other parties interesting in continuing this more time to figure out if/how/when. rest of post sniped -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing - REPRIEVE
Great news! Thanks again Cliff Cheers Trevor Ockenden OSP --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free by AVG 6.0. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.642 / Virus Database: 410 - Release Date: 25/03/2004 -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Dennis Bartlett agrees that: Dennis Bartlett wrote: All that subscribing to a forum And that Dennis Bartlett was obviously smoking out of some BEEG pot resulting in the fact that Dennis Bartlett is truly soree errr.. oops -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing ** adulation to Clif ***
Clif, Like others I've selfishly used your lists for my gain, without thinking of the work involved. Like others,I've learnt so much, and probably given so little. Like others, I've flamed, been flamed, and duly reprimanded in such a loving way :) Like others, I've been awed at a 400 message inbox and loved picking through, grouping and storing Like others, I've been enraged self-righteous when others didn't understand Like others, I've had a life apart from the daily grind called oliver.com, home from home. Like others, I'm really grateful, all these things provided by you alone Like others, all I have are paltry thanks for what must have cost you much Thanks seem insufficient, yet they're all I have. I could not have done what you did, Dennis saddened by this bartlett -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
So there Will Johnson Ha Will! So nice to see you're wearing a new style... Must say it really suits you... -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Cliff, We whose lists are about to die, salute you. It's been a great service - you should be held up as a shining example to moderators everywhere in promoting the best blend of discussion, humour and debate amongst a very informative list. More than that, you have made us all into a (not always united, but what the hell) community. I'll miss picking through the 700+ emails when I get back from holidays, and I'm sure my productivity will increase as a result ! but what I will mostly miss is the feeling of being part of an immediate, entertaining and switch-on online community. Brian -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
British Humour in the morning ain't it great? Don Kibbey Financial Systems Manager Finnegan, Henderson, Farabow, Garrett Dunner LLP [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/29/04 05:36AM Cliff, We whose lists are about to die, salute you. -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
..Yes I'll see you, I'll see you on the other side... - Ozzy Osbourne -Original Message- From: Brian Leach [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 5:36 AM To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' Subject: RE: The lists are closing Cliff, We whose lists are about to die, salute you. It's been a great service - you should be held up as a shining example to moderators everywhere in promoting the best blend of discussion, humour and debate amongst a very informative list. More than that, you have made us all into a (not always united, but what the hell) community. I'll miss picking through the 700+ emails when I get back from holidays, and I'm sure my productivity will increase as a result ! but what I will mostly miss is the feeling of being part of an immediate, entertaining and switch-on online community. Brian -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Ye'll tak the high road and I'll tak the low road ... Cheers, Wol -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Burwell, Edward Sent: 29 March 2004 15:35 To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' Subject: RE: The lists are closing ..Yes I'll see you, I'll see you on the other side... - Ozzy Osbourne -Original Message- From: Brian Leach [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 5:36 AM To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' Subject: RE: The lists are closing Cliff, We whose lists are about to die, salute you. It's been a great service - you should be held up as a shining example to moderators everywhere in promoting the best blend of discussion, humour and debate amongst a very informative list. More than that, you have made us all into a (not always united, but what the hell) community. I'll miss picking through the 700+ emails when I get back from holidays, and I'm sure my productivity will increase as a result ! but what I will mostly miss is the feeling of being part of an immediate, entertaining and switch-on online community. Brian -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users *** This transmission is intended for the named recipient only. It may contain private and confidential information. If this has come to you in error you must not act on anything disclosed in it, nor must you copy it, modify it, disseminate it in any way, or show it to anyone. Please e-mail the sender to inform us of the transmission error or telephone ECA International immediately and delete the e-mail from your information system. Telephone numbers for ECA International offices are: Sydney +61 (0)2 9911 7799, Hong Kong + 852 2121 2388, London +44 (0)20 7351 5000 and New York +1 212 582 2333. *** -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
