Re: Fermi paradox

On 5/10/2021 10:41 AM, Lawrence Crowell wrote: Most interested in space and astronomy are familiar with Enrico Fermi’s question “Where are they?” concerning intelligent life. This so-called Fermi paradox poses the Copernican Principle, that any region of the universe is not unique and so li

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 5/6/2021 6:36 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 30 Apr 2021, at 20:47, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 4/30/2021 4:19 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: If a program can be said to "know" something then can we also

Re: A minimally conscious program

Combines panpsychism with integrated information theory and assumes causal powers are singular.  That's three strikes in the first five minutes. Brent On 4/27/2021 7:26 AM, Philip Thrift wrote: A bit long, but this interview of of the very lucid Hedda Mørch (pronounced "Mark") is very good:(

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 5/2/2021 4:33 AM, Lawrence Crowell wrote: On Monday, April 26, 2021 at 10:16:47 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, Apr 26, 2021 at 10:45 AM Terren Suydam wrote: > It's impossible to refute solipsism True, but it's equally impossible to refute the idea that

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 5/2/2021 4:27 AM, Lawrence Crowell wrote: On Monday, April 26, 2021 at 3:50:14 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 4:29 PM Jason Resch wrote: /> It is quite easy, I think, to define a program that "remembers" (stores and later retrieves ( inf

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/30/2021 11:48 AM, John Clark wrote: On Fri, Apr 30, 2021 at 2:22 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: >> If somebody says "pick up that red object" we both know what is expected of u

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/30/2021 11:20 AM, John Clark wrote: On Fri, Apr 30, 2021 at 12:56 PM Terren Suydam mailto:terren.suy...@gmail.com>> wrote: /> I have arguments against your arguments,/ They say persistence is a virtue so I'll ask the same question for the fourth time;  given that evolution can't s

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/30/2021 4:19 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: If a program can be said to "know" something then can we also say it is conscious of that thing? That's not even common parlance.  Conscious thoughts are fleeting. Knowledge is in memory.  I know how to ride a bicycle /because/ I do it unconsciousl

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/30/2021 2:24 AM, John Clark wrote: Nonsense. If somebody says "pick up that red object" we both know what is expected of us even though we may have very very different mental conceptions of the qualia "red" because we both agree that the dictionary says red is the color formed in the min

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/29/2021 7:08 AM, John Clark wrote: On Thu, Apr 29, 2021 at 9:34 AM Terren Suydam > wrote: /> A theory would give you a way to predict what kinds of beings are capable of feeling pain/ Finding a theory is not a problem, theories are a dime a dozen

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/29/2021 6:34 AM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Thu, Apr 29, 2021 at 1:57 AM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 4/28/2021 9:42 PM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:15 PM 'Brent Meeker&

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/29/2021 1:30 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Am Mi, 28. Apr 2021, um 20:51, schrieb Brent Meeker: On 4/28/2021 9:54 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Am Di, 27. Apr 2021, um 04:07, schrieb 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List: It certainly seems likely that any brain or AI that ca

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/28/2021 9:42 PM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:15 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 4/28/2021 4:40 PM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 7:25 PM 'Brent Meeker&

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/28/2021 4:40 PM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 7:25 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 4/28/2021 3:17 PM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 5:51 PM John Clark mailto:j

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/28/2021 3:17 PM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 5:51 PM John Clark > wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 4:48 PM Terren Suydam mailto:terren.suy...@gmail.com>> wrote: />>> testimony of experience constitutes facts about

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/28/2021 12:09 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 2:02 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 4/28/2021 11:39 AM, Terren Suydam wrote: > > I'm interested in a theory of conscio

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/28/2021 12:03 PM, John Clark wrote: On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 2:41 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: /> one can discover whether your reports of green qualia correspond to something consiste

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/28/2021 11:39 AM, Terren Suydam wrote: I'm interested in a theory of consciousness that can tell me, among other things, how it is that we have conscious experiences when we dream. Don't you wonder about that? No especially.  It's certainly consistent with consciousness being a brai

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/28/2021 9:06 AM, John Clark wrote: /> If we can explain why, for example, you see stars if you bash the back of your head,/ It might be able to explain why I say "I see green stars" but that's not what you're interested in, you want to know why I subjectively experience the gr

