How easy is to manipulate  the ones who are asking to be manipulated because 
of their need of depending upon someone else words and not as much by 
acknowledging,  facing, accepting and embracing what is in them. God, Buddha, 
Jesus Heart.... is in each inhalation and each exhalation I do in awareness 
--- On Mon, 4/10/10, DP <> wrote:

From: DP <>
Subject: [Zen] Re: Don't pray in my school and I won't think in your church.
Date: Monday, 4 October, 2010, 16:46


But it's a scattershot technique being employed against all religion. 

Religious people can point out that they support the theory of evolution and 
that they condemn the cover-up by the Catholic Church and they still get "all 
religions are equally corrupt and wrong." It would be like saying all industry 
was evil and corrupt because of the actions of the oil industry. (Perhaps it 
is. Perhaps all religion is wrong. However, making broad generalizations does 
not prove that).

--- In, mike brown <uerusub...@...> wrote:
> Mayka,
> It goes waaaaaaaaay beyond mere "disappontment" in any established religious 
> institutions. I really don't understand why religion gets a "free pass" from 
> criticism. We attack the oil industry for polluting the environment; 
> goverment/politicians for corruption and other socially unacceptable 
> behaviours 
> etc. What is it about religion that can claim "I'm offended" as a valid 
> argument 
> against scrutiny and even ridicule? If I said the world was flat you'd 
> probably 
> think I was mentally sick. But deny evolution (despite the overwhelming 
> scientific eveidence) and that's ok because I claim to have 'faith' in a 
> bronze-age myth. And I'm not even going to begin with the institutionalised 
> cover-up of child rape by the Catholic church..
> Mike
> ________________________________
> From: Maria Lopez <flordel...@...>
> To:
> Sent: Mon, 4 October, 2010 22:51:51
> Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Don't pray in my school and I won't think in your 
> church.
> Hi Mike and Everyone!
> If everytime one has a dissapointment in any established religious 
> institution 
> whether that dissapointment was in Christian, Muslim, Jew, Buddhist, Zen 
> Buddhist, etc, etc institutions:  and  afterwards acts as a destructor 
> towards 
> the institution from which dissapointment took place, then it doesn't sound a 
> very wise way of doing towards oneself.  I certainly include myself in this 
> unwise way of doing as I've recently experienced a great dissapointment in 
> the 
> TNH institutions which lead me to criticism of them. Though never 
> as irrespetuos 
> or destructive as many atheists show themselves ugly behaviour in front of 
> Christianity.  This harmful way of doing doesn't affect the instituions 
> established but just to the ones who carries away such violent shows. 
>  When I look deeply into myself, I realice that it was me all the way alone 
> who 
> built up a pedestal to that institution.  It was me who caused herself the 
> dissapointment for building a pedestal of "holiness, the 
> institution".  They weren't the ones!!!. Having seeing this within myself I 
> am 
> now grateful having found that institution from which I was introduced in the 
> walk of zen buddhism.
>   I was ever dissapointed in any Christian institutions because I never 
> built up 
> a pedestal to the instituion!.  And so my experience was always healthy and 
> positive.  It was positive because I never put that instituion in a 
> pedestal.  I 
> saw it for what it was.  And so I could get all the benefit from it and 
> never 
> the dissapointment and the anger and frustation that comes with it.
> Mayka
> --- On Sun, 3/10/10, mike brown <uerusub...@...> wrote:
> >From: mike brown <uerusub...@...>
> >Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Don't pray in my school and I won't think in your 
> church.
> >To:
> >Date: Sunday, 3 October, 2010, 11:33
> >
> >
> >  
> >Kristy,
> >
> >You wrote:  "If you have faith, there is a whole sphere they are ignorant 
> >about."  
> >
> >
> >However, this isn't really the whole story. Many atheists were once 
> >believers 
> >who have seen thru 'faith' and have rejected it for what it is. Moreover, I 
> >am 
> >ignorant of what it is to be a neo-nazis, but have no trouble rejecting 
> >their 
> >beliefs as not just harmful, but wrong.
> >
> >Mike
> >
> >

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