Hello Big Fish,

It is always a pleasure to read your post.  Always so serious and 
straight from the heart.  Especially this post.  Because...

Before I reply, please excuse me first.  Because I trapped you with this 
small statement to illustrate a point.  hahaha...

Roshi(老師) - is indeed a Japanese pronunciation for the same 
character of (老師) pronounces Lao-Shi in Chinese, which is what I am 
called in the Chinese community. 
While the naming of American Zen Association has the opposite story.  At 
the time of our registration, I thought Zen is Chan, because they are 
the same character in Chinese.

Now what is the point?  The point is, labels are confusing.  That's 
all....  And you fell for it.  Sorry.

It does not matter at all, my friend.  State of our Inner Self is the 
only thing matters.

I will address your other longer post after dinner.  OK?  Stay Tuned. 

Sorry again,
_/\_
JM


Bill Smart wrote:
>
> JMJM:
>
> AND ANOTHER THING...
>
> (Sorry for the second posting so soon after my last, but I'm on my
> second cup of tea this mornig and my inner self is in a frenzy. It
> wants to reach out and CHI someone!)
>
> Here is my question:
>
> You are a teacher in a Chan school. Chan is Chinese. You spell and
> pronouce Chi as 'Chi' which is modern Chinese (as opposed to 'ki' as
> in Japnese' or 'qi' traditional or some other kind of Chinese.) Your
> family name is Hwong. Isn't that Chinese also?
>
> So...and here comes the question...Why is your title 'Roshi', which
> is Japanese?
>
> Enquiring no-minds want to know...
>
> Bill!, Big Fish
>
> --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com>, 
> "Bill Smart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > JMJM,
> >
> > I DID NOT agree with you that zen was 'just a mind-balancing
> > exercise'. I agreed with you that zen was not spritual. Zen is no-
> > mind, so there is nothing to balance - WYSIWYG, no adjustments
> > necessary.
> >
> > I'm not sure what your remark below about my 'inner self' means. I
> > guess you think I have an 'inner self' and that you know more about
> > what it's doing than I. Please continue to let me know what it's
> up
> > to. I'd hate to have my inner self sneak up on me and surprise me.
> >
> > Buddha Nature, which I have called 'JUST THIS', is not in the realm
> > of sprituality or maya. It is real. It is reality.
> >
> > Buddha Nature and Chi are not the same, or at least Buddha Nature,
> as
> > I know it, is not the same as what you have described Chi to be.
> > You've described Chi as a universal energy that you can connect
> with
> > and detect in others, that you can cultivate and accumulate, that
> you
> > can learn to direct and channel, that you can use to heal yourself
> > and others, that misuse can harm yourself and others, that you
> > describe things you like as to having 'good' Chi and things you
> don't
> > as having 'bad' Chi. This sounds more like something sung about in
> > the Beach Boy's song 'Good Vibrations'. (Good hamony there...)
> >
> > Some of the above qualities overlap with Buddha Nature, but
> certainly
> > not all of them. Buddha Nature is universal but you could not call
> > it energy (or at least I wouldn't). You can 'connect' with it by
> > becoming aware of it. You could say you can cultivate it, but what
> > you really do is cultivate your awareness of it. You cannot
> > accumulate it in the sense of 'storing it up', but you can
> strengthen
> > your awareness of it. You cannot direct or channel it, you follow
> > it. You cannot use it to heal yourself and others, although the
> > awareness of it has healing in the sense of acceptance and peace.
> > You cannot use it to harm yourself or others, other than
> > intentionally or unintentionally misrepresenting Buddha Nature to
> > others. There is no 'good' or 'bad' Buddha Nature.
> >
> > As you have described Chi, I think it has the same relationship
> with
> > Buddha Nature as I now beleive Chan has with zen. Chi represents a
> > spritualized version of Buddha Nature as does Chan vis-a-vis zen,
> > complete with add-on surpernatural qualities, superstitions,
> wishful
> > thinking and lots of attachment-magnets.
> >
> > (I just now made up the term attachment-magnets. Pretty cool,
> huh?
> > Feel free to use it without feeling obligated to cite me.)
> >
> > JMJM, you didn't comment on my title before when it was Bill!. I
> > just got a new one: Big Fish. How do you like it? Does it have
> good
> > Chi or bad Chi? Can I heal or hurt someone with it? If I can, Al
> > had better WATCH OUT!
> >
> > ...Bill!, Big Fish
> >
> > --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com 
> <mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com>, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > >
> > > On the contrary, Al. What I meant was, if Bill admitted at the
> > > beginning that Zen is just a mental balancing exercise, then my
> > point is
> > > made. Since his did not agree with my observation, yet his Inner
> > Self
> > > did, he had convinced himself that there could be spirituality.
> > > Spirituality in my dictionary is Buddha Nature. :-)
> > >
> > > There is no one to convert to no where. Just some are more
> > delusional
> > > than others. No offense.
> > >
> > > Fitness63 wrote:
> > > >
> > > > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - >Hi Bill, Your post was what I
> > expected. If
> > > > you
> > > > had mentioned in the first place that spirituality to you has
> no
> > meaning,
> > > > then I don't have to write that many posts. :-) JM
> > > >
> > > > You sound like a missionary who tries to convert a heathen and
> > then says
> > > > "What could I expect from a heathen" when the conversion fails!!
> > > >
> > > > That is funny when I see things in zen that are just like
> > Christianity
> > > > and
> > > > then it makes me wonder if the cynics are right.
> > > >
> > > > Then again, I learned something from this, so thanks for trying
> > to
> > > > convert
> > > > Bill. You may have missed the big fish but gotten some little
> > ones.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>  

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