Re: [Emc-users] Choice of CNC conversions

[Bruce Layne]

I love that LinuxCNC is hacker friendly and can be customized as needed, 
but I also think it'd be great if there was a simple generic 
plug-and-play solution for a 3 axis mill or router and another for a 
lathe.  It's all some people would need and it'd go a long way toward 
lowering the initial learning curve for those destined to greater 
things.  Buy a list of commonly available hardware, plug it together, 
install a pre-configured ISO and change the travel limits in the setup.  
Bob's your uncle.  Now, it could be a Pi4.  There is still a lot of 
customizing that could be done by selecting the appropriate motors 
depending on the size of the machine, the user interface, etc.  Whenever 
I suggested that, I'd get:


1) LinuxCNC is developed by hackers, for hackers.  We don't want all of 
the support that rank amateurs would entail.  It's a net negative for 
the people who develop LinuxCNC.


2) Great idea.  Why don't YOU do that?





On 12/23/21 2:25 PM, Matthew Herd wrote:

I think it's a great idea, I've had a lot of the same thoughts in the
past.  Mach3 was traditionally the "go to" solution instead of the Acorn
CNC unit due to ease of implementation.  I haven't tried either, but agree
that LinuxCNC has a steep learning curve.  And that comes as a prior
hobbyist Linux user.  Once you are familiar, it is remarkably flexible and
powerful.  But that requires the learning stage.

In order to actually do it, it might be nice if we could get someone doing
a conversion or new build to walk through each step on the forum.  It's
been done here and there, but another one might not hurt.

As to the clearpath servos, I think "clear choice" is a bit of an
overstatement.  They're good, but a true AC servo seems miles ahead.  And
the various Chinese ones seem quite good for the price.

Matt

On Thu, Dec 23, 2021 at 2:05 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:


Everyone is probably partying or drinking egg nog this close to Christmas
but on one of the local metal groups a new member posted that he was
converting his mill to CNC.

His first posting:
"Just doing a cnc conversion to my Craftex knee mill, using the Acorn cnc
board and Clearpath Nema 34 servo's, direct drive. Motor has been converted
to VFD, and just installed a rotor encoder to measure RPM accurately. Post
some pic's when I'm done. Now I just have to learn g-code."

Here's my question to him:
"May I ask why you chose Acorn over say a MESA Solution <
http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/search=7I76E%20>
and LinuxCNC running on a PC or Pi4. Granted Pi4 4GB is hard to find at the
moment but PCs can be had for next to nothing as well as LinuxCNC is free."

And his answer:
"Did my research, liked that it was Windows compatible (sorry been at
computers too long and don't need to learn another set of headaches).
Additionally it is plug and play using the add on board from CNC4PC for the
Clearpath SDSK. Clearpath was to only choice based on the torque and built
in encoding and processing. Based on the basic encoder 0.000125 is possible
if all works as designed and the winds in the right direction."

I checked and Clearpath motors are not cheap so I don't think money was an
obstacle.  And I understand being a Windows type about not wanting to learn
a new OS.  I've had a love/hate relationship with Unix/Linux since a PDP-10
in university.  No choice but to learn it for Beaglebone or Pi and now of
course LCNC.

But I wonder if it wouldn't be a good idea in the new year to develop a
build thread that takes a beginner through conversion of a mill to LCNC so
it appears to be turnkey like the perhaps the ACORN CNC approach.

Comments?
John



"ELS! Nothing else works as well for your Lathe"
Automation Artisans Inc.
www dot autoartisans dot com


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Re: [Emc-users] Replacing a handle.

[Bruce Layne]

My medium format S Box printer was among the first monochrome LCD 
printers.  It's faster than the 3D printers that use cell phone LCDs, 
and the technology is more reliable in general but probably not in this 
particular case, given that it was among the first.  A year later, 
hopefully the 3D printer manufacturers have worked with the LCD 
manufacturers to produce monochrome LCDs that are optimized for MSLA 3D 
printing, with high resolution, better thermal management to stay cooler 
when sitting on top of a very high power UV LED array, etc.




On 10/14/21 6:50 AM, Gregg Eshelman via Emc-users wrote:

The technology to look for in LCD resin printers is a high resolution 
monochrome LCD. They allow much more UV light through than the color LCDs and 
last longer before degradation from the UV light exposure ruins them. But since 
these printers are pretty much the only reason to revive old mono LCD 
technology, they come with a premium price - but the per layer speed is 
considerably higher.



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Re: [Emc-users] Replacing a handle.

[Bruce Layne]

On 10/13/21 12:03 PM, Martin Dobbins wrote:

Bruce Layne wrote:

Someone needs to make an upgraded MSLA printer that automates the post
processing operations.

I'll pull the trigger when they do, Bruce.


I think of the current state of resin 3D printing as similar to the 
early days of photography - nearly magical, but there is some 
inconvenient slopping of chemicals to make the magic work.  We need the 
3D printing equivalent of digital photography with all of the magic, 
instant gratification, and without the messy chemicals.


However, a little rinsing with isopropyl alcohol, air drying, and UV 
exposure to cure the surface is a minor price to pay for the resin 3D 
printing magic.  It's SO much easier to CAD a structural part and resin 
print it than it is to use CNC to make the part.  I complain about the 
IPA rinse, but it's much faster and easier than cutting raw stock, 
fixturing, breaking end mills, tool changes, clearing chips, multiple 
fixture setups, tumble deburring, etc.   As an added bonus, I can 3D 
print parts that can't be made by CNC or injection molding.  Small parts 
can be arrayed and they 3D print as quickly as a single part when using 
MSLA where the entire layer is exposed. Resin printing is an incredibly 
powerful tool in my engineering toolbox.





Do you have an MSLA right now? What model?


I have a Qidi Shadow 5.5S and a Qidi S Box.  Both are budget resin 
printers that do a good job, but there are probably better options now.  
We're still fairly early in the MSLA technological development.  Prices 
are falling as the quality and features improve.


I've had good results with Saraya Tech ABS-Like resin.  It prints well 
at the printer's default settings.  I hung some parts outside in direct 
sunlight all summer and there was no degradation in strength or loss of 
aesthetics.  The quality of the available resins is quickly improving 
too.  I'm hoping the supply catches up to the increasing demand and the 
prices fall to a penny a gram.


Resin printing is enabling a lot of small businesses to make great niche 
products that wouldn't be viable if they required expensive high volume 
injection molding.






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Re: [Emc-users] Replacing a handle.

[Bruce Layne]

On 10/13/21 12:02 AM, John Dammeyer wrote:

Chrome plated pot metal and if that can crack and break a 3D printed handle 
would definitely.


An FDM 3D printed crank arm would almost certainly break, regardless of 
the material used.


An MSLA (resin) 3D printed crank arm almost certainly would not break.  
I would fix this problem by creating the part in FreeCAD and printing it 
on a resin 3D printer using an "ABS-like" structural resin.


A part's strength can be measured in many ways, but in general, MSLA 
resin printed 3D parts created using a structural polyurethane resin are 
stronger than aluminum but not as strong as steel.  The polyurethane is 
as durable as a hockey puck and polyurethane is very resistant to 
cracking, unlike aluminum or the pot metal original part.


Even for home gamers, 3D printers are not just filament based. Resin goo 
MSLA 3D printers are now fairly cheap, and the resolution is almost as 
good as injection molding.  The parts are very strong and the material 
cost is around US$.03 per gram.  Part strength is isotropic so layer 
delamination isn't a problem when designing parts as it is with FDM 3D 
printing.  The biggest MSLA downside is the isopropyl alcohol part 
cleaning and UV post curing, but it's not that bad.


Someone needs to make an upgraded MSLA printer that automates the post 
processing operations.





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[Emc-users] The Code Of Conduct Fait Accompli

[Bruce Layne]

The "discussion" is apparently over and we still have the Code of Conduct.

https://linuxcnc.org/CODE_OF_CONDUCT

It wasn't much of a discussion.  Questions were asked but there were no 
meaningful answers.


At the risk of offending any programmers in the LinuxCNC community by 
appropriating programmer culture, here is my pseudo code for the 
LinuxCNC Code of Conduct Fait Accompli:



01  IMPOSE CODE OF CONDUCT ON LINUXCNC COMMUNITY
02  IF COMPLAINTS > 0 THEN GOTO 02
03  END


All of the complaints by those who didn't feel a code of conduct was 
needed have apparently now concluded and those who wanted a code of 
conduct to regulate other people's behavior have won without ever 
engaging on the issues... without ever justifying why their code of 
conduct was needed, without explaining what event might have 
precipitated the rules imposed on others, etc.


There was no need to explain who would decide what is "disinformation" 
or "conspiracy theories", or who would decide what is "other conduct 
which could reasonably be considered inappropriate", or who would decide 
what is "inappropriate language" or "inappropriate images".  There was 
no need to explain why the Code of Conduct was required when there were 
no hostile comments on this group until the Code of Conduct caused all 
of the recent animosity, resulting in exactly what it purported to prevent.


One of the things I liked about LinuxCNC was that it was a community 
effort.  Certainly there are a core group of contributors (greatly 
appreciated), but nobody was perceived as being in charge.  There was a 
spontaneous order arising from mutual cooperation.  This open source 
community functioned very well without a lot of rules, and certainly 
without any rulers.  I no longer feel that way.  At best, rather than 
everyone behaving with courtesy and respect toward others because it's 
the right thing to do, it now feels like coerced behavior.  I now feel 
that this community is under the rule of unelected and as yet unnamed 
rulers.


The process was so opaque that I still don't know if one person 
unilaterally enacted the Code of Conduct, or was there some oligarchy 
that made the decision after a secret discussion?


When someone violates one of the subjective rules in the new Code of 
Conduct, will we then learn who the rulers are... or at least who the 
enforcers are?  Or will dissidents be quietly disappeared in the middle 
of the night?


An open source community that has always operated on mutual consent is 
now operating under dictatorial decree with all objections ignored and 
unanswered.  I think that's very sad.


I don't like the subjective rules in the Code of Conduct.  They seem 
politically motivated and the vague rules can be selectively enforced.  
I also feel that the Code of Conduct will cause problems rather than 
preventing problems.  That concern seems warranted based on the hostile 
arguments we've already suffered as a direct result of the Code of 
Conduct.  Mostly, I didn't like the way the Code of Conduct was 
unilaterally decreed without discussion, and when a few people tried to 
initiate a discussion, they were ignored by the person who posted the 
Code of Conduct.  I'm left with the feeling that there wasn't any 
explanation for why the Code of Conduct was needed because there wasn't 
an actual need to regulate the behavior of a group that has been self 
regulated for decades.  The Code of Conduct couldn't be justified, so 
there was no effort to justify it.  If there was an actual need, why 
wasn't there a discussion that led to community standards that were 
established by the community?  That would have been a far less 
contentious process than someone posting the new Code of Conduct for 
everyone else to follow without prior discussion and without any 
community consensus.







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Re: [Emc-users] Code of Conduct

[Bruce Layne]

On 7/12/21 4:27 PM, Dave Cole wrote:
The argument that no professional organizations or people will be 
attracted to a project without a COC is nonsense.


LinuxCNC has succeeded brilliantly all of these years without a Code of 
Conduct, and I saw nothing that necessitated a CoC.  It seems to have 
been externally mandated without cause.




On 7/12/21 5:12 PM, Les Newell wrote:
...the list admins have had the power to ban users for a very long 
time. You agreed to that when you signed up.  They have of course used 
their fascist dictator powers to... maybe ban a few spammers.


The Terms of Service were apparently sufficient to regulate behavior, or 
more likely, were not needed because everyone acted as an adult and 
moderated their own behavior.  Why add an unneeded Code of Conduct to 
the sufficient or unneeded Terms of Service?  Nobody was being banned 
because everyone played nice... for decades.  But that's not good 
enough.  Now we have an externally mandated Code of Conduct to further 
regulate self regulated civil behavior.




The Code of Conduct is worse than a solution in search of a problem.  
It's now proven to be a divisive political tool that is a solution to a 
problem of its own creation.  I've been a member of the LinuxCNC 
community for over 15 years and have never seen such acrimony - vicious 
bickering, people leaving the community, others pulling their 
contributions...  and it all started as a result of the new Code of 
Conduct.  Given the strife it has caused, the only way to justify the 
Code of Conduct would be as a tool to divide the community along 
previously irrelevant and unseen political lines, turn us against each 
other, and drive away anyone with a differing political opinion.


I hate to see the divisive toxic politics that have recently infested 
the world now destroying the LinuxCNC community.  Are we going to see a 
fork of LinuxCNC into a red team version and blue team version?  Ugh.  
Why am I now being forced to endorse or oppose someone's political 
views?  I'm only here for the CNC.


I previously suggested that an appropriate Code of Conduct would be, 
"Y'all be cool."  If that's not enough for the LinuxCNC community, then 
perhaps it could be amended to include, "Politics are divisive and 
counterproductive to a technical open source community, so keep your 
politics to yourself."


I realize this isn't a democracy, but if it were, I'd cast my vote for 
deleting this deadly Code of Conduct before it completely tears this 
community apart.  It's caused nothing but trouble.  I miss the peaceful 
days before the Code of Conduct, when we all got along because we were 
focused on the technical issues we had in common rather than being 
forced to focus on the politics that divide us.







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Re: [Emc-users] off topic: cura profile for BIQU BX 3d printer

[Bruce Layne]

On 7/9/21 2:37 PM, Ralph Stirling wrote:

Did you get any of the options for that SV01?


I bought the SV01 from Amazon for $224 including two day shipping. It's 
bare bones.  I would have liked the silent stepper motherboard upgrade 
but it wasn't offered at Amazon.  If I need to replace the motherboard, 
I'll upgrade at that time.  It's not very noisy without the upgrade.  
It's next to me on my desk.  It's not nearly as noisy as my laser 
printer.  It doesn't bother me and nobody can hear it when I'm talking 
to people on the phone.  Probably half of the noise is from the fans and 
not the stepper motors.  Some people have used larger and slower turning 
fans to reduce the fan noise, although the stepper motor music is 
probably the more objectionable noise from a qualitative perspective.


The generic textured glass bed works very well.  I've printed a lot of 
flexible TPU in 96A to 98A durometer.  Most of it was without any bed 
heating but I now heat the bed to 60C and print the first layer with a 
nozzle temperature of 230C, then turn off bed heating to save power and 
lower the nozzle to 210C to reduce stringing after the first layer.  No 
glue stick, which makes turnover between parts very fast and easy.  Just 
TPU on glass.  Best (quality + speed) is at 50 mm/s print speed and 3 mm 
of retraction.  I have the slicer keep the print head within the infill 
of the print to avoid traversing open areas whenever possible and there 
is essentially no stringing with 98A TPU.


There are more options when buying the SV01 directly from Sovol's 
website, but there's probably a bit more of a premium price for the 
factory upgrades than there should be.  It's about the same price as 
buying the upgrades after buying the printer, but with them doing the 
labor.  I'm very happy with the inexpensive Keep It Simple bare bones 
version from Amazon.  I expected to need to upgrade the extruder, but 
I've been very pleased with the stock extruder. There's no programmed 
filament loading.  To unload and load filament, use the scroll wheel 
user interface to preheat the nozzle (I always use the ABS profile to 
get it good and hot), pull the filament tension lever to disengage the 
drive roller, press the old filament down to manually extrude some 
filament and rapidly withdraw the filament to clear the nozzle, then 
push in the new filament until 100 mm or so has been extruded from the 
nozzle.  So far, the extruder has been 100% maintenance free, and I've 
done a lot of printing with TPU, which is a worst case for jams.


The PLA test cube sample print that was on the microSD card had the 
highest print quality I've seen from a hobby grade 3D printer.  The 
print quality was almost as good as a friend's expensive Statasys 
commercial 3D printer.


The tiny microSD card in the weird location is my biggest gripe. Some 
fiddly left handed dexterity is needed to insert the microSD card.  Each 
time, I spend a minute fiddling with it.  One time, I missed the slot on 
the motherboard and the microSD card fell into the electronics enclosure 
and I was forced to remove the bottom panel to remove the microSD card.  
This would only be a minor aggravation for a print farm that prints the 
same parts, but I use this for prototyping and one-off parts that I 
design, so I'll probably get a Raspberry Pi and use OctoPrint rather 
than fiddling with the PIA microSD card.  On the plus side, the power 
switch is conveniently located on the right side of the printer instead 
of being next to the power cord on the back of the printer, so it's easy 
to turn off the power before removing the microSD card, and turn on the 
power after inserting the microSD card.


Anyone not printing flexible filaments may be better served with a 
Bowden style extruder for faster print speeds.  Properly tuned, a modern 
Bowden design can print TPU, particularly the higher durometer 
versions.  For most applications, the flexibility of the part is much 
more a factor of the wall thickness and fill percentage.  I've been 
printing a very squishy padded part with relatively stiff 98A TPU using 
one layer (.4 mm) wall thickness and 20% fill.  10% felt too squishy, 
like it was an air filled pocket. 20% infill feels like a moderate 
density closed cell foam.


With a 240mm X 280mm X 300mm build volume, I need to print something 
goofy like a waste paper basket or lampshade, although the real benefit 
for me will be volume printing a large array of parts, or maybe larger 
mechanical one-off parts such as fixtures, brackets, vacuforming plugs, 
composite fiberglass molds, etc.


My first 3D printer was an ORDbot Hadron that I built from parts. I've 
always poo-pooed the 3D printers using Delrin rollers in slotted 
aluminum for the motion control components as well as the structural 
frame, but the modern versions work very well.  It's not difficult to 
keep the slots and rollers clean in an office environment, and the 
motion is very smooth.  I initially 

Re: [Emc-users] off topic: cura profile for BIQU BX 3d printer

[Bruce Layne]

On 7/9/21 9:05 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

I also priced the pro version of cura, but $750 for a years seat at that
table is a bit steep.

I am not a happy camper this morning.


SLICERS:

A month ago, I decided that the Simplify3D slicing software that I 
bought with lifetime free upgrades, that seemed to become free minor 
upgrades with additional fees for the upcoming major release upgrade, 
which now looks more like abandonware, has fallen behind the curve and 
it's time to replace it with an open source slicer. Simplify3D was the 
only commercial software on my computer.  I evaluated several slicers 
and chose PrusaSlicer.  Here was my ordered preferences (your mileage 
may vary):


PrusaSlicer
IdeaMaker
Cura
Simplify3D

Cura and Simplify3D were approximately a tie.  I didn't like Cura's 
phone-home-to-Ultimaker operation, but Simplify3D phones home too. They 
both have user interfaces that don't always work the way I'd like and 
are counter intuitive or even a bit buggy as Gene described in Cura's 
add-a-new-printer feature.  Cura eased out Simplify3D because it's open 
source.


IdeaMaker looks and works a lot like PrusaSlicer.

PrusaSlicer manages to have a lot of features but still be fairly easy 
to use.  Everything is arranged logically, so even though there are long 
pages of options, I can scan and find what I want.  I found it easier to 
enableExpert mode.  Even though there were more options to confuse me, 
at least I wasn't looking for a hidden option.  The popup help for each 
item helps.  Simplify3D has a fairly logical layout too, but some things 
aren't where I'd expect them to be, or aren't implemented as I'd 
expect.  As an added bonus, PrusaSlicer is now slicing files for optical 
MSLA resin printers.  It may only be the Prusa resin printer now.  I'm 
still using Chitubox to slice my MSLA files, but hopefully soon I can 
use PrusaSlicer for all of my 3D printers.  Chitubox is free, but I 
don't think it's open source. It phones home, and there's no telling 
what it's reporting.  I should trap some packets and try to see for 
myself.   :-)




3D PRINTERS:

I also recently stopped trying to support my QIDI Tech FDM printers.  I 
paid $3000 for five of them three years ago, plus spending a lot of time 
and money upgrading them.  I bought them because they had dual direct 
drive extruders, dual linear rods for all three axes of motion, were 
enclosed so they could better print large ABS objects without 
differential cooling cracks, etc.  They were abandoned by the 
manufacturer, and the proprietary parts became impossible to obtain.  I 
had bought common repair parts, but other items were breaking.  I was 
robbing one printer to keep another going.  QIDI went so far as to use 
open source stepper driver PCBs but solder the header pins on the back 
side to reverse the pinout to make them proprietary so I was forced to 
buy the repair parts from them if I didn't want to unsolder the pins and 
solder them on backwards.  That's a customer hostile attitude.  
Manufacturers should make reliable products that are cheap and easy to 
maintain but QIDI deliberately made that 3D printer difficult and 
expensive to maintain.


I bought a very inexpensive Sovol SV01.  It has a much larger glass 
print bed (textured one side and smooth on the other).  It only has a 
single extruder, but unlike the QIDI extruders, this Titan clone is jam 
proof and it feeds flexible filament like a dream.  The print quality is 
much better than the QIDI, which was best in class three years ago.  The 
open architecture makes maintenance and repairs easy and the generic 
Ender compatible parts are cheap and readily available.  3D printers 
have come a long way in the last three years.  Now is a great time to 
get on board with one of the inexpensive and very capable new 3D 
printers.  I recommend keeping it simple and inexpensive.


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Re: [Emc-users] Code of Conduct

[Bruce Layne]

I've been a member of this community for approximately 14 years.  In 
that time, I've almost exclusively witnessed camaraderie with good 
people helping each other and learning together.  In the short time 
since the introduction of the Code of Conduct, I've seen arguing, 
acrimony, ad hominem attacks, people publicly leaving the community and 
almost certainly many more who left without a public announcement.


See how much better we're behaving now that we have a Code of Conduct 
regulating our behavior?  We are certainly poised for future success now 
that we have codified rules to ensure that everyone is nice to everyone 
else.


I'm an engineer.  I solve technical problems.  There are some simple 
rules for that.


1) If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it.

2) Understand what you're trying to improve.

3) Avoid random changes hoping they'll be improvements.

4) Before effecting a change, consider the larger picture to avoid 
wrecking something else.


5) If you made it worse, undo your modification because it's not working.






I might still make the odd pull request but this mailing list, I'm out.



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Re: [Emc-users] Code of Conduct

[Bruce Layne]

On 6/29/21 4:10 AM, andy pugh wrote:

It does seem a little odd. I suspect it is aimed at some manner of
behaviour that I have not (knowingly) seen on our forums.
It is a bit of a concern to think that I could be accused of breaking
the CoC for being too helpful.


I believe the Code of Conduct was designed to protect the feelings of 
people who don't know, so they ask, but are offended when someone 
"mansplains" to them in a manner they perceive to be condescending.


Unfortunately, the CoC doesn't concern itself with the intent of the 
person providing the answer.  The person asking the question decides 
whether the answer is helpful or condescending, and if the latter, the 
person trying to be helpful is punished.  That's no way to encourage 
people to try to help others.  Many of these externally applied rules of 
conduct have noble intent but often produce ignoble results.


When I don't know and I ask a question, it's because I tried to find the 
answer and couldn't.  I'm probably approaching the problem incorrectly 
and I'm hoping for a quick answer to point me in the right direction.  
If someone takes the time to explain it to me in greater detail to 
educate me rather than simply helping me to educate myself, I'm even 
more grateful they spent their time to save my time.  I try to be that 
guy, who provides a more detailed explanation because more information 
seems more helpful to me.  It seems like a welcoming gesture to someone 
new to the community. However, there are some people who want only the 
answer that they want.  We're expected to read their minds to ascertain 
exactly what they want and provide only the information they want but 
not any excess information that might imply they don't know something.  
The Code of Conduct appears to force our entire community into tip 
toeing through that mine field.





I get the feeling that this CoC was written for a somewhat different
demographic than LinuxCNC users tend to be. (By which I am mainly
referring to age).


I believe age is part of the demographic difference, but there is also a 
difference between typical engineers who are good at technical issues 
but not good at social issues.  Or, as my wife tells me, it's not what 
you said but how you said it. :-/




On 6/29/21 7:47 AM, Mark Wendt wrote:


My only question is why in the heck is this even necessary?  We're all in
this because we share the common bonds of machining, LinuxCNC, and other
related things that go along with.


Apparently, a history of peaceful coexistence is not good enough. 
There's an old saying.  You may not care about politics, but politics 
cares about you.


There may be an online community of people who enjoy LinuxCNC, who 
support each other and anyone sharing that interest is welcome, but they 
cannot be allowed to restrict their conversations to the technical and 
ignore someone else's political issues.  All interest groups must be 
expanded to include identity politics.


LinuxCNC  -->  LinuxCNC + politics
Flower Arranging  -->  Flower Arranging + politics
etc.



On 6/29/21 8:10 AM, Les Newell wrote:
I find it mildly ironic that the introduction of a code of conduct 
triggered one of the few posts I've seen on this list that breaks the 
code of conduct...


Ironic, yes, but probably not unintended.

