Re: Java 32 Redux
Am 08/29/2016 01:07 AM, schrieb Kay Schenk: On 01/08/2015 03:36 PM, V Stuart Foote wrote: I've added a background color and icon. The text was also It certainly won't be missed now... No, it won't. It seems using a 32-bit Java on a 64-bit Windows environment continues to be a source of frustration for end users. We'll be changing System Requirements generally for 4.2. But, meanwhile, could this lovely message box be added as a second paragraph to the current System Requirements page? http://www.openoffice.org/dev_docs/source/sys_reqs_aoo41.html does anyone have the exact wording handy? Then I can create something for the webpage. TIA Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32 Redux
There's also a proposal to rework the error messages. I started over a year ago, and was flummoxes on not wanting there to be multiple warnings in the same message (having to do with how exception messages are combined). It would be worth getting back to for 4.2. - Dennis > -Original Message- > From: Kay Schenk [mailto:ksch...@apache.org] > Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2016 16:07 > To: dev@openoffice.apache.org > Subject: Re: Java 32 Redux > > > > On 01/08/2015 03:36 PM, V Stuart Foote wrote: > >> I've added a background color and icon. The text was also > > > > It certainly won't be missed now... > > > > > > > > > > > > No, it won't. It seems using a 32-bit Java on a 64-bit Windows > environment continues to be a source of frustration for end users. > > We'll be changing System Requirements generally for 4.2. But, meanwhile, > could this lovely message box be added as a second paragraph to the > current System Requirements page? > > http://www.openoffice.org/dev_docs/source/sys_reqs_aoo41.html > > On another related thread, Juergen had suggested an added parameter of > -d32 to run the 64 bit Java in 32 bit mode. Unfortunately this only > applies to *nix variants and maybe(?) MacOSX. Windows doesn't have it. > it's too bad, because it certainly would be an easy fix. > > > -- > > > -- > > Kay Schenk > Apache OpenOffice > > "Things work out best for those who make > the best of the way things work out." > -- John Wooden > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32 Redux
On 01/08/2015 03:36 PM, V Stuart Foote wrote: >> I've added a background color and icon. The text was also > > It certainly won't be missed now... > > > > > No, it won't. It seems using a 32-bit Java on a 64-bit Windows environment continues to be a source of frustration for end users. We'll be changing System Requirements generally for 4.2. But, meanwhile, could this lovely message box be added as a second paragraph to the current System Requirements page? http://www.openoffice.org/dev_docs/source/sys_reqs_aoo41.html On another related thread, Juergen had suggested an added parameter of -d32 to run the 64 bit Java in 32 bit mode. Unfortunately this only applies to *nix variants and maybe(?) MacOSX. Windows doesn't have it. it's too bad, because it certainly would be an easy fix. -- -- Kay Schenk Apache OpenOffice "Things work out best for those who make the best of the way things work out." -- John Wooden - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) - BASE Questions
On 01/22/2015 09:42 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: Before improving the messages and taking another run at the Java explanation on the web site, I ran more tests to be certain I knew the circumstances for one of the messages that is tied to SQL Exceptions. One thing I noticed (which was useful for seeing how the different messages arise) is that the default embedded database produced by OpenOffice Base is HSQLDB, which is 100% Java-required. According to the HSQLDB site, there was collaboration on upgrading the version of HSQLDB, http://hsqldb.org/web/openoffice.html. That's from November 2011 though. I have three questions: 1. What happened with regard to the improvements with regard to the version of HSQLDB used? We're still using the base of hsqldb 1.8 with patches for use with java 7. See: https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=121754 There had been some additional discussion switching to hsql 2.3 but this has not been done. See : https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=121837 2. What happened with regard to being able to make an HSQLDB for local use but external to the .ODB file? I don't recall a discussion like this. Can you provide a reference? 3. Is there any effort at any stage of development to use a local but non-Java-requiring database? Not that I'm aware of. We've had requests for other dbs like sqlite but these were not in-depth discussions of a replacement. At some point, we do need a more in-depth discussion about Base. Please feel free to start this if you like. This isn't going to matter with regard to immediately cleaning up the messages and the explanation on the web site. I'm just curious because Base is a place that might have some relatively isolatable maintenance work (or maybe not). I think you're right about this. - Dennis -Original Message- From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:dennis.hamil...@acm.org] Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2015 10:39 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: RE: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) I've started working over the six Java-specific messages that are produced by AOO and adjusting the localizable explanation at http://openoffice.org/xx/java. WEB SITE QUESTION: For page-specific images that I want to include under content/xx/java/, can I simply put them in that directory, since they are only used by the web page(s) there? I am thinking that will work perfectly for localization, because the localized versions of those folders can replace the images made from screen captures with equivalent ones made from the same-language UI. And for starters, copies of the xx/java/ images can continue to be used until localization-friendlier ones are supplied. Is this a good way to approach this? Is there different guidance with regard to images having such local context? - Dennis -Original Message- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 07:28 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) Am 12/30/2014 03:54 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: [ ... ] orcmid I thought the idea was to create openoffice.org/java/index.htm and seed the xx structure from that. Have I misunderstood how that is usually done? /orcmid I think there was no agreemnt here. However, it's just a commit more when we all agree that this is the best place. Can be done later as the page was recently updated by Kay. So, now the several error messages need to be updated. orcmid Some of the error messages can be essentially unchanged because they happen when the JRE is installed or has been intentionally avoided. I will put up a suggested list when I am feeling better. /orcmid That would be great. I'm a bit lost to resolve which text part is combined with what and in which case. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- - MzK There's a bit of magic in everything, and some loss to even things out. -- Lou Reed - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) - BASE Questions
On 22/01/2015 Kay Schenk wrote: On 01/22/2015 09:42 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: 1. What happened with regard to the improvements with regard to the version of HSQLDB used? We're still using the base of hsqldb 1.8 with patches for use with java 7. See: https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=121754 To be precise, as you will read there, we are using an unmodified 1.8.0.11, but since it was not released as a tarball but just as a SVN tag, we actually use 1.8.0.10 and patch it with the few changes needed to align the code to 1.8.0.11. 3. Is there any effort at any stage of development to use a local but non-Java-requiring database? No. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) - BASE Questions
Before improving the messages and taking another run at the Java explanation on the web site, I ran more tests to be certain I knew the circumstances for one of the messages that is tied to SQL Exceptions. One thing I noticed (which was useful for seeing how the different messages arise) is that the default embedded database produced by OpenOffice Base is HSQLDB, which is 100% Java-required. According to the HSQLDB site, there was collaboration on upgrading the version of HSQLDB, http://hsqldb.org/web/openoffice.html. That's from November 2011 though. I have three questions: 1. What happened with regard to the improvements with regard to the version of HSQLDB used? 2. What happened with regard to being able to make an HSQLDB for local use but external to the .ODB file? 3. Is there any effort at any stage of development to use a local but non-Java-requiring database? This isn't going to matter with regard to immediately cleaning up the messages and the explanation on the web site. I'm just curious because Base is a place that might have some relatively isolatable maintenance work (or maybe not). - Dennis -Original Message- From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:dennis.hamil...@acm.org] Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2015 10:39 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: RE: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) I've started working over the six Java-specific messages that are produced by AOO and adjusting the localizable explanation at http://openoffice.org/xx/java. WEB SITE QUESTION: For page-specific images that I want to include under content/xx/java/, can I simply put them in that directory, since they are only used by the web page(s) there? I am thinking that will work perfectly for localization, because the localized versions of those folders can replace the images made from screen captures with equivalent ones made from the same-language UI. And for starters, copies of the xx/java/ images can continue to be used until localization-friendlier ones are supplied. Is this a good way to approach this? Is there different guidance with regard to images having such local context? - Dennis -Original Message- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 07:28 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) Am 12/30/2014 03:54 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: [ ... ] orcmid I thought the idea was to create openoffice.org/java/index.htm and seed the xx structure from that. Have I misunderstood how that is usually done? /orcmid I think there was no agreemnt here. However, it's just a commit more when we all agree that this is the best place. Can be done later as the page was recently updated by Kay. So, now the several error messages need to be updated. orcmid Some of the error messages can be essentially unchanged because they happen when the JRE is installed or has been intentionally avoided. I will put up a suggested list when I am feeling better. /orcmid That would be great. I'm a bit lost to resolve which text part is combined with what and in which case. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
