The Globe and Mail, Monday, April 17, 2000
Economist guru blasts system
Former World Bank insider Joseph Stiglitz says the international
financial setup is undemocratic and overly secretive
By Barrie McKenna
Washington -- Joseph Stiglitz, once a powerful World Bank insider, has
crossed the
Greetings,
Leaders in business and education think Ontario gov't has gone too far
in bashing liberal education. available on-line with on-site 7 day
search using "High-tech CEOs"
http://www.theglobeandmail.com
Steve
The Globe and Mail, Apr. 8:
There could be trouble ahead As Opec flexes
its muscles and the price of oil rises,
recession becomes a frightening reality
Source: The Observer
Greetings,
I couldn't resist the opportinity of sharing this with you. The race to
the bottom (of the physical resource barrel) continues on merry unison.
The last 25 lines or so beginning "Economics should not..." get right to
the point.
Steve
I couldn't quickly determine which date this appeared, but it seems
recent.
Steve
CPI REPORT DID NOT
INCLUDE ENERGY COSTS
By JOHN CRUDELE
NY POST
Did Washington eliminate the rising price of oil from
the last Consumer Price Index?
If you have a car, you know that the price of gasoline
has
that a mental apartheid exists for listmembers which
accepts internal inconsistency as the norm. Limits are ignored as
'inconvenient'.
As I personally have finite time and energy, I bid you ado. Enjoy your
fantasia while it lasts.
Steve Kurtz
(fwd from POL-SCI-TECH list)
Clampdown hits Shanghai cyber cafés
---
China has closed 127 Internet cafés in Shanghai in a new effort to curb
the spread of online information, which is threatening to mushroom out
of control.
Hi Doug,
This reminded me of your work. I'm Cc Gary Kaeter, the author of this
page.
The relevant website of yours is :
http://www.socialtechnology.org/index.html
(to remind folks help Gary).
Cheers,
Steve Kurtz
We all want to help our planet and our future. Thats a natural fact!
Most
Greetings,
I don't agree with:
"In this instance, "Sustainability" means that
business and population growth could continue at no expense or
degradation to the environment..."
but they have recognized that there is a problem.
Steve
---
Oregon Will
Harry,
Major assumption here:
The not very secret solution to the problem is to change this potty
thinking that we must find ways to feed the multitude. The way to attack
the problem of inadequate "proper services and health care" is to make it
possible for people to provide them
Harry,
So we should believe you, an economist?, and choose a Georgist
philosophy (which was formulated when global pop was around the 2B that
many thousands of scientists think is close to optimal) rather than
believe the scientific consensus shown below.
Harry:
If there isn't enough land, how
benefits all. New pipelines will permit new trickles, but I bet others
are quietly closed over time.
Since I am new to WSN, I'll add that my focus is a materially
sustainable healthy habitat, which in my opinion is necessary for any
socio-economic system to thrive.
Steve Kurtz
This was just sent to me. A "Dr.Strangelove" sequel may be in order.
Steve
In this week's New Scientist is an article on the threat of biological
warfare on the world's crops (particularly monocultures) and suggests it
implementation
of the first tithe, from production to development.
snip
Steve Kurtz
Hi Douglas all,
Fear not, you're not alone.
As far as I could figure out from 2 years of reading Wes Burt's
'solution' posts, a re-distribution or tithing of a greater % of
national income is his key. I love to skim his posts now, looking for
new (to me) historic references, as my background
Colin Stark writes:
I believe that the balance that must be reached is between Voluntary
Simplicity (mainly on the part of the developed Nations) and population
REDUCTION -- the main contribution the City of Aspen (and most of us in N.
America) can make is in the realm of Voluntary
in my opinion. As
long as human population expands, migration pressure will continue until
all habitats are trashed and predation becomes the universal norm.
Reversing population growth is the most humane choice in my opinion.
BTW, the US is the 4th most populated nation on earth.
Steve Kurtz
Sorry for this timewarp to Dec 6, when I first attempted to post the
attached. I have changed servers (new email addr), and had difficulty
setting parameters for list subscriptions.
