[CTRL] Fwd: [CogLib] Psychedelics and Sedition

2002-03-05 Thread RoadsEnd



---BeginMessage---

***
Is Taking a Psychedelic an Act of Sedition?
***

The March-April 2002 issue of Tikkun Magazine has an interesting article
by Charles Hayes in which he explores cognitive liberty and
psychedelics. His article examines the multiplicity of possible
individual and social contexts for taking psychedelics, and some of the
meanings of the act post 9/11.

 Read More at: http://www.alchemind.org/topclnews.htm

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[CTRL] Feds Abet Proselytisers

2002-03-05 Thread Euphorian

-Caveat Lector-

From PoliTechBot


}}}Begin
Federal law helps religious filtering firms proselytize


Date: Sat, 02 Mar 2002 11:32:12 -0500
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: FC: Federal law helps religious filtering firms proselytize
From: Declan McCullagh [EMAIL PROTECTED]


[Last I checked, the Feds give libraries billions of dollars a year. Is it
really a surprise that if if you route that kind of cash through Washington
every year, Congress will notice -- and slap wacky restrictions on it? And
because libraries aren't required to take the handouts, the ACLU's court
challenge (trial this spring) may not be terribly successful. --Declan]

--

From: Kimberly Allen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Bias in Web Filtering
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 07:30:15 -0800

Declan,

This is of possible interest to Politechbots. I continue to be amazed at the
actions we will take in protection of children, when these same actions
would be blatantly unconstitutional if attempted against adults. Do children
need protection from the Constitution?

Kim Allen


--

REPORT CITES RELIGIOUS BIAS IN SCHOOL WEB FILTERS
A recent report from the Responsible Netizen Project of the University of
Oregon's Center for Advanced Technology in Education draws attention to
links between conservative religious groups and the Internet filtering tools
being used in several public schools. The report, titled Filtering
Software: The Religious Connection, looks at 8 companies who are either
connected to conservative Christian organizations or who have expressed
conservative religious philosophies. Several of the companies profiled in
the report have used the Children's internet Protection Act (CIPA) as a way
to target public schools looking for technology solutions that will bar
students from seeing inappropriate online material. The report surmises that
there has been some conservative bias in the material that has been selected
to be blocked from students.
[SOURCE: eSchools, AUTHOR: Dennis Pierce]
(http://www.eschoolnews.com/news/showStory.cfm?ArticleID=3537)




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believe in anything merely on the authority of Teachers, elders or wise men.
Believe only after careful observation and analysis, when you find that it
agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all.
Then accept it and live up to it.
The Buddha on Belief, from the Kalama Sutta
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Universal Declaration of Human Rights
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Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will
teach you to keep your mouth shut.
--- Ernest Hemingway

A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!  These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of 

[CTRL] Fwd: Mossad Agent Appointed Israeli Ambassador To US : In What World Is Isai...

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon



---BeginMessage---

Mossad Agent Appointed Israeli Ambassador To US
In What World Is Isaiah Berlin A World Famous Or Influential
Philosopher?

3/4/02 3:22:00 PM
United Press International

Washington, DC -- Analysis: Mossad chief may be next envoy

By Martin Sieff

Senior News Analyst

Published 2/27/2002 6:23 PM

WASHINGTON, Feb 27 (UPI) -- Israel may send a super-spook related to a
world
famous philosopher as its next ambassador to Washington to end a long
deadlock
between Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and Foreign Minister Shimon Peres

Long embattled Israeli Ambassador to Washington David Ivry is hanging up
his
hat and going home in April No firm decision has been taken on who will
succeed him, but the frontrunner is Ephraim Halevy, the 67-year-old head
of
Israel's Mossad Secret Intelligence Service and the nephew of Sir Isaiah
Berlin, one of the most influential Western political philosophers of the
20th
century

[LSN:  Has anyone ever even heard of Isaiah Berlin?]

Sources in Israel and Washington said Ivry would return home right after
celebrating Israeli Independence Day on April 17 Ivry is the legendary
former
head of the Israeli air force, long-time director of the Israeli Defense
Ministry and first Israeli National Security Council chief who personally
led
the famous 1981 IAF airstrike that destroyed Iraq's French-built Osirak
nuclear reactor

Political sources in Israel's ruling Likud Party in Israel said Ivry was
not
being pushed out and could have stayed on for several more months This
was
because, they said, Sharon and Peres can still not agree on his successor

But the ambassador, these sources said, was determined not to stay on
because
he was angry at what he regarded as a long campaign to denigrate and
undercut
him within Likud itself

It is an open secret in Likud circles that Dore Gold, who then-Prime
Minister
Benjamin Netanyahu plucked from obscurity to become first his top foreign
policy adviser and then Israeli ambassador to the United Nations from 1996
to
1999, has been campaigning hard over the past year to get the plum and
powerful Washington envoy post Some Israeli media reports have even
described
him as ambassador-designate

But Likud and Labour party sources in Israel said Gold would not get it
because Peres was determined not to appoint him

Gold will never get the job as long as Shimon (Peres) remains foreign
minister, one well-placed Israeli political insider said

The main frontrunner for the job, according to the Israeli insiders, is
Halevy, the British-born, highly cultivated veteran diplomat who now heads
Mossad He is a former Israeli ambassador to the European Union

Halevy, the Israeli sources said, is seen as a politically neutral figure
acceptable to both Sharon and Peres He is also a veteran high-powered
diplomat and while his term as Mossad director has not seen any
spectacular
intelligence coups, it has also so far been free of any scandals or
intelligence bungles such as marred the careers of some of his
predecessors
He grew up in North London

Halevy directed the secret rescue of the Jews of Ethiopia to Israel and
was
the key negotiator under former Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin in concluding
the
historic 1994 Israel-Jordan peace treaty For well more than a decade, he
was
Israel's most important clandestine contact with the late King Hussein of
Jordan

Halevy is fully fluent in English as his native language and unlike the
low
key Ivry is a skilled and experienced communicator The biggest criticism
thrown against Ivry by his Israeli critics was that he shunned the media
and
neglected to put Israel's case to the American public

However, Sharon and Peres have not yet made a final decision to appoint
Halevy, the Israeli sources said If he is not appointed, the next favored
candidate is Deputy Defense Minister Dalia Rabin-Pelossof, the daughter of
assassinated Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin

Rabin-Pelossof does not have the communications skills or diplomatic
expertise
of Halevy, they said, but would enjoy very high and, it is believed,
favorable
name recognition in the United States and is regarded as an acceptable
compromise by both Peres and Sharon

Peres earlier tried to push an obscure figure with close personal ties to
him,
Danny Gilman, head of Israel's Federation of Chambers of Commerce, Israeli
sources said But this proposal got nowhere with Sharon and his advisers,
according to the Israeli insiders

Despite the criticisms thrown at Ivry, he will be leaving on a career
high
Israel's standings in US public opinion polls remain at a very high
level
and ever since the terror bomb attacks in Haifa and Jerusalem at the
beginning
of December, President Bush has reverted to his traditional support of
both
Israel and its prime minister

Ivry has also enjoyed exceptionally good access and respect in both the
State
Department and, most especially, the Department of Defense, where he is
seen
as a literally legendary warrior figure

But two question marks still hang 

[CTRL] Another Journalist Group Attacked

2002-03-05 Thread Euphorian

-Caveat Lector-

From
http://www.torontostar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?GXHC_gx_session_id_=4cb9
bbf2b3aabacdpagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1c=Articlecid=1015240573
879call_page=TS_Newscall_pageid=968332188492call_pagepath=News/News
col=968793972154

}}}Begin
Mar. 4, 03:41 EDT

Star reporter injured in Afghan ambush

Gunmen attack car carrying Star journalists near Kabul

By Josh Rubin
Staff Reporter thestar.com



AFP PHOTO/JEWEL SAMAD

The Star's Kathleen Kenna, centre, is helped by husband Hadi Dadashian, left, and a
local Afghan man after being wounded in an attack on the road between Kabul and
Gardez, in eastern Afghanistan, March 4.

Star reporter Kathleen Kenna suffered serious injuries to her leg in Afghanistan today
when the car she was travelling in was ambushed by unidentified gunmen.

Kenna, her husband Hadi Dadashian, Star photographer Bernard Weil and an
Afghan driver were travelling on the main road from Kabul to Gardez when their car
was attacked by at least two people, according to Weil.
End{{{

Remainder of story @ site~~~
Forwarded as information only; no endorsement to be presumed
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In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material
is distributed without charge or profit to those who have
expressed a prior interest in receiving this type of information
for non-profit research and educational purposes only.
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
The only real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking
new landscapes but in having new eyes. -Marcel Proust
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe
simply because it has been handed down for many generations. Do not
believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do
not believe in anything simply because it is written in Holy Scriptures. Do not
believe in anything merely on the authority of Teachers, elders or wise men.
Believe only after careful observation and analysis, when you find that it
agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all.
Then accept it and live up to it.
The Buddha on Belief, from the Kalama Sutta
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
A merely fallen enemy may rise again, but the reconciled
one is truly vanquished. -Johann Christoph Schiller,
 German Writer (1759-1805)
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
It is preoccupation with possessions, more than anything else, that
prevents us from living freely and nobly. -Bertrand Russell
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
Everyone has the right...to seek, receive and impart
information and ideas through any media and regardless
of frontiers.
Universal Declaration of Human Rights
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will
teach you to keep your mouth shut.
--- Ernest Hemingway

A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
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screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!  These are
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major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
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Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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[CTRL] Rappoport On DynCorp

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://www.nomorefakenews.com/



MONDAY, MARCH 4. Lurking behind Enron is another corporation which also functions as a high-level cutout. DynCorp. This wing of the intell/military cartel has been racking up quite a record for itself.

 On the surface,DynCorp is an info tech company, which has contracts with more than 30 US govagencies, including Defense, State, the FBI, DEA, Bureau of Prisons, Office of National Drug Policy.

 It participates in drug interdiction in Latin America.

 CorpWatch reports that on May 12, 2000, the Colombian National Police intercepted a DynCorp package destined for a US DynCorp office. The 250-gram container ofliquid tested positive for heroin.

 DynCorp runs the aerial fumigation project to eradicate Latin American coca crops. The company will not say what chemicals it is using.

 Articles in Insight and the London Observer identify DynCorp employees as being involved in buying and selling women and young girls as sex slaves in Bosnia.

 Pug Winokur, chairman of the finance committee of Enron, and a board member of the Harvard Endowment Fund, is the former CEO of DynCorp. Since DynCorp has major contracts to provide info tech services to the government agencies listed above--and also to the US Securities and Exchange Commission, which oversees all stock trading inthe US--Pug could easily have access to details of the government investigation of Enron. In his position as chairman of the Enron finance committee, Pug would have overseen the formation of all those private partnerships Enron used to hide and steal $$.

 As Catherine Austin Fitts points out, another member of the DynCorp board, Frabk Savage, is also onthe board of Lockheed. Between them, DynCopr and Lockheed run major accounting functions for US government agencies. Fitts, Kelly O'Meara of Insight, and others have pointed out that between 2 and 3 trillion dollars are missing from US government budget accounts. Gone. Running those account books would provide a wonderful opportunity to hide enormous sums.

 More on DynCorp's Winokur. This from Harvard Watch, a student/alumni group which analyzes Harvard's money dealings. During the period in which Enron executives touted the company's stock to employees, Harvard's main private investment fund...short sold [means betting a stock will go down] several million shares of Enron stock for an estimated profit of $50 million. Mr.Winokur's leadership positions at Enron and Harvard raise questions...

 In other words, while Ken Lay was telling Enron employees to bet on Enron stock going up, Harvard was betting it would go down. Harvard won. 

 Now, a suit has been filed in the US against DynCorp, by a group of agricultural workers in Latin American countries, demanding damages for grave illness and death caused byDynCorp's aerial spraying program. In deposition, DynCorp still refuses to state which toxic chemicals it is using.

 If an overall US government investigation of DynCorp is ever launched, not only will hundreds of gov employees have to recuse themselves, but the agencies investigating DynCorp will be feeding all their findings into info systems run by DynCorp.

 So when I say that CARTELS are really running things, and these cartels overlap traditional and outmoded views of government and business, I'm not whistling dixie.

 DynCorp. Bringing a new tomorrow today. 


[CTRL] Report: U.S. Breaks Up Major Israeli Spy Ring

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://www.albawaba.com/headlines/TheNews.php3?sid=203629lang=edir=news



Report: U.S. Breaks Up Major Israeli Spy Ring; Speculation: Mossad Was Aware of Sept. 11 Preparations


Authorities in the United States have broken up a network of Israeli spies living in the US who were burrowing into the justice and defense departments, a French website specializing in intelligence matters reported Monday.

The site, Intelligence Online, said it had exclusive access to a US justice department report that showed "a huge Israeli spy ring operating in the United States was rolled up by the Justice Department's counter-espionage service" last year, AFP cited the site.

An estimated 120 Israelis were detained or deported as a result of the highly top-secret operation, which it said had began in April last year and was ongoing.

The Website reported the ring was active in the states of Arkansas, California, Florida and Texas, and was made up of around 20 cells of between four and eight members who were aged between 22 and 30 and had recently completed Israeli military service in an army intelligence division.

It named several Israelis alleged to be the espionage operatives, including 3 of 13 Israeli "art students" it said were arrested in the Texan city of Irving on March 26 and 27 last year.

Intelligence Online editor-in-chief Guillaume Dasquie told AFP that the network had been trying "to penetrate justice department and defense department systems" through drug-fighting agencies such as the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA), which has access to files from other US departments.

"The DEA plays a central role in counter-espionage because of its internal security service, the Office of Security Programs, which was the first to notice the unusual behavior of young Israeli nationals among its agents," Dasquie said.

His Website reported the network's objectives included some of the most sensitive sites in the United States, such as the Tinker Air Force Base located close to Oklahoma City. It said the US Air Force had requested the help of the Justice Department last May in the investigation against the Israelis.

Dasquie added that US investigators were concerned by indications that some of the alleged Israeli spies had been based in the same US cities as people suspected of having helped in the logistics of the devastating September 11 attacks on New York and Washington.

For instance, it had been established, he said, that a dozen Israelis, including the alleged surveillance leader, had been based in the Florida town of Hollywood between January and June last year.

US authorities have arrested another dozen people "suspected of being tasked with the logistics of preparing the September 11 attacks" in the same area, he noted.

Dasquie pointed out, however, that the "troubling" coincidence was still only one theory being looked into and that there was not enough information to determine whether Israel's Mossad secret service had been aware of the preparations for the September attacks.

"It has to be verified if these teams were in the same place at the same time before hypotheses are built up," he said. (Albawaba.com)





[CTRL] Fwd: Harold Weisberg Obit.

2002-03-05 Thread RoadsEnd



---BeginMessage---

NYT
March 4, 2002

Harold Weisberg, 88, Critic of Inquiry in Kennedy Death, Dies

By STUART LAVIETES

Associated Press, 1994
Harold Weisberg

Harold Weisberg, an implacable critic of the government's investigation of
the assassination of President John F Kennedy, died on Feb 21 at his home
in Frederick, Md

He was 88

A former journalist, investigator for the Senate Committee on Civil
Liberties and analyst for the Office of Strategic Services in World War II,
Mr Weisberg had retired to be a Maryland chicken farmer and writer by the
time of the shooting in Dallas in 1963

Incensed by the government's investigation into the assassination, he
published a response at his own expense, the bluntly titled Whitewash
(1965) In it, he argued that careful analysis of the evidence presented in
the Warren Commission's report undermined the single-bullet theory and, with
it, the possibility that Lee Harvey Oswald had acted alone

Mr Weisberg followed this book, which was republished by Dell in 1966, with
Whitewash II That book presents a close examination the Zapruder film and
questions the time sequence accepted by the Warren Commission

He wrote four more sequels, each devoted to evidence in the commission
report and to government documents that he uncovered using the Freedom of
Information Act Over the years, he collected more than 250,000 government
papers on the assassination, all of which he stored at his home in Maryland

Unlike many other critics of the investigation, Mr Weisberg cannot
accurately be called conspiracy theorist, because he did not speculate about
who might have been involved in the assassination

Jim Garrison, a New Orleans district attorney, was inspired by Whitewash
to search for and prosecute conspiracy suspects But in a 1992 opinion
article in The Washington Post, prompted by JFK, the Oliver Stone film
about Mr Garrison, Mr Weisberg wrote that the proliferating conspiracy
theories mislead and confuse as much or more than the faulted official
conclusions In a letter to The Post, Mr Weisberg called the movie a
monumental piece of disinformation

Mr Weisberg was also a critic of the government's handling of the
investigation into the assassination of the Rev Dr Martin Luther King Jr
in 1968 Hired as an investigator for James Earl Ray, he came to believe
that his client had not fired the bullet that killed Dr King In his
subsequent book, Frame-Up (Outerbridge  Dienstfrey, 1971), Mr Weisberg
maintained that although Mr Ray was a member of a racist group, he was
merely a decoy and had been pressured into a confession, which he later
recanted

Mr Weisberg had his own critics and accusers In a review of Whitewash in
The New York Times Book Review, Fred Graham, then the Supreme Court
correspondent for The Times, wrote that it was difficult to believe that
any institution could be as inept, careless, wrong or venal as Mr Weisberg
implied

Mr Weisberg, who was born in Philadelphia and grew up in Wilmington, Del,
is survived by his wife, Lillian Stone Weisberg, and two sisters

Mr Weisberg saw some of his beliefs vindicated in the final report of the
House Select Committee on Assassinations in 1979, which concluded that
President Kennedy's death was probably the result of a conspiracy The
report criticized the Warren Commission for failing to investigate
adequately the possibility of a conspiracy, placing a large part of the
blame on the refusal of the CIA and FBI to provide it with all
relevant evidence and information



---End Message---


[CTRL] John Rambo Joins The Hizbollah

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://geocities.com/joevialls/Rambo.html



John Rambo Joins The Hizbollah 
Eleven Israelis Die in a Hail of Well-Placed Bullets 

Joe Vialls, 4 March 2002

You all know what happens to any Palestinian stupid enough to challenge an illegal checkpoint in their own territory, because the western media has reinforced the sad reality hundreds of times If the enraged Palestinian is carrying a gun or a grenade, the Israelis normally shoot him or her with a bloody great 120-mm tank shell. If the enraged Palestinian is merely a stone-throwing child, they just execute him or her with a couple of well-placed 5.56-mm rounds to the head. 
  