I've started working over the six Java-specific messages that are produced by AOO and adjusting the localizable explanation at http://openoffice.org/xx/java. WEB SITE QUESTION: For page-specific images that I want to include under content/xx/java/, can I simply put them in that directory, since they are only used by the web page(s) there? I am thinking that will work perfectly for localization, because the localized versions of those folders can replace the images made from screen captures with equivalent ones made from the same-language UI. And for starters, copies of the xx/java/ images can continue to be used until localization-friendlier ones are supplied. Is this a good way to approach this? Is there different guidance with regard to images having such local context? - Dennis -Original Message- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 07:28 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) Am 12/30/2014 03:54 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: [ ... ] orcmid I thought the idea was to create openoffice.org/java/index.htm and seed the xx structure from that. Have I misunderstood how that is usually done? /orcmid I think there was no agreemnt here. However, it's just a commit more when we all agree that this is the best place. Can be done later as the page was recently updated by Kay. So, now the several error messages need to be updated. orcmid Some of the error messages can be essentially unchanged because they happen when the JRE is installed or has been intentionally avoided. I will put up a suggested list when I am feeling better. /orcmid That would be great. I'm a bit lost to resolve which text part is combined with what and in which case. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32 Redux
I've added a background color and icon. The text was also It certainly won't be missed now... -- View this message in context: http://openoffice.2283327.n4.nabble.com/Java-32-Redux-tp4670709p4670758.html Sent from the Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32 Redux
Am 01/07/2015 06:29 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: The page at http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html covers the Java problem nicely. As most of the Java problems originate with Windows users, many of whom are lesser skilled in computers, might I ask for the Windows section to be repeated with more emphasis - perhaps boxed and backgrounded as a side (or other note), so that it catches the eye? the only part that is directly related to Windows is IMHO the important note part. So, only this was changed [1] - for the moment on the staging area. I've added a background color and icon. The text was also slightly enhanced: Old: Important note for Apache OpenOffice on Windows: The Windows version of OpenOffice is 32-bit and requires a 32-bit JRE. You must install a 32-bit JRE even if you already have a 64-bit JRE installed. New: Important note for all Windows users: The Windows version of OpenOffice is 32-bit and therefore it requires a 32-bit JRE. Even when you have a Windows version with 64-bit installed. Furthermore you have to install a 32-bit JRE - additionally or instead - when you already have a 64-bit JRE installed. Does the Windows part meets now better your expectation? [1] http://ooo-site.staging.apache.org/download/common/java.html I'm off-line for the next 60 hours - I have to attend a funeral in the UK. I'm very sorry for that. You have my deepest sympathy. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Java 32 Redux
The page at http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html covers the Java problem nicely. As most of the Java problems originate with Windows users, many of whom are lesser skilled in computers, might I ask for the Windows section to be repeated with more emphasis - perhaps boxed and backgrounded as a side (or other note), so that it catches the eye? I'm off-line for the next 60 hours - I have to attend a funeral in the UK. -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
Am 12/29/2014 10:30 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: On 28/12/2014 Marcus wrote: Am 12/27/2014 12:44 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). in general, I would agree with you. However in this well-known case I've a problem with Java resp. JRE - What to do? I would make an exception here as it is easier for the average user to remember openoffice.org/java/ resp. openoffice.org/xx/java/. Yes, it's in the dialog box but IMHO not clickable OK, good point. And now it is well past time this conversation had to stop and turn into action, so I highly recommend that you open an issue and that we have further discussion there if needed, or that we just get it done! sure, the issue is #125981: The webpage is now copied from .../download/common/java.html to .../xx/java/index.html. So, now the several error messages need to be updated. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
[fuzzy-headed with the flu] -- replying below to -- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 03:35 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) Am 12/29/2014 10:30 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: On 28/12/2014 Marcus wrote: Am 12/27/2014 12:44 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). in general, I would agree with you. However in this well-known case I've a problem with Java resp. JRE - What to do? I would make an exception here as it is easier for the average user to remember openoffice.org/java/ resp. openoffice.org/xx/java/. Yes, it's in the dialog box but IMHO not clickable OK, good point. And now it is well past time this conversation had to stop and turn into action, so I highly recommend that you open an issue and that we have further discussion there if needed, or that we just get it done! sure, the issue is #125981: The webpage is now copied from .../download/common/java.html to .../xx/java/index.html. orcmid I thought the idea was to create openoffice.org/java/index.htm and seed the xx structure from that. Have I misunderstood how that is usually done? /orcmid So, now the several error messages need to be updated. orcmid Some of the error messages can be essentially unchanged because they happen when the JRE is installed or has been intentionally avoided. I will put up a suggested list when I am feeling better. /orcmid Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
Am 12/30/2014 03:54 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: [fuzzy-headed with the flu] -- replying below to -- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 03:35 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) Am 12/29/2014 10:30 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: On 28/12/2014 Marcus wrote: Am 12/27/2014 12:44 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). in general, I would agree with you. However in this well-known case I've a problem with Java resp. JRE - What to do? I would make an exception here as it is easier for the average user to remember openoffice.org/java/ resp. openoffice.org/xx/java/. Yes, it's in the dialog box but IMHO not clickable OK, good point. And now it is well past time this conversation had to stop and turn into action, so I highly recommend that you open an issue and that we have further discussion there if needed, or that we just get it done! sure, the issue is #125981: The webpage is now copied from .../download/common/java.html to .../xx/java/index.html. orcmid I thought the idea was to create openoffice.org/java/index.htm and seed the xx structure from that. Have I misunderstood how that is usually done? /orcmid I think there was no agreemnt here. However, it's just a commit more when we all agree that this is the best place. Can be done later as the page was recently updated by Kay. So, now the several error messages need to be updated. orcmid Some of the error messages can be essentially unchanged because they happen when the JRE is installed or has been intentionally avoided. I will put up a suggested list when I am feeling better. /orcmid That would be great. I'm a bit lost to resolve which text part is combined with what and in which case. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
On 28/12/2014 Marcus wrote: Am 12/27/2014 12:44 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). in general, I would agree with you. However in this well-known case I've a problem with Java resp. JRE - What to do? I would make an exception here as it is easier for the average user to remember openoffice.org/java/ resp. openoffice.org/xx/java/. Yes, it's in the dialog box but IMHO not clickable OK, good point. And now it is well past time this conversation had to stop and turn into action, so I highly recommend that you open an issue and that we have further discussion there if needed, or that we just get it done! Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