John C. makes his points well in this post. The commonweal, though,
needs more than an apportionment plan for
Hi Brad,
As usual I find your analysis mostly cogent and challenging. Perhaps you
can help me here:
When the word
"transcendental" is as trendy as "algorithmic" there
will be some hope for a future.
I'm familiar with the "Transcendentalist" writers including Emerson and
Thoreau. What
I received this privately, and am skeptical. Anyone else hear about it?
I'll do a search for the alleged legal firm report back.
Steve
Please read the following carefully if you intend to stay on-line and
continue using email:
The last few months have revealed an alarming trend in
Greetings,
There is a long history of personal property acquisition by governing
bodies for various reasons. The notion of "Eminent Domain" is written in
laws in the US; I'm not familiar with other countries. Of course the
criteria for the grab can vary from road building to reservoir
from the Amer. Physical Society, Nov 26, 1999
APPLIED PHYSICS: HARNESSING THE LAWS OF NATURE FOR POLITICS.
While the Democratic, Republican and Reform parties engage in
destructive internal squabbles over the selection of their
presidential candidates, the Natural Law Party has peacefully
Maybe of interest to some.
Steve
Original Message
Subject: ECB wants bigger say in e-commerce
Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 12:49:31 +0100
From: "Danyal Sattar" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "'Social Banking List'" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
FT 8 November 1999
ECB wants
Thanks for this fwd, Sally. I've been thinking along these lines for
some time. My brief comments follow.
I don't think this guy is an irrational scare monger. A double whammy
could result if energy, food, and water scarcities inflate prices for
necessities at the same time that high tech toys
As I sent off my last comments, this arrived! I actually worked with Ed
at EF Hutton in the late 70s. This monthly alert is free., the website
is quite good IMO.
Steve
Original Message
Subject: New on Dr. Ed's Economics Network
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:22:24 -0500
From: "Ed
(Forgive any duplicate postings)
Six Billion of Us: Boo or Hooray?
By Donella Meadows mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
OCTOBER 8, 1999
Months ago the United Nations decided to make an event out of the fact that
the human population meter would soon click over another billion. They
picked an arbitrary
Peter Challen wrote:
While entering the futurework arena, I slip in thoughts in a wider
perspective, just hoping they might be an encourgement to some,
where the money idol reigns so disastrously and denies
dignity to so many :-
While I agree with most of your sentiments, cementing them
FYI,
Steve
America's Vanishing Biodiversity
By Catherine Lazaroff
Environment News
WASHINGTON, DC, September 21, 1999 (ENS) - Biological diversity in the
United States is declining dramatically, a new U.S. Geological Survey
assessment
Greetings,
I've presented my (similiar) views on this linkage for the three years
I've been on-line, and received little response. With the limits of
waste sinks and non-renewable resources, growth /or development (even
with better technology and social policy) are proving incapable of
providing
Beaming Prayers to God's Last-Known
Residence
Now here's an even-handed approach to the debate between
creationism and science. Newprayer.com is offering to use
a
"directional radio transmitter" to beam prayers to the part of
the universe
Free weekly mailings from American Physical Society:
http://www.aps.org
Steve
Original Message
From: "What's New" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: What's New for Aug 27, 1999
WHAT'S NEW Robert L. Park Friday, 27 Aug 99 Washington, DC
1. DEVOLUTION: WILL NO ONE STAND UP FOR
Greetings,
Go to URL link below to see story of funding sources, 37 orgs
protesting.
Steve
EDF DISPATCH: From Environmental Defense Fund
Tuesday, August 24 1999
*
4. ENVIRONMENTAL RECORD SULLIES WORLD FINANCE AGENCIES
China's Three Gorges Dam is one of many
Despite the fact that this is within the present system and not a
paradigm shift or "Second Strategy" (Y. Bajard), it is IMO still a
positive. It legitimizes to some extent the recognition that there is a
'problem'; many still try to deny even that.
Steve
PS
Sorry for format, note this
This is self-explanatory. Governments will likely pick up on it if they
haven't something like it already.