Either way the result is normally 100% predictable: An instant and very bloody death for the Palestinian resident daring to defend Palestinian territory, while the Israeli invaders cheer wildly from behind their safe concrete walls. In many ways this killing process has become part of the Jewish growing-up ritual for young males. First someone tears off your foreskin while you are a tiny and defenceless baby, then you have a Bar Mitzvah, then you shoot a Palestinian through the head. But all that was yesterday, and today is suddenly different and very violent. 
   
"Taking aim from a hilltop, a sniper killed 11 soldiers and civilians at a checkpoint Sunday in the deadliest of a two-day string of Palestinian attacks that killed 21 Israelis."  Which all seems deceptively easy until you realize these Israeli checkpoint personnel were supported by forty troops in the immediate area, plus five battle tanks and seven other assorted armored vehicles. 
   
So there they all were, a bunch of Israeli soldiers innocently eating their pretzels after cutting down a few unarmed Palestinian women and children for kicks, when all hell broke loose. Well not exactly hell perhaps, but a single sniper taking pot shots with an old-fashioned bolt-action rifle. With a what? United Press International reported it this way:-
  
“ -- Early Sunday a Palestinian sniper apparently using an old Carbine took pot shots at soldiers and civilians who were at a roadblock about a mile from the settlement of Ofra northeast of Ramallah, military sources and eye witnesses said."
  
“The gunman who was on a hill overlooking a valley with the roadblock killed three civilians, two army officers and three soldiers before reinforcements arrived, returned fire and hit the Carbine."
  
"Apparently the hills surrounding the valley caused an echo so single shots sounded like bursts of fire and it was difficult to detect its source. The attacker disappeared.”
   
So to sum up again,  a single man using an “old carbine” outgunned a total of more than 40 Israeli soldiers in the area, plus the five known battle tanks and seven other assorted armored vehicles.
  
OKay then, let us assume for the moment that this awesome individual managed to work the bolt on his rifle quickly enough to hold off the Israeli jackals below, and let us further assume that he managed to avoid the 1,000+ rounds of small arms ammo that would surely have been fired back in his direction. But hey, that still leaves those bloody great 120-mm tank guns doesn't it?
  
After obviously deflecting the tank shells with his bare hands or clenched teeth, our hero beats a hasty tactical retreat across the ridge, where he will surely be cut down by one of those nice American- taxpayer-funded Cobra helicopter gunships. After all, these choppers have the lot: Gatling cannon in the nose, missiles on the stub wings, infra red guidance, thermal imagery, ultra-violet tracking, and sheepskin covered seats for perfect lumbar support. 
  
Unfortunately, not today. Though the nose gunners swivel their turrets and bloodshot eyeballs in their sockets until they hurt, there is no-one in sight. Evidently the ghostly attacker has melted into the background, or disguised himself as a cold rock, or dug a deep cave with his bare hands.
 
You can almost hear the distant voice of Colonel Troutman on the radio:  "Come in John Rambo, Come in John. This is Colonel Troutman. You've done some bad things John, some very bad things, but we can sort it out. I've come to take you home to Fort Bragg."

   
"But they drew first blood, Sir, they drew first blood."



[CTRL] Scotland: Ministers Declare 'War On Drugs' Is Over

2002-03-05 Thread Joshua Tinnin

-Caveat Lector-

Scotland: Ministers Declare 'War On Drugs' Is Over
URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v02/n374/a10.html
Newshawk: puff_tuff
Pubdate: Sun, 03 Mar 2002
Source: Sunday Herald, The (UK)
Copyright: 2002 Sunday Herald
Contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Website: http://www.sundayherald.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/873
Author: Neil Mackay, Home Affairs Editor


MINISTERS DECLARE 'WAR ON DRUGS' IS OVER

No More 'Just Say No' Campaigns ...  Instead, Harm Reduction, Rehabilitation
And Information Will Be The Policy

THIS weekend Scotland's drugs minister has officially declared that the
30-year war on drugs is over.  In an exclusive interview with the Sunday
Herald, Dr Richard Simpson, also the deputy justice minister, said: 'The
only time you will hear me use terms such as 'War On Drugs' and 'Just Say
No' is to denigrate them.'

Instead Simpson has pledged to ensure that Scotland's harm-reduction,
methadone, and rehabilitation services are fixed.

Simpson, who was a prison doctor, said: 'I've never used the term 'teach
children how to take drugs', but what I would say is that we need to provide
them with information.  We need to say 'we'd rather you didn't take ecstasy,
but if you make that decision, here are the risks'.  We have to give them
all the information they need to take responsibility for themselves.

'It's not about us wagging a finger at young people as they won't pay
attention to that -- so it's not worthwhile.  We've got to be very realistic
and not say 'you're going to die if you take ecstasy', what we will say is
'some people do die when they take ecstasy but we don't truly know why'.'

He said that 'we can't pretend that we're going to stop the availability of
drugs' or people using drugs, and the concept of 'Just Say No' had therefore
been abandoned for good.

In an another interview, the UK pensions minister Ian McCartney, whose son
died of a heroin overdose because he was not given methadone in jail, told
the Sunday Herald: 'It wasn't a prison sentence he got, it was a death
sentence.  There is no sense to the current system.  Going to jail harmed my
son and did nothing to address the cause of crime.'

Now he is determined to change the system.  'I'm not just a government
minister,' he said.  'I'm a parent too, and if I thought our strategy was
flawed I wouldn't be part of it.  The prevailing attitude both in and out of
government towards addicts has been 'it's all your own fault'.  That's why
we have virtually no treatment services and a legacy of 3000 deaths a year.
In 20 years, 60,000 people have died -- that's enough to fill Ibrox Stadium.
That's why we need harm-reduction policies in place.'

His Scottish government colleague Simpson also edged close to support for a
Royal Commission on drugs saying that the debate was 'stifled', and issues
such as legalisation and decriminalisation 'have to be addressed', adding:
'We can't have a genuine debate about these issues because some of the press
turn around and say that's wrong.  We need to have that debate, we need to
be more sophisticated about our approach.  I think this parliament has to
talk about it much more openly.'

As part of an in-depth Sunday Herald investigation into Scotland's drug
problem, we found that some addicts wait as long as two years to get
methadone.  Simpson said there must be 'adequate resources' for all drug
addicts and if services were not improved then 'questions would have to be
asked of local health boards'.

He attacked the jailing of addicts for short prison terms : 'Drug addicts
going into prison and coming back out again is a waste of public money.  It
neither addresses their offending behaviour nor does it cut crime.  It's
purposeless ...  We have our priorities wrong.' He added that he would like
to see 'very, very, very many fewer' addicts going to prison.

He favours exploring the concept of ecstasy testing kits in clubs to reduce
risk.  He is unconvinced whether or not cannabis is a gateway drug, adding
that the Executive was less concerned with people possessing illegal drugs
than with them resorting to crime to feed their habit.

Backing David Blunkett's plan to downgrade the criminal classification of
cannabis, he said: 'We need to concentrate on the most dangerous drugs and
that is class-As such as heroin and cocaine.  The reason for changing the
classification of cannabis -- if we chose to -- is to send a clear message
about priorities.  It says to young people that we recognise that all drugs
aren't the same.

'If we give messages that they are all bad then we will not be believed.
Young people say alcohol causes five times the deaths that drugs do.  Last
year there were 1500 deaths due to alcohol and 292 from drugs.  From a
criminal point of view young men drinking and becoming aggressive is a
significant problem ...  cannabis is not associated with aggression.'

Simpson said he looked on drug addiction as a health problem as well as a
criminal one.

A 

[CTRL] Fwd: CONTRAILS.......

2002-03-05 Thread Colleen Jones

So this is letter I sent out March 1noting these extra strange
contrails in the sky and the weather was so nice

Now I reported this to the list and note to Tenorlove - and since then
note - 20 people have died in record breaking weather disasters   Oh
just 20 people, so they too were expendable?

Now - during the time frame of these HUGE markers in the sky - this
weather disaster occurredfurther in this time frame two schools
have been closed inour area for the reason of flu

Anyway here is the letter I sent out - and these x's went it seemed
clear across the sky and I do not know how to measure space and planes
up this high

20 people died from this weather in this great experimentbelieve
two planes were involved but these are markers   Like maybe dog fights
in the sky

OSaba


---BeginMessage---


---BeginMessage---

So contrails to the north of me; contrails to the south of me 10
'oclock and 2'oclock   Did not see anything above me

To the South this big X (looked just like that) and to the North this
big X (looked like the other)to the South is was disappating
somewhat; to the North, beautiful perfect X but obviously done by same
plane or planes, and not simultaneously

Now yesterday we had snowflakes and oh so cold, chilll factor horrible -
damp in this house which was unusual cold   Then about 6:00 I went
outside it was like the temperature had gone up 20 degrees or this chill
factor had gone down, not sure anymore

Sun is out now, and it is getting nicer  These marks - like dogs
marking territories for satellites I think to do with this weather
modificationStill chilly but two days ago this snow was beautiful
the kind of snow you would want on a Christmas Day - big flakes, not
this sleaze

Further when this program is in full effect often rain, is sleazy
rainnot the big friendly drops but just plain sleaze meaning someone
else go the rain you should have gotten

Believe from all indications this weather modification program has
gained more control for they sure as hell let it get out of control that
day in April in Xenia when it was hit as was the bible belt, the
experimental station, by a tornado which demolished huge areas

While the CFR Governor (whom John Glen detested) said did you note the
patter of that storm, etc etc etc, as if he had a secret - which he
did

but the year the big Siberian Clipper hit this area, and the weather so
cold and blizard - a little 9 year old boy disappeared and week later
they found him lying in what was big snow drift right outside his door -
for he was too cold and weak to get back into the house

Do I love this program?   Well it was all done to warm up Russia so they
could grow our food and wheat   And to spare Palm Slprings and Naples,
from the dreadful hurricanes to which they had become accustomed

Problem:   other people were not prepared, but then this is what the
feds and ARCo may have called colllateral damaage

We shall see what the next few days bring here; be it the plague,
pneumonia, influenza, or will the temperature soar to to reach a new
record in his area

Anyway, my daffodiles are okay, my little purple flowers still there
after sitting two days, in the snow

So MARCH COMES IN LIKE LION, but goes out, like lamb to slaughter
Hibernians awakening - sleepers in place?

OSaba

Further wouldn't it be nice if the government would prepare shelters for
the people for who the hell needs all that dead weight at the top,
pushing for war to keep their jobs


---End Message---
---End Message---


Re: [CTRL] Boycott Mel Gibson's We Were Soldiers

2002-03-05 Thread thew

-Caveat Lector-

on 3/5/02 12:51 AM, RevCOAL at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 So I doubt that there were gobs of war-themed scripts just sitting around,
 but even if their were, then one has to ask WHY scriptwriters suddenly
 decided to start writing scripts using a theme that at the time would not
 have seemed very promising in regards to getting the interest of investors
 who are only interested in making a handsome profit on the film they invest
 in..
War films always do well when the right is in power.
Welcome to the zeitgeist.
--
We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant
facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies and competitive values. For
a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and
falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its
people.
   President John F. Kennedy

A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!  These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html
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[CTRL] Fwd: [NA] Why Votefraud.org is Marked “Forbidden”

2002-03-05 Thread RoadsEnd



---BeginMessage---

PREThose who cast the votes decide nothing.
Those who count the votes decide everything.
attributed to Communist Tyrant Josef Stalin

* [If you are on Paypal, you can donate to this effort at email address: 
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* [URGENT NOTICE: For perspective on 9-11 attacks you must see the articles lined 
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hand side under the headings a section in red, America's New War, or War on 
Americans? When you click on that and scroll down you will find a section in blue 
letters called Attack on America, when you click on that you find many key articles 
on 9-11, including: Operation 911: No Suicide Pilots! by Carol Valentine; and Who 
We Need Fear and What is Global Hawk? from this e-wire; and More 911 Questions; 
Anthrax; Who's the Coward? also from this e-wire. After today's message you can find 
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Archived messages can be found at votefraud.org, then hit red hot news on the 
Navigation Bar, then pick month and date] * /PRE


March 05, 2002 NA (Network America) e-wire

Why Votefraud.org is Marked “Forbidden”

O.K. I’ll do it. But after I cover this first point, I've sent along one
of my best tirades -- at least it felt like one of the best when I wrote
it a few minutes ago.

A number of you good souls have written and asked why votefraud.org is
down and marked “Forbidden” when you try to get to it.

The reason is simple: in this case it is not the Illuminati, the B’nai
B’rith, the JDL, DHL, FBI, CIA, FEMA, IMF, DUI, or MOUSE.

No, we have simply been unable to pay our bill to our good service
provider for many months now, and he has been most patient. Our bill now
sits at $495 --- MINUS the $250 that a good man and old friend has just
told me he is sending from the east coast. This good man was sending
this generous donation without even knowing of our plight.

Now, with regard to the next paragraph, please don’t write me any nasty
letters, accuse me of wanting to “make a living off the movement”, or
call me a “pay-triot.” As the great Jim Rockford used to say with regard
to something else, that kind of thing “turns me off my own business.”

But if you are not trying to keep afloat your own operation, -- if you
have some discretionary money – and if you feel that you want to help us
get the website unblocked – then you can send a little donation to
Network America, PO Box 11339, Cincinnati, Ohio 45211. You can do it by
check or you can do it by credit card, in which case you must but the
card number and the expiration date, and the amount you want us to
charge. Many thanks – in advance --  to all who can do this.

Now I am not appealing here to a) others running their own research
operations  or websites or educational efforts – you have your hands
full; b) the “usual suspects” who always generously respond, and who
then eventually get piled on by everyone who finds out how generous they
are.

This appeal is to those who have perhaps never contributed anything to
Network America or Citizens for A Fair Vote Count, but have been
thinking from time to time that they might do so. --- And if you don’t
want to contribute, that’s OK too. I realize that almost all of us go on
the internet for free information --- I do too. This is and will remain
a free e-wire service. The idea is to get ideas and facts out there as
far as possible that the “Powers that be” don’t want us to hear or think
about. And one more thing –

If you are strapped with a bunch of kids or a sick mother in law and
will just be going further into debt – please do not send any money. But
do say a prayer – say it right now if you would be so kind – that we
here and you there can follow God’s will to the best of our ability in
the critical months and years ahead – and that we find the means to do
the work we should do.

Make that prayer to include this intention: besides doing my best to
earn a living, I am working on three different avenues to fund this
movement and other worthwhile movements so that we can get some momentum
to fight and thwart the moral devils who are trying to tighten their
grip on our beloved nation.

In the next few days will come a short e-wire regarding who will be to
blame if there is a nuclear or biological attack on the USA in the next
10 months.

In case you haven’t been able to notice, the Big Media has been BRIMMING
OVER with references to the USA being a victim of a 

[CTRL] Fwd: Manhattan Institute/Alliance Capital Management/Enron and the Bush administration

2002-03-05 Thread RoadsEnd



---BeginMessage---

Manhattan Institute/Alliance Capital Management/Enron and the Bush
administration:
It just keeps getting deeper
by Robert Lederman http://baltech.org/lederman/

Last week I sent out an essay about GW Bush's extensive ties to the
Manhattan Institute [MI] a far right think tank founded by the CIA.  Now the
South Florida Sentinel has published a story detailing the think tanks ties
to Jeb Bush and to Alliance Capital Management, Enron's top shareholder SEE:
http://www.cnet.com/investor/news/newsitem/0-9900-1028-8663286-0.html  ALSO
see below for the Sun-Sentinel article, my previous article and many other
quotes on MI]. It turns out that ACM is run by the top board members of MI
while MI is financed by JP Morgan/Chase - the bank behind both Enron and GW
Bush.