Am 12/27/2014 12:44 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: On 25/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: A. Is this a potential way to do it? 1. Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/xx/java/ directory. 2. Create leftnav.mdtext and index.mdtext files there. 3. The content/xx/java/index.mdtext would become the English Language version that We adopt for the target. If further breakout is required, it can be handled in that directory at a later time. In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). in general, I would agree with you. However in this well-known case I've a problem with Java resp. JRE - What to do? I would make an exception here as it is easier for the average user to remember openoffice.org/java/ resp. openoffice.org/xx/java/. Yes, it's in the dialog box but IMHO not clickable - as long no core developer will create this functionality. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
+1 -- replying below to -- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2014 10:06 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) Am 12/27/2014 12:44 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: On 25/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: A. Is this a potential way to do it? 1. Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/xx/java/ directory. 2. Create leftnav.mdtext and index.mdtext files there. 3. The content/xx/java/index.mdtext would become the English Language version that We adopt for the target. If further breakout is required, it can be handled in that directory at a later time. In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). in general, I would agree with you. However in this well-known case I've a problem with Java resp. JRE - What to do? I would make an exception here as it is easier for the average user to remember openoffice.org/java/ resp. openoffice.org/xx/java/. Yes, it's in the dialog box but IMHO not clickable - as long no core developer will create this functionality. orcmid I think there is the same problem with java.html versus java.htm as well. openoffice.org/java is just easier and more-flexible at the destination. Concerning message boxes. I don't think there is an east way to use standard message-box resources to produce a URL. We are talking about GUI work instead, and having it be internationalized. I think this takes us too far from the least that can possibly work -- and assist users immediately. [Side Note: This might be possible with a button for Help though. Or put the URL in a button label. I have not checked further, but the idea came up in the WinForms case at http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1833747/clickable-url-in-a-winform-message-box. I am a bit wary of live links in dialog boxes. Unlike browser links, it is not easy for the user to know that the link is to the location indicated in the message. We are also creating a small problem with having a URL at all, since derivatives and knock-offs probably won't change the messages. In this case, having users taken care of seems to have clear precedence. /orcmid Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
Am 12/28/2014 07:38 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: +1 -- replying below to -- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2014 10:06 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) Am 12/27/2014 12:44 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: On 25/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: A. Is this a potential way to do it? 1. Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/xx/java/ directory. 2. Create leftnav.mdtext and index.mdtext files there. 3. The content/xx/java/index.mdtext would become the English Language version that We adopt for the target. If further breakout is required, it can be handled in that directory at a later time. In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). in general, I would agree with you. However in this well-known case I've a problem with Java resp. JRE - What to do? I would make an exception here as it is easier for the average user to remember openoffice.org/java/ resp. openoffice.org/xx/java/. Yes, it's in the dialog box but IMHO not clickable - as long no core developer will create this functionality. orcmid I think there is the same problem with java.html versus java.htm as well. openoffice.org/java is just easier and more-flexible at the destination. Concerning message boxes. I don't think there is an east way to use standard message-box resources to produce a URL. We are talking about GUI work instead, and having it be internationalized. I think this takes us too far from the least that can possibly work -- and assist users immediately. [Side Note: This might be possible with a button for Help though. Or put the URL in a button label. I have not checked further, but the idea came up in the WinForms case athttp://stackoverflow.com/questions/1833747/clickable-url-in-a-winform-message-box. I am a bit wary of live links in dialog boxes. Unlike browser links, it is not easy for the user to know that the link is to the location indicated in the message. When you remember the text you have suggested I'm pretty sure the user will know that the URL is directly connected with the text. ;-) We are also creating a small problem with having a URL at all, since derivatives and knock-offs probably won't change the messages. In this case, having users taken care of seems to have clear precedence. /orcmid Ah, yes. Another argument to separate the Java text into an own webpage and sub-dir. Then we can control, change or delete it without influencing other files in other dirs. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
-- reply below to -- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2014 11:13 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) Am 12/28/2014 07:38 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: [ ... ] I am a bit wary of live links in dialog boxes. Unlike browser links, it is not easy for the user to know that the link is to the location indicated in the message. When you remember the text you have suggested I'm pretty sure the user will know that the URL is directly connected with the text. ;-) orcmid Oh. I was not clear. I meant that the live link might go to a different place than is shown in the message box. For example, as a form of malware or a way of tracking users. In my browser I can always tell where a static link goes (unless JavaScript is being used to hide it, and then I am very careful). I don't know if this is a significant risk, but it does increase the threat surface unnecessarily. (Silently pinging for updates is similar in not having the user in charge of what is happening.) /orcmid [ ... ] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
On 27/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: How about this? Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/java/ *folder* where the index.htm will be the new version of the target file. This can be done in advance because and, after the text is considered OK, internationalization could proceed without pressure in anticipation of 4.2.0. there is no link to it from anywhere yet. This would be OK. then java/index.html becomes, for translations, xx/product/java.html ; we already do this for other files. I missed the message about timing and 4.1.2 versus 4.2.0 somehow. So, we can we discuss changes to the messages and maybe make bugzilla issues but changes should not be made to the trunk until 4.1.2 is out the door? Code and translations follow separate paths. The current trunk can be freely modified and it will lead to, say, 4.2.0 (exact numbering still undecided). For a bugfix release (like 4.1.2) we will have a separate line based on AOO410, the one that was used for 4.1.0 and 4.1.1. So code is OK. Translations, instead, currently have only one version available: in our example, it can be set to trunk or to the 4.1.2 branch. And it is currently aligned with trunk. So if we created (for code) a 4.1.2 branch and you pushed the new English string to it, translators wouldn't find it in Pootle and wouldn't be able to localize it. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
Am 12/25/2014 12:42 AM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: I finished checking on the Java-specific messages and the six messages only have a single place where each is produced. It appears that a single (default en) page could provide the necessary information for reference from any messages in the installed binaries. Andrea suggests The page could be included in the set of standard pages (the xx pages, see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their translated one. A. Is this a potential way to do it? 1. Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/xx/java/ directory. 2. Create leftnav.mdtext and index.mdtext files there. 3. The content/xx/java/index.mdtext would become the English Language version that We adopt for the target. If further breakout is required, it can be handled in that directory at a later time. B. Having done that, and having the message be agreeable, internationalization can commence. C. At an appropriate time, the content/java/ directory is created and it is arranged that this and content/xx/java/ are synchronized. (I have no idea what order this has to be in and which is the master.) D. The current content/download/common/java.html can be redirected to content/java/ Or E. The adjusted default messages that link to the site will link to http://openoffice.org/java and be in the build in time to test (4.1.2?) developer builds with the new messages and the new site pages. How am I doing? sounds good. To have this ready for a 4.1.2 sounds also be feasible. Marcus -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 00:12 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 On 22/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I see no problem with where it is kept. One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one. The page could be included in the set of standard pages (the xx pages, see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their translated one. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