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/26/2021 11:11 PM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Tue, Apr 27, 2021 at 1:27 AM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: However, in a certain sense, intelligence is easier because it's constrained. Intellig

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/26/2021 10:07 PM, Terren Suydam wrote: On Mon, Apr 26, 2021 at 10:08 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: It certainly seems likely that any brain or AI that can perceive sensory events and form an inner n

Re: A minimally conscious program

It certainly seems likely that any brain or AI that can perceive sensory events and form an inner narrative and memory of that is conscious in a sense even if they are unable to act. This is commonly the situation during a dream.  One is aware of dreamt events but doesn't actually move in respo

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/26/2021 8:16 AM, John Clark wrote: On Mon, Apr 26, 2021 at 10:45 AM Terren Suydam mailto:terren.suy...@gmail.com>> wrote: > It's impossible to refute solipsism True, but it's equally impossible to refute the idea that everything including rocks is conscious. And if both a theory a

Re: A minimally conscious program

On 4/26/2021 8:03 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Mon, Apr 26, 2021, 5:29 AM John Clark > wrote: On Mon, Apr 26, 2021 at 6:06 AM Telmo Menezes mailto:te...@telmomenezes.net>> wrote: >> And for anemotion like pain write a program such that the

Re: BATS (was:Qualia and communicability)

On 4/14/2021 12:36 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Wed, Apr 14, 2021 at 1:41 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 4/14/2021 3:22 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 11 Apr 2021, at 20:55, 'Brent Mee

Re: BATS (was:Qualia and communicability)

On 4/14/2021 3:22 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 11 Apr 2021, at 20:55, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: That would be of some interest but I think it would fail to communicate what it is like to be a bat because of the i

Re: BATS (was:Qualia and communicability)

On 4/12/2021 11:17 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 1:12 PM John Clark > wrote: On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 12:35 PM Jason Resch mailto:jasonre...@gmail.com>> wrote: /> An ant brain has hundreds of thousands of neurons and tens of mi

Re: BATS (was:Qualia and communicability)

That would be of some interest but I think it would fail to communicate what it is like to be a bat because of the inability to act as a bat.  I'm not sure your brain could learn to interpret visual input if it were not able to correlate it with touch and movement. Brent On 4/11/2021 11:06 AM

Re: Qualia and communicability

On 4/9/2021 3:31 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Fri, Apr 9, 2021, 4:23 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 4/9/2021 4:57 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 9 Apr 2021, at 02:40, 'Brent Mee

Re: Qualia and communicability

On 4/9/2021 4:57 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 9 Apr 2021, at 02:40, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 4/8/2021 12:38 PM, Jason Resch wrote: Hi Telmo, Thank you for these links, they are very helpful in articulat

Re: Qualia and communicability

On 4/8/2021 12:38 PM, Jason Resch wrote: Hi Telmo, Thank you for these links, they are very helpful in articulating the problem. I think you are right about there being some connection between communication of qualia and the symbol grounding problem. I used to think there were two kinds of

Re: Carlo Rovelli: The Old Fisherman's Mistake

On 4/2/2021 1:10 PM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: Am 02.04.2021 um 20:27 schrieb Brent Meeker: On 4/1/2021 11:39 PM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: Only philosophically naive neuroscientists reject realism . I am sorry, I have not understood your answer. Do you mean that a person sees red flowers

Re: Carlo Rovelli: The Old Fisherman's Mistake

On 4/1/2021 8:10 AM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: Am 31.03.2021 um 20:16 schrieb Brent Meeker: Yes, in general he sees the flowers where they are located (I don't know what "physically" adds to "located").  He can reach out with stick and accurately touch the flowers.  He

Re: Q Anon is the tip of the iceberg

On 4/1/2021 2:37 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 1 Apr 2021, at 00:08, Philip Benjamin > wrote: [*Bruno Marchal*] I think Trump is a symptom, not a cause *[Philip Benjamin]* Symptom of what? What exactly are the reasons why he is so hated? Personal? Official?

