[tw5] Re: sort:version:reverse?

[Cade Roux]

I see, I can use that separate reverse operator instead of doing it in the 
initial sort.

I'm still not sure how to use the reverse documented here in the flaglist 
in the :sort filter run prefix:

https://tiddlywiki.com/#Sort%20Filter%20Run%20Prefix

[image: Screenshot 2024-04-16 182937.png]

I'll post any future questions in the other forums.

Thanks,

Cade

On Tuesday, April 16, 2024 at 6:01:18 PM UTC-5 springer wrote:

> Of course, I meant "come on over *from* google groups, and join us at 
> talk.tiddlywiki.org"
>
> On Tuesday, April 16, 2024 at 6:59:58 PM UTC-4 springer wrote:
>
>> Hello Cade! As you might note with other posts at google groups, the 
>> community for this discussion has migrated to talk.tiddlywiki.org.
>>
>> Although we (at that forum) can still *see* posts from the google group, 
>> we can't reply easily to them. 
>>
>> So please come on over to google groups.
>>
>> Meanwhile, I can suggest that the documentation on the reverse Operator 
>> <https://tiddlywiki.com/#reverse%20Operator%20(Examples)> shows that it 
>> doesn't take a parameter, nor does it work as a parameter within the sort 
>> filter run prefix; instead it works at the "caboose" end of any filter to 
>> flip the list order. Something like this works at Tiddlywiki.com:
>>
>> `{{{ [has[version]] :sort:version[get[version]] +[reverse[]] }}}`
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 16, 2024 at 12:29:33 PM UTC-4 Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>>> I have change logs with a field for version information, and I am trying 
>>> to sort them in reverse order and it doesn't appear to be working.  The 
>>> change log tiddlers themselves are also lists, but I cleared all that out 
>>> and loaded these into the latest TW version to make a minimal reproducible 
>>> case.  If I take out the sort entirely, the 10.0 comes to the top as you 
>>> would expect for them to be sorted by title.  But the sort either with or 
>>> without :reverse is the same.
>>> [image: Screenshot 2024-04-16 112417.png]
>>> <$list filter="[ascend.change[index]] 
>>> :sort:version:reverse[get[ascend.version]]"><$link to={{!!title}} 
>>> /><$transclude/>
>>>
>>> [image: Screenshot 2024-04-16 112528.png]
>>> What am I doing wrong?
>>>
>>

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[tw5] sort:version:reverse?

[Cade Roux]

I have change logs with a field for version information, and I am trying to 
sort them in reverse order and it doesn't appear to be working.  The change 
log tiddlers themselves are also lists, but I cleared all that out and 
loaded these into the latest TW version to make a minimal reproducible 
case.  If I take out the sort entirely, the 10.0 comes to the top as you 
would expect for them to be sorted by title.  But the sort either with or 
without :reverse is the same.
[image: Screenshot 2024-04-16 112417.png]
<$list filter="[ascend.change[index]] 
:sort:version:reverse[get[ascend.version]]"><$link to={{!!title}} 
/><$transclude/>

[image: Screenshot 2024-04-16 112528.png]
What am I doing wrong?

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[tw5] Re: Complex search - data inside transcluded tiddlers, produce outer pages instead

[Cade Roux]

[image: AdvancedSearch.PNG]
I see.  In the version of the user manual we ship, we disable editing, and 
hide a lot of stuff in TW, so that the users don't get confused.  They do 
actually have access to advanced search still, apparently I wasn't thorough 
enough.

In this case, we probably need to make the regular search be more like the 
advanced search and take some actions to suppress the ones in the ST Codes, 
because that's redundant.  Or switch the fragment tiddlers back to regular 
tiddlers and suppress them in other places where seeing the underlying 
fragments might be confusing to users.

I guess I can probably figure out ways to do all that by myself.

Bot to figure out a way to only show the top level results.  Is there a way 
to switch out the search result to make it link to a different tiddler?  In 
the case above, I would want to only see Mitral valve|Doppler and Tricuspid 
valve|Doppler

Thanks,

Cade

On Wednesday, March 1, 2023 at 10:19:30 AM UTC-6 PMario wrote:

> Thx for the info. This helps to understand the structure a bit better. 
>
> On Wednesday, March 1, 2023 at 4:55:15 PM UTC+1 Cade Roux wrote:
>
> The system tiddlers do not show up in the search normally (I think because 
> they are system tiddlers).  But the content we are looking for is inside 
> those tiddlers.
>
>
> OK. I thought, you did already modify the search dialogue. ... 
>
> What about $:/AdvancedSarch -- System Tab ? .. 
>
> -m
>

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[tw5] Re: Complex search - data inside transcluded tiddlers, produce outer pages instead

[Cade Roux]

I left off a search example:

Right now "wave peak" only shows these other tiddlers, the changelog we 
generate between versions which is not broken up this way because it 
doesn't need a lot of interspersed user content, and some other generated 
content related to coding systems for data interchange which have it as a 
literal and again, aren't structured to be interspersed with user content 
(at the moment)

[image: wave peak.PNG]

On Wednesday, March 1, 2023 at 9:55:15 AM UTC-6 Cade Roux wrote:

> The system tiddlers do not show up in the search normally (I think because 
> they are system tiddlers).  But the content we are looking for is inside 
> those tiddlers.
>
> The "Mitral valve｜Doppler" tiddler does exist as a normal tiddler, its 
> only content is the <> macro which uses the template to make 
> all the content, using fields in the tiddler and transcludes of tiddlers 
> based on name
>
> [image: MitralTiddler.PNG]
>
> This is one of the data table tiddlers used in it that contains useful 
> search content:
>
> [image: MitralTextTiddler.PNG]
>
> That table of data is fully generated by the build, and itself can 
> transclude user-entered comments using that trans-edit macro.  For 
> instance, the "$:/ascend/Text.Measurement.View.description:Name=Mitral 
> valve｜Doppler" is the user-entered tiddler of comments about the View 
> column in the Measurement table for Mitral Valve | Doppler measurements.  
> Such tiddlers may or may not exist.  In "edit-mode" the informatics 
> specialist can click on "Edit" or "Missing" and either edit them or create 
> any missing notes on that item.  So that content also, we would like to 
> show up in the search.  And we can tell from the name of those fragment 
> tiddlers which the primary Measurement tiddler it eventually bubbles up to.
>
> I probably picked a bad example because there aren't any comments on that 
> data.  This is the final render of the page.  I circled most of the 
> transcludes and you can see the inner transcludes.
>
> [image: MitralComplete.PNG]
>
> So for instance, if someone right now searches for "wave peak", they don't 
> get any useful results because it's in the system tiddlers, but we'd like 
> it to show this tiddler as a result, because the content contains it.  If 
> one of those "Missing" user-edited transcludes contains some content, we'd 
> also like those to be searched and this main tiddler to show up in the 
> results.
>
> I hope that makes it a little more clear.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Cade
>
> On Wednesday, March 1, 2023 at 8:20:25 AM UTC-6 PMario wrote:
>
>> Hi Cade,
>>
>> Can you show a screenshot of the search dialogue, where it finds content 
>> in a system tiddler? .. Is this possible to share?
>>
>> I'll do a quick summary, to see if I do understand it right. .. 
>> Everything works will except of search. 
>>
>> Search finds content from auto created "inner" / shadow tiddlers. 
>> But clicking the link should open the "outer" template which basically 
>> shows a transcluded list of auto-created and user-created content. 
>>
>> I think it should be possible to create a "link-catcher" configuration 
>> the filters out the prefix and links to the name only. 
>>
>> So one of your "outer" tiddlers is: "Mitral valve｜Doppler"  
>> This tiddler exists. So it is a real tiddler. right?
>>
>> Do your system tiddlers eg: 
>> "$:/ascend/XText.Measurement.stcodes:Name=Mitral valve｜Doppler" have a 
>> caption-field? or do they show up with the full title in the search 
>> results? 
>>
>> As written an example of a search result dropdown would be needed. 
>>
>> -mario
>>
>>

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[tw5] Complex search - data inside transcluded tiddlers, produce outer pages instead

[Cade Roux]

It's a while since I posted, so I will recap our use case.  I produce a 
data dictionary of our cardiovascular data warehouse in TiddlyWiki during 
our build process.

A particular set of main tiddlers concern "Observations", while other sets 
are "Measurements", "Procedures", "Devices" etc.

Each of these have a certain granularity they are grouped at for 
documentation - these are  what I would call the Measurement tiddlers.  So 
all the Mitral valve Doppler measurements are grouped in one tiddler that 
has the title "Mitral Valve | Doppler", and that page is made up of 
sections.  There might be many many other Measurement tiddlers like "Aortic 
valve | Area" and "Pulmonic valve | Regurgitation", each holding the 
documentation for a grouped set of the things:

[image: Measurements.PNG]

Within each Measurement, a page follows a template and the template 
transcludes tiddlers which represent the appropriate chunk of the page 
which is generated by the build process.  And also transcludes tiddlers 
which represent the human additions of documentation to the wiki.  Each of 
these, whether auto-generated or manually edited, are loaded as system 
tiddlers to keep them out of the way of the form:

$:/ascend/SOMEPREFIX:Name=Mitral valve｜Doppler

Where SOMEPREFIX might be XText.Measurement for the main auto-gen table of 
information, and Text.Measurement.summary for some fragment that the user 
can edit.

And then the <> macro puts all this together with transcludes 
to make the "Mitral valve｜Doppler" tiddler:

$:/ascend/Text.Measurement.preamble:Name=Mitral valve｜Doppler <-- user 
tiddler
$:/ascend/XText.Measurement:Name=Mitral valve｜Doppler <-- auto-gen tiddler
$:/ascend/Text.Measurement.summary:Name=Mitral valve｜Doppler <-- another 
user tiddler
$:/ascend/XText.Measurement.stcodes:Name=Mitral valve｜Doppler <-- another 
auto-gen tiddler

So all those prefixed tiddlers are designated elements of the tiddler with 
that Name.

So if we want to change the template for Measurements, we can change it in 
one place without having to rebuild every Measuement tiddler if the 
underlying tables and bits are still the same.  The inner bits can be 
re-used in other pages and the auto-gen stuff never tramples on the 
human-gen stuff.  All wonderful.

The problem comes in searching.  Some of the content we want to be able to 
search is inside the transcluded tiddlers, but we would like search results 
for be able to show a list of basically the final outer tiddlers (the 
non-system ones).

We can generate the outer tiddlers completely in our build process if 
necessary, but that means the human part also needs to go through the 
earlier parts of the build process and kind of defeats the benefits.  We 
could generate search text that is hidden during the build process on the 
main tiddlers, also needing to bring in the human template earlier.

Each of these elements does mainly go to one tiddler, so it would be 
possible to go from a fragment to a tiddler - even if they were remixed on 
a custom tiddler, we could tell the difference, so what I'm looking for I 
think is maybe a redirect from a tiddler to the tiddler that transcludes it 
or some other hints to make the search function more useful without losing 
a lot of the benefits of the transclusion system by generating whole 
tiddlers again.

Thanks in advance,

Cade

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[tw5] Export multiple tiddlers by filter to single JSON file from command-line

[Cade Roux]

I am sending a filter to --render but it is only putting one tiddler in the 
json file.

Current command line:

tiddlywiki "Data Mart User Manual" --render "[field:change.from[7.0SU2 
(7.0.Local)]][field:change.to[9.0 (9.0.Local)]]" ChangeLog.json text/plain 
"$:/core/templates/json-tiddler"

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: How make TW appear alive?

[Cade Roux]

I wish I could share the TWs we generate for our cardiovascular Data Mart 
product here.  We generate the data dictionary/manual in a TW and all our 
test outputs are in a few TWs organized by test groupings.  It definitely 
satisfies 2 and 3, as far as 1, I am still tweaking it to be more and more 
attractive and useful all the time.  We started off very simply because we 
didn't want to commit too deeply down a path which would limit us from 
retargeting our documentation to HTML or Word later.  However, as we 
progressed, it was more and more accepted to start using TW features more 
heavily as stakeholders started to get the hang of it, and there are some 
fundamental aspects of TW which we have taken advantage of to solve 
traditional problems in code/document generation:

Transclusion means that we can have parts of the TW that are manually 
edited and parts that are generated and that work can go along 
independently with each feeding off the other, without requiring 
significant synchronization between engineering staff and informatics staff 
- changes to the code/rules can be done independent of editing the TW 
template file independent of the data that is going to be imported from 
JSON to fill out many lookup tables and generate necessary tiddlers and 
indexes.  Normally with code/document generation, you have to decide 
whether the template or the content is driving the design and what we've 
found with TW is both are on pretty equal footing compared to past 
techniques like in Excel or Word where areas have to be labeled and then 
only designated labeled areas can be filled in and there really isn't 
referencing back and forth.  And you have to decide where longer narratives 
are stored and how they get combined in the document. And you have to 
decide how to handle multiple passes so that you can embed generated 
content in user content inside the generated content.  That is simple for 
us, they are always in a tiddler, potentially itself transcluding generated 
data, and it's all seamlessly handled by transclusion.

