Tell me, my friend, which "goat herder" wrote the Bible? It appears you have
more information than I about the authorship of the Bible. Tell me, please,
what is the name of the goat herder that wrote the entirety of the Bible?
Have you even read the Bible?
You know, It says in the Bible "Giovanni is an idiot". You say "No, it does
not". I say "How do you know, when you haven't read it?"
LOL ....
Jojo
PS. Actually, The Bible calls people like Giovanni much more worse labels than
an "idiot". Find out... read it for yourself and you'll see what I mean.
----- Original Message -----
From: Giovanni Santostasi
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, November 02, 2012 12:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:The Quantum Soul?
How can anybody in the 21st century still mention the bible for any guidance
on any topics goes beyond me.
Don't you realize it is the "wisdom" of some ignorant goat herder that lived
thousands of year ago?
Giovanni
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 11:51 PM, Axil Axil <janap...@gmail.com> wrote:
A chimera or chimaera is a single organism that is composed of two or more
different populations of genetically distinct cells that originated from
different zygotes involved in sexual reproduction.
Chimeras are formed from at least four parent cells (two fertilized eggs or
early embryos fused together). Each population of cells keeps its own character
and the resulting organism is a mixture of tissues. Chimeras are typically seen
in animals; there are some reports of human chimerism.
In the process of human chimerism, two separate souls existed at the time
of conception.
When the early embryos fused together sometime after conception, does two
souls become one? Or does one of the souls die? Does the chimera have two souls?
What Bible verse direct us in answering these soul allocation questions
associated with the formation of a chimera?
=====================================
Regarding the soul formation process associated with identical twin
formation.
When the soul is created at conception, one soul is formed. But at a later
time, the blastocyst undergoes fission into two separate individuals.
When is the soul of the second individual formed? This second soul could
not have been in place at the time of conception.
I contend that the Bible does not cover this secondary soul creation
process. Am I correct on this point?
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 9:49 PM, Jojo Jaro <jth...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Axil, I always like your responses because you always get me thinking
deeper. Anyways, I feel there are a few errors in your logic.
First, you need to realize that the body - cells, DNA, etc. that form the
human physical attributes exist in only 4 dimensions (length, width, height,
and time). The soul on the other hand, comes from God and imparted by God and
hence is "Spiritual" - metaphysical. A Soul is a "hyper-dimensional" entity.
It exists beyond the 4 dimensions of our physical existence. That is why it
survives our physical death. Your presupposition that a single fertilized egg,
being small and non-functionalized, therefore can not "contain" the soul is a
faulty premise. The soul is not bound by the size nor the non-functionality of
a single egg.
Second, you presuppose that the soul is "bound" to the cells and DNA.
IOW, you say that by destroying a fingernail, you are "killing" a living
entity. That is in fact is a faulty understanding. The soul is not bound to
any cell or DNA. It exist 'with' our physical cells, DNA and body; not exist
'because of' our physical cells, DNA and body. The cells does not contaiin
"part of a soul" that you kill when you trim your fingernail. The source of
your (mis)understanding is the ancient occultic religion of animism, which
presupposes that everything has a "soul", including inanimate objects like
rocks and fingernails.
Third. The creator of our being, clearly says that life starts in the
womb. That means, conception is the time He imparts the living soul. The
Bible teaches that God breathed into Adam and Adam became a Living soul.
Before God's breathe, Adam was just a collection of dirt. God imparted the
life. Before conception, the female egg is not alive, hence, when a woman
experiences a menstrual cycle, that is not murder. Immediately at conception,
God breathe into that union of egg and sperm a life. From that point on, that
cells contains a living soul. That life is alive until such time as God
decides to separate that living soul from that body, hence physical death
occurs.
Fourth, Putting human DNA to animal or vice versa has nothing to do with
life or the soul. Man can do this all day long but until God breathes into
that creation, it is not a lviing soul. As mentioned above, the soul is not
bound to a cell or single DNA that you carry along with it when you transfer
DNA to another animal. The soul is software. A computer is dead without
software. You do not transfer software when you transfer a single resistor of
a PC into another circuit.
Last, my understanding is not of my own origin. I have no intellect to
extend "my" theology, since it is not "my" theology to begin with. If you want
to understand man and his soul, you have to study the software manual that
comes with it. You need to study the Bible.
Jojo
----- Original Message -----
From: Axil Axil
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, November 02, 2012 4:17 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:The Quantum Soul?
Some believe that the soul comes into being when the human egg is
fertilized; aka the moment of conception.