Re: Q Anon is the tip of the iceberg

On 3/31/2021 10:21 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 25 Feb 2021, at 20:30, Telmo Menezes > wrote: Are you sure that any of that stuff really matters? To be clear, I am against tearing down some of those agreements. I do think that China should be sanctioned for co

Re: Carlo Rovelli: The Old Fisherman's Mistake

On 3/29/2021 5:17 PM, Lawrence Crowell wrote: Rovelli is a loop quantum gravitation maven. This is a very ontological physics, and explains in part Rovelli's stance. The though has occurred to me that maybe LQG states are the kernel of some sort of target map. Either than or they are epistemi

Fwd: Carlo Rovelli: The Old Fisherman's Mistake

Forwarded Message *The Old Fisherman's Mistake* ROVELLI, Carlo (2021) Abstract A number of thorny issues such as the nature of time, free will, the clash of the manifest and scientific images, the possibility of a naturalistic foundation of morality, and perhaps even th

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/17/2021 2:42 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 16 Mar 2021, at 19:53, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 3/16/2021 2:27 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 15 Mar 2021, at 10:23, smitra <mailto:smi...@zonnet.nl>>

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/16/2021 2:27 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 15 Mar 2021, at 10:23, smitra wrote: On 14-03-2021 20:03, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List wrote: On 3/14/2021 3:24 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: The laws are constructs of the human mind. [Lawrence] The expression of the laws are con

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/14/2021 3:24 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: The laws are constructs of the human mind.  [Lawrence] The expression of the laws are constructs of the human mind, but I guess you are OK that F=GmM/r^2 was as much approximately true before human life appears on this planet and after. OK? I t

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/12/2021 1:09 AM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Friday, March 12, 2021 at 1:03:38 AM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/11/2021 2:23 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 10:27:35 PM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/11/2021 9:44 AM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Thursday,

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/12/2021 12:53 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: So, the algorithm to save democracy and science would be 1) abolish the prohibition laws (or equivalently, reinstate the free-market, If you lived in Texas, you'd have a $16,000 electric bill.  :-) Brent -- You received this message because you a

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/11/2021 2:23 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 10:27:35 PM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/11/2021 9:44 AM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 1:26:27 AM UTC+1 Bruce wrote: On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 10:52 AM Tomas Pales wrote:

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/11/2021 9:44 AM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 1:26:27 AM UTC+1 Bruce wrote: On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 10:52 AM Tomas Pales wrote: If there is a contradiction in the definition of an object, that means that the law of identity is violated and

Re: more books on quantum foundations

On 3/11/2021 3:51 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: When doing theology (aka metaphysics) with the scientific method, it is better to not commit oneself in any ontological assumption at the start That's pretty funny coming from a guy who assumes all of arithmetic exists as a starting point. Brent

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/10/2021 3:52 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Thursday, March 11, 2021 at 12:15:43 AM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/10/2021 2:41 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:29:13 PM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/10/2021 1:18 AM, Tomas Pales wrote: Then you've

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

r than the string itself. Jason On Wed, Mar 10, 2021, 3:43 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 3/10/2021 7:15 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 10 Mar 2021, at 00:19, 'Brent Meeker' via Eve

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/10/2021 2:51 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Wed, Mar 10, 2021, 4:38 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 3/10/2021 9:41 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Wed, Mar 10, 2021, 11:29 AM 'Brent Mee

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/10/2021 2:41 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:29:13 PM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/10/2021 1:18 AM, Tomas Pales wrote: Then you've either (1) changed the meaning of "real" existence (2) changed the meaning of possible or (3) gone mad. As I said, poss

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/10/2021 9:41 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Wed, Mar 10, 2021, 11:29 AM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 3/10/2021 1:18 AM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:40:51 AM UTC+1 Brent wro

Re: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why

On 3/10/2021 7:33 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 9 Mar 2021, at 20:06, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 3/9/2021 5:29 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 6 Feb 2021, at 20:27, John Clark <mailto:johnkcl...@gmail.com>&

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/10/2021 7:15 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 10 Mar 2021, at 00:19, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 3/9/2021 2:00 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 6:00 AM Jason Resch <mailto:jasonre...@gmail

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/10/2021 1:18 AM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 6:40:51 AM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/9/2021 3:52 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 12:29:07 AM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/9/2021 3:03 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: The law of id