If you got my press release from 3/1/2002 [available at my website
http://baltech.org/lederman/ ] you'll note that my attorneys just subpoenaed
MI's chairman of the board, Roger Hertog. Please let me know if you get this
message and please pass it along to any media or activist contacts.

From: South Florida Sun-Sentinel
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/florida/sfl-fjeb02mar02.story?coll=sf
la%2Dnews%2Dflorida
Praise for Bush policy questioned
By Tamara Lytle
and Lori Horvitz Washington Bureau
March 2, 2002

WASHINGTON · Gov. Jeb Bush, who has staked much of his legacy on improving
education in Florida, a few weeks ago gleefully touted a study praising his
school policies. The report by the Manhattan Institute think tank provides
further evidence that Florida is truly making a positive difference in
providing greater educational choice for Floridians and improving student
academic achievement, Bush said in a Jan. 22 statement shortly after the
study was released. What he didn't mention was that the chairman of the
Manhattan Institute also is a top executive of Alliance Capital Management,
a Wall Street investment firm that lost almost $300 million of Florida's
pension money by investing in Enron stock as it tumbled. Another Alliance
Capital executive, Lewis Sanders, also serves on the think tank's board.
That relationship has led to conflict-of-interest questions about Bush's
role in protecting Florida's pension fund, because he is one of three
trustees charged with overseeing the state's retirement system. The Florida
pension fund kept Alliance Capital on the job, earning millions in fees,
even though it had invested poorly for 18 months. Alliance Capital was fired
in December after its disastrous decision to invest more and more in Enron
stock as the price was dropping. Now critics are saying Alliance Capital
should have been fired sooner and are suspicious that Bush may have not done
enough to monitor the company connected to such a glowing report of his
education plan. The study, released Jan. 22, was one of two in the past year
by the conservative-supported Manhattan Institute praising Bush's education
reforms. It singled out Florida as one of the country's leaders of school
choice under Bush.  When you have political oversight of things like state
pension funds, the fact the governor is getting political support from them,
it definitely raises a question of whether there was a quid pro quo there,
said Bill Allison of the nonpartisan ethics watchdog Center for Public
Integrity. It looks like the ulterior motive was cozying up to the governor
of Florida to keep a business arrangement beneficial to them goingThe
Manhattan Institute studies were written by Jay Greene of Fort Lauderdale, a
senior fellow of the think tank. Florida's State Department of Education
paid for part of the February study; the think tank also contributed. The
chairman of the think tank is Roger Hertog, who also is vice chairman of
Alliance Capital. Greene said he doesn't know Hertog and was not pressured
to report favorably on Bush's plan. He may be chairman of the board of the
Manhattan Institute but he's not my boss in any real sense, Greene said.
Tamara Lytle can be reached at 202-824-8255 or [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Copyright © 2002, South Florida Sun-Sentinel


PLEASE FORWARD WIDELY
Axis of Evil: Another Manhattan Institute Slogan in Service to the NWO by
Robert Lederman

The man who coined GW's now infamous slogan, Axis of Evil was a senior
fellow at the Manhattan Institute (MI) before joining the Bush
administration. He's just been dropped from the Bush payroll according to
the Washington Times [see article below]. MI also coined the slogan,
Compassionate Conservatism for GW, who publicly claims the
Rockefeller-funded organizations' influence on his thinking is, second only
to the Holy Bible.

What is the Manhattan Institute?

MI is a right wing think tank founded in 1978 by William Casey,
Bush/Reagan's CIA director. Following WWII Casey helped bring thousands of
former Nazis involved in eugenics and the Holocaust to the U.S. As CIA
director he later funded bin Laden and Co. with billions in arms, 

[CTRL] test

2002-03-05 Thread Dale Stonehouse



test
"Belief is the enemy."-- John A. Keel, The Mothman
Prophecies 



[CTRL] Fwd: THERE IS SOMETHING CALLED PROOF, AND THIS IS IT!!

2002-03-05 Thread RoadsEnd



---BeginMessage---



THERE IS SOMETHING CALLED PROOF, AND THIS IS IT!!
http://discservercom/discussioncgi?id=149495article=19651

Click on: Flight 77
http://wwwcnncom/SPECIALS/2001/tradecenter/maphtml

---End Message---


[CTRL] War Against Iraq to Start Secretly - Without Informing Congress

2002-03-05 Thread Jei

-Caveat Lector-

http://news1.iwon.com/article/id/215359|top|03-03-2002::13:40|reuters.html

Lieberman: Action Against Iraq Might Start Secretly
March 3, 2002 1:17 pm EST

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A leading Democrat said on Sunday that U.S. action
against Baghdad might begin without notification to Congress to allow
President Bush to employ surprise in attacking or going against the
leadership of Iraq.

Sen. Joseph Lieberman, a Connecticut Democrat and former vice presidential
candidate, criticized the Bush administration for generally failing to
consult enough with members of Congress in the ongoing war against
terrorism, telling CBS's Face the Nation program: The administration
could at this point do a better job of involving members of Congress in some
of the discussions about where the war is going.

But Lieberman made a blunt distinction with regards to Iraq and efforts to
overturn President Saddam Hussein. Bush's recent declaration of Iraq, Iran
and North Korea as an axis of evil bent on pursuing weapons of mass
destruction fueled speculation the U.S. administration would act next
against Saddam, whose regime survived the U.S.-led 1991 Gulf War.

Bush has warned Saddam his country will face the consequences if he does not
allow U.N. weapons inspectors to return, and also has reportedly approved a
covert plan to topple Saddam. Iraq denies it has any weapons of mass
destruction.

The president should consult with members of Congress as his administration
it seems to me has clearly turned a corner here and made a judgement that it
is critically important to American security to change the regime in
Baghdad, Lieberman said.

But I think you have also got to give the commander in chief the right to
employ surprise in attacking or in going against the leadership of Iraq,
the senator added. And therefore, consultation, but it may be that we will
not have an actual congressional resolution until after activities or
actions have begun in Iraq.

Lieberman was one of 10 leading members of Congress who have urged Bush to
make Iraq the next target in the U.S. war on terrorism, saying it had
reinvigorated its weapons programs since U.N. inspectors left in December
1998.

Another senator who joined the effort, Arizona Republican John McCain, told
CNN's Late Edition program, Saddam presents a clear and present danger to
the United States and should be removed from power.

The administration and others are discussing and planning whether to pursue
diplomatic, economic and other means, said McCain, a former presidential
rival to Bush.

The United States I think has to examine all options. I don't think there
is going to be a precipitous invasion of Iraq but I do believe that we have
to explore the options necessary for a regime change, he said.

Lieberman also hailed the Middle East peace proposal recently outlined by
Saudi Prince Abdullah, calling it a significant development.

The United States should seize this moment of opportunity, send a
high-level, permanent ... representative to stay in the Middle East and use
the Abdullah plan as a way to begin to create negotiations, Lieberman said.

McCain called the plan an important framework the United States must
embrace in the face of a terribly, terribly explosive situation.

A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!  These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html
 A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of
[EMAIL PROTECTED]/A

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
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[CTRL] WORLD BANK ACCUSATIONS ARE EYE-POPPING...

2002-03-05 Thread RoadsEnd

-Caveat Lector-

from:
http://disc.server.com/discussion.cgi?id=149495article=19661
Click Here: A
HREF=http://disc.server.com/discussion.cgi?id=149495article=19661;APFN/A
-
Greg Palast
WORLD BANK ACCUSATIONS ARE EYE-POPPING...
Tue Mar 5 02:43:53 2002
68.3.132.0


The Globalizer Who Came In From the Cold - READ THIS!!! (english)
by Greg Palast/London Observer 3:02pm Mon Mar 4 '02 (Modified on 6:38pm Mon
Mar 4 '02)

The World Bank’s former Chief Economist’s accusations are
eye-popping - including how the IMF and US Treasury fixed the
Russian elections

The Globalizer Who Came In From the Cold
Observer, London
Wednesday, October 10, 2001
E-Mail Article
Printer Friendly Version


JOE STIGLITZ: TODAY’S WINNER OF THE NOBEL PRIZE IN ECONOMICS

by Greg Palast

The World Bank’s former Chief Economist’s accusations are eye-popping -
including how
the IMF and US Treasury fixed the Russian elections

It has condemned people to death, the former apparatchik told me. This was
like a scene
out of Le Carre. The brilliant old agent comes in from the cold, crosses to
our side, and in
hours of debriefing, empties his memory of horrors committed in the name of a
political
ideology he now realizes has gone rotten.

And here before me was a far bigger catch than some used Cold War spy. Joseph
Stiglitz
was Chief Economist of the World Bank. To a great extent, the new world
economic order
was his theory come to life.

I debriefed Stigltiz over several days, at Cambridge University, in a
London hotel and finally
in Washington in April 2001 during the big confab of the World Bank and the
International
Monetary Fund. But instead of chairing the meetings of ministers and central
bankers,
Stiglitz was kept exiled safely behind the blue police cordons, the same as
the nuns
carrying a large wooden cross, the Bolivian union leaders, the parents of
AIDS victims and
the other ‘anti-globalization’ protesters. The ultimate insider was now on
the outside.

In 1999 the World Bank fired Stiglitz. He was not allowed quiet retirement;
US Treasury
Secretary Larry Summers, I’m told, demanded a public excommunication for
Stiglitz’ having
expressed his first mild dissent from globalization World Bank style.

Here in Washington we completed the last of several hours of exclusive
interviews for The
Observer and BBC TV’s Newsnight about the real, often hidden, workings of the
IMF, World
Bank, and the bank’s 51% owner, the US Treasury.

And here, from sources unnamable (not Stiglitz), we obtained a cache of
documents
marked, confidential, restricted, and not otherwise (to be) disclosed
without World Bank
authorization.

Stiglitz helped translate one from bureaucratise, a Country Assistance
Strategy. There’s
an Assistance Strategy for every poorer nation, designed, says the World
Bank, after
careful in-country investigation. But according to insider Stiglitz, the
Bank’s staff
‘investigation’ consists of close inspection of a nation’s 5-star hotels. It
concludes with the
Bank staff meeting some begging, busted finance minister who is handed a
‘restructuring
agreement’ pre-drafted for his ‘voluntary’ signature (I have a selection of
these).

Each nation’s economy is individually analyzed, then, says Stiglitz, the Bank
hands every
minister the same exact four-step program.

Step One is Privatization - which Stiglitz said could more accurately be
called,
‘Briberization.’ Rather than object to the sell-offs of state industries, he
said national leaders
- using the World Bank’s demands to silence local critics - happily flogged
their electricity
and water companies. You could see their eyes widen at the prospect of 10%
commissions paid to Swiss bank accounts for simply shaving a few billion off
the sale price
of national assets.

And the US government knew it, charges Stiglitz, at least in the case of the
biggest
‘briberization’ of all, the 1995 Russian sell-off. The US Treasury view was
this was great as
we wanted Yeltsin re-elected. We don’t care if it’s a corrupt election. We
want the money to
go to Yeltzin via kick-backs for his campaign.

Stiglitz is no conspiracy nutter ranting about Black Helicopters. The man was
inside the
game, a member of Bill Clinton’s cabinet as Chairman of the President’s
council of
economic advisors.

Most ill-making for Stiglitz is that the US-backed oligarchs stripped
Russia’s industrial
assets, with the effect that the corruption scheme cut national output nearly
in half causing
depression and starvation.

After briberization, Step Two of the IMF/World Bank one-size-fits-all
rescue-your-economy
plan is ‘Capital Market Liberalization.’ In theory, capital market
deregulation allows
investment capital to flow in and out. Unfortunately, as in Indonesia and
Brazil, the money
simply flowed out and out. Stiglitz calls this the Hot Money cycle. Cash
comes in for
speculation in real estate and currency, then flees at the first whiff of
trouble. A nation’s
reserves can drain in days, hours. And when that happens, to seduce

[CTRL] KeyConference on Agent Orange Opens in Hanoi

2002-03-05 Thread Jei

-Caveat Lector-

http://www.tehrantimes.com/News.asp?Da=3/4/02Cat=2Num=0#004

KeyConference on Agent Orange Opens in Hanoi

HANOI -- U.S. and Vietnamese government scientists and international experts
gathered in Hanoi on Sunday for a key meeting on the effects of the toxic
Vietnam war defoliant agent Orange.

The three-day conference will look at what is known about the effects of the
Agent Orange and its major contaminantsh--highly poisonous disjoins -- and
consider future research needs.

The issue is a tricky one for the United States, which has faced
compensation demands from both Hanoi and U.S. veterans for exposure to the
toxic defoliants sprayed to deny Communist soldiers jungle cover during the
Vietnam war that ended in 1975.

U.S. forces sprayed millions of gallons of agent Orange and other defoliants
on Vietnam from 1962 to 1971. Spraying was halted after it was discovered
that agent Orange, which contained the disking TH.D., caused cancer in rats.

The U.S. government says it hopes the conference will lead to a more precise
understanding of the effects of herbicides and other toxic chemicals in
Vietnam, with which it normalized ties in 1995.

But it stressed it is not about to entertain compensation claims from
Vietnam.

U.S. Vietnam-relations were normalized in 1995 after Vietnam dropped claims
war reparations/compensation, a U.S. embassy statement said. At the time
of normalization, neither compensation nor reparations were granted or
contemplated for the future.

Asked if this situation could change in the future depending on the outcome
of more research, a U.S. embassy spokesman said: I think the statement
speaks for itself.

--- Lobbying by Veterans ---

The Hanoi conference came about after intense lobbying in the United States
by the Vietnam veterans of America, which would like to see more
compensation for members who have fallen sick after exposure to agent
orange, and assistance to Vietnamese victims.

The Vietnam veterans of America have pushed for over 20 years to make this
happen, VVA President Thomas Cory told Reuters in Hanoi. We have to get
the research started and move from there.

More than 100,000 veterans have asked the U.S. veterans administration for
help for illnesses they feel are associated with Vietnam war service. Only
7,500 are receiving assistance.

Vietnam estimates that more than a million of its people were exposed to
agent Orange and says it is to blame for tens of thousands of birth defects.

Washington argues the scientific evidence is inconclusive and says the
conference is aimed at filling holes in research so far.

One of the issues that has always been a concern in trying to start a
research program is understanding what the Vietnamese already know about the
environmental and health effects, said conference chairman Christopher
Portier of the U.S. government's national institute of environmental health
sciences.

Much of the research is unpublished and we hear about it in sketchy pieces
and parts, Portier said.

Observers say conclusive research could have far reaching and expensive
consequences in terms of compensation claims for the United States and the
Agent Orange makers, Dow Chemical Co. and Monsanto Co.

A group of 20,000 U.S. veterans sued the two firms in 1999 and eventually
won a $180 million judgement.

Agent Orange exposure is also an issue for veterans from other countries who
served in Vietnam, including South Koreans, Australians, Thais and New
Zealanders.

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Re: [CTRL] test--Mothman

2002-03-05 Thread Edward Britton

Dale:


test

Belief is the enemy.
-- John A. Keel, The Mothman Prophecies 


John Keel was wrong: Insisting that others share X belief is the
enemy. :-)


In religion and politics, there are two kinds of people:
those who wish to control others and those who wish to remain free. The
only means by which the former may reign over the latter is by deception,
fear and force; by deluding those who enjoy God-given personal liberty
into accepting empty promises of security, elaborate schemes of
dependence and the propaganda of divisiveness.



Edward +

If you have fifty problems and one of them is government, you have only
one problem.
http://www.global-connector.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/reality_pump/




Re: [CTRL] War Against Iraq to Start Secretly - Without Informing Congress

2002-03-05 Thread Colleen Jones

-Caveat Lector-

They want a surprise attack and want to end the reign of terror, let
them hit Israel - end of problem.

This Joseph Lieberman is the most treacherous bastard sitting in the
Senate.

He is the one who pushed for war with Iraq, this deceitful man.

He has put Iraq on guard - which means American lives are at stake.

This man should be charged with treason.

OSaba

As stated - no Israel?   No problems.

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Re: [CTRL] test--Mothman

2002-03-05 Thread thew
Title: Re: [CTRL] test--Mothman



Belief is the opposite of knowing. You need beliefs, because not all theories are tested out yet  you do not know everything, but please  try to keep them separate. 


on 3/5/02 11:50 AM, Edward Britton at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Dale:


test

Belief is the enemy.
-- John A. Keel, The Mothman Prophecies 



John Keel was wrong: Insisting that others share X belief is the enemy. :-)


In religion and politics, there are two kinds of people: those who wish to control others and those who wish to remain free. The only means by which the former may reign over the latter is by deception, fear and force; by deluding those who enjoy God-given personal liberty into accepting empty promises of security, elaborate schemes of dependence and the propaganda of divisiveness.


Edward +



-- 
 Doubt. 
Doubt thyself.
Doubt even if thou doubtest thyself.
Doubt all.
Doubt even if thou doubtest all.
It seems sometimes as if beneath all conscious doubt
there lay some deepest certainty. O kill it! Slay the
snake!
The horn of the Doubt-Goat be exalted
Dive deeper, ever deeper, into the Abyss of Mind,
until thou unearth the fox THAT. On, hounds!
Yoicks! Tally-ho! Bring THAT to bay!
Then, wind the Mort!