Most people want self governance, but a small minority see themselves as 
our rulers.  They know better than we do what's best for us.  It's not 
good enough to have a group of technical people discussing technical 
issues.  We can't be allowed to ignore the important issues of our day.  
We must be forced to engage in the divisive politics of race, gender, 
sexual orientation, etc.  For our own good.  Even if it destroys the 
community.




On 6/29/21 8:14 AM, fxkl47BF via Emc-users wrote:

have one or be labeled non-conformist and be boycotted


Maybe being boycotted might not be so bad if those who boycott are the 
ones whose participation would consist of off-topic divisive politics.   :-)


If the Powers That Be insist on a code of conduct, can't we just 
formalize our unwritten code?  "Everybody be cool."




On 6/29/21 12:51 PM, Kirk Wallace wrote:
In my view, the LinuxCNC user list has been too toxic to be involved 
with for the last few years. It has been toxic long enough that the 
usual suspects have grown used to their habits and don't know any 
better. Fortunately for me, I have learned enough to fix whatever goes 
wrong with my machines or the software, but it hurts to see this drive 
away the people that have provided the foundation for this amazing 
project for the last twenty years.


It's almost as if we're reading different email lists.  I see the 
LinuxCNC community as helpful and welcoming.  On very rare occasions, 
I've seen a terse reply from someone who has seen the same question 
asked many times before, but it's almost always followed up with someone 
patiently answering the same question again for the benefit of someone 
who 

Re: [Emc-users] lathe paths with linux cnc and CAD software

[Bruce Layne]

This is my annual warning that AutoDesk isn't The Benevolent Software
Company, and they aren't in business to give you free stuff because
you're so awesome.  AutoDesk has a history of offering free or low cost
software to entice users into investing their time to learn the software
(this may be the highest cost of ownership), and once you have tens or
hundreds of designs in their proprietary CAD format, they decide to
unilaterally change the deal and you're trapped.  They did this to me
with AutoSketch, a couple of decades ago.  I had hundreds of hours
wasted and many designs were abandoned because I couldn't export them. 
AutoSketch was never a serious product.  It was used to migrate users to
AutoCAD LT, and then to AutoCAD.

FreeCAD doesn't do everything you might want, but I've been very happy
with it and I'm grateful to the open source programmers who make it
possible.  If all you want is 2D or 2.5D CAM for LinuxCNC, it may be all
you need in its current state.  FreeCAD is still under development, so
it may have the features you need by the time you need them, but that's
a risky proposition with free open source software.

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Re: [Emc-users] Bed isn't flat on my 6040.

[Bruce Layne]

On 1/6/21 4:29 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> how does one maintain access to the bed slots for hold down clamps?

That's the problem with the slotted aluminum table top.  Very handy...
until you realize it's not flat and/or level.

For a small slotted aluminum bed that was flat, I'd probably try to shim
it level.

If it's not quite flat and the top thickness allowed it, I might machine
the top of the T slot bed flat and level, just like a spoil board.

If you had convenient access to the edges of the T slots, you could
always use countersunk screws to install a UHMW (cutting board) as a
spoil board and machine it level.  Fly cutters are problematic with a
low torque and possibly out of tram spindle that would cause cupping so
I use a 1" or 1.5" diameter router bit on my 2' X 4' CNC router.  You
could use an even smaller diameter cutter on your smaller CNC router. 
Then drill a series of spaced holes coinciding with the slots and push
in T slot nuts from the side to the location you want when mounting your
workpiece.  It's not that fiddly.  Push the machine screws down to stop
the nut, lift the screw, and push the nut another 3/8" until the screw
drops into the tapped hole in the nut.  You lose the continuous 1D
adjustment range of the entire slot, but there is already a course
spacing between the slots on the other axis.

Or you could mount the UHMW bed upside down and machine clearance holes
and hexagonal nut pockets an inch apart along the slots, press in an
array of nuts, flip the UHMW over, screw it down and machine the top level.

If you really want to impress the chicks, mount an aluminum plate with
countersunk screws, machine the top flat and level, drill or mill an
array of holes and use a thread mill to tap them.  Be sure to use
anti-seize in those holes and use black oxide screws instead of
stainless because aluminum is galling and aluminum and stainless is bad
juju.  Don't use a cordless impact driver to fixture your work.

Probably twenty eleven other ways to get a flat level bed on your CNC
router... and we haven't even discussed vacuum hold down tables.   :-)





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Re: [Emc-users] Bed isn't flat on my 6040.

[Bruce Layne]

Why don't you just install a spoil board and machine it flat like most
people do with a CNC router?



On 1/5/21 10:48 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Greetings all;
>
> I find on a simple jobs tonight, that the bed isn't flat, and that I need 
> to scan it for lincurve data.
>
> But this would be a true 3d need as it needs correction in both X and Y 
> travel. lincurve isn't made to do that.  So how might that be done?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] Changed mind on motor, now for sale

[Bruce Layne]

On 11/30/20 1:56 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> ...it did a fine job, very good finish with a 4 flute 1/8" uncoated carbide 
> tool 
> plowing out the outline of these motor mounts

When using these high RPM spindle motors on the router, I try to use
single flute small diameter end mills.  That allows a higher spindle RPM
where the motor makes a bit of power without having a cut depth that is
friction burning rather than cutting.  Managing friction is very
important when milling plastics, and the Onsrud O flute carbide bits do
a good job, although they're expensive so do some slow air cuts when
writing your own G code.

I run the water cooled spindle motor between 9000 and 24000 RPM. 
Bogging it down with low RPM makes more heat than power.


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Re: [Emc-users] back to a bad cable?

[Bruce Layne]

*PRO TIP #1 -* A hotter iron is better for soldering pins in connectors
with low melting point plastic.  It sounds counter intuitive, but the
goal is to get in and out quickly.  You want to dump heat into the pin
as quickly as possible, melt the solder, and then stop heating the pin. 
A lower temperature iron will cause the pin to heat more slowly,
allowing more heat to transfer to the surrounding plastic.

*PRO TIP #2 -* Plug the connector into a mating connector before
soldering.  The heat traveling down the pin will flow into the socket in
the mating connector instead of the surrounding plastic, and even if the
plastic softens, the mating connector will keep the pins properly
aligned until the plastic is a solid again.




On 11/13/20 10:54 PM, Karl Schmidt wrote:
> Beware of the cheap solder-cup connectors they are selling on amazon and
> other places.  They are made out of the wrong kind of plastic and even
> with
> a temperature controlled iron and a quick hand, the pins can shift.
>
> If a quick jab with the iron leaves a dent - throw them out.


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Re: [Emc-users] More questions for the 3d 'spurts

[Bruce Layne]

I haven't used PETG, but I'd print that part with 5 outer layers (looks
like you're using 12-15) and 20% infill (50% maximum).  It'll print
faster and it'll probably be stronger in many respects.  An FDM printer
lays down strands of hot plastic that squish into each other.  If a part
is printed as a solid, it'll contract when it cools and there will be so
much internal stress that the part can tear itself apart.  That's
usually seen as layer separation, particularly when using high shrinkage
materials such as ABS, but most people don't print with as many outer
layers as you're using.  You may be experiencing layer separation in the
X and Y directions instead of the Z direction.

I'm not saying that's the problem you're experiencing, but I think
reducing internal stress would be a good start in the right direction.

That's one of the things I like about MSLA resin printers.  I can print
completely solid hard polyurethane objects without concerns over
internal stresses, and with no interlayer bonding weaknesses as we have
with FDM printing.  Resin printers make more heterogeneous parts that
are very strong in all directions.




-Original Message-
> From: Gene Heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
> Sent: November-12-20 9:02 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: [Emc-users] More questions for the 3d 'spurts
>
> 2 scans attached if they get thru the listserver.
>
> I am having a problem with this part, printed right side up, I am getting
> this from PETG at 250C nozzle/70C bed. The ledge in the center,
> destroyed as you can see, has an overhang of about 1.5mm to retain the
> bearing. Turned over, its destroying the bottoms of the cap screw
> counterbores. And the supports in the bolt holes are being caught and
> pulled back out of the holes, mucking up the bottoms of the counterbores
> that bolt it all together.
>
> Suggested fixes?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 



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Re: [Emc-users] freecad, latest, starter tut?

[Bruce Layne]

On 9/20/20 3:47 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Sunday 20 September 2020 01:50:10 Bruce Layne wrote:
>
>> Creating an STL from a FreeCAD part is about as simple as it can be.
>>
> How many times do I have to say it? Freecad has an export to linuxcnc 
> menu. It does not work.

You cropped the part of my reply that made it obvious that I was
replying to someone else's comment lamenting that it shouldn't be so
difficult to create an STL in FreeCAD.  I was merely demonstrating that
it isn't difficult.  I wasn't trying to tell you to create an STL to 3D
print your part.

I did try to generate G code for your part.  I drew your part by
subtracting one cylinder from another in a few seconds.  I then tried to
teach myself how to generate G code for LinuxCNC from FreeCAD.  I
thought I might be able to help you while learning a useful new tool. 
Nope.  The tutorial on the FreeCAD site was so out of date as to be
unusable.  I found a nine month old tutorial using FreeCAD 0.18 that I
thought might work with 0.19.

http://cadcamlessons.com/freecad-path-workbench-tutorial

Close, but no cigar.

The FreeCAD menus, icons and hot keys had changed but I mostly muddled
through that.  I was able to select the linuxcnc post processor and
create Default Tool 1 and set the following parameters:

horizontal feed speed
vertical feed speed
spindle speed
spindle direction
conventional milling

However, I was unable to set:

horizontal rapid speed
vertical rapid speed
tool diameter

The CAM process was clearly not ready for prime time.  It seemed buggy,
even by alpha code standards.  Some of the fields seemed to allow me to
enter a number but when I tried, the numbers were interpreted as hot
keys for the 3D view perspective.

I'll keep using FreeCAD for my 3D printers.  It's good at that.  I might
try CAM a year from now in FreeCAD, although I still prefer to write my
own G code by hand, occasionally using a G code generator for creating
pockets, bolt hole patterns, etc.



> the youtube screen is way too small to see what they are actually doing.

It's even worse for me as I'm inevitably trying to watch a FreeCAD
demo/tutorial on my cell phone, which is a frustratingly pointless exercise.





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Re: [Emc-users] freecad, latest, starter tut?

[Bruce Layne]

I'm not a professional draftsman.  I was initially intimidated by
FreeCAD, as many people naturally are.  I knew when I was glomming parts
together using geometric primitives that I wasn't doing *real* CAD, but
that inelegant method allowed me to produce simple usable parts.  Some
complex parts need to be drawn in 2D and lofted or rotated, and that's
what I do when I need a complex shape, but if I was drawing Gene's
simple part in FreeCAD it's much faster to create two cylinders and
subtract one from the other, and it would be much faster and easier for
Gene to get the part he wants that way instead of trying to talk him
through using Draft mode to draw 2D shapes (which requires selecting
working planes, etc.) and then switching to Part mode to extrude the
shape into 3D.

I totally agree that restricting ourselves to simple 3D shapes would
severely limit our capabilities, but for simple 3D shapes it's easier in
FreeCAD to stay in the 3D Part environment and simply create the
parametric part I need.  The notion of drawing 2D parts and then lofting
or rotating them as THE way to work seems to have its origins in the
days when AutoCAD was trying to embrace 3D CAD but was barking up the
wrong tree because they were adding that capability to their legacy 2D CAD.

I assume Fusion360 and Solidworks make it much easier to work in 2D and
3D.  It's not terribly difficult in FreeCAD, but I find it cumbersome to
switch gears.  If I want a rectangular plate with some holes or a disk
or tube, it's much easier to use the 3D primitives.  It's certainly much
easier to talk a newbie through the 3D process than try to convince them
to draw 2D parts and then switch to 3D to extrude them, which is similar
to telling then to use a 2D CAD program to draw their part and then
export that to a DXF and import that into a separate program to loft the
part and create the G code.

And it IS surprising how complex parts can be when constructed using 3D
primitives.  Most of us aren't doing a lot of 3D surface machining for
injection molds or art objects.  Most of us are cranking out simple
parts that are readily machinable using 2.5D methods.  Gene's part is on
the simple side but is a good example.  Designing parts from 3D
primitives is quite amenable to the types of parts that hobbyists are
usually machining.  I don't have a five axis machining center in my
basement shop, so I had no need for complex 3D CAD until I had a 3D
printer that was much less restricted in the part geometry it could
create.  In fact, for the simple parts I machine on the mill, router and
lathes, I prefer to write my own G code from scratch rather than using
CAD and CAM.





On 9/20/20 6:38 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 at 06:52, Bruce Layne  
> wrote:
>
>>  It's amazing how much can be
>> accomplished by using geometric primitives (cube, cone, sphere,
>> cylinder, torus) and using Boolean operations to add or subtract these
>> components, then using chamfer or fillet on the edges.
> I would suggest that this probably isn't the best way to work.
>
> It is typically rather more flexible to start with a sketch then
> extrude it (for milling) or revolve it (for turning).
>
> The vast majority of lathe parts can be designed from a single
> dimensioned sketch revolved about an axis.
>


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Re: [Emc-users] freecad, latest, starter tut?

[Bruce Layne]

Creating an STL from a FreeCAD part is about as simple as it can be.

Highlight the part by clicking on it in the left hand Application window.
Click File-Export
Type in the filename, select the directory where you want it (defaults
to the current location), and select STL from the list of many export
options.

There are a few aspects of FreeCAD that still aren't intuitive. 
Engraved text is one.  It's not too difficult, but it's not very
intuitive.  Like GIMP, now that I've used FreeCAD for some time and have
figured out its quirks, I'm fairly productive.  Not productive in the
manner of a CAD draftsman, but pretty good for a maker who does CAD an
hour or two a week on average.  It's amazing how much can be
accomplished by using geometric primitives (cube, cone, sphere,
cylinder, torus) and using Boolean operations to add or subtract these
components, then using chamfer or fillet on the edges.

The YouTube FreeCAD tutorials are often out of date and the user
interface improvements and new features make those out of date and
useless (and frustrating), although the current 0.19 version seems to be
stabilizing the basic features.  Another issue that confuses people is
the different navigation modes that determine the mouse functions. 
Allowing the user to switch to the mouse navigation that they already
learned in a previous CAD program makes FreeCAD flexible, but unless you
use the same navigation mode as the person making the tutorial, you'll
be lost.  Finally, way too many alleged tutorials on YouTube are
actually demos.  I can see that someone is able to do something, but the
quick clicky demo without any narration to tell me what they're doing is
closer to a magic trick than a tutorial.  Slow down, and tell us what
you're doing and why.

The best way to learn FreeCAD would be to have someone who knows it walk
you through a design.  Figuring it out on your own is probably 1% as
efficient so there's a high frustration factor.  The lack of training
materials is seriously holding back the growth of FreeCAD.





On 9/20/20 1:25 AM, Gregg Eshelman via Emc-users wrote:
> Ugh. Why can't it just do all that automatically to whatever is the currently 
> selected part of what's on the screen, or all of it if all of what's on 
> screen is one object?Save > Export > .STL
> and the software does the rest behind the scenes.
>
> On Saturday, September 19, 2020, 12:03:07 PM MDT, grumpy--- via Emc-users 
>  wrote:  
> i have used freecad enough to be a middle'n noib
> this is how i do it
> save my .fcstd so i can come back and re-edit
> in the top row select "Mesh design" in the drop down
> in the left top panel select your design, "Cut"
> in the top menu click "Meshes"
> select "Create mesh from shape"
> select "Standard"
> select "OK"
> in left top panel click on "Cut (Meshed)"
> right click and select "Export mesh"
> this creates a .stl
> then use cura to slice  
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Re: [Emc-users] Solidworks for $40.

[Bruce Layne]

On 9/17/20 2:33 PM, Glenn Edwards wrote:
> I am a member of ASME and they should be doing something like
> this- I will contact my local chapter.

You're looking at this from the end user perspective.  Yes, it would be
very appreciated if the ASME included a $4000 software license as a
benefit of membership.  I think the correct perspective for analyzing
this is the vendor's perspective as they decide who pays what for their
software.  The incremental price of software is nearly zero, so the
price of software in the marketing world is whatever the customer will
pay.  Experimental Aircraft Association members aren't going to pay for
Solidworks, so they can have it as a benefit of EAA membership.  ASME
members are the targeted market for Solidworks, so they're expected to
pay the $4,000 or $8,000 up front and $1300 per year thereafter.

I'm a very happy FreeCAD user.  It's not as polished nor as feature rich
as Solidworks, Fusion360, etc., but it does more than I need and I'm not
worried about exporting all of my designs to non-proprietary file
formats because I live in constant fear that my CAD vendor is going to
unilaterally change the rules and the designs that I created will be
held hostage and exorbitant sums will be extorted from me to continue
using the tools I know to access the designs I created.

Remember Darth Vader in Lando's cloud city?

CAD User:  We had an agreement!

CAD Vendor:  I'm altering our agreement.  Pray I don't alter it further.




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Re: [Emc-users] Mini-PC

[Bruce Layne]

On 9/8/20 12:48 PM, Dave Matthews wrote:
> A few weeks ago someone mentioned the HP 8300 SFF as having very good
> jitter numbers.  Those are an i5 that takes a $5 cable to add the
> parallel port.  Usually about $150 US on Amazon.
>
> $155 today - 
> https://www.amazon.com/HP-8300-Elite-Computer-Quad-Core/dp/B01CV9G1BO/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1=hp+8300+sff=1599583671=8-1

That's the Amazon price with Win10.  It's $81 on eBay, maybe less for
one without Windows.  Search for item number 184439631747, or more
generically, search for "HP 8300 i5 -usdt".

I can't vouch for how well it runs LinuxCNC, but the i7 version (eBay,
off lease) has been my Linux desktop PC for the past few years and it's
on 24/7.  It's been 100% reliable and with a solid state drive and
Linux, it runs like a scalded dog.  I run FreeCAD and it'll spin a
complex model, generating shaded images at more than twice the frame
rate needed for smooth persistence of vision video.  There's definitely
something to be said for a reliable PC to use for LinuxCNC in the shop.

In hind sight, I probably should have gotten good used PCs that run
LinuxCNC instead of buying a bunch of Intel motherboards so I could have
standard controllers for all of my LinuxCNC projects.  However, I was
very stoked to see that LinuxCNC 2.8.0 can be installed on a Raspberry
Pi 4.  That's very cool, and would be ideal for tiny machines like a
little desktop CNC router or a Sherline mini lathe.




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Re: [Emc-users] found a harmonic drive set of .stl's on thingiverse

[Bruce Layne]

On 8/23/20 4:32 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> The TPU hasn't arrived, and its way too 
> flexible for this from what I've found on you-tube.  Wait for a 
> different design to show up. From what I've learned, the cup of the 
> flexgear could be doubled in depth aspect ratio. Or we need a plastic 
> with more flexability, and tpu isn't it.  ABS maybe, its pretty tough 
> stuff. And higher priced too.

I'd advise printing some object such as a tire ("tyre" for Andy) using
TPU, 90 or 95 on the Shore A scale.  Print it with four outer layers and
20% infill.  You'll have a tough and durable part with some compliance. 
Print the same part with one outer layer and 10% infill.  You'll have a
very soft and flexible part.  TPU offers a large range of physical
properties, in part because of different durometers of the filament,
typically 85-98 on the Shore A scale, but much more as a result of the
part geometry, number of outer layers and infill percentage.

ABS might be a good choice if you need toughness and PLA is too
brittle.  Like TPU, the part geometry and slicer settings can greatly
alter the physical properties.  ABS is not inherently more expensive
than PLA, or at least not significantly so.  I previously sent a link to
a source of excellent quality ABS filament for 1.62 cents per gram,
delivered in the US.

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Re: [Emc-users] found a harmonic drive set of .stl's on thingiverse

[Bruce Layne]

I'm starting to use larger quantities of filament in a small but growing
3D print farm.  I'd love to find someplace where I could buy 10-100 kg
of filament per order and be assured of good quality and good pricing,
but I've been surprised that my initial investigations have been mostly
fruitless.  Maybe my search-fu is weak, but it looks like online sources
aren't much better than Amazon.

I did stumble across MakeShaper.com.  I recently placed an order for two
2.25kg reels of ABS filament.  With the discount code from their website
and free shipping, it was 1.62 cents per gram, probably the least
expensive filament I've purchased, and it prints like a dream.  It's the
only filament I've ever used that doesn't dribble when the nozzle is
preheated, but it prints very well without stringing or blobs.  It
doesn't have the styrene smell of other ABS filament when printing.  The
filament feeds reliably from the spool and the diameter in both reels is
always 1.74mm or 1.75mm - much higher tolerance than other brands.  The
84th part just finished of a 100 part order.  In 30 minutes, the part
will contract and separate from the glass plate.  I'll lift it from the
bed effortlessly, apply a few milliliters of glue juice (10 grams of
Elmer's XTreme glue stick dissolved in 500 ml of distilled water), I'll
spread the glue juice on the glass bed with a nylon bristle brush and
press Print Another Copy.  Easy peasey.  Having good filament is
important to reliable and trouble free 3D printing.  I'm sure bad
filament is the source of a lot of frustration and failed prints.

If anyone has a good source of quality 3D printing filament at a good
price, particularly TPU, I'd love to hear your suggestion.





On 8/19/20 11:34 PM, James Isaac wrote:
>
>> The white pla is not the same stuff as the black, by a hell of a long row
> of apple trees.  Where the black is a brittle as can be cold, the white
> is much more forgiving,  . . .
>
> Back in about 1977, I got told the black plastic was the first that was 
> recycled.
> The people doing the recycling needed a consistent colour in their product,
> and hid the recycling by changing the colour to black.
> The quantity of additives needed to mask the multiple colours of the source 
> plastic changed the properties of the plastic at the same time.
>
> Sounds as though the same thing is happening today.
>
> James Isaac.
>
>
> 
> From: Gene Heskett 
> Sent: August 19, 2020 10:47 PM
> To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] found a harmonic drive set of .stl's on thingiverse
>
> On Wednesday 19 August 2020 19:17:08 Gene Heskett wrote:
>
> Well, I'm back, hat in hand.
>
> The white pla is not the same stuff as the black, by a hell of a long row
> of apple trees.  Where the black is a brittle as can be cold, the white
> is much more forgiving, AND it sticks to the glass about 1000 times
> better, I just interrupted the job because I moved the glass trying to
> get the priming . . .
>
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Re: [Emc-users] found a harmonic drive set of .stl's on thingiverse

[Bruce Layne]

On 8/17/20 3:52 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

> This one is printing at the same scale as the output shaft, which I just 
> remade after finding they were to big to enter the main bearing even with 
> help from the assembly screws. So this will have a smaller bore, which means 
> I'll have to make a smaller internal spline, and that may demand a smaller 
> bearing carrier, as I need it to push the splines fully engaged, but only 
> enough clearance from pull-in that at the midpoint between the rollers, the 
> tips of the splines clear each other, this condition corresponds to the 
> minimum flex it needs to work=longest life.

Maybe you should have started your 3D printing with a baby Yoda like
everyone else.     :-)



>> 1500 mm/minute for all motion
> Thats 3x the top speed setting in merlin.

You may be seeing mm/second units rather than the mm/minute that I
specified.  1500mm/min = 25mm/sec, fairly slow for a 3D printer.






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Re: [Emc-users] found a harmonic drive set of .stl's on thingiverse

[Bruce Layne]

On 8/16/20 8:40 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:

> And it ran about 5 minutes, broke the cup of the flexgear off at the disk 
> junction. Only 1.2mm thick there, concentrating the wall flex into that 
> relatively sharp corner. Can I fix that in cura? How?

Cura should allow you to specify the number of layers.  In Simplify3D, I
can set the number of bottom layers, the number of top layers and the
number of side layers... all independently.  As Chris and I have
maintained, the outer layers largely determine part strength and the
infill doesn't.  I'm printing a small production run of structural parts
and I had the slicer use four outer layers and 20% infill.  They're very
strong ABS parts.  If I wanted rigid parts such as gears that were
resistant to impact forces or layer separation, I might specify six
outer layers, and possibly more.



> Looking at that edge with a strong lens, I see 3 layers of wall, with quite a 
> bit of air 
> too.  So I was still having plastic delivery problems even after 
> calibrating it according to Andy, where scale is set to deliver 100mm of 
> pla for a 100mm move command.

That's a good calibration method but it assumes filament that is within
specifications.  I've recently encountered some filament that I bought
on Amazon (with good reviews) that was 1.49mm in diameter instead of
1.75mm +/- .03mm.  Undersized filament will cause under extrusion.  You
should be able to compensate with a slicer setting, within reason, but
if the filament diameter is too small it may not feed reliably in some
extruders.  The software compensation can't compensate for absolute
hardware limitations.