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/9/2021 3:52 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: On Wednesday, March 10, 2021 at 12:29:07 AM UTC+1 Brent wrote: On 3/9/2021 3:03 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: The law of identity determines what can possibly exist, namely that which is identical to itself. But what is the difference betwe

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/9/2021 3:03 PM, Tomas Pales wrote: The law of identity determines what can possibly exist, namely that which is identical to itself. But what is the difference between a possibly existing object and a "really" existing object? I see no difference, and hence all possible objects exist, ne

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/9/2021 2:55 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 9:46 AM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 3/9/2021 1:20 PM, John Clark wrote: On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 1:57 AM Kim Jones mailto:kimjo...@oze

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/9/2021 2:30 PM, Philip Benjamin wrote: If nothing ever existed, nothing can exist today. “Ex nihilo, nihil fit” (Parmenides). Yeah, but what has he published recently? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubs

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/9/2021 2:00 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 6:00 AM Jason Resch > wrote: On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 9:41 AM Lawrence Crowell mailto:goldenfieldquaterni...@gmail.com>> wrote: Nothingness is a paradoxical thing. Does nothingness exi

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/9/2021 1:20 PM, John Clark wrote: On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 1:57 AM Kim Jones > wrote: /> What was there before there was nothing?/ "Before" implies time and time implies change; if nothing exists then nothing can change, and if nothing can change time

Re: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why

On 3/9/2021 5:29 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 6 Feb 2021, at 20:27, John Clark > wrote: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why John K Clark My comment there: << Why to assume even one universe? We know

Re: Why Does Anything Exist?

On 3/9/2021 12:22 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 12:57 AM Kim Jones > wrote: What was there before there was nothing? I don't believe reality was ever a state of absolute nothingness. Rather, there are things that exist necessarily: logi

Re: cognitive functioning in extremists

On 2/26/2021 1:49 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List wrote: We don't live in a free country, but a land that is increasingly menaced by an oligarchy funding democratic socialist (soviet) causes. The oligarchs funding tax cuts for the rich, voter suppression measures, repealing the ACA,

Re: Q Anon is the tip of the iceberg

On 2/25/2021 4:03 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: With the mainstream adoption of the Internet, in the early 2000s, political campaigns were reinvented (data-driven, highly targeted like advertisement). The early examples of this appear to be Tony Blair's second campaign in the UK and Obama's first

Re: Q Anon is the tip of the iceberg

On 2/25/2021 11:30 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Are you sure that any of that stuff really matters? To be clear, I am against tearing down some of those agreements. I do think that China should be sanctioned for committing genocide, and I am skeptical of things like TPP. I certainly don't desire

Re: Q Anon is the tip of the iceberg

On 2/25/2021 2:55 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 24 Feb 2021, at 15:30, Telmo Menezes > wrote: As an outside observer, I can't help but notice the following pattern in American politics: every presidential election is now seen as a civilization-threatening event

Re: Q Anon is the tip of the iceberg

On 2/24/2021 12:36 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 24 Feb 2021, at 05:14, spudboy100 via Everything List > wrote: Well look at it this way The billionaires the globalist all the same funded and conspired with news media according to Time magazine a cou

Re: [Consciousness-Online] FW: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds")

On 2/20/2021 12:22 PM, Philip Benjamin wrote: When the last breath was gone, life ceased. So the ancients considered soul/spirit of life as something akin to wind. That's why the Pythagoreans forbade eating beans. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google G

Re: [Consciousness-Online] FW: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds")

On 2/19/2021 8:03 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Am Fr, 19. Feb 2021, um 05:59, schrieb 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List: On 2/18/2021 8:54 PM, Samiya Illias wrote: God is One and Only! But /*which*/ one and only God?  Agdistis or Angdistis, Ah Puch, Ahura Mazda, Alber

Re: [Consciousness-Online] FW: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds")

source. ** *Philip Benjamin* *From:* 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List *Sent:* Thursday, February 18, 2021 1:55 PM *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com *Subject:* Re: [Consciousness-Online] FW: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds") It's not &quo

Re: [Consciousness-Online] FW: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds")

On 2/19/2021 4:57 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Feb 2021, at 06:59, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 2/18/2021 8:54 PM, Samiya Illias wrote: God is One and Only! But /*which*/ one and only God?  Agdistis or

