On Fri, 9 Dec 2005, Al Petfield wrote:
I think it would be great if there was a meritocracy whereby artists
were paid in proportion to their popularity but I don't suppose record
companies would be too happy to see the link between artist and
audience become so transparent!
The "unit" based mus
nue share info (or 5 'idle'
> >>> PCs
> >>> playing my songs on loop for that matter) and earning themselves
> >>> lots of
> >>> money?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> Fr
:55 PM
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: [backstage] iMP and alternative models to DRM
Hi backstage people,
I'm a bit of a lurker on the list and have been catching up!
Especially on
the iMP and how its DRM has apparently been cracked.
Someone mentioned alternatives to DRM and I just tho
e info (or 5
'idle' PCs
playing my songs on loop for that matter) and earning themselves
lots of
money?
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Kerswill
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 11:55 PM
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.
lots of
money?
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Kerswill
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 11:55 PM
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: [backstage] iMP and alternative models to DRM
Hi backstage people,
I'm a bit of a lurker
PCs
playing my songs on loop for that matter) and earning themselves lots of
money?
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Kerswill
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 11:55 PM
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: [backstage] iMP and altern
m Kerswill
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 11:55 PM
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: [backstage] iMP and alternative models to DRM
Hi backstage people,
I'm a bit of a lurker on the list and have been catching up! Especially on
the iMP and how its DRM has apparently been cracked.
Someone me
lto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Kerswill
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 11:55 PM
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: [backstage] iMP and alternative models to DRM
Hi backstage people,
I'm a bit of a lurker on the list and have been catching up! Especially on
the iMP and how its DRM
Hi backstage people,
I'm a bit of a lurker on the list and have been catching up! Especially
on the iMP and how its DRM has apparently been cracked.
Someone mentioned alternatives to DRM and I just thought I'd throw
something I've been thinking about into the melting pot. I was thinking
of i
>BBC Worldwide Limited is company, wholly owned by the BBC, that sells
>BBC merchandise (e.g. video and audio recordings of BBC programmes,
>books, magazines, toys and games).
They're primarily there to hold the rights to BBC productions for
commercial exploitation - ie, for rebroadcast interna
Good that kneejerk reaction resulted in dialogue & useful information.
The BBC is in a major struggle for funding, markets, viewers,
listeners, browsers, players & global societal role . next year
sees massive changes in department structures, employment &
directions.
Consider the alternative
At 19:40 + 24/11/05, Kirk Northrop wrote:
Andy Hawkins wrote:
Umm...the BBC aren't allowed to take money from advertising are they?
No... but BBC Worldwide are...
BBC Worldwide Limited is company, wholly owned by the BBC, that sells
BBC merchandise (e.g. video and audio recordings of B
Hi,
On 11/24/05, Kirk Northrop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Andy Hawkins wrote:
> > Umm...the BBC aren't allowed to take money from advertising are they?
>
> No... but BBC Worldwide are...
Ah. Ok.
Andy
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Very slightly OT - I am not an iMP trial user - but am
keen to try on my O2 XDA Exec. Does anyone know if I
have completely missed the boat in terms of getting
onto the trial?
TIA
Neil
--- "J.P.Knight" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Nov 2005, Luke Dicken wrote:
> >> Umm...the BBC aren'
Andy Hawkins wrote:
Umm...the BBC aren't allowed to take money from advertising are they?
No... but BBC Worldwide are...
--
From the North, this is Kirk
www.noisetosignal.org
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On Thu, 24 Nov 2005, Luke Dicken wrote:
Umm...the BBC aren't allowed to take money from advertising are they?
Andy
That's what I'd have thought.
And it jolly nice to have one major media outlet on the web that *isn't*
stuffing your browser full of banner ads, targetted popups, etc, etc.
Lon
> On 11/24/05, Nico Morrison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Time for my 2 p - been monitoring this list since it started - has
> > noone suggested that the Beeb use their extraordinary visibility &
> > 'customer base' to emulate Google on a paid ad basis?
>
> Umm...the BBC aren't allowed to take
Hi,
On 11/24/05, Nico Morrison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Time for my 2 p - been monitoring this list since it started - has
> noone suggested that the Beeb use their extraordinary visibility &
> 'customer base' to emulate Google on a paid ad basis?