Macros/filters mean that the document in many cases is data driven on its 
own using TW features.  Typically in a Word or HTML document generation, 
you would have to generate the index, often our indexes are not even 
generated - they are tiddler list macros on tiddlers with dedicated 
transclusion points for including manual edited tiddlers in appropriate 
places.  Sure Word can generate a table of contents based on the heading 
structure in your document.  That is nothing compared to what TW does for 
us because of how we tag everything in custom fields and then can have all 
kinds of options for organizing and displaying indexes of the same data.

Tiddler grain - do everything at a small meaningful grain and tag/label 
data fully in custom fields.  A lot of this could be done with an HTML site 
generator, but TW has really saved a lot of work for us by us buying into 
the TW philosophy of fine-grained tiddlers.  So we use custom fields and 
tags and filters and generate tiddlers appropriately tagged for every 
element of our Data Mart and then they merge seamlessly with manually 
created tiddlers and index tiddlers which know how to group up different 
tags.

I know there are other tools we could have looked at, but based on what we 
did with TW, I am not confident that we would have achieved what we did, or 
as well, or as flexibly accommodating the ongoing releases of our Data Mart 
as we curate more and more data, with any other product or technique.

Thanks,

Cade

On Tuesday, October 19, 2021 at 5:13:36 PM UTC-5 cj.v...@gmail.com wrote:

> I'm not clear on what exactly the problem is.
>
> What problem are we trying to solve, how will making TW appear alive solve 
> it?  Alive to who?  And alive how?
>
> Yeah, I think I'm either over-analyzing things or things are too 
> broad/unclear for me to contribute anything useful.
>
> I do look forward to seeing how this discussion thread evolves.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, October 19, 2021 at 5:33:46 PM UTC-3 Mat wrote:
>
>> What does "nicely designed" mean?  I may find something wonderfully 
>>> designed, while 99% of normal folk find the same thing awful.  
>>>
>>
>> So I'm talking about appealing to the 99%. If we look at, say, the 
>> "clothes design industry" we should realize how incredibly narrow our 
>> tastes are if we consider that clothes really could be designed in 
>> unlimited number of ways. Most of us have similar preferences about most 
>> things. (Of course, you and I have our own distinguished tastes and free 
>> minds... and that very belief is another thing we have in common with 
>> almost all other people.)
>>
>> [...], and who cares whether it looks abandoned or not?
>>>
>>
>> Before people become full tiddlywikians, then need to decide if they want 
>> to try out TW to begin with. At that stage, impressions and feelings matter 
>> a lot. Things that look abandoned or outdated are generally less appealing 

[tw5] Re: Styling individual cells in a WikiText table

[Cade Roux]

This looks promising enough for what I need.

Thanks,

Cade

On Friday, April 23, 2021 at 6:05:38 PM UTC-5 john.edw...@gmail.com wrote:

> something like this maybe?
>
> |One|Two|Three|h
> |My Data Standard|@@background-color:red;My Data Red Background@@ 
> |@@color:green;background-color:yellow;My Data Yellow Background and Green 
> Text@@|
> |styles in tables example |>|>|
>
>
>
> On Friday, April 23, 2021 at 6:21:02 PM UTC-4 Cade Roux wrote:
>
>> I have a table and I am using WikiText because of the ability to use ~ 
>> and < to merge up and left - this is very convenient when generating the 
>> data tables in my build process so I don't have to look ahead indefinitely 
>> down and to the right.
>>
>> But I am finding need for more formatting (specifically making the 
>> background of a cell change due to content), but if I move to and HTML 
>> table, I will lose that ~ and < capability and have to look ahead in my 
>> data to decide when to merge cells using rowspan and colspan.
>>
>> So I am looking to see if there is a way to style a cell in a WikiText 
>> table.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>

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[tw5] Styling individual cells in a WikiText table

[Cade Roux]

I have a table and I am using WikiText because of the ability to use ~ and 
< to merge up and left - this is very convenient when generating the data 
tables in my build process so I don't have to look ahead indefinitely down 
and to the right.

But I am finding need for more formatting (specifically making the 
background of a cell change due to content), but if I move to and HTML 
table, I will lose that ~ and < capability and have to look ahead in my 
data to decide when to merge cells using rowspan and colspan.

So I am looking to see if there is a way to style a cell in a WikiText 
table.

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Query: POWERSHELL for TW: anyone doing anything?

[Cade Roux]

I use Powershell extensively in our data warehouse build and deploy 
process.  And that includes importing TW "templates", importing tiddlers 
from a JSON file generated from the database in SQL procs, exporting the 
whole file to HTML.  We use it for the user documentation generation as 
well as somewhat interactively in the QA process, where the informatics 
staff can review the test output results and check off that they are 
correct - these tiddlers get imported so that they can round-trip in future 
build/test cycles.

Doing all this using tiddlywiki nodejs command line.

Thanks,

Cade

On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 3:53:35 AM UTC-6 TiddlyTweeter wrote:

> Having worked with Mark S. on POLLY 
> (A 
> very useful Powershell tool to save & backup TW and more). 
>
> I am very aware of the utility of Powershell to get things done. And 
> "Powershell Core" is now multi-platform (all except Android natively).
>
> The QUESTION here is whether any of you are using Powershell to help 
> support TW in interesting ways?
>
> Just an initial query,
> TT 
>

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[tw5] Re: Fields other than the default text field being able to be treated also as a textarea?

[Cade Roux]

Thanks, I will check that out once we get through this current release.

We started with TW just being a great way to output a single HTML file of 
data dictionary/build status/testing results to be shared and approved 
instead of Word/Excel document artifacts.  But we treated it as a target 
document output until we had enough time to play with it, see how 
stakeholders responded and learned how to use it.  We wanted to be able to 
pivot away from it if users weren't happy with it.

But now, Instead of treating it as a target where we generate all the lists 
and tiddlers fully formed the way we want them to be presented like you 
might generate multiple HTML pages on a site, we've moved to really using 
it more "natively" in the sense of only exporting very simple data-like 
tiddlers and using filters and macros within TW tiddlers to generate 
information from them.

Thanks,

Cade
On Wednesday, December 2, 2020 at 7:32:58 PM UTC-6 TW Tones wrote:

> Cade,
>
> I have a solution I am proud of that uses all the mechaisiums you are 
> asking for. It is attached. Let me know if you need more instructions.
>
> I am yet to polish it for publication but it is a tool to have local view 
> templates specific to a tiddler, it works by only allowing you to edit the 
> local-viewtemplate field in a multiline editor in edit mode. It gets hidden 
> from the field in edit mode otherwise the you loose the line breaks.
>
>
>- Drop the package local-viewtemplate on a wiki. It does nothing 
>without further action.
>- Edit a tiddler and add a field "local-viewtemplate" with or without 
>a value, click add
>- Now the multiline editor of the local-viewtemplate field appears in 
>edit mode.
>- In this case there is a local view template that will display the 
>fields contents in view mode.
>
> Not only does it demonstrate multiline fields it provides a quick and easy 
> test bed for writing view Template tests that will not appear everywhere.
>
> There is a possibility tiddler may not be saved correctly on node 
> implementations. But I checked right now on Bobexe and it survived a save 
> and reload.
>
> Regards
> Tones
>
>
> On Thursday, 3 December 2020 at 04:19:10 UTC+11 Cade Roux wrote:
>
>> I was wondering if anyone has done anything like this where a tiddler has 
>> another field "promoted" to a "textarea"-type of field like the main text 
>> field so that a tiddler has two text areas when it's in edit mode, where 
>> one is the text of the tiddler and one is the field denoted to be edited in 
>> a textarea instead of a textbox with all the other (shorter) fields.
>>
>> In my particular use case, the second field is directly related to the 
>> first, but an alternate rendering or similar.  In my case, one is HTML and 
>> the other is raw XML or some other related data but they differ such that 
>> they aren't realistically directly transformable from one to the other 
>> within the browser.
>>
>> In the past I have put that text in a separate tiddler that is directly 
>> linked to the first, but I have found over time, that that technique has 
>> grown unwieldy and I have moved many things back into fields in the main 
>> tiddler (including these large bits of text/data - which are just very 
>> difficult to read in edit mode in their fields - they are obviously fine 
>> when transcluded or otherwise used).
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>

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[tw5] Fields other than the default text field being able to be treated also as a textarea?

[Cade Roux]

I was wondering if anyone has done anything like this where a tiddler has 
another field "promoted" to a "textarea"-type of field like the main text 
field so that a tiddler has two text areas when it's in edit mode, where 
one is the text of the tiddler and one is the field denoted to be edited in 
a textarea instead of a textbox with all the other (shorter) fields.

In my particular use case, the second field is directly related to the 
first, but an alternate rendering or similar.  In my case, one is HTML and 
the other is raw XML or some other related data but they differ such that 
they aren't realistically directly transformable from one to the other 
within the browser.

In the past I have put that text in a separate tiddler that is directly 
linked to the first, but I have found over time, that that technique has 
grown unwieldy and I have moved many things back into fields in the main 
tiddler (including these large bits of text/data - which are just very 
difficult to read in edit mode in their fields - they are obviously fine 
when transcluded or otherwise used).

Thanks in advance,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Way to disable <$checkbox> element?

[Cade Roux]

That will be really excellent.

Thank you so much!

Cade

On Thursday, November 12, 2020 at 11:28:50 AM UTC-6 PMario wrote:

> Hi, 
> This will be implemented in TW 5.1.23 ... the next version
> -m
>
> On Thursday, November 12, 2020 at 6:09:25 PM UTC+1 Cade Roux wrote:
>
>> In HTML  there is a disabled attribute.  But this is not available 
>> in <$checkbox>  Would also like to be able to disable <$edit-text> as well.
>>
>> Particular use case is that during my build cycle I am generating results 
>> into some TW in a "read-only" mode where the users cannot sign off on 
>> things and into some TW in a "test verification" mode where users do have 
>> to sign off on things, and I would like the layout to look similar to users 
>> and be able to simplify the code which generates the tiddlers/transcludes.  
>> Currently, I replace those inputs with literal text, but would prefer to 
>> just be able to tag them with disabled so that all the existing TW bindings 
>> logic to tiddlers/fields would work.
>>
>> I am considering just generating  elements which would look 
>> similar to the TW <$checkbox> elements but are disabled by attribute (and 
>> would lose their binding to the underlying tiddlers/fields, so that would 
>> have to be a literal as well).  Another option I am considering is layering 
>> a div over them so they cannot get the focus.
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>

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[tw5] Way to disable <$checkbox> element?

[Cade Roux]

In HTML  there is a disabled attribute.  But this is not available 
in <$checkbox>  Would also like to be able to disable <$edit-text> as well.

Particular use case is that during my build cycle I am generating results 
into some TW in a "read-only" mode where the users cannot sign off on 
things and into some TW in a "test verification" mode where users do have 
to sign off on things, and I would like the layout to look similar to users 
and be able to simplify the code which generates the tiddlers/transcludes.  
Currently, I replace those inputs with literal text, but would prefer to 
just be able to tag them with disabled so that all the existing TW bindings 
logic to tiddlers/fields would work.

I am considering just generating  elements which would look similar 
to the TW <$checkbox> elements but are disabled by attribute (and would 
lose their binding to the underlying tiddlers/fields, so that would have to 
be a literal as well).  Another option I am considering is layering a div 
over them so they cannot get the focus.

Thanks in advance,

Cade

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[tw5] Constant operator?

[Cade Roux]

Is there an equivalent of a "constant" operator for a filter that doesn't 
effect the tiddler being selected?

I want the subfilter to allow all tiddlers through if the dropdown is the 
"All Tiddlers" item that has the value "--any--" or allow only tiddlers 
through if the customer tags field contains the selected dropdown value.

i.e. the logical equivalent of 
{$:/state/dropdownvalue} = "--any--"
OR
contains:customtagsfield{$:/state/dropdownvalue}] 

Currently I have worked around this by putting [[--any--]] in all the 
custom tags fields and using this subfilter:

\define selectedindropdown()
[contains:customtagsfield{$:/state/dropdownvalue}]
\end

I'd like to eliminate having to have the [[--any--]] in all the tags fields.

Something like this which doesn't select or alter the tiddler coming into 
the subfilter in any way, but either allows it through or not based on an 
unrelated condition.

\define selectedindropdown()
[constant[--any--]{$:/state/dropdownvalue} 
contains:customtagsfield{$:/state/dropdownvalue}]
\end

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[tw5] Re: Breaking up very long runs in a filter?

[Cade Roux]

You have an example I can look at somewhere?  I just tried to extract one 
of the filters and it doesn't appear to be working - probably because of 
the curlybracket reference to the value of another tiddler set by the 
dropdowns?

\define obsname()
contains:ascend.observation.name{$:/ascend/state/observation.name.selected}
\end

Then I tried to use it as subfilter in the filter where that 
original filter was and the filter no longer works as expected.

