Chris, Guess we could all just shout "Kwatz!" at each other from now on then...
Mike ________________________________ From: Chris Austin-Lane <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Sunday, 2 September 2012, 21:52 Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: " dancing with the daffodils" This day it is the annotated Zen Forum. On Sep 2, 2012 4:05 AM, "mike brown" <[email protected]> wrote: > > >Bill!, > > > >Isn't it the Zen BuddhistForum, at least by implication? Isn't it fair to talk >about comparisons? > > >>ED, Just sit. Don't think. Just sit. > > >But if you do find yourself thinking, just come back gently to the breath. >When you find your mind has become calm become mindful of how the breath (or >any bodily sensations) arises and passes. How it is that there is no 'you' >doing the breathing - rather the universe is breathing 'you'. Note how even >pleasant sensations eventually pass and more unpleasant, or neutral, >sensations take their place. With such mindfulness you may find you gain some >insight into the 3 Characteristics of existence: impermanence, non-self, and >the unsatisfactoriness of phenomena. With diligence and patience, you may >become liberated from suffering. > > > >Not exactly pithy, I admit. And Zen is certainly direct in pointing to our >True Nature. But "wash your bowls", "just sit" and "Just This!" is also not >'it' either. So if we're going to have instructions/guides, then there is >definitely a place for more descriptive ones (even tho the endgame will always >be that they are ultimately dropped). The method is NOT the meditation. > > > > > >Mike > > > > >________________________________ > From: Bill! <[email protected]> >To: [email protected] >Sent: Sunday, 2 September 2012, 11:33 >Subject: [Zen] Re: " dancing with the daffodils" > > > >Mike, Point taken, but this is the Zen Forum, not the Theravada Forum or the >Here-Have-Some-More-Rice-Gruel Forum. > >ED, Just sit. Don't think. Just sit. > >...Bill! > >--- In [email protected], mike brown <uerusuboyo@...> wrote: >> >> Bill!, >> >> A great instruction, and is certainly direct, but Joshu's instructions were >> given to a monk who had probably been practicing meditation for a long time >> and was already 'ripe' for awakening to happen. Imagine how useful that >> instruction would be to a neophyte coming off the street asking about the >> search for truth or something similar. Joshu's instruction is just that - an >> instruction. That's why i believe Buddha's skilful means (upaya) is so >> useful as a teaching method. On the one side we can have the direct pointing >> to the Dharma (Zen) and on the other we can have Therevada Buddhism with >> it's more step by step instructions, such as following the Noble eightfold >> Path. >> >> The Buddha was very wise to understand that there are many different kinds >> of people/cultures/personalities etc. out there and no one method will work >> for all. I think it should be clear now that "wash you bowls" just isn't >> going to work for someone like ED. If you agree, what else could you say >> that might help him? >> >> Mike >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> From: Bill! <BillSmart@...> >> To: [email protected] >> Sent: Sunday, 2 September 2012, 9:48 >> Subject: [Zen] Re: " dancing with the daffodils" >> >> >> Â >> ED, >> >> Mind if Joshu and I jump in? >> >> "WASH YOUR BOWLS!" That's how...Bill! (and Joshu) >> >> --- In [email protected], "ED" <seacrofter001@> wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> > Edgar, >> > >> > And how is this magic trick accomplished? >> > >> > --ED >> > >> > >> > >> > --- In [email protected], Edgar Owen <edgarowen@> wrote: >> > > >> > > ED, >> > > >> > > Stop practicing and just BE your Buddha Nature! >> > > >> > > Edgar >> > >> > >> > >> > > > Edgar, >> > > > >> > > > Therefore, although each of us is complete, we need to practice >> > > > diligently at all times with no objective in mind? >> > > > >> > > > --ED >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > Joe and Merle, >> > > > > >> > > > > There is no 'goal' of enlightenment to be achieved without which >> > you >> > > > imagine you are incomplete.... >> > > > > >> > > > > There is no incompleteness. This understanding is an essential >> > aspect >> > > > of realization... >> > > > > >> > > > > Wham! >> > > > > >> > > > > Edgar >> > >> > > > > > >