Umm...the BBC aren't allowed to take money fr
Time for my 2 p - been monitoring this list since it started - has
noone suggested that the Beeb use their extraordinary visibility &
'customer base' to emulate Google on a paid ad basis?
Example might be a Beeb player or toolbar or both that returned
viewing, lisening, browsing information to a c
On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 14:06:34 +
Richard Lockwood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 1. Don't even *think* about telling me what I should and shouldn't support
this is not about you its about what is a good codec to use for the BBC's IMP
system , a system that is supposed to be platform agnostic . A
On 11/22/05, Amias Channer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 08:22:53 +
> Richard Lockwood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > On 11/13/05, Adam Leach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > This is a bigger problem as iMP is using standard Microsoft WMA DRM
> > > files. As this is widely
On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 08:22:53 +
Richard Lockwood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 11/13/05, Adam Leach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > This is a bigger problem as iMP is using standard Microsoft WMA DRM
> > files. As this is widely used, there are more people interested in
> > bypassing the DRM
On 11/13/05, Adam Leach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This is a bigger problem as iMP is using standard Microsoft WMA DRM
> files. As this is widely used, there are more people interested in
> bypassing the DRM system, and so eventually it will always be bypassed,
Fair enough
> plus its created b
lem is they will be free to UK tv licence payers, there will be
> > insentive for people outside the UK to try and bypass it
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Adam Leach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To:
>
licence payers, there will be
insentive for people outside the UK to try and bypass itDave- Original Message -From: "Adam Leach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk>Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 2:49 PMSubject: Re: [backstage] iMP issue> This is a
Problem is they will be free to UK tv licence payers, there will be
insentive for people outside the UK to try and bypass it
Dave
- Original Message -
From: "Adam Leach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 2:49 PM
Subject: Re: [backstage] iMP iss
This is a bigger problem as iMP is using standard Microsoft WMA DRM
files. As this is widely used, there are more people interested in
bypassing the DRM system, and so eventually it will always be bypassed,
plus its created by Microsoft.
Other codecs are less widely used and known about, so i
Shame; even thought I hate DRM, I know that PHBs love it, and if they cant work it, it means the Beeb might scram iMP :(On 13/11/05, Dave Whitehead <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Seems BBC may have a problem with the iMP trial,
apparently it's possible to get round the DRM thus taking away the
Seems BBC may have a problem with the iMP trial,
apparently it's possible to get round the DRM thus taking away the watch within
7days restriction
source - http://groups.google.co.uk/group/uk.tech.digital-tv
At 16:35 + 9/11/05, Ben Metcalfe wrote:
Just to say that a lot of BBC radio content (and soon TV) can be
downloaded via iTunes or direct from the BBC website. You can also
get all BBC radio streamed via the website
Let us assume we are taking about the national radio (e.g. Radio 4
> Where do you find downloads on the BBC site? I know the
> Radio Player, for on-demand streaming, but where do you
> download? Is that different from the podcasting trial, which
> applies only to a few programs?
>
The radio downloads are not different from the podcasting trial, they're
a p
another format so I can listen on my
minidisc player (I hate sony software).
Dave
- Original Message -
From: "Millie Niss" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 7:57 PM
Subject: Re: [backstage] iMP
Where do you find downloads on the BBC site?
essage -
From: "Ben Metcalfe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 11:35 AM
Subject: RE: [backstage] iMP
> Just to say that a lot of BBC radio content (and soon TV) can be
downloaded via iTunes or direct from the BBC website. You
At 14:04 + 9/11/05, Andrew Bowden wrote:
Betsie is a bull in a sledgehammer/nut approach to accessibility from a
time when that was the only way to crack the nut. Now, someone has
invented the nutcracker.
Of course not everyone yet has a nutcracker so we still need the
sledgehammer, but i
llie Niss
> Sent: 08 November 2005 05:08
> To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
> Subject: Re: [backstage] iMP
>
>
> I don't know exactly what iMP is, so I hope I am not totally
> off-base here...
>
> However, I am a (US) American who would defnitely be willing
> t
c, is even easier with CSS. These things can be
automatically built into a page without needing standalone parsers.