Uncle Al. the kiddies pal




NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew 






Re: [CTRL] test--Mothman

2002-03-05 Thread Dale Stonehouse

-Caveat Lector-

And we come around to Keel again. Not just opposite, but the enemy of
knowing. This was in the context of his research on the Mothman. He felt the
beliefs of those seeing whatever they were seeing determined what they saw.
If they actually saw something which did not exist in their belief database
it was converted into an existing element of that database.

There is no reality, only perception. -- Dr. Phil McGraw

Belief is the opposite of knowing. You need beliefs, because not all
theories are tested out yet - you do not know everything, but please - try
to keep them separate.

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That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
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Re: [CTRL] test--Mothman

2002-03-05 Thread thew

-Caveat Lector-

As Bob Wilson said so eloquently :

Convictions cause Convicts



on 3/5/02 12:04 PM, Dale Stonehouse at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 -Caveat Lector-

 And we come around to Keel again. Not just opposite, but the enemy of
 knowing. This was in the context of his research on the Mothman. He felt the
 beliefs of those seeing whatever they were seeing determined what they saw.
 If they actually saw something which did not exist in their belief database
 it was converted into an existing element of that database.

 There is no reality, only perception. -- Dr. Phil McGraw

 Belief is the opposite of knowing. You need beliefs, because not all
 theories are tested out yet - you do not know everything, but please - try
 to keep them separate.



Free your mind and your ass will follow.
   St George


NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew

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sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
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Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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[CTRL] Potpourri

2002-03-05 Thread Dale Stonehouse




On May 31, 1998, at a seminar in St. Paul, MN, Dr. Fred Bell provided the
following information you may not have seen elsewhere in conspiracy
literature:
-- School shootings are being done by reincarnated members of Hitler's Youth,
who were the last 15,000-20,000 people to die in World War II.
-- Bees, which are too heavy to fly aerodynamically, use anti-gravity to stay
aloft.
-- Between Scearcy and Batesville, AR, in a place called Joe Brown Valley,
reside prehistoric beings such as Bigfoot. One tore the heads off 13 goats in a
rampage.
-- Hydrocarbons pollute air with positive ions. Without negative ions, the
human body cannot reproduce its cells.
-- (The late) Bill Cooper was a victim of NSC harassment. "He has a bad
attitude and beats people up," said Bell. "But I love the man."
-- "Bo Gritz is a friend of mine. He has been born again but I forgive him
for that.""
(The last two make an interesting juxtaposition since Gritz and the late Bill
Cooper were bitter enemies, Cooper hating Gritz for his Masonic membership and
Gritz questioning whether Cooper had any intelligence background at all.)
-- Bell, who has connections in the intelligence community, has developed an
anti-gray device and used it to run them out of their Dulce underground base.
One attacked him in the 4 corners area, coming within 100 feet in its UFO at 300
mph before turning off. "I've been attacked by grays many times since I found
their underground base," said Bell. "Once I got very sick and my wife nearly
died."
-- The grays are "evolved insects" who have no individual soul but are trying
to acquire them through research on humans they abduct at the astral level.
Their blood is chlorophyll based and they come here every 12,000 years when
human consciousness reached a high point in its cycle. "They want individual
souls but it will never happen," Bell said.
-- The rate of abduction is highest among Native Americans. "They lose
hundreds of kids, and 20,000 are abducted each year," said Bell, who has spent
much time on the Indian Reservations of the American Southwest.
-- Bell became a contactee while working for the 3rd Reich in his last life.
He was killed in 1942 and can remember the gun going off when he was shot. He
was born in 1943 and spoke German at birth. He used to hang out with Hermann
Goering and was buried with full honors by the 3rd Reich.
-- Bell's father, who was killed by Nazis in Egypt while searching for
artifacts, and Henry Ford were the best of friends. H.
-- ELF frequencies, used for submarine communication, have toxic effects on
humans. It enters your house through the ground and attacks biosystems. Your
refrigerator is a big culprit.
-- Implants are used to produce mass shootings. One murderer in Texas was
found to have 2 implants in his head.
-- Margaret Hapsburg of Palm Springs, CA, a Rothschild heir, had NSC security
protection at the time of her husband's death in part because they had four
grays living with them. She inherited one-twelfth of a $4.3 trillion estate. The
NSC-NSA has an $80 billion budget.
-- While in the US Air Force, Bell worked at Point Arena Radar Station in
California, where they saw UFOs zooming at 20,000 mph every night on radar. Each
morning when they left their duty stations security guards would shred their DDS
Form 332 which recorded the UFOs. Point Arena had the same radar array as
Montauk Point on Long Island.
-- The Roswell UFO crash(es) were caused by radar at Kirtland AFB in
Albuquerque.
"Belief is the enemy."
-- John A. Keel, The Mothman Prophecies 



Re: [CTRL] test--Mothman

2002-03-05 Thread Edward Britton

Belief is the opposite
of knowing.


For humans, there is no such thing as knowing.
Knowing is an arbitrary absolute. There are, however,
greater and lesser degrees of
understanding.



You need beliefs,
because not all theories are tested out yet you do not know
everything,


I need to eat/drink, sleep, breathe and eventually die.
I use beliefs to explain gaps in the logical sequence/flow of
information. I observed X and am now observing Z. I can only
speculate (believe) that something occurred in interval Y.




Edward +

If you have fifty problems and one of them is government, you have only
one problem.
http://www.global-connector.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/reality_pump/




Re: [CTRL] test--Mothman

2002-03-05 Thread Edward Britton

And we come around to
Keel again. Not just opposite, but the enemy of
knowing. This was in the context of his research on the Mothman. He felt
the
beliefs of those seeing whatever they were seeing determined what they
saw.
If they actually saw something which did not exist in their belief
database
it was converted into an existing element of that
database.


Closure, by any other name. . .?



There is no
reality, only perception.


Reality is a fluid, and like any fluid, it may be pumped :-)




Edward +

If you have fifty problems and one of them is government, you have only
one problem.
http://www.global-connector.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/reality_pump/




[CTRL] Fwd: Bodies found at Ga. crematory | The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

2002-03-05 Thread saba

The negro American who committed these atrocities, the lid has been put
on this and why was nothing done to the parents who owned and previously
rant this crematorium?

Because the Mother was a Democrat Official in the Democrat Party.   And
one can imagine what a cesspool that must be for there is no doubt in my
mind that there were those who knew what was going on.and nobody
ever noticed anything strange about this bastard?   Pornography in his
computer along with pictures of the dead bodies?

Did this filthy creep get his hands on the body of this little 11 year
old girl who died - so blonde and pale.this lewd and lascivicious
man - wonder if he read any of Larry Flynt's material for this seems to
be the major way to pass time these days with Democrat Party in
particular for they take his dirty money while the ADL launders it for
him.

OSaba

[The Atlanta Journal-Constitution: 3.05.2002]

Marsh bond denial linked to flight risk, his safety

Prosecutor: Pornography, pictures of corpses found in Marsh office,
computer

By NORMAN AREY

Atlanta Journal-Constitution Staff Writer
LaFayette -- The mystery of what has been going on at the Tri-State
Crematory, and why, took a new twist Monday as two previously held
theories were dismissed and some new evidence was introduced.

It started Monday during a bond hearing when the prosecution said it had
discovered pictures of dead bodies in various stages or decomposition,
and pornography on Ray Brent Marsh's computer, which was seized from
his home in Noble last week.

It ended with Georgia Emergency Management Agency Director Gary
McConnell confirming a WAGA television report from Sunday that the
machine used to cremate bodies in the Tri-State Crematorium had been
tested and found operable. Marsh had told authorities the machine had
broken down.

And in between, it was learned that of the 339 bodies discovered on the
property, none had been dated back past 1998. Officials previously
thought some of the bodies could have been on the Marsh property for 15
to 20 years.

The oldest we've been able to conclusively identify was 1998, said Dr.
Kris Sperry, Georgia chief medical examiner.

Magistrate Judge Jerry Day denied bond for Marsh on Monday, because it
has been determined that Marsh has become a flight risk and his safety
might be in peril.

Just yesterday, I was at a meeting where a man from Jasper said he'd
like to get his hands on Mr. Marsh, Walker County Sheriff Steve Wilson
testified. The mood in the county is such that I have never seen this
level of anger directed at one defendant.

District Attorney Buzz Franklin added that the Jasper man received a
thunderous ovation after his impassioned address to the crowd.

The total of 118 counts of theft by deception that have been filed
against Marsh is the most ever in Walker County.

After the hearing and the revelation of the computer pictures, questions
rose immediately about the possibility that the bodies had been sexually
abused. But Sperry put that to rest.

There has been nothing found and no reason to suspect that [sexual
abuse] would be part of the problem, Sperry said.

The state began draining the three-acre pond on Marsh's property where a
skull and torso had been discovered. Department of Natural Resources
spokesman Dr. Bert Langley said it will be Friday before crews can begin
examining the lake's bottom.

It'll probably be then before we can go in on flat-bottomed boats that
we can push around to get more than a cursory look, he said.

It'll be quite awhile before we have a dry bottom.

Back to top   |   ajc.com home
The Noble crematory case
 

 
Matthew, chapter 18

6: But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in
me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck,
and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.


---BeginMessage---

http://wwwaccessatlantacom/ajc/metro/crematory/0305noblehtml

---End Message---


Re: [CTRL] Potpourri

2002-03-05 Thread Joshua Tinnin

-Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: Dale Stonehouse [EMAIL PROTECTED]


 On May 31, 1998, at a seminar in St. Paul, MN, Dr. Fred Bell provided the
 following information you may not have seen elsewhere in conspiracy
 literature:

 -- School shootings are being done by reincarnated members of Hitler's
 Youth, who were the last 15,000-20,000 people to die in World War II.

Wow. Nope, hadn't heard that one.

 -- Bees, which are too heavy to fly aerodynamically, use anti-gravity to
 stay aloft.

This is obviously untrue. Check here for the physics:
http://www.sciam.com/2001/0601issue/0601dickinson.html

http://www.news.cornell.edu/releases/March00/APS_Wang.hrs.html

from link above:

Until recently, however, an embarrassing gap has marred our understanding
of insect flight: scientists have had a difficult time explaining the
aerodynamics of how insects generate the forces needed to stay aloft.

That difficulty has even made its way into an urban legend of science,
typically recounted as a scientist 'proved' that a bumblebee can't fly and
often cited as an inspiring example for persevering in the face of
overbearing dogma. The bumblebee story can be traced back to a 1934 book by
entomologist Antoine Magnan, who refers to a calculation by his assistant
André Sainte-Laguë, who was an engineer. The conclusion was presumably based
on the fact that the maximum possible lift produced by aircraft wings as
small as a bumblebee's wings and traveling as slowly as a bee in flight
would be much less than the weight of a bee.

In the decades since 1934, engineers and mathematicians have amassed a body
of aerodynamic theory sufficient to design Boeing 747s and stealth fighters.
As sophisticated as these aircraft may be, their design and function are
based on steady-state principles: the flow of air around the wings and the
resulting forces generated by that flow are stable over time. The reason
insects represent such a challenge is that they flap and rotate their wings
from 20 to 600 times a second. The resulting pattern of airflow creates
aerodynamic forces that change continually and confound both mathematical
and experimental analyses.

 -- Between Scearcy and Batesville, AR, in a place called Joe Brown Valley,
 reside prehistoric beings such as Bigfoot. One tore the heads off 13 goats
 in a rampage.

Hmmm ... Chupacabra? Did this Bigfoot drink their blood, too?

 -- Hydrocarbons pollute air with positive ions. Without negative ions, the
 human body cannot reproduce its cells.



 -- (The late) Bill Cooper was a victim of NSC harassment. He has a bad
 attitude and beats people up, said Bell. But I love the man.

 -- Bo Gritz is a friend of mine. He has been born again but I forgive him
 for that.

 (The last two make an interesting juxtaposition since Gritz and the late
 Bill Cooper were bitter enemies, Cooper hating Gritz for his Masonic
 membership and Gritz questioning whether Cooper had any intelligence
 background at all.)

Hmmm ... can't really comment on that. Their intertwining stories make for a
great drama, but it's just *too* much drama to sift through ...

 -- Bell, who has connections in the intelligence community, has developed
an
 anti-gray device and used it to run them out of their Dulce underground
 base. One attacked him in the 4 corners area, coming within 100 feet in
its
 UFO at 300 mph before turning off. I've been attacked by grays many times
 since I found their underground base, said Bell. Once I got very sick
and
 my wife nearly died.

Hmmm ... nevertheless, the Four Corners area is quite interesting. Crown
Point, NM, mentioned by myself below, is in that area.

 -- The grays are evolved insects who have no individual soul but are
 trying to acquire them through research on humans they abduct at the
astral
 level. Their blood is chlorophyll based and they come here every 12,000
 years when human consciousness reached a high point in its cycle. They
want
 individual souls but it will never happen, Bell said.

No soul? Why would a sentient being without a soul want one or even
realize that it exists, if it really does at all? Sounds like the Tin Man
wanting a heart ... then realizing he had one anyway. Such intangibles ...

 -- The rate of abduction is highest among Native Americans. They lose
 hundreds of kids, and 20,000 are abducted each year, said Bell, who has
 spent much time on the Indian Reservations of the American Southwest.

Now, this I find interesting, having grown up in the Southwest. Go hang out
in Crown Point, NM (Four Corners area), for a while and talk with some of
the people there. *Something* is going on, that's for sure.

 -- Bell became a contactee while working for the 3rd Reich in his last
life.
 He was killed in 1942 and can remember the gun going off when he was shot.
 He was born in 1943 and spoke German at birth. He used to hang out with
 Hermann Goering and was buried with full honors by the 3rd Reich.

Hmmm ...

 -- Bell's father, who was killed by 

Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Bodies found at Ga. crematory | The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

2002-03-05 Thread saba

-Caveat Lector-

Might add here, over 300 bodies found and more on the way and now this
Georgia bunch says oh we have been unabale to date any of the bodies
prior to 1998..really - they have only identified so far around 39
bodies at the reporting of this statement.

It would see the Democrat Party down there, this cess pool once call a
party that is, has a lot more to cover up than dead bodies.

Maybe the Old Line will come to the aid of their party.

OSaba

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==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!  These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Re: [CTRL] Bodies found at Ga. crematory | The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

2002-03-05 Thread Edward Britton

Colleen:



The negro
American


Relevance?



who committed
these atrocities, the lid has been put
on this 


Since when?! The whole gory story has been, or was, made the focus
of world wide attention for more than a week.



and why was nothing
done to the parents who owned and previously
rant this crematorium?


The word is ran, and charges against the Marsh family are
still pending.



Because the Mother was
a Democrat Official in the Democrat Party.


And you know this how?



 And
one can imagine what a cesspool that must be for there is no doubt in
my
mind that there were those who knew what was going
on


On this much, we are agreed. I live in Georgia (Atlanta), and most
of the news coverage here has indicated that locals within Noble, Georgia
were somewhat to keenly aware that something was amiss.



.and nobody
ever noticed anything strange about this bastard? Pornography
in his
computer along with pictures of the dead
bodies?


The two are separate: authorities found 1) pornography, and 2)
pictures of dead bodies on his computer. One may not necessarily
have anything to do with the other. At any one time, YOU might have
both in the cache of your computer without even realizing it. If
you've ever gone to a porn site or have been transferred to one, you have
pornography on your computer unless you clean out your cache on a regular
basis. Add to that mix any pictures of dead bodies which might be
there from news sites you've visited.



Did this filthy creep
get his hands on the body of this little 11 year
old girl who died - so blonde and pale.


What 11-year old girl? No mention was made of an 11 year old
girl in this article. In any case, READ this part again,
Colleen:


After the hearing and the revelation of the computer
pictures, questions rose immediately about the possibility that the
bodies had been sexually abused. But Sperry put that to rest.

There has been nothing found and no reason to suspect that
[sexual
abuse] would be part of the problem, Sperry said.



this lewd and lascivicious
man - wonder if he read any of Larry Flynt's material for this seems
to
be the major way to pass time these days with Democrat Party in
particular for they take his dirty money while the ADL launders it
for
him.

The Democratic Party may have perverts within its ranks, and true, the
party's political philosophy is decidedly twisted, but not all Democrats
are lewd, lascivious, necrophiles. Keep it honest if you
can't keep it clean, Colleen.




Edward +

If you have fifty problems and one of them is government, you have only
one problem.
http://www.global-connector.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/reality_pump/




Re: [CTRL] Bodies found at Ga. crematory | The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

2002-03-05 Thread saba

-Caveat Lector-

Edward there was a picture of this little girl, pale and blonde, and the
mother had had her ashes sent to a place where dolphins played because
this little girl loved dolphins.   The ashes this woman received were
god knows what.

This was prior to this crap.   And what does negro have to do with it?
Where the hell have you been.   The AFRI Asian war has already
started.look to Africa and what is happening down there to the white
farmers; look at America where the attempt has been made to disarm WHITE
Americans is the goal.

