Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 8:54:40 AM UTC-7 Jesse Glick wrote: > On Thu, Feb 24, 2022 at 8:42 AM Mark Waite wrote: > >> more exploring of potential issues related to the transition. >>> >> > My main concern is about bugs, like JENKINS-59910 which no one seems to be > evaluating. If

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Thu, Feb 24, 2022 at 8:42 AM Mark Waite wrote: > more exploring of potential issues related to the transition. >> > My main concern is about bugs, like JENKINS-59910 which no one seems to be evaluating. If stuff works when run on 8 and does not work when run on 11 then users will not accept

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Friday, February 18, 2022 at 1:53:10 PM UTC-7 Tim Jacomb wrote: > Hello > > https://jenkins.io/jep/236 has been integrated. > > Please have a read and share any thoughts. > > Any thoughts on us continuing as Basil suggested with the June 14 date for > LTS? > > and a weekly in the near

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Hello https://jenkins.io/jep/236 has been integrated. Please have a read and share any thoughts. Any thoughts on us continuing as Basil suggested with the June 14 date for LTS? and a weekly in the near future? Thanks Tim On Tue, 4 Jan 2022 at 20:16, Matt Sicker wrote: > I’ll note the

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

I’ll note the illegal reflection is only an issue starting with Java 16, and that can be “fixed” with some add-opens CLI options to Java. See for example how the ErrorProne compiler plugin requires several of those flags in a build with recent Java versions (and I’d expect similar for Lombok

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 12:48 PM Mark Waite wrote: > > I think there are changes that are as yet undiscovered on the removal of Java > 8 support. I believe that finding and fixing those surprises will need more > time. We are already aware of issues with WebSockets (fixed), JAXB (fixed in all

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

I don’t really understand this, Basil has done the minor Pom file changes needed. Users have been running Java 11 in production for years including the Jenkins project. Java 11 work from the Jenkins project side is not much work remaining, generally just filling in dates =/ On Mon, 3 Jan 2022 at

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 1:39 PM Basil Crow wrote: > On Tue, Dec 28, 2021 at 11:20 PM Baptiste Mathus wrote: > > > > I think updating the minimum in Feb 2021 for weeklies and hence June for > LTS is a bit too aggressive. I think we should at least target the LTS > _after_ June. > > I fail to see

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Tue, Dec 28, 2021 at 11:20 PM Baptiste Mathus wrote: > > I think updating the minimum in Feb 2021 for weeklies and hence June for LTS > is a bit too aggressive. I think we should at least target the LTS _after_ > June. I fail to see any reason why a June target for LTS is too aggressive.

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

We can update the monitor in 2.319.2 which would give a 6 month notice to LTS users? They’ve already had a few months encouraging them to move, and as said before a lot of them have I don’t think there’s much point maintaining the LTS line longer except for security fixes and that could always

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

I see no problem with switching the Weekly release line in February with the new LTS baseline release. I also agree with Baptiste that a 3-month notice for deprecation is too short. I suggest announcing the September LTS as a target for complete Java 8 support removal in the LTS baseline. The

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

I like the planning idea, I think updating the minimum in Feb 2021 for weeklies and hence June for LTS is a bit too aggressive. I think we should *at least* target the LTS _after_ June. And in the meantime keep communicating on this timeline like we had done for Java 8. Blogs. Tweet encouraging

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

> On 23. Dec 2021, at 17:49, Basil Crow wrote: > > > Do we expect that a notable subset of users will be unable to switch to > > Java 11 due to platform issues (or perhaps just shitty policies)? > > I do not expect so. Users who are not consuming the Docker image may > trivially install

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Tue, Dec 21, 2021 at 12:01 PM Tim Jacomb wrote: > > I think we should target the LTS after next for dropping Java 8 support. +1 > That would be: > > Weekly - 2nd February (week after baseline selection for next LTS) > LTS - approx 7th June (roughly when ths LTS after next will be released)

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

> On 21. Dec 2021, at 21:01, Tim Jacomb wrote: > > I think we should target the LTS after next for dropping Java 8 support. > > That would be: > • Weekly - 2nd February (week after baseline selection for next LTS) > • LTS - approx 7th June (roughly when ths LTS after next will be

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Back to Java 11 :) (I suggest another thread for Java 17 Basil has been doing some great work there) There's been an 'admin monitor' around for quite a while now encouraging users to upgrade to Java 11 if they are on 8. The JavaVersionRecommendationAdminMonitor

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Mon, Dec 20, 2021 at 1:53 PM 'Jesse Glick' via Jenkins Developers wrote: > > Is this mostly about Servlet API types, or other EE packages? Servlet types and JavaMail were the most common cases I saw in the prototype, along with a new package namespace for FileUpload to go along with the new

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Sun, Dec 19, 2021 at 9:13 PM Basil Crow wrote: > When loading plugins without "Jakarta-Ready: true" in a Jakarta EE 9 > environment, we will probably need to apply some special compatibility > transformations, exempli gratia, transforming the binaries after > exploding the plugin or loading

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

I did some experiments with integrating Eclipse Transformer into Jenkins core and the Maven HPI plugin. It seems to work pretty well: I have not seen any false positives yet, and almost all plugins converted by it seem to work OK in a Jakarta EE 9 environment. I am starting to think that any

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

JEP with java 11 as minimum? Or Java 17? (I guess this will be a bit too aggressive :) ) Once we have Winstone ready for jetty 10 and Java 11 (PR ready and already working) moving to jetty 11/Jakarta namespace it’s just a matter of changing package javax.servlet to jakarta.servlet package On