Steve
--
This info comes from the Center for Media and Democracy
http://www.prwatch.org/99-Q1/outrage.html
Greetings,
Occasional 'positive' news merits posting, since we are deluged with the
negative. This seems less 'double edged' than the overestimates of
population growth, which are due to rising mortality and topping out of
longevity as well as to declining fertility rates.
Steve
Original Message
From: "BrainFood" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Book Alert!
*Permission to reprint granted!
(by Jay Hanson)
---
Why is economic theory so screwed-up? Why do economists invariably
assume
what they
Purpose: Marketing? I'd bet yes. But that doesn't negate the impact of
public education, albeit superficial, re the risks involved. I wonder
about pesticide, fungicide, synthetic fertilizer... content; maybe
that's the next target.
Steve
WASHINGTON, July 30 -/E-Wire/-- Greenpeace
Please email me off list if you would like a copy of a summary of the
state of affairs in this field. I hesitate to post it because it is
perhaps 4 pages long. I was unable to stop reading it once I began.
Implications for the future of work and social processes are enormous,
and both the article
A most interesting website IMO.
Steve
- - - - -
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Thinktank/6926/y2krep.html
Conclusions of the US Naval War College Year 2000 International Security
Dimension Project Report
Conclusion #1
How You Describe Y2K Depends on From When You View It
Greetings,
Many discussions on Futurework stimulate some of us to repeatedly
interject that goods, services, credits, and debits are not nearly the
whole picture. Here is an indication that the US leadership will have
some of these ideas presented to them by a body widely recognized as
Tom Walker wrote:
Context, Steve, context.
Your response to Jim Stanford's piece seemed to
miss the point that poor-bashing and welfare-bashing have been mainstays of
the self-styled individualist, "free market" line since time immemorial.
Maybe that's the opinion of some about the actions
support low
income mortgage pools, hospitals, bridges, schools, water, sewage
treatment, etc.
If Stanford qualifies as an economist, I'll seriously think about
hanging up a shingle re-joining his 'real economy' as a competing
consultant in the field.
Steve Kurtz
Ottawa
-
(CAW economist Jim Stanford is a visiting fellow with the CCPA.)
Taken from The CCPA Monitor, June 1999.
tgage pools, hospitals, bridges, schools, water, sewage
treatment, etc.
If Stanford qualifies as an economist, I'll seriously think about
hanging up a shingle re-joining his 'real economy' as a competing
consultant in the field.
Steve Kurtz
Ottawa
-
(CAW economist Jim Stanford is a visiting fellow with the CCPA.)
Taken from The CCPA Monitor, June 1999.
I agree in general with Thomas' evaluations. Enforcing peace with the
threat of force seems a particularly perverse requirement, though. We
humans are alone in this particular dilemma, as ethics appears tied to
our form of self-reflective consciousness.
Steve
Thomas:
It would seem to me,
FIRST EU THREAT TO WITHHOLD FUNDING OVER ENVIRONMENTAL COMPLIANCE
BRUSSELS, Belgium, July 8, 1999 - The European Commission has told five
countries that they may not be eligible for European Union (EU) regional
aid money unless they properly apply European nature laws.
Published in cooperation
News Hour had a program about what issues citizens think the
presidential candidates should discuss. I realize that the PBS audience
isn't representative of the general population, so this may not mean too
much to the pols.
Steve
-
http://www.uexpress.com/ups/opinion/column/gg/text/1999/06/gg9906011832.html
POPULATION GROWTH IS PIVOTAL ISSUE IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT
by Georgie Anne Geyer
WASHINGTON -- It's not working.
For years, people who were against family planning could argue, and
hope, and pretend, and weave tales
US leaders (incl Al Gore) better change their tune or they may end up
isolated from the rest of the planet when the next recession arrives.
Steve
---
"NATURAL" DISASTERS A MISNOMER, UN LEADER SAYS
GENEVA, Switzerland, July 6, 1999
Thank you Thomas for thoughtfully restating some of the questions that I
have tried to ask during my three years on this list. Attention to the
quality and durability of human societies demands that jobs/work not be
bound by traditional economic definitions.
