ng others. I have found the universal
>> categories to be a more robust grounding to generalize to the entirety of
>> Nature and its manifestations.
>>
>> Best, Mike
>>
> --
> __
>
> Michael K. Bergman
> 319.621.5225htt
I have to pick with many scholars of semiosis is their too
>>> literal restriction to human signs and perhaps even elevating semiosis as a
>>> Peircean thesis first among others. I have found the universal categories
>>> to be a more robust grounding to generalize to the ent
; These are a focus of my current studies.
>>> One of the bones I have to pick with many scholars of semiosis is their too
>>> literal restriction to human signs and perhaps even elevating semiosis as a
>>> Peircean thesis first among others. I have found the universal categories
&
ike
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others. I have found the universal
> categories to be a more robust grounding to generalize to the entirety of
> Nature and its manifestations.
>
> Best, Mike
>
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length that which was succinctly -- albeit abstractly -- posited in
that single sentence I just added emphasis to above. As usual, quotations and
examples proved extremely helpful.
Best,
Gary Richmond
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egards propositions into the natural world.
Best,
Gary Richmond
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isigns do not necessarily
>> require human language, thought, and logic -- not human consciousness --
>> whatsoever.
>>
>> I'm not a biosemiotician -- although I find the field of considerable
>> interest -- and I know that you aren't either, Jon. But I'd be most
I find the field of considerable
> interest -- and I know that you aren't either, Jon. But I'd be most
> interested in what you or others on the List might think regarding the
> generalization of Peirce's furthest thinking as regards propositions into
> the natural world.
>
>
a sentence, the
>>>>> subjects that denote its objects are either descriptive names or
>>>>> designative pronouns or gestures, while the pure/continuous predicate
>>>>> that signifies its interpretant is often a copulant sign.
>>>>>
&
odied in the
>>> syntax of every tongue.
>>>
>>>
>>> Finally, the whole matter is tied up in your concluding paragraph which
>>> begins with this idea.
>>>
>>> JAS: Pure/continuous predicates are sometimes conveyed entirely by
>>> *
t;> which in natural languages tends to reflect "the flow of causation."
>>>
>>> In conclusion: Jon, I did not expect such a complete response to my
>>> request for an explication of this comment in your last post:
>>>
>>> JAS: The necessi
notable insights. It leads to the
>> recognition that *every name in a proposition is a subject that
>> indexically denotes one of its objects*, while *its syntax is the pure
>> predicate that iconically signifies its interpretant as the general form of
>> their logical relatio
emphasis I put in this
> quotation as a kind of "more iconic" diagram for the purpose of studying
> your post today. GR).
>
> Again, much appreciated. Thank you for taking the time and making the
> effort to explain at length that which was succinctly -- albeit abstractly
> --
of the names and lines,
> as well as any shaded areas for negation. Specifically, attributing
> concepts to individuals by attaching names to lines makes those individuals
> *more* definite and those concepts *more* determinate in the mind of an
> interpreter.
>
> Regards,
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eed a bit of 'unpacking' to be entirely clear.
>
> JAS: The necessity of collateral experience/observation for any sign to be
> understood is one of Peirce's most notable insights. It leads to the
> recognition that every name in a proposition is a subject that indexically
> denote
Peirce wrote: "One generation collects
>>> premisses in order that a distant generation may discover what they mean"
>>> (CP 7.87, 1902). Although I have little doubt that John would disagree, I
>>> would point to Jon Schmidt's paper, "Peirce's evolving
emiotica* 2022 (246): 211-223.
>> 2022.
>> https://philarchive.org/archive/SCHPEI-12v1
>>
>> Moreover, I am certain that I am not alone in seeing the very existence
>> of semeiotics today as arguing against John's dismissal of Peirce's
>> writings about interpretan
to use
> them to do or say anything useful." John seems to be basically advocating
> ignoring anything that Peirce wrote unless it is somehow relevant to "the
> latest developments in cognitive science." Doing so suggests that he is
> employing the methods of tenacity and authorit
e - ie- all three - Interpretants to be vital in the
> generation of all matter and life. How else is a community to interact with
> each other, without the observation of the constantly produced Dynamic
> Interpretants? How else are habits to develop within this community except
> by
at
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refer to Bakhtin’s ‘dialogic’ emphasis on context enabling linguistic
> changes.
>
> Edwina
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&g
nges.
Edwina
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PE
r
> explanation. And then it could be repeated a third time. Then a fourth. And
> so on,
> and so on, and so on. Apart from boredom or frustration, there does not seem
> to be
> any obvious stopping point.
>
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e concept of markedness as it
> operates in the so-called "pass-key" of language as semeiotic, see the
> attached article.