I have a simple-minded idea that may increase the value of the U2UG website and prevent us from loosing the huge amount of already accumulated knowledge that resides in this list. Would it be possible to transfer the posts to the list to the website? I know that there may be some legal wrangling and space considerations to deal with but I for one would hate to loose the knowledge that has been generated by this list. Dave Graham Storis Management Systems, Inc. (954) 725-3655 Ext. 102 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Burwell, Edward [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:35 AM To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' Subject: RE: The lists are closing ..Yes I'll see you, I'll see you on the other side... - Ozzy Osbourne -Original Message- From: Brian Leach [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 5:36 AM To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' Subject: RE: The lists are closing Cliff, We whose lists are about to die, salute you. It's been a great service - you should be held up as a shining example to moderators everywhere in promoting the best blend of discussion, humour and debate amongst a very informative list. More than that, you have made us all into a (not always united, but what the hell) community. I'll miss picking through the 700+ emails when I get back from holidays, and I'm sure my productivity will increase as a result ! but what I will mostly miss is the feeling of being part of an immediate, entertaining and switch-on online community. Brian -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
I have a simple-minded idea that may increase the value of the U2UG website and prevent us from loosing the huge amount of already accumulated knowledge that resides in this list. Would it be possible to transfer the posts to the list tothe website? I know that there may be some legal wrangling and space considerations to deal with but I for one wouldhate to loose the knowledge that has been generated by this list. Glad you asked that - I was thinking the same thing - or wondering where the archives would be held! -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Or maybe there could be a way for us to download them in a zipped format? Probably too much data though huh? BTW, I too want to pay my respects to Clif for hosting the list. I have learned so much just by reading through other peoples problems/experiences and by the direct responses to my own problems. Thanks to all of you for being such a wonderful resource for me. There have been many times over the past 5 years that I have been here that people have been kind enough to bail me out in my hour of need. Many thanks to you Clif and to all who have helped me out s much! I have a simple-minded idea that may increase the value of the U2UG website and prevent us from loosing the huge amount of already accumulated knowledge that resides in this list. Would it be possible to transfer the posts to the list tothe website? I know that there may be some legal wrangling and space considerations to deal with but I for one wouldhate to loose the knowledge that has been generated by this list. Glad you asked that - I was thinking the same thing - or wondering where the archives would be held! -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
The archives for the lists (which go back to the mid-90's) would remain for now at http://www.indexinfocus.com. But I don't yet see a way to go forward on our site archiving the IBM web content so they'd be static. We do plan real soon now to add other content. Is there a general opinion that the email lists should continue? How can we avoid then having two separate, disconnected places for information -- the list and the U2UG forums? At this point in the lifecycle of the U2 products, the user group is very, very important. We need to make sure there are lots of squeaking wheels in the discussion threads. I ask this because we are looking at the technical issues of rehosting the lists here. But I agree with Clif in his reasons for shutting them down. Lee On Mon, 29 Mar 2004, David Wolverton wrote: I have a simple-minded idea that may increase the value of the U2UG website and prevent us from loosing the huge amount of already accumulated knowledge that resides in this list. Would it be possible to transfer the posts to the list tothe website? I know that there may be some legal wrangling and space considerations to deal with but I for one wouldhate to loose the knowledge that has been generated by this list. Glad you asked that - I was thinking the same thing - or wondering where the archives would be held! -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- Lee J. Leitner, Ph.D. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.leitner.org/~leitnerl The world can only be grasped by action, not by contemplation. The hand is the cutting edge of the mind. -- Jacob Bronowski V.13.0 --- -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