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James
> Sent: 09 November 2005 09:20
> To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Betsie was for an age when only one version of a site was usually
produced. The advent of CSS and more importantly I think, XSLT and XML
means it's much easier and cleaner to produce XML datasets of websites
and parse the contents through XSLT to produce differing compliant outputs..
Gordon J
I quite understand that the BBC is funded by UK Licensing fees and that they
cannot afford to offer me all the services for free that license-payers get
for their money.
Indeed, like BBC News Online?
***
The Foreign Office will now "pay" for a new BBC Arabic TV (but at the
cost of 10 langua
Betsie's days are no doubt numbered - modern coding techniques allow
much greater accessibility to be built into webpages, allowing
accessibility without having to resort to parsers like Betsie. You can
do a huge amount with a sensible HTML structure and CSS
layout/presenation techniques.
I
Yay CSS rocks, time for a visit to the CSS Zen garden: http://www.csszengarden.com/
On 08/11/05, Kim Plowright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Because it's written entirely in standards compliant code, with CSS, socan be rendered using a user-applied stylesheet, I think?I've heard - and this is just on
f pages. I think it's getting a bit long in the tooth
and there are load issues, but I could be wrong.
K
-Original Message-
From: Gordon Joly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 08 November 2005 10:08
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Cc: Kim Plowright; Jonathan Chetwynd
Subject: RE:
I wouldnt be suprised to see MP4 as the distribution method with
attached DRM (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=62723).
MP4 will be well supported by Windows, Apple and Linux and in other
devices such as PSP, Mobinote etc it is the default format.
I dont think your ever going
> >http://www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/
> Why is there no "text only" link on this page? There is on most pages
> on bbc.co.uk...
Probably because it has accessibility features built into the page
itself, which allow the presentation in a similar way to what Betsie
provides, and in some aspects, b
On Tue, 8 Nov 2005, James wrote:
Here's a few screenies: http://www.webcoding.co.uk/imp/
Note that you can actually play the DRM'd files in Media Player itself, it
doesnt have to go through the iMP player "design". All the video's can be
fast forwarded etc without issue.
With all this DRMed
http://www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/
Why is there no "text only" link on this page? There is on most pages
on bbc.co.uk...
Feel free to use this!
http://www.recursion.co.uk/cgi-bin/betsie.cgi/www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/
No charge!
Gordo
--
"Think Feynman"/
http://pobox.com/~g
Thanks for the screenshots James.
So unless they just ripped the graphics from WMP (possible but
unlikely) it's using that as an embedded client.
It could be worth trying some of the standard WM player keyboard
shortcuts, eg F9/F10 for volume, ALT+ENTER for full screen, and see
if it interce
at is quite expensive & impractical (especially for non automobile use)
> still but I'd consider subscribing to satellite radio if I could get the
> World Service and Radio 4.
>
> Millie
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "James" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
&
adio if I could get the
World Service and Radio 4.
Millie
- Original Message -
From: "James" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 10:40 AM
Subject: Re: [backstage] iMP
> Releasing iMP to the world would almost end piracy of the BBC's content.
> R
Here's a few screenies: http://www.webcoding.co.uk/imp/
Note that you can actually play the DRM'd files in Media Player itself,
it doesnt have to go through the iMP player "design". All the video's
can be fast forwarded etc without issue.
Jim.
Neil Smith [MVP Digital Media] wrote:
At 12:
At 12:01 07/11/2005, you wrote:
Since it's a testing beta more aimed at testing the technology and
the idea I'm sure the accessibility elements will come in when it's out.
The boards suggest a limited budget to examine this idea and that's
why we havent seen a linux or mac client and I suspect t
Hi
as an ex UK resident now living in Australia, I would be delighted to
get access to BBC TV, as there is nothing other thank shonk available
locally (excepting the odd UK production that gets broadcast here and
the ABC attempts to make programs on a budget of at least $2 per whole
program)
Richard Edwards wrote:
Also, why are Mac users still second for the iMP - I use my Mac for far
more things than the average PC user, and it always works.
It makes sense to target the main user base first, obviously.
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At the same time, if I am sitting in my living room in London with my
laptop, paying a TV license - then I can access it. Yet if I take my
same laptop to my house in Spain then I can't access it. surely
that is where I would want it most. I would pay - no problem.