Properly calibrated, adjacent layers of extruded filament should touch
each other.  You shouldn't be able to see any space between adjacent
layers.  The layers will typically be .4mm wide, on .4mm centers, so
they touch.  Maybe verify that your slicer knows what size nozzle you're
using.  It sounds like you've made a lot of adjustments to the settings
in Cura and in the Marlin firmware, and it would be easy to accidentally
enter a wrong value that persists and causes problems.  It might be a
good idea to return to known good values for Cura and Marlin.  The
people who have better luck 3D printing didn't need to do a lot of
configurations.



> Bruce mentioned TPU with an 85 or better shore as being more flexible but 
> I've not found that for sale anyplace. URL anybody?

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=tpu+1.75

Warning - The Priline TPU was the filament I mentioned that had an outer
diameter of 1.49mm instead of 1.75mm.  Yoyi is pretty good TPU but a bit
stringy.  The higher the durometer (Shore A value) the easier the
filament is to print because it's not as soft and stringy.  The extruder
has less trouble feeding the filament, and there are fewer problems with
stringy parts.  Each brand of TPU is different, but I generally use the
following slicer settings for TPU:

1500 mm/minute for all motion
220C nozzle temperature
No retraction
25% speed for the first layer, no cooling fan, 60C bed temperature.
100% speed for all subsequent layers, 100% cooling fan speed, 50C bed
temperature
Avoid crossing outer perimeter





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Re: [Emc-users] found a harmonic drive set of .stl's on thingiverse

[Bruce Layne]

On 8/16/20 1:07 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> the guy on y-t showing a razor blade being used in a jig, 
> hopefully to get a square cut. Not having a razor blade, or the jig he 
> was using, I cut it about half a mm long and took the hot block with it 
> sticking out to a piece of 320 sandpaper and sanded it flat, reversed 
> the tubing and sanded the other end flat.

The extruder on my 3D printer uses a short piece of 4mm OD PTFE tubing
as the heat break between the hot end and the cold end.  This part needs
to be replaced when clearing a clogged nozzle.  I designed and 3D
printed a miniature miter block that guides an X-Acto knife to make a
clean perpendicular cut so I could make a pile of replacement PTFE tubes.



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Re: [Emc-users] cura being a bitch, was printer balistics questions, unrelated to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

On 8/10/20 10:17 AM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> Is it possible to use two glass plates so you can let the parts cool
> outside of the printer while printing the next part?

Absolutely.  That would save 30 minutes per print.  That's how long it
takes for the thick borosilicate glass to cool and completely release
the part.  I can rush it and pull the part off at 20 minutes but it
requires a little bit of force that I'd rather not use.

I originally designed my small 3D print farm to use glass plates with
nickel plated steel strips siliconed to the bottom, to the sides of the
aluminum build plate, so I could use magnets underneath to secure the
glass plate so I could swap them quickly.  I decided that for production
printing, the extra 30 minutes per print wasn't a big deal and it would
be better to use high temperature double sided adhesive to
semi-permanently mount the glass plate.  I didn't want to handle a hot
glass plate or pull on the plate to remove it and possibly mess up the
bed leveling.  Handling glass plates will cause me to drop and break
one, and I'd need someplace to store the extra glass plate.

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Re: [Emc-users] cura being a bitch, was printer balistics questions, unrelated to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

On 8/9/20 10:19 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> The different support base came off the glass, not easily but a bit easier 
> than the previous run.

PLA is generally considered to be easier to print but If you printed in
ABS, the higher thermal expansion rate (that can cause warping or
delamination problems when printing) ensures that the parts will self
release from the glass bed when it cools.  Around 15 minutes after the
print has completed, you'll hear what sounds like glass cracking but
it's the ABS popping loose from the glass bed.  The cracking sounds
continue for another 15 minutes.  After approximately 30 minutes the ABS
part is completely separate from the glass bed.  There is no scraping or
prying needed.  These violent acts can knock a bed out of level and
cause print problems on subsequent prints, and could even damage the
delicate motion control components on a 3D printer.

I'm currently running a 100 part 3D print job.  Each ABS part takes
three hours to print.  After 3.5 hours, I pick the part off the bed,
squirt a couple of milliliters of glue juice (water with a small amount
of dissolved glue stick) onto the glass bed, evenly distribute it with a
nylon bristle brush, and select Print Another Copy.  Easy peasy.

PLA doesn't self release as well as ABS, but you should be able to
squirt some water around the periphery of the part and it should
dissolve the glue that bonds it to the glass build plate.  Give it 30
minutes for capillary action to float the part off the glass bed.  Even
with ABS, I'd recommend 30 minutes for the glass plate to cool.  PLA has
less contraction when cooling than ABS but the contraction will still
greatly help reduce the bond strength between the part and the glass bed.

Very little glue is needed.  I have best results when I can see only a
slightly hazy glue layer on top of the glass.  I think it helps to use a
nylon bristle brush to scrub the old glue and new glue water into an
evenly distributed emulsion.  That's a few seconds well spent to ensure
a strong first layer bond.




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Re: [Emc-users] printer errs, was printer balistics questions, unrelated to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

I agree with Chris.  I want the CAD model to represent the actual part
and not some fudge factor version of the part.  If you don't want to
tweak the dimensions of the CAD model and you don't want to try to tweak
the printer settings which can be tedious and difficult, you can easily
adjust the scaling factors in the slicer, independently for X, Y and Z. 
For a complicated part with many features, that may have you chasing
your tail, fixing one feature and wrecking another, but if you have a
simple part with only one precision feature, such as a bearing block
with loose clearance holes for mounting screws and a precision hole
where a bearing is pressed in place, you can print a copy, measure the
bearing pocket, and adjust the scaling factor for each of the three axes
and slice another part to print, all without altering the CAD file.

I don't think tramming is a thing with FDM 3D printers.  The tool length
and tool diameter are on the order of the nozzle diameter so tramming
errors should be fairly insignificant.  The extruded filament may slip a
bit to the side if dispensed along a vector that's slightly misaligned
to the Z axis but I think most of those small errors would cancel, with
only a very slight distortion to the circumference of a vertical hole. 
If you level the bed to the nozzle with three or more points, the bed
will be perpendicular to the Z axis so you should see no large scale
errors across the part's surface as you'd have if, for example, you were
fly cutting on a milling machine that wasn't trammed.





On 8/4/20 7:52 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 04 August 2020 16:13:52 Bari wrote:
>
> I finally got around to measureing the 5x5 cube I did this morning.
> X=5.31mm,10.40,15.45,20.58,25.55
> Y=5.25,10.35,15.40,20.4925.62
> Z=brim 0.70,5,61,10.54,15.57,20.43,25.39
>
> The top 5x5 has a fat spot near its bottom that reads almost 5.9. Only in 
> X.  I was not in the room at the time.  brim is too thick. Raise glass. 
> And scale.
>
> So I need to subtract a bias from xy to even get in the ball park.
> And add a teeny bit to Z.
>
> And this was after I had taken it apart to see in I could improve the 
> tramming which I did a considerable bit of, Z moves a lot easier both 
> ways now. MUCH less binding between the 3 point trolleys now.
>  But I can't find anything that could be miss-construed as bias.  Home 
> offsets, yes but no fixed subtraction to compensate for bias. Cura post 
> processor job?  Is there such a critter?
>
> Thanks all;
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] printer balistics questions, unrelated to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

Selecting a feature in the Tree View or Combo View windows on the left
side of the FreeCAD screen and pressing the space bar to hide or show
that feature works the same for me in the 0.19 app image as it did in
previous FreeCAD versions.  I also tested it to ensure that it would
hide and reveal an STL if that's what you were viewing.

It's odd that your Tree List is blank.  Whenever I use FreeCAD, the same
objects are listed in the Tree List and the Combo View.  That's probably
a clue.  I am far from a FreeCAD expert.

I'm using Ubuntu 18.04.

If you'd like to email (off list) the file you're viewing, I can see if
I can replicate the problem you're having.





On 8/4/20 7:13 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Unfortunately, that tree list is also blank in the 19 appimage. 16 shows 
> it nicely, and a click on the part links back to the tree list. 19 does 
> not. Or I haven't found the option to enable that.


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Re: [Emc-users] printer balistics questions, unrelated to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

Gene:  Send me your USPS address and I'll mail you a free glue stick
that's 99.44% coronavirus free. :-)

Or buy a glue stick on Amazon.

https://www.amazon.com/Elmers-Strength-Washable-1-4-Ounces-E590/dp/B008M56Z0O

Coronavirus not withstanding, it's seldom worth me making a 15 minute
trip to buy something like this when I can buy it online in a minute and
it's at my door a day or two later.  Can't wait for Amazon Prime drone
delivery in 20 minutes.

Use a nylon bristle brush to distribute the tiny bit of glue stick and
water on the glass plate, immediately before printing.  I think the
scrubbing of fresh glue and water results in a high surface energy
that's needed for a good bond.

The white glue experiments I tried resulted in something analogous to a
slick non-stick surface.  I was surprised by that.  It may have been the
result of the 110C bed temperature I was using for ABS.  I didn't try it
with PLA or TPU.  It failed with ABS and that's all I needed to know. 
The glue stick and water works very well for ABS, PLA and TPU.

I hope you enjoy glass & glue stick 3D printing as much as I do.  The
trick is to get good adhesion to a hot bed and good release from a cold
bed so there are no failed prints and no need to hack and pry the part
off the build plate that results in a loss of bed level that causes
subsequent prints to fail and possible damage to the printer... or at
least damage and degradation to a plastic build surface.  3D printing
requires some patience because it's slow, but it shouldn't require much
labor and the process should be repeatable and reliable.  That's
definitely an attainable goal, because I'm doing it.

Others have already done a lot of 3D printing process development.  It's
inefficient and frustrating to ignore the work of others and repeat the
painstaking development yourself.  At this point, most people buy a
cheap 3D printer from a known good source (Sainsmart should have been
good to go), watch a few YouTube videos, and have reasonable success out
of the starting gate.  It's been painful for me to see you struggling
with this.




On 8/2/20 4:28 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Sunday 02 August 2020 15:12:39 Bruce Layne wrote:
>
>> On 8/2/20 2:43 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
>>> One the right in particular, there is no room for anything. About
>>> 1mm clearance between the plate and the upright carrying the PSU
>>> too.
>> It's usually possible to pinch the wire handle on a bulldog clip and
>> lift the compressed handle out of the spring steel clip once it's
>> installed for a minimal clearance clip, although the curved back on
>> the spring steel will probably protrude more than 1mm.
>>
>>> But now its slightly
>>> cloudy with dried white school glue & lots of water mixed, so we'll
>>> see how the adhesion works.
>> Based on my experience, the adhesion will be terrible.  I tested white
>> Elmer's Glue-All and white Elmer's washable school glue and both
>> provided terrible ABS adhesion on glass.  The only glue that's worked
>> well for me is glue stick.  As I've repeatedly mentioned in this
>> ongoing 3D printing discussion, I use Elmer's X-Treme glue stick.  The
>> thinnest possible application directly to glass (applied with a pound
>> or more of normal force to a cold glass plate, with a slow steady
>> motion) works well, but even better is a small smudge of glue on the
>> glass plate with a few grams of water, evenly distributed across the
>> glass plate to form a nearly invisible glue film when dried.
>>
> I have not "been to town" with a mask to get any of that. This was a 
> small bottle of craft glue a good 15 yo I add an inch of water to and 
> shook like a rattle gun paint can to get a wee bit of glue dissolved 
> into the water.  Mowing the grass, otherwise staying safe and out of 
> sight here at the house. The Elmers is probably at CVS. This looks like 
> heck but its sticking well after about 3 turns of the brim laydown.  The 
> initial clear the nozzle by running up and back on the left edge of the 
> plate also stuck to clean glass, very close to as well as it stuck to 
> the magnetic sign mat it came with. From that, I think clean glass is 
> all it needs. OOTB and plastic wrap, it acted like it was waxed & water 
> just pooled on it.  Like a freshly waxed car.  This part is only about 4 
> hours, its other mating half is about 8 or 9 cuz its taller and I need 3 
> of each yet.
>
> Thanks Bruce.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] printer balistics questions, unrelated to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

On 8/2/20 2:43 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:

> One the right in particular, there is no room for anything. About 1mm 
> clearance between the plate and the upright carrying the PSU too.

It's usually possible to pinch the wire handle on a bulldog clip and
lift the compressed handle out of the spring steel clip once it's
installed for a minimal clearance clip, although the curved back on the
spring steel will probably protrude more than 1mm.



> But now its slightly 
> cloudy with dried white school glue & lots of water mixed, so we'll see 
> how the adhesion works.

Based on my experience, the adhesion will be terrible.  I tested white
Elmer's Glue-All and white Elmer's washable school glue and both
provided terrible ABS adhesion on glass.  The only glue that's worked
well for me is glue stick.  As I've repeatedly mentioned in this ongoing
3D printing discussion, I use Elmer's X-Treme glue stick.  The thinnest
possible application directly to glass (applied with a pound or more of
normal force to a cold glass plate, with a slow steady motion) works
well, but even better is a small smudge of glue on the glass plate with
a few grams of water, evenly distributed across the glass plate to form
a nearly invisible glue film when dried.






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Re: [Emc-users] printer balistics questions, unrelated to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

I'd 3D print some low profile clips for the glass plate, or (my
preference) use high temperature double sided adhesive to secure the
glass plate to the print bed.  I initially thought I'd be swapping glass
beds between prints, but in practice, I prefer having the glass bed
fixed to the printer.  KISS.  I'd need to wait for the glass bed to heat
so I wouldn't save much time by avoiding the cool down phase, and
handling a hot glass plate and swapping glass beds in general sounds
goofy to me.  I'd eliminate the clothes pins or binder clips ASAP.  It's
much better to have nothing sticking up where the nozzle can crash into it.

My 3D printers were fine with no retuning after I added some thick
borosilicate glass, but my printers only move the bed vertically in .2mm
steps when printing.  The X and Y stages are suspended above, running on
linear guide rods.  If you were concerned about altered acceleration on
your Ender 3 clone, I'd try printing two small test cubes, separated by
100mm in the Y direction, at 10% higher speed than you'd usually use. 
If the acceleration was too much for the stepper motors or the print
quality was adversely impacted by the momentum of the added mass, only
then would I try to reduce the acceleration.  I'm too old to fix
problems that don't exist or otherwise looking for dragons to slay.

In practice, there is a high gear ratio so the 3D printer doesn't need
much torque, and most of the torque requirements are when the motors are
at low RPM where stepper motors have their most torque.  I think these
glass bed upgrades are usually done without changing the motor parameters.



On 8/2/20 10:59 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Greetings all;
>
> Several question mark below.
>
> Those glass plates for my ender-3 Pro's build plate use have arrived, and 
> I'm somewhat taken aback by the mass of a 230x230mm by 4mm piece of 
> glass. This at least doubles, likely more, the weight the y motor has to 
> manhandle, in my mind affecting the ballistics of its movement. No glass 
> clips or instructions came with it although the glass was packed to 
> survive a tactical nuke, So I'll raid the laundry room for some spring 
> clothes pins. Plastic, lighter than the old wooden ones, but I stuck a 
> couple on the front of the bed and the heat isn't bothering them.
>
> The stock Merlin driver has some adjustments for both acceleration and 
> jerk. Accel is currently set at 500, sounds pretty instant to me and 
> jerk is set at 8 but thats a new term for me and I have no idea of how a 
> change to that effects the machine.
>
> Given the increased mass to move, is it even possible to keep the working 
> velocities at the currently set values, or is there a way to determine 
> what is optimum for this added mass it has to move?
>
> I'm assuming changes in the ballistics would have to be set in the x axis 
> at the same time to keep it from bending corners.
>
> Or, would I be better off spending the sheckles for one of the improved 
> 32 bit driver boards I see being offered? Power supply might come into 
> play too as its only 24 volts now, which will effect its accel and 
> ballistics envelope too.
>
> Discussion, educational/reference URL's all welcome.
>
> Thanks all.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] Default Path Blending

[Bruce Layne]

I've been using FreeCAD and I do like it quite a bit.  It's very
powerful.  The two downsides I see:

1) It's currently at version 0.19.  It's not polished software.  It's
definitely usable as is, but I save my work often.  It does crash
occasionally, usually when I do something stupid but sometimes for no
reason that I can discern.

2) Like GIMP, the open source user interface isn't the most intuitive. 
Engraved text in FreeCAD is a good example.  Switch from the Part
workbench to the Draft workbench.  Select the ShapeString tool.  Enter
the text, text height and set the path to a TrueType font (it doesn't
use the system installed fonts).  Switch back to the Part workbench,
select the shape string that was just created and then select the
Extrude tool to make it into a 3D object.  You can then make a union of
the 3D text with another 3D object for raised text, or make a cut of the
3D text from another object for engraved text.

I've been using FreeCAD to put website addresses on the custom parts I'm
designing that are 3D printed on my MSLA resin 3D printer.  The
resolution is good enough that a simple font would probably be legible
in 1mm tall font (not with my old eyes!), although I usually make the
text 2mm or 3mm tall.

The above FreeCAD disadvantage #1 is helping with disadvantage #2.  The
less intuitive user interface features are evolving to be more intuitive
as the software matures, and that's a good thing.  Unfortunately, it
introduces a third disadvantage:

3) The FreeCAD demo videos on YouTube are quickly obsolete.  Many times,
I've found a video that explains some feature I want to use in FreeCAD,
but I'm using a later version of FreeCAD so the demo is fairly useless
because not only have the buttons all moved, many have disappeared to be
replaced by different buttons as a more intuitive method is
implemented.  Overall, it's moving in the right direction but FreeCAD
still has a few growing pains.

I'd be a jerk to complain that the completely awesome free open source
software isn't perfect, and doesn't work exactly the way I think it
should.  I currently have three different parts that I designed in
FreeCAD, printing on three different 3D printers.  I've only scratched
the surface of what FreeCAD can do (finite element analysis, anyone?),
but I'm definitely a satisfied customer.




On 7/31/20 3:09 PM, Todd Zuercher wrote:
> Other free Linux based options might be Inkscape with G-code Tools, or 
> Freecad.  But both of them might be more painful to learn/use than what 
> you're doing now.   Of those 2 Freecad is probably the most powerful, but 
> also the most cumbersome and difficult to use.


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Re: [Emc-users] new problem w/ender 3 pro

[Bruce Layne]

On 7/30/20 10:55 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> And since the ender-3 is bigger, meaning the non-magnetic peel and stick 
> glue coated pads that come with the PLA are both too small, and covered 
> with a peel and stick bottom which would preclude removing it from the 
> plate once cooked into place, where do I obtain a kit to convert it 
> thats known to be "the right stuff"?

There are hundreds of products when I searched eBay and Amazon for
"Ender 3 glass".  I'd avoid the simple glass plates that require binder
clips, unless you're planning to use high temperature two sided adhesive
to bond the glass to the aluminum table so you won't need any clips.

Many of these upgrades are cheap, even by our standards, Gene.   :-)

$15 is a small price to pay for consistently reliable 3D prints.

There are some glass print surface upgrade kits that also include larger
bed leveling wheels, a Capricorn PTFE Bowden tube upgrade, etc.  It
might be nice and cost effective to do several upgrades at once.



> I had to remove the tab on the z switch to lower it another 
> 2mm in order to get enough spring tension to make the plate levelers 
> actually work.

You'll probably need to lower the Z homed bed height when you add the
thickness of a glass plate, prior to leveling the bed again.  That's
probably covered in the glass print bed upgrade instructions.  If not,
it should be fairly obvious to someone who builds LinuxCNC machines.



You shouldn't have needed to do most of the heroic things that were
required to get your 3D printer working.  I'd blame most of that on a
fly-by-night manufacturer not properly configuring your printer before
shipping.  That may have been the result of trying to save that last $20
compared to buying from a well established supplier with a good
reputation, but that's water under the bridge for this 3D printer.

You shouldn't need to keep chasing your tail, tweaking settings and
having ongoing unpredictable bed adhesion.  Once you're in the
Goldilocks zone where this bed adhesion is just right, the process
should be repeatable from one print to another.  A glass print surface
should do that for you.  Keep the bed level (easy if you aren't prying
on it to get a print to release), keep a thin coating of glue on glass,
and 3D printing gets a lot easier.  Then, all you'll be fighting is the
occasional mystery nozzle jam every couple of reels of filament or so. 
After the first couple of cleared nozzle jams, this ten minute repair is
not intimidating.  I try to buy filament that gets good Amazon reviews
for unspooling without jams to ensure reliable printing.

I shipped 100 parts last week to a guy who is selling them on his
website, and he just ordered another hundred parts today.  I print these
large flat parts one at a time, three hours of printing per part, and I
couldn't do this project if my 3D printing wasn't reliable.  The ABS
parts pop off the glass plate 15 minutes after the part has finished
printing.  I pick up the part, squirt a couple of drops of Glue Juice
that I made by dissolving a few grams of glue stick in a pint of water
onto the glass surface, and I reactivate the glue surface by scrubbing
the glass for a few seconds with a nylon bristle brush.  The turnaround
between parts is less than a minute, and these large ABS parts never
warp or delaminate from the print surface.




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Re: [Emc-users] new problem w/ender 3 pro

[Bruce Layne]

The various build surfaces are good for an introduction to 3D printing,
but I've found them to change considerably over time with wear.  This
results in a variable that prevents a consistent process.  Quality is
achieved by doing the same thing, the same way, every time.  That's why
I've consistently urged you to switch to a glass build plate, preferably
borosilicate glass, with a very thin coating of glue stick and water. 
The water evaporates leaving a very thin layer of glue that provides a
uniform and consistent build surface that's strong enough to prevent
even ABS from warping and separating from the build surface.  When the
bed cools, the parts self release.  There is no scraping or gouging that
can not only damage a build surface but also knock the bed out of
level.  These are relatively delicate little CNC machines.  Hacking and
prying with a putty knife is not conducive to repeated success or
machine longevity.

The first thing I do with a new 3D printer is preheat the bed to 110C
and peel off the plastic build surface, leaving the adhesive on the
aluminum build plate which I use to adhere a new glass build surface. 
There are also clips that can be 3D printed to secure a glass build
surface to the bare aluminum built plate.





On 7/30/20 7:40 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Greetings all;
>
> I gave up putting off sleep and with the last of 3 motor top plates 88% 
> done, went to bed around 2ish, knowing it would be done and cold by the 
> time I woke up, which it was.
>
> But the magnetic sheet used for a build surface was welded to the hot 
> plate pretty bad, and by the time I had gotten the putty knife under it 
> and pried it loose, and lifted free, both the bottom of the mag sheet 
> and the tan pad glued to the build plate were surface damaged.  Has 
> anyone else encountered this?
>
> As time and use have gone by, part adhesion to the build surface has 
> improved to the point the brim has become permanently stuck, sometimes 
> coming off with the next part so that hasn't been a huge problem yet, 
> but is that how it works, making the whole build plate an assembly one 
> should keep on hand?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] 3d printed nut pockets #$%^

[Bruce Layne]

On 7/25/20 1:10 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> ...just model threads in the plastic.

This trick works much better on the newer high resolution MSLA resin
printers that sell for as little as $209.  I used FreeCAD this morning
to design a rough functional prototype to test that has 1/2-28 threads. 
Two of them are currently printing on my MSLA printer with about 40
minutes remaining.  I used high temperature resin for these parts.  I'm
sure several of you guys, including Gene, can guess what I'm
prototyping.  I attached an image.  Hopefully it made it through the
list server.

I've printed gradually tapering nut pockets on both the FDM and MSLA 3D
printers and pushed in stainless nuts.  That works very well, and it's a
cheap trick.  I designed some large thumb wheels with an M3 nut pocket
that's over 20mm deep.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4383435

In theory, horizontal holes and hexagonal pockets have overhangs that
are greater than 45 degrees and that's usually a no-no for 3D printing,
but in practice, small holes for screws or nuts can be bridged by the
filament on an FDM printer and don't need support.





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Re: [Emc-users] Cutting plastic film

[Bruce Layne]

While I wouldn't want to discourage anyone from getting a CNC router or
laser, as a little exercise in outside the box thinking, 3D printing
these insulator sheets would be a fairly trivial exercise.  I sometimes
print first layer calibration test squares on a flat glass bed.  Dial in
the bed leveling and the single layer ABS prints peel off the bed and
are very thin and tough.  You could easily add layers to create whatever
dielectric strength you need for your application, but I'd bet one layer
would probably be enough for common purposes.  These thin parts would
print very quickly.

3D printers (filament and liquid resin) are quickly becoming my toolbox
full of hammers and all of my problems are looking like nails to be
smashed by 3D printed awesomeness.





On 7/25/20 7:09 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> On Sat, 25 Jul 2020 at 12:05, N  wrote:
>
>> Square outline with four or six square holes is the most important but it 
>> might be I want to cover another surface with slighlty more complicated form 
>> and mor holes. Need only four of them right now for prototypes and maybe 
>> 30-40 later on.
> Laser cutting (excuse to buy one?)
>
> Or laser-print the outline onto the film and then cut on the lines
> with scissors.
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Calculating table acceleration. Was: Need help with Bostomatic BD18-2 to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

On 7/22/20 11:43 PM, Thaddeus Waldner wrote:
> 1g = roughly 32in/s^2

1 g is 32 ft/sec^2

Feet, not inches.