>
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iotics anthology
> Part V: Semiotics and Ecology
> Part VI: Semiotics and Cognitive Science
> Part VII: Semiotics and Artificial Intelligence
>
> Edwina
>
>
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The Oxford Handbook of Charles S. PeirceEdited by Cornelis de Waal
piro wrote:
> Yes, it does, Jon.
>
> M.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jon Alan Schmidt
> Sent: Feb 3, 2024 2:04 PM
> To: Peirce-L
> Subject: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Interpretants
>
>
> Michael, List:
>
> I honestly do not know much about linguistics, but I wo
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s I would like to
>> recommend that they take a look at my discussion of markedness in one or
>> more of my books, the latest being *The Logic of Lasnguage* (New York:
>> Springer, 2022). Markedness in language is the epitomre of the relationship
>> between sign and
e or
> more of my books, the latest being *The Logic of Lasnguage* (New York:
> Springer, 2022). Markedness in language is the epitomre of the relationship
> between sign and object.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Edwina Taborsky
> Sent: Feb 3, 2024 7:46 AM
&
nt: Feb 3, 2024 7:46 AM
> To: Edwina Taborsky mailto:tabor...@primus.ca>>
> Cc: John F Sowa mailto:s...@bestweb.net>>, Peirce List
> mailto:peirce-l@list.iupui.edu>>, CG
> mailto:c...@lists.iccs-conference.org>>
> Subject: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Interpretants
>
between sign
and object.
-Original Message-
From: Edwina Taborsky
Sent: Feb 3, 2024 7:46 AM
To: Edwina Taborsky
Cc: John F Sowa , Peirce List , CG
Subject: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Interpretants
Again, if I might continue with the importance of the hexadic semiosic process,
in that it enables
interpretants aided him in the discovery and formulation
>> of his commentary.
>>
>> Can you (or any other reader of P-List) find any important (or just useful)
>> example of an insight in which Peirce's theory of interpretants helped
>> discover that insight?
>>
both biological and
> societal systems." I agree.
>
> My recommendation: Let scholars pursue the inquiries which interest them
> and which they see potential value in pursuing. To suggest otherwise is
> to "block the way of inquiry."
>
> Best,
>
> Gary Richmo
important (or just useful)
> example of an insight in which Peirce's theory of interpretants helped
> discover that insight?
>
> John
>
>
> From: "Edwina Taborsky"
> Sent: 2/2/24 5:01 PM
> To: John F Sowa
> Cc: Peirce List , CG
> Subject: Re: [PEIRCE-
sifications imposed
by further subdivisions of the interpretant. (For more on this discussion see,
Liszka 1990 and 1996; Fitzgerald 1966; Lalor 1997; Short 1981, 1996, and 2004).
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Peirce's theory of interpretants helped discover
that insight?
John
From: "Edwina Taborsky"
Sent: 2/2/24 5:01 PM
To: John F Sowa
Cc: Peirce List , CG
Subject: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Interpretants
John, list
I wouldn’t say that the Interpretants are
etic/logical counts as a distinct
> division. And finally, there is little provision in Peirce’s projected
> sixty-six classes of signs for the kind of additional classifications
> imposed by further subdivisions of the interpretant. (For more on this
> discussion see, Liszka 19
iments whilst the emotional/energetic/logical counts as a distinct
>> division. And finally, there is little provision in Peirce’s projected
>> sixty-six classes of signs for the kind of additional classifications
>> imposed by further subdivisions of the interpretant. (For mor
, and 2004).
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immediate and dynamical.
Best, Helmut
Gesendet: Freitag, 02. Februar 2024 um 00:07 Uhr
Von: "Jon Alan Schmidt"
An: "Peirce-L"
Betreff: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Interpretants
Helmut, List:
HR: But why are there more than three interpretants?
There are not more
communicational.
>
> Maybe these threee classes of context are categorially 1ns, 2ns, 3ns?
>
> And if, I think, there should be a second context for the object too, in
> which it is divided other than into immediate and dynamical.
>
> Best, Helmut
> *Gesendet:* Freitag, 02. Fe
, 2ns, 3ns?
And if, I think, there should be a second context for the object too, in which it is divided other than into immediate and dynamical.
Best, Helmut
Gesendet: Freitag, 02. Februar 2024 um 00:07 Uhr
Von: "Jon Alan Schmidt"
An: "Peirce-L"
Betreff: Re: [PEIRCE-L]
three interpretants.
>
> Or many more, if you keep on divi(di)ng.
>
> Best, Helmut
>
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a thirdness into three parts are of 1ns, 2ns, 3ns.
Like this, there are three times three interpretants.
Or many more, if you keep on divi(di)ng.