Steve
(excerpt)
Thomas Lunde:
But
FYI. (posted to pol-sci-tech by Ian Pitchford)
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: 2 JULY 1999
UNESCO
http://www.unesco.org/
World Conference on Science adopts declaration
Budapest, Hungary, July 2 - The World Conference on Science ended its
six-day
meeting by adopting a Declaration on Science and the Use
Re-post from KZPG (excerpt) by Ed Glaze
"We don't see Y6B as a problem, but rather a milestone," said
Zero Population Growth Director of Communications Tim Cline. The mission
of
Y6B is to educate women, provide women
This was posted to Ecol-Econ list today. It addresses some of the issues
which Thomas Lunde I recently discussed. The liklihood of a world of
"eco-villages" is remote IMO, increasingly so with Y6B(global pop)
still growing.
But the outline of the issues seems solid to me. Perhaps that's why I
Dear Thomas,
I think JG's argument is a 'thought experiment':
As a first step, imagine a national economy entirely closed to trade. Such
an economy will have three basic types of activity in it.
He never claims that reality operates in this fashion. Trade has been
part of most national
This is the second positive article I've seen in Canadian mainstream
press in the past few weeks. They are somewhat ahead of New England,
which is the 'greenest' area in the US. Looks like we really may have
picked a compatible city as our next home.
Steve
Original Message
Hi Jan,
Jan Matthieu wrote:
How many investors are nowadays buying (and holding on to) stocks for the
dividends they produce? Nowadays stocks are bought primarily because their
value is expected to rise.
In my outline essay on this subject I exclude direct investment in
equity markets.
Dear Thomas,
TL:
Your argument about "natural/material" value, rather than token value has
some merit. I would appreciate your comments in the context of Galbraith
(not in quote) who gives these figures. 10% are employed in the knowledge
sector, 10% in the manufacturing of goods and 80% in
Durant wrote:
Non-virtual profits are falling - there is not enough to
re-distribute.
(snip)
The global markets are limited - there is, I'm afraid, the
classic contradiction.
Do you really think it can be fixed?
I agree with Eva here! But it is not *just* markets profits that are
**FORWARDED MESSAGE** [re: joining a global online dialogue "debating
issues
such as the monetary and financial architecture of the global economy,
economic and social policies of an evolving world, and educational needs
for a world
community."]
--- Forwarded Message Follows ---
Date
Hi Thomas all,
Thanks for the clear, informative review. I've interacted with JG, and
he has shied away from my questions about the impact of the sharp rise
in the size of the labor force since WWII. I'm *not* disputing any of
the factors described in the review; I'm suggesting that at the same
BBC Friday, May 7, 1999 Published at 17:32 GMT 18:32 UK
Historic Green victory
The Scottish Green Party is celebrating a political landmark
[Picture: Britain's first Green parliamentarian has been elected in
Scotland, hailing the victory as an historic one. }
Robin Harper, principal
Some news items which may be of interest.
Steve
--
Dog slaughter follows pig cull
http://news.bbc.co.uk/low/english/world/asia-pacific/newsid_324000/324176.stm
Malaysian officials have begun slaughtering stray dogs in an attempt
Passing along a very interesting article sent by Al Bartlett.
Steve
-
Dear Friends,
Here is an interesting item from the Philippines.
With best wishes, I am,
Sincerely yours,
Al
Albert A. Bartlett: Professor Emeritus
FYI. Rather good news given the strength of US economy (traditional terms of
measurement). It suggests that alternate indicators of well-being perhaps
sustainability are being considered.
_
Green Party's Victory Stunned
the book from the web-link below.
CSF depends on your involvement to help insure its sustainability.
Steve Kurtz
-
SEMINAR ANNOUNCEMENT:
Jeffrey Gates
The Ownership Solution
Bertrand Schneider is the recent past Sec'y Gen'l of The Club of Rome.
Subject:
Re: response from Worldwatch V.P. re population
To:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Steve,
The lack of focus on population has always been a problem linked to the
sustainable
development. But we have to
ditorial opening. ("We
appreciate having readers like you who are paying careful attention to what we
write.")
Steve Kurtz
*
Steve,
I am responding to your comments about the importance of keeping population
growth in the forefront of environmental planning.