I think I need to make up a toy version of this wiki so people can see it 
in action.

Thanks,

Cade

On Wednesday, September 30, 2020 at 6:22:25 PM UTC-5 joshua@gmail.com 
wrote:

> You can define sections of that filter as macro definitions, and then call 
> them with "subfilter".
>
> I.e. "[all[tiddlers+shadows]tag[MyTag]subfilter 
> subfilter sort[]]" 
>
> Define them at the start of the tiddler which is using the filter, or 
> define them in other tiddlers and import using the "\import 
> filter-to-import" Pragma at the top of the text field where the filters 
> will be used.
>
> Best,
> Joshua Fontany
> On Wednesday, September 30, 2020 at 10:41:23 AM UTC-7 Cade Roux wrote:
>
>> What is the best technique to break up very long runs in a filter 
>> (preferably to different lines)?  Can't use whitespace since that separates 
>> runs.  I have a filter that is currently 382 characters.
>>
>> It selects a subset of tiddlers on one field, then four other fields 
>> individually have to have tags matching four dropdowns which allow the user 
>> to filter, and then it is sorted.  Some of that can be mitigated with 
>> shorted field names, but it still is unwieldy in most editors.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>

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Re: [tw5] Still frustrated

[Cade Roux]

I sympathize.

It's very hard for me to switch gears into TiddlyWiki filter and widget 
syntax.  I generate my tiddlers with a combination of SQL and PowerShell 
within and around a source template TW.  So I am dealing with two 
completely different declarative models (TW - plus HTML/CSS - and SQL 
queries) and four different imperative models (C#, Javascript, PowerShell, 
SQL procedures) on a daily basis.

I am trying to let each be the best at what it does.  So in cases where I 
might have previously generated an HTML table to put in a tiddler, I am 
instead replacing that with a macro based on a list(s) of elements put into 
a field(s) in the tiddler, and generating more of the raw data into the 
fields of the tiddlers and let them render more things based on their 
attached data.

I find the filters are really hard to deal with finding which one you 
need.  The names are so generic and terse and they are so varied.  I mean 
we have tag, tags and tagged which all have to do different things.  And 
ones like each, get, has, is, contains - all needed obviously for their 
different input and semantics, but it's hard to keep them all in your head 
there are so many compared to other languages.

I use a macro to do edit/transclusion extensively, to allow the medical 
informaticist to edit tiddlers which annotate things in various places 
which need handwritten narratives - so he gets quick feedback since 
everything is transcluded, he can see the results immediately as if he was 
building the manual in Word or some other documentation tool without having 
to cut and paste in new lists of things generated from the datamart.  He 
just transcludes them and when they are regenerated, they are updated.

Because we have a combination of edited manual tiddlers and generated 
tiddlers, and also need source control for our work simultaneously, I tend 
to relegate all control over the template to the medical informaticist and 
put anything I want in through the build process - all tiddlers are either 
in the template or they are generated, there is no mixing.  Once we 
established that separation (generated tiddlers are marked in a field and 
are all deleted and recreated during the build process), it has worked very 
well.  Generated tiddlers can transclude manual tiddlers and vice versa, 
which truly is wonderful.  It's somehow hard to tell whether the system is 
filling out a template we have created or we are filling out a template the 
build process has created - that is very liberating from the point of view 
of generating a rapidly growing data dictionary for our data mart.  It's a 
continual learning process and a lot of refactoring and refinement, but I 
think the process is a lot smoother and less labor intensive than if we had 
a system that was more biased one way or the other towards whether the main 
point of view was the generated documentation from manual parts or the 
manual documentation from generated parts.

Best of luck,

Cade
On Wednesday, September 30, 2020 at 12:46:41 PM UTC-5 bob...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Read with interest all the comments. I am trying to help and it is warming 
> to read that you seem to agree. Other lists I have been on are less 
> welcoming.
>
> Imtaz's comments are right but I would go further and argue for a rewrite 
> of all the filter docs. The one thing I have learned is the central and 
> crucial role of filters to the extent that I believe they need a 'Book' on 
> their own. Filters drive just about everything and understanding them, 
> their role and how to code them is most crucial.
>
> Secondly, how to address stuff needs a rewrite, what 
> bracket/brace/underscore configuration drives me crazy and every time I get 
> my problem fixed and then apply that to the next wiki text statement to 
> have it fail makes things worse. I don't believe the problem is because TW 
> is a declarative language. I have used other such languages and they don't 
> suffer from this. It sounds as if the scope of today's browsers contributes 
> and maybe that needs to be looked at. Looking at HTML/CSS though, the early 
> days of hard coding have been replaced by IDE's. Maybe TW needs to change 
> to something like an IDE with sound foundation in language grammar and 
> possibly restrict what can be done through the IDE but with a hook to let 
> the experienced programmer do what they want with appropriate 
> responsibilities on results of course.
>
> Mario, the examples I mentioned used code like '.operator parameter'. I'll 
> find some and mail them to this list.
>
> BobJ
>
> ---
>
> Dr Bob Jansen
>
> The Cultural Conversations project 
>
> Turtle Lane Studios Pty Ltd trading as the Australian Centre for Oral History
>
> 122 Cameron St, Rockdale NSW 2216, Australia 
>
> Ph (Korea): +82 10-4494-0328 <+82%2010-4494-0328> 
>
> Ph (Australia) +61 414 297 448 <+61%20414%20297%20448> 
>
> Resume: http://au.linkedin.com/in/bobjan 
>
> Skype: bobjtls 
>
> KakaoTalk: 

[tw5] Breaking up very long runs in a filter?

[Cade Roux]

What is the best technique to break up very long runs in a filter 
(preferably to different lines)?  Can't use whitespace since that separates 
runs.  I have a filter that is currently 382 characters.

It selects a subset of tiddlers on one field, then four other fields 
individually have to have tags matching four dropdowns which allow the user 
to filter, and then it is sorted.  Some of that can be mitigated with 
shorted field names, but it still is unwieldy in most editors.

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Generic Tags Fields: State Of Play

[Cade Roux]

Yes, as you know, GenTags extends the tags operator to add tags:field[] so 
I can do something to get a list of tiddlers and then get the union of 
their tags:

[myfield[fieldcriteria]contains:myfield2[sometagcriteria]tags:myfield3[]sort[title]]

It's something like that which I am doing to build the various filter drop 
downs for my cardiovascular observations.  Each filter is based on the tags 
in a specific field and as one dropdown changes, the others change to only 
offer the tags in their field that are still available.

To do this, I rely on the tags:field[] operator from 
https://github.com/OokTech/TW5-GenTags/tree/master/core%20updates

But maybe the list or get operators can now do this?
[image: ObsIndex.PNG]


On Tuesday, September 29, 2020 at 11:24:45 PM UTC-5 TW Tones wrote:

> Cade;
>
> You can access the tags filed with the tag operators or 
> as a field in its own right {{!!tags}} or has[tags] or has:field[tags]  
> these should work with gen tags fields
>
> If you are asking about operators for gen tags specifically refer to its 
> documentation. It adds a some operators.
>
> Regards
> Tony
>
>
> On Wednesday, 30 September 2020 10:59:10 UTC+10, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> Cool, is there also now a Core alternative now to the tags:field[] 
>> operator?  I am using that extension from the GenTags plugin to build my 
>> dropdowns of tags across a set of tiddlers.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>> On Tuesday, September 29, 2020 at 5:57:23 PM UTC-5 TW Tones wrote:
>>
>>> Cade,
>>>
>>> The contains operator is newer than GenTags. Also as I said earlier;
>>>
>>>
>>>- *Instead I tend to use my own fields and list fields that in many 
>>>ways work not unlike tags if you want them to.*
>>>   - *See listops and other operators and widgets.*
>>>
>>> Tones
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, 29 September 2020 02:11:22 UTC+10, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>>
>>>> OK, that appears to work.  I was working from the readme on GenTags.  I 
>>>> think to do what I need, I don't even really need the GenTags plugin 
>>>> anyway 
>>>> (I don't need to display the tags), and this wasn't relying on it.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Cade
>>>>
>>>> On Monday, September 28, 2020 at 9:26:34 AM UTC-5 Eric Shulman wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Monday, September 28, 2020 at 6:39:48 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> FWIW, to me it appears like the listed operator cannot be re-used in 
>>>>>> the run for some reason, even on a different parameter or different 
>>>>>> field.  
>>>>>> Yet by itself just once, combined with tag does work.  I made my.field 
>>>>>> and 
>>>>>> my.field2 with combinations of A, B, C and X, Y, Z respectively and put 
>>>>>> alpha, beta, gamma in tags, and combining tag operator with listed works 
>>>>>> fine.  And tag filter intersection seems to work as 
>>>>>> expected: [tag[alpha]tag[gamma]]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Perhaps the clunky original plan of prefixing tags for the possible 
>>>>>> values of each field may have to be what I resort to.  e.g. 
>>>>>> [tag[name-some 
>>>>>> name]tag[structure-some structure]tag[context-some context]]
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I think you might be using the wrong filter operator!  Try using 
>>>>> "contains:fieldname[value]", like this:
>>>>>
>>>>> <$list filter="[contains:my.field[A]contains:my.field[C]]" />
>>>>>
>>>>> (see https://tiddlywiki.com/#contains%20Operator)
>>>>>
>>>>> -e
>>>>>
>>>>>

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[tw5] Re: Generic Tags Fields: State Of Play

[Cade Roux]

Cool, is there also now a Core alternative now to the tags:field[] 
operator?  I am using that extension from the GenTags plugin to build my 
dropdowns of tags across a set of tiddlers.

Thanks,

Cade

On Tuesday, September 29, 2020 at 5:57:23 PM UTC-5 TW Tones wrote:

> Cade,
>
> The contains operator is newer than GenTags. Also as I said earlier;
>
>
>- *Instead I tend to use my own fields and list fields that in many 
>ways work not unlike tags if you want them to.*
>   - *See listops and other operators and widgets.*
>
> Tones
>
>
> On Tuesday, 29 September 2020 02:11:22 UTC+10, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> OK, that appears to work.  I was working from the readme on GenTags.  I 
>> think to do what I need, I don't even really need the GenTags plugin anyway 
>> (I don't need to display the tags), and this wasn't relying on it.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>> On Monday, September 28, 2020 at 9:26:34 AM UTC-5 Eric Shulman wrote:
>>
>>> On Monday, September 28, 2020 at 6:39:48 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>>
>>>> FWIW, to me it appears like the listed operator cannot be re-used in 
>>>> the run for some reason, even on a different parameter or different field. 
>>>>  
>>>> Yet by itself just once, combined with tag does work.  I made my.field and 
>>>> my.field2 with combinations of A, B, C and X, Y, Z respectively and put 
>>>> alpha, beta, gamma in tags, and combining tag operator with listed works 
>>>> fine.  And tag filter intersection seems to work as 
>>>> expected: [tag[alpha]tag[gamma]]
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps the clunky original plan of prefixing tags for the possible 
>>>> values of each field may have to be what I resort to.  e.g. [tag[name-some 
>>>> name]tag[structure-some structure]tag[context-some context]]
>>>>
>>>
>>> I think you might be using the wrong filter operator!  Try using 
>>> "contains:fieldname[value]", like this:
>>>
>>> <$list filter="[contains:my.field[A]contains:my.field[C]]" />
>>>
>>> (see https://tiddlywiki.com/#contains%20Operator)
>>>
>>> -e
>>>
>>>

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[tw5] Re: Generic Tags Fields: State Of Play

[Cade Roux]

OK, that appears to work.  I was working from the readme on GenTags.  I 
think to do what I need, I don't even really need the GenTags plugin anyway 
(I don't need to display the tags), and this wasn't relying on it.