Best, Helmut
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 01. Februar 2024 um 00:37 Uhr
Von: "John F Sowa"
An: "Peirce List" , &quo
aching with Technology Prize page
<https://www.apaonline.org/page/oup_prize>.
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erpretant. (For more on this discussion
> see, Liszka 1990 and 1996; Fitzgerald 1966; Lalor 1997; Short 1981, 1996, and
> 2004).
>
>
>
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turies."
Albert Einstein
Best,
Gary Richmond
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the link in slide 2 of ppe.pdf. It's helpful to
read the slides before going to the longer article.
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refore his claim, that there "scienttific"ly is a necessity in history.
>> History is just stories. I wonder, whether Popper knew Peirce, because I see
>> some parallelity.
>>
>> Best, Helmut
>>
>> Gesendet: Sonntag, 28. Januar 2024 um 21:33 Uhr
>
knew Peirce, because I see
> some parallelity.
>
> Best, Helmut
>
> Gesendet: Sonntag, 28. Januar 2024 um 21:33 Uhr
> Von: "Edwina Taborsky"
> An: s...@bestweb.net
> Cc: "Peirce List" , "CG"
>
> Betreff: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Concluding section 7 o
parallelity.
Best, Helmut
Gesendet: Sonntag, 28. Januar 2024 um 21:33 Uhr
Von: "Edwina Taborsky"
An: s...@bestweb.net
Cc: "Peirce List" , "CG"
Betreff: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Concluding section 7 of the article on phaneroscopy
John, list
Thanks for the chapter.
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> .
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mination affair is somehow confusing. It surely is, if we
> take "determination" too literally, I mean, if we take it too muchly for
> real. Do you agree? You see, I have been trying very hard to not contradict
> Peirce.
>
> Best, Helmut
> _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
> A
://www.logicandreligion.com/webinars
JYB, Vice President of LARA
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with
agree? You see, I have been trying very hard to not contradict Peirce.
Best, Helmut
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o not contradict Peirce.
Best, Helmut
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"determination" too literally, I mean, if we take it too muchly for real. Do you agree? You see, I have been trying very hard to not contradict Peirce.
Best, Helmut
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 24. Januar 2024 um 00:06 Uhr
Von: "Jon Alan Schmidt"
An: "Peirce-L"
Betr
century.
Any commentary about these issues must be compared to the developments in 21st
C neuroscience and cognitive science. Otherwise, the comments are likely to
be more misleading than helpful
John
From: "Jon Alan Schmidt"
Sent: 1/19/2
t;
> Warm regards,
>
> --
> *Cécile Cosculluela*
> MC anglais UPPA ∗ SSH ∗ LEA
> Maître de Conférences en Etudes Anglophones
> *Associate Professor of English as a Second Language*
> *Semiotics • Linguistics • Grammar • Translation*
>
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eas, Peirce has important points
to add, and experts in those fields often agree that Peirce was right.
John
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a*
> MC anglais UPPA ∗ SSH ∗ LEA
> Maître de Conférences en Etudes Anglophones
> *Associate Professor of English as a Second Language*
> *Semiotics • Linguistics • Grammar • Translation*
>
> --
> *De: *"Jon Alan Schmidt"
> *À: *"Peirce-L&q
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hmidt"
À: "Peirce-L"
Envoyé: Lundi 22 Janvier 2024 22:13:05
Objet: Re: [PEIRCE-L] 10 Classes of Signs (Question on CP 8.376, 1908)
Cécile, List:
321 in the 1903 taxonomy (R 799) is a rhematic indexical legisign. The sign
itself is a general law (3 for legisign), its dyadic re
anglais UPPA ∗ SSH ∗ LEA
> Maître de Conférences en Etudes Anglophones
> *Associate Professor of English as a Second Language*
> *Semiotics • Linguistics • Grammar • Translation*
>
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;A sign, therefore, has a triadic relation to its Object and to its
>> Interpretant." (CP 8.343, 1908)
>>
>> "The proper way to pursue the inquiry is to start from the definition
>> already given of the triadic relation of Sign-Object-Interpretant." (CP
>> 8
ncept is a Sign and shall define a Sign and show
> its triadic form.” ( CP 8.305, c. 1909)
>
> --
> *Cécile Cosculluela*
> MC anglais UPPA ∗ SSH ∗ LEA
> Maître de Conférences en Etudes Anglophones
> *Associate Professor of English as a Second Language*
&g
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ers
Jerry
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t;>> Would perhaps conscious “tones” more like musical notations?
>>> Clearly, a basis to related such terms to either “tokens” or “types” seem
>>> inappropriate given CSP’s allocation of these terms to words (composed from
>>> alphabetic symbols).