Look at this cess pool we once called America and look at Larry Flynt -
the world hates this country now as a Sodom and Gomorrah.

Now they butcher the children and now they desecrate the bodies of the
diead.

This man was BLACKand black means Nigerwhat would you prefer I
call this animal.

The parents?   Well one good source wrote to tell me of this connection
to the Democrat party.

I doubt very much he would just dump this body of this beautiful little
girl - hey Larry Flynt probably would buy the pictures.

I say this - I hope the REAL KKK gets that bastard, castrates him, and
dumps him in the sea in shoes of cement.

This free Jamal garge is also activating...this creep murdered a
copyand on this one bus in my area one of their sickos who was not
taking his memdication beat up a white man who had done nothing other
than get on a COTA bus.

I had to leave a night job with the newspaper because of these pigs on
the late bus, for I could not take the express.   One sweet negro for
othey are not black, they are brindle brown - pulled a machet knife
across the way and I pulled a police badge and he assumed I had a gun
and was part of a security on some busses.

I know what these people are likegeneralization - who and where will
you stand for the war has begun.

They are coming in for the kill and not being satisfied destroying
cities and rioting and just think the ADL and those pigs wanted to take
away our guns - the only thing that keeps these animals on their own
side of the line, is the gun and I mean big guns.  But not being
satisfied now they attack the dead?   Think this is isolated incident?
I do not.

They are robbing graves over America.

I do not like negros, I do not want to be around them.   Live and let
live.

But I say this, if Georgia does not do something about this famly and
have a railing party they deserve what they get.

The little girls picture is on the web but prior to this atrocity being
announced.

When I saw this creek had a casket in his backyard with a corpse still
in it - well what do you think he was doing - playing Dry Bones?

I am a segregationist by choice.   This man had a mother in the Democrat
Party structure and oh the Company of Undertakers will be ones
ultimately held reesonsible.   Would not be surprised if this bastard
did not provide the urgs for the World Trade Center.

Better read up on the Mau Mau.and consider Jesse Jackson threatening
to lloose his savages in the streets but keep in mind one thing - it is
our guns, that keep us safe and free -

And keep in mind the 18,000 Africans coming to our shores yearly who
must have AIDS and then preach this crap as Martin Luther King did and
that wasn ot his real name either, that he just wants to be a brother
and not brother in law.

I hope the KKK gets this creep and I hope they awaken soon before it is
too late.

You see I am not like Billy Graham, or Nixon, or Hill and Bill - when
pushed I tell you exactly what I think.   No mealy mouthed magnolia
mouthed words...I am a segregationist but if you want to live with
the negros, I could care less.

If you do not mind have negros maul the dead bodies of our chilldren,
and loved ones - fine.   You are such a sensitive man.

And if you do not mind turning your country over to Zulus and savages a
alittle over 100 years away from cannibalism, I do not care but keep
them off my turf.

The line is drawn, here.

OSaba

You see the negros have their NAACP, the Jews have their Jewish Defense
League and ADL - but tell me, Edward - what does the white folk have, us
pore white folk and I will tell you - we have our guns and i dare the
creeps to cross my line.

A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
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screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!  These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
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credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Re: [CTRL] USA MURDERS 30 MILLION PERSONS WITH THE HIV DISEASE

2002-03-05 Thread Mike Clark

-Caveat Lector-

 Progress on creating an IMMUNE RAVAGING MICROORGANISM which would be 
RACIALLY SPECIFIC

 was started in 1902 when FRANCIS PEYTON ROUS discovered the chicken 
sarcoma virus.


 This secret program was stepped up in 1961 because of the CIVIL 
RIGHTS MOVEMENT in the UNITED STATES.

 The 1961 program was FUNDED by ROCKEFELLER MONEY and labeled the 
SPECIAL VIRUS CANCER PROJECT.


 You can download the HIV FLOWCHART by going to BOYD GRAVES website.

 www.boydgraves.com


 Now we find there is a SECRET IMMUNITY to HIV.  Persons of CAUCASIAN 
HERITAGE from the northern most

 parts of EUROPE have TWO GENES which REFUSE to accept the HIV VIRUS 
into their WHITE BLOOD CELLS

 NUCLEUS.   This is called the CCR5 IMMUNITY to HIV.   Why do you 
suppose this hasnt been on mainstream

 television.


 It seems that a CONSIDERABLE PORTION of the BRITISH POPULATION are 
TOTALLY IMMUNE TO HIV.


 http://www.geocities.com/endeavour_uksa/article.html

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That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
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Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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Re: [CTRL] Boycott Mel Gibson's We Were Soldiers

2002-03-05 Thread Euphorian

-Caveat Lector-

On 5 Mar 2002 at 11:11, thew wrote:

 War films always do well when the right is in power.
 Welcome to the zeitgeist.

Like *Saving Pvt Ryan*?

AER

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That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
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Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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[CTRL] Sludge Report #126 – Truth, Peace Love (Part 1)

2002-03-05 Thread RoadsEnd

-Caveat Lector-

Click Here: A HREF=http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0203/S00023.htm;
Scoop: Sludge Report #126 – Truth, Peace  Love…/A
-


Sludge Report #126 – Truth, Peace  Love (Part 1)
Tuesday, 5 March 2002, 2:26 pm
Column: C.D. Sludge

In This Edition: Unpleasant Thoughts, Truth, Peace  Love - First Some Quotes
- Immediate Threats To Peace And Security – Who Is The Enemy?
NOTE: Authors of this report will be anonymous and wide ranging, and
occasionally finely balanced. Indeed you are invited to contribute: The
format is as a reporters notebook. It will be published as and when material
is available. C.D. Sludge can be contacted at [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Sludge
Report is available as a free email service..Click HERE -
http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/myscoop/  to subscribe...
Sludge Report #126
Unpleasant Thoughts, Truth, Peace  Love
This Sludge Report introduces what will become a five part series attempting
to shed light on the State of the World, and why - for the sake of self
preservation - we all need to do something about it urgently.
In upcoming parts this series will focus on asking questions about matters
which you most probably have not thus far thought about, but which disclose a
new map to the world in which you live. You are invited to challenge all that
we write, for it is only by questioning what you are told that you can find
the truth.
Sludge readers who find this process enlightening are invited to forward this
and subsequent parts in the series to friends, acquaintances and even enemies
who in turn might be in need of a little enlightenment.
**
First Some Quotes (For Inspiration And To Set The Tone)
“A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy
enough people to make it worth the effort.”  - Herm Albright
(After noting that the U.S. is back bombing Afghanistan again ). “You know I
can picture a world without war. But then I can picture the Americans bombing
it…… Okay lets cheer someone up.”  - Julian Byrne – Wellington ZMFM afternoon
radio host Monday, 04 March 2002, 3.43pm before making a listener competition
phone call. ZMFM is the top rating commercial music station in Wellington the
capital city in New Zealand.
“Turn the enemy into a laughing matter”  - Catherine Austin Fitts
“That the Gods will destroy they will first make ludicrous” - Greek
Philosopher
“Truth is beauty, beauty truth. That's all you know of life, and all you need
to know.” - Keats
**
Our Millennial Crisis
The world is now well into what might be best described as it’s second
millennial crisis.
The financial, military and political firmament is rapidly becoming a
quagmire. What was once predictable, isn’t. Anxiety rather than security has
become the overarching tone of the zeitgeist.
Ask yourself honestly this question: Do you seriously believe George W. Bush,
Donald Rumsfeld and Dick Cheney are going to win their war against terrorism
and restore order and sanity to planet earth?
If your answer is no then you are not alone. Even George, Donald and Dick
themselves don’t seriously think there war is winnable any time soon. In
launching his battle against evildoers George himself said he expected it
would take years if not decades.
Meanwhile the U.S. Congress too is beginning to wonder just what it is that
the Commander in Chief and his advisers have in mind for the rest of planet
in general, and for Yemen, Somalia, the Phillipines and Iraq in particular.
Fortunately all crises - as Sludge has often observed before - are also
opportunities for reversal of fortune, potential moments of catharsis.
That is, it is invariably at times of crisis that both the happiest and the
most sorrowful things happen.
Back in 1999, just when it appeared East Timor would turn into a blood bath,
contrary to all predictions the peace-keepers were let in. More recently, in
Afghanistan, just when the idea of a unified Afghani administration (and an
end to tribal infighting in Afghanistan) seemed a hopeless pipedream, a UN
conference in Bonn produced exactly that.
Peace is far more resilient that it appears.
Less obviously the daily work of millions of well-intentioned and faithful
people to make the world a better and safer place, and their small victories,
serve ends which we might also applaud.
But unfortunately, “Crisis Averted”, makes a lousy headline and such so such
victories tend to go unnoticed in the media.
Nevertheless this quiet, background work with the objective of well-being for
all, and the good fortune that accompanies it does have a name, grace. And
while the odds against peace sometimes seem overwhelming it is important to
always remember that the peace-loving, kind and gentle have always hugely
outnumbered the war-lovers, even if they have seldom held court in the
corridors of power.
And so it is a function of the analytical side of the media, and the
inquisitive among the public, to illuminate the grace around us, to look out
for the disasters waiting to happen in 

[CTRL] Fwd: The Next Enron?

2002-03-05 Thread RoadsEnd



---BeginMessage---

* * * * * * * * * * * * REMINDER * * * * * * * * * * * * *

On the days that I don't publish, like today, you receive
Bill Bonner's DAILY RECKONING. This will help you to keep
pace with the changes in the markets.  Bonner and I agree
on most things in the field of economics, so the two letters
reinforce each other.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

The Next Enron?

THE DAILY RECKONING

PARIS, FRANCE

TUESDAY, 5 MARCH 2002

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

*** It's a BULL MARKET!!! Everybody says so...

*** Keeping the powder dry...waiting for the dollar to
fall... and paying tribute to sunny optimism...

*** The Lady 'Buffette' wins big... broken spirits,
hunched shoulders... and so much more it will make your
head spin!

I'm getting murdered, a friend said to me at dinner on
Saturday night.

Guillaume imports lawn care products from America and
sells them in France. The products are good, he says.
But the dollar is so high he can't sell them. This is a
big part of the reason why U.S. corporations have just
suffered their biggest drop in earnings since WWII...
and why manufacturing output has fallen for more
consecutive months than at any time since the Great
Depression.

I'm just waiting for the dollar to go down, Guillaume
continued. It has to go down sooner or later, doesn't
it? Or America will go out of business!

It is remarkable how little the world has changed in the
last two weeks. We are still on the edge of our seats...
waiting for things that have not happened yet.

Stocks are still priced as though we were at the top of
a bubble market. The dollar is still regarded as though
it would last forever. And Americans still spend money
as if they had some.

The world shuddered when the World Trade center towers
came down. But according to the latest statistics, it
soon returned to business more-or-less as usual. And
recession? Forget it. It never happened. The airlines
are full. Bars are crowded. Reservations are once-again
advised for good restaurants.

A new bull market has begun on Wall Street. At least,
everybody says so.

Right Eric?

   *

Eric Fry in New York...

- Stocks are soaring...everywhere! Across every time
zone, the financial markets are smiling on the bulls.
Japan's Nikkei 225 Index led the Asian markets with a
sparkling 6% rally - its biggest one-day gain in almost
a year. Heading east, Russian stocks jumped 4.4%,
bringing their considerable gains in 2002 to more than
25%.

- The stock-buying wave continued rolling east (somehow
making its way past the Maginot Line), buoying share
prices as it swept across the European bourses, before
finally splashing up on the shores of lower Manhattan,
home to the NYSE.

- Here in New York, where we put the bull in
bullishness, the Dow gained 217 points to 10,586. The
Nasdaq soared more than 3% to 1,859.

- This latest stock market rally in the States has all
the classic signs of a short-squeeze: the move is
abrupt, ferocious and led by stocks better known for
their recent problems than for their considerable
virtues.

- For example, the beleaguered banking giant, J.P.
Morgan Chase, led the blue chips with a 10% gain.
Similarly, Cisco and Tyco - two companies beset by
accounting concerns - both surged about 10%. Even truly
marginal companies like Providian Financial managed to
tack on 12%.

- When the market rallies violently, as it has the past
several days, the stocks of troubled companies sometimes
climb more than good companies, explains C.A. Green,
Investment Director of The Oxford Club. The reason,
ironically, is short covering... When the market starts
to really gather steam, short sellers often panic and
buy to cover their positions. The higher prices then
cause other short sellers to cover as well, adding fuel
to the fire.

- Green is keeping his powder dry while awaiting for
this rally to exhaust itself.

- Last weekend, Green continues, I spent over an hour
on the phone with Jim Rogers, the former partner of
legendary hedge fund manager George Soros. Jim believes,
as I do, that many of the best opportunities in the
month ahead will be on the short side. He said
individual investors are going to have to learn to sell
short if they want to make money in the volatile
financial markets we're experiencing.

- Not all investors, however, possess the mutant gene
that predisposes a person to short-selling. For the vast
majority of investors - the kind of folks who invest
hoping stocks will go up, not down - the recent rally on
Wall Street is welcome relief.

- For them, the cause of a rally is about as important
as the color of a free Ferrari. Gains in the market are
no less valuable for having been produced by short-
covering. But it's helpful to remember that short-
covering rallies tend to be short and swift - often
reversing their moves very quickly. And since stocks are
still expensive, in fact more so than three days ago,
and since corporate CFOs 

[CTRL] Insanity Unleashed! (was: Bodies found at Ga. crematory)

2002-03-05 Thread Edward Britton

Colleen:



Edward there was a picture of this
little girl,


Where? I haven't seen this picture. Was she cremated at the
Marsh crematorium?



pale and blonde,
and the
mother had had her ashes sent to a place where dolphins played
because
this little girl loved dolphins. The ashes this woman
received were
god knows what.


Precisely. Unless she happened to pay attention to the contents of
the urn before it was placed where dolphins played, then only
God knows where her remains really are. We do not.



This was prior to this
crap.


If it was prior to this crap, how do we know they are even related?



 And what
does negro have to do with it?


I don't know. That's why I asked :-)



Where the hell have
you been.


Obviously not trying to tie particular crimes to particular
races--Muslims notwithstanding :-)



 The AFRI
Asian war has already
started


What does an AFRI-Asian war have to do with a crematorium in
Noble, Georgia?



.look to Africa and
what is happening down there to the white
farmers;


What does the plight of white farmers in Africa have to do with a crime
committed in Noble, Georgia. Try to maintain focus, Colleen
:-)



look at America
where the attempt has been made to disarm WHITE
Americans is the goal.


Actually, the attempt to disarm Americans knows no racial bounds--even if
that had anything to do with crematoriums or cremations :-)



Look at this cess pool
we once called America and look at Larry Flynt -
the world hates this country now as a Sodom and
Gomorrah.


That may be because we have abandoned our moral center, but the issue was
whether race had anything to do with a propensity for committing a
specific crime.



Now they butcher the
children and now they desecrate the bodies of the
diead.


Who's they? Only one person has been accused of this
crime in the article you forwarded.



This man was
BLACKand black means Nigerwhat would you prefer I
call this animal.


An animal perhaps, but animals come in all shapes, sizes and
colors.



The
parents? Well one good source wrote to tell me of this
connection
to the Democrat party.


ROFL! And this good source wouldn't happen to believe
in chemtrails, UFO's and/or shape-shifting reptilian royalty would
they? :-)



I doubt very much he
would just dump this body of this beautiful little
girl


Upon what do you base your doubts?



I say this - I hope
the REAL KKK gets that bastard, castrates him, and
dumps him in the sea in shoes of cement.


Remind me to have you disqualified from my pool of jurors if I'm ever
accused of a crime. 

I'd wager that you wouldn't even feel guilty for this statement if you
found out tomorrow that this man had been set up or was taking the fall
for some other family member.



This free Jamal garge
is also activating...


What is free Jarnal garge?



this creep murdered
a
copyand on this one bus in my area one of their sickos who was
not
taking his memdication beat up a white man who had done
nothing other
than get on a COTA bus.


What are you on, Colleen? This statement makes no sense
whatsoever.



I had to leave a night
job with the newspaper because of these pigs on
the late bus, for I could not take the express.


What in the hell are you talking about?!



 One sweet
negro for othey are not black, they are brindle brown - pulled a machet
knife
across the way and I pulled a police badge and he assumed I had a
gun
and was part of a security on some busses.


Colleen, please don't take this the wrong way, but you need MAJOR
help. Shut your computer down and go seek counseling before you
become dangerous.



I know what these
people are likegeneralization -


BIG TIME!!



who and where
will
you stand for the war has begun.


I fight for me and mine.



They are coming in for
the kill and not being satisfied destroying
cities and rioting and just think the ADL and those pigs wanted to
take
away our guns - the only thing that keeps these animals on their
own
side of the line, is the gun and I mean big guns. But not
being
satisfied now they attack the dead?


ONE MAN, Colleen. ONE MAN! This is NOT a government
conspiracy. This is about ONE presumably sick bastard in rural
northern Georgia. That's ALL.



 Think
this is isolated incident?


Generally, yes.



I do
not.


Crack kills, Colleen. Seek help.



I do not like
negros,


Negroes, and no shit! :-)



I do not want to
be around them. Live and let
live.