Thanks,

Cade

On Monday, September 28, 2020 at 9:26:34 AM UTC-5 Eric Shulman wrote:

> On Monday, September 28, 2020 at 6:39:48 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> FWIW, to me it appears like the listed operator cannot be re-used in the 
>> run for some reason, even on a different parameter or different field.  Yet 
>> by itself just once, combined with tag does work.  I made my.field and 
>> my.field2 with combinations of A, B, C and X, Y, Z respectively and put 
>> alpha, beta, gamma in tags, and combining tag operator with listed works 
>> fine.  And tag filter intersection seems to work as 
>> expected: [tag[alpha]tag[gamma]]
>>
>> Perhaps the clunky original plan of prefixing tags for the possible 
>> values of each field may have to be what I resort to.  e.g. [tag[name-some 
>> name]tag[structure-some structure]tag[context-some context]]
>>
>
> I think you might be using the wrong filter operator!  Try using 
> "contains:fieldname[value]", like this:
>
> <$list filter="[contains:my.field[A]contains:my.field[C]]" />
>
> (see https://tiddlywiki.com/#contains%20Operator)
>
> -e
>
>

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[tw5] Re: Generic Tags Fields: State Of Play

[Cade Roux]

FWIW, to me it appears like the listed operator cannot be re-used in the 
run for some reason, even on a different parameter or different field.  Yet 
by itself just once, combined with tag does work.  I made my.field and 
my.field2 with combinations of A, B, C and X, Y, Z respectively and put 
alpha, beta, gamma in tags, and combining tag operator with listed works 
fine.  And tag filter intersection seems to work as 
expected: [tag[alpha]tag[gamma]]

Perhaps the clunky original plan of prefixing tags for the possible values 
of each field may have to be what I resort to.  e.g. [tag[name-some 
name]tag[structure-some structure]tag[context-some context]]



On Sunday, September 27, 2020 at 6:50:46 PM UTC-5 Cade Roux wrote:

> I see what you are saying, but I thought it was starting with a default 
> [all[]] operator.  I even tried putting an explicit [all[]] operator on the 
> front.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Cade
>
> On Saturday, September 26, 2020 at 11:37:23 AM UTC-5 compa...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Cade,
>>
>> you are understanding the mathematical "idea" of intersection correct BUT 
>> you are telling TW to throw away everyting that your first run outputted 
>> when you are using filter-operators that throw away the input (stated as 
>> "input ignored" in the filter operator) in subsequent runs, as *[A]* and 
>> *[C]* do. See also: https://tiddlywiki.com/#title%20Operator.
>>
>> What you actually get is everything that lists *C* in your first <$list> 
>> and *A* in your second.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Mirko
>>
>> Am Samstag, 26. September 2020 17:56:02 UTC+2 schrieb Cade Roux:
>>>
>>> Thanks, I have started using a field and I am struggling with list 
>>> intersections, i.e. lists of items that are tagged both A and C:
>>>
>>> I thought these would be the intersection and should be equivalent:
>>>
>>> <$list filter="[[A]listed[my.field]] +[[C]listed[my.field]]" />
>>> <$list filter="[[C]listed[my.field]] +[[A]listed[my.field]]" />
>>>
>>> But not only are they not equivalent, they are not correct lists:
>>>
>>> [image: Screenshot 2020-09-26 105510.png]
>>>
>>> What am I not understanding correctly about the filter intersections?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Cade
>>>
>>> On Saturday, September 26, 2020 at 1:03:00 AM UTC-5 TW Tones wrote:
>>>
>>>> Cade,
>>>>
>>>> As far as I know Gentags is the state of the art for a plugin giving 
>>>> you alternative tag fields. 
>>>>
>>>> Just keep in mind tags are a solution built into the core. 
>>>>
>>>>- I for one avoid them to keep them free for ad hoc tagging. 
>>>>- Instead I tend to use my own fields and list fields that in many 
>>>>ways work not unlike tags if you want them to.
>>>>   - See listops and other operators and widgets.
>>>>- Avoid the use of prefixes on titles, including tag names where 
>>>>practical otherwise you will find you need to parse the title to 
>>>> extract 
>>>>info.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> For a small or for purpose wiki do what you want with the tags and 
>>>> prefixed titles, its only when you transfer tiddlers or grow wikis it may 
>>>> become a problem.
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>> Tony
>>>>
>>>> On Saturday, 26 September 2020 04:48:59 UTC+10, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I find myself looking to use this concept in my data mart data 
>>>>> dictionary/user manual, as I want to have three types of tags for one set 
>>>>> of generated tiddlers and three types of tags for another set of 
>>>>> generated 
>>>>> tiddlers and putting a prefix on each set and throwing them into tags 
>>>>> field 
>>>>> is kind of unwieldy and the filters will be really awkward.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is https://ooktech.com/jed/ExampleWikis/GenericTagFields/ this the 
>>>>> latest thinking on that or is there another plugin I should be looking at 
>>>>> (or something that has made it to core?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Cade
>>>>>
>>>>

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[tw5] Re: Generic Tags Fields: State Of Play

[Cade Roux]

I see what you are saying, but I thought it was starting with a default 
[all[]] operator.  I even tried putting an explicit [all[]] operator on the 
front.

Thanks,

Cade

On Saturday, September 26, 2020 at 11:37:23 AM UTC-5 compa...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Hi Cade,
>
> you are understanding the mathematical "idea" of intersection correct BUT 
> you are telling TW to throw away everyting that your first run outputted 
> when you are using filter-operators that throw away the input (stated as 
> "input ignored" in the filter operator) in subsequent runs, as *[A]* and 
> *[C]* do. See also: https://tiddlywiki.com/#title%20Operator.
>
> What you actually get is everything that lists *C* in your first <$list> 
> and *A* in your second.
>
> Regards,
> Mirko
>
> Am Samstag, 26. September 2020 17:56:02 UTC+2 schrieb Cade Roux:
>>
>> Thanks, I have started using a field and I am struggling with list 
>> intersections, i.e. lists of items that are tagged both A and C:
>>
>> I thought these would be the intersection and should be equivalent:
>>
>> <$list filter="[[A]listed[my.field]] +[[C]listed[my.field]]" />
>> <$list filter="[[C]listed[my.field]] +[[A]listed[my.field]]" />
>>
>> But not only are they not equivalent, they are not correct lists:
>>
>> [image: Screenshot 2020-09-26 105510.png]
>>
>> What am I not understanding correctly about the filter intersections?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>> On Saturday, September 26, 2020 at 1:03:00 AM UTC-5 TW Tones wrote:
>>
>>> Cade,
>>>
>>> As far as I know Gentags is the state of the art for a plugin giving you 
>>> alternative tag fields. 
>>>
>>> Just keep in mind tags are a solution built into the core. 
>>>
>>>- I for one avoid them to keep them free for ad hoc tagging. 
>>>- Instead I tend to use my own fields and list fields that in many 
>>>ways work not unlike tags if you want them to.
>>>   - See listops and other operators and widgets.
>>>- Avoid the use of prefixes on titles, including tag names where 
>>>practical otherwise you will find you need to parse the title to extract 
>>>info.
>>>
>>>
>>> For a small or for purpose wiki do what you want with the tags and 
>>> prefixed titles, its only when you transfer tiddlers or grow wikis it may 
>>> become a problem.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Tony
>>>
>>> On Saturday, 26 September 2020 04:48:59 UTC+10, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I find myself looking to use this concept in my data mart data 
>>>> dictionary/user manual, as I want to have three types of tags for one set 
>>>> of generated tiddlers and three types of tags for another set of generated 
>>>> tiddlers and putting a prefix on each set and throwing them into tags 
>>>> field 
>>>> is kind of unwieldy and the filters will be really awkward.
>>>>
>>>> Is https://ooktech.com/jed/ExampleWikis/GenericTagFields/ this the 
>>>> latest thinking on that or is there another plugin I should be looking at 
>>>> (or something that has made it to core?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Cade
>>>>
>>>

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[tw5] Re: Generic Tags Fields: State Of Play

[Cade Roux]

Same issue.  Filtering only on C gives me the A/C, B/C items, then 
seemingly when adding the additional filter through the then operator, 
removes the B/C but ADDs an A/B item which wasn't in the first list.  I'm 
clearly missing something in the syntax, including where the runs are 
defined and the which brackets are used as logical grouping delimiters and 
which are used as parameter containers.

I'm using the comments here regarding using the listed operator to find 
tiddlers based on tags in a field 
https://ooktech.com/jed/ExampleWikis/GenericTagFields/#%24%3A%2Fplugins%2Finmysocks%2FGenericTagFields%2FReadMe

[image: then-operator-test.PNG]

Current testing goal: List of all tiddlers which have all specified "tags" 
in a dedicated field "my.field" - i.e. my.field contains 'A' and my.field 
contains 'B' where A and B are tags (potentially containing spaces, so 
delimited in my.field with []_

Ultimate goal for context: Offer a filterable tiddler index of 
cardiovascular observations with dropdowns for Name, Structure, Context.  
Each page of observations will have three fields: observation.name, 
observation.structure, observation.context.  A page which discusses e.g. 
Regurgitation and Stenosis observations might have 
observation.name="[Regurgitation] [Stenosis]", observation.structure="[Left 
ventricle]", observation.context="[History] [Findings]"

This is very similar to the case 
here: 
http://inmysocks.tiddlyspot.com/#%24%3A%2Fplugins%2Finmysocks%2FBookmarks%2FBookmarks%20by%20Tags
 
except all three dropdowns would be present at all times and the tags would 
be restricted to the relevant field - this is why I broke it up into three 
dedicated fields, to avoid having to prefix different tags which only apply 
to certain dropdowns.

In this case, I would always be looking for my list to be the intersection 
of tiddlers matching all three dropdowns (ignoring any dropdowns set to 
Select All)

Thanks in advance.  I know I am rather slow wrapping my head around the 
filter syntax.

On Saturday, September 26, 2020 at 1:10:02 PM UTC-5 Eric Shulman wrote:

>
> On Saturday, September 26, 2020 at 8:56:02 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> I thought these would be the intersection and should be equivalent:
>>
>> <$list filter="[[A]listed[my.field]] +[[C]listed[my.field]]" />
>> <$list filter="[[C]listed[my.field]] +[[A]listed[my.field]]" />
>>
>> But not only are they not equivalent, they are not correct lists:
>>
>
> Try this:
> <$list filter="[[A]listed[my.field]then[C]listed[my.field]]" />
> <$list filter="[[C]listed[my.field]then[A]listed[my.field]]" />
>
> "if [A] is listed, then test to see if [C] is listed"
> "if [C] is listed, then test to see if [A] is listed"
>
> -e
>
>  
>

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[tw5] Re: Generic Tags Fields: State Of Play

[Cade Roux]

Thanks, I have started using a field and I am struggling with list 
intersections, i.e. lists of items that are tagged both A and C:

I thought these would be the intersection and should be equivalent:

<$list filter="[[A]listed[my.field]] +[[C]listed[my.field]]" />
<$list filter="[[C]listed[my.field]] +[[A]listed[my.field]]" />

But not only are they not equivalent, they are not correct lists:

[image: Screenshot 2020-09-26 105510.png]

What am I not understanding correctly about the filter intersections?

Thanks,

Cade

On Saturday, September 26, 2020 at 1:03:00 AM UTC-5 TW Tones wrote:

> Cade,
>
> As far as I know Gentags is the state of the art for a plugin giving you 
> alternative tag fields. 
>
> Just keep in mind tags are a solution built into the core. 
>
>- I for one avoid them to keep them free for ad hoc tagging. 
>- Instead I tend to use my own fields and list fields that in many 
>ways work not unlike tags if you want them to.
>   - See listops and other operators and widgets.
>- Avoid the use of prefixes on titles, including tag names where 
>practical otherwise you will find you need to parse the title to extract 
>info.
>
>
> For a small or for purpose wiki do what you want with the tags and 
> prefixed titles, its only when you transfer tiddlers or grow wikis it may 
> become a problem.
>
> Regards
> Tony
>
> On Saturday, 26 September 2020 04:48:59 UTC+10, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> I find myself looking to use this concept in my data mart data 
>> dictionary/user manual, as I want to have three types of tags for one set 
>> of generated tiddlers and three types of tags for another set of generated 
>> tiddlers and putting a prefix on each set and throwing them into tags field 
>> is kind of unwieldy and the filters will be really awkward.
>>
>> Is https://ooktech.com/jed/ExampleWikis/GenericTagFields/ this the 
>> latest thinking on that or is there another plugin I should be looking at 
>> (or something that has made it to core?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>

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[tw5] Re: When running on node, disabling the Filesystem plugin has really nasty effects

[Cade Roux]

This is true about needing the filesystem plugin in nodejs even if not 
serving out over web but just using the command-line.

First step I do after --init is to change the tiddlywiki.info file to add 
the plugin.

The only use case would be if you do want changes to be kind of ephemeral 
until it's restarted

Cade

On Thursday, September 24, 2020 at 11:19:57 AM UTC-5 dieg...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Sorry if this is obvious, but is there is a reason for this to be a plugin 
> that can be disabled? 
>
> On Thursday, September 24, 2020 at 4:32:55 AM UTC-5 PMario wrote:
>
>> Hi, 
>> I did create a PR with the new description. 
>> https://github.com/Jermolene/TiddlyWiki5/pull/4865
>> -mario
>>
>

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[tw5] Re: How to make the tiddlywiki only can be edit in some of the ip or the read only mode?

[Cade Roux]

FWIW, if you have a process or something for publishing your wiki in 
another place for people to download, what I do is have a set of tiddlers 
that I import (ReleaseMode.json) during my build/publish process that turn 
off a bunch of buttons and UI elements, so I build a user version and an 
editor version using the nodejs tiddlywiki which has already been loaded 
with the master template:

tiddlywiki "Data Mart User Manual" --import ReleaseMode.json application/json

Obviously this technique can be enhanced (all these tiddlers are actually 
tagged in my full version so they can be deleted automatically).  Macros 
and other parts of your Wiki can look for the ReleaseMode tiddler to see if 
it's in Release Mode or not (perhaps to show some tiddlers differently).