FYI,
Steve
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 13:41:06 +1000 (GMT+1000)
From: Carole Renouf [EMAIL PROTECTED]
A quick summary of our lay panel's report for those who may be interested,
but I am sure you will find more detail in due course on the
Australian
Thanks Pete Mike for clarifying re the .exe file for Happy 99 virus. Luckily I
haven't set an auto execute I was familiar with the name of this virus.
Steve
--
"To teach how to live without certainty, and yet without being
paralyzed by hesitation, is perhaps the chief thing that
This appears to be an example of random garbage email output of the "Happy 99"
virus that is transmitted by opening a *FILE* attached to an email. I'm a
moderator of ecological-economics list, it was sent twice. The poster did send
another post in readable english, so the virus must seek recent
Financed by NASA, US Dept of Agric., an airline, some foundations (incl
business), but appears positive to me. Of course, I haven't seen it yet. :-) The
second segment focuses on urbanization, population growth, their impacts!
Co-ordinated educational materials are available for free as well.
Simplistic, has problems with growth.., but for editors of a paper in a North
Amer. national capital, I'm impressed.
"Greening the tax man"
Editorial in "The Ottawa Citizen" Friday, February 19th, 1999.
If there's
Victor Milne wrote:
My point is that if a simple model of dominance does not apply very well to
equine behaviour, it's certainly a mistake to extend it to human behaviour.
Who ever said anything about "simple" or "model"?
hierarchies and
ranges of human ( other) behavior have always
Durant wrote:
Capitalism cannot function without growth, if the rate of profit
decreases - and it does anyway - capitalism is in crisis.
What's wrong with having a distribution that allows everyone to
live freely and in dignity, rather than under an economic bridle.
As traditionally
Eva Durant wrote:
The bully tend to be the biggest puppy, the one with
the most expendable energy. Even in dogs,
aggressivity is "taught" by the human
who replaced the role of the alpha.
Above is another example of internal inconsistency. The bully pup is
aggressive independently of human
Mike raises the issue of human values - individual, cultural, and species
wide. The relationship of self-conscious free will and determinism as part
of nature is explored in a paper by Tom Clark linked below.
A main point I've tried rather unsuccessfully to make for the past two
years on this
Good subject title! :-)
Jan Matthieu wrote:
One wonders if there is no ecological list where these same ongoing crazy
discussions are not overshadowing what is really important.
Hope you agree that "what is really important" is 100% OPINION.
who now is going to take the place of evolution
Durant wrote: (responding to Jay)
What you ignore is, that we are able to evaluate
which social structures can be more beneficial
for us in the future,
The past provides the data from which scenarios of probable futures are
created. Science is the best process we have to calculate those
Durant wrote:
No, competition is not necessary in the economic structure.
Says who? Why? What evidence?
Competition is an enormous waste of human and material
resources.
Sometimes.
I think you are grasping at straws now.
Steve
Eva
...
I agree with Jay, here. What some might
I came across this while researching a botany question. The theory is
obviously widely held.
Steve
http://www.science.mcmaster.ca/Biology/faculty/Kolasa/refs.htm#References
References on Hierarchy in Ecology
Last updated: Jan 16, 1999.
If you know of any references not on this list but
Hi Eva,
You and I agree on one subject ( maybe a few others)! We're both atheists.
Steve
Durant wrote:
(REH)
Somewhere I read that the market must expand for it to work as a system.
Could some of the economists fill me in on that one?
(ED)
Isn't it obvious, that a profit based
system needs the profits to grow thus needs the markets to grow,
so it is doomed when those
Martin Hufner is chief economist of Bayerische Vereinsbank, second largest
bank in Ger. The Greens have long been branded 'leftists'; and I have
attempted to argue strongly against knee-jerk positions blindly following
that label for reasons including some expressed below. There is a critical
Eva:
At present large densities of people in Japan, Holland,
etc have high standard of living and falling birth rates.
agreed
At present population levels are not the cause of rising poverty,
but the insane structure of economics and distribution.