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Re: [Emc-users] Need help with Bostomatic BD18-2 to linuxcnc

[Bruce Layne]

On 7/21/20 10:09 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:
> If Gravity is 32 ft/sec^2 then it's also 2.7 in/sec^2.

Only if there are 12 feet in an inch, but there are 12 inches in a foot,
so one g is 384 in/sec^2.




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Re: [Emc-users] mailing list for ender 3 pro owners?

[Bruce Layne]

On 7/17/20 6:03 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> ...added 5.00 to the extruder feed, and gave it another go.  After 
> 4 restarts it laid down the first two layers of a raft, with no missing 
> lines and only one little bump, all while running at 20 lb paper 
> clearance, so the lines it was laying down were about 50% coverage, but 
> no missing gaps because it ran out of PLA.

Rather than adjusting the extrusion rate to get a good first layer at
the nozzle height you used to level the bed, I'd first calibrate the
nozzle to extrude the correct amount of material.  Andy described how to
do this earlier in this painful saga, where you mark the filament 120mm
back, have it extrude 100mm of filament, measure how much filament it
actually extruded, and then adjust the extrusion multiplier until it's
extruding 100mm.  Once the extrusion rate is properly set, leave it
alone.  Fix the first layer adhesion by tweaking the nozzle height using
the bed leveling nuts, or by adjusting the first layer height and/or
first layer extrusion multiplier in Cura.

Your 3D printing experience has been needlessly difficult.  Maybe the
default settings were grossly incorrect when you received your 3D
printer but that's very rare these days.  Most people don't mess with
the basic settings.  Most of us get a new machine, level the bed and
start printing.  There is generally a little bit of a learning curve
getting good first layer adhesion on your first 3D printer, but none of
the ongoing problems you've experienced.  That sounds like hobby 3D
printing ten years ago when the burden was on the hobby builder.  These
days, 3D printers are built in factories and are almost consumer
appliances with no need to adjust basic settings.  It's as if you bought
a new car and it idled rough so you are building your own engine
computer to fix it.

I'm cheap, but I've learned that there is value at every level and it's
usually the case that saving that last 10% is a negative value
proposition.  I buy low cost items but usually not the lowest priced
item, particularly on something as complex as a 3D printer.  I don't
want to spend $220 on a 3D printer that was built in small numbers by
people with little experience with 3D printers, who may not have
configured it properly, used the very lowest quality components with no
warranty or customer support, when I have a much better experience by
spending $30 more.  If I need to spend $150 and three weeks of my time
fixing problems, saving $30 was a bad deal.

I just finished 3D printing 4kg of ABS parts for a small production run
for a friend.  I did have two clogged nozzles but those are now an easy
three minute one dollar repair.  I put another 3D printer into service
in my small 3D print farm and the set screws backed out in an X axis
idler pulley so I had to fix that.  I'll Loctite and properly torque the
set screws on all of my 3D printers to avoid that failure in the
future.  Otherwise, that 430 hours of printing those 132 parts was
pretty much a matter of picking a part off the glass plate (they self
release when cool in 15 minutes), adding a tiny amount of glue juice,
distributing it on the glass plate with a nylon bristle brush and
selecting Print Another Copy.  Once your 3D printer is adjusted
properly, hardware and software, it should be reliable.

I'm getting better with FreeCAD and I always preview the job using
Simplify3D after slicing it.  Cura allows previewing too, so you can
ensure that it's printing what you want, the way you want it to print.

I hope your 3D printing becomes a lot easier and a lot more fun soon,
Gene.  It shouldn't be this difficult.  I wish you could start fresh
with a known good configuration.

The only time I use a raft is when I'm printing a large number of very
small parts with little contact area on the build platform, where any
part that failed would ruin the entire print job.  Glue on glass makes a
reliable first layer adhesion with ABS, PLA or TPU.






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Re: [Emc-users] Freecad

[Bruce Layne]

Soon after the introduction of Fusion360, I inquired about a Linux
version on the Fusion360 forum.  I expressed the belief that Autodesk
must be using cross platform development tools, and while it wouldn't be
as simple as clicking a Compile For Linux button, it shouldn't be too
difficult to provide a Linux version.  I was met with extreme hostility
by the forum moderator, who was an Autodesk employee.  I was told that
Autodesk would not be releasing a Linux version of Fusion360 because
Linux users don't pay for software.  I was basically treated as if I was
a burglar who rang someone's doorbell and asked if they would be going
out that evening.  It was analogous to Microsoft's infamous "Linux is
cancer" comment.

I explained that I purchased a $1200 license for Eagle electronic CAD
software (plus recurring maintenance fees) specifically because there
was a native Linux version.  It didn't matter.  Apparently the official
Autodesk position was, "It wouldn't be that difficult to create a Linux
version of Fusion360, but we won't, because we hate you."

I'm a satisfied FreeCAD user.  Open source for the win.





On 6/29/20 4:45 PM, andy pugh wrote:
> On Mon, 29 Jun 2020 at 21:19, Chris Albertson  
> wrote:
>
>> I bet they open this up to everyone.   Mac is moving to Arm processors and
>> it would be easier for Autodesk to open up running in a browser then to
>> poort to Arm.
> I doubt that there will be much difficulty porting. Apple have done
> this twice before, and they know how to set up the tools and
> compatibility shims.
>
> LinuxCNC compiles for ARM with only very minor tweaks.
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Printer working, need involute gear designer

[Bruce Layne]

I still say you guys need to print gears on an MSLA resin printer using
a dense high durometer polyurethane structural resin.  They'd not only
look like high quality injection molded parts, they'd be as strong as
injection molded parts.  Email me an STL and a USPS mailing address and
I'll see what I can do.

I finally learned how to engrave text in FreeCAD tonight, so I could put
your name on your gear for you.   :-)




On 6/18/20 1:09 AM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> The theory with printed gears is that with helical gears there is more
> material in contact so the stress on the teeth is reduced and that for
> plastic we need this extra strength.   But what I found is that teeth never
> fail.  The hubs fail first.
>
> The better reason for helical gears is that they are quieter.  But if they
> move slow, all gears are quiet.
>
> Try breaking stuff, it's fun.  especially if the material cost only 2 cents
> per gram.  If you have parts that did not come out as you like.  Try
> crushing them in a vice, whacking with a hammer or screw it to a shaft and
> see what it takes to break the set screw.
>
> On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 9:03 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday 17 June 2020 22:28:22 andy pugh wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 at 03:04, Gene Heskett 
>> wrote:
> Note, these are a daft idea. But I have actually seen a 9 foot
> diameter triple helical in my dad's old workplace. He did need to
> explain to me why it was silly, and why they refused to replace it
> and specced a double instead.
 That's easy, the teeth in the middle were carrying twice the thrust
 load.
>>> It isn't that it is that it is kinematically redundant, one of the
>>> sets of teeth will see no load at all.
>> Or, given manufacturing tolerances it could even dance from one set of
>> teeth to the other. I was assuming a perfect make, where the outside
>> rows of teeth would be carrying half the thrust load per side that the
>> middle row was carrying by itself.  But it never got a chance to wear in
>> and achieve even that.
>>
>>> (Though possibly, over time, they might wear to share equally)
>>
>> Cheers, Gene Heskett
>> --
>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>>  - Louis D. Brandeis
>> Genes Web page 
>>
>>
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>>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] q for Chris on 5mm cal routine

[Bruce Layne]

On 6/16/20 10:23 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

> I've not been anyplace to get a glass plate yet. At my age & health, I'm 
> steering as clear of this damned virus as I can.

Good plan.  Stay healthy.

https://www.amazon.com/Glass-Print-Borosilicate-Printer-235x235x3-7mm/dp/B07JKGNB6W

Plenty of options on eBay when searching for "Ender 3 glass".



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Re: [Emc-users] q for Chris on 5mm cal routine

[Bruce Layne]

Modern window glass is cheap and usually flat enough for 3D printing. 
Mirrors need to be flatter to avoid reflective distortions and a pack of
12"X12" mirror wall tiles are a cheap optically flat surface.  I
recommended borosilicate glass because it's formulated to have a very
low coefficient of thermal expansion.  It's used in labware that can be
placed directly over a burner, and it's used in furnace doors that don't
break from thermal expansion over a very wide range of temperatures. 
The borosilicate sheets I get at McMaster-Carr are very flat.

Glass is a solid.  It's an amorphous solid.  There's no crystalline
lattice structure but it's definitely a solid, now, and a thousand years
from now.  It only flows as the glass transition temperature is
approached and a 3D printer won't get anywhere near that temperature.

Some people get a piece of glass that's frosted on one side so they can
3D print with reportedly better adhesion and a matte finish on the
frosted side and turn the glass over to get a glass smooth finish on the
bottom of their prints when printing on the smooth side.

I'm intrigued when I see videos where people pull their spring steel
sheet off the magnetic bed and flex it to pop the prints loose, but
these are covered in some polymer finish and there is some wear to the
surface.  They're replaceable parts, so I assume the adhesion gradually
decreases over time and the build plate is replaced when the prints
start failing.  I don't like processes like that.  Glass is forever,
unless you drop it and break it.  I leave mine on the printer so that's
not a problem.

This virtual community is great and there are many fabulous ideas
shared, but it's a shame we can't meet in meat space.  Chris or I, and
probably many others on this list, could have your 3D printing problems
sorted in no time.  Much is lost in my lengthy posts.  In the real
world, I could show you how easy it is to print on glass, and how
reliable the process is once it's dialed in and working.  I CAD my parts
in FreeCAD, slice the STL file in Simplify123, copy the file to the
microSD card (no root privileges required), plug the card into the
printer, put a thin film of glue on the glass where the part will be
printed and I select the file from the front panel menu to 3D print it. 
No gnashing of teeth.  No babysitting the printer.  No parts failing to
adhere to the print bed.  No parts stuck to the bed after printing. 
Just like it ought to be.

Again, if you need to apply violence when removing a part from the print
bed, the bed probably isn't level after that which will cause the next
print to fail.  Once the process starts downhill, it's a race to the
bottom after that.  If you truly grok how the process works, it's not
difficult to get the printer in its happy place and keep it there.





On 6/15/20 8:04 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> The glass idea seems like a good one, but is it flat enough?  Glass as 
> you should know isn't a solid, but a supercooled liquid and will flow 
> sorta by the same mechanism that lets a glacier move over time, often 
> being twice as thick at the bottom of a light as it is at the top after 
> hanging vertically for 100 years.  Or is that why you said borosilicate?  
> Its more stable?


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Re: [Emc-users] q for Chris on 5mm cal routine

[Bruce Layne]

If you're zeroing the nozzle .0005" above the bed and getting a
transparent first layer, there's a good chance the nozzle is too close
to dispense a bead of plastic, because that's exactly how it looks.  You
should be able to use a slightly thicker shim to zero the nozzle and
fine tune the first layer height as a setting in the slicer.  That way,
the hardware settings remain standard and you can have different slicer
profiles for printing different materials if you should need slight
changes in first layer height, although the defaults should work well if
the hardware is dialed in properly.  If you're dragging the nozzle too
close to the bed and you're trying to fix that by arbitrarily cranking
up the extrusion rate, that's a recipe for a clogged nozzle and those
are no fun.  I'd recommend the process that Andy described where you
mark 120mm back on the filament, tell it to dispense 100mm of filament,
measure the filament to the mark and adjust the extrusion rate until it
dispenses 100mm and leaves 20mm above the extruder.

The plastic bed surfaces vary in their ability to accept a first layer
and the surface of the ones I've tried seem to be constantly wearing out
with every print so the print surface keeps changing and what worked
before no longer works.  Quality is doing the same thing every time, and
I never found that to be possible with a plastic print surface.  The
first thing I do with a new printer is preheat the bed to 110C to soften
the plastic sheet adhesive and peel off the plastic sheet.  I now leave
the adhesive on the table and use it to adhere a sheet of borosilicate
glass.  If not, then the glass can be held in place with binder clips,
but be careful not to crash a nozzle into a binder clip.  The glass
works great with the jumbo size Elmer's X-treme glue stick, with PLA
(bed temperature of 40C) or ABS (bed temperature of 110C).  It takes
only a few seconds to apply a thin film of glue to the room temperature
glass bed and cleanup requires only water and a paper towel.  Prints
stick great.  ABS pops off when it cools.  If the PLA doesn't release
enough when cool, a teaspoon of water around the outside of the print
will float the part off the bed in a few minutes, and you'd be watering
the glass bed anyway to clean off the glue after every print.  If you
are having trouble getting prints to stick, or you need to use force to
remove parts after they've printed, then you're doing it wrong.  If you
don't want to order a borosilicate glass bed for your printer, you can
get a sheet of window glass or a mirror tile at your local home store. 
They'll probably cut it to fit your printer.

I've been doing production printing lately and I'm definitely not
messing around with problematic first layer adhesion.  Get it right and
it's easy peasey, and reliable enough that I'll start a print and walk
away while it's preheating.  When printing more than a few small parts
with little surface area, I use a thin raft because if just one of those
parts doesn't adhere, the entire array of parts is scrap.  The raft is
good insurance.

As Chris said, CAD is the way to 3D printing happiness.  To unlock the
power of 3D printing you need to be able to design your own simple
parts.  CAD isn't as difficult as it was.  It's a trick that even an old
dog like me can learn.  I write G code for my LinuxCNC machines by hand,
but that's not possible with 3D printing.  You need to be able to
generate an STL file to feed into the slicer program.





On 6/15/20 6:46 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Monday 15 June 2020 16:10:41 Chris Albertson wrote:
>
>> Have you followed the link to the documents from Cura's "help" tab?  
>> It is really excellent.
>> The help link takes you here:
>> https://support.ultimaker.com/hc/en-us/sections/360003548339-Ultimaker
>> -Cura Every printer setting is explained with examples showing parts
>> made with and without the settings enables.
>>
>> I don't think anyone is using printable PDF files for docs anymore
>> because PDF is so hard to read on different sized screens.  They use
>> formats that reflow and allow different font sizes.
>>
> Thats html, and a right pain in the rear orifice to get right both on 
> screen and on paper. Additive colors that look great on screen are 
> poorly translated to the printers subtractive color palates so you do 
> not end up with an easily readable document in hand very often.  Perhaps 
> my blood is contaminated with printers ink, as a young teen 70+ years 
> ago I hung around the local print job shop who had both a darkroom and a 
> Heidelburg windmill job press and I KNOW what quality color printing can 
> look like. We are not getting it today from a printer I can afford.
>
> Anyway, change subject, to see thru prints because the 3d isn't using 
> enough string. Its getting better as I raise the extruder steps/mm. Im 
> now making the third of those fan duct attachments, but this time the 
> bed was zeroed on some .0005" alu foil.  And the extruder was 

Re: [Emc-users] Design for the materials and process

[Bruce Layne]

On 6/6/20 3:19 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> lets 
> concentrate on why the teeth are being rendered by the infill, no 
> surface walls for smoothness at all.  Inside or out, its all infill.

I think Gene correct, at least in this statement.  I don't think his 3D
printer is under extruding and I don't think there are gross dimensional
errors.  I think the weird rough finish in his image is gyroid infill
with no outer layers.

Does Cura have a way to restore a default setup?  If not, can someone
send Gene a Cura profile that works?  Something like 2 or 3 outer
layers, .2mm layer height and 20% infill.

I still don't know why Gene is printing these mistakes instead of
previewing the print in Cura and fixing the obvious problems before
printing.




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Re: [Emc-users] pix too big, rejected, so Chris is only other receiver.

[Bruce Layne]

In my experience, the plastic build sheets that ship with most of the
low cost printers are OK for several PLA prints but the surface degrades
quickly.  The adhesive backing fails and the plastic peels off the build
plate when trying to print ABS on a 110C bed, and that's a great
opportunity to install a sheet of borosilicate glass over the tacky
adhesive.

As I previously mentioned, a jumbo sized Elmer's glue stick can cover
the entire bed in less than a minute.  You only need glue where you're
printing.  You do not want a thick gloppy mess of glue.  You want the
thinnest uniform layer possible.  It should look cloudy on the glass. 
Apply glue stick to the room temperature glass plate.  After printing,
ABS parts cool, contract, and pop off the plate.  PLA parts come loose
after a few minutes soaking in water, which you use to clean the glass
plate between parts.  The glue is easily removed from the build plate
and from the part with water.  No messy hair spray buildup.

If you've struggled removing a previous print, you may have knocked the
bed out of level.  Problems removing a part lead to problems with the
next part not sticking to the unlevel print bed.

It's important to focus on the fundamentals when 3D printing.  When it
works, it works well.  When it doesn't work, it seems that nothing
works.  A methodical approach will yield positive results.  Getting in a
hurry and putting the cart before the horse will lead to frustration and
failed prints.  It's similar to competitive shooting, where slow is
smooth and smooth is fast.  The fast path to 3D printing success is to
slow down.  Once you've mastered the fundamentals, 3D printing is much
faster than CNC machining and the success rate is higher.





On 6/5/20 3:17 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> But then the raft comes loose but intact before its finished its laydown.
>
> 92% iso alky isn't getting it really clean of hair spray, whats next? 
> fine sandpaper? I have up to 2000 grit.  Acetone?  The middle of the 
> plate is losing its textured feel but is otherwise undamaged.


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Re: [Emc-users] Design for the materials and process

[Bruce Layne]

On 6/4/20 8:01 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Someone was right, I did have "mold" checked.

You can save yourself all kinds of grief if you get in the habit of
previewing each print in Cura before printing it, so you can see exactly
what the printer will print, layer by layer.  It's a great way to spot
support material where you don't want it, unsupported portions of the
part that will cause a print to fail, mistakes in a part you created,
mistaken configurations of the slicer parameters and gross errors like
telling the slicer to print a mold instead of the part.

I'd also second the advice to print simpler objects to learn how the
printer works.  I bought my 3D printers for serious structural parts and
I'm not into printing baby Yoda, but it's very helpful to first print
the known good G code file the manufacturer supplies on the SD card so
you aren't trying to learn SCAD, understand the various file formats,
teach yourself Cura, and learn all of the tricks of 3D printing at the
same time.  That's too steep a learning curve, even for quick witted
youngsters (which we are not).  It's tempting to get a new tool and
immediately attempt to press it into service making the parts you need,
but you'll run sooner if you don't try to run before you learn to crawl.

If you want a resin 3D printed pulley (60mm / 2.5" OD or less), email me
the STL and your USPS address.






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Re: [Emc-users] LinuxCNC 3Dprinting

[Bruce Layne]

On 6/4/20 4:50 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> One more question.  How do you post-process the printed parts?  Do you use
> a separate UV lamp or sunlight.  Same with cleaning? Just use a bucket of
> alcohol?  I know they make SLA post-processing equipment, ultrasonic
> cleaners, and UV booths.


I'm still experimenting with post processing.  I'm fairly new at resin
printing so probably not the best source of information.  I want to be
able to run limited production so I want to simplify the process as much
as possible and automate it as much as I can.

For cleaning the printed parts, I'm having the best results with
isopropyl alcohol.  I spray it on and scrub gently with my gloved hand
and then spray the part again and let the IPA rinse drip off and allow
the part to air dry.  I had seen some encouraging videos and posts
online from people getting good results with a detergent such as Simple
Green in an ultrasonic cleaner so I bought a larger ultrasonic cleaner. 
The first parts out of the cleaner looked very good but every part after
that was progressively worse.  The part surfaces were increasingly
cloudy and there was some gritty orange precipitate in the bottom of the
ultrasonic tank that would settle on the parts.  I don't want to drain
the ultrasonic tank each time or I'd be better served by spraying IPA on
the parts.  Some resins apparently don't like aqueous cleaning.  At the
very least, the cleaned parts should be allowed to dry overnight before
the UV post cure.

I thought I'd be clever and UV post cure the parts in the final rinse
tank.  I was planning to ultrasonically wash the parts, rinse the parts
in a tank of deionized water, then do a final rinse in another tank of
DI water that's agitated with a submersed pump.  After a minute of
agitated rinsing, an Arduino would turn on the UV light in the lid of
the rinse tank to UV cure the part underwater.  I did some research and
others were UV curing under water.  I tried it and the results were OK
but not great.  Then I read where some resin manufacturer stated that
the UV post cure should not be done under water and the parts should be
thoroughly dry before they are post cured.

I'm still experimenting.  I bought several different resins to test but
have only tried two resins.  I need to do a lot more experimenting but
I've been busy designing and printing parts on the FDM printers lately.

The cost of the MSLA 3D printers is low, and the print resolution and
part strength is high, so resin printers are going to be gaining
popularity and these post processing issues will become much less hassle
and mystery.  I've looked at some post processing equipment and read
reviews and so far I'm underwhelmed.  Someone needs to make a Resin
Printing Best Practices video or PDF.  If it exists, I haven't seen it. 
There are some useful tips but much of the information is contradictory.

I need to make a fixture to gently scrape the parts off the build plate
in a controlled manner.  That can be a treacherous process, fraught with
peril.  Maybe I'll devise something that washes the parts on the build
plate by spraying everything with IPA to clean the build plate at the
same time, then scrape the clean parts off the clean build plate to
avoid gumming up the scraper mechanism.  That would be better than slimy
gooey parts flying across the room, or gouging a resin covered scraper
10mm into my hand.

I bought an inexpensive but very nice 30W UV lamp, Amazon ASIN
B07XCQ5C58.  It does a good job of post curing the parts.  I've seen
where people build curing boxes with UV LEDs and line the box with
mirrors, not realizing that glass blocks most of the UV.  They'd have
better results with polished stainless steel as a front surface mirror.





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Re: [Emc-users] LinuxCNC 3Dprinting

[Bruce Layne]

Some misinformation in Chris' post.

The QIDI Shadow 5.5S has a USB port, just like most 3D printers, but the
lack of an SD card does not imply that data is dribbled across a USB
cable as the printer needs it.  Instead of an SD card, I plug a USB
thumb drive into the Shadow.  There's a very nice graphic touch LCD for
a user interface.  When I select PRINT from the touch screen, the
contents of the USB card are listed in little buttons on the screen. 
The writing is too small for my old eyes without magnification, but
there are images of the parts to be printed which is very cool.  Touch
the image I want to print and it prints from the USB thumb drive.

I replaced the supplied (possibly fake) Toshiba thumb drive with a tiny
64GB Sandisk (they're awesome, Gene :-) Cruzer Fit thumb drive (Amazon
ASIN: B07MDXBTL1) that's almost flush with the side of the printer so it
won't snag and banjax the printer's USB port.




On 6/4/20 2:25 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> I looked.   They have their own slicing software that runs on Mac or
> Windows.   The interface is USB only, no SD card.  So on Linux you'd be
> using a virtual machine to host a Windows image and then their software in
> that.  Windows runs well in a VM if the host machine is powerful enough.
>
> I would prefer a printer that accepts SD cards as that is more reliable and
> does not tie up a computer for possibly 20 hours.
>
> Here is a very good unbiased article comparing 3D printer types from a
> company that makes all three types of printers.I would start with FDM
> as it will do 90% of what I want.  Then SLA for the other 20%.  If you
> must have a solid-built FDM printer These guys have that or you  Utilmaker
> printers are well made but at literally 10X the price.
> https://ultimaker.com/learn/comparing-fff-sla-and-sls-technologies
>
> SLA is limited to small parts and is a mess to work (goggles, apron, and
> gloves required) with but worth it if I want to build a mechanical hand
> with 5 tiny motors inside.  The cost of the material is high but if
> only making small parts maybe it does not matter.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 9:09 AM grumpy--- via Emc-users <
> emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:
>
>>> I bought a QIDI Shadow 5.5S a few weeks ago for US$289
>> i see it is available now for $259.00 and free shipping
>> what slicing software is needed
>> does it run under linux
>> is the manual available
>> i would like to read up on this
>>
>>
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Re: [Emc-users] LinuxCNC 3Dprinting

[Bruce Layne]

On 6/4/20 12:06 PM, grumpy--- via Emc-users wrote:
>> I bought a QIDI Shadow 5.5S a few weeks ago for US$289
>
> i see it is available now for $259.00 and free shipping

Thanks.  Now I want to buy another one!



> what slicing software is needed

Chitubox.  It seems to be proprietary freeware, which kind of bugs me. 
It's simple and it works fairly well.  I hope it's not sending the
contents of my hard drive to some nefarious website.

https://www.chitubox.com/download.html



> does it run under linux?

Linux, Mac and Windows.  Download link is above.



> is the manual available

I don't know.  It's so easy to use that  I never tried to RTFM.