Yeah, right. Live and let live--except when you're sending the KKK out to
castrate one of them for a crime he MAY have committed. Oh, and did
I mention I was black? It says so right on my high school
transcript :-)



But I say this, if
Georgia does not do something about this famly and
have a railing party they deserve what they
get.


Who, everybody in the state, the courts or the jury?



The little girls
picture is on the web but prior to this atrocity being
announced.


A URL would be helpful. :-)



When I saw this creek
had a casket in his backyard with a 

[CTRL] Mid East Econo Mix

2002-03-05 Thread Euphorian

-Caveat Lector-

From
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/index.html

}}}Begin
The Middle East Economies: The Impact of Domestic and International Politics

Eliyahu Kanovsky

Mideast Security and Policy Studies
Number 31, February 1997
Begin-Sadat Center for Strategic Studies
Bar-Ilan University



Introduction
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap1.html

Israel's Economy--Successes and Problems
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap2.html

The Palestinian Economy--One Big Mess
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap3.html

Jordan: From Prosperity to Crisis
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap4.html

Egypt's Economy--Perpetually in Ruins?
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap5.html

Saudi Arabia--A Giant on Clay Feet
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap6.html

How Well (or How Poorly) is the Syrian Economy Doing?
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap7.html

Food for Thought
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap8.html

Conclusion
http://www.biu.ac.il/SOC/besa/books/kanov/chap9.html

Eliyahu Kanovsky is Professor of Economics at Bar-Ilan University, Senior Research
Associate at the Begin-Sadat Center for Strategic Studies, and Ludwig Jesselson
Visiting Professor of Economics at Yeshiva University.

Last Update:March 26, 1998
End{{{~~~
Forwarded as information only; no endorsement to be presumed
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not believe in anything simply because it is written in Holy Scriptures. Do not
believe in anything merely on the authority of Teachers, elders or wise men.
Believe only after careful observation and analysis, when you find that it
agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all.
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It is preoccupation with possessions, more than anything else, that
prevents us from living freely and nobly. -Bertrand Russell
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
Everyone has the right...to seek, receive and impart
information and ideas through any media and regardless
of frontiers.
Universal Declaration of Human Rights
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will
teach you to keep your mouth shut.
--- Ernest Hemingway

A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
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screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!  These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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[CTRL] Smile! You're on Candid Camera!

2002-03-05 Thread Euphorian

-Caveat Lector-

From Arabia.Com

}}}Begin
To print: Select File and then Print from your browser's menu
--
This story was printed from http://www.arabia.com, News channel.
--
US breaks up major Israeli spy ring

March 04, 2002, 01:33 PM TABRIYYEH

US authorities have broken a network of Israeli spies living in the United States who
were burrowing into the justice and defence departments.

Intelligence Online, a French website specialising in intelligence matters, said it had
exclusive access to a US justice department report that showed a huge Israeli spy
ring operating in the United States was rolled up by the Justice Department's
counter-espionage service last year.

Around 120 Israelis were arrested or deported as a result of the top-secret operation,
which it said had began in April last year and was ongoing.

The website said the ring was active in the states of Arkansas, California, Florida and
Texas, and was made up of around 20 cells of between four and eight members who
were aged between 22 and 30 and had recently completed Israeli military service in
an army intelligence division.

It named several Israelis alleged to be the espionage operatives, including three of
13 Israeli art students it said were arrested in the Texan city of Irving on March 26
and 27 last year.

Intelligence Online editor-in-chief Guillaume Dasquie told AFP the network had been
trying to penetrate justice department and defence department systems through
drug-fighting agencies such as the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA), which
has access to files from other US departments.

The DEA plays a central role in counter-espionage because of its internal security
service, the Office of Security Programs, which was the first to notice the unusual
behaviour of young Israeli nationals among its agents, Dasquie said.

His website said the network's objectives included some of the most sensitive sites in
the United States, such as the Tinker Air Force Base located close to Oklahoma City.

It said the US Air Force had requested the help of the Justice Department last May in
the investigation against the Israelis.

Dasquie said US investigators were concerned by indications that some of the
alleged Israeli spies had been based in the same US cities as people suspected of
having helped in the logistics of the devastating September 11 attacks on New York
and Washington.

For instance, it had been established, he said, that a dozen Israelis, including the
alleged surveillance leader, had been based in the Florida town of Hollywood
between January and June last year.

US authorities have arrested another dozen people suspected of being tasked with
the logistics of preparing the September 11 attacks in the same area, he noted.

Dasquie stressed, however, that the troubling coincidence was still only one theory
being looked into and that there was not enough information to determine whether
Israel's Mossad secret service had been aware of the preparations for the
September attacks.

It has to be verified if these teams were in the same place at the same time before
hypotheses are built up, he said.
End{{{~~~
Forwarded as information only; no endorsement to be presumed
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material
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expressed a prior interest in receiving this type of information
for non-profit research and educational purposes only.
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The only real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking
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Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe
simply because it has been handed down for many generations. Do not
believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do
not believe in anything simply because it is written in Holy Scriptures. Do not
believe in anything merely on the authority of Teachers, elders or wise men.
Believe only after careful observation and analysis, when you find that it
agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all.
Then accept it and live up to it.
The Buddha on Belief, from the Kalama Sutta
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
A merely fallen enemy may rise again, but the reconciled
one is truly vanquished. -Johann Christoph Schiller,
 German Writer (1759-1805)
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
It is preoccupation with possessions, more than anything else, that
prevents us from living freely and nobly. -Bertrand Russell
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
Everyone has the right...to seek, receive and impart
information and ideas 

[CTRL] Religious violence

2002-03-05 Thread Dale Stonehouse

-Caveat Lector-

from: http://www.ahpweb.org/pub/perspective/saharasia.html

AHP PERSPECTIVE June/July 2000 Table of Contents
SAHARASIA: The 4000 BCE
Origins of Child Abuse, Sex Repression, Warfare and Social Violence in the
Deserts of the Old World
By James DeMeo, Ph.D.
Greensprings, OR: Orgone Biophysical Research Laboratory, 1998.
Reviewed by Paul Von Ward

Today, we see too few big books with big ideas. If for no other reason,
James DeMeo's magnum opus deserves the attention of all concerned about the
roots of violent human behavior. As the title suggests, he attempts to pin
down the origins of institutionalized violence, the source for so much pain
in society and a conundrum for the field of psychology.

Some of his big questions should titillate your questing mind. Are humans
innately violent, due either to original sin or faulty genes. Are truly
peaceful societies possible? With so much media attention to sex, why is
there so little profound sexuality in modern society? Why are overtly
religious nations so violent? How do politics and business contribute to
social violence?

There are additional compelling reasons to spend time with this broadly
researched and provocative volume: DeMeo reminds us of the relevance of
Wilhelm Reich's largely unknown, ignored, or suppressed contributions to
developmental psychology. DeMeo's (and Reich's) hypothesis stimulates
re-examination of currently competing theories of personality development.
Documentation of patrist/armored/patriarchal/dominator behavior patterns
versus those of the Yin polarity in world cultures is very well presented.
He makes clear just how repressive and anti-human most societies, including
our own, remain, as we begin the 21st century. His findings suggest that our
modern concepts of social control and jurisprudence only reinforce the
historically rooted, violent traditions we allegedly abhor. In other words,
our self-serving, repressive institutions and social values cause the
violence-youth and adult-that we pretend is beyond our understanding and
control.
DeMeo believes his work supports Reich's thesis that human armoring, a
defensive personality, results from painful social and physical
environmental factors. Thus, he concludes, that the apparent correlation of
repressive, abusive, and violent behaviors in societies undergoing harsh
environmental shifts millennia ago confirms a geographic basis for such
human behavior.

The focal point of his work is the region he calls Saharasia, the primarily
desert area that encompasses most of North Africa, the Near East and Central
Asia. Truly a Renaissance Man with graduate training in geography, DeMeo
assembled data that tracks the Saharasian transition from a fertile,
nurturing environment to its current harsh, arid state. Describing Saharasia
around 10,000 BP, he says it possessed a relatively moist and lush
environment, thick with grasses, trees, lakes, rivers, swamps, and a
plethora of large and small animals. Neolithic hunters ranged over it,
engaging in animal herding and limited agriculture. The region began to
experience extreme droughts five or six thousand years ago and, over time,
turned into the desert we know today.

With archaeological and anthropological data, DeMeo pinpoints the appearance
of what he calls patrist cultures in this region. He theorizes that these
violent, sadistic cultures arose in reaction to the increasingly harsh
environment, where resources became scarce and the basic necessities of life
were difficult to come by. He suggests the biometeorological effects of
drought and famine, with the trauma of competition for food and water, could
have led to irritability and conflict. From this plausible assumption, he
extrapolates the assertion that such disturbed cultures therefore developed
formal patterns of violence, including genital mutilations, sacrifice,
torture, etc.

These formal patterns in patrist cultures, or subcultures in a larger
society, include:
* repressive patriarchal institutions and deities,
* castes and classes that may include slavery,
* low attention to infant needs, and * painful male and female initiation
rites.

These societies punish sexual expression, subordinate females, inflict pain
and trauma on the young, murder widows and female infants, and torture and
execute criminals. The resulting authoritarian society suppresses healthy
pleasures, creating guilt-ridden, repressive personalities that are violence
prone. Individual members manifest what Reich called armored character
structures. Such people direct their violence not only at established
victims (children, females, submissive males) in their own group, but toward
outsiders whom they perceive as different. (These attributes apply just as
much to modern, industrial cultures as they do to more traditional ones. And
the suppression of natural pleasure-seeking emotions may be done by force,
rules, or drugs-as is now shown in British research on the use of Prozac.)

A matrist culture, in 

[CTRL] Fw: BOSNIA - TERRORIST SUPPLIES FOUND IN NATO RAID (FEB 22/AP)

2002-03-05 Thread Mrs. Jela Jovanovic




  BOSNIA - TERRORIST SUPPLIES FOUND IN NATO RAID 
(FEB 22/AP)  ASSOCIATED PRESS -- A senior U.S. official said 
NATO authorities who raided a Saudi aid agency in Bosnia last fall found 
computer files containing photographs of terrorist targets and street 
maps of Washington with government buildings marked, reports the 
Associated Press, citing a senior U.S. official.  
 When the Sarajevo office of the Saudi High Commissioner for Aid 
to Bosnia was raided, officials found a computer program explaining 
how to use crop-duster aircraft to spread pesticide, and materials 
used to make fake U.S. State Dept. identification badges and 
credit cards.   Also discovered were photos of 
the World Trade Center, the Pentagon, the USS Cole and the U.S. 
embassies in Kenya and Tanzania that were attacked in 1998, the American 
official said.  



Re: [CTRL] Fwd: CONTRAILS....... Update on our weird weather....

2002-03-05 Thread Tenorlove

-Caveat Lector-

Since I last reported, I haven't seen any more, the temperature has
dropped to near zero, and apparently all I had was a simple cold. But
Gov. McGreevy (sp?) declared a drought emergency in the entire state of
New Jersey yesterday, and NJN News reported that thousands of wells
went dry this past year. I'm hoping for a rainy spring, followed by a
hot humid summer, which will make my garden happy. Think the HAARPies
are listening?

Tenorlove

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DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!  These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Om



[CTRL] Fwd: LeMonde on the Israeli Spy Ring in U.S.

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon



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 THIS STORY NO LONGER EXISTS

  MAJOR ISRAELI SPY SCANDAL UNFOLDING ONCE AGAIN

MID-EAST REALITIES - www.MiddleEast.Org - Washington - 3/05/2002:
Just a few months ago, in December of last year, FOX News ran a major 4-part 
expose on Israeli spying in the U.S.   The story was hightlighted on consecutive days 
on FOX News TV and was published in a major way on their Internet site.  It was at the 
time said to be the biggest story about Israeli spying ever, with more than sixty 
Israelis held in custody at that time.  
   Tremendous pressure was brought to bear in a coverup in which the U.S. government 
is now thought to have participated.   And in an unprecedented move FOX News not only 
did no further broadcast stories about this matter but even removed the stories from 
its website.  This story no longer exists is what FOX has to say about the matter.  
But now the story is comng back to life, not in the U.S. so far, but in foreign 
publications, including France's most important newspaper, Le Monde:



   FRENCH REPORTS:  U.S. BUSTS BIG ISRAELI SPY RING

[PARIS (Reuters - 5 March)] - The French daily Le Monde reported on Tuesday that the 
United States had broken up a huge Israeli spy ring that may have trailed suspected al 
Qaeda members in the United States without informing federal authorities.   

The newspaper cited a secret U.S. government report outlining spying activities by 
Israelis that it said contained elements (that) support the theory that Israel did 
not give the U.S. all the information it had about the planning for the September 11 
attacks.   

In Washington, however, U.S. law enforcement officials discounted the report, with one 
calling the assertion of a spy ring a bogus story.

Le Monde said the secret study said the Israelis posed as graphic arts students and 
tried to enter buildings belonging to the Drug Enforcement  Administration and other 
U.S. agencies.   

Intelligence Online, a Paris-based newsletter that reported on the study  Monday, said 
some 120 Israeli spies had been arrested or expelled and inquiries were continuing.   

Asked by Reuters Monday about the Intelligence Online report, an FBI spokesman flatly 
called it a bogus story. The spokesman said: There wasn't a spy ring.   

In Washington on Tuesday, U.S. Justice Department spokeswoman Susan Dryden said of the 
Le Monde report, At this time, we have no information to support this.   

U.S. officials said some Israeli students had been sent out of the country for 
immigration violations, not for spying.   

In Israel on Monday, a spokesman said the prime minister had no comment  on the 
matter.   

Le Monde reported Intelligence Online's findings and added elements it said its 
reporters had uncovered.   

A vast Israeli espionage network operating on American territory has been broken up, 
it wrote.   

The French newspaper described it as the biggest Israeli spy case in the United States 
to be made public since 1986, a reference to the life sentence given Jonathan Pollard, 
an American Jew who passed U.S. military secrets to Israel.   

The Pollard affair strained relations between the United States and Israel, two 
traditionally close allies.   

Guillaume Dasquie, editor of Intelligence Online, told Reuters Monday the report did 
not specify exactly what information the alleged agents were seeking.   

The report shows the clandestine network was engaged in several intelligence 
operations. It was a long-term project, he said.   

Le Monde said it published excerpts from the introduction of the June 2001 report, 
including a comment that the women in the spy ring were usually very attractive.   

 AL QAEDA LINK?   

Le Monde said more than one third of the suspected Israeli spies had lived in Florida, 
where at least 10 of the 19 Arabs involved in the Sept. 11 airplane attacks on New 
York's World Trade Center and the Pentagon also lived.

At least five of the spies resided in Hollywood, Florida, where alleged hijacker 
Mohammad Atta and four accomplices in the attacks also lived, the paper said.   

The United States holds Saudi-born Osama bin Laden's al Qaeda network responsible for 
the September attacks.   

Two Israelis lived in Fort Lauderdale, near Delray Beach, where 

[CTRL] Fw: SUPORTING PRESIDENT MILOSEVIC IS FIGHTING AGAINST FASCISM AND MILITARISM !

2002-03-05 Thread Mrs. Jela Jovanovic

-Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: ICDSM [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 9:56 PM
Subject: SUPORTING PRESIDENT MILOSEVIC IS FIGHTING AGAINST FASCISM AND
MILITARISM !


 Symposium of Berlin (2 march 2002) about THE
 MILOSEVIC CASE - INTERNATIONAL CRIMINAL JURIDICTION
 AND THE NEW WARS OF THE GREAT POWERS  (organized on
 the invitation of the Berlin-Schöneberg/Tempelhof
 Branch of the Party of Democratic Socialism/PDS by the
 German Section of the International Committee to
 Defend Slobodan Milosevic) :

 Intervention of Luc MICHEL,
 Chairman of the Frenchspeaking Section
 of the ICDSM

 SUPORTING PRESIDENT MILOSEVIC IS FIGHTING AGAINST
 FASCISM AND MILITARISM !

 Dear comrades,

 I give to all of you the greeting from the militants
 of the frenchspeaking section of ICDSM in Belgium,
 France, Switzerland  and now Quebecq. It's good for us
 to see here so many people fighting united for justice
 !
 I want to thank you too for the warm reception here in
 Berlin that show me that the spirit of  friendship of
 the other Germany is still alive.

 I have read in a French newspaper that Milosevic is a
 new Hitler. It's the key of the NATO's propaganda
 against Milosevic. So, I want to explain you why
 suporting President Milosevic is fighting against
 fascism and militarism.
 Speaking of the Milosevic case is speaking about
 NATO and Imperialism.
 Speaking about the Yugoslavia of Milosevic is speaking
 also of the collapse of the Soviet Union a decade ago.
 In that time, NATO claims the victory of the so-called
 western democracy.
 To the name of the New World Order, NATO announced
 the end of history. In fact, NATO wanted the end of
 the memory ! Like in Berlin, They destroyed all over
 monuments against militarism and Fascism. But
 militarism of NATO and new fascism of the American
 imperialism followed their bloody run.