In this way of thinking, with DNA as the software of the soul, the
human DNA has the potential to form a complete person, but at the time of
conception no organ is yet formed to contain the soul.
With current technology, any cell in the body can be transformed into a
omnipotent cell that can produce a human.
So human spiritual characteristic is inherent in any DNA present in the
human body.
If this is true, do you commit murder when you cut your hair or trim
your finger nails?
If a mouse is given flawed disease carrying human DNA to simulate human
disease or a goat is given human genes to produce human insulin, have these
animals become human with a soul.
If a geneticist copies human DNA, and puts it into a animal cell, does
the animal become human? What parts of human DNA define the soul?
Please extend your theology into the domain of genetic manipulation in
your quest to define the soul.
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 7:53 AM, Jojo Jaro <jth...@hotmail.com> wrote:
You've made my point better than I. For when you are studying the
ones and zeros wherever they may persist, you are in fact studying the
software. The ones and zeros are not hardware, they're software.
Much like the soul. We can spend a hundred lifetimes studying neuron
chemical reactions, electrical impulses, cellular structure of brain cells and
other psychological theories and mumbo-jumbo; we will never understand how
Human consciousness works. To understand the human soul, one needs to
understand its creator. Much like studying the software requires an
understanding of Microsoft Software Engineer's design methods and techniques,
in fact, a understanding of the man himself.
Tell me, can you reverse engineer the entire windows operating system
from the ones and zeros of machine code? Doesn't understanding windows require
understanding of its design at a higher level? not at the machine code level?
possibly by interviewing the designer and studying his work? Why would one
think he can understand the human soul by studying the individual ones and
zeros of the neurons?
You see, this issue goes deeper than just discussions about the human
soul. This issue involves our humanistic prederilection to avoid acknowledging
the creator. We try our best to understand ourselves without studying the
human blueprint. Such efforts are always doom to fail, much like the fallacies
of Darwinian Evolution.
Jojo
----- Original Message -----
From: Patrick Ellul
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2012 1:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:The Quantum Soul?
If I studied close enough the inside of a computer that has MS
Windows installed on it, without ever switching it on, I can still see and
understand the expected behaviour. The software program is persisted as ones
and zeros on a memory device.
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:58 PM, Jojo Jaro <jth...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Any psychological/psychiatric/philosophical attempt to understand
the soul is doom to failure from the onset.
Let says you're a hardware/ASIC/Electronics/IC engineer who
designed the Pentuim chip. Without understanding of the software, can you
discern the operation of a PC from your understanding of the
hardware/Chips/IC/CPU/GPU/etc? At best, you understanding would be severely
incomplete and faulty. Software is the intangible thing that controls the
behavior of the computer. Software controls the hardware.
On the same token, experts in
Psychology/Psychiatry/Philosophy/Sociology/Humanism/etc, can never hope to
completely understand the Human Soul. It is that intangible entity - the soul,
that controls the hardware consisting of your brain cells/neurons, etc. The
Software soul is what needs to be understood for us to understand the behavior
of man. You need to study the soul, not the brain. The brain is simply a
mechanism that the soul controls much like the CPU chip is the mechanism that
MS Windows controls. The analogy is apt and accurate.
Hence, one is wasting their time trying to study all the ideas of
these philosophers/psychologists/psychiatrists/etc. They are at best severely
incomplete, at worst gravely misleading.
If you want to understand the spiritual soul, go to the one who
wrote the software soul. Study his book - the Bible to have a better
understanding of human behavior.
Jojo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Terry Blanton"
<hohlr...@gmail.com>
To: <vortex-l@eskimo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2012 10:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:The Quantum Soul?
I think Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff have the best
explanation of
consciousness to date. It's called Orchestrated Objective
Reduction,
or Orch-OR. The two actually developed the idea separately, Sir
Penrose being a physicist and Hameroff being a physician who
specialized in anesthesia and cancer research. Roger was
seeking a
model of the brain that did not require computation. Hameroff
wanted
to know how anesthesia worked and where the conscious went when
under.
Penrose theorizes that spacetime is granular at the size of the
Planck length and that quantum superposition is linked to the
curvature. Orchestrated Reduction is the collapse of the
superposition.
Hameroff brought in the neuron microtubles which provide the
structure. He sees a synchronous oscillation in neural MT can
influence other neurons. Together they see these electrons as
a sea
embedded in the geometry of spacetime.
Needless to say, they have many critics. :-)
--
Patrick
www.tRacePerfect.com
The daily puzzle everyone can finish but not everyone can perfect!
The quickest puzzle ever!