On 25/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: A. Is this a potential way to do it? 1. Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/xx/java/ directory. 2. Create leftnav.mdtext and index.mdtext files there. 3. The content/xx/java/index.mdtext would become the English Language version that We adopt for the target. If further breakout is required, it can be handled in that directory at a later time. In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). B. Having done that, and having the message be agreeable, internationalization can commence. C. At an appropriate time, the content/java/ directory is created and it is arranged that this and content/xx/java/ are synchronized. (I have no idea what order this has to be in and which is the master.) xx is generated from the English content, so steps are: write English page; copy to xx (structure, i.e., filenames and directories, may change); translators add it. D. The current content/download/common/java.html can be redirected to content/java/ Or E. The adjusted default messages that link to the site will link to http://openoffice.org/java and be in the build in time to test (4.1.2?) developer builds with the new messages and the new site pages. Correct. How am I doing? Well, except one detail: as I wrote earlier today, we cannot do it for 4.1.2 since strings in Pootle have already been updated and translators are already working on 4.2.0; so at the moment we have no way to add a string between 4.1.1 and 4.1.2 (also, 4.1.2 is not meant for string changes). I'm also curious about the new mechanism Jan described... well, very likely I'll know more about it at FOSDEM next month! Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
-- replying to this below -- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Friday, December 26, 2014 15:44 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32) On 25/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: A. Is this a potential way to do it? 1. Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/xx/java/ directory. 2. Create leftnav.mdtext and index.mdtext files there. 3. The content/xx/java/index.mdtext would become the English Language version that We adopt for the target. If further breakout is required, it can be handled in that directory at a later time. In xx we try to avoid too many subdirectories. The Java file could find a place in the product directory, and be referenced from the leftnav in that directory (extended a few hours ago). B. Having done that, and having the message be agreeable, internationalization can commence. C. At an appropriate time, the content/java/ directory is created and it is arranged that this and content/xx/java/ are synchronized. (I have no idea what order this has to be in and which is the master.) xx is generated from the English content, so steps are: write English page; copy to xx (structure, i.e., filenames and directories, may change); translators add it. orcmid How about this? Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/java/ *folder* where the index.htm will be the new version of the target file. This can be done in advance because and, after the text is considered OK, internationalization could proceed without pressure in anticipation of 4.2.0. there is no link to it from anywhere yet. The folder is both to allow the very short URL, http://openoffice.org/java in messages, and the possibility that there might be further more- technical detail in order to keep the main page straightforward. We'll know better in trying it out. /orcmid D. The current content/download/common/java.html can be redirected to content/java/ Or E. The adjusted default messages that link to the site will link to http://openoffice.org/java and be in the build in time to test (4.1.2?) developer builds with the new messages and the new site pages. Correct. How am I doing? Well, except one detail: as I wrote earlier today, we cannot do it for 4.1.2 since strings in Pootle have already been updated and translators are already working on 4.2.0; so at the moment we have no way to add a string between 4.1.1 and 4.1.2 (also, 4.1.2 is not meant for string changes). orcmid I missed the message about timing and 4.1.2 versus 4.2.0 somehow. So, we can we discuss changes to the messages and maybe make bugzilla issues but changes should not be made to the trunk until 4.1.2 is out the door? Whenever the messages are adjusted, they can refer to web pages that are already waiting, even if not linked from anywhere else up until then. It looks like the redirect from download/common/java.html could happen at any time it is considered that java/index.html is ready. /orcmid I'm also curious about the new mechanism Jan described... well, very likely I'll know more about it at FOSDEM next month! Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
On 25 December 2014 at 00:42, Dennis E. Hamilton dennis.hamil...@acm.org wrote: I finished checking on the Java-specific messages and the six messages only have a single place where each is produced. It appears that a single (default en) page could provide the necessary information for reference from any messages in the installed binaries. Andrea suggests The page could be included in the set of standard pages (the xx pages, see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their translated one. A. Is this a potential way to do it? 1. Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/xx/java/ directory. 2. Create leftnav.mdtext and index.mdtext files there. 3. The content/xx/java/index.mdtext would become the English Language version that We adopt for the target. If further breakout is required, it can be handled in that directory at a later time. B. Having done that, and having the message be agreeable, internationalization can commence. C. At an appropriate time, the content/java/ directory is created and it is arranged that this and content/xx/java/ are synchronized. (I have no idea what order this has to be in and which is the master.) D. The current content/download/common/java.html can be redirected to content/java/ Or E. The adjusted default messages that link to the site will link to http://openoffice.org/java and be in the build in time to test (4.1.2?) developer builds with the new messages and the new site pages. How am I doing? Without being an expert, I can only say your suggestion looks pretty much like how I would have done it. Remark, Infra (==me) work on moving translations to a new service. This service will also offer webpage translation (through the same interface) so we can ask all our translators to translate relevant parts. We have to change every page slightly (add a special css and js) and the it just works. I hope to be able to present this at FOSDEM. rgds jan i. -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 00:12 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 On 22/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I see no problem with where it is kept. One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one. The page could be included in the set of standard pages (the xx pages, see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their translated one. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Explaining Java (was RE: Java 32)
I finished checking on the Java-specific messages and the six messages only have a single place where each is produced. It appears that a single (default en) page could provide the necessary information for reference from any messages in the installed binaries. Andrea suggests The page could be included in the set of standard pages (the xx pages, see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their translated one. A. Is this a potential way to do it? 1. Create an ooo-site/trunk/content/xx/java/ directory. 2. Create leftnav.mdtext and index.mdtext files there. 3. The content/xx/java/index.mdtext would become the English Language version that We adopt for the target. If further breakout is required, it can be handled in that directory at a later time. B. Having done that, and having the message be agreeable, internationalization can commence. C. At an appropriate time, the content/java/ directory is created and it is arranged that this and content/xx/java/ are synchronized. (I have no idea what order this has to be in and which is the master.) D. The current content/download/common/java.html can be redirected to content/java/ Or E. The adjusted default messages that link to the site will link to http://openoffice.org/java and be in the build in time to test (4.1.2?) developer builds with the new messages and the new site pages. How am I doing? -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 00:12 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 On 22/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I see no problem with where it is kept. One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one. The page could be included in the set of standard pages (the xx pages, see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their translated one. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On 22/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I see no problem with where it is kept. One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one. The page could be included in the set of standard pages (the xx pages, see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their translated one. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32