Re: [Consciousness-Online] FW: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds")

On 2/18/2021 8:54 PM, Samiya Illias wrote: God is One and Only! But /*which*/ one and only God? Agdistis or Angdistis, Ah Puch, Ahura Mazda, Alberich, Allah, Amaterasu, An, Anansi, Anat, Andvari, Anshar, Anu, Aphrodite, Apollo, Apsu, Ares, Artemis, Asclepius, Athena, Athirat, Athtart, Atla

Re: [Consciousness-Online] FW: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds")

It's not "taboo".  It's non-existent because we don't know what dark-matter is.  It's like saying the genetics of Big Foot are taboo because we're not studying them.  There are an infinite number to "possibilities" that are not being studies for the simple reason that nobody thinks they're wort

Re: papers on probabilities & MWI

On 2/17/2021 6:46 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Thu, Feb 18, 2021 at 1:05 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 2/17/2021 4:29 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: Thus previous experience is no guide to the future in MWI.

Re: papers on probabilities & MWI

On 2/17/2021 4:29 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Thu, Feb 18, 2021 at 10:51 AM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 2/17/2021 2:07 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Thu, Feb 18, 2021 at 7:26 AM 'sce

Re: papers on probabilities & MWI

On 2/17/2021 2:07 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Thu, Feb 18, 2021 at 7:26 AM 'scerir' via Everything List > wrote: just few links! http://users.ox.ac.uk/~everett/docs/Hemmo%20Pitowsky%20Quantum%20probability.pdf

Re: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why

On 2/9/2021 7:55 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: Hilbert space is a kind of vector space.  Vectors can always be expressed in terms of different basis vectors. *I've refreshed my understanding of Hilbert spaces. So, if you really believe your second sentence above, doesn't it make the idea

Re: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why

On 2/9/2021 2:46 AM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 12:13:37 AM UTC-7 Brent wrote: On 2/8/2021 9:31 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 9:22:29 PM UTC-7 Brent wrote: On 2/8/2021 7:50 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: *More

Re: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why

On 2/8/2021 9:31 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 9:22:29 PM UTC-7 Brent wrote: On 2/8/2021 7:50 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: *More important, I don't think your comment relates to what I wrote immediately above in RED -- which is consistent with

Re: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why

On 2/8/2021 7:50 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: *More important, I don't think your comment relates to what I wrote immediately above in RED -- which is consistent with Bohr's view that a system is NOT in any specific eigenstate before measurement* I don't know the quote from B

Re: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why

On 2/8/2021 12:40 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 1:25:47 PM UTC-7 Brent wrote: On 2/8/2021 4:12 AM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 4:13:38 AM UTC-7 johnk...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Feb 7, 2021 at 7:25 PM Alan Grayson

Re: Parallel Worlds Probably Exist. Here’s Why

On 2/8/2021 4:12 AM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 4:13:38 AM UTC-7 johnk...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Feb 7, 2021 at 7:25 PM Alan Grayson wrote: >> A hydroelectric dam producing electricity and the accelerating expansion of the universe

Re: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds")

On 2/3/2021 3:49 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Wednesday, February 3, 2021 at 3:39:44 PM UTC-7 Brent wrote: On 2/3/2021 12:25 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Wednesday, February 3, 2021 at 10:55:13 AM UTC-7 johnk...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Feb 3, 2021 at 10:05 AM Alan Gray

Re: Falling Outward (was: Words, definitions, and Many "Worlds")

On 2/3/2021 12:25 PM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Wednesday, February 3, 2021 at 10:55:13 AM UTC-7 johnk...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Feb 3, 2021 at 10:05 AM Alan Grayson wrote: /> in GR universes evolve in time, but cannot instantaneously evolve faster than the SoL./

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/29/2021 5:52 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: If you induce decoherence by measuring at the slits, then the interference pattern disappears -- you have certainly created a separate "world" for each path, but these can no longer interfere. That is part of the definition of the "worlds" that are

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/27/2021 8:42 PM, Pierz Newton-John wrote: On 28 Jan 2021, at 2:49 pm, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List wrote: On 1/27/2021 5:11 PM, Pierz Newton-John wrote: I’m not saying decoherence is reversible. I’ve corrected myself (or accepted your correction) on that poi

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/27/2021 5:11 PM, Pierz Newton-John wrote: I’m not saying decoherence is reversible. I’ve corrected myself (or accepted your correction) on that point. But my understanding of proposals for disconfirming MWI involve extending quantum coherence to larger and larger scales. Deutsch has arg

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/27/2021 3:06 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 9:51 AM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> wrote: On 1/27/2021 2:28 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 3:08 AM Bruno Marchal mailto:marc..