 Their first victims was the Yugoslavia of Milosevic
 and especially the Serbian people.
 Thanks to NATO, and especially to American and German
 imperialism, the collapse of the second Yugoslavia
 followed immediatly these of Soviet Union.
 Thanks to NATO, the direct heirs of fascist Croation
 USTASCHA seize the power in Croatia.
 Thanks to NATO, five decades after second worl war,
 the bombs of militarism hit again Beograd and
 Yugoslavia.
 After the collapse of the USSR, far-right ethnic
 nationalists in Croatia and Bosnia launched civil wars
 that were tearing the country apart. The U.S. and
 German governments and secret services backed these
 right-wing forces, especially the neo-fascist Franjo
 Tudjman in Croatia and the Alija Izetbegovic regime in
 Bosnia.

 President Milosevic was in that times the only one to
 say No. No to NATO and imperialism, no to the
 liquidation of Socialism and the collapse of
 multinational Yugoslavia.
 In that time of world triumph of the New World
 Order, Milosevic was the first to organise resistance
 in Europe.
 As president Milosevic pointed out a few days ago in
 The Hague, only the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia
 which now exists, retained its multiethnic makeup.
 There were no expulsions, from the beginning to the
 end of the Yugoslav crisis.. After the
 imperialist-backed forces won, half a million Serbs
 were expelled from Croatia,  Bosnia was split in
 three ethnic regions, and virtually all non-Albanians
 were driven from Kosovo.
 In his adress to the Yugoslavian people of May 8
 '2000, President Milosevic made a direct link with the
 antifascist Resistance of World War II and his fight
 against NATO agression in Yugoslavia and Eastern
 Europa.

 All the Milosevic case is there. And all of that
 explain the hate and lies of the western propaganda
 against him. The so-called International Criminal
 Tribunal for former Yugoslavia (ICTY) is only a
 sequel of that.

 Since its creation by the NATO, the so-called
 International Criminal Tribunal for former
 Yugoslavia (ICTY) is a war machine leaded against the
 Serbian People and its defenders, in Yugoslavia and in
 Republika Srpska (Bosnia). Directly financed by NATO,
 the International Criminal Tribunal and his slavish
 magistrates abiding by the orders of Washington, is a
 shame to all the magistracy and the international
 judicial world.
 The proceedings they use - secret charging, anonymous
 evidences without any proofs, kidnapping of the
 accused regardless of the international law, automatic
 presumption of guiltiness of the accused,
 investigations in accusation and not in defence, and
 so on. - remind us of the sinister inquisition and
 would deserve a non-admissibility of the charging in
 any independent court of law , starting with those in
 the USA.
 The detention conditions in the ICTY jails are also
 outrageous. Especially the medical help brought to the
 prisoners , the behaviour of the medical staff of the
 ITCY prison is also a shame to all the medical world.
 These are instances that are enough as proofs.
 The 

[CTRL] Theories are not Theorems

2002-03-05 Thread Euphorian

-Caveat Lector-

From WorkForChange


}}}Begin
When conspiracy theories go bad

David Corn - WorkingForChange

03.04.02 - Please stop sending me those emails. You know who are. And you know
what emails I mean ... Okay, I'll spell it out -- those forwarded emails suggesting, or
flat-out stating, the CIA and the U.S. government were somehow involved in the
horrific September 11 attacks.

There are emails about a fellow imprisoned in Canada who claims to be a former
U.S. intelligence office and who supposedly passed advance warning of the attack to
jail guards in mid-August. There are emails, citing an Italian newspaper, reporting
that last July Osama bin Laden was treated for kidney disease at the American
hospital in Dubai and met with a CIA official. There are the emails, referring to a 
book
published in France, that note the attacks came a month after Bush Administration
officials, who were negotiating an oil deal with the Taliban, told the Afghans either
you accept our offer of a carpet of gold, or we bury you under a carpet of bombs.

Get the hint? Washington either did nothing to stop the September 11 attacks or
plotted the assaults so a justifiable war could then be waged against Afghanistan to
benefit Big Oil.

One email I keep receiving is a timeline of so-called suspicious events that
establishes CIA foreknowledge of [the September 11 attacks] and strongly suggests
that there was criminal complicity on the part of the U.S. government in their
execution.

I won't argue that the U.S. government does not engage in brutal, murderous
skullduggery from time to time. But the notion that the U.S. government either
detected the attacks but allowed them to occur, or, worse, conspired to kill thousands
of Americans to launch a war-for-oil in Afghanistan is absurd. Still, each week emails
passing on such tripe arrive. This crap is probably not worth a rational rebuttal, but
I'm irritated enough to try.

It's a mug's game to refute individual pieces of conspiracy theories. Who can really
know if anything that bizarre happened at a Dubai hospital? As for the man jailed in
Canada, he was being held on a credit card fraud charge, and the only source for the
story about his warning was his own word. The judge in his case said, There is no
independent evidence to support his colossal allegations. But a conspiracy-monges
can reply, wouldn't you expect the government and its friends in Canada to say that?

So let's start with a broad question: would U.S. officials be capable of such a foul
deed? Capable -- as in able to pull it off and willing to do so. Simply put, the spies
and special agents are not good enough, evil enough, or gutsy enough to mount this
operation. That conclusion is based partly on, dare I say it, common sense, but also
on years spent covering national security matters. (For a book I wrote on the CIA, I
interviewed over 100 CIA officials and employees.)

Not good enough: Such a plot -- to execute the simultaneous destruction of the two
towers, a piece of the Pentagon, and four airplanes and make it appear as if it all
was done by another party -- is far beyond the skill level of U.S. intelligence. It 
would
require dozens (or scores or hundreds) of individuals to attempt such a scheme.
They would have to work together, and trust one another not to blow their part or
reveal the conspiracy. They would hail from an assortment of agencies (CIA, FBI,
INS, Customs, State, FAA, NTSB, DOD, etc.).

Yet anyone with the most basic understanding of how government functions (or,
does not function) realizes that the various bureaucracies of Washington - -
particularly those of the national security community -- do not work well together.
Even covering up advance knowledge would require an extensive plot. If there truly
had been intelligence reports predicting the 9/11 attacks, these reports would have
circulated through intelligence and policymaking circles before the folks at the top
decided to smother them for geopolitical gain. That would make for a unwieldy
conspiracy of silence. And in either scenario -- planning the attacks or permitting
them to occur -- everyone who participated in the conspiracy would have to be
freakin' sure that all the other plotters would stay quiet.

Not evil enough: This is as foul as it gets -- to kill thousands of Americans, 
including
Pentagon employees, to help out oil companies. (The sacrificial lambs could have
included White House staff or members of Congress, had the fourth plane not
crashed in Pennsylvania.) This is a Hollywood-level of dastardliness, James Bond (or
Dr. Evil) material.

Are there enough people of such a bent in all those agencies? That's doubtful. CIA
officers and American officials have been evildoers. They have supported death
squads and made use of drug dealers overseas. They have assisted torturers,
disseminated assassination manuals, sold weapons to terrorist- friendly
governments, undermined democratically-elected governments, and aided dictators

Re: [CTRL] 1 [CTRL] Hydrogeological underground Weather control ?

2002-03-05 Thread magnetic field

-Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: magnetic field [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Conspiracy Theory Research List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 5:37 PM
Subject: Re: 1 [CTRL] Hydrogeological underground Weather control ?


 Tony,
Please don't be scared off by the titles of these books. They are
 very old and contain more science than astrology. Going way back to early
 history what we call science and medicine were the bastard offsprings of
 astrology. They were once proud of the connection. Now neither one wants
to
 be reminded of their lineage.
I can suggest 2 books for you to read on the connection between
 astrology and science in relation to earthquakes. One is We Are The
 Earthquake Generation by Jeffery Goodman Ph.D. (berkley books N. Y. 1981)
 and the other is Astrology: the space age science by Joseph F. Goodavage
 (Signet 1966). They explain it better than I can but you can actually
 produce or turn off earthquakes by pumping water into the ground or
 extracting it at a certain rate. There really is a connection between the
 way that the planets line up and earthquakes. I have several books on the
 subject but these two contain some real gems of wisdom.
 Also read Earth in Upheaval and Worlds In Collision by Emmanuel
 Velikovsky. Also another book that I think was called the The Jupiter
 Effect by Gribbin and Plagemann (about the connection between planet
 alignment and earthquakes).
  Hope this inspires a trip to the library soon.
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 p.s. There is more than one reason that my name is magnetic field. I am
 facinated with shortwave radio, science, music and many things that have
to
 do with magnetic fields. We swim in a magnetic field everyday of our lives
 and our bodies are alive and function because of magnetic fields.

 ##
 - Original Message -
 From: Tony Dickinson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 12:16 PM
 Subject: [CTRL] Hydrogeological underground Weather control ?


  -Caveat Lector-
 
  Anyone know whether (Weather) these earthquakes might happen to ease up
  local oil flow for extraction ? I happened to notice that this occurred
  the same day as the strategic bombing of that country involved a
  powerful new weapon in the U.S. arsenal, fuel-rich warheads that can
 fill
  tunnels .. (MSNBC NEWS).
 
  Some might regard this as a rather 'out-of-context' quote and connection
  on my part - but I found it thought provoking.
 
  T.
 
   Mar 2 Afghanistan: an earthquake measuring 7.2 on the Richter scale
   occurred in Samangan province in northern Afghanistan. Authorities
   estimate that more than 50 people are dead and 100 others missing.
 
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  major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and
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  always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
  credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.
 
  Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
  
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  Om
 


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 A 

Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Mossad Agent Appointed Israeli Ambassador To US : In What Wor...

2002-03-05 Thread Prudence L. Kuhn

-Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 3/5/02 9:53:42 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:

 WASHINGTON, Feb. 27 (UPI) -- Israel may send a super-spook related to a
 world
 famous philosopher as its next ambassador to Washington to end a long
 deadlock
 between Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and Foreign Minister Shimon Peres.

 Long embattled Israeli Ambassador to Washington David Ivry is hanging up
 his
 hat and going home in April. No firm decision has been taken on who will
 succeed him, but the frontrunner is Ephraim Halevy, the 67-year-old head
 of
 Israel's Mossad Secret Intelligence Service and the nephew of Sir Isaiah
 Berlin, one of the most influential Western political philosophers of the
 20th
 century. 

Wonderful.  He and John Deutch will be able to compare notes and methods.  We
need more spies in the diplomatic business anyway.  Prudy

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Re: [CTRL] War Against Iraq to Start Secretly - Without Informing Congress

2002-03-05 Thread Prudence L. Kuhn

-Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 3/5/02 11:41:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:

 WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A leading Democrat said on Sunday that U.S. action
 against Baghdad might begin without notification to Congress to allow
 President Bush to employ surprise in attacking or going against the
 leadership of Iraq.

 Sen. Joseph Lieberman, a Connecticut Democrat and former vice presidential
 candidate, criticized the Bush administration for generally failing to
 consult enough with members of Congress in the ongoing war against
 terrorism, telling CBS's Face the Nation program: The administration
 could at this point do a better job of involving members of Congress in some
 of the discussions about where the war is going. 

A country with the might and majesty of the United States of America needs to
SNEAK UP on Iraq???  Bush, Rumsfeld, and Cheney certainly fight
wars in strange ways.  It must be the corporate approach.   Prudy

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Re: [CTRL] Fw: BOSNIA - TERRORIST SUPPLIES FOUND IN NATO RAID (FEB 22/AP)

2002-03-05 Thread Prudence L. Kuhn

-Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 3/5/02 3:51:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:

 
  Also discovered were photos of the World Trade Center, the Pentagon,
  the USS Cole and the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania that were
  attacked in 1998, the American official said. 

Fantastic.  And what was the name of the American official, and his
organization, please.  Prudy

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DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
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sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
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That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
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[CTRL] SNET: WOW !!! Re: Government Land Ownership by State (fwd)

2002-03-05 Thread William Bacon

-Caveat Lector-

visit my web site at  http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon
My ICQ# is 79071904
for a precise list of the powers of the Federal Government linkto:
http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon/Enumerated.html

-- Forwarded message --
Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 01:14:56 EST
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: SNET: WOW !!! Re: Government Land Ownership by State

-  SNETNEWS  Mailing List

Hi Bob,
I can't even come up with a rebuttal to this - all I can say is WOW!

May I refer to The Constitution, Article One, Section 8, Clause 17

   To excercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever,
   over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by
   Cession of particular States, and the Acceptance of Congress,
   become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and
   to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the
   Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall
   be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards,
   and other needful Builldings;-And

May I now, for sake of our discussion, assume that the 80.89% of the
Sovereign State of Nevada that is federally owned
1.  sits outside of the 'ten miles square' of DC and
2.  that this land is not covered by one or more 'forts, magazines, arsenals,
dock-Yards or/and other needful buildings.'

If my assumptions are correct, then where is the constitutionality of federal
ownership of 'rocks  dirt' except for bureaucratic control as in The Klamath
Basin criminal actions?

Regards,
Bob

In a message dated 3/4/02 10:10:33 PM Central Standard Time, SantiniTwo
writes:


 Subj: Re: Government Land Ownership by State
 Date: 3/4/02 10:10:33 PM Central Standard Time
 From: A HREF=mailto:SantiniTwo;SantiniTwo/A
 To: A HREF=mailto:BOB%20WORN;BOB WORN/A



 Bob, don't know where the Constitution PROHIBITS the federal government
 from owning land.  Congress is expressly given the power and authority to
 pass rules and regulations to protect the property of the United States,
 and you have to recognize the right of the federal government to purchase
 land - like when we bought Alaska from Russia, Seward's Folly!  No state
 or private individual bought that - it was Uncle Sam.  The federal
 government or it's agencies frequently purchase land from private land
 owners, such as for parks, etc.  Are you saying you are in favor of
 prohibiting your fellow citizens from selling their land to whoever they
 want to, including the federal government?  I don't think that would be
 right.


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sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
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[CTRL] SNET: Getting rid of the income tax (fwd)

2002-03-05 Thread William Bacon

-Caveat Lector-

visit my web site at  http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon
My ICQ# is 79071904
for a precise list of the powers of the Federal Government linkto:
http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon/Enumerated.html

-- Forwarded message --
Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 18:17:10 -0500 (EST)
From: William Bacon [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Against Constitutional terrorists [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: The search net [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: SNET: Getting rid of the income tax

-  SNETNEWS  Mailing List

Hello!
Since the 16th amendment is always used as the basis of the income tax,why
not get the states that ratified the 16th amendment RECIND their
ratification? And as soon as the number of ratifications goes below the
required 3/4 th majority, the 16th amendment goes away! THE TENTH
AMENDMENT SAYS SO!
Bill BAcon

visit my web site at  http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon
My ICQ# is 79071904
for a precise list of the powers of the Federal Government linkto:
http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon/Enumerated.html


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[CTRL] SNET: Get A Cup Of Coffee/Tea, sit back and read the scroll (fwd)

2002-03-05 Thread William Bacon

-Caveat Lector-

visit my web site at  http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon
My ICQ# is 79071904
for a precise list of the powers of the Federal Government linkto:
http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon/Enumerated.html

-- Forwarded message --
Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 15:26:39 EST
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: SNET: Get A Cup Of Coffee/Tea, sit back and read the scroll

-  SNETNEWS  Mailing List

And ten DON'T MISS clicking on 'Documents You'll be enriched.

A HREF=http://www.showmethelaw.net/;Click here: 
ShowMeTheLaw.net/A

  http://www.showmethelaw.net/


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sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
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That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
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[CTRL] Closed Disinformation Agency Can't Cconvince Staff It's Closed

2002-03-05 Thread Joshua Tinnin

-Caveat Lector-

(thanks to Chris Case for the forward sent on another list)

- jt

---

from - http://satirewire.com/news/feb02/osi.shtml

The Pentagon on Tuesday shut down its short-lived strategic information
office after media reports suggested it might be used to spread
disinformation abroad. - Reuters, Feb. 26, 2002


CLOSED DISINFORMATION AGENCY
CAN'T CONVINCE STAFF IT'S CLOSED
Right, Sure, We're 'Closed,' Gotcha, Say Winking Employees

Washington, D.C. (SatireWire.com) - Following Tuesday's announcement that
the Pentagon had closed the controversial Office of Strategic Influence,
which allegedly was created to spread false information abroad, the agency
said it has been unable to convince OSI employees to stop reporting for
work.

We got ya, sir, we're 'closed', said a winking Major Chad Brumley when
Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld found him at his desk again today. There
is no one here spreading misinformation now, and certainly there won't be
anyone here spreading misinformation daily from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. Sir.

How was that? the major added in a whisper.

Rubbing his temples, a clearly frustrated Rumsfeld attempted to explain to
Brumley and other staffers that the office really had been shut down.
Listen people, with all the reports circulating that we were going to use
the OSI to spread false news, we had no choice but to close. So please,
everyone, go home.

Yes sir, we're gone, sir. No one here at all, sir! responded information
specialist Lt. Alice Ball, who then turned back to her computer.

Look, you're not getting this, said Rumsfeld.