+1 !! -- in reply to -- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 00:12 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 On 22/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I see no problem with where it is kept. One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one. The page could be included in the set of standard pages (the xx pages, see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their translated one. orcnote Great! That's wonderful. I must remember to do that sort of thing on other sites. - Dennis PS: I wanted to provoke the Java messages and I figured the AOO 4.1.1 I have on the Windows 10 Technical Preview would work for that. Except Java SE Development Kit 7 Update 55 is already installed! I had no recollection of doing such a thing. It turns out it came with the Visual Studio 2015 Technical Preview (along with Google's Android SDK Tools) and a Git version 1.9.0 that needs to get the security update. (The copy in GitHub for Windows is current.) /orcnote - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Marcus wrote: Sounds like a good solution in general. But I don't know how to integrate a variable URL into the error message for the dialogbox. You needn't do that. It must be something like the follwong: http://www.openoffice.org/; + $ISO_CODE + java.html No, in the ENGLISH string you write the link as http://www.openoffice.org/java.html Then the Italian translators, for example, in the Italian translation in Pootle (not in the code) use http://www.openoffice.org/it/java.html but there is no need for anything special, we do it in several places already, especially the README. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32
-- in reply to -- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 09:55 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 Am 12/22/2014 05:13 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: +1 !! Sounds like a good solution in general. But I don't know how to integrate a variable URL into the error message for the dialogbox. It must be something like the follwong: http://www.openoffice.org/; + $ISO_CODE + java.html Another thing we need a core developer for. ;-) So, adding a link that points to w.oo.o/d/c/java.html seems to be the faster solution. Marcus orcnote Two cases come to mind: 1. One way would be for the default (no language code in the URL) case would be to add a script at the web page to redirect to different pages based on any browser language-preference setting. That way, the web pages don't have to be internationalized in step with the different language builds. 2. Another way would be to have the URL internationalized at the same time as the message that the URL is in. Then, where there is no custom page at that location, there could be a redirect to the English page or an obvious second choice. I favor (1) because it doesn't force the same language as on the product. I suppose that for either (1-2), it would be good for the pages to have sidebars that indicate the other available-language pages having translations of the information. How do users who prefer non-English pages prefer this to work? Are there preferences (or even requirements) for use in multi- lingual countries such as Canada, Belgium, and Switzerland? /orcnote - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32
+1 Looks like a workable case, especially if translators know what to do. -- and reply to --- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 13:41 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] in the ENGLISH string you write the link as http://www.openoffice.org/java.html orcnote Since http://openoffice.org resolves to http://www.openoffice.org anyhow, I thought it useful to recommend the shorter URL to users. /orcnote Then the Italian translators, for example, in the Italian translation in Pootle (not in the code) use http://www.openoffice.org/it/java.html but there is no need for anything special, we do it in several places already, especially the README. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On 11/12/2014 Andreas Säger wrote: Am 11.12.2014 um 09:49 schrieb Andrea Pescetti: My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html More detailed info is needed to overthrow the common prejudice that OpenOffice relies heavily on Java which is not even true for the Base component. Thanks for the excellent text. Indeed, the page could be written in the form of FAQ and this one (link to archives: http://markmail.org/message/zr5cjxxpv7qqu5y3 ) be the answer to What is Java needed for in OpenOffice?. 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit And here we have this proposal by Dennis, which can work for me. http://markmail.org/thread/awj3rdjxluw4kdf3 This would be very easy if the dialog box would not show inadequate JREs. If it would list only the JREs with correct bitness, the list of JREs could have a slightly modified label with a 32 or 64 bit prefix like this: 32|64 bit Java runtime environments (JRE) already installed: I strongly suggest to fix the list content first. Showing the right label text with wrong options does not help much. At the moment, this will have to be postponed since nobody volunteered to do the needed code fix. So I would go on with the rest, otherwise we will wait forever. 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. This is still perfectly feasible, so my recommendation is: just do it! We have the text, creating a patch from it is easy and even it is a small improvement it will help many users. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Am 12/21/2014 11:06 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: On 11/12/2014 Andreas Säger wrote: Am 11.12.2014 um 09:49 schrieb Andrea Pescetti: My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html More detailed info is needed to overthrow the common prejudice that OpenOffice relies heavily on Java which is not even true for the Base component. Thanks for the excellent text. Indeed, the page could be written in the form of FAQ and this one (link to archives: http://markmail.org/message/zr5cjxxpv7qqu5y3 ) be the answer to What is Java needed for in OpenOffice?. 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it when thinking a bit, I would favor to completely move the file to the root of w.oo.o As it is the explaining text how OpenOffice and Java are working together and therefore it has nothing to do with the download - as it was in former days as the JRE was included - it's better suited there than in the download area. What do others think? 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit And here we have this proposal by Dennis, which can work for me. http://markmail.org/thread/awj3rdjxluw4kdf3 He updated his suggestion a bit. Now it's: Some OpenOffice operations use Java Runtime (JRE). A suitable JRE is not installed. For details http://openoffice.org/java.html; This would be very easy if the dialog box would not show inadequate JREs. If it would list only the JREs with correct bitness, the list of JREs could have a slightly modified label with a 32 or 64 bit prefix like this: 32|64 bit Java runtime environments (JRE) already installed: I strongly suggest to fix the list content first. Showing the right label text with wrong options does not help much. At the moment, this will have to be postponed since nobody volunteered to do the needed code fix. So I would go on with the rest, otherwise we will wait forever. 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. This is still perfectly feasible, so my recommendation is: just do it! We have the text, creating a patch from it is easy and even it is a small improvement it will help many users. Then it's time to go to point #4. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32
-- in reply to -- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2014 15:32 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 Am 12/21/2014 11:06 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: [ ... ] 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it when thinking a bit, I would favor to completely move the file to the root of w.oo.o As it is the explaining text how OpenOffice and Java are working together and therefore it has nothing to do with the download - as it was in former days as the JRE was included - it's better suited there than in the download area. What do others think? orcnote I think the reason for redirecting from the top level was simply to have something still at the original location for those who might be linked to it for some reason. It doesn't matter which location has the actual file, versus which one redirects. I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I see no problem with where it is kept. One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one. I don't have any sense of what is involved for that. Marcus, would localization and browser branching on language be a factor in preference for the location of the file? /orcnote [ ... ] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32
Marcus,
Thank you for reminding me about this message. I have used your clues to dig
into the code farther. Remarks in-line below.
I am tired digging through the code for now.
-- in reply to --
From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de]
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 14:49
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
Am 12/10/2014 08:22 AM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum
JRE is Defective
No Java installation could be found
Please check your installation
thanks for your help.
I think I've found the locations in the code and it seems to be a
combined text from 2 sources:
http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/svtools/source/java/javaerror.src
Line 86
orcnote
That code defines 5 dialog boxes, all about Java situations.