>>>
>>> Alternatively, p
be “forms” of consciousness?
>>> Would perhaps conscious “tones” more like musical notations?
>>> Clearly, a basis to related such terms to either “tokens” or “types” seem
>>> inappropriate given CSP’s allocation of these terms to words (composed from
>>> a
basis to related such terms to either “tokens” or “types” seem
>> inappropriate given CSP’s allocation of these terms to words (composed from
>> alphabetic symbols).
>>
>> Alternatively, perhaps I’m not reading your usage of “modal categories”
>> properly….
>&
endet: Freitag, 19. Januar 2024 um 17:25 Uhr
Von: "Jon Alan Schmidt"
An: "Peirce-L"
Betreff: [PEIRCE-L] Forms of Consciousness (was Categorizations of Triadic Relationships)
Jerry, List:
Here is the entire referenced paragraph.
CSP: There are no other forms of cons
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;
> Jerry
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Schmidt
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PE
happened, semiotically.
Best, Helmut
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Januar 2024 um 22:52 Uhr
Von: "Edwina Taborsky"
An: "Helmut Raulien"
Cc: "Peirce List"
Betreff: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Categorizations of triadic Relationships (Was Re: Graphical Representations of the
. That is
> conclusive evidence beyond any shadow of a doubt that Peirce's 1911 system is
> one of his most brilliant achievements.
>
> I'll send another note with all the references.
>
> John
>
>
> From: "Jon Alan Schmidt"
> Sent: 1/1
most brilliant achievements.
I'll send another note with all the references.
John
From: "Jon Alan Schmidt"
Sent: 1/11/24 6:13 PM
To: Peirce-L
Subject: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Categorizations of triadic Relationships (Was Re:
Graphical Representations o
From: "Jerry LR Chandler"
Sent: 1/11/24 4:09 PM
To: Jon Alan Schmidt
Cc: Peirce List
Subject: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Categorizations of triadic Relationships (Was Re:
Graphical Representations of the Sign by Peirce)
Thanks for your answer.
We seem to be on different wavelengths.
On Jan 11
r entropy
> or dogmas or…. Just seeking a scientifically useful meaning for my
> research.
>
> Cheers
> Jerry
>
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
ARISBE: THE PEIRCE GATEWAY is now at
https://cspeirce.com and, just as well, at
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gt; (thinking, medisense).
>
> Best, Helmut
>
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Januar 2024 um 18:28 Uhr
> Von: "Edwina Taborsky"
> An: "Jerry LR Chandler"
> Cc: "Peirce List"
> Betreff: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Categorizations of triadic Relationships (Was Re:
I appreciate your responses.
Cheers
Jerry _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
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cs or entropy or
> dogmas or…. Just seeking a scientifically useful meaning for my research.
>
> Cheers
> Jerry
>
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
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It'll take a while to repair / update all the links!
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carried> back
> 2. (having been) returned <https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/returned>
> , restored <https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/restored>, repaid
> <https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/repaid>
> 3. (having been) reported <https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/r
: Donnerstag, 11. Januar 2024 um 18:28 Uhr
Von: "Edwina Taborsky"
An: "Jerry LR Chandler"
Cc: "Peirce List"
Betreff: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Categorizations of triadic Relationships (Was Re: Graphical Representations of the Sign by Peirce)
jerry
Yes- you can feel a headache wi
,
> that all "entities" of course are prescinded, as they donot really exist
> alone, before somebody feels the need of telling me so.
> Best, Helmut
>
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
ARISBE: THE PEIRCE GATEWAY is now at
https://cspeirce.com and, just as well, at
https://www.cspeirce.com . It'll
e adjectives (…ness) and the numbers, either / or cardinal or ordinal? …. neither /nor? CheersJerry
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ARISBE: THE PEIRCE GATEWAY is now at https://cspeirce.com and, just as well, at https://www.cspeirce.com . It'll take a while to repair / update all the links!► PEI
semantic aspects of the "triadic relations are internal to the describer?In other words, Where does the syntax for triadic relation originate?And, Where does the syntax for triadic relation reside?And, how would such a determination fix the differentiation between the adjectives (…ness) and the n
iadic relation reside?And, how would such a determination fix the differentiation between the adjectives (…ness) and the numbers, either / or cardinal or ordinal? …. neither /nor? CheersJerry
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ARISBE: THE PEIRCE GATEWAY is now at https://cspeirce.com and, just as well,
must add, that all "entities" of course are prescinded, as they donot really exist alone, before somebody feels the need of telling me so.
Best, Helmut
Gesendet: Dienstag, 09. Januar 2024 um 17:42 Uhr
Von: "Edwina Taborsky"
An: "Helmut Raulien"
Cc: "Peirc
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