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Re: [Emc-users] LinuxCNC 3Dprinting

[Bruce Layne]

The resins seem to be UV cured polyurethane or similar.  Polyurethanes
have a wide range of physical properties.  There are "ABS-like" resins
that are very structural.  I believe hockey pucks are made of
polyurethane.  The resin printed parts are dense and impact resistant. 
One good choice for a structural resin is Siraya Blu, available in
translucent light blue or clear.  Most of the resins can be mixed, even
between different companies, to fine tune the physical properties.  As
an example, I printed some little bars that are 5mm X 30mm X 60mm from a
generic gray resin that isn't considered to be one of the structural
resins.  I'd need some tools to damage it.  If I tried to break it with
my hands, I'd only hurt myself.

I'd been waiting for resin printers to decrease in price and for the
parts to be structural rather than "looks like" prototypes and fragile
miniature figurines.  It happened while I wasn't watching and was a
pleasant surprise.  We're suddenly seeing structural parts from resin
printers appearing everywhere.  Here's another advantage over FDM parts
- resin printed parts are solid so they can be used to make fittings and
manifolds for compressed air or liquids.

The flexible resin is very flexible but it has a slow return to its
original shape.  I have an application that needs a fast rebound, so
I'll be using the FDM printers to print those parts from TPU filament.

There are plenty of YouTube MSLA videos, and the resins are for sale on
Amazon if you'd like to read some customer reviews.

My only down side to resin printing is washing the uncured resin from
the parts, rinsing them and UV post curing the parts.  It's a bit of a
hassle but worth it if you want strong parts printed at high resolution.





On 6/3/20 6:48 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 1:05 PM Bruce Layne 
> wrote:
>
>> You might consider a resin printer for your high precision smaller
>> parts.  The MSLA machines are very inexpensive... no where near FormLabs
>> prices.
>
> I didn't know these had dropped in price so far.
>
> What resin choices are available for these MSLA printers?  What are the
> mechanical properties of the resins?   Maybe there is a good article on
> this?  One advantage of Formlabs is resin selection.  But maybe these same
> resins work in the low cost MSLA printer?
>
> Things I'd like to print are would need a tough semi-compliant plastic  I'm
> experimenting with robot gripper.  One is an anthropomorphic hand that was
> actually designed as a prosthetic for amputees.
> https://openbionicslabs.com/shop/brunel-hand The other is a pure robot
> design.  Both are Open Source and all the CAD files are available.
> Something like this
> https://www.eng.yale.edu/grablab/openhand/model_q.html#about
> <https://www.eng.yale.edu/grablab/openhand/model_q.html#about>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] LinuxCNC 3Dprinting

[Bruce Layne]

On 6/3/20 3:32 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:

> I think my next printer
> will be a smaller, "delta" style that is best used for higher precision and
> smaller parts
>
> One reason to buy a more expensive printer is if you need a resin printer.

You might consider a resin printer for your high precision smaller
parts.  The MSLA machines are very inexpensive... no where near FormLabs
prices.  I bought a QIDI Shadow 5.5S a few weeks ago for US$289
delivered, but there are a few others in the same market niche.  I went
with the Shadow because it has dual rails on the Z axis and that's the
premium Gen 2 version at additional cost from other companies.  So far,
the Shadow has been rugged, reliable, and the print quality, as you
said, is on par with injection molding.  Other than the fun of building
it yourself, I don't know why you'd want a delta printer for small high
precision parts unless you have a strong aversion to messy chemical goo.




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Re: [Emc-users] missing feature of openscad

[Bruce Layne]

3D PRINTING - WHAT WORKS FOR ME AND WHAT I'VE LEARNED

I print on borosilicate glass.  I use Elmer's Xtreme glue stick for
first layer adhesion.  The larger 40 gram stick takes less time to
apply.  I use a clean dry borosilicate glass plate.  Apply the glue when
the plate is room temperature.  Press down with 1-2 pounds of force
making contact with the entire flat face of the glue stick and move the
glue stick one inch per second to produce a thin and nearly transparent
layer of glue.  You don't want gloppy thick glue.  Overlap the glue
stick slightly for complete coverage.  Apply the glue immediately before
printing.  The glue stick works well when printing with ABS or PLA. 
Here are my settings:

PLA
Nozzle Temperature:  215C
Bed Temperature:  80C for the first layer and then 50C for the other
layers (50C for all layers works well too)

ABS
Nozzle Temperature:  230C
Bed Temperature:  110C

If you use hairspray as a first layer adhesive, remove the glass sheet
before spraying it.  I see YouTube videos where people fog the inside of
their 3D printers with hairspray that'll gum up whatever precision
linear motion components their printer uses.

In addition to proper adhesive, a level bed at the correct height is
also a necessity for that critical first layer adhesion.  I designed and
printed some oversized knurled thumb wheels to replace the tiny M3
wingnuts that the printer manufacturer supplied for bed leveling.  I
used nylon thread locking M3 nuts as inserts into my thumb wheels to
help the bed stay level.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4383435

If you want to really dial in the bed leveling, do the regular bed
leveling with a thin shim, then print a 30mm square that's .2mm thick
(one layer) over each bed leveling nut.  If you see the plastic
smearing, the bed is too high.  Stop the print to avoid clogging the
nozzle and lower the bed.  If the squares print but when peeled from the
bed they're composed of individual strands, the bed is too low and needs
to be raised slightly.  When the bed is level at the correct height,
each of the sample squares will print as a solid plastic film.  Slicers
have software settings for first layer printing parameters.  I prefer to
leave these as default.  If you fix a bad bed level with slicer
settings, the problem will return with a different slicer profile.

It's also necessary to easily remove the parts after printing.  This
isn't only a matter of convenience.  People attack their printed parts
with a sharp scraper and try to pry them off the bed.  Many people have
gouged themselves with a sharp scraper blade.  Using excessive force to
pull the parts off the bed results in at best a ruined bed level.  Who
applies that kind of force to delicate precision motion components?  For
PLA parts, I dribble some water around the perimeter of the part and it
dissolves the glue, wicking under the part and floating it off the print
bed in a few minutes.  ABS parts are even easier.  ABS is printed at a
higher temperature and shrinks more when it cools.  ABS parts pop off
the glass bed when it cools.  It often sounds like the glass has cracked
when the ABS pops free a section at a time.  If you use any form of
violence to remove your printed parts, you're doing it wrong.

I find it easier to make dimensionally correct parts with PLA.  ABS
shrinkage isn't linear.  It depends on part geometry, infill, etc.  If I
want accurate ABS parts I'll adjust the design to get the dimensions I want.

It's counter intuitive but filament deposition 3D printed parts with
100% infill are less structural.  There is no internal compliance so the
solid part has internal stress and is likely to fail by layer
separation.  50% fill makes very strong parts, but 20% fill is strong
too.  I usually use 20% or 25% infill.  If I want stronger parts I'll
increase the number of outer layers.

I recently bought an MSLA resin printer to complement my FDM printers. 
With a structural resin such as Siraya Blu, the resin printer would make
some VERY strong and dimensionally accurate parts, such as timing belt
pulleys.  The biggest disadvantage is the relatively small build volume,
but I've been making some very nice parts that are comparable to
injection molded parts.  Even with low cost commodity resin, the solid
parts from the MSLA printer are very strong.




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Re: [Emc-users] question about glue

[Bruce Layne]

> On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 10:30 AM Gene Heskett 
> wrote:
>
>> Cleaned up with acetone of course.


Cleaning with acetone will result in a good epoxy bond.  Cleaning with
isopropyl alcohol will result in an excellent epoxy bond.  Commercial
acetone, at least in the US, is recovered from industrial processes. 
It's distilled, but a trace amount of the waste oil remains in the
acetone after the distillation process and will leave a slight oily film
on your parts after the acetone evaporates.  It's not enough to feel or
see, but it's enough to prevent the best possible epoxy bond.

Maybe remove most of the oily gunk with acetone, scrub with 60-100 grit
sandpaper to create a rough surface for the epoxy to grab, then flood
with isopropyl alcohol to thoroughly degrease the part prior to applying
epoxy.  I'll sometimes use a clean blue paper shop towel or toothbrush
with the alcohol at first if some physical scrubbing is still needed. 
I'll finish the job with a spray bottle with isopropyl alcohol to blast
off the last traces of oil, allowing the alcohol and suspended oil to
drip off the part, and then I don't touch the part with my bare hands. 
You've made your own printed circuit boards and the process is similar
to the final step of cleaning the bare copper board before the etch
resist process.  When the board is clean of oxides and oil free, the
solvent will uniformly wet the board, drip off the bottom edge, and the
board will dry from the top down leaving a matte finish.

Pro Tip:  for the very best bond when using a filled epoxy, first paint
the bare surface with a thin layer of raw epoxy (resin and hardener)
before applying the filled epoxy (such as JB Weld).  The unfilled epoxy
can more easily penetrate the fine scratches on the substrate, and the
filled epoxy then binds to the unfilled epoxy.  That's a tip from people
who build composite fiberglass airplanes.




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Re: [Emc-users] question about glue

[Bruce Layne]

On 2/11/20 2:53 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 11 February 2020 13:34:29 Chris Albertson wrote:
>
>> "JB Weld" Epoxy.  It is a mixture of two part epoxy and steel powder. 
>>  Get it at any auto parts store or Home Depot.
>>
> It it magnetic enough to fool an ATS-667?  Thats been the reason I 
> haven't tried it. I have some but it could be getting old by now.


These gear tooth sensors use a couple of tricks that allow them to
automatically compensate for installation variables - hysteresis,
automatic gain control, etc.  The electronics after the Hall effect
sensors accentuate the difference in the signals.  Rather than having a
fixed threshold, they're adaptive.  I was almost sure that was the case
for your part but I double checked with the datasheet.

https://www.allegromicro.com/en/Products/Sense/Magnetic-Speed/Transmission-Sensor-ICs/ATS667

 "High-resolution peak detecting DACs are used to set the
 adaptive switching thresholds of the device. Hysteresis in
 the thresholds reduces the negative effects of any anomalies
 in the magnetic signal associated with the targets used in
 many automotive applications."

Unless you completely bury the sensor in JB Weld, you should be OK. 
It's designed for automotive applications.  It'd probably work beneath a
couple of millimeters of JB Weld.




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Re: [Emc-users] Fotek SSR

[Bruce Layne]

I have the same lead melt pot, and living in Kentucky, I do use it to
cast lead bullets.  Pew pew.

An honest to goodness PID temperature controller would be an
improvement, and it might be a product as some people would like that
upgrade.  An even better upgrade would be a self cleaning anti-dribble
nozzle.

I use a lot of the Fostek SSRs in my own projects (never for
commercial/industrial work) but I know the 40A rating is a joke.  I
always suspected the newer 40A version is the same as the 10A version
that wasn't good for a reliable 10A.  I generally limit the 40A version
to 5A and I watch them carefully on the initial startup to ensure they
work and don't latch in the shorted condition.  Sometimes I'll test them
manually with the load before installing them in my control panel.  The
internal heat sink potting on the ones I've seen is some white spooge
that isn't silicone grease, and it's very haphazardly applied with a lot
of variation from one to the next.  In general, I take US specs at 100%,
Japanese and German ratings at 150-200%, and Chinese specs at 15-20%. 
And the 15,000 mA hour 18650 lithium cells sold on eBay are pulled from
dead laptop battery packs and they were only rated for 2500 mA hours
when new.

Your little tankards are adorable.   :-)





On 12/19/19 2:23 PM, andy pugh wrote:
> I have a bunch of Fotek SSRs, rated 385V / 40A.
>
> Well, that's what it says on the label.
>
> Perhaps I have been hanging around with Americans too long, but I
> recently bought a bullet-casting melter. I wasn't happy with the
> temperature controller, so I modified it with a PID controller and
> SSR.
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/mq4NFtVtiSsVHFSk9
>
> (A variant of that 1/32 DIN controller has a built-in 5A SSR, which
> might be an easier modification, but I used the relay / ssr driver
> version: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/193179699038 )
>
> I measured the cold resistance of the element at 111ohms, so that's
> nominally 2A, or 3A if we allow for the actual peak mains voltage.
>
> So I figured that the 40A SSR should be fine. Imagine my surprise when
> it failed short-circuit almost immediately.
>
> It was potted up, and when I pulled it apart the actual driver chip
> fell apart, so no way to be sure what the actual rated current was
> now. The last one of these I took apart had a 10A driver, so that is
> what I have been mentally rating them at. Perhaps I was wrong.
> Possibly it's a fake 10A driver in a fake 40A SSR?
>
> If you are wondering why a resident of the UK wants a bullet mould, I
> have been making tiny glass-bottomed peter tankards:
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/RHmiUKG1BtCT5qW16
>


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Re: [Emc-users] parallel port picie cards

[Bruce Layne]

I'd use a USB WiFi dongle for the software upgrades or any other
internet access, and use the ethernet port to control the 7i96.

If you don't want your CNC machine on the internet most of the time,
pull the WiFi dongle.  I use my phone as the hotspot for my WiFi
connected CNC machines.  It's very convenient, secure, and it avoids
stringing Cat6 cable around the shop.



On 12/5/19 6:41 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Can that work thru a switch and maintain some modicum of decent latentcy?
> Since very few, and they are getting old, computers have 2 ethernet 
> ports, and I consider a net connection a pre-requisite if for no other 
> reason than keeping the machine up to date


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Re: [Emc-users] Whereare you getting your wire from?

[Bruce Layne]

Gene,

Knowing your propensity for eBay/Amazon buyer's remorse, it would be a
good idea to warn you about the cheap speaker wire.  Most of it is
stranded copper plated aluminum wire.  The sellers don't exactly go out
of their way to prominently advertise that it's aluminum cable.  Buyer
beware.

It's crazy how expensive wire has become.  Copper may not be a precious
metal, but it's making a good go at semi-precious status.  I need 100
feet of 12/2 with ground to wire my sister's new walk in closet and I'm
not looking forward to seeing how much the price of Romex cable has
increased since my last purchase, which produced severe sticker shock. 
Copper cable would have been a much better investment than gold or
silver in the last ten years.





On 10/26/19 9:49 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Saturday 26 October 2019 19:56:59 Chris Albertson wrote:
>
>> "zip cord"? Search for "speaker wire"This come in all sizes
>> and in a few different colors., white, black/red and white
>>
>> I use  it for power and what not in prototypes but for "real" work I'd
>> spec the proper multiconductor cable.
>>
> Which, the way I work, adding this or that function until I have pretty 
> much explored what the machine can do, would waste a lot of multicore. 
> Besides, a bunch of 2 conductor or even individual wires in the cable 
> chain are generally more flexible than bigger multicore would be. I 
> purposely buy cable chain with double the estimated window size just so 
> I can snap it open and add another functions wires or hoses without 
> having to redesign for a whole new cable. This particular change will do 
> away with a small plastic hose taking 10 psi to the coolant bottle, 
> replacing it with some 18 gauge black and red zip, only marginally 
> stiffer than the small bore hose being pulled out. A pressure regulator 
> at the coke bottles intake vent will go away, which weighs a long pound, 
> in favor of a 2oz pump, a net loss in the "unsprung weight" the y motor 
> has to move. Overall, I think a net gain in both velocity and accel 
> settings for the y.  No change in z w/o a bigger motor, its pretty puny. 
> A motor I have, about a 235oz I'd estimate at 3x the torque of the oem 
> toy, but I've misslaid my round tuit.  If I ever find a good image to 
> put on it that isn't copyrighted, I'll make a couple dozen more, wiping 
> out that excuse. ;-)  But first, make this mister work... :)
>
>> On Sat, Oct 26, 2019 at 3:31 PM Gene Heskett  
> wrote:
>>> Greetings all;
>>>
>>>
>>> I went out to wire that pump up today, but discovered that nominally
>>> 1/3 roll of small zip cord I thought I had, seems to have obtained
>>> some growth hormone, grew legs and walked off.  Might not have been
>>> enough anyway.
>>>
>>> So who has the miniature zip cord at the best price on this side of
>>> the pond? I'd like a 50 or 100 foot spool.
> I wound up getting some 18 gauge from amazon, the next size down was 28 
> gauge. Even at .5 amps, that seemed a bit small. But by the time its 
> strung thru all the cable chain, estimated at 17-18 feet, I'd druther be 
> big enough than to find I've only 8 volts at the 12 volt motor. 
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] sorting an rpi4 for an rt kernel

[Bruce Layne]

"Linux is a cancer"
   - Microsoft ex-CEO Steve Balmer.


Now, Microsoft and their fellow travelers just can't say enough nice
stuff about the open source community.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/ballmer-i-may-have-called-linux-a-cancer-but-now-i-love-it



"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they attack you,
then you win."





On 9/22/19 10:08 AM, MC Cason via Emc-users wrote:

> And now there's talk of a proposal within Microsoft to move Windows 11
> away from the rarely updated, and horribly outdated hybrid NT kernel,
> which was originally released in 1993, and replace it with the Linux
> kernel.  Times sure are changing




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Re: [Emc-users] Spindle experiences/recommendations?

[Bruce Layne]

The 2.2 KW water cooled Chinese spindles that I have are apparently
dynamically balanced.  There are two machined divots of different depths
in two flats on the ER collet nut, apparently to remove rotating mass to
balance the spindle.  24000 is a lot of rippums.  I guess they assume
the collet nut will be indexed to the same place each time relative to
the spindle?  Or did they balance the spindle somewhere I can't see and
then balance the collet nut?  It looked like a lot of material to be
removed to balance only the nut.



On 6/25/19 12:01 AM, Thaddeus Waldner wrote:
> .
>> On Jun 24, 2019, at 12:50 PM, andy pugh  wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 24 Jun 2019 at 17:29, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
>>>
>>> As far as I know the ER collet holders on these things are always integral.
>> For fixed tooling I can imagine making a solid piece to fit the ER
>> cavity, retained by a ring-nut.
>>
>> Or maybe dismantle and re-machine the shaft. I think that these are
>> typically plain induction motors, so disassembly and reassembly is
>> pretty straightforward.
> Before you dismantle a high speed spindle, be aware that some are balanced 
> after assembly. I have a nice 3hp 18,000 rpm air-cooled Elte spindle. I had 
> the idea of removing the fan and replacing it with something quieter that is 
> thermostatically controlled, since I use it mostly for engraving. I called up 
> a stateside distributor and their tech guy told me that the company bolts the 
> fan in place, then balanced the entire rotating assembly
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Spindle experiences/recommendations?

[Bruce Layne]

I've used the 2.2 KW water cooled Chinese spindle with good success for
a few years.  As Danny mentioned, the power at low RPM isn't very good. 
The largest cutter I use for machining is 1/4" and it's usually 1/8" or
less, but I do use a 1.125" mortising bit to level the spoil board and
it seems to tolerate that fairly well at a medium RPM (tradeoff between
power and spindle wear from a heavier and larger diameter unbalanced
cutter).

The electrical connection on top is a four pin DIN style connector but
the quality isn't great.  It works OK but before I used pliers to
tighten the knurled collar more than hand tight, it worked loose. 
Nothing was harmed other than blowing a fuse on the VFD when something
shorted, and of course if broke another one of those $35 1/16" Onsrud
carbide O flute cutters.

The 8mm tubing connectors are a bit low quality too but I used good
quality highly flexible tubing and tightened the compression fittings to
the Gene Standard (1/8th of a turn less than breaking) and haven't had
any problems.

The bearings were a pleasant surprise.  Spinning the unpowered spindle
by hand is smoooth.  It feels nicer than the spindle on megabuck
machine tools.  They advertise German bearings.  I had assumed that
"German" was a company in the Guangdong province, but maybe not.

If the spindle met your torque requirements over your RPM range, my
biggest concern in your application would be keeping grinding grit out
of the spindle bearings.

At the price of the spindle and VFD combos on eBay, you could buy a
spare spindle and bearing and still be many bucks ahead.  The Chinese
water cooled spindles are not the highest overall quality, but in my
experience, it's got it where it counts and the value is hard to beat. 
For a CNC router, it's a lot better than bolting on a woodworking router
IMO.





On 6/23/19 8:39 PM, Danny Miller wrote:
> Have used a cheap Chinese air cooled 18krpm 3kw spindle for years. 
> You must drive them off a VFD anyways.
>
> At 3000 rpm you have much less power.  Well the torque is probably the
> same but power=torque * rpm.
>
> The air cooled is cooled by a shaft-driven impeller, so fan rpm drops
> to 3000 rpm too.  At high torque, low-rpm loads, it will still
> generate a lot of heat but get very little fan cooling.  You can swap
> with a DC computer fan or go with water cooled.
>
> Danny
>
> On 6/23/2019 5:41 PM, Andy Evans wrote:
>> Greetings everyone,
>>
>> I wish to upgrade a dressing spindle in our EMC grinder.  We
>> currently have a very small DC motor turning a one-inch
>> diamond-studded disc at about 1500 RPM, with fairly decent results,
>> but my research indicates we may be better served with a much larger
>> disc and higher RPM.  We drive this dresser under the wheel with a
>> contoured path to give us the form we desire.
>>
>> There are available dresser spindles in the neighborhood of $12K that
>> are very good looking but we wonder if we can build something that is
>> sufficient for our needs for far less.
>>
>> We are considering the common router/milling machine spindles on
>> ebay, air or water cooled, in the 1-2 KW range.  Most of these seem
>> to be equipped with either an ER11 or ER20 spindle, and most are
>> advertised as 18,000 or 24,000 RPM.  Some of them tout multiple
>> bearings.  Some claim a range of 8,000 to 24,000 RPM.
>>
>> Since I would expect many on this list to have experience with these,
>> I am seeking to find out if we can successfully utilize a 3,000 to
>> 10,000 RPM range, and also if the ER mounts are integral or if they
>> can be removed.
>>
>> Or, if there are better ideas for accomplishing this, or if we are
>> crazy not to purchase the $12K solution.
>>
>> Thank you!
>>
>> Andy Evans
>> Evans Precision Tooling Incorporated
>> 541.990.2122
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Emc-users] How come....

[Bruce Layne]

On 5/19/19 6:01 PM, Kirk Wallace wrote:

> There are a lot of surplus Leaf batteries available. My opinion on
> these is that these were removed for warranty replacement due to
> overheating. These are air cooled and don't do well if they are rapid
> charged more than once during long trips. I am tending to avoid these.

I saw those Nissan Leaf batteries as related eBay links.  The price per
energy storage looked very good.  I assumed these were some sort of
warranty replacement batteries, but didn't search to learn the reason
these are on the surplus market.  I vaguely recall hearing of technical
problems with the Nissan Leaf.  If the problem was overheating when fast
charging or discharging in a car, that wouldn't deter me from using them
in an off-the-grid home.  It probably wouldn't be an issue in a properly
sized system, and the Nissan batteries could easily be mounted
vertically with air gaps and even inexpensive heat sinks could be used
to accentuate cooling.

I'd need to research the cell balancing and battery management as that's
critical.  A lot of those electronics are built into the Tesla battery
packs which sounds good, but it's proprietary so using them in a home
requires the batteries to be fooled into thinking they're in a car.  An
entrepreneur makes a device to do that.  Jack Rickard of EVTV.

http://store.evtv.me/proddetail.php?prod=1FullpackController

I sent links earlier in this thread to a friend who used a Tesla battery
for his off-the-grid home, and he displays battery life in odometer
miles.  I think he largely does this for a lark and he displays more
conventional units as well, but keeping it in terms of miles, even
though not applicable to a house, does provide a battery life indication
that compares well to the original automotive use.  No doubt he'll get
more "miles" from his off the grid batteries than they'd get in a car
where they're typically charged and discharged at a faster rate.

Part 3 of the series, where the custom battery monitoring is demonstrated:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIY2EWke-AA



On 5/19/19 6:07 PM, andy pugh wrote:
> (And, while we are at it, kWh is a horrible unit. What is wrong with MJ? )

Kilowatt hours is easier for me to convert into miles.   :-)

An American arguing with an Englishman over the metric system is funny. 
You guys invented this crummy system.  Just because you were smart
enough to switch to the metric system and we're still stuck on stupid is
no call for being cheeky.   :-P








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Re: [Emc-users] How come....

[Bruce Layne]

It's interesting that Tesla maintains a record of all Tesla vehicles,
and once a car is scrapped, it's black listed in their records.  There
is no factory support.  The vehicles that were eligible for free
charging at Tesla Superchargers are barred from using the chargers, even
on a paying basis.  You can only recharge the car at home so it's a
commuter car and is no longer practical for interstate use.  Tesla won't
sell any spare parts to support scrapped or rebuilt Tesla vehicles, and
they won't help with any information.  Tesla has adopted the software
rental model where the customer doesn't really own anything.