The five STR_... definitions are for the titles on those
dialog boxes.
Messages with those dialogs are produced by the file
Main/svtools/source/java/javainteractionhandler.cxx in method
JavaInteractionHandler::handle. This function noses around
And then produces exactly one of those 5 dialogs, without
Any apparent modification of the messages.
If that analysis holds, it is easy to adjust the five
messages. Here are the exceptions that lead to
each one, with the default title on the dialog box and
the default message in the box.
com::sun::star::Java::JavaNotFoundException
Title: JRE required
%PRODUCTNAME requires a Java runtime environment (JRE)
to perform this task. Please install a JRE and
restart %PRODUCTNAME.
[This is the only one to customize, I think.]
com::sun::star::Java::InvalidJavaSettingsException
Title: Select JRE
%The %PRODUCTNAME configuration has been changed.
Under Tools - Options - %PRODUCTNAME - Java, select
the Java runtime environment you want to have used
by %PRODUCTNAME.
com::sun::star::java::JavaDisabledException
Title: Enable JRE
%PRODUCTNAME requires a Java runtime environment (JRE)
to perform this task. However, use of a JRE has been
disabled. Do you want to enable the use of a JRE now?
[Responses are Yes, No, Cancel]
com::sun::star::java::JavaVMCreationFailureException
Title: JRE is Defective
%PRODUCTNAME requies a Java runtime environment (JRE)
to perform this task. The selected JRE is defective.
Please select another version or install a new JRE
and select it under Tools - Options - %PRODUCTNAME
- Java.
com::sun::star::java::RestartRequiredException
Title: Restart Required
For the selected Java runtime environment to work
properly, %PRODUCTNAME must be restarted. Please
restart %PRODUCTNAME now.
/orcmid
and
http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/connectivity/source/resource/conn_shared_res.src
Line 535
orcnote
The definition in conn_shared_res.src is a definition of the
string resource with ID of STR_NO_JAVA and initial value
{ Text [ en-US ] = No Java installation could be found. \
Please check your installation.
[Line break is my addition above to keep the lines short.]
This line is internationalized in a ton of languages
elsewhere. However, in code in trunk/main, this string
resource is only used in the following ways:
main/connectivity/source/drivers/jdbc/JConnection.cxx:
throwGenericSQLException(STR_NO_JAVA,*this);
main/connectivity/source/drivers/jdbc/JConnection.cxx:
throwGenericSQLException(STR_NO_JAVA,*this);
main/connectivity/source/inc/resource/common_res.hrc:
#define STR_NO_JAVA ( STR_COMMON_BASE + 22 )
main/connectivity/source/resource/conn_shared_res.src:
String STR_NO_JAVA (setting the default message)
The use in JConnection.cxx is on failure to get a JVM
Connected for setting up a Java SQL Connection.
There are numerous usages of the function
throwGenericSQLException( ). When the final catch
happens and a dialog comes up, the message is composed
by combining messages from the cascade of exceptions
that may be involved. That takes more examination to
find out where any other messages, if any, come from
in this case. This seems to be handled in
main/connectivity/source/commontools/dbexception.cxx.
I don't think there is any cascading in this case,
But more analysis is required. I can see modifying
the STR_NO_JAVA message text depending on how that
turns out.
/orcnote
[ ... ]
If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but
in
huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle:
https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/
and find the English original, then do the above.
Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it
and report the number here if you have doubts.
OK, let's see.
Marcus
Re: Java 32
On 11/12/14 11:13, Andreas Säger wrote: A Java runtime environment (JRE) is required to use the following functionality: *Wizards*, namely: *Macros* *Extensions* Finding keywords in the F1 help depends on Java. *Database access* Doesn't a11y functionality/capability require Java? jonathon signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Java 32
jonathon-3 wrote On 11/12/14 11:13, Andreas Säger wrote: A Java runtime environment (JRE) is required to use the following functionality: *Wizards*, namely: *Macros* *Extensions* Finding keywords in the F1 help depends on Java. *Database access* Doesn't a11y functionality/capability require Java? Not since early in the 4.1 release cycle with implementation of IAccessible2 based native bridge for Windows, and then JAB based code was removed for final release. Same over on the LibreOffice side at their 4.3 release. Stuart -- View this message in context: http://openoffice.2283327.n4.nabble.com/Java-32-tp4669997p4670245.html Sent from the Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On 19/12/14 23:45, V Stuart Foote wrote: Doesn't a11y functionality/capability require Java? Not since early in the 4.1 release cycle with implementation of IAccessible2 based native bridge for Windows, Thanks. That sort of explains a bizarre call had with GW Micro. jonathon signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Java 32
On 12/14/2014 05:46 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Carl Marcum cmar...@apache.org wrote: On 12/12/2014 06:04 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote: Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan. There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users. For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first. OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on. For me it's fine. Marcus -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this. 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org Also, When attempting to run an UNO client Java application on a system using Java 64 bit you receive an error: Can't load IA 32-bit .dll on a AMD 64-bit platform This message probably comes from Java but it may be useful to mention it because the end user may not be aware. Unfortunately there is no way to get the user from that error to the java.html page. Thanks, Carl hmmm...This should be mentioned in the Development Guide I would think. https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/DevGuide - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org I was thinking of the end user of a client application that may know nothing about development. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On Thu, Dec 18, 2014 at 3:00 AM, Carl Marcum cmar...@apache.org wrote: On 12/14/2014 05:46 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Carl Marcum cmar...@apache.org wrote: On 12/12/2014 06:04 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote: Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan. There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users. For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first. OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on. For me it's fine. Marcus -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this. 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org Also, When attempting to run an UNO client Java application on a system using Java 64 bit you receive an error: Can't load IA 32-bit .dll on a AMD 64-bit platform This message probably comes from Java but it may be useful to mention it because the end user may not be aware. Unfortunately there is no way to get the user from that error to the java.html page. Thanks, Carl hmmm...This should be mentioned in the Development Guide I would think. https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/DevGuide - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org I was thinking of the end user of a client application that may know nothing about development. Oh I see. Well maybe you could propose some appropriate wording and suggest a good place to put this. I would think the provider of such an app would inform the user about this, though. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- - MzK There's a bit of magic in everything, and some loss to even things out. -- Lou Reed
Re: Java 32
On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Carl Marcum cmar...@apache.org wrote: On 12/12/2014 06:04 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote: Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan. There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users. For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first. OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on. For me it's fine. Marcus -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this. 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org Also, When attempting to run an UNO client Java application on a system using Java 64 bit you receive an error: Can't load IA 32-bit .dll on a AMD 64-bit platform This message probably comes from Java but it may be useful to mention it because the end user may not be aware. Unfortunately there is no way to get the user from that error to the java.html page. Thanks, Carl hmmm...This should be mentioned in the Development Guide I would think. https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/DevGuide - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- - MzK There's a bit of magic in everything, and some loss to even things out. -- Lou Reed
Re: Java 32
On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote: Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan. There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users. For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first. OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on. For me it's fine. Marcus -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this. 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- - MzK There's a bit of magic in everything, and some loss to even things out. -- Lou Reed - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On 12/12/2014 06:04 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote: Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan. There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users. For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first. OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on. For me it's fine. Marcus -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this. 