[{
"title" : "ReleaseMode"
,"text" : "# This Wiki is in Release mode"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : 
"$:/config/PageControlButtons/Visibility/$:/core/ui/Buttons/control-panel"
,"text" : "hide"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : 
"$:/config/PageControlButtons/Visibility/$:/core/ui/Buttons/new-tiddler"
,"text" : "hide"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : 
"$:/config/PageControlButtons/Visibility/$:/core/ui/Buttons/save-wiki"
,"text" : "hide"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : 
"$:/config/PageControlButtons/Visibility/$:/plugins/tiddlywiki/markdown/new-markdown-button"
,"text" : "hide"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : "$:/config/ViewToolbarButtons/Visibility/$:/core/ui/Buttons/edit"
,"text" : "hide"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : 
"$:/config/ViewToolbarButtons/Visibility/$:/core/ui/Buttons/more-tiddler-actions"
,"text" : "hide"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : "$:/core/ui/SideBar/More"
,"text" : ""
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : "$:/core/ui/SideBar/Tools"
,"text" : ""
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
,{
"title" : "$:/core/ui/SideBar/Recent"
,"text" : ""
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}
]


On Friday, September 25, 2020 at 5:37:19 AM UTC-5 Ton Gerner wrote:

> Hi
>
> Since you mention 'predifined button', I assume you did install the 
> 'simple readonly' plugin.
> If you refresh your wiki after installing that plugin, a 'publish' button 
> (square with pencil) will be available next to the hide/show sidebar button 
> (top right).
> Clicking that button openes a separate window with 4 tabs.
> Do read the Help tab (the tutorial you asked for) carefully before 
> proceding.
> Carry out the mentioned steps and reload your wiki after the last step 
> (save).
>
> Hope that helps.
>
> Ton
>

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[tw5] Generic Tags Fields: State Of Play

[Cade Roux]

I find myself looking to use this concept in my data mart data 
dictionary/user manual, as I want to have three types of tags for one set 
of generated tiddlers and three types of tags for another set of generated 
tiddlers and putting a prefix on each set and throwing them into tags field 
is kind of unwieldy and the filters will be really awkward.

Is https://ooktech.com/jed/ExampleWikis/GenericTagFields/ this the latest 
thinking on that or is there another plugin I should be looking at (or 
something that has made it to core?

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Styling list in columns - top alignment

[Cade Roux]

A ha!  Thanks so much.

Cade

On Wednesday, September 23, 2020 at 12:35:16 PM UTC-5 PMario wrote:

> Hi,
>
> The list UL element has a margin-top and a margin-bottom. If you remove 
> it, it should be OK.
>
> So if you add 
>
> .threecolumns ul {
>   margin-top: 0;
>   margin-bottom: 0;
> }
>
> you should be fine. 
>
> -mario
>

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[tw5] Exporting several tiddlers to a JSON file using --rendertiddler - looking for more documentation

[Cade Roux]

I'm looking for any more examples or exposition of the --render, 
--rendertiddler, and --rendertiddlers commands.

What I am doing is exporting a set of tiddlers from a tiddlywiki into a 
single JSON file to be processed by a program/script.

This is my current command in PowerShell with appropriate escaping and it 
works fine:

& tiddlywiki --% TestsVerified --verbose --rendertiddler 
"$:/core/templates/exporters/JsonFile" TestsVerified.json text/plain "" 
exportFilter "[regexp:title[^(XmlOutput|TestVerified):.*]]"

But I don't understand which parameter that "" is supposed to be a 
placeholder for:

--rendertiddler   [] [] [] []


is what the documentation has with the example:

--rendertiddler "$:/core/templates/exporters/JsonFile" output.json text/plain 
"" exportFilter "[tag[done]]"


and the documentation also says that --render can replace the other two 
commands, but I'm not sure what would be equivalent.

Any pointers to more docs on this would be appreciated.

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[tw5] Re: Getting from a non-linear notebook to something a little more linear

[Cade Roux]

This looks to have good potential to help with our users.  Thanks for the 
input!

Cade

On Friday, December 6, 2019 at 12:00:33 AM UTC-6, Mohammad wrote:
>
> Hi Cade,
>  I have encountered the same problem before. There is a plugin help you 
> very much in this case and answer part of your questions
>
> The slider plugin creates a trails and a trail is a linear set of tiddlers 
> start from a page 1 and ends to page n
> Have a look at https://kookma.github.io/slider/
>
>
>- It has page number 
>- Shows total number in a trail (like a chapter), so you know where 
>you are
>- It has a footnote to show what is the chapter name (trail name) and 
>can include logo or more information
>- It has next | previous buttons to let navigate to next | previous 
>pages
>- It has a popup window appear on mouse hover on footnote ribbon to 
>show the table of content on each page
>
>
> You can have many trails (chapters) and open one at a time.
>
> I may recommend to hide the Open tab from side bar and use Zoomin story 
> view.
>
> I think this will address many of the issues you mention above!
>
> There is one more improvement you may need which is recently brought by 
> PMario, highlighting the title entry in table of content which is open and 
> under focus in story river.
>
>
> Best
> Mohammad
>

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[tw5] Getting from a non-linear notebook to something a little more linear

[Cade Roux]

I've been using TW since August as a documentation target for the metadata 
and manual for our data mart of cardiovascular information and we are 
starting to get feedback from internal users and we are soon going to be 
sending it out to customers to get feedback on both the documentation and 
the data mart capabilities.

I'm very happy with how it is going.  It's an integral part of our build 
process that produces the documentation and it's been really good to be 
able to combine very easily generated tiddlers of lists of content along 
with narratives that are created by the informatics staff.

Users are very used to a linear document like a PDF or Word, but the 
TiddlyWiki is winning out the dev team with the powerful abilities to 
transclude information helping remove the artificial lines between what is 
template and what is manually written content and generated content.  This 
flexibility has really saved a lot of cycles in developing the document's 
"framework" and editing.

One of the feedback items that I did expect from the beginning is the 
issues surrounding the non-linear nature of TW.  For many users, it's kind 
of scary, because like all hypertext system you don't know how much 
material is underneath when you don't have a table of contents and a page 
number to know where you are.  And a lot of these users are medical 
informaticists, so high proportion of OCD - and things moving around is 
disorienting to them.

What we would like to do to give some comfort to the people that are in 
that mindset is to have a subset of our tiddlers that is identified as the 
"default content" of N tiddlers in a particular order that would:

1. The default content would open at the start (already a feature of TW - I 
have this working as expected)

2. If tiddlers are closed and re-opened, that they show up in the same 
place in the order - this is something I am struggling to figure out how to 
get a closed tiddler to re-appear back in its place.

3. Have a default content button that restores all the tiddlers - I have a 
button that will open them - it's based on a macro I found - it opens them 
in reverse order so that the order at the end looks like the original 
order, but if the tiddler is already open, it does not get back in the 
right spot.  I could just close all open tiddlers at the start of the 
macro, and then it would just be like a reset.

If you have any ideas how to approach a slight linearization to ease 
beginners into using our TW, particularly with item 2 in trying to keep the 
ordering, I would be grateful.

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Descenders in titles cut off at bottom

[Cade Roux]

My Chrome appeared a little out of date so I went ahead and let it update 
and it appears to have cleared it up:

[image: descenders.PNG]


On Wednesday, October 23, 2019 at 11:04:49 AM UTC-5, Cade Roux wrote:
>
> Everything seemed fine with all those numbers locally, and I don't think 
> I'm not styling anything, so I headed to tiddlywiki.com and checked it in 
> stock (this is on Chrome)
>
>
> [image: descenders.PNG]
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 23, 2019 at 10:36:32 AM UTC-5, Mark S. wrote:
>>
>> The first place I would check is in Control Panel, Appearance, Theme 
>> Tweaks, Font Sizes.
>>
>> Usually the standard font and line size are 14 and 20 respectively, and 
>> the tiddler body
>> sizes are 15 and 22 respectively.
>>
>> If you have any custom style sheets in play, or styles specified in the 
>> tiddler, they
>> might be having an effect.
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 23, 2019 at 7:35:39 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>
>>> [image: descenders.PNG]
>>>
>>> Is that something I have inadvertantly messed up?  Where to look for a 
>>> fix for that?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Cade
>>>
>>

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[tw5] Re: Descenders in titles cut off at bottom

[Cade Roux]

Everything seemed fine with all those numbers locally, and I don't think 
I'm not styling anything, so I headed to tiddlywiki.com and checked it in 
stock (this is on Chrome)


[image: descenders.PNG]


On Wednesday, October 23, 2019 at 10:36:32 AM UTC-5, Mark S. wrote:
>
> The first place I would check is in Control Panel, Appearance, Theme 
> Tweaks, Font Sizes.
>
> Usually the standard font and line size are 14 and 20 respectively, and 
> the tiddler body
> sizes are 15 and 22 respectively.
>
> If you have any custom style sheets in play, or styles specified in the 
> tiddler, they
> might be having an effect.
>
> On Wednesday, October 23, 2019 at 7:35:39 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> [image: descenders.PNG]
>>
>> Is that something I have inadvertantly messed up?  Where to look for a 
>> fix for that?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>

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[tw5] Descenders in titles cut off at bottom

[Cade Roux]

[image: descenders.PNG]

Is that something I have inadvertantly messed up?  Where to look for a fix 
for that?

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Struggling to nest a macro

[Cade Roux]

emptyMessage had had no success getting working nested so ended up with 
this working:

<$list filter="[[releasemode]!is[missing]]">{{$title$}}
<$list filter="[[releasemode]is[missing]]"><$list filter="[title[$title$]] 
+[has[title]]" emptyMessage=<>>{{$title$}} 
<>

Thanks,

Cade


On Thursday, October 17, 2019 at 11:29:49 PM UTC-5, Sycom wrote:
>
> 1Hello
>
> If I get correctly what you're trying to do I'll recommend using the 
> "variable" parameter of $list when you nest them. Maybe you can use else 
> operator in your filter but the scope is limited.
>
> Greetings
>
> Sylvain
> @sycom
>
>

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[tw5] Struggling to nest a macro

[Cade Roux]

My existing macros allow me to present a transcluded tiddler with an (Edit) 
link after it and if the tiddler is missing, it presents it as (Missing), 
so that an editor can create and immediately the tiddler.

So I can do <>

and either get:

Transcluded tiddler content (Edit)

or

(Missing)

Now, I want to modify the macro so that it only puts those links in IF we 
are not in release mode (so casual users who are sent the file to read 
don't think they are editing anything).  But I know you can't nest macros 
and it also seems that you can't nest $list widgets?

These are my existing macros.  I tried to wrap the $list widget in 
trans-edit with another $list widget using a search on a "releasemode" 
tiddler, but it didn't seem to work.

\define trans-edit-btn(title)
(<$button class="tc-btn-invisible tc-tiddlylink">
<$action-createtiddler $basetitle="$title$" />
<$action-sendmessage $message="tm-edit-tiddler" $param="$title$"/>
Missing
)
\end

\define edit-btn(title)
(<$button class="tc-btn-invisible tc-tiddlylink">
<$action-sendmessage $message="tm-edit-tiddler" $param="$title$"/>
Edit
)
\end

\define trans-edit(title)
<$list filter="[title[$title$]] +[has[title]]" 
emptyMessage=<>>{{$title$}} <>
\end

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[tw5] Re: Focus on edit after a tm-edit-tiddler message

[Cade Roux]

Bumping this up - is there any way to set the focus to the text instead of 
the title when you go into edit mode?

Thanks in advance,

Cade

On Tuesday, September 3, 2019 at 5:17:49 PM UTC-5, Cade Roux wrote:
>
> I have a set of macros that let me transclude a tiddler and offer a link 
> next to the transcluded tiddler to edit it if it exists or a link button to 
> create it if it's missing.
>
> This is one of the relevant sub-macros for the Edit button:
>
> \define edit-btn(title)
> (<$button class="tc-btn-invisible tc-tiddlylink">
> <$action-sendmessage $message="tm-edit-tiddler" $param="$title$"/>
> Edit
> )
> \end
>
> After the tm-edit-tiddler message, I want to set the focus on that draft 
> tiddler that comes up so that the cursor is in the text field and not in 
> the title field.
>
> Any tips?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Cade
>

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[tw5] Re: [TW5] Introducing TiddlyTables a plugin for creating sortable tables.

[Cade Roux]

This is very exciting for me.  I'm using a lot of tables of test results 
generated from my data warehouse build/deploy/test process.  Currently they 
are regular TiddlyTables of the form |column|column|column| with checkboxes 
for when individual test case results have been validated against 
requirements but this looks like it could be a good avenue to get more 
functionality.

I look forward to checking it out soon.