I would argue that the lists should continue. With some employers offering e-mail, but not web-access to their employees, those employees would be able to contribute to an e-mail list, but not a forum. Steve Wagner At 11:02 AM 3/29/04 -0500, you wrote: The archives for the lists (which go back to the mid-90's) would remain for now at http://www.indexinfocus.com. But I don't yet see a way to go forward on our site archiving the IBM web content so they'd be static. We do plan real soon now to add other content. Is there a general opinion that the email lists should continue? How can we avoid then having two separate, disconnected places for information -- the list and the U2UG forums? At this point in the lifecycle of the U2 products, the user group is very, very important. We need to make sure there are lots of squeaking wheels in the discussion threads. I ask this because we are looking at the technical issues of rehosting the lists here. But I agree with Clif in his reasons for shutting them down. Lee snip prior message -- Steven M Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cary, North Carolina, United States of America -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
I just tested the subscribe button on the Universe Forum and I am definitely receiving new posts as email. Unfortunately, to reply to the posting you have to do so on the webpage (there is a link provided in the email) :-( So it's half-way there in terms of the comments/wishes I've seen so far in this discussion. Would be nice if we could reply directly to the forum using a normal email reply. Gary Eppel Cerner Corp. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wendy Smoak Posted At: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:23 AM Posted To: Informix-mv Conversation: The lists are closing Subject: RE: The lists are closing Lee Leitner wrote: The archives for the lists (which go back to the mid-90's) would remain for now at http://www.indexinfocus.com. Is there a general opinion that the email lists should continue? How can we avoid then having two separate, disconnected places for information -- the list and the U2UG forums? For me it has to be email or newsgroup. I will not be as active in a forum that requires using a web browser as I will in an email list or newgroup. However, it looks like you can subscribe to the forums on u2ug.org, which I hope means that forum postings will arrive via email. If that's true, then if you have only email access at work, you should still be able to participate once you join and subscribe. Thanks, Clif, for hosting these lists. Without them, I never would have gotten all of my UniObjects for Java stuff working, nor been able to help so many other people get started. -- Wendy Smoak Application Systems Analyst, Sr. ASU IA Information Resources Management -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This message and any included attachments are from Cerner Corporation and are intended only for the addressee. The information contained in this message is confidential and may constitute inside or non-public information under international, federal, or state securities laws. Unauthorized forwarding, printing, copying, distribution, or use of such information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not the addressee, please promptly delete this message and notify the sender of the delivery error by e-mail or you may call Cerner's corporate offices in Kansas City, Missouri, U.S.A at (+1) (816)221-1024. -- -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Proof of seek and ye shall find. Thanks I have the www.indexinfocus.com archiver hooked up to it so it will archive the technical content. I am sure the site has archiving ability, but if you want the whole she-bang back to the heady-90's we have here. www.indexinfocus.com will include the u2 list content and the technical groups content from u2ug.org Lee On Mon, 29 Mar 2004, Eppel,Gary wrote: I just tested the subscribe button on the Universe Forum and I am definitely receiving new posts as email. Unfortunately, to reply to the posting you have to do so on the webpage (there is a link provided in the email) :-( So it's half-way there in terms of the comments/wishes I've seen so far in this discussion. Would be nice if we could reply directly to the forum using a normal email reply. Gary Eppel Cerner Corp. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wendy Smoak Posted At: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:23 AM Posted To: Informix-mv Conversation: The lists are closing Subject: RE: The lists are closing Lee Leitner wrote: The archives for the lists (which go back to the mid-90's) would remain for now at http://www.indexinfocus.com. Is there a general opinion that the email lists should continue? How can we avoid then having two separate, disconnected places for information -- the list and the U2UG forums? For me it has to be email or newsgroup. I will not be as active in a forum that requires using a web browser as I will in an email list or newgroup. However, it looks like you can subscribe to the forums on u2ug.org, which I hope means that forum postings will arrive via email. If that's true, then if you have only email access at work, you should still be able to participate once you join and subscribe. Thanks, Clif, for hosting these lists. Without them, I never would have gotten all of my UniObjects for Java stuff working, nor been able to help so many other people get started. -- Wendy Smoak Application Systems Analyst, Sr. ASU IA Information Resources Management -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This message and any included attachments are from Cerner Corporation and are intended only for the addressee. The information contained in this message is confidential and may constitute inside or non-public information under international, federal, or state securities laws. Unauthorized forwarding, printing, copying, distribution, or use of such information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not the addressee, please promptly delete this message and notify the sender of the delivery error by e-mail or you may call Cerner's corporate offices in Kansas City, Missouri, U.S.A at (+1) (816)221-1024. -- -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- Lee J. Leitner, Ph.D. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.leitner.org/~leitnerl The world can only be grasped by action, not by contemplation. The hand is the cutting edge of the mind. -- Jacob Bronowski V.13.0 --- -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
1) We DO want to leave the archives at indexinfocus. 2) We DONT want to replicate the archives onto u2ug 3) We DONT want the lists to continue Go to the web site, and enter each forum you are interested in and click on SUBSCRIBE this will make all responses come to your email box just as they do now. You can register, but if you dont SUBSCRIBE you wont be seeing nothing Will In a message dated 3/29/2004 11:02:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The archives for the lists (which go back to the mid-90's) would remain for now at http://www.indexinfocus.com. But I don't yet see a way to go forward on our site archiving the IBM web content so they'd be static. We do plan real soon now to add other content. Is there a general opinion that the email lists should continue? How can we avoid then having two separate, disconnected places for information -- the list and the U2UG forums? -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Not to be obnoxious but why not keep data in one place? How would it benefit someone to start a question in one medium and then be referred to another? That sound counter-intuitive to me. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 2:03 PM To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing 1) We DO want to leave the archives at indexinfocus. 2) We DONT want to replicate the archives onto u2ug 3) We DONT want the lists to continue Go to the web site, and enter each forum you are interested in and click on SUBSCRIBE this will make all responses come to your email box just as they do now. You can register, but if you dont SUBSCRIBE you wont be seeing nothing Will In a message dated 3/29/2004 11:02:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The archives for the lists (which go back to the mid-90's) would remain for now at http://www.indexinfocus.com. But I don't yet see a way to go forward on our site archiving the IBM web content so they'd be static. We do plan real soon now to add other content. Is there a general opinion that the email lists should continue? How can we avoid then having two separate, disconnected places for information -- the list and the U2UG forums? -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Unclassified RE: The lists are closing
Like Wol and a couple of others, my participation as a listener and occasional poster will stop if the medium changes from email to web or news-group. My employer does not permit desktop internet access - we do have a large and rich intranet - for reasons of security, of cost (we pay for TRAFFIC here!), and perhaps also of wanting employees to do the work they're paid for rather than surfing all day. So yes, I'm very sad at the prospect of the lists going away and being replaced by an inaccessible alternative. My general opinion is definitely that the lists should continue. I'm fairly indifferent as to who hosts them, though I must say that the U2UG.ORG web site looks very nice, I had a quick glance from home last night. If U2UG wants to host the lists, I'll gladly subscribe, or if acm.org wants to do it, I'm up for that. If it's a web- or newsgroup-based service, then I'll look by only very occasionally, or when I'm in need of help. My $NZ0.02 Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lee Leitner Sent: Tuesday, 30 March 2004 04:03 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: RE: The lists are closing [snip] Is there a general opinion that the email lists should continue? [snip] Lee The information contained in this Internet Email message is intended for the addressee only and may contain privileged information, but not necessarily the official views or opinions of the New Zealand Defence Force. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute this message or the information in it. If you have received this message in error, please Email or telephone the sender immediately. -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Simple! He's saying Don't mix web and email. And I couldn't agree more. If I get a forum post sent to me by email, I don't want the grief and hassle of firing up a browser, and a web connection, and and and ... Oh - and I've just recently upgraded my email client at home. The assumption when the previous version was written was that mail got read OFF line. So web links in email didn't work because it assumed there wouldn't be a web accessible to get at. I suspect there are still a lot of clients like that around ... And how many people know to click on subscribe? I didn't ... Cheers, Wol -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2004 20:54 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing Could you explain what you are referring to more clearly? In a message dated 3/29/2004 2:09:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Not to be obnoxious but why not keep data in one place? How would it benefit someone to start a question in one medium and then be referred to another? That sound counter-intuitive to me. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 2:03 PM To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: Re: The lists are closing 1) We DO want to leave the archives at indexinfocus. 2) We DONT want to replicate the archives onto u2ug 3) We DONT want the lists to continue Go to the web site, and enter each forum you are interested in and click on SUBSCRIBE this will make all responses come to your email box just as they do now. You can register, but if you dont SUBSCRIBE you wont be seeing nothing Will -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users *** This transmission is intended for the named recipient only. It may contain private and confidential information. If this has come to you in error you must not act on anything disclosed in it, nor must you copy it, modify it, disseminate it in any way, or show it to anyone. Please e-mail the sender to inform us of the transmission error or telephone ECA International immediately and delete the e-mail from your information system. Telephone numbers for ECA International offices are: Sydney +61 (0)2 9911 7799, Hong Kong + 852 2121 2388, London +44 (0)20 7351 5000 and New York +1 212 582 2333. *** -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Dear Friends: After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the info-prime, info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc lists, I have decided to shut down the list server. Congratulations Clif for a fantastic job well done! I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the the www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. This is *exactly* what many of you on this list have wanted over the years. If Not Now, When? 6141 visitors to date in March ... looks like it's Now. Cheers and see you there, Stuart ** This email message and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of addressed recipient(s). If you have received this email in error please notify the Spotless IS Support Centre (61 3 9269 7555) immediately who will advise further action. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been scanned for the presence of computer viruses. ** -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
David, As the list is closing this is probably not off topic - so I will comment. I believe PICK has been around since the mid to late 1960's, whereas Oracle and the SQL relation model has been around only since the mid to late 1970's early 1980's if you are talking about Oracle etc. I may be wrong. Phil Walker +64 21 336294 [EMAIL PROTECTED] infocusp limited \\ PO Box 77032, Auckland New Zealand \ www.infocusp.co.nz DISCLAIMER: This electronic message together with any attachments is confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, do not copy, disclose or use the contents in any way. Please also advise us by return e-mail that you have received the message and then please destroy. infocusp limited is not responsible for any changes made to this message and / or any attachments after sending by infocusp limited. We use virus scanning software but exclude all liability for viruses or anything similar in this email or any attachment -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Logan, David (SST - Adelaide) Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 12:36 PM To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: RE: The lists are closing Best of luck Jeff, however I will point out the obvious, what is your definition of modern? I would have thought the good old relational databases have been around since before pick anyway? 8-) Regards David Logan Database Administrator HP Managed Services 139 Frome Street, Adelaide 5000 Australia +61 8 8408 4273 +61 417 268 665 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Ritchie Sent: Monday, 29 March 2004 8:03 AM To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: RE: The lists are closing Thanks for the memories Cliff :) Sorry to hear the lists are closing, but what the heck time and tide, work committments etc. As some one who is shortly to be ex mv, and moving into the more modern technologies l will decline the offer to join, but wish the site all the best. Cheers, Jeff -Original Message- From: Moderator [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, 27 March 2004 7:14 PM To: U2 Users Discussion List; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: The lists are closing Dear Friends: After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the info-prime, info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc lists, I have decided to shut down the list server. u2-users and u2-community will cease to exist as of 1 April 2004. IBM is officially supporting the efforts of the new U2UG.org group. (Yes. I am a member of the establishing Board of that group. So this is not a coup or Sour Grapes!) If you check out the forums that have been set up, I think you will will see that they cover everything anyone has asked for over the years in this group. I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the the www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. This is *exactly* what many of you on this list have wanted over the years. If Not Now, When? Almost ten years on my Watch. How many years before that on Mike O'Rear's Watch? In the Net World, this has been a Hell of a good run. (I just couldn't resist tripping the Net Nanny filters one last time very evil grin) I'll see all of you on the other media, ok? -- Regards, Clif ~~~ W. Clifton Oliver, CCP CLIFTON OLIVER ASSOCIATES Tel: +1 619 460 5678Web: www.oliver.com ~~~ -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