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org Also, When attempting to run an UNO client Java application on a system using Java 64 bit you receive an error: Can't load IA 32-bit .dll on a AMD 64-bit platform This message probably comes from Java but it may be useful to mention it because the end user may not be aware. Unfortunately there is no way to get the user from that error to the java.html page. Thanks, Carl - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Marcus wrote: Of course I can change it in the code with a commit. However, I'm not able to create a build to check myself to see if my fix is good or produces an ugly build breaker. I'm not yet so far to build AOO from scratch myself. I wanted to try this for the quite days at this years end. Any tips? My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Am 11.12.2014 um 09:49 schrieb Andrea Pescetti: Marcus wrote: Of course I can change it in the code with a commit. However, I'm not able to create a build to check myself to see if my fix is good or produces an ugly build breaker. I'm not yet so far to build AOO from scratch myself. I wanted to try this for the quite days at this years end. Any tips? My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html More detailed info is needed to overthrow the common prejudice that OpenOffice relies heavily on Java which is not even true for the Base component. A Java runtime environment (JRE) is required to use the following functionality: *Wizards*, namely: menu:FileWizardLetter... menu:FileWizardFax... menu:FileWizardAgenda... menu:FileWizardWeb Page... *Macros* JavaScript and BeanShell macros require Java The dialog menu:ToolsMacrosRun... can't be used. Without Java you can still use menu:ToolsMacrosOrganize... to run Python and Basic macros. https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=86541 *Extensions* Extensions coded in Java Finding keywords in the F1 help depends on Java. *Database access* All Base wizards are coded in Java. The embedded HSQLDB and any other JDBC connetion requires Java. Contrary to the current text stating that Base depends entirely on Java, most of the Base component is functional without Java. You can query and mail merge any kind of non-Java database and you can create fully functional input forms manually without the questionable help of the form wizard. You can even create a new database without Java. This results in a (less functionable) dBase directory. *Required JRE* when needing any of the above features: Any recent version of Java 7 or 8 Windwos: 32 bit JRE in any case since OpenOffice for Windows is a 32 bit application Mac: 64 bit JRE for all recent versions of OpenOffice since all recent versions for the Mac are 64 bit versions. Linux: 32 or 64 bit JRE according to the bitness of OpenOffice which should be the same as the system bitness. 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it This would be very easy if the dialog box would not show inadequate JREs. If it would list only the JREs with correct bitness, the list of JREs could have a slightly modified label with a 32 or 64 bit prefix like this: 32|64 bit Java runtime environments (JRE) already installed: I strongly suggest to fix the list content first. Showing the right label text with wrong options does not help much. 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32
+1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan. There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users. For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first. - Dennis -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton: +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan. There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users. For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first. OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on. For me it's fine. Marcus -Original Message- From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pesce...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person): 1. Find a proper wording for http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2 should take care of it 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code committers, even better) 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On 10/12/14 08:22, Rory O'Farrell wrote: On Tue, 09 Dec 2014 23:01:01 + Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie wrote: On 9 December 2014 22:19:41 GMT+00:00, Marcus marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: Marcus wrote: Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: If we are working towards a new release, could the Java not found message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine. ... Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to extend it? If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find it here (in English): http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/ maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits. ;-) I'll uninstall Java on on unused windows machine tomorrow and catch the error message, but it is likely to be about 15 hours from now as I have meetings tomorrow morning. Going to bed now! Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum JRE is Defective No Java installation could be found Please check your installation I am currently have no proper windows machine in place but have anybody tested AOO on Windows with a 64 bit Java and added a JVM parameter -d32 to run the JVM in 32 mode. I can't remember if it works or not, some features will definitely not work but these are not so often used from the average user. It can potentially help to improve the search functionality and in case of a 64 bit Java this parameter is added. But I am not sure a swell if this parameter still exists in the latest Java versions. The longterm goal should be to become a 64 bit application on Windows but this is of course a little bit more more work. Juergen If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but in huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle: https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/ and find the English original, then do the above. Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it and report the number here if you have doubts. OK, let's see. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32
JRE is Defective is an awful and unhelpful message in any language. There is no programmatic basis for claiming that as a fact, and the software certainly does not have a way of determining it. The requested remedy is pretty opaque to ordinary users too. I suggest that this be modified somehow. It appears that this message arises because a 32-bit Java Runtime Environment (JRE) is required for some functions. Somehow, there needs to be some sort of link or help that explains what functions matter and what to do to enable them. That's what users care about. Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it seems something like A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See helpful URL. I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser sniffing could take care of language there. That does mean the openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with this. Too much work? If someone holds my hand, I'm happy to help with that. I think user-sensitive Forum folk like Rory will be indispensable in vetting understandability and utility of the result. - Dennis -Original Message- From: Rory O'Farrell [mailto:ofarr...@iol.ie] Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 23:22 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum JRE is Defective No Java installation could be found Please check your installation [ ... ] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Am 12/10/2014 08:22 AM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: On Tue, 09 Dec 2014 23:01:01 + Rory O'Farrellofarr...@iol.ie wrote: On 9 December 2014 22:19:41 GMT+00:00, Marcusmarcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: Marcus wrote: Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: If we are working towards a new release, could the Java not found message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine. ... Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to extend it? If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find it here (in English): http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/ maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits. ;-) I'll uninstall Java on on unused windows machine tomorrow and catch the error message, but it is likely to be about 15 hours from now as I have meetings tomorrow morning. Going to bed now! Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum JRE is Defective No Java installation could be found Please check your installation thanks for your help. I think I've found the locations in the code and it seems to be a combined text from 2 sources: http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/svtools/source/java/javaerror.src Line 86 and http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/connectivity/source/resource/conn_shared_res.src Line 535 The problem that I see is that it's a generic message for all platforms. So, when changing the wording like ... Windows needs a 32-bit JRE ... then it will look stupid on Linux and Mac. ;-) So, we have to find a better generic wording. My suggestion is: - don't use JRE is defective at all as it is missleading with the next both sentences. - instead of just writing No Java installation could be found. Please check your installation. better would be to add another sentence like Hint: When using a 32-bit operation system then also a 32-bit JRE has to be installed. Or a 64-bit JRE when using a 64-bit operating system. And then maybe add the URL Kay has mentioned. Next problem for me: Of course I can change it in the code with a commit. However, I'm not able to create a build to check myself to see if my fix is good or produces an ugly build breaker. I'm not yet so far to build AOO from scratch myself. I wanted to try this for the quite days at this years end. Any tips? BTW: At least we can satisfy Dennis' request to find a better word for defective. :-P Marcus If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but in huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle: https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/ and find the English original, then do the above. Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it and report the number here if you have doubts. OK, let's see. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Am 12/10/2014 11:08 PM, schrieb Kay Schenk: On 12/10/2014 08:52 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: JRE is Defective is an awful and unhelpful message in any language. There is no programmatic basis for claiming that as a fact, and the software certainly does not have a way of determining it. The requested remedy is pretty opaque to ordinary users too. I suggest that this be modified somehow. It appears that this message arises because a 32-bit Java Runtime Environment (JRE) is required for some functions. Somehow, there needs to be some sort of link or help that explains what functions matter and what to do to enable them. That's what users care about. Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it seems something like A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See helpful URL. I've tracked down info needed to change this message. Do we want to use the following for the helpful URL -- http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html looks good (however, I've not yet read the complete text). Is it possible to include a URL that is actually clickable? If not, the user has to write it down and then input it into the browser's URL field to get to the webpage. IMHO not really user-friendly. If we can get it copyable - like in the About dialogbox - then it's for sure better. Marcus I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser sniffing could take care of language there. That does mean the openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with this. Too much work? If someone holds my hand, I'm happy to help with that. I think user-sensitive Forum folk like Rory will be indispensable in vetting understandability and utility of the result. - Dennis -Original Message- From: Rory O'Farrell [mailto:ofarr...@iol.ie] Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 23:22 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 [ ... ] Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum JRE is Defective No Java installation could be found Please check your installation [ ... ] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