Thanks,

Cade

On Monday, September 9, 2019 at 2:01:41 PM UTC-5, Alan Aldrich wrote:
>
> Greetings All, I am a long time fan of TiddlyWiki but new to the 
> community. First and foremost, I would like to thank Jeremy for creating 
> TiddlyWiki and everyone who supports it. As a way to learn the ins and outs 
> of TiddlyWiki I started a "table builder" plugin that I have been gradually 
> improving in my spare time. I finally got around to finishing it up 
> recently and would like to share it with the community. 
>
> The ability for the entire wiki to import/export to/from a spreadsheet is 
> a fascinating feature of TiddlyWiki, and I wanted to build on that strength 
> by creating a simple way to query data in the wiki and display it in a 
> tabular way. I am calling it TiddlyTables. The following link contains 
> installation instructions and examples:
>
> http://tiddlytables.tiddlyspot.com/
>
> There is also a "task manager" plugin that can be downloaded. Its primary 
> purpose is to demonstrate the features of TiddlyTables. I look forward to 
> hearing from you. I will do my best to answer questions and I appreciate 
> any feedback. 
>
> Thanks,
> Alan Aldrich
>

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[tw5] Focus on edit after a tm-edit-tiddler message

[Cade Roux]

I have a set of macros that let me transclude a tiddler and offer a link 
next to the transcluded tiddler to edit it if it exists or a link button to 
create it if it's missing.

This is one of the relevant sub-macros for the Edit button:

\define edit-btn(title)
(<$button class="tc-btn-invisible tc-tiddlylink">
<$action-sendmessage $message="tm-edit-tiddler" $param="$title$"/>
Edit
)
\end

After the tm-edit-tiddler message, I want to set the focus on that draft 
tiddler that comes up so that the cursor is in the text field and not in 
the title field.

Any tips?

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Keep losing my edit and add tiddler buttons - where to look?

[Cade Roux]

OK, I have replicated the issue.  It has nothing to do with the JSON 
imports or the occasional errors in the JSON.  It is due to the 
tiddlywiki/tiddlyweb plugin in my tiddlywiki.info file.

This script replicates the issue (empty.html is the clean TW dowloaded) as 
simply as I can without any JSON imports - just an init, load and build:

$tests = ( "good", "bad" )

foreach ($test in $tests) {
Remove-Item -Path ".\twtest" -Force -Recurse -ErrorAction "Ignore" # purge 
wikifolder completely
& tiddlywiki twtest --verbose --init
Copy-Item ".\tiddlywiki.$($test).info" -Destination 
.\twtest\tiddlywiki.info -Force # Needed to enabled the filesystem plugin, 
otherwise the load can't save the tiddlers anywhere
# Bring in base template to the nodejs TW
& tiddlywiki twtest --verbose --load empty.html
# Build the single file TW
& tiddlywiki twtest --verbose --build
# Copy the output for comparison
Copy-Item ".\twtest\output\index.html" -Destination ".\$test.html" -Force
}


The only difference between the good and bad .info files is the tiddlyweb 
plugin (which it looks like I don't need for this).

I can't say if this is a bug or what.  When I was initially trying to get 
node to import the JSON, it was saying it was importing but there was 
nothing in the folder, and the exports were empty too.  That's when I added 
the plugins.

Hopefully that helps determine if anything needs to change or what.

Thanks,

Cade

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 9:48:18 AM UTC-5, @TiddlyTweeter wrote:
>
> Its then a serious issue of real substance. I can't replicate it on TW 
> stand alone so can't help.
>
> TT
>
> On Wednesday, 28 August 2019 16:45:18 UTC+2, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> It's generated JSON.
>>
>> When you get a JSON error on the command-line, it just gives a JSON error 
>> at a character in the JSON file, but it's not clear how to see what this 
>> affects in TW.  It does make a .tid file with the error in the name in the 
>> tiddlers folder.  I fix the problem, delete that tiddler and re-run the 
>> import without any error.
>>
>> I'm going to try to experiment with increasing subsets of the import.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>> On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 6:19:28 AM UTC-5, @TiddlyTweeter wrote:
>>>
>>> Cade Roux wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I have imported a lot of JSON tiddlers, sometimes with errors, and I 
>>>> think these must bash something.  Typically, it's something in the JSON 
>>>> that's not escaped properly.
>>>
>>>
>>> Doesn't this answer your own question?
>>>
>>> I never seen a TiddlyWiki JSON EXPORT ever fail on IMPORT.
>>>
>>> *So are you talking about TiddlyWiki created JSON? *OR something else?
>>>
>>> TT
>>>
>>

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tiddlywiki.bad.info
Description: Binary data


tiddlywiki.good.info
Description: Binary data

[tw5] Re: Keep losing my edit and add tiddler buttons - where to look?

[Cade Roux]

It's generated JSON.

When you get a JSON error on the command-line, it just gives a JSON error 
at a character in the JSON file, but it's not clear how to see what this 
affects in TW.  It does make a .tid file with the error in the name in the 
tiddlers folder.  I fix the problem, delete that tiddler and re-run the 
import without any error.

I'm going to try to experiment with increasing subsets of the import.

Thanks,

Cade

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 6:19:28 AM UTC-5, @TiddlyTweeter wrote:
>
> Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> I have imported a lot of JSON tiddlers, sometimes with errors, and I 
>> think these must bash something.  Typically, it's something in the JSON 
>> that's not escaped properly.
>
>
> Doesn't this answer your own question?
>
> I never seen a TiddlyWiki JSON EXPORT ever fail on IMPORT.
>
> *So are you talking about TiddlyWiki created JSON? *OR something else?
>
> TT
>

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[tw5] Re: Keep losing my edit and add tiddler buttons - where to look?

[Cade Roux]

It's not supposed to contain any system tiddlers.  It is generated from my 
build process/database schema/testing results.  But some are containing 
macros now, and of course, I occasionally find problems where things aren't 
escaped out or a stray line feed makes it through escaping.

It's just an array of tiddlers of the form:

{
"title" : "dbo Schema"
,"text" : "Module: \nDescription: \nTables:\n\n* 
[[dbo.Numbers Table]]\n"
,"tags" : "schema text-source.auto"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
},{
"title" : "Doc Schema"
,"text" : "Module: \nDescription: \nTables:\n\n"
,"tags" : "schema text-source.auto"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
},{
"title" : "ETL Schema"
,"text" : "Module: \nDescription: \nTables:\n\n"
,"tags" : "schema text-source.auto"
,"type" : "text/vnd.tiddlywiki"
}

Cade

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 5:56:19 AM UTC-5, TonyM wrote:
>
> Case
>
> Is it easy to determin the difference between your database tiddlers and 
> the others in your import? I would imagine such problems could come about 
> if you overwrite a system tiddler or display or use styles or css. Are 
> there tiddlers that once closed or you remove a system tag the problem goes 
> away?
>
> When you create a json are you only exporting what you need or are you 
> including others?
>
> just some possible approaches. 
>
> Tony
>
>

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[tw5] Keep losing my edit and add tiddler buttons - where to look?

[Cade Roux]

I have imported a lot of JSON tiddlers, sometimes with errors, and I think 
these must bash something.  Typically, it's something in the JSON that's 
not escaped properly - like \import instead of \\import (unexpected element 
i or something like that) or an embedded double quote in the JSON that's 
not escaped \".  Currently the JSON is clean and not giving any warnings or 
anything on the import.  (I'm running --verbose).

At the end of my build process, I use nodejs to init an empty TW, I load my 
template TW file (single html), I import the JSON of all the tiddlers about 
my database and build process and tests (which may overwrite many tiddlers 
that have updated data) and then build a single file (which then become my 
future template).  As I add manual tiddlers to this, the manual tiddlers of 
it expand in scope while the regenerated parts just keep getting 
overwritten and expanding themselves.  The process seems to work pretty 
well over the last couple weeks.

But at some point the edit and add buttons are lost.

I can add or edit a tiddler in many ways, like using the dropdown on an 
existing tiddler and new here or edit.

But I have lost the pencil on tiddlers and the + by the controls toolbar.

Occasionally it comes back - presumably when whatever is breaking those 
tiddlers isn't interfering.

I'm probably going to go ahead and start with a blank TW again so my 
template is a little cleaner, but I expect this issue will return.

Any ideas as to what causes this?

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Conditional macro: transclusion or tiddler creation button/link

[Cade Roux]

Yep, I think that's basically what I discovered about the filter but it was 
masked and only uncovered when I started to add the edit link for what was 
supposed to be existing tiddlers

Thanks again,

Cade

On Tuesday, August 27, 2019 at 4:41:35 PM UTC-5, Eric Shulman wrote:
>
>
> On Tuesday, August 27, 2019 at 2:21:19 PM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> I think I follow what you are doing, but now it's not putting out the 
>> button link at all.  Is there any kind of debug mode so you can see all the 
>> processing steps before rendering?
>>
>>>
>>>
> oops I forgot to pass the $title$ value on to the button macro
> also, because of the way filters are parsed, your filter "[$title$]" will 
> never be "empty"...
>
> try this:
>
> <$list filter="[[$title$]is[tiddler]]" emptyMessage=< """$title$""">>>{{$title$}}
>
>
> -e
>
>
>

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[tw5] Re: Conditional macro: transclusion or tiddler creation button/link

[Cade Roux]

After fooling with it and altering the filter and adding some features, I 
got it - thanks for the point in the right direction!

\define btn(title)
<$button class="tc-btn-invisible tc-tiddlylink">
<$action-createtiddler $basetitle="$title$" />
<$action-navigate $to="$title$" $scroll="yes"/>
Missing: $title$

\end

[image: Capture.PNG]


\define conditionaltiddler(title)
<$list filter="[title[$title$]] +[has[title]]" emptyMessage=<>>{{$title$}} ([[Edit|$title$]])
\end

On Tuesday, August 27, 2019 at 4:21:19 PM UTC-5, Cade Roux wrote:
>
> I think I follow what you are doing, but now it's not putting out the 
> button link at all.  Is there any kind of debug mode so you can see all the 
> processing steps before rendering?
>
>
> [image: Capture.PNG]
>
>
> On Tuesday, August 27, 2019 at 4:08:32 PM UTC-5, Eric Shulman wrote:
>>
>> On Tuesday, August 27, 2019 at 1:30:17 PM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>
>>> Where I want tiddlers to be transcluded if they exist and a button to 
>>> create the tiddler if they don't exist in my table.
>>>
>>
>> try this:
>>
>> \define btn(title)
>> <$button class="tc-btn-invisible tc-tiddlylink">
>> <$action-createtiddler $basetitle="$title$" />
>> Create Tiddler: $title$
>> 
>> \end
>>
>> \define conditionaltiddler(title)
>> <$list filter="[$title$]" emptyMessage=<>>{{$title$}}
>> \end
>>
>> enjoy,
>> -e
>> Eric Shulman
>> TiddlyTools: "Small Tools for Big Ideas!" (tm) 
>> http://tiddlytools.github.io (TWClassic)
>> InsideTiddlyWiki: The Missing Manuals
>>
>>

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[tw5] Re: Conditional macro: transclusion or tiddler creation button/link

[Cade Roux]

I think I follow what you are doing, but now it's not putting out the 
button link at all.  Is there any kind of debug mode so you can see all the 
processing steps before rendering?


[image: Capture.PNG]


On Tuesday, August 27, 2019 at 4:08:32 PM UTC-5, Eric Shulman wrote:
>
> On Tuesday, August 27, 2019 at 1:30:17 PM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> Where I want tiddlers to be transcluded if they exist and a button to 
>> create the tiddler if they don't exist in my table.
>>
>
> try this:
>
> \define btn(title)
> <$button class="tc-btn-invisible tc-tiddlylink">
> <$action-createtiddler $basetitle="$title$" />
> Create Tiddler: $title$
> 
> \end
>
> \define conditionaltiddler(title)
> <$list filter="[$title$]" emptyMessage=<>>{{$title$}}
> \end
>
> enjoy,
> -e
> Eric Shulman
> TiddlyTools: "Small Tools for Big Ideas!" (tm) 
> http://tiddlytools.github.io (TWClassic)
> InsideTiddlyWiki: The Missing Manuals
>
>

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[tw5] Conditional macro: transclusion or tiddler creation button/link

[Cade Roux]

Where I want tiddlers to be transcluded if they exist and a button to 
create the tiddler if they don't exist in my table.

\define conditionaltiddler(title : "Tiddler Title")
<$set name="btn">
<$button class="tc-btn-invisible tc-tiddlylink">
<$action-createtiddler $basetitle="$title$" />
Create Tiddler: $title$


<$list filter="[$title$]" emptyMessage="$btn$">{{$title$}}
\end

|Value|Description|h
|Absent|<>|
|Mild|<>|
|Mild to moderate|<>|

|Value|Description|h
|Absent|{{Observation-Regurgitation-Absent}}|
|Mild|<$button class="tc-btn-invisible 
tc-tiddlylink"><$action-createtiddler 
$basetitle="Observation-Regurgitation-Mild" />Create Tiddler: 
Observation-Regurgitation-Mild|
|Mild to moderate|{{Observation-Regurgitation-Mild to moderate}}|

The bottom table is what I want it to look like, the top is my attempt so 
far.  The transclusion part is working fine.  I made a variable to hold the 
button and put that in the empty message, but it's showing up all the 
time.  I feel like I have a little while to go before I grok the 
macro/filter/widget system.