I'm really happy to see
Personally, I'd rather see the BBC spend money on developing the archive and
player, rather than developing and administering overly complex
authorisation systems. You could spend a practically infinite amount of
money trying to tie it down to UK only, but whatever method you use will see
people fi
om: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James
Sent: 07 November 2005 15:40
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: Re: [backstage] iMP
Releasing iMP to the world would almost end piracy of the BBC's content.
Releasing it to the UK would still keep all the BBC's content av
Releasing iMP to the world would almost end piracy of the BBC's content.
Releasing it to the UK would still keep all the BBC's content available
over the net through the standard ways. What better way to maintain
control and quality than to irradicate the need for piracy of BBC content..?
I a
n
Sent: 07 November 2005 14:53
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: RE: [backstage] iMP
> >> I'm at work so I can't check at the moment, but ISTR that my telly
> >> licence has a unique reference number with it.
> > This is going back a few years (say about 3-4).
> >> I'm at work so I can't check at the moment, but ISTR that my telly
> >> licence has a unique reference number with it.
> > This is going back a few years (say about 3-4). I used to buy my
> > license from the old Post Office, and those didn't have a unique
> > number on them. The ones you
On Mon, 7 Nov 2005, Andrew Bowden wrote:
I'm at work so I can't check at the moment, but ISTR that my
telly licence has a unique reference number with it.
This is going back a few years (say about 3-4). I used to buy my
license from the old Post Office, and those didn't have a unique number
on
> I'm at work so I can't check at the moment, but ISTR that my
> telly licence has a unique reference number with it.
This is going back a few years (say about 3-4). I used to buy my
license from the old Post Office, and those didn't have a unique number
on them. The ones you get sent by TV Lic
-Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Murray Walker
> Sent: 07 November 2005 13:05
> To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
> Subject: RE: [backstage] iMP: accessibility, is the smell really that
> bad?
>
>
> > -Origin
Mark Simpkins wrote:
How about a 'Rate this weather' option? Just grade how accurate you
thought the weather forcast was for your area.
Isithotornot.com?
Oh really, I should go on tour :)
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On Mon, 7 Nov 2005, Angelo wrote:
How long do you foresee the trials taking place for before it is released
onto the UK market? Also, I assume the basic technology will prevent those
from outside the UK viewing the content on imp, but how will you be able to
distinguish between those who have and
ubject: RE: [backstage] iMP: accessibility, is the smell really that
bad?
> -Original Message-
> From: Gordon Joly
> (Ignore that fact that temperatures forecast may differ by as much as
> 5 degrees C:-)
Reminds me of an old idea...
Weather from Yahoo, BBC, Met Office all re
> -Original Message-
> From: Gordon Joly
> (Ignore that fact that temperatures forecast may differ by as much as
> 5 degrees C:-)
Reminds me of an old idea...
Weather from Yahoo, BBC, Met Office all regularly seem to differ quite
widely, based purely on personal subjective checking. So.
How long do you foresee the trials taking place for before it is
released onto the UK market? Also, I assume the basic technology will
prevent those from outside the UK viewing the content on imp, but how
will you be able to distinguish between those who have and have not
paid their licence fee? Or
. Great believer in common
sense, me...
k
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Chetwynd
Sent: 05 November 2005 08:58
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: [backstage] iMP: accessibility, is the smell really that bad?
iMP: accessibility,
ROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Chetwynd
Sent: 05 November 2005 08:58
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: [backstage] iMP: accessibility, is the smell really that bad?
iMP: accessibility, is the smell really that bad?
Does anyone have links to positive reports
You're *such* a terror. :-)
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Chetwynd
Sent: 04 November 2005 16:19
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: Re: [backstage] iMP
Kim,
I'd just like to correct your suggestion that we on
> -Original Message-
> Liked it very much, interesting URI - had a peek with
> etherpeek! Wanted
> to know if there is any thought given to API's and such which
> will allow
> for any interfacing should this go 'gold'. The intergrated
> media player
> is cool but essentially unusabl
e why not - what's your beef?