RE: Java 32
Great, Marcus and Kay! Yes, Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See helpful URL. The http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html page is a great start. 1. It needs to say Versions Of Apache OpenOffice do not include a JRE. (The case for OpenOffice.org 3.4 doesn't matter.) 2. The 32-bit versus 64-bit distinction needs to be covered. 3. There is some wordsmithing that would be useful before submitting the page to any translation. (The last-sentence use of appreciate is quaint. I would think the link to java.com above is fine, since it provides download links immediately. The last sentence can be removed.) Is it sufficient to hack directly on https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/ooo-site/trunk/content/download/common/java.html? - Dennis -Original Message- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 14:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 Am 12/10/2014 11:08 PM, schrieb Kay Schenk: On 12/10/2014 08:52 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: [ ... ] Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it seems something like A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See helpful URL. I've tracked down info needed to change this message. Do we want to use the following for the helpful URL -- http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html looks good (however, I've not yet read the complete text). Is it possible to include a URL that is actually clickable? If not, the user has to write it down and then input it into the browser's URL field to get to the webpage. IMHO not really user-friendly. If we can get it copyable - like in the About dialogbox - then it's for sure better. Marcus I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser sniffing could take care of language there. That does mean the openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with this. [ ... ] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On Wed, 10 Dec 2014 21:04:37 -0800 Dennis E. Hamilton dennis.hamil...@acm.org wrote: Great, Marcus and Kay! Yes, Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See helpful URL. The http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html page is a great start. 1. It needs to say Versions Of Apache OpenOffice do not include a JRE. (The case for OpenOffice.org 3.4 doesn't matter.) 2. The 32-bit versus 64-bit distinction needs to be covered. 3. There is some wordsmithing that would be useful before submitting the page to any translation. (The last-sentence use of appreciate is quaint. I would think the link to java.com above is fine, since it provides download links immediately. The last sentence can be removed.) Is it sufficient to hack directly on https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/ooo-site/trunk/content/download/common/java.html? - Dennis I read the latest posts in this thread just before going to sleep last night and made no comment at the time. I remind the thread readers that I raised this function in the context specifically of Windows _needing_ a 32 bit Java, no matter what the bitness of the Windows is. I have not run into any other instances of OpenOffice/Operating Systems with differing bitness - these may exist, but are rare in my opinion and Forum experience. So I urge a message such as A Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations using OpenOffice. If using 64 bit version of Windows, a 32 bit Java must be installed to work with OpenOffice. See helpful URL. I read through the text at the target URL: my thoughts are that it is over-complex and (specifically) didn't mention the problem of the bit-matching. Remember that our major User-base is of Windows Users, many of whom are using older machines running XP(32), Win 7(32). I may re-read the text at that URL later, but can't guarantee it - my central heating has died and I have to go investigate - I fear it is serious! -Original Message- From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.m...@wtnet.de] Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 14:49 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32 Am 12/10/2014 11:08 PM, schrieb Kay Schenk: On 12/10/2014 08:52 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote: [ ... ] Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it seems something like A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See helpful URL. I've tracked down info needed to change this message. Do we want to use the following for the helpful URL -- http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html looks good (however, I've not yet read the complete text). Is it possible to include a URL that is actually clickable? If not, the user has to write it down and then input it into the browser's URL field to get to the webpage. IMHO not really user-friendly. If we can get it copyable - like in the About dialogbox - then it's for sure better. Marcus I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser sniffing could take care of language there. That does mean the openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with this. [ ... ] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Java 32
If we are working towards a new release, could the Java not found message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine. Many Windows users know they have Java installed and are baffled when OO doesn't find it. -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: If we are working towards a new release, could the Java not found message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine. Many Windows users know they have Java installed and are baffled when OO doesn't find it. right, this could help indeed. Especially when the Win 64-bit users have installed a 64-bit Java and now doesn't understand why AOO doesn't find it - when actually a 32-bit Java needs to be found. Of course this little addition in the sentence needs to be translated, too. Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to extend it? Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Marcus wrote: Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: If we are working towards a new release, could the Java not found message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine. ... Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to extend it? If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find it here (in English): http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/ If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but in huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle: https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/ and find the English original, then do the above. Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it and report the number here if you have doubts. Regards, Andrea. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: Marcus wrote: Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: If we are working towards a new release, could the Java not found message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine. ... Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to extend it? If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find it here (in English): http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/ maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits. ;-) If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but in huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle: https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/ and find the English original, then do the above. Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it and report the number here if you have doubts. OK, let's see. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On 9 December 2014 22:19:41 GMT+00:00, Marcus marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: Marcus wrote: Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: If we are working towards a new release, could the Java not found message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine. ... Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to extend it? If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find it here (in English): http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/ maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits. ;-) I'll uninstall Java on on unused windows machine tomorrow and catch the error message, but it is likely to be about 15 hours from now as I have meetings tomorrow morning. Going to bed now! If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but in huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle: https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/ and find the English original, then do the above. Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it and report the number here if you have doubts. OK, let's see. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: Java 32
On Tue, 09 Dec 2014 23:01:01 + Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie wrote: On 9 December 2014 22:19:41 GMT+00:00, Marcus marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: Marcus wrote: Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell: If we are working towards a new release, could the Java not found message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine. ... Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to extend it? If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find it here (in English): http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/ maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits. ;-) I'll uninstall Java on on unused windows machine tomorrow and catch the error message, but it is likely to be about 15 hours from now as I have meetings tomorrow morning. Going to bed now! Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum JRE is Defective No Java installation could be found Please check your installation If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but in huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle: https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/ and find the English original, then do the above. Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it and report the number here if you have doubts. OK, let's see. Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