[image: Capture.PNG]


Thanks in advance,


Cade

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Re: [tw5] Re: GitHub saving tips?

[Cade Roux]

I'm not sure - nothing is being committed to GitHub outside of TW in my 
testing, and I get the fresh file before starting, so I think there might 
very well be a timing issue.  It's hard to see what's going on, I guess I 
should probably pull up the browser dev tools and look at traffic.

Thanks,

Cade

On Tuesday, August 27, 2019 at 10:42:23 AM UTC-5, Jeremy Ruston wrote:
>
> Hi Everyone
>
> Apologies, I'm late to this thread. What's the current status? Do we have 
> bugs, or do we need to improve the docs?
>
> The error HTTP 409 typically means that the file has changed on Git 
> inbetween the start of the save operation and its conclusion; this can 
> happen very easily if save operations overlap.
>
> We may need to patch things to detect that a save is in progress.
>
> Best wishes
>
> Jeremy
>
> --
> Jeremy Ruston
> jer...@jermolene.com 
> https://jermolene.com
>
> On 26 Aug 2019, at 20:37, 'Mark S.' via TiddlyWiki <
> tiddl...@googlegroups.com > wrote:
>
> 
> This is definitely one for Jeremy.
>
> How about if you delete your file from the master on github, reload your 
> local copy, and reset github settings to use master? Then can you at least 
> use master?
>
> I found that by going through a similar sequence I could get ONE save on 
> the development branch. It seems like github doesn't like the development 
> branch
> getting out of synch with the master branch. But exactly how that works is 
> a mystery ...
>
> Good luck!
>
> On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 12:05:17 PM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> So I merged everything into master, switched over to master, pulled 
>> everything, opened the file from the filesystem in browser, switched it 
>> over to master, put in user name, edited a tiddler and clicked save:
>>
>>
>> [image: Capture.PNG]
>>
>>
>>
>> [image: Capture.PNG]
>>
>>
>> But - it does say in GitHub "Saved by TiddlyWiki"
>>
>>
>> [image: Capture.PNG]
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>> On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 12:40:19 PM UTC-5, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>
>>> I have a TW file in GitHub.  I set up all the parameters for GitHub 
>>> saving, they seem to be correct.  I got some errors in XMLHttpRequest 409, 
>>> which perhaps indicates that a commit was not allowed due to a conflict?  
>>> Sometimes it gives that error or sometimes it just sits there with the red 
>>> check in a circle.  Either way, nothing is committing to GitHub.
>>>
>>> Any tips on what to look at?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Cade
>>>
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> .
>
>

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[tw5] Re: GitHub saving tips?

[Cade Roux]

So I merged everything into master, switched over to master, pulled 
everything, opened the file from the filesystem in browser, switched it 
over to master, put in user name, edited a tiddler and clicked save:


[image: Capture.PNG]



[image: Capture.PNG]


But - it does say in GitHub "Saved by TiddlyWiki"


[image: Capture.PNG]



Thanks,

Cade

On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 12:40:19 PM UTC-5, Cade Roux wrote:
>
> I have a TW file in GitHub.  I set up all the parameters for GitHub 
> saving, they seem to be correct.  I got some errors in XMLHttpRequest 409, 
> which perhaps indicates that a commit was not allowed due to a conflict?  
> Sometimes it gives that error or sometimes it just sits there with the red 
> check in a circle.  Either way, nothing is committing to GitHub.
>
> Any tips on what to look at?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Cade
>

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[tw5] Re: GitHub saving tips?

[Cade Roux]

Let me try that.  I did originally have develop instead of development 
because another repo used that convention and I got a 404.

Thanks,

Cade

On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 1:50:10 PM UTC-5, Mark S. wrote:
>
> Does it save if you switch to master?
>
> On mine, I got everything to work, including working on development 
> branch. Then I downloaded and reloaded the file, and after that
> I couldn't get it work on "development". I had the same 409 message. Then 
> I switched back to "master" and it worked OK again.
>
> Suggests there's a bug somewhere, that retains "master" as a default.
>
> Good luck!
>
> On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 10:59:01 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> Sure.
>>
>> I have a token in the password
>>
>>
>> This is what GitHub looks like in the Web interface:
>>
>> [image: Capture.PNG]
>>
>>
>> On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 12:52:14 PM UTC-5, Mark S. wrote:
>>>
>>> It might help if you could show a screen shot of your set up.
>>>
>>> I found that you MUST specify
>>>
>>> Path to target file (e.g. /wiki/)
>>>>
>>>
>>> That is, that field can not be blank. I was using the top level, so put 
>>> in /
>>>
>>> Good luck!
>>>
>>> On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 10:40:19 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I have a TW file in GitHub.  I set up all the parameters for GitHub 
>>>> saving, they seem to be correct.  I got some errors in XMLHttpRequest 409, 
>>>> which perhaps indicates that a commit was not allowed due to a conflict?  
>>>> Sometimes it gives that error or sometimes it just sits there with the red 
>>>> check in a circle.  Either way, nothing is committing to GitHub.
>>>>
>>>> Any tips on what to look at?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Cade
>>>>
>>>

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[tw5] Re: GitHub saving tips?

[Cade Roux]

Sure.

I have a token in the password


This is what GitHub looks like in the Web interface:

[image: Capture.PNG]


On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 12:52:14 PM UTC-5, Mark S. wrote:
>
> It might help if you could show a screen shot of your set up.
>
> I found that you MUST specify
>
> Path to target file (e.g. /wiki/)
>>
>
> That is, that field can not be blank. I was using the top level, so put in 
> /
>
> Good luck!
>
> On Monday, August 26, 2019 at 10:40:19 AM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> I have a TW file in GitHub.  I set up all the parameters for GitHub 
>> saving, they seem to be correct.  I got some errors in XMLHttpRequest 409, 
>> which perhaps indicates that a commit was not allowed due to a conflict?  
>> Sometimes it gives that error or sometimes it just sits there with the red 
>> check in a circle.  Either way, nothing is committing to GitHub.
>>
>> Any tips on what to look at?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>

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[tw5] GitHub saving tips?

[Cade Roux]

I have a TW file in GitHub.  I set up all the parameters for GitHub saving, 
they seem to be correct.  I got some errors in XMLHttpRequest 409, which 
perhaps indicates that a commit was not allowed due to a conflict?  
Sometimes it gives that error or sometimes it just sits there with the red 
check in a circle.  Either way, nothing is committing to GitHub.

Any tips on what to look at?

Thanks,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: Doubled Single Quotes Behavior in text/vnd.tiddlywiki format - do these need to be escaped or is it a bug?

[Cade Roux]

I have decided to go ahead and use the backticks around it and (also to be 
careful when that text is empty to not put two consecutive backticks).

I'm changing up the markup to generally use TW for now and potentially move 
to XML in front of that with an XSLT to transform to TW or other targets 
depending on how the prototype is received.

Thanks,

Cade

On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 4:24:17 PM UTC-5, PMario wrote:
>
> Hi, 
>
> If you want to disable some wikitext rules you can put the 
>
> \rules except bold 
>
> pragma  at the very beginning of the 
> tiddler. So double single quotes will no longer start a "bold" text 
> section. 
>
> hope that helps
> -mario
>

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[tw5] Re: Doubled Single Quotes Behavior in text/vnd.tiddlywiki format - do these need to be escaped or is it a bug?

[Cade Roux]

It's a code sample and it's an empty string.

As an example, the actual code in that cell is:

EXEC Doc.UpdateXP @obj = '[Config].[ConfigName]', @name = 'MS_Description', 
@value = '';

It's an output of my build process that highlights database artifacts 
without metadata and that is the code to add the missing metadata.

I guess I should look at the code backticks.  If I put the code backticks 
around it, can there be back to back ' embedded in the code?

Thanks,

Cade

On Tuesday, August 13, 2019 at 6:57:38 PM UTC-5, Mark S. wrote:
>
> Double single quotes begin *bold*. 
>
> https://tiddlywiki.com/prerelease/#Formatting%20in%20WikiText
>
> You could switch the tiddler to HTML mode, if you're not going to use any 
> TW features.
>
> Perhaps you could explain why you need double single quotes?
>
> On Tuesday, August 13, 2019 at 4:47:08 PM UTC-7, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> I have this in a Tiddler and I was wondering if this is a bug or 
>> intentional?
>>
>> 
>> Empty Single Quotes: ''
>> Single Quotes With a Space: ' '
>> 
>>
>> I fixed it with:
>>
>> 
>> Empty Single Quotes: 
>> Single Quotes With a Space:  
>> 
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>>
>> Cade
>>
>

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[tw5] Doubled Single Quotes Behavior in text/vnd.tiddlywiki format - do these need to be escaped or is it a bug?

[Cade Roux]

I have this in a Tiddler and I was wondering if this is a bug or 
intentional?


Empty Single Quotes: ''
Single Quotes With a Space: ' '


I fixed it with:


Empty Single Quotes: 
Single Quotes With a Space:  


Thanks in advance,

Cade

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[tw5] Re: TiddlyWiki node command line issue importing and/or rendering for offline

[Cade Roux]

For the benefit of anyone coming behind me, I think the issue was that the 
--init initialization of the TiddlyWiki did not have the plugins in the 
tiddlywiki.info file:

"tiddlywiki/tiddlyweb", "tiddlywiki/filesystem"

This seems to help several things in generation now.

Thanks,

Cade

On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 3:19:53 PM UTC-5, Cade Roux wrote:
>
> I am importing a JSON array of 10 Tiddlers with title and text properties 
> only.
>
> After running the command below, I have a tiddlywiki.info file in the 
> folder, an output folder with an empty index.html file and no sign of the 
> tiddlers.
>
> This is what the JSON file looks like:
>
> [
> {
> "title" : "SCHEMA Config"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "SCHEMA DataMart"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "SCHEMA db_securityadmin"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "SCHEMA dbo"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "SCHEMA Doc"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "SCHEMA ETL"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "SCHEMA Logging"
> ,"text" : "Module: LOG\nDescription: Logging schema"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "AscendDataMart SCHEMA Modeling"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "AscendDataMart SCHEMA Notify"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ,{
> "title" : "AscendDataMart SCHEMA TEST"
> ,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
> }
> ]
>
>
> >tiddlywiki ./DataDictionary --verbose --init empty
> Boot log:
>   Startup task: load-modules
>   Startup task: info after: load-modules before: startup
>   Startup task: startup after: load-modules
>   Startup task: story after: startup
>   Startup task: commands platforms: node after: story
> Executing command: init empty
> Copied edition 'empty' to ./DataDictionary
>
> >tiddlywiki ./DataDictionary --verbose --import tiddlers.json 
> application/json
> Boot log:
>   Startup task: load-modules
>   Startup task: info after: load-modules before: startup
>   Startup task: startup after: load-modules
>   Startup task: story after: startup
>   Startup task: commands platforms: node after: story
> Executing command: import tiddlers.json application/json
> 10 tiddler(s) imported
>
> >tiddlywiki ./DataDictionary --verbose --rendertiddler 
> $:/plugins/tiddlywiki/tiddlyweb/save/offline index.html text/plain
> Boot log:
>   Startup task: load-modules
>   Startup task: info after: load-modules before: startup
>   Startup task: startup after: load-modules
>   Startup task: story after: startup
>   Startup task: commands platforms: node after: story
> Executing command: rendertiddler 
> $:/plugins/tiddlywiki/tiddlyweb/save/offline index.html text/plain
>
>

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[tw5] Re: Generating a complete TiddlyWiki from Excel

[Cade Roux]

As far as the concept of push, you can do that.  I am currently using the 
nodejs command line to import tiddlers into TiddyWiki and then generate the 
single file:

tiddlywiki MyWiki --verbose --import tiddlers.json application/json --build 
index

My database is generating the json containing all the tiddlers

Cade

On Monday, August 12, 2019 at 7:53:49 AM UTC-5, Paul Richardson wrote:
>
> Good afternoon, complete beginner here.
>
> I maintain a reference document for my organisation which has some 
> pre-amble and then is essentially a large table. The user looks through the 
> table for their particular area of interest and then is given a particular 
> category/label for their information. The document is also shared with 
> partner organisations and suppliers and needs to be presented in a portable 
> format - and it cannot be shared on the internet or in a collaborative 
> manner. The document has three levels e.g. section 1, section 1.1, section 
> 1.1.1 (although in some places 1.1.1.1).
>
> [image: Untitled.png]
>
> As the document is quite wordy (with footnotes) it is currently maintained 
> in Word, but I would like to move away from this, and have been playing 
> with TiddlyWiki. As I still need to provide the Word version, what I would 
> quite like to do is have a master database (probably in Excel) which then 
> auto-populates the Word document *and* the TiddlyWiki version. 
>
> I am familiar with the principles of markup laguage and I have managed to 
> get as far as getting Excel to generate the code for the table rows, and 
> have successfully pasted these into a tiddler manually. 
>
> |4.1|Wordy description of situation A| class4 
> | class4 | class2 
> |
> |4.11|Wordy description of situation B| class3 div> | class3 | class1 |
>
>
> [image: Capture.JPG]
>
> However I then wanted to get Excel to generate the code for the whole 
> tiddler itself, (the ), but when I paste 
> the complete tiddler ( header and the content and the  closing) 
> into the HTML directly (just after the tiddlers I created in tiddlywiki), 
> this doesn't seem to work. It looks identical in format to other tiddlers I 
> have added in the usual manner, so there must be other parts of the HTML I 
> need to edit.. (I can see my tiddlers both in the "static" area and in one 
> other place and have added equivalent entries in both).
>
>  title="Description">
> |4.1|Wordy description of situation A| class4
>  | class4 | 
> class2 |
> |4.11|Wordy description of situation B| class3
>  | class3 | 
> class1 |
> 
>
> I know the HTML isn't intended to be directly edited but what can I say!
>
> So my immediate question is, which parts of the HTML file do I need to 
> insert code into in order to add a working tiddler? 
> My other question is - is my objective even possible or will there be too 
> many other unseen hurdles and complications along the way? 
>
> (I suppose the alternative approach is to maintain the master version in 
> TiddlyWiki and then find a way of exporting the whole document to Word, but 
> it needs to be clean and professional).
>
> Thank you!
>
>

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[tw5] TiddlyWiki node command line issue importing and/or rendering for offline

[Cade Roux]

I am importing a JSON array of 10 Tiddlers with title and text properties 
only.