Without parasitic imports of food,
I didn't coin this term.( Eva: 'Horn of Plenty' is another similiar term )
Here is a snippet from a paper "THE CORNUCOPIAN FALLACIES"
Lindsey Grant (1992)
An intense if intermittent debate is under way between environmentalists
and
"cornucopians." The
Durant wrote:
At the moment it is a big enough pie,
Not according to thousands of scientists including majority of living Nobel
winners. Not according to Wm. Rees Mathis Wackernagel, _The Ecological
Footprint_. Their estimate is that 2Billion is maximum population
sustainable at the *current
Eva:
individual freedoms
would be only lessened for a small minority,
for the rest I think a change to the future
I advocate would mean more individual freedom.
This is your great speculative hope. If the worlds scientists are to be
believed(back to dieoff.org for multiple exhibits of
Eva Durant wrote:
Not informed , yes. But not intelligent?? I wasn't aware of
any decline in public intelligence. Any data?
Voting and tv vieing habits are not valid - they belong to
the "not informed" bit.
I am seriously concerned now. How many of this list have
this total contempt for
Greetings,
This isn't my view, but it contains elements that Jay(I think), Don
Chisholm, I agree with. The recent posts about definitions of science
were still in my memory when this arrived. It had been fwd to Gaia
Preservation Coalition list.
Steve
FYI. Sorry for dupes
NEW CENTURY TO BE MARKED BY GROWING
THREATS, OPPORTUNITIES
The bright promise of a new century is clouded by unprecedented threats to
the
stability of the natural world, according to a special millennial edition
of the
State of the World report, released by the
deborah middleton wrote:
My thoughts are that the concepts of sustainability may also be able to be
applied to the individual in relation to the organization/social
environment.
Perhaps so; but the number of individuals in relation
to the local ( global) environment (includes org./
social)
A friend fwd this to me; some of you may care to respond or follow the
proceedings.
Sorry for inevitable dupes.
Steve
--
The World Bank is taking the
unusual step of seeking public comment on its environmental strategy for
the
Greetings,
The article below pertains to COMMONS beyond traditional usage. It also
uses a broad notion of "externalities". There is as much economics as
politics involved (IMO), although it is written as a piece on democracy. I
don't agree with everything in it, particularly the statement about
I have no verification of the truth/falsity of this.
Steve
FYI
Don
Return-path: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Envelope-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Delivery-date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:15:48 -0500
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 15:14:50 -0400 (AST)
From: Mark Graffis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Jay Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
cc:
Since I'm planning to move northward, this certainly raised my eyebrows!
Steve
--
Canada 'haven for terrorists'
BY STANLEY OZIEWICZ
South China Morning Post (Hong Kong), January 4, 1999
Canada's spy chief shed the service's
Sorry about cut/paste format result. I believe the article is freely
available till tomorrows edition comes on. (maybe 6pm EST?)
http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/news/financial/currency-stability.html
This is another indication that tremendous strides are occurring in
understanding the linkages between population density and well-being.
Steve
Population group of 14
nations say they are
NEWS FROM THE WORLDWATCH INSTITUTE
Vital Signs Brief 98-3
GLOBAL TEMPERATURE JUMPS OFF CHART
The average temperature of the earth's atmosphere hit the highest level ever
recorded in the first two-thirds of 1998, literally jumping off the charts.
Six of the first eight months of the year
excerpt from a paper by Albert Bartlett published in Population
Environment, Vol. 20, No. 1, September 1998, Pgs. 77 - 81.
REGIONWIDE PLANNING WILL MAKE THE PROBLEMS WORSE
REGIONAL PLANNING DILUTES AND ULTIMATELY DEFEATS DEMOCRACY
FYI -
New York Times
December 8, 1998
Will Humans Overwhelm the Earth? The Debate Goes on
By MALCOLM W. BROWNE
PHILADELPHIA -- Two hundred years ago the Rev. Thomas Robert Malthus, an
English economist and mathematician, anonymously published an essay
predicting that the world's
Hi Mike all,
I've been away, and just got to your post. I'm familiar with the World Game
site. It is likely that their software is not nearly as comprehensive nor
as flexible as the Global System Simulator one. For those interested in
receiving a detailed description of the system, I have it in
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