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/27/2021 2:28 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 3:08 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: Also, worlds interfere statistically, by do not interact at all. A term in a superposition cannot interact with any other terms, but we can make them interfe

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/25/2021 5:39 AM, Alan Grayson wrote: On Wednesday, January 20, 2021 at 12:59:02 PM UTC-7 Brent wrote: On 1/20/2021 3:58 AM, John Clark wrote: On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 12:01 AM Alan Grayson wrote: >> No, there are *NOT*exactly 10 winners! There are an

Re: Evolution 2.0 Prize - $10 million

Read Nick Lane's book, "The Vital Question"  and  listen to his address to the Royal Society.  It's online. Brent On 1/20/2021 3:52 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List wrote: For Chemistry, specifically biochemistry, we still cannot after 70 years(?) go beyond the Stanley Miller-Harold Urey exp

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/20/2021 3:58 AM, John Clark wrote: On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 12:01 AM Alan Grayson > wrote: >> No, there are *NOT*exactly 10 winners! There are an astronomical number to an astronomical power number horses that won that race with only a

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/20/2021 12:34 AM, Pierz Newton-John wrote: On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 at 6:29 pm, Alan Grayson > wrote: On Tuesday, January 19, 2021 at 10:08:21 PM UTC-7 Pierz wrote: On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 at 4:01 pm, Alan Grayson wrote: On Tuesd

Re: Evolution 2.0 Prize - $10 million

On 1/18/2021 11:27 PM, smitra wrote: On 19-01-2021 05:44, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List wrote: On 1/18/2021 3:58 PM, smitra wrote: On 18-01-2021 18:03, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: Am 18.01.2021 um 01:01 schrieb Lawrence Crowell: There are molecules that already do thi

Re: Evolution 2.0 Prize - $10 million

On 1/18/2021 3:58 PM, smitra wrote: On 18-01-2021 18:03, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: Am 18.01.2021 um 01:01 schrieb Lawrence Crowell: There are molecules that already do this. DNA and polypeptides are sequences that are in effect codes. Yes, this is exactly the point by the prize. The question i

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/17/2021 10:00 PM, Pierz Newton-John wrote: One needs to mention Frauchiger and Renner’s result here, which makes rigorous the intuitive “Wigner’s friend” type argument and shows that a single-world QM is inconsistent, Does it?  Seems to me F&R's experiment doesn't realize Wigner's frien

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

Thanks. On 1/16/2021 11:20 PM, 'scerir' via Everything List wrote: That's behind a paywall.  Can you post a copy? Brent I hope it works http://www.socsci.uci.edu/~jabarret/bio/publications/ToBeAWorld.pdf -- You rec

Re: Q Anon is the tip of the iceberg

On 1/16/2021 4:11 AM, John Clark wrote: On Fri, Jan 15, 2021 at 10:00 PM spudboy100 via Everything List > wrote: /> For me, all I need to see is which companies are doing the censoring?/ To censor someone you need the power to imprison or kill

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

On 1/16/2021 4:25 AM, Pierz Newton-John wrote: On Sat, 16 Jan 2021 at 8:16 pm, 'scerir' via Everything List > wrote: Pierz wrote: "If you want to argue against the internal logic of MWI, you have to start by accepting what it proposes then

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

021 5:00 PM, smitra wrote: Decoherence should be irrelevant. Whether or not you (considered as some given physical system) have measured something, should not only depend on the entanglement between the measured system and those that belong to you. Saibal On 16-01-2021 00:48, 'Brent Mee

Re: Born's rule from almost nothing

Julian Barbour had a metaphor in which the multiverse is like a river with infinitely many streamlines which differ only at a microscopic level where they can interfere but it makes no difference at the macroscopic level of the river.  But there can be divisions by islands in the stream that sp

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