After running the command below, I have a tiddlywiki.info file in the 
folder, an output folder with an empty index.html file and no sign of the 
tiddlers.

This is what the JSON file looks like:

[
{
"title" : "SCHEMA Config"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
,{
"title" : "SCHEMA DataMart"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
,{
"title" : "SCHEMA db_securityadmin"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
,{
"title" : "SCHEMA dbo"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
,{
"title" : "SCHEMA Doc"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
,{
"title" : "SCHEMA ETL"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
,{
"title" : "SCHEMA Logging"
,"text" : "Module: LOG\nDescription: Logging schema"
}
,{
"title" : "AscendDataMart SCHEMA Modeling"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
,{
"title" : "AscendDataMart SCHEMA Notify"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
,{
"title" : "AscendDataMart SCHEMA TEST"
,"text" : "Module:\nDescription:"
}
]


>tiddlywiki ./DataDictionary --verbose --init empty
Boot log:
  Startup task: load-modules
  Startup task: info after: load-modules before: startup
  Startup task: startup after: load-modules
  Startup task: story after: startup
  Startup task: commands platforms: node after: story
Executing command: init empty
Copied edition 'empty' to ./DataDictionary

>tiddlywiki ./DataDictionary --verbose --import tiddlers.json 
application/json
Boot log:
  Startup task: load-modules
  Startup task: info after: load-modules before: startup
  Startup task: startup after: load-modules
  Startup task: story after: startup
  Startup task: commands platforms: node after: story
Executing command: import tiddlers.json application/json
10 tiddler(s) imported

>tiddlywiki ./DataDictionary --verbose --rendertiddler 
$:/plugins/tiddlywiki/tiddlyweb/save/offline index.html text/plain
Boot log:
  Startup task: load-modules
  Startup task: info after: load-modules before: startup
  Startup task: startup after: load-modules
  Startup task: story after: startup
  Startup task: commands platforms: node after: story
Executing command: rendertiddler 
$:/plugins/tiddlywiki/tiddlyweb/save/offline index.html text/plain

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[tw5] Re: TiddlyWiki as a target for generated help documentation

[Cade Roux]

I have started to look at the command-line available in node, and it seems 
like once I have all my pages in a single appropriate json file, then what 
I could do for my prototype is simply all a single line somewhere near the 
end of my build script:

tiddlywiki ./DataDictionary --init empty --import allmydata.json 
--rendertiddler $:/plugins/tiddlywiki/tiddlyweb/save/offline index.html 
text/plain

Then I have it all in a single file I can send someone to play with.  And 
that looks like a good start.

Thanks,

Cade

On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 12:22:13 AM UTC-5, TonyM wrote:
>
> Cade,
>
> Others have used tiddlywiki to consolidate documentation in the past. 
> Using csv or JSON has the most tools and features available in 3rd party 
> plugins. Import and export, so these may be good standards around to build 
> data interchange.
>
> I can't grasp the whole of your requirements but much of it touches on 
> things I have done or researched. Do consider opening threads here in the 
> forum with a specific or subset of things you are trying to do do so people 
> do not need to understand your whole project to help.  It is easier for 
> people to volunteer for issues rather than projects, although it is great 
> you have outlined the bigger picture here.
>
> How you are going to access and host your wiki can have an influence here. 
> The node version also publishes every tiddler as a separate "static" html 
> page, and you can export any tiddler as static html even from a single file 
> wiki. Crafting of additional templates like those to export static html 
> pages could be used to export html pages to build a standard html site, 
> however as Mat suggested it would be in your interest to keep as much as 
> practical in one tiddlywiki because of the control and global handling you 
> can do.
>
> Perhaps in the recent 5.1.20 release post you can see my comments on the 
> Innerwiki Plugin, not that I am sure this will help with your project. With 
> tiddlywiki the sky was the limit now I think it is the stars.
>
> Regards
> Tony
>  
>
> On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 7:54:24 AM UTC+10, Cade Roux wrote:
>>
>> Yeah, I have a large amount of metadata that is changing, and the source 
>> of that data is either going to be:
>>
>> 1. Originating in the metadata of the SQL tables (attached to the tables 
>> and columns) - kind of basic data dictionary things which will look like:
>>
>> > />
>>
>> Where we would want to generate a page for every one of these 
>> automatically from the source code (mostly manually edited) during the 
>> build.  There might be also editable narratives to go with them.
>>
>> 2. It is going to be in rules that original in Excel (manually edited), 
>> go through XML and then become data in mapping tables.
>>
>> These are kind of similar, but have much more data about the source data 
>> that matches the rule and the output data, plus the edited narratives are 
>> more likely to include screenshots and longer explanations.
>> > />
>>
>>
>> 3. Other things:  Perhaps pages of build results like any warnings, 
>> exceptions or errors in the rulesets in the current build process that we 
>> detected from #2.  Technically we already get these as logs or tables, but 
>> makes sense to include them in the set of pages if we have an HTML 
>> framework to put them in now.
>>
>> It's unlikely I want to put TiddlyWiki on the front end of this process 
>> because I do need to check in structural changes like new tables, columns, 
>> views and procedures with their metadata all together.  Plus I don't think 
>> generating all my SQL from TiddlyWiki pages makes a lot of sense.  Plus, I 
>> would need to transition writing the rules from a spreadsheet to TiddlyWiki 
>> Tables - and we do occasionally use Excel macros to make these more 
>> functional for data input and validation.
>>
>> There are two obvious approaches:  One is to generate the page framework 
>> from all the data we have and incorporate manually edited data somehow - 
>> like another manually edited source.  The other is to have manual set of 
>> pages which can embed automatically generated content as some kind of 
>> widgets or plugins of the form > Category='CategoryName' DataElement='DataElementName' /> or whatever
>>
>> There currently isn't any web-based application built that is hitting 
>> this data warehouse.  If I had that I could make some kind of service to 
>> serve up the metadata and plug it into manual pages as a widget or plugin.  
>> I could also just build an app that lets you navigate the metadata and 
>>

[tw5] Re: TiddlyWiki as a target for generated help documentation

[Cade Roux]

Yeah, I have a large amount of metadata that is changing, and the source of 
that data is either going to be:

1. Originating in the metadata of the SQL tables (attached to the tables 
and columns) - kind of basic data dictionary things which will look like:



Where we would want to generate a page for every one of these automatically 
from the source code (mostly manually edited) during the build.  There 
might be also editable narratives to go with them.

2. It is going to be in rules that original in Excel (manually edited), go 
through XML and then become data in mapping tables.

These are kind of similar, but have much more data about the source data 
that matches the rule and the output data, plus the edited narratives are 
more likely to include screenshots and longer explanations.



3. Other things:  Perhaps pages of build results like any warnings, 
exceptions or errors in the rulesets in the current build process that we 
detected from #2.  Technically we already get these as logs or tables, but 
makes sense to include them in the set of pages if we have an HTML 
framework to put them in now.

It's unlikely I want to put TiddlyWiki on the front end of this process 
because I do need to check in structural changes like new tables, columns, 
views and procedures with their metadata all together.  Plus I don't think 
generating all my SQL from TiddlyWiki pages makes a lot of sense.  Plus, I 
would need to transition writing the rules from a spreadsheet to TiddlyWiki 
Tables - and we do occasionally use Excel macros to make these more 
functional for data input and validation.

There are two obvious approaches:  One is to generate the page framework 
from all the data we have and incorporate manually edited data somehow - 
like another manually edited source.  The other is to have manual set of 
pages which can embed automatically generated content as some kind of 
widgets or plugins of the form  or whatever

There currently isn't any web-based application built that is hitting this 
data warehouse.  If I had that I could make some kind of service to serve 
up the metadata and plug it into manual pages as a widget or plugin.  I 
could also just build an app that lets you navigate the metadata and allows 
annotation and stores it somewhere and displays it all to the user.  But I 
didn't really want to build an app yet until we've explored the gaps in the 
data and the features people will need.

I could just going to generate a bunch of HTML pages with links.  But I 
would have to style them, have some framework, navigation, etc.  Again, not 
ready to build all that just yet - just looking to output something people 
can interact with and tell me what's missing so we can get it added 
somewhere in the process.

Basically, anything where I can load a big file like wiki markup herewiki markup 
herewiki markup here would be 
great.

In fact, that's basically what I am starting to generate for whatever 
presentation layer we end up using.

So I was looking to potentially push out a pre-built TiddlyWiki at the end 
of this process right now so people can browse it and see where the gaps 
are and what they would like to see.  I think ideally it would probably 
morph into something where they could edit any of the discussions or 
narratives and have that change recorded and save and potentially fed back 
through some change management process.  Who knows, maybe TiddlyWiki is the 
perfect platform for the whole thing with some kind of plugin.

Thanks,

Cade

On Friday, August 9, 2019 at 3:51:35 PM UTC-5, Mat wrote:
>
> Hi Cade and welcome!
>
> Reading your text I was thinking "OK, that is super simple" ...until you 
> said
>
> So is there a way to generate a set of pages or the content for the pages 
>> and have them "loaded" into TiddlyWiki?
>>
>
> Oh. That is a different matter. Someone just very recently posted 
> something about this (within the last month) but the crucial thing is if 
> you want your content to be actively integrated in TW or not. Now you state 
> you have not quite defined what you want so may I suggest that you just do 
> it all in TiddlyWiki? You can very easily export tiddlers as e.g ready made 
> html pages or as e.g json files. Or just leave it in the TW because it is a 
> single file which you can manage as a unit. 
>
> Would that work?
>
> I suggest you play around a bit with TW to see how it works so you can 
> express your needs more in "TW terms".
>
> <:-)
>

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[tw5] TiddlyWiki as a target for generated help documentation

[Cade Roux]

I'm working on some data dictionary documentation and am trying to generate 
a basic prototype of an HTML-based help system.  At this point I haven't 
really chosen a platform or anything, but I'd like to just demo something 
simple as a possible starting point for the design discussion and I was 
wondering if I could use TiddlyWiki to give me a starting point instead of 
generating all the HTML framework around the pages completely from 
scratch.  What I'd like to do is generate a series of pages like this:

IndexPage:

   - Index
  - CategoryOne - link to page for everything in category one with a 
  header about category one
 - CategoryOne.ItemOne - link to page for just this data element
 - CategoryOne.ItemTwo - link to page for just this data element
  - CategoryTwo - link to page for everything in category two with a 
  header about category two
 - CategoryTwo.ItemOne - link to page for just this data element
  

CategoryOnePage:
*Category One*
*Blah blah blah*

   - CategoryOne.ItemOne - link to page for just this data element
   - CategoryOne.ItemTwo - link to page for just this data element

CategoryOne.ItemOnePage:
*CategoryOne.Item One*
Possible values are: etc - will generate a table here from my metadata
Source data is: etc
Update frequency is: etc
Narrative: An informatics person will have provided text and images to go 
here

So is there a way to generate a set of pages or the content for the pages 
and have them "loaded" into TiddlyWiki?

Then I could add a step to my build process to generate the TiddlyWiki 
content from my metadata and I could demo the generated wiki and then show 
how it evolves as the metadata gets updated/fixed corrected and the new 
TiddlyWiki is generated.

Again, it's just a simple prototype to see if this concept would fly before 
we figure out the whole scope of what we want to achieve.

Thanks in advance.

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