Thanks Clif for providing the forum for the years. My only concern is that while it has been great for UV/UD questions, I have also received good advice about D3 and even hooked up with someone regarding an old copy of AP-Pro. Thus, would/could there be an 'all other MV' forum such that I could have my cake and eat it too. Not for nothing, but I did enjoy the diversity of the topics, UV/UD and others in my single email inbox. Even though I wasn't looking for any specific topic, just scanning the various topics and responses was useful. thanks. Mark Johnson - Original Message - From: Moderator [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U2 Users Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2004 3:14 AM Subject: The lists are closing Dear Friends: After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the info-prime, info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc lists, I have decided to shut down the list server. u2-users and u2-community will cease to exist as of 1 April 2004. IBM is officially supporting the efforts of the new U2UG.org group. (Yes. I am a member of the establishing Board of that group. So this is not a coup or Sour Grapes!) If you check out the forums that have been set up, I think you will will see that they cover everything anyone has asked for over the years in this group. I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the the www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. This is *exactly* what many of you on this list have wanted over the years. If Not Now, When? Almost ten years on my Watch. How many years before that on Mike O'Rear's Watch? In the Net World, this has been a Hell of a good run. (I just couldn't resist tripping the Net Nanny filters one last time very evil grin) I'll see all of you on the other media, ok? -- Regards, Clif ~~~ W. Clifton Oliver, CCP CLIFTON OLIVER ASSOCIATES Tel: +1 619 460 5678Web: www.oliver.com ~~~ -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Ah -- it's good to see that the noble art of April Foolery is not dead! I'm not sure whether this was really from Clif, though, or someone spoofing him. Matti -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Moderator Sent: 27 March 2004 08:14 To: U2 Users Discussion List; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: The lists are closing Dear Friends: After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the info-prime, info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc lists, I have decided to shut down the list server. u2-users and u2-community will cease to exist as of 1 April 2004. -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 chuckle Oops. Maybe I should have chosen a different date. Yes Matti. It is really me. (Message digitally signed, if you want to check.) And no. It is not an April Fool joke. Check out u2ug.org. Kevin has done a great job on the website. Not only are there forums and (soon) newsletter and such, but topics are split into UniVerse, UniData, etc--one of the most common requests of the list over the years. The group has official IBM recognition and is setting up processes for feedback to them of your issues and concerns. I'll let the other members of the establishing board chime in with details of the various efforts. - -- Regards, Clif ~~~ W. Clifton Oliver, CCP CLIFTON OLIVER ASSOCIATES Tel: +1 619 460 5678Web: www.oliver.com ~~~ Matti Lamprhey wrote: | Ah -- it's good to see that the noble art of April Foolery is not dead! | | I'm not sure whether this was really from Clif, though, or someone spoofing | him. | | Matti -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFAZcmYks2nR5uSeicRAvz5AJ0WK3nrPSJLeBnxunqhICTu+Lj9gwCfVvpW UiEXJ1RoYF0HgRnDr2wJnvk= =l3DK -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
Clif, Your work here, even if it is carried over perfectly there, will be missed. We have all benefited from your light hand on the tiller. These sort of lists often die of neglect or of tyranny. You steered us clear of both and instead created a vibrant and live place where people could exchange ideas, opinions, and solutions. You have be invaluable to our community. - Charles Barouch Moderator wrote: Dear Friends: After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the info-prime, info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc lists, I have decided to shut down the list server. u2-users and u2-community will cease to exist as of 1 April 2004. IBM is officially supporting the efforts of the new U2UG.org group. (Yes. I am a member of the establishing Board of that group. So this is not a coup or Sour Grapes!) If you check out the forums that have been set up, I think you will will see that they cover