On 5/18/19 3:06 AM, Gregg Eshelman via Emc-users wrote:
> Look up Rich Rebuilds on YouTube. He built himself a really cheap Tesla Model 
> S by buying one that was in a flood and another that was rolled. Stripped the 
> flooded one of nearly everything, put the electrics and electronics from the 
> rolled one into it, then sold a bunch of leftover parts. Now he's fixing up a 
> flood damaged Model X, which has been built with a much higher degree of 
> water resistance. Nearly every electronics box on the Model S had been full 
> of water. The battery had water in it. The motors, inverters, and gearboxes 
> were full of water. The Model S, if it could be IP rated at all, would be at 
> the lowest rating. See a clogged storm drain making a pond at an 
> intersection? Don't go through it to have splashy fun with a Model S. Could 
> get water into a motor and/or inverter.
>
> During the Model X teardown, Rich has been finding there isn't much needing 
> replacing with the electronics due to much better sealing of the boxes and 
> connectors have better gaskets. The charge regulator on the X, mounted inside 
> behind the right rear wheel, was totally dry inside despite being almost 
> completely submerged. The one on the S was full of water. Apparently Tesla 
> has learned what IP65 means, which is what everything on an electric car that 
> runs on electricity ought to be, especially the parts outside the cabin.
>
> On Friday, May 17, 2019, 8:20:05 AM MDT, Dave Cole 
>  wrote:  
>  OK,
> Buy  a new "cheap" Tesla - about $35,800 right now.
> Remove the battery pack  ;-)
>
> You guys on the west coast make it sound like you have Tesla's sitting 
> on the side of the road with "$500 or best offer" sale signs.
>
> We now have 11 supercharger stations in the state of Indiana.
> If Tesla's burned coal or biowaste we would be all set.   :-/
>
> What is is a "cheap" Tesla going for in places where they are popular?
>
> Dave
>
>> So, let's turn that on its head. How can I run my cordless tools from Tesla
>> cells...
>   
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Re: [Emc-users] How come....

[Bruce Layne]

Great analysis, Chris.  There's no way I'd use any lead acid battery
technology in a new off-the-grid solar power system.

A friend of mine replaced his old lead acid batteries with a home brewed
Tesla Power Wall, built from the battery from a wrecked Tesla Model S
automobile.

Part 1 (23 minutes):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpPYkqpe-Ms

Part 2 (13 minutes):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3PM2Ndu0zg

For small solar powered devices, there are LiFePo4 batteries that are
sized to replace sealed lead acid batteries.  LiFePO4 technology is the
much safer form of lithium battery.  These sealed battery modules have
internal cell balancing, and some of them have under voltage and over
voltage protection.  A cheap imported DC to DC converter can be used in
lieu of a charge controller.  That makes it very easy to design a solar
power system.  For most applications, simply size the battery for the
maximum energy needed for use at night and cloudy days and then size the
solar panel to be sufficient for the desired charge time without being
so large that it can charge the battery at an excessive rate.  I just
got the components from Amazon to power a 100W amateur radio station
that's entirely off-the-grid.  Hopefully I'll get that built and tested
this week.





On 5/14/19 1:36 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> If you are building a battery-based power system and space and weight are
> not issues then what you should care about is the "total watt-hours per
> dollar".
>
> Here is an example,... You have a 100 amp-hour lead-acid battery at 12
> volts.  If it is lead-acid then you can only discharge to 50% if you want a
> reasonable lifetime.If it is a cheap batery it might last only 100
> charge cycles.   so 50% x 100 cycles x 100 amp-hours x 12 volts is 60 KWH.
>The cheap battery might cost $100 to you pay  $1.60 per KHW for battery
> power based on the replacement cost of the battery.  You can buy a higher
> quality battery for more money but your cost is going to be between $1 and
> $2. per KWH
>
> So the cost of the battery power is 4 to 8 times high than the cost of
> power from the utility company.
>
> But what if you buy higher quality batteries?
>
> A Tesla "Power Wall" cost $6,800 (They used to be $10K)  it is a 13 KW
> capacity and is good for more than 3,000 charge cycles and is actually
> warrantied for 10 years.   It is maintenance free for 10 years.   Use with
> a waentry you have an incentive to use it for the full 3,650 cycles.
> Lets assume you only cycle it 3,000 times. That is under 20 cets per
> KHW for battery power.  It is dramtically cheaper then lead acid.
>
> This is why Tesla is selling b'zillions fo power wall systems.   If you do
> care about space, these Power Wall units cn be mounted to an exterior wall
> and actually look attractive.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 9:32 AM Dave Cole  wrote:
>
>> I've been planning to put up an array on my roof.  But I have plenty of
>> space so I may do a ground level install.
>> It would be a lot easier to maintain.
>>
>> FLA batteries seem to be the general recommendation for a constant use
>> residential install.
>>
>> I've had chargers trash batteries when they failed.  I sure wouldn't
>> want that to happen to $10K worth of Lithium batteries!
>>
>> Weight isn't an issue.
>>
>> Dave
>>
>>
>>
>> On 5/9/2019 10:37 PM, Erik Christiansen wrote:
>>> On 09.05.19 10:24, Dave Cole wrote:
 Erik,

 Do you have a blog going on your build?
>>> Now that's an idea. All I've started is the seeds of an article for
>>> "Owner Builder" magazine - the editor was interested when we last spoke.
>>>
 I'd be very interested in your solar and battery setup for your off-grid
 home.
>>> The existing home, from the 1950's & extended, only has a little 2 kW
>>> petrol generator. The new roof which will carry the solar arrays goes up
>>> in June, if the framing carpenters turn up on time. (Just off the phone
>>> to 'em half an hour ago.) There's 6 or 7 kW of equator-facing panels,
>>> but the west-facing hipped roof can only take 9 panels, so only 2.5 kW
>>> or so - but still enough to keep pace with a modest aircon.
>>>
>>> The best trick for allowing high power consumption straight from the
>>> arrays, yet limiting battery charge rate to permissible maximum, is to
>>> use a hybrid inverter - they're beginning to become more available now.
>>> The Redflow ZnBr battery has a limited max charge rate (44A), and pretty
>>> much any other does too, e.g. 20A/100AH of capacity for LiFePO4. The
>> hybrid
>>> inverter looks after that while delivering to load first.
>>>
>>> I like the Redflow, as it's a long-life unit, unkillable by 100%
>>> discharge. It does though need that once a fortnight to regenerate, so
>>> it can be handy to have another battery. For off-grid, just one 10 kWh
>>> battery is maybe enough for one occupant, but a second is great for
>>> visitors from the city. But the reflow is about A$14k (US$10k), so I've
>>> even been 

Re: [Emc-users] Cutting aly with a drop/sliding saw

[Bruce Layne]

On 4/26/19 5:32 AM, andy pugh wrote:

> Do you get these in the US?
>
> https://www.screwfix.com/p/evolution-r210cms-210mm-single-bevel-compound-mitre-saw-240v/7277p
>
> The entire machine costs less than you are quoting for a blade.

I had seen the Evolution saw at Amazon, and saw it again last night when
I went there to find the model number of the Dewalt saw for my previous
email.  Someone had asked a question on Amazon.  Why is the Dewalt multi
cut saw more than twice the price of the Evolution saw?  The answer was
that the quality of the Evolution saw wasn't good.  I've never used
either so I can't say.  I'm cheap.  If I just had a few cuts to make,
I'd be tempted to get the Evolution.  If I was making cuts like Wallace
(8 cubic feet of swarf per job!) I'd spend more in the hope of getting
more.  Durability and cut quality are certainly issues, but at those
volumes, saving five seconds per cut is a significant labor savings.

This thread reminds be of my desire to use LinuxCNC to make an automated
band saw... or updated to the modern technology, an automated multi cut
saw.  All of this stock prep work seems like boring work for a human. 
Even in a world with audiobooks to occupy my mind while doing repetitive
tasks, I'll still spend 40 hours to automate a job to save 20 hours of
tedium.   :-)







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Re: [Emc-users] Cutting aly with a drop/sliding saw

[Bruce Layne]

I've used my power miter saw to cut aluminum on many occasions.  I use a
14" carbide blade that's intended for wood.  I go slower than I'd cut
wood.  I use a feed rate that produces a nice thin chip.  I'm sure it
dulls the carbide faster than cutting wood, but it's not that bad.  As
was noted in the video, it's much faster than using the bandsaw, and
it's easier to make accurate and repeatable rough cuts.  I've cut thick
pieces as shown in the video, but I usually cut 1-2 inch aluminum angle
to make custom brackets.  I dry cut the aluminum, mostly because I was
too lazy to set up a mister.

I've thought about buying one of the similar looking multi cut saws such
as the DW872 that cuts metal at a slower RPM.  They can cut steel as
well as aluminum.  A good 14" blade is $100 and up, but the cost per cut
is reported to be better than abrasive cutting wheels, and it's much
faster than an abrasive cutuff saw or a bandsaw.





On 4/25/19 8:30 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Thursday 25 April 2019 19:21:03 Marshland Engineering wrote:
>
>> May be of interest to chaps here. This cuts down on milling swarf and
>> machining time.
>> Needed to rough cut 100 blocks of thick aly before putting them in the
>> milling machine. Cutting with only 1.5 mm extra for finish machining.
>>
>> https://youtu.be/gLLt79OqRvA
>>
>> Cheers Wallace
>>
> I do that too, but its hell on 12" saw blades.
>>
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> Cheers, Gene Heskett




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Re: [Emc-users] ER ATC tool idea

[Bruce Layne]

On Sunday, April 21, 2019, 5:47:22 PM MDT, Gene Heskett
 wrote:
>  On Sunday 21 April 2019 14:51:31 Bruce Layne wrote:
>
>> I don't need to use an impact wrench to tighten and loosen the drawbar
>> to prevent TTS tooling from pulling out.  Something isn't right there,
>> Gene.  Maybe some of the grease you're using on the drawbar threads
>> made its way into the 3/4" interior of the modified R8 collet?
> Possible, but whats this about a "modified R8 collet"?

Here's the Tormach TTS modified R8 collet.  If you're not using this,
you probably aren't really using the Tormach Tooling System, and that
may be your problem with TTS pull out.

https://www.tormach.com/store/index.php?app=ecom=prodshow=35356

The TTS tool holders are pulled up by the modified R8 collet and the top
of the TTS tool holder has a flat ring that is pulled tightly against
the bottom of the spindle nose.  This is sort of the TTS magic.  If the
nose of your spindle is bunged up or is uneven from being cheaply
manufactured or from a crash, you should tram your mill to get the
spindle axis orthogonal to the table and then mount a carbide cutter to
the table and lower the spindle to machine the nose of the spindle flat
and perpendicular to the spindle axis so the TTS tool holders have a
flat mating surface.

I wouldn't recommend TTS for professional shops with big machines, but
for the home gamers with spindles of up to 2HP or maybe 3HP, I think TTS
is a very good low cost solution.  A great deal of engineering has been
done to create tool holding for professionals and I'm grateful that
Tormach created TTS for the rest of us.  It's a quick and easy way for
me to keep the tools I use the most loaded and ready to go, with a quick
change that retains the Z axis offset.  Get the official TTS tooling
from Tormach with the annular ring and it's even compatible with their
automatic tool changer.  One of these days, after I automate the tool
change operation, I might get around to making my own mini ATC with a
cheesy tool tray that holds 6-8 TTS tool holders on the left side of the
table and simply index over, drop a tool in a spring loaded pocket,
verify the tool has been unloaded, then go over and grab another tool
from a different pocket.  It wouldn't allow me to load all the tools I
commonly use (that's what my big TTS tool rack is for), but I could load
the few tools needed for a job into the mini-ATC tool tray.






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Re: [Emc-users] ER ATC tool idea

[Bruce Layne]

Thank you Ken!

I don't have a Tormach but I do use the Tormach Tooling System on my 2
HP milling machine.  I typically use it for machining plastic or
aluminum but I've taken serious cuts in steel numerous times and never
had any problem with tool pull out.  The tool stays in the TTS ER20
collet holder (Tormach brand or the Chinese knock offs) and the TTS tool
holder stays in the modified 3/4" R8 collet.  When I install a new TTS
tool holder, I snug the drawbar with a 3/8" ratchet with a one foot long
handle.  I don't use the long handle for torque.  I use it to clear the
head of the milling machine.  Similarly, I don't need much torque to
loosen the modified R8 collet to remove a TTS tool holder, but I
generally do need to tap the top of the draw bar after loosening the
drawbar to release the TTS tool holder.

I don't need to use an impact wrench to tighten and loosen the drawbar
to prevent TTS tooling from pulling out.  Something isn't right there,
Gene.  Maybe some of the grease you're using on the drawbar threads made
its way into the 3/4" interior of the modified R8 collet?





On 4/21/19 2:03 PM, Ken Strauss wrote:
> I'm very surprised by your comments.
> I have a Tormach 770 and the only time that I've had a TTS slip is when I
> allowed the power drawbar to become mis-adjusted. Are you ensuring the the
> TTS shank is clean and free of grease? What is the size of your spindle
> motor? I only have a 1HP spindle motor but it will stall before the TTS
> slips.
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Gene Heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
>> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 4:31 PM
>> To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] ER ATC tool idea
>>
>> On Saturday 20 April 2019 12:20:53 Jon Elson wrote:
>>
>>> On 04/19/2019 09:55 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
 I'm doing that now, for big ER's in that sheldon, but I
 had the G0704 spindle in mind, I've developed an abiding
 hate for R8's and their tool slippage.
>>> Hmmm, I've never had tool slippage with R8 end mill
>>> holders.  I HAVE had slippage on a few occasions using
>>> collets in the R8.  So, except in unusual circumstances, I
>>> ALWAYS put end mills in an R8 holder, instead of a collet.
>>> When it did slip, I'm pretty sure I didn't tighten the
>>> collet enough, or maybe there was a little chip in there
>>> that crushed out, loosening the collet.
>>>
>>> Jon
>>>
>> The only way I can be assured that a 3/4" shank of a TTS tool holder will
>> not slip, rotating in the R8, is if I put an 8 point 5/16" socket in a
>> 20 volt rattle wrench, and let it rattle for most of a second,
>> tightening the drawbar bolt about half a turn more that the 10mm end
>> wrench supplied can.  No way can that 10mm end wrench can ever loosen
>> it, and that socket will be cracked in 50 shots of that. I order those
>> in 3 packs from grainger. I keep chassis grease on the drawbolts threads
>> and under its shoulder.  But a TTS shank spins in it so easy you'd swear
>> it was teflon coated. I made those tap hats that are keyed to the r8
>> because a 1/4" tap takes enough torque to slip it rotationally either at
>> the TTS/R8 interface or the collet to tap.  The hats are eyed to a notch
>> I cut in th R8's mouth.  No slip.
>>
>>
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>> Cheers, Gene Heskett
>> --
>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>> Genes Web page 
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Emc-users] chinese vfd is driving me bonkers.

[Bruce Layne]

I've had reliable operation from Little Giant and Superior Electric
pumps as small coolant pumps.  The small pumps are not expensive so
there is no excuse for skimping on quality in my opinion.  Spindle
coolant is too important to take unnecessary risks on a pump of
questionable quality.  I particularly like the magnetic drive pumps. 
These are the sorts of pumps that people leave in a lily pond all year
long, pumping algae and koi carp crap sludge.

Here are a couple of eBay items you might want to consider.

254049597655
382673181410

The small Superior Electric pumps currently on eBay seemed to be imitations.

The worst part about using one of these small submersible pond or
fountain pumps is the plumbing.  They probably won't have the plastic
fitting you'll need.  You probably need 8mm internal diameter tubing for
the spindle motor and the pump's tube fittings are usually much larger. 
You may need to epoxy a fitting into the pump's outlet or tap one of
their plastic friction fittings.  The good news is, it's a submersible
pump, so it doesn't matter if the fitting leaks.

Sorry that I can't help you with the Chinese VFD.  I have a few similar
Chinese VFDs (two home brew CNC routers and a 3/4 HP CNC'd Clausing
lathe) and they all work well.  I bought them from eBay sellers with
good reputations.  For the two CNC routers, I bought the spindle motor
and VFD as a matched pair and they were perfectly configured from the
factory.  I needed to do a little programming on the lathe VFD, but the
registers were reasonably well documented in the manual and there are
YouTube videos that described how to configure a genuine Huanyang VFD
for an arbitrary sized spindle motor.  It wasn't difficult, but I
probably spent an hour fiddling with it.  It's handy to watch YouTube
videos like this on the LinuxCNC machine that I'm configuring.

It's sad that someone is selling what are essentially cut rate imitation
Huanyang VFDs.

PRO TIP:  The Huanyang VFDs emit a lot of EMI.  Preferably, use HDMI for
video.  If not, use the best shielded VGA cables you can buy.  Use
shielded continuous flex cable between the VFD and spindle motor and
ground the shield in the electrical panel.





On 3/27/19 4:39 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> While trying to get a reverse control over this POS, I noted that the 
> default was reversed, so I traded the 2 U & V wires to the motor to make 
> it run fwd.
>
> This is toward the end of March, but as of this afternoon its default, 
> can't change it w/o moving UV again, is now its running bass ackwards 
> again.
>
> Then, I note after I had unplugged the hoses from the pump in order to 
> re-route them thru the new cable chains, that the pump wasn't.  Power is 
> being switched on queue..
>
> Pull pump out of water, note its slightly warm. Made sure power was off 
> and popped the end covers, discover its a PM armature with pretty strong 
> cogging. Put front cover back on as its also the front bearing.  Apply 
> power, and 8 or 10 pokes at turning it, It takes off again. Its not 
> stiff or dragging. Stop AC to it, stops, start it, runs. Several times. 
> So obviously it can't be trusted.
>
> I've a mind to just order another pump and a vfd.  I am plumb sick of 
> screwing with this documentless piece of Chinese shit vfd. I want to 
> actually USE it before I fall over...
>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett




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Re: [Emc-users] switch debounce experiment

[Bruce Layne]

On 3/26/19 1:38 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> Yes, I know a switch can be de-bounced in software but this introduces
> latency as the software has to keep checking the state of the switch.
>  Reduced latency very much increases the accuracy of the microswitch.

Like Steve Ciarcia said in Byte magazine, circa 1978, my favorite
programming language is SOLDER.  I usually prefer the hardware solution
as the fastest and often most reliable solution.  However, rather than
increased responsive time when debouncing a switch in software, an
intelligent debounce algorithm can greatly reduce the response time. 
For a home or limit switch, you don't really care when the switch
contacts become stable in the new state.  What you want to know is the
moment the stable condition changes.  I'd debounce that limit switch
activation by acting on the initial state change and then set a timer to
ignore any subsequent bounces.  I definitely wouldn't wait for switch
contacts to stabilize before acting on the new state.  That could be the
difference between a machine crashing or not.

Of course, hardware can implement the same debounce strategy, but it's
easier to wire a bare switch and debounce it in software... even for an
old hardware guy like me.






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Re: [Emc-users] Wish me luck. I am downloading v.18 of freecad as src, gonna see if I can build a 32 bit version

[Bruce Layne]

I decided to install FreeCAD 0.18 to get the latest and greatest
FreeCAM.  Thanks for the encouragement, Lester.

I'm running Ubuntu so I didn't need to compile anything.  There's a
FreeCAD daily repository for Ubuntu.  Details are here:

https://launchpad.net/~freecad-maintainers/+archive/ubuntu/freecad-daily

When I searched for the above link, I also saw a link to a YouTube video
demonstrating the FreeCAD daily installation process if you like, but I
didn't watch it.

All I did was:

sudo add-apt-repository ppa:freecad-maintainers/freecad-daily
sudo apt-get update

Then I ran the Ubuntu software updater.  Holy cow.  The FreeCAD
documentation is a third of a GB.

Then I did:

sudo apt-get install freecad-daily

Ta da!  Version 0.18.

I removed the ppa from the repository because I'm not a developer and I
don't need (or want) daily builds.  I just wanted the latest FreeCAD.

sudo add-apt-repository ppa:freecad-maintainers/freecad-daily -r

The above should work as well for a fresh install rather than an
upgrade.  In fact, I left the stable FreeCAD 0.16 installed in case I
have problems with 0.18, but 0.18 seemed able to open the parts I
designed with 0.16.

Sorry if you aren't running Ubuntu and have a harder time getting the
latest FreeCAD, but the above *might* work for other Debian based distros.




On 3/22/19 6:52 PM, Lester Caine wrote:

> Sorry I have to disagree with that ... I'm running perfectly good
> gcode for the Taig mill from FreeCAD. Yes for 3D printing one of the
> other slicer options is required, but for 2.5D machining it works well
> enough and is improving all the time.
>

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Re: [Emc-users] ConFusion 360

[Bruce Layne]

On 3/23/19 7:11 PM, Gregg Eshelman via Emc-users wrote:
> Dunno why Microsoft cannot stop re-breaking things in Windows 10 after 
> they've fixed them. The RTM release had major problems with a large number of 
> laptop WiFi adapters. Took them almost a year to put out a fix, which they 
> had to make available for direct download both for RTM and the first update 
> build. Then Microsoft proceeded to re-break WiFi several more times until 
> they seem to have decide to quit mucking about and leave it alone.

It can probably be traced back to the open source IP stack that Windows
stole from FreeBSD 20 years ago.   :-)

https://betanews.com/2001/06/18/microsoft-we-use-freebsd






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Re: [Emc-users] Fusion 360

[Bruce Layne]

On 3/23/19 12:52 PM, Greg Bernard wrote:
> As an Autocad user for 25 years, I can say the issue of file formats not
> being backward compatible is really not a significant problem. All Autocad
> versions have the option of saving the file in an older .dwg or .dxf
> format. There may be some minor problems with formatting of dimensions,
> etc. but when they do occur it's usually not a big deal to correct them.

DXF export may be true of AutoCAD but it was not the case with the ill
fated AutoSketch which would export a DWG so I could start leasing
AutoCAD, or some version of DXF that I was never able to import into
anything.

AutoDesk had a reputation of creating the industry "standard" DXF format
so they could control it.  In theory, it was a standard file format that
allowed CAD data to be interchanged between all CAD programs.  That
seems like a very user oriented concept.  However, the DXF "standard"
was anything but a standard.  It was extremely problematic when I tried
to use it.  AutoCAD competitors inevitably had data import menus that
listed six different versions of the DXF "standard" depending on which
version of AutoCAD exported the DXF, and very often, none of them would
work.  The numerous versions of DXF files also made it very difficult
for CAD developers to know which version to use for exporting.  When I
last looked a dozen years ago, I think the other companies had finally
standardized on one version of the DXF "standard" to use, but there was
still some lingering confusion.  To this day, LibreCAD can export to DXF
R12, DXF R14, DXF 2000, DXF 2004, and DXF 2007.  I can only assume that
AutoDesk loves standards because they created so many of them.   :-/

It could be argued that a bad industry standard from the dominant
manufacturer greatly delayed the development of a true industry standard
for CAD data and hindered data exchange to protect market share.

In order to ensure compatibility, most commercial CAD manufacturers were
forced to give up and pay AutoDesk to license the proprietary DWG
format.  That wasn't an option for open source software because it's
free as in "free beer" so there wasn't money to pay AutoDesk, and it's
free as in "free speech" so it couldn't incorporate licensed proprietary
software.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AutoCAD_DXF

/"As AutoCAD has become more powerful, supporting more complex
object types, DXF has become less useful. Certain object types,
including //ACIS//solids and regions, are not documented. Other
object types, including AutoCAD 2006's dynamic blocks, and all of
the objects specific to the //vertical market//versions of AutoCAD,
are partially documented, but not well enough to allow other
developers to support them. For these reasons many CAD applications
use the //DWG//format which can be licensed from //Autodesk//or
non-natively from the //Open Design Alliance//." /

Microsoft has engaged in similar proprietary data strategies.  Every
year or two, there would be a new version of Word, and it would read
files from the last version or two, but no others.  Toward the end,
there was only the pretense of new features in their mature word
processing and spreadsheet products.  The "upgrades" were nothing but
designed inoperability to force the market to buy new software as soon
as customers could no longer exchange files.  Meanwhile, LibreOffice
Writer and LibreOffice Calc can import every version of Open Document
file ever used.  100% backward compatibility, without the need to try
different import filters.

I have no problem paying for commercial software that makes my life
easier, but I don't like being forced to buy software that makes my life
more difficult by deliberately rendering my data useless to me unless I
pay their annual extortion fees.



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Re: [Emc-users] Fusion 360

[Bruce Layne]

Being an unrepentant capitalist, I must admit that commercial software
has much to recommend it.  There is money to pay programmers to develop
stable and feature rich software, and market forces keep the product
customer focused so the market gets the features that customers want. 
When Fusion 360 launched, I signed up on the AutoDesk forum to ask for a
native Linux version.  The AutoDesk administrator told me that despite
not being too much effort given the cross platform development tools
they use to make the Windows and Mac version, there would never be a
Linux version because Linux users won't pay for software.  That was an
odd thing to tell me, given that I had long ago paid $1250 for Eagle
electronic CAD software, specifically because they offered a very good
native Linux version, and I paid annual maintenance fees for years after
the initial "purchase."  Do we ever really own software?

I wasn't impressed with the AutoDesk attitude, which was slightly less
offensive than Microsoft's "Linux is cancer" public statement on open
source software.