> > >
> > >
> > >-Original Message-
> > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James
> > >Sent: 04 November 2005 10:58
> > >To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
> >
gt; Kim Plowright wrote:
>
> >Yes, but zen ve vould haff to kill you...
> >
> >:-)
> >
> >Don't see why not - what's your beef?
> >
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 08:57 + 5/11/05, Jonathan Chetwynd wrote:
iMP: accessibility, is the smell really that bad?
Does anyone have links to positive reports on the accessibility of iMP?
According to: http://cms.elfden.co.uk/2005/10/18/bbc-imp-trial-part-1/
"Accessibility wise it stinks. No keyboard access wh
iMP: accessibility, is the smell really that bad?
Does anyone have links to positive reports on the accessibility of iMP?
According to: http://cms.elfden.co.uk/2005/10/18/bbc-imp-trial-part-1/
"Accessibility wise it stinks. No keyboard access what so ever."
Who is responsible for accessibi
et!
Jim.
Kim Plowright wrote:
Yes, but zen ve vould haff to kill you...
:-)
Don't see why not - what's your beef?
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James
Sent: 04 November 2005 10:58
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject:
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Victoria Conlan
> Sent: 04 November 2005 16:38
> To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
> Subject: RE: [backstage] iMP
>
>
>
>
> > we only execute internal candidates
>
> Ok, this makes me slightly afraid to apply for anything ever a
> we only execute internal candidates
Ok, this makes me slightly afraid to apply for anything ever again.
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Jonathan Chetwynd wrote:
I hope this has cleared up any misunderstanding that may have occurred,
and I apologise if I was not clear in any of my previous emails about
this matter.
Someone get me whatever he's on.
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vi
Kim,
I'd just like to correct your suggestion that we only
execute internal candidates, in fact we're open to anybody and
that is why details are circulated on the BBC Backstage list.
There was a slight mix-up on the day they appeared, as the BBC Snuff
team
inadvertently forgot to flag them a
Yes, but zen ve vould haff to kill you...
:-)
Don't see why not - what's your beef?
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James
Sent: 04 November 2005 10:58
To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk
Subject: [backstage] iMP
Are we allow
>
>
> Are we allowed to talk about iMP here ?
>
> >
Sure.
We can also pass on any specific queries to the iMP team if you're on
the trial.
There's also quite a lengthy thread on one of our message boards with
contributions from the iMP trial team.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbpointsofview/F19515
Are we allowed to talk about iMP here ?
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Hi News Profile
Sorry about that. The consumer beta was for only 5000 users and is
currently full.
Subject to the beta being a success and the BBC approval process for a
new service there will be further betas as this product develops. I
hope you get a chance to contribute further down the line
J
I was told I would be included back in May, received an email from a
lady at BBC. Unfortunately I don't have a copy of that email. Suffice
to say, they didn't follow this up in September. So, slightly gutted.
Also, bit peeved.
At 11:41 +0100 6/10/05, Ben Metcalfe wrote:
I applied ages ago, seems I haven't been selected :(
The odds were good too - 30,000 applicants - 5,000
places - 1:6.
- David (Very disappointed :()
I'm not really supposed to plug my own blog on here, but I have written
a review of the iMP pla
> I applied ages ago, seems I haven't been selected :(
> The odds were good too - 30,000 applicants - 5,000
> places - 1:6.
>
> - David (Very disappointed :()
I'm not really supposed to plug my own blog on here, but I have written
a review of the iMP player:
http://benmetcalfe.com/blog/index.ph
I applied ages ago, seems I haven't been selected :(
The odds were good too - 30,000 applicants - 5,000
places - 1:6.
- David (Very disappointed :()
On Wed, 5 Oct 2005 20:30:39 +0100 (BST), "J.P.Knight"
wrote
>
> I see from Slashdot[1] that the BBC have started their
> Internet Media
> Player[
> Any backstagers in the lucky public group?
Yep. And I've been unexpectedly Slashdotted, to boot...!
-- Tom
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visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html.
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I see from Slashdot[1] that the BBC have started their Internet Media
Player[2] trial. Any backstagers in the lucky public group?
I see that it has a Windows only DRM so no point in us Linux users
applying for the trial. Back to tvtime for us!
Jim'll
[1] http://slashdot.org/articles/05/10/
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