everything anyone has asked for over the years in this group. I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the the www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. This is *exactly* what many of you on this list have wanted over the years. If Not Now, When? Almost ten years on my Watch. How many years before that on Mike O'Rear's Watch? In the Net World, this has been a Hell of a good run. (I just couldn't resist tripping the Net Nanny filters one last time very evil grin) I'll see all of you on the other media, ok? -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Clif, Ditto my comments on the DataStage list. It will be interesting to see if your efforts can be emulated on these other vehicles. Phil Phil Walker +64 21 336294 [EMAIL PROTECTED] infocusp limited \\ PO Box 77032, Auckland New Zealand \ www.infocusp.co.nz DISCLAIMER: This electronic message together with any attachments is confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, do not copy, disclose or use the contents in any way. Please also advise us by return e-mail that you have received the message and then please destroy. infocusp limited is not responsible for any changes made to this message and / or any attachments after sending by infocusp limited. We use virus scanning software but exclude all liability for viruses or anything similar in this email or any attachment -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Moderator Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2004 8:14 PM To: U2 Users Discussion List; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: The lists are closing Dear Friends: After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the info-prime, info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc lists, I have decided to shut down the list server. u2-users and u2-community will cease to exist as of 1 April 2004. IBM is officially supporting the efforts of the new U2UG.org group. (Yes. I am a member of the establishing Board of that group. So this is not a coup or Sour Grapes!) If you check out the forums that have been set up, I think you will will see that they cover everything anyone has asked for over the years in this group. I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the the www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. This is *exactly* what many of you on this list have wanted over the years. If Not Now, When? Almost ten years on my Watch. How many years before that on Mike O'Rear's Watch? In the Net World, this has been a Hell of a good run. (I just couldn't resist tripping the Net Nanny filters one last time very evil grin) I'll see all of you on the other media, ok? -- Regards, Clif ~~~ W. Clifton Oliver, CCP CLIFTON OLIVER ASSOCIATES Tel: +1 619 460 5678Web: www.oliver.com ~~~ -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
Thanks - Original Message - From: Results To: U2 Users Discussion List Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2004 11:01 AM Subject: Re: The lists are closing Clif, Your work here, even if it is carried over perfectly there, will be missed. We have all benefited from your light hand on the tiller. These sort of lists often die of neglect or of tyranny. You steered us clear of both and instead created a vibrant and live place where people could exchange ideas, opinions, and solutions. You have be invaluable to our community. - Charles Barouch Moderator wrote: Dear Friends: After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the info-prime, info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc lists, I have decided to shut down the list server. u2-users and u2-community will cease to exist as of 1 April 2004. IBM is officially supporting the efforts of the new U2UG.org group. (Yes. I am a member of the establishing Board of that group. So this is not a coup or Sour Grapes!) If you check out the forums that have been set up, I think you will will see that they cover everything anyone has asked for over the years in this group. I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the the www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. This is *exactly* what many of you on this list have wanted over the years. If Not Now, When? Almost ten years on my Watch. How many years before that on Mike O'Rear's Watch? In the Net World, this has been a Hell of a good run. (I just couldn't resist tripping the Net Nanny filters one last time very evil grin) I'll see all of you on the other media, ok? -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
RE: The lists are closing
Thanks for the community effort Clif! Tony Dear Friends: After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the info-prime, info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc lists, I have decided to shut down the list server. I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the the www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: The lists are closing
Careful, Dan. There is still time to nail your feet to the perch. :-) Dan Fitzgerald wrote: So is it an ex-list, or is it just pinin' for the fjords? }:) _ Free up your inbox with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage. Multiple plans available. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-uspage=hotmail/es2ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/ -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