Part of me was relieved.  Even though I wouldn't have the advantage of
the rich features and rising industry standard that Fusion 360
represented, I wouldn't be setting myself up for another proprietary
software ambush.  AutoDesk had done that to me before.  They sold me on
AutoSketch which, as an electrical engineer was all of the mechanical
CAD software I'd need.  Then they discontinued AutoSketch at the moment
that I learned enough to be productive and unilaterally converted my
license to an AutoCAD Lite license.  AutoCAD Lite required a completely
new learning curve, so I was forced to start over.  They charged me the
higher AutoCAD Lite maintenance fees while constantly nagging me to
upgrade to the complicated and expensive full blown AutoCAD that I
didn't want or need.  None of the drawings that I created in AutoSketch
could be used.  There was no import or conversion to AutoCAD Lite.  The
hundreds of hours I spent in AutoSketch was a completely wasted effort. 
I got the impression that AutoDesk viewed their entry level products as
marketing tools to hook new users so they could be up sold on their more
expensive CAD software.  It was a marketing approach that was not
customer oriented.

At the time, AutoCAD was still a 2D CAD package, but they had tacked on
some kludge 3D features.  Meanwhile, smaller and leaner software
companies had introduced true 3D CAD.  Many still exist but SolidWorks
emerged as the big winner.  AutoDesk was suddenly at the back of the
pack and disappeared in the rear view mirror for a few years.  Fusion
360 is their attempt to recapture the market they lost through
complacency.  I can't help but feel that once AutoDesk has herded the
majority of the CAD market back into a near AutoDesk monopoly, they'll
start putting the screws to the users again.

I have no interest in AutoDesk's proprietary Fusion 360 file format that
uses the files that I create to hold me hostage.  I have even less
interest in sharing my data on their cloud.

I use FreeCAD, mostly for 3D printing.  It's still not ready for prime
time and doesn't have a usable CAM system so it's not a possible
replacement for Fusion 360, but it's a viable CAD option for me when
Fusion 360 isn't.

If there was no FreeCAD, I'd use OpenSCAD long before I'd use Fusion
360.  Free Open Source Software for the win.  I wish there was some
effective method to leverage the advantages of commercial software and
FOSS.  I'd like to be able to pool my financial donations with those of
other users to encourage open source software developers to implement
new features.





On 3/22/2019 5:14 PM, Jeff Johnson wrote:
> Anyone on here have opinions on Fusion 360 Cad/Cam by Autodesk?
>
> Using  ShopCam for simple 2.5D work, VisualCam for 3 or more axis work,
> using Alibre Cad for 3D Drwaing and creation as well as ProgeCad for 2D
> Drawings.
>
> With this combo there is not much we can't handle but maintenance
> agreements
> and updates do get cumbersome.
>
>  
> I am worried about moving to the cloud based system but I guess it's the
> future.
>
>  
> What are this groups thoughts if any?
>
>  
> Jeff Johnson
>
> john...@superiorroll.com
>
> Superior Roll & Turning
>
> 734-279-1831
>  




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Re: [Emc-users] Spindle motor coolant advice needed

[Bruce Layne]

> How about using a radiator like
> https://www.amazon.com/Computer-Radiator-Water-Cooling-Cooler/dp/B079D
> HJ91F/ which is intended to cool CPUs? It comes with mountings for
> three 120mm muffin fans.
>

I have a similar radiator for the laser, but the 80W laser produces
approximately 800W of waste heat and I wanted to be able to use it all day.

I think a radiator is needless expense and complexity for a small
spindle motor.  I have the 2.2 KW spindle on the larger CNC router and
the coolant starts to become slightly warm after running it constantly
for several hours.  Given that the heat transfer rate out of the coolant
tank increases as the coolant temperature increases, I doubt I could
overheat the coolant system running it nonstop, even with a high
temperature ambient environment.  The spindle motor is probably too
efficient for that to happen.  If I wanted to run it full time and
cooling did become an issue, I'd probably add a second five gallon cat
litter bucket cooling tank (free) and another 4 gallons of RV antifreeze
(US$10).  If space was at a premium, I still wouldn't be tempted to use
even the smaller single 120mm fan radiator to avoid adding more series
plumbed coolant tanks.  I'd be concerned about leaks and galvanic
corrosion and a fan failure.  I'd just get a 50 foot length of tubing
and toss the coil on top of the machine enclosure to make a passive
radiator.  The thermal conductivity of plastic tubing is lousy, but it's
easy and cheap to compensate with a lot of surface area, and I like the
simplicity - just a longer piece of the tubing I'd already be using with
no welded aluminum radiator, no fan, and nothing to leak or break.

I wired my coolant pump into the machine power.  The low power pump runs
as long as the machine is powered.  That seemed inherently safer and a
lot easier than having the pump under software control.




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Re: [Emc-users] Spindle motor coolant advice needed

[Bruce Layne]

I run pet safe RV antifreeze as a spindle coolant.  It's sometimes also
used to freeze proof a toilet at a vacation home.  It's the pink stuff
at Walmart.  It's cheap, even by our standards, Gene.  Don't dilute it. 
Run it full strength.  Nothing grows in it and unlike distilled water,
it won't dissolve metals to reionize itself.

Put 3-4 gallons in a five gallon bucket with a lid to keep crud from
falling into the coolant and you probably won't need a chiller or
radiator.  By the time the coolant becomes warm, your machining is finished.

Locate the coolant tank above the spindle if possible (negative head
pressure) so you can run a small low power submersible pump.  You don't
need much flow, and a high power pump will heat the coolant more than a
small spindle.  The only disadvantage of elevating the tank is that a
leak will probably drain the tank and make a mess.

I use a strip thermometer on the side of the spindle motor.  It changes
colors to indicate the temperature so I can see at a glance if the
spindle motor is running over 120 degrees F (that's 49 Centipedes for
those who have a Royale With Cheese instead of a Big Mac because of the
metric system).



On 3/15/19 3:34 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Greetings all;
>
> I've had the coolant tank filled with distilled water for about a month 
> now, and its turning the hoses faintly reddish, like copper. I don't 
> want to put a deionizer on it to keep it up in perfect insulation since 
> a bypass cartridge is a $100+ throwaway.  So what sort of anti corrosion 
> contaminant do you folks run in you spindle motor coolants? Something I 
> can get at NAPA or similar places?  Or do you just change it monthly? I 
> though about that last night when I was at Wallies and spotted what was 
> said to be distilled water "but with added minerals for taste" In other 
> words, tap water at $1/gallon.  False advertising if there ever was such 
> a thing. Lesson, read the labels folks.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett




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Re: [Emc-users] OT: Where's them fires. [Was: Re Conversational mode.

[Bruce Layne]

On 3/10/19 5:12 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> California, where I live passed a law that the electric grid be
> powered by 100% renewable energy.   Some said it was a dream but
> economic forces are already such that the plan is ahead of schedule.
> Last year for a few days the grid over 50% renewable
>
> THere is also a law requiring panels of every new home. 

Good ideas don't require government coercion.  The market will solve
problems like this far more efficiently.  It's an historical fact that
central economic planning doesn't work.  Government control of an
economy always results in poor quality products and shortages with
people standing in long lines for food or on a waiting list to buy a
poor excuse for a car they can't afford.  Current example of a failed
government controlled economy:  Venezuela.  Even ignoring the inevitable
corruption, no bureaucrat has the detailed information that a market
effortlessly uses to accurately allocate resources.

My 30W solar panel arrived today, along with sixteen 18650 lithium
batteries, battery holders, DC-DC voltage converters that I'm using as a
solar charge controller, and a battery balancing circuit.  These are all
inexpensive parts that I bought on Amazon and they're a bit less
expensive on eBay.  No engineering required.  Wire the modules together
and Bob's your uncle.  No government laws were required to force me to
use solar power, either.







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Re: [Emc-users] VFS-11 modbus driver

[Bruce Layne]

On 3/3/19 1:22 AM, Thaddeus Waldner wrote:
> Maybe there was not so much dweeb in the Toshiba marketing department as 
> there was ignorance in the hobbyist integrator
>
> It turns out they don’t call the port an RS485 port; they call it a Toshiba 
> Inverter Protocol port. They sell converters that converts the Toshiba port 
> to either RS232 or RS485. These cost about $130 on ebay, which I don’t 
> necessarily want to spend.
> I found this;
> http://static.mah.priv.at/cnc/vfs11-rs232.pdf
>
> Can you or anyone enlighten me as to what is taking place with the Schmitt 
> trigger inverter and MAX232 chips?

IC1A and IC1D negate the serial data logic.  Apparently the two systems
use the opposite logic levels.  The Schmitt triggers also have internal
hysteresis to avoid false noise triggering that could cause erroneous data.

IC1C and IC1E are being used as LED drivers for the blinky status lights.

The MAX232 does the voltage level translation of the data signals.

R1 and R3 are also used for voltage translation for the transmitted
data.  Apparently, J1 has 24 volt signals.

C4, C5, C6 and C7 are used by the charge pumps in the MAX232 as flying
capacitors to generate the +/- 10V used for the RS-232 signals.








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Re: [Emc-users] Metric units (was: Would this blower be useful...)

[Bruce Layne]

On 2/25/19 5:10 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> My favourite wierd unit is the megaparsec.barn. It's a about a
> teaspoon, but very long and thin.

There's a Wikipedia article for people like you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_humorous_units_of_measurement

When I first heard that Google would do unit conversions, I naturally
asked it how many teaspoons are in a cubic parsec.  That could be handy
to know some day.

https://www.google.com/search?=teaspoons+in+cubic+parsec






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Re: [Emc-users] Metric units (was: Would this blower be useful...)

[Bruce Layne]

As an American engineer, I almost invariably convert my "real world"
units into the metric system, solve the problem, and then translate the
solution back into the units that are used in my country.  Cumulatively,
it's a significant competitive disadvantage for a nation, but it's
easier than trying to solve problems in nonsensical and arbitrary
imperial units, and it's apparently easier than trying to convince
Americans to accept the logical system of measurement that's used by the
rest of the planet.

Forget measuring cutting speed in mm per second.  What is it in furlongs
per fortnight?





On 2/24/19 11:51 AM, Eric Keller wrote:
> Yes, people who complain about the metric system apparently don't realize
> that they are using it without even knowing it.  The United States adopted
> the metric standard for the inch in 1959.




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Re: [Emc-users] No clean solder flux, how to buy in Sweden

[Bruce Layne]

Fortunately, "EVERY electronic device eventually ends up in a land fill"
is a patently false statement.  At least in the US and probably to a
greater extent in Europe, almost all electronic devices are recycled. 
They're shredded and the metals are chemically extracted and separated. 
It's probably less expensive than constantly sourcing raw materials from
ores and then throwing those products in a landfill five years later, so
the recycling is a commercially viable venture that requires no
government mandates.  The market can manage this environmentally
friendly process, which probably implies that electronics recycling is a
worldwide phenomenon, regardless of any government policies that may exist.



On 2/24/19 4:14 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> The reason they have banned lead is that EVERY electronic device eventually
> ends up in a land fill.  The lead then leaches into the water table.
> Sounds silly that tiny phone might contaminate an entire aquifer but Apple
> sells something like five million phones every month and now that the
> market is started this means 5 million phones go into landfills every
> month.




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Re: [Emc-users] DIY CNC builder dilemma, open request for comments

[Bruce Layne]

I'm glad there are fully integrated CNC control packages for those who
want to go that route, but I greatly prefer LinuxCNC for two major reasons.

1)  I control the entire design, making the design choices that make
sense for me on each machine.  I generally prefer to spend a few more
dollars on high quality PC components that will be reliable - a solid
power supple, name brand motherboard, solid state drive, etc.  I usually
prefer inexpensive motion control components, often stepper motor and
driver packages from Chinese manufacturers.  They're a great value and
they've been reliable.  I usually buy a set with one more axis than I
need so I have a spare motor and driver.  (Pro Tip:  It's worth buying
high quality shaft couplings and good bearings for the motion control
components.)  I'll usually get the largest LCD I can fit on the machine
and a Logitech wireless keyboard and touchpad that doubles as a pendant
when jogging and zeroing the axes.  No vendor can offer the exact
hardware I want on each machine.  There are too many variables and every
pre-configured package will have compromises, and they're usually fairly
severe.

2)  I built the entire system so it's much easier for me to repair.  A
heavily integrated CNC control system, particularly if the computer and
the motion control are on the same board, is both more likely to be
damaged and less likely to be repaired.  Repair is often by
replacement.  A comparable problem on my system might only require
swapping a stepper driver (and I have a spare already on hand).  For the
same reason, LinuxCNC is great for replacing antiquated high dollar CNC
controls on commercial equipment.  Toss the 1990s Fanuc controls,
replace them with LinuxCNC for a very small amount of money, and breathe
new life into an old machine where the controls were dead but the iron
still has a lot of life left in it.



On 2/18/19 5:39 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:
> I still had to edit the text into one line 
> However if you google this: " ? alibaba Low-cost-New-Product-3Axis-> 4Axis "
> it will bring up the link.
>
> Point is that for $1500 you get a CNC controller ready to go.
>
> For $800 Alibaba lists "Cheap 3 axis CNC milling center CNC controller"  The
> drawing shows the outputs going to 3 drives and motors.
>
> But for $50 for a used dual core PC and either parallel port and BoB or and
> enhanced control card from Mesa and the rest is the same.  3 drives and
> motors.
>
> I don't believe that it's currently, in today's market, to compete with a
> far east by making a custom board. 
>
> John
>
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: John Dammeyer [mailto:jo...@autoartisans.com]
>> Sent: February-18-19 2:07 PM
>> To: 'Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)'
>> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] DIY CNC builder dilemma, open request for
>> comments
>>
>> Let's try this then.
>>
>> Then there is the Far East solutions like the one in this link.
>> > 4Axis_60343603384.html?spm=a2700.7724857.normalList.37.3701292eTmjk5
>> p>
>>
>>
>> John Dammeyer
>>
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Emc-users] Postman semi-good to me today

[Bruce Layne]

SMC is your friend.

You can often find good industrial surplus SMC pneumatic components on
sale on eBay that will probably still last halfway to the entropic heat
death of the universe.  There are also apparently SMC components that
are made in China for the Chinese market (same good stuff) that are sold
on FleaBay and Amazon in other markets at prices comparable to the
lesser industrial brands.  I've had good luck with both for common stuff
like an FRG (filter, regulator, gauge), small commodity air cylinders
and common commodity solenoid valves.

Like seemingly everything else, there are probably cheap clones of SMC
parts that are junk.  Caveat emptor.  It's your luck that's what you'll
likely buy on eBay, Gene. :-/





On 2/15/19 9:02 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Friday 15 February 2019 20:33:44 andy pugh wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 16 Feb 2019 at 01:07, Gene Heskett  
> wrote:
>>> But, if I turn that 6 amps times 12 volts into watts=72, no way in
>>> hell would that survive a 1 hour run time gcode program.
>> Why do you assume that?
>>
>> (and what do you have to lose by testing the assumption?)
> A: From the size of the coil Andy, 72 watts of heat would let ALL the 
> smoke out in 15 minutes or less, Its sold as an air horn valve with an 
> expected duty cycle of <5%, and
>
> B: I don't have a 12 volt, >80 watt psu to do the smoke test with.
>
> C: I'd druther not test my fire insurance.
>
> D: I just bought that Chinese airtec as I can probably regulate the input 
> pressure to below its 0.8MPa ratings.  If not, I just got another $12.50 
> schmardter. :(
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett




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Re: [Emc-users] OT note to Erik C - Solar batteries

[Bruce Layne]

A friend of mine recently replaced his aging lead acid battery bank with 
a wrecked Tesla battery.  He documented the project on YouTube.  Good 
stuff with lots of great DIY info.  It's very interesting if you're a 
geek, even if you aren't planning on hacking a battery for your solar 
powered house.  Here's the first in the video series.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpPYkqpe-Ms





On 2/12/19 8:05 PM, Greg Bentzinger via Emc-users wrote:

(Greg)
Erik,
A trend I have been noticing in the DIY solar crowd is to salvage the batteries 
from wrecked Tesla or Mercedes Hybrids.
The Batteries are series wired for output in the 400VDC range but can be 
rewired in parallel for a 50-60VDC output.
Just need to be sure the charge controller has a custom or Li-po setting.
I hope to rig up a 6Kw bank here at the ranch so it can handle the Inrush 
starting demands of my deep well pump.
If I can off load the spare refrigerator, freezer chest and well pump that will 
be about half my domestic electric cost. With luck I can eventually get the 
whole house on solar + wind power.

The shop will always have to be on the grid, the big CNC's have 26Kw or higher 
startup loads. If the house is off grid then my electric bill will be a 100% 
business expense.
(/Greg)

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Re: [Emc-users] sim still broken

[Bruce Layne]

On Sat, 22 Dec 2018 at 23:50, Gene Heskett  wrote:


The only thing I could not find with any
search terms was a 1/2 to 1 gallon water tank to bury the water pump in.


I have a Chinese water cooled spindle on two different home built CNC 
routers.  I used a 5 gallon plastic bucket for the coolant tank on 
each.  They were free with a cat litter purchase.  The plastic snap on 
top is hinged.  The back 1/3 stays snapped in place and the front 2/3 
can be hinged open in case I ever need to dump the coolant, add to it, 
etc.  The lid keeps dust and debris out of the closed loop coolant 
system.  A small pump is submerged in the coolant and the power cord for 
the pump and the coolant inlet and outlet hoses are routed through the 
back third of the lid that remains snapped onto the top of the bucket.


You don't need a big pump regardless of the size of the spindle motor.  
I use a small Little Giant pump that's often sold for fountains, 
hydroponics, etc.  I get the best version they make and it's still 
inexpensive.  Good brands include Superior and the upper end versions of 
Little Giant.  Here are a couple of possible examples.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/362400850664

https://www.ebay.com/itm/233055122922

I like the magnetic drive submersible pumps for reliability.  I'd pay a 
little more for a long power cord to get any electrical splices well 
away from the coolant and a pipe thread outlet port so you can easily 
find a fitting to connect to the weird metric sized very flexible hose 
that connects to the spindle motor.


These small pumps don't produce much head pressure (aka "lift").  On the 
larger CNC router, I tried to hide the coolant pump under the enclosure 
and route the coolant lines on top of the enclosure and then down to the 
spindle motor.  That didn't work because the pump couldn't push the 
coolant that high.  I tried a much larger pump trying to power my way 
through the problem and the head pressure was marginal.  It barely 
worked, most of the time, but the pump is cooled by the coolant and the 
coolant temperature rose quickly.  The coolant was cooling the pump more 
than it was cooling the spindle. I finally gave up, went back to the 
smaller pump, and put the coolant tank on top of the CNC router's 
enclosure so it was pumping down to the spindle motor and back up to the 
coolant tank.  The pump only needs enough head pressure to clear the top 
of the coolant tank.  A possible down side is that a coolant leak could 
siphon most of the coolant out of the coolant tank, but I used good hose 
and it hasn't been a problem.  On the small CNC router, I placed the 
coolant tank on a shelf behind the CNC router, and it also pumps down to 
the spindle motor.


I continue to be impressed with the Chinese water cooled spindle 
motors.  The quality is very good.  They brag about the precision 
"German" bearings and they are very smooth and have a very precise feel, 
certainly much better than a Porter Cable or Bosch wood working router, 
even though I suspect that "German" is the deliberately deceptive name 
of a company or town in China.  Still, good is good.


Using four gallons of coolant allows the larger CNC router to run pretty 
much indefinitely now that the garage shop is air conditioned.  When it 
was hot in the summer, the coolant would get a bit warm in the summer 
after five hours of hard use of the spindle motor.  Less coolant means 
it will get hotter sooner.  More coolant is an easier and cheaper 
solution than adding a radiator.


I use the pink RV safe antifreeze as the coolant.  I don't think it will 
corrode metals as readily as water and it won't freeze in your unheated 
shop.  Unlike some automotive coolant, this is used full strength.


I buy liquid LCD thermometer strips on eBay and I'll wrap one around the 
spindle motor and I'll stick another in the electrical panel so I can 
see the temperature at a glance.  These are passive thermometers with no 
electronics.  They're sold for use in pet terrariums for lizards.  
Direct reading with no batteries to replace.  Be sure to get one that 
goes as high as 40C or 104F.  The selection isn't as good as I remember.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/253864383162

I wanted to measure the spindle motor temperature rather than the 
coolant temperature to catch a fault where the pump stops pumping. I 
still need to install a thermal switch on the spindle motor to E-stop 
the CNC router if the spindle motor starts to overheat.  I wired the 
gantry for the thermal switch but never installed it... or I installed 
the switch but never wired it into the E-stop circuit. These projects 
all blur together in my old brain.






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Re: [Emc-users] SPI

[Bruce Layne]

When I've had problems similar to those you described when interfacing 
SPI devices to a microcontroller, it was usually caused by some 
violation of the timing diagram.  I was writing my own SPI 
communications routines in assembler on a PIC microcontroller.  I did a 
quick search and it looks like that part is being done for you with the 
Arduino.


https://www.arduino.cc/en/Reference/SPI

That is a very well written article.  It might be a good idea to read 
through it as a troubleshooting guide to see if any of the issues it 
mentions might be causing you problems.


I'd still get a digital storage oscilloscope and capture the signals to 
see what might be causing the problem.  Seeing the signals is the best 
and quickest way to verify a lot of things, many of which you might not 
even imagine would be a problem - voltage levels, noise, ground bounce, 
timing issues, etc.  Make sure the signals match the signals shown in 
the ADS1256 data sheet.


This is the sort of thing that can eat your lunch (from the link 
provided above):



The SPI standard is loose and each device implements it a little 
differently. This means you have to pay special attention to the 
device's datasheet when writing your code.


Generally speaking, there are four modes of transmission. These modes 
control whether data is shifted in and out on the rising or falling edge 
of the data clock signal (called the clock *phase*), and whether the 
clock is idle when high or low (called the clock *polarity*). The four 
modes combine polarity and phase according to this table:


*Mode* 	*Clock Polarity (CPOL)* 	*Clock Phase (CPHA)* 	*Output Edge* 
*Data Capture*

SPI_MODE0   0   0   Falling Rising
SPI_MODE1   0   1   Rising  Falling
SPI_MODE2   1   0   Rising  Falling
SPI_MODE3   1   1   Falling Rising








On 12/17/18 9:38 AM, andy pugh wrote:

On Mon, 17 Dec 2018 at 14:18, Charles Steinkuehler
 wrote:


Double-check your wiring and the data sheets, paying particular
attention to the direction of the data signals.  I have found the data
line labeling (MISO/MOSI, DIn/DOut, etc) to be somewhat haphazardly
applied, and your symptoms would be explained by having the data lines
swapped (so two drivers bus-fighting on one line, and the other line
floating).

I have buzzed this through from the Arduino to the pins on the actual
ADS1256 chip, and that all seems correct.




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Re: [Emc-users] Surface grinder vertical axis servo motor and controller recommendation

[Bruce Layne]

While LinuxCNC does seem like overkill for such a simple CNC project, it 
would still be my first choice.


It's inexpensive and easy to toss together a LinuxCNC control system, 
and this minimal system will be even simpler than most.


LinuxCNC offers a lot of potential for expansion if that should be 
required later.  It probably seems that there would never be a need to 
expand the surface grinder controls, but most systems that are in use 
tend toward greater complexity over time. What about controlling a 
coolant pump?  What about a magnetic chuck?  It might be good to verify 
that the chuck is securing the part the entire time the program is 
operating.  What about over travel limit switches?


LinuxCNC will be supported until the entropic heat death of the 
universe, and LinuxCNC uses standard, modular, interchangeable 
off-the-shelf hardware components, so a LinuxCNC based system will never 
be stuck with a dead proprietary control system.  Once converted to 
LinuxCNC, machines are much easier and less expensive to maintain 
because there are no discontinued proprietary parts.


Not many shops have a surface grinder and nothing else.  I like the idea 
of using LinuxCNC for all of the CNC machine tools.  Supporting a full 
shop of CNC machinery becomes a lot simpler when they all use the same 
CNC software and common control electronics design practices.  Whether 
designing and building machines from scratch or converting manual 
machines or old CNC machines with good iron and dead controls, I greatly 
prefer to install my own LinuxCNC control systems.






On 11/19/18 10:38 PM, Tom Easterday wrote:

A friend is fixing up a 70s vintage surface grinder that has a ball screw on the 
vertical axis and a non functioning drive.  He wants to replace what is there with 
a servo motor and driver and have a simple control that lets him select several 
ranges, say 100, .010, .001, .0001 & .5 increments to move the spindle.

He asked what motor, driver, and control to use.  My experience with servos is 
pretty limited, I’ve built one gantry machine with them.  We used Kelling 
servos, CUI encoders, Granite Devices drivers and Mesa cards with Linuxcnc.  A 
full Linuxcnc controller seems like overkill though to control a single axis in 
fixed increments but I am not sure what other options there are.  I am curious 
what folks here would recommend for this application?