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Thanks to Basil for starting a pull request for it. Probably this is a case when we should probably work on the JEP together with all platform SIG members. As a first step, I would recommend putting a warning for upcoming Java 8 depreciation as a Jenkins administrative monitor and to the startup

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Jetty 11 is too far away and by the way mean moving to Jakarta namespace which means having our all frameworks (and plugins) using this namespace… We should first migrate to jetty 10 which only have java11 minimum. I have started a branch in winstone for this but need to finish it. On Sat, 18

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Tue, Nov 16, 2021 at 2:30 AM Olivier Lamy wrote: > But as it turns EOL, we will have to upgrade to Jetty 10 (or 11 but not > sure at this stage Jenkins will have been migrated to use > jakarta.servlet/jakarta.* namespaces). > I put together a prototype

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Would be interesting to look at the numbers on the JVM version for only recent Jenkins versions, say for the past 18 to 24+ months. I had done so for https://www.jenkins.io/blog/2017/01/17/Jenkins-is-upgrading-to-Java-8/ but I'm not sure how I did this, I think I had still access to the raw stats

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

JGit has released 6.0.0 that drops support for Java 8. The Jenkins git client plugin will stay on JGit 5. On Sat, Dec 4, 2021 at 3:02 PM Tim Jacomb wrote: > Looks like Andrew has fixed the reporting issue for core versions by > rewriting the processor: >

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Looks like Andrew has fixed the reporting issue for core versions by rewriting the processor: https://github.com/jenkins-infra/jenkins-usage-stats You can see the report at https://stats.jenkins.io/plugin-installation-trend/jvms.json Last month: "163572480": { "1.7": 686,

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Thu, Nov 18, 2021 at 4:57 AM 'Daniel Beck' via Jenkins Developers < jenkinsci-dev@googlegroups.com> wrote: > On Thu, Nov 18, 2021 at 10:22 AM 'Björn Pedersen' via Jenkins Developers < > jenkinsci-dev@googlegroups.com> wrote: > >> you can build projects in any java version you like, even if

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Thu, Nov 18, 2021 at 10:22 AM 'Björn Pedersen' via Jenkins Developers < jenkinsci-dev@googlegroups.com> wrote: > between the java version used to run jenkins and the version used to > really build java projects. I think that could warrant a bit more > epxlanation that you can build projects in

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Hi, from what I observer during many of these discussion a huge part of the reluctance to update stems from the fatc, that (historical) there is not enough distiction between the java version used to run jenkins and the version used to really build java projects. I think that could warrant a

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Agreed that the benefit to developers is a critical point. For Java 8 bump that was a big driver. We do want Jenkins to be appealing to the OSS Java developers out there. I think we should plan & announce ahead like we've

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Wed, Nov 17, 2021 at 4:03 AM 'Daniel Beck' via Jenkins Developers < jenkinsci-dev@googlegroups.com> wrote: > […] do not show a rapid growth of Java 11 adoption > > Every time this topic comes up I need to remind people that while the proportion of installations currently running 8 vs. 11 is an

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

Yes, something is definitely wrong. We have a sync-up with Andrew Bayer today, let's see what whether we could triage that quickly On Wed, Nov 17, 2021 at 10:17 AM 'Daniel Beck' via Jenkins Developers < jenkinsci-dev@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > > On Wed, Nov 17, 2021 at 10:03 AM Daniel Beck

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Wed, Nov 17, 2021 at 10:03 AM Daniel Beck wrote: > > In fact, looking at the difference between > https://stats.jenkins.io/jenkins-stats/svg/total-jenkins.svg and the JVM > stats, we can see they were almost equal (99+%) up to early 2019. And then > around the time

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

> So it's almost certain we're just not collecting usage stats correctly. Filed https://issues.jenkins.io/browse/JENKINS-67158 for investigation, would be great if someone can take a look! On Wed, 17 Nov 2021 at 09:03, 'Daniel Beck' via Jenkins Developers < jenkinsci-dev@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Wed, Nov 17, 2021 at 12:49 AM Oleg Nenashev wrote: > I think we should eventually drop Java 8 support but only when we have > enough Java 11 adoption About that… https://stats.jenkins.io/plugin-installation-trend/jvms.json seems unlikely given we switched the Docker images around. Even

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

> I don't yet see a compelling benefit that would motivate us to drop support for OpenJDK 8. Its support lifetime is almost as long as Java 11. New language features... Not stuck on a version released 7 years ago... Libraries dropping support for it... I'm now sure how the Java 8 baseline

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

For completeness, Adoptium (previously known as AdoptOpenJDK) also has a target of May 2026 and October 2024 for JDK 8 & 11 respectively (which isn't surprising as both Red Hat and Adoptium are probably using the same binary) - see Support | Adoptium - Open source, prebuilt OpenJDK binaries

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

On Tue, Nov 16, 2021 at 4:49 PM Oleg Nenashev wrote: > I think we should eventually drop Java 8 support but only when we have > enough Java 11 adoption > What we could do in short term is to deprecate Java 8 and to put explicit > recommendation to switch to Java 11 or 17 preview > An

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

I think we should eventually drop Java 8 support but only when we have enough Java 11 adoption What we could do in short term is to deprecate Java 8 and to put explicit recommendation to switch to Java 11 or 17 preview IMHO we are already in the state when we can announce our intent to drop

Re: Java 11 as minimum? (Jetty 9.4.x EOL)

There is no plan to make Java 11 a Jenkins minimum requirement yet. When the Docker images were changed to Java 11 in August, 2021, the discussions in the governing board meeting noted that we don't have a plan to