-Tom


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Re: [Emc-users] No mail received?

[Bruce Layne]

On 10/19/2018 10:15 AM, Peter Blodow wrote:

I haven't got any mail from this list since Oct.10th.  How come?


I'm finished building CNC equipment (are they ever completely finished?) 
and am now gainfully employed using LinuxCNC to make products for sale 
in a small online business.  I just set my brother up with a 24" X 49" 
heavy duty LinuxCNC router in his garage and he's shipping his first 
products in the next couple of days.  I wrote a lot of hand coded G code 
over the summer to make that happen, along with building production jigs 
and fixture plates.


I love automation.  I have some programs that run for seven hours, 
making several hundred parts while I'm asleep.  I've only recently been 
reaping the benefits of CNC.  There was a lengthy phase when I wasn't 
saving much time with unattended CNC machining because I'd just stand 
there staring at the CNC machining while thinking, "This is so cool."


I'm already looking forward to my next LinuxCNC project.  It feels like 
small business is my excuse to justify my geeky aspirations and CNC 
addiction.


Huge thanks to those who made LinuxCNC the incredible tool it is today.






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Re: [Emc-users] [Off topic] Clocks and radios

[Bruce Layne]

As long as ntp.org is available, I won't miss WWVB.  My computers and 
cell phone automatically keep perfect time.  I can reset the clock on 
the microwave oven manually.


The US Congress, in their arrogance, changed the timing of daylight 
savings time.  They have excuses, but I really think they need to 
reassure themselves of their self importance.  They have the awesome 
power to dictate when people wake up, go to work, eat lunch, etc. The 
last time they changed daylight savings time, I had to throw away two 
relatively new digital clocks that automatically synced to the radio 
broadcast.  The firmware in those clocks didn't know about the 
congressional edict, so my clocks were off by EXACTLY one hour, for two 
weeks of the year.  Those useless clocks went in the trash. There's yet 
another way that government costs me money.




On 08/22/2018 04:51 AM, andy pugh wrote:

I know that some folk here like clocks, and that others are interested in radio.
And some in both.
This might be of interest.
https://hackaday.com/2018/08/20/what-will-you-do-if-wwvb-goes-silent/

(There is a proposal to stop broadcasting the time signals that radio
controlled clocks use)




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Re: [Emc-users] Servo Failure

[Bruce Layne]

One obvious initial check would be a resistance check between each servo 
motor phase to chassis ground, and then check for consistent resistance 
values from phase to phase as an initial check of the servo motor's health.


This could also be an intermittent problem in the motor (dielectric 
breakdown when hot or triggered by machine vibration), or more likely a 
persistent or intermittent fault in the cable that connects the servo to 
the servo drive.  The connectors are also suspect so give them a good 
look as well.


If you replace the cable, get the best flex rated cable you can find.  I 
use Igus cable that's rated for "continuous flex". McMaster-Carr sells 
it by the foot.  It's made for cable chain wireway that's in constant 
motion in robots or CNC machine gantries.


Good luck!

Why can't Mondays be more like Fridays?





On 08/20/2018 05:26 PM, Todd Zuercher wrote:

Looks like I need to get a new servo drive ☹
https://postimg.cc/gallery/18e5wxmd4/

Other than being old, what would be the most probable cause of such a failure?


Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031

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Re: [Emc-users] CAD for LinuxCNC

[Bruce Layne]

On 07/24/2018 02:14 AM, Chris Albertson wrote:


That is not going to happen for two reasons
1) the deal is not introductory, It is licensed so that it is free for
those doing less then $50,000 of work per year  Those doing more have to
pay for it


I was unable to find the Fusion360 license agreement on the AutoDesk 
site.  Apparently, it's only available for viewing and clicking "I 
accept" as part of the installation process.  However, I'd be very 
surprised if there wasn't a clause stating that AutoDesk reserves the 
right to alter or amend the agreement at any time.  That's standard in 
these click-through software license agreements that nobody reads.  The 
agreements are very one sided.  The manufacturer owns the software.  
They can and will do anything they choose.


Example:  I seem to recall that Fusion360 was originally free for 
students and anyone doing less than $100,000 worth of work per year.  
Now you say it's $50,000.  Will it be $25,000 next year? Will the free 
introductory offer go away entirely?  If AutoDesk decides that they're 
losing more money in licensing revenue than they're gaining in future 
revenue by adding to their installed base via the free introductory 
offer, then they will discontinue the free introductory offer.  Yes, 
even if they swore they wouldn't and signed in blood.





2) it can save the files in any of about a dozen industry standard file
formats so it is really easy to move your projects both in and out of
Fusion. On the roadmap is to directly open and save to other file
formats.


I recall the AutoCAD DWG file format becoming increasingly proprietary 
and deliberately obfuscated after other CAD manufacturers started 
importing DWG files to help people move away from AutoCAD.  That's to be 
expected.  AutoDesk didn't want to make it easy for their customers to 
leave for a different CAD program that was easier and much less 
expensive.  Then there was the resulting industry push to create an open 
CAD format, the DXF. AutoDesk was the 800 pound CAD gorilla, so they had 
a lot of say in how the DXF format was developed.  Big surprise.  It 
wasn't the universal CAD format that users wanted.  There were different 
incompatible versions of the DXF.  Most CAD companies other than 
AutoDesk tried to standardize on one version of DXF but AutoDesk always 
seemed to have a different version of DXF, rendering that standard of 
limited use.  When you have a de facto monopoly, standard 
non-proprietary file formats are not your friend. Marketing issues such 
as this make me appreciate open source so much more.  Open source 
developers love well documented standards.


Fusion360 is currently among the least expensive 3D parametric CAD 
programs, so it makes sense that they support open standards now when 
they're still working to pull users back from the other 3D CAD programs 
that yanked the market out from under AutoDesk.  In a year or two... not 
so much.  Been there and got the T shirt.  Not my first CAD marketing rodeo.





I'm fan of open source software but


In the first year of Fusion360, I inquired on the Fusion360 forum about 
Fusion360 for Linux.  I certainly wasn't asking for an open source 
version.  I was asking if they'd have a version for Linux, given that 
they had Windows and Mac versions.  I assumed that they were using cross 
platform software development tools and while it wouldn't be as simple 
as cross compiling for Linux, it would be a lot easier than a complete 
rewrite.  I was told by the AutoDesk representative in the Fusion360 
forum that there would never be a Linux version because people who use 
Linux won't pay for software. The response was right up there with 
Microsoft's comment that open source software is cancer.  I tried to 
explain that I paid $1250 plus annual licensing fees for the 
professional version of Eagle electronic CAD software, largely BECAUSE 
there as a stable native Linux version.  Apparently, I'm an aberration, 
because Linux users are all hippie freeloaders.   :-/


I'm not hating on Fusion360.  It's very nice software that's growing and 
improving rapidly.  I think it's much more user friendly than AutoCAD 
was, given the relative nature of CAD, then and now.  Many people have 
been able to take advantage of the free introductory offer to learn CAD 
and do a lot of useful work and that's a very good thing.  The cost is 
reasonable for companies leasing it annually.  I just wanted to make 
sure that people realized that AutoDesk is in business to make money and 
they're not running a charity to give away nice CAD software to 
everyone.  TANSTAAFL. Solidworks et al ate AutoDesk's lunch and drank 
their milkshake because AutoDesk rested on their laurels.  Being the 
monopoly CAD company made them lazy.  Now they're working to earn back 
market share they lost when other CAD companies like Solidworks did a 
better job of meeting the customer's needs.  Competition is a good 
thing.  The end users benefit 

Re: [Emc-users] CAD for LinuxCNC

[Bruce Layne]

Not sure if this will be a useful response, but in the interest of not 
omitting an option


I write my G code manually.  This gives me the ultimate control over the 
process.  CAD and CAM are both very mature now, but I still prefer to 
write the programs myself.  This wouldn't be an option for someone doing 
a lot of job shop work, with the need to input customers' CAD files or 
quickly create a CAD file from a concept sketch and then quickly spit 
out the G code using a CAM program, but I'm not running a job shop and I 
don't do much one-off work.  My methods also wouldn't work for mold 
makers, but my parts are usually fairly simple 2.5D parts.  I write G 
code that is used for ongoing production.  The same programs are run 
daily.  The time required to write the programs isn't much when 
amortized over the life of the program.


Writing the G code is almost incidental to designing the parts.  It 
feels like I'm writing G code in the background as I'm designing the 
various parts of a machined project.  The design and development is what 
takes time.  I doubt I'd proceed any more quickly if the back end to the 
design process was CAD/CAM instead of typing G code.


I also save the time it takes to learn new CAD and CAM software, which 
is fairly significant.


I visualize the parts by previewing them in LinuxCNC as I write the G 
code.  The design process is very iterative and the G code runs on the 
production hardware, so tight fitting parts can be optimized as the 
program is written.  I get a better feel for the design process when I 
can tweak as I'm designing.  I avoid designing an entire project only to 
realize at the start of production that a part in the middle of the 
design process can't be made to work and the project needs to be redesigned.


For complex or repetitive coding, I'll use one of the python scripts or 
PyCam.  Andy's lathe macros would be a great choice if you wanted a 
conversational programming process for shop lathe work.


Writing G code is also a necessity when I make a custom production tool 
that's controlled by LinuxCNC.  There is no CAD or CAM that will 
generate G code to pick up a part on the spindle that's serving as a 
mandrel, move the spinning part across a pair of razor knife cutters to 
precisely trim the rubbery parts to length, then move the part to a U 
shaped fixture protrusion that is used to pull the parts off the spindle.


I use FreeCAD to design more complex 3D parts to be 3D printed. They're 
working on FreeCAM, and when that's ready for prime time (or near 
enough), I may use that open source tool chain to generate G code for 
LinuxCNC.  Until then, I'll continue to write the G code manually.  I 
always enjoyed RISC assembler programming for microcontrollers, for a 
lot of the same reasons I prefer to write my own G code.  Simple tools 
for simple minds, eh?


Many people now use Fusion360.  There was a very attractive introductory 
deal to lure people back away from SolidWorks and similar 3D parametric 
CAD programs that had been gobbling up market share.  I've witnessed 
these marketing driven software product cycles before.  Enough people 
have now switched to Fusion360 that the door is about to slam shut.  It 
won't be long before people are held hostage to the CAD files they 
created and they can be abused and exploited.  AutoDesk got me on that 
one before.  I'm not falling for it again, no matter how nice Fusion360 
looks.






On 07/24/2018 12:17 AM, John Dammeyer wrote:

Mini Poll here if possible
I use WIN-7 and design with AlibreCAD and use MecSoft AlibreCAM to make the 
G-Code.  As I get closer to getting the Mill converted I could do like I have 
with the CNC router and run WIN-XP and MACH3.
Or continue on the path I started with LinuxCNC.

So what OS and CAD/CAM software are users of LinuxCNC working with?

Thanks
John


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Re: [Emc-users] AC Power for Mill and PC+Monitor

[Bruce Layne]

I typed "linear" when I was thinking "switching" in the last paragraph.  
Unfortunately, I also read "switching" when I proof read what I typed 
before sending it to the group.  I fixed it in the forwarded text, 
below.  Sorry for the confusion.




On 05/28/2018 06:55 PM, Bruce Layne wrote:
For the lathe, milling machine and 24" X 49" CNC router, I ran four 
conductor service to the outlets so I have the neutral at the 
machine.  I can run the 240VAC only VFD from both hot legs, and I 
divided the 120VAC loads evenly between the two 120VAC legs.


The 24" X 25" CNC router is powered by a 20A 120VAC outlet, so that's 
the opposite of your problem with a 240VAC supply and needing to run 
120VAC loads.  In my case, I used a large transformer (used, on eBay) 
to step up the 120VAC to 240VAC to run the VFD for the spindle motor.  
The transformer was more expense and weight and heat in the electrical 
panel than I wanted but it was less hassle than running 240VAC to the 
machine.


If I needed to design a CNC machine for 240VAC with no center neutral, 
I'd buy components that run on 240VAC.  As others already mentioned, 
that's no problem for most devices.  Switching power supplies usually 
have a switch to select 115/230. although many now automatically 
switch or are indifferent to wide input voltages. That should take 
care of the *SWITCHING* DC power supplies for stepper motor drives, 
*SWITCHING* DC power supplies for 5 or 12 or 24 VDC control voltages, 
and the computer's *SWITCHING* power supply.  There are plenty of 
computer monitors that run on 120VAC or 240VAC.  For the simple CNC 
systems I've designed, not having 120VAC at the wall really shouldn't 
be much of a problem, and could save money on smaller gauge wiring. 
Copper is becoming a much more significant part of machine building 
lately.






On 05/28/2018 04:42 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:
If you are in the UK or EU it's not such a big deal since the power 
isn't split phase 110/220 VAC.  PCs, monitors etc are all configured 
for 220/240 VAC input as would be your Mill.  That means the CNC side 
is also probably powered from the same 220/240VAC circuit.


But for North America we have split phase.  My Mill was wired for 
220VAC in and has a small  transformer (120VAC, 24VAC) to run the 
power feed and relay logic.  The split isn't wired nor does the 
switch and contactor handle this.


I could run a 250VA Step down transformer to create 110VAC for the PC 
and Monitor (0.8A + 1.7A) or just run them both off 220VAC switched 
from the same master switch that runs the mill.


What are others in North America doing for powering their PCs and 
Monitors?  Separate AC outlet/power bar for the PC?


Thanks
John




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Re: [Emc-users] AC Power for Mill and PC+Monitor

[Bruce Layne]

For the lathe, milling machine and 24" X 49" CNC router, I ran four 
conductor service to the outlets so I have the neutral at the machine.  
I can run the 240VAC only VFD from both hot legs, and I divided the 
120VAC loads evenly between the two 120VAC legs.


The 24" X 25" CNC router is powered by a 20A 120VAC outlet, so that's 
the opposite of your problem with a 240VAC supply and needing to run 
120VAC loads.  In my case, I used a large transformer (used, on eBay) to 
step up the 120VAC to 240VAC to run the VFD for the spindle motor.  The 
transformer was more expense and weight and heat in the electrical panel 
than I wanted but it was less hassle than running 240VAC to the machine.


If I needed to design a CNC machine for 240VAC with no center neutral, 
I'd buy components that run on 240VAC.  As others already mentioned, 
that's no problem for most devices.  Switching power supplies usually 
have a switch to select 115/230. although many now automatically switch 
or are indifferent to wide input voltages. That should take care of the 
linear DC power supplies for stepper motor drives, linear DC power 
supplies for 5 or 12 or 24 VDC control voltages, and the computer's 
linear power supply.  There are plenty of computer monitors that run on 
120VAC or 240VAC.  For the simple CNC systems I've designed, not having 
120VAC at the wall really shouldn't be much of a problem, and could save 
money on smaller gauge wiring.  Copper is becoming a much more 
significant part of machine building lately.






On 05/28/2018 04:42 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:

If you are in the UK or EU it's not such a big deal since the power isn't split 
phase 110/220 VAC.  PCs, monitors etc are all configured for 220/240 VAC input 
as would be your Mill.  That means the CNC side is also probably powered from 
the same 220/240VAC circuit.

But for North America we have split phase.  My Mill was wired for 220VAC in and 
has a small  transformer (120VAC, 24VAC) to run the power feed and relay logic. 
 The split isn't wired nor does the switch and contactor handle this.

I could run a 250VA Step down transformer to create 110VAC for the PC and 
Monitor (0.8A + 1.7A) or just run them both off 220VAC switched from the same 
master switch that runs the mill.

What are others in North America doing for powering their PCs and Monitors?  
Separate AC outlet/power bar for the PC?

Thanks
John




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Re: [Emc-users] Water or Air cooled spindles

[Bruce Layne]

I've had two of the Chinese 2.2 KW water cooled spindles for the last 
few years and have had no trouble with them.  I consider them to be a 
good value.  Well worth the plumbing hassle, in my opinion.


Be sure to use good quality very flexible tubing of the correct size.  I 
think I got 8mm outside diameter tubing from McMaster-Carr (red for 
supply and blue for return).  I use pink RV antifreeze as the coolant.  
It's used full strength and not diluted.  I use it in the hope that it's 
less corrosive than water.  Neither machine's coolant has had any rust 
or other issues, although there was a slight film of oil that's flushed 
out of the spindle motor.  I'm not worried about it freezing because one 
of the CNC routers is in an attached garage and the other is in my 
basement, and neither get very cold.  I'd actually be more worried about 
the machine rusting if it was in a condensing environment, and the CNC 
routers are mostly aluminum.


I mounted a thin liquid crystal thermometer on the spindle facing the 
operator so I can tell at a glance if the spindle overheats. These 
liquid crystal strip thermometers are readily available on eBay and are 
sold for reptile terrariums.  I buy a bunch of them and put them in 
electrical panels, etc.


I haven't finished wiring it yet, but the production machine will have a 
130F bimetallic button thermal switch siliconed to the spindle motor 
housing and wired into the e-stop circuit to shut everything down if the 
spindle overheats.


The Huanyang VFD produces a lot of electrical noise, apparently mostly 
radiated.  I used ultra flexible shielded four conductor cable (three 
phases plus ground) to keep the cable from radiating much energy.  The 
only place I had an RFI problem was the VGA monitor and a good quality 
VGA cable fixed that problem.


On the larger router, I tried to place a five gallon coolant tank under 
the router and pump the coolant up and then back down to the spindle 
motor.  I was partly motivated by not wanting a leak that siphoned the 
five gallon coolant tank empty.  After some experimentation, I gave up 
and put the coolant tank on top of the CNC router enclosure.  When it 
was underneath, I needed to use such a large pump to have enough 
pressure to pump the coolant six feet vertically that the submerged 
coolant pump was heating the coolant more than the spindle.  It was a 
spindle heater, not a spindle cooler.


We're finally ramping up production, with some programs running 
unattended for ten hours.  I'm going to need to add a radiator in the 
coolant return line and a couple of muffin fans to keep the coolant 
temperature low enough.  The other alternative might be ten or fifteen 
more gallons of coolant to increase the thermal mass, but that seems to 
only delay the overheating problem with greater risk of a severe coolant 
leak.







On 05/22/2018 03:18 PM, Roland Jollivet wrote:

I'm looking at getting one of those 2.2kW air or water cooled spindles +
VFD kits out there for a router.
I'm not worried about the noise difference between the two types.

Has anyone taken apart a water cooled spindle?
How are they doing the cooling? Is it a water jacket or just some copper
tubing inside?
How likely is it to leak in a few months time?
I can only find one video describing leaks and water related shorts etc.
(so they must be good?)

I actually prefer the idea of using air-cooled and making ducting to take
the exhaust away from the spindle nose. Make a closed loop fan-assisted air
duct.
The irony is that I want to use flood cooling on the work. (composite
material)  So it won't be a dry environment.

Regards
Roland
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Re: [Emc-users] Monitoring coolant level

[Bruce Layne]

The low-tech method is a piece of clear vinyl tubing with one end 
connected to the bottom of the coolant tank, the other end connected to 
the top of the coolant tank, and the middle of the tubing routed as a 
vertical sight gauge on the front of the machine.  Added Bonus:  It's an 
analog gauge so you're monitoring the actual level in real time, as 
opposed to getting a digital indication of FULL or NOT FULL, which is 
much more useful information when topping off the coolant tank.  You can 
also use heat shrink tubing or electrical tape to mark the acceptable 
high and low range, like the marks on an oil dipstick.


I use a float switch to shut down the laser if the coolant level is too 
low and I use a flow switch to shut down the laser if the coolant pump 
decides to take a vacation, but I prefer a sight gauge for monitoring 
the coolant level.






On 04/12/2018 02:37 PM, andy pugh wrote:

It isn't easy to get to the coolant tank on my mill (because the tool
cart is there) so I top up the coolant by pouring it in the top.
It's hard to know when to stop, and also to know when it is low.

So I installed one of these:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Plastic-Liquid-Sensor-Double-Floaters/dp/B01EZZKM8U/

Works nicely.

In conjunction with the HAL "message" function I now get a "coolant
high" or "coolant low" message when the machine starts up.

Other versions are available, with more or less range, right-angle
mounting and in stainless steel.

NB. There are two black wires for one switch and two red ones for the
other. It took me a while to figure out what was wrong when I wired as
two red/black pairs.




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Re: [Emc-users] Getting a burned up polygroove belt out of a motor pulley. Need chemist expert

[Bruce Layne]

The self cleaning oven would probably do a good job on the belt residue 
but would almost certainly result in damage to the aluminum's material 
properties.  The self cleaning oven temperature is around 500C.  A quick 
online search seems to indicate 6000 series aluminum experiences 
recrystalization somewhere in the 250C to 300C range, and the effect 
becomes pronounced around 400C.


https://www.researchgate.net/post/Temperature_of_recrystallisation_of_6xxx_aluminum_alloys

A pulley might have sufficient design margins to tolerate the exposure 
to high temperature without subsequent failure, although if there's a 
key slot it may fail.  I wouldn't heat 6xxx aluminum to 500C in anything 
close to a critical application where I needed the original mechanical 
properties.


I'd probably go with a version of the previous suggestion.  Have the 
bandsaw motor spin the pulley and use something like an ice pick to 
mechanically remove the rubbery goo.  I wouldn't push the tool against 
the rotation in the manner of a wood lathe.  That seems like a good way 
to catch the tool in the workpiece, have it spun around and jabbed into 
your arm.  I'd let the tool dragging on the workpiece so it wouldn't 
gouge and kick back.  The material removal rate would be slower but it 
should be a lot faster than removing the pulley, using solvent, baking, 
etc. and then reinstalling it.


Good luck!



On 03/21/2018 11:48 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:

My bet is the toaster ain't going to work.   What will work is if you have
a self-cleaning oven.  But the pulley and any completely blacken cookware
you might want to also clean in the oven and run a self cleaning cycle.
Any organic matter will turn to grey ash and fall off.



On Wed, Mar 21, 2018 at 6:13 PM, Gene Heskett  wrote:


On Wednesday 21 March 2018 19:03:28 N. Christopher Perry wrote:


I’d pull the pulley off and through it into an over set to 450F for a
couple of hours.

N. Christopher Perry

So as not to stink up the house, would a $20 toaster oven do?  It goes up
to about 425F. It would stink up the garage instead that way.

But not till warmer weather as the saw is in an almost unheated shed and
it will take a bit of time as the lower drive wheel will need to come
off to gain good access to the motor pulley. The shed is not well
insulated, so I keep the heat set to just above the dew point to
discourage rust on the machinery in the winter. We're on the inside edge
of the current four-easter, and its a bit chilly out, and still snowing.

Thanks.

On Mar 21, 2018, at 6:45 PM, Gene Heskett 
wrote:

Greetings all;

I have a Rikon 10-325 bandsaw. Trying to cut a block of alu with a
blade thats had one side of it dulled, the blade turned and bound in
the cut, and burned the drive belt, a 240J into the motor pulley.
Rather thoroughly welding the kevlar backing into the pulley.

Does anyone have a recipe for some panther piss that will clean it
out, or am I stuck buying another pulley from Rikon's parts dept?

Thanks.

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  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 


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Re: [Emc-users] PC MB for Linux.

[Bruce Layne]

The firmware inside the SSD does a good job of writing to the entire 
drive to avoid wearing out one small area if a file is rewritten 
continuously.  You can probably plan on 100,000 or more write cycles to 
the entire drive before the FLASH memory wears out.  Again, the SSD 
controller manages bad blocks to try to minimize the damage that you see.


For your part, avoid writing to the swap partition if it's on the SSD.  
You can do this by having a lot of RAM so the operating system isn't 
caching RAM memory contents to the SSD.  This will make the system 
throughput much faster as well if everything doesn't need to grind to a 
halt to cache some RAM to the SSD to load a new application.  If you 
need a swap partition on an SSD, make it as large as possible so the 
drive controller can spread out the writes to the SSD to avoid quickly 
wearing out a small swap partition.


For a bare bones dedicated LinuxCNC machine with 4 GB of RAM, you should 
probably be OK.


All of my LinuxCNC machines now have SSDs as the only hard drives. I 
shouldn't watch YouTube videos and surf the internet while running 
LinuxCNC. :-(





On 10/19/2017 12:14 AM, John Dammeyer wrote:

I do have one question about this module just before I order one.  Is the 
Debian LinuxCNC set up to _not_ use the 'hard drive' for any temp files?
Over time it wouldn't take long to wear out the FLASH memory.

I understand that most of the folders that are used this way are generally 
created and maintained in RAM.  They look as if they are on the hard drive when 
you look at the file directory structure but in fact there are indirect links 
that point to the RAM area.

It normally takes a customized version of the OS to ensure that it's all RAM 
and only during shutdown is information written to the FLASH drive.

I know what they say on the EBAY web site but that doesn't mean it's true.

John





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