Yes sir, we don't get it, sir, Ball replied. There is no getting here,
sir. We don't do getting, and if asked, we never have, sir.

Rumsfeld then turned to Undersecretary of Defense Douglas Feith, who had
been in charge of the office. I don't understand, said Feith, shrugging.
I sent out a memo about the closure. Didn't you people get the memo?

Yes sir! By which we mean, of course, no sir! Brumley answered.

Well, what did you do with it? asked Feith.

We translated it into 46 languages, and sent it to journalists in 102
nations, sir. We also had our bombers drop leaflets about it across the
Middle East, sir! said Ball.

You didn't, said Rumsfeld, wincing.

Oh... right, we didn't sir, no sir! said Ball. We did not do that, sir.
Nor are we having it continually broadcast from Special Operations aircraft,
nor will we be having it planted on so-called 'objective news' sites across
the Internet. Corporal Jennings will be 'not' be handling that end of it.
Sir!

Exasperated, Rumsfeld finally commanded the staff to stop what it was doing.
Listen up, all of you! This is not a joke, all right? Leave now and do not
come back! That's an order!

In the stunned silence that followed, a crestfallen Corporal Jennings
approached the Defense Secretary. You... you mean it, sir? We really are
closed? You're not, you know, putting us on?

No, I am not kidding, Rumsfeld said patiently. You really are closed.

And the U.S. government really is not interested in propagating lies,
Feith added.

With that, a wave of relief suddenly washed over the room. Oh good one,
sir! said Brumley as the office erupted in laughter. You really had us
going there, sir!

We never should have started this, muttered Rumsfeld, throwing up his
hands and walking out.

Ooo ingenious, sir, said Brumley. Jennings, new disinformation! The OSI
wasn't 'closed,'. We never even opened!

Yes sir, I won't get to work on that right away, sir!

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[CTRL] Fwd: Media Suppressed Facts About Murdered American Journalist

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon



---BeginMessage---
http://www.americanfreepress.net/03_03_02/Murdered_American_Journalist/murdered_american_journalist.html



Media Suppressed Facts About Murdered American Journalist

The tragic killing of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl highlights the impropriety of placing dual nationals in regions of the world where it could put them in mortal danger.
 
Exclusive to American Free Press

By Christopher Bollyn
 
Although the killing of Daniel Pearl was a tragedy for his family and loved ones, the American media has once again misreported the facts. Contrary to the claim that Pearl was an American, at best he was half American because he was also a citizen of Israel.

What is fact is that Pearl’s killers claimed that he was Mossad and executed him as an Israeli spy.

One week after Pearl, a reporter for The Wall Street Journal, was kidnapped in Pakistan on Jan. 23, his captors claimed he was working with Israel’s intelligence agency, the Mossad, and that, if their demands were not met, he would be killed. The American mass media cooperated to conceal Pearl’s Israeli origin and citizenship while he was held, ostensibly to protect his life and, unlike the Israeli press, continued to do so even after his death.

During the month following Pearl’s kidnapping, there was great concern that publication of his family’s Israeli roots would further endanger his life. In Israel, as soon as news of Pearl’s death was disclosed, newspapers rushed to report his Israeli origins.

ACCUSED OF SPYING

An unsigned email purportedly sent by the kidnappers on Jan. 30 showed Pearl with a gun to his head and threatened to kill him within 24 hours. The message claimed that Pearl, the paper’s South Asian bureau chief, was a Mossad agent. 

“We talked to Daniel Pearl and we learned that he is not a CIA officer but is an agent of Mossad,” the statement said.

The previously unknown group, the National Movement for the Restoration of Pakistani Sovereignty, demanded the release of Pakistani prisoners held at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, in exchange for Pearl. Their messages denounced the detention of Pakistanis in the United States and Cuba on terrorism-related charges without benefit of lawyers or trials.

The kidnappers accused U.S. reporters of working for intelligence agencies and warned “all American journalists” in Pakistan to leave the country within three days. “Anyone remaining after that will be targeted,” it said. Fahad Naseem, one of three men accused of involvement in the kidnapping, said Pearl was abducted be cause he was a Jew working against Islam.

Efforts to rescue Pearl were in vain and four weeks after he was kidnapped his death was confirmed in a videotape. The State Department said the U.S. Embassy in Pakistan received evidence on Feb. 21 that Pearl was dead.

The Journal denied that Pearl was a spy while representatives of Dow Jones, its parent company, reportedly worked intensively behind the scenes to alert news organizations to the danger in publishing the names of Pearl’s parents or the family’s Israeli background.

PEARL’S ISRAELI ROOTS

Although a Dow Jones spokesman, Gary Foster, said Daniel Pearl was “very proud of his heritage” the company organized a concerted effort to keep the details of Pearl’s Israeli heritage out of the news.

“We were particularly anxious that networks reaching large international audiences, such as CNN and BBC, would not break the news,” Foster said. Since his death announcement, some newspapers have reported, briefly, that the Pearl parents have “remained Israeli citizens.”

Pearl’s father, Yehuda Pearl, was born in Tel Aviv in 1936 to parents who had emigrated from Eastern Europe. He served in the Israeli army and studied electronics at the Technion, the Israeli Institute of Technology in Haifa, where he met his future wife, Ruth. They came to the United States in the late 1950s, where they had three children, Daniel, Tamara, 41, and Michelle, 32.

Yehuda and Ruth came to Princeton, N.J., for graduate studies and he subsequently worked at the RCI research center near Princeton, where Daniel was born in 1963. The family moved to Los Angeles in 1969, after Yehuda was offered a position at UCLA. They eventually became American citizens but retained their Israeli citizenship and close links with Israel.

Tova Pearl, Daniel’s grandmother, lives in north Tel Aviv. “His parents were Israeli but he was not Israeli. He came to Israel a few times to be with his grandmother and take part in celebrations,” she told Ma'ariv newspaper, adding, “And even if he had been an Israeli, it’s also not a crime for which he needed to die.”

Although the Israeli interior ministry considered Daniel Pearl a citizen, he reportedly did not use an Israeli passport, and according to his father saw himself as an American.

Yehuda Pearl expressed anger over the revelation by the Israeli media of his family’s “Israeli connection” and Daniel’s Israeli citizenship. Los Angeles is home to some 150,000 

[CTRL] FAA's Sex Scandal

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://www.insightmag.com/main.cfm/include/detail/storyid/195010.html



Issue Date: March 25, 2002  
FAA's Sex Scandal
Posted March 4, 2002
By Paul M. Rodriguez 

Amid news from a whistle-blower that Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) officials covered up or ignored serious lapses in U.S. aviation security ? both before and after Sept. 11 ? come startling new allegations of sexual misconduct overseas involving at least three federal air marshals, one of whom is accused of having sex with a 13-year-old child.

The stunning new allegations, covering a time period between the early 1990s and at least through Jan. 1, 2000, include allegations of visits to whorehouses, bordellos and interactive strip clubs. These allegations were shared with federal authorities by Insight because of the seriousness of the charges and the credible nature of the sources, one of whom has asked to be called an "anonymous whistle-blower."

Steve Elson, a former Navy SEAL and former member of the FAA's elite and secret "Red Team" that conducted mock raids to test security at U.S. airports, tells Insight that over the years he has been made aware of sexual exploitation of children by traveling U.S. aviation-security personnel. "I heard them talk about having sex with young girls," he says. "Some of them talked about how [the children] were hairless [in their pubic area]. It was disgusting. My impression is that the behavior was pretty well-known. It was kind of a joke."

Elson, whose security office was on the same floor at Washington Dulles International Airport as the federal air-marshal program, often conducted intelligence debriefings of the air marshals upon their return from overseas assignments in which they shared such stories. Asked pointedly whether, given al-Qaeda's long-standing presence in the Philippines, for instance, alleged sexcapades there constituted a security risk, he replied: "Obviously so ? in retrospect."

When Insight raised these matters with officials at the Department of Transportation (DOT), the FAA and DOT's Office of Inspector General (IG) they said the allegations had not reached their level. Most officials contacted doubted the truth of the allegations.

Nevertheless, within days of the magazine's initial contact with DOT to review the charges, the following statement was provided to Insight from the office of Transportation Secretary Norman Mineta:

"Secretary Mineta considers activities of the type described in these allegations outrageous. Immediately after learning of the allegations he asked the inspector general of the DOT to begin investigating. And that process began [Feb. 23]. The investigation continues with the full cooperation of Undersecretary John Magaw and his staff at the Transportation Security Administration."

Insight also reached out to individuals caught up in the allegations, including three who have been identified to the inspector general. These three individuals declined to speak with the magazine on the record, and their names and identities have been withheld by editors. Two of the three would not comment and the other flatly denied any knowledge of any such conduct.

If found to be true, the charges raise not only moral and legal issues ? they may pose significant threats to airline safety as a result of potential blackmail of aviation-security officials or leaked secrets concerning which airlines or flights are carrying air marshals at any given moment.

Moreover, department officials say, any such sexual misconduct by federal air marshals or other U.S. aviation-security personnel raises particular concern because both terrorist and organized criminal enterprises operate in the countries named as centers of the alleged debaucheries. These include Thailand, Brazil and, particularly, the Philippines.

The anonymous whistle-blower who contacted Insight has identified at least three current FAA employees and implicated a number of others (both current and former employees) as having engaged in this gross sexual misbehavior or having known of such activities but having done nothing about it because (1) it was personal behavior or (2) such acts are not illegal where they were committed. One of the allegations, Insight and investigators have been told, involved an FAA employee boasting of having had sex with children. However, in reporting this story, DOT brass denied having any knowledge of such activities or finding any reports or complaints.

Most sources interviewed by the magazine did not want to be quoted by name but assured Insight they are willing to share their information with federal investigators. The magazine has obtained two affidavits by one individual who claims to have been told that the alleged sexcapades spanned at least three continents and centered on Bangkok, Rio de Janeiro and Manila. Many of those mentioned as either engaging in or knowing about such activities had or have top-secret clearances.

The accusations of sexual misconduct and potential 

[CTRL] U.S. Assumes Image of Beast War to Enforce The Mark

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://www.thewinds.org/2001/09/modern_beast.html



U.S. Assumes Image of Beast
War to Enforce The Mark

By all accounts it was a political success. In his address before a joint session of the United States Congress, President Bush issued an ultimatum to the nations of the world: "Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists." The implications are clear. All nations not cooperating fully with the U.S. agenda will be considered the enemy in this new "war on terror."

Merriam-Webster's dictionary defines terrorism as a "systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion." The Department of Defense describes it as "the calculated use of violence or the threat of violence to inculcate fear; intended to coerce or to intimidate governments or societies in the pursuit of goals that are generally political, religious, or ideological." Even though terrorism may be defined in a variety of ways, the common, underlying belief is that terrorism can only be committed by "terrorists" -- that is, unofficial, non-governmental "fanatics" and "extremists" who are willing to use violence to achieve their political ends.

As with Saddam Hussein, this group of "terrorists" in Afghanistan were armed and employed by the U.S. in the 1980's. "We created the first international jihad in recent history," states Harvard Professor Jessica Stern (Washington Post, 9-18), who worked in the Clinton White House on terrorism issues. Stern was referring to the Afghan mujahideen who the U.S. equipped with American made Stinger anti-aircraft missiles for shooting down Russian aircraft. Many of these fighters, like Osama bin Laden, came from Saudi Arabia to resist the Russian occupation. In what may be referred to as a poetic twist of divine justice, the U.S. is now going to war against the "terrorists" that formerly did the bidding of its Central Intelligence Agency.

Most Americans are unwilling to face the truth that their government has been committing violence to achieve political goals for decades -- the clearest example being the recent NATO air campaign against Serbia. U.S. planes bombed power and heating plants, trains, bridges, homes, schools, and churches, killing thousands of civilians in the process, with the goal of pressuring Serbians into overthrowing their leader, Slobodan Milosevic. It has been hailed as the first bombing campaign to achieve a desired political result. In other words, according to our own government's definition, it was international terrorism.

During the Cold War any attacks by the U.S. on a European state would have triggered a confrontation with the Soviet Union, and possibly nuclear war. The constant tension between East and West maintained an equilibrium that was lost when the Soviet Union collapsed -- causing the United States to succumb to the arrogance that comes with unbridled power.

The Image of the Beast

Arrogance and presumption -- there are no better words for it -- have been displayed by a world power to this degree only one other time since the Bible was written, and that was by the papal power in the middle ages. Ironically, in the days following September 11, President Bush repeatedly used the words "crusade" to describe the upcoming "war on terror", and "barbarians" as the presumed target of our revenge. These words have overtones reminiscent of the Catholic crusades of medieval times when the pope sent crusaders to wipe out the Muslim infidel in the holy land. They appropriately reflect the spirit behind the world's remaining superpower today.

In the book of Revelation, chapter 13, it says:

"And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon."

This beast is the United States which has the appearance of a lamb, professing to love peace and "democracy", while threatening with destruction those opposed to its agenda.

"And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him."

The Catholic church became the preeminent world power after the collapse of the Roman empire. The pope had his own states, but also claimed supreme authority over all earthly governments, reserving the right to depose kings and collect tribute from kingdoms. If a country failed to stamp out "heresy" and enforce the popes religion, or refused to deliver a "heretic" to the papal court, the pope would place it under "interdict", a form of sanctions that struck terror to hearts in medieval times. Or he would declare a "crusade" and raise a "coalition" army from obedient states to pummel the intransigent nation into submission. This power was the "first beast", who received a "deadly wound" when Napoleon took the pope prisoner in 1798.

This "deadly wound" was healed when the U.S. regime assumed the spirit of the papacy in its dealing with the nations -- becoming a reflected image of the first beast. In his speech before Congress, Mr. Bush accused Osama bin Laden's organization, Al Qaeda, as having an international agenda. "...its 

[CTRL] THE CALIGULAN AMERICAN JUSTICE SYSTEM

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://english.pravda.ru/columnists/2002/03/04/26765.html



THE CALIGULAN AMERICAN JUSTICE SYSTEM - U.N. INTERVENTION IS NECESSARY

By John Stanton and Wayne Madsen

John Stanton is a Virginia-based writer on national
security affairs and Wayne Madsen is a Washington,
DC-based investigative journalist who writes and
comments frequently on civil liberties and human
rights issues.

The U.S. justice system (courts, enforcement agencies,
rule and law making bodies) was the last venue of hope
for America's censored, oppressed, disenfranchised,
and falsely accused. Indeed, the authors of the U.S.
Constitution recognized that the third branch of
government, the judicial branch, must be the stable
and incorruptible anchor of American government and
society as the other two branches-executive and
legislative - would be subject to the whim and whimsy
of special interests and the public whose opinions
would invariably reflect those special interests. But
what was once the envy of the world is now gangrene on
the public body of a once proud nation, and it is the
site of squalor, death, exploitation, rape, abuse,
experimentation, and profit and loss.

At this critical moment in U.S. history when the
American justice system is needed to stem the tide of
American totalitarianism, it finds itself incapable of
doing so. What a tragic commentary on a once novel and
enlightened system that ended segregation, gave the
convicted rights, ensured a free press and dissent,
enforced a women's right-to-choose, and checked the
imperious power of the executive branch. Now, however,
it is extraordinarily politicized and corrupted at
every level, and wealthy ideologues, corporations and
defendants with money to burn far too easily
manipulate it. It is a system that is suspect by the
general public and daily mocked by shows like Judge
Judy. High school students in America know that the
right amount of money and influence can buy a
favorable decision, a legislative loophole, timeshare
at a low security Federal Prison Camp, and even the US
presidency as the Election of 2000 demonstrated.

With the collapse of the American justice system, the
United States stands on the precipice of the
totalitarian state. Indeed, the evidence is there to
show that the US is in the initial stages of some form
of mutated capitalist totalitarianism. And in one of
the most stunning bits of irony, the very system of
justice that steered the country away from dalliances
in State totalitarianism, is leading America there.

The War on Drugs - based on ill-conceived presidential
directives, legislation passed by a deaf, dumb and
blind Congress, and public paranoia and panic fueled
by self-serving interests - increased the U.S. prison
population by approximately 3 million people between
1990 and 2000; the collateral damage being innocents
behind bars, ruined reputations, federal interagency
squabbles and further erosion of the Bill of Rights.
The War on Terrorism, designed with equal
simple-mindedness and expediency, seems destined to
perform in similar fashion and will undoubtedly
produce fresh crops of productive inmates for the
American justice system. Scylla and Charybdis, those
quaint legends of yore, have now been replaced by the
War on Drugs and the War on Terrorism. The notorious
Roman emperor Caligula would have marvelled at the
viciousness of these monstrous creations and relished
the opportunity to wield these weapons against the
population.

Drugwarfacts.org reports 89% of police departments
have paramilitary units, and 46% have been trained by
active duty armed forces. The most common use of
paramilitary units is serving drug-related search
warrants (usually no-knock entries into private
homes). 20% of police departments use paramilitary
units to patrol urban areas. The U.S. National Guard
currently has more counter-narcotics officers than the
DEA has special agents on duty. Each day, the National
Guard is involved in 1,300 counter-drug operations and
has approximately 4,000 troops on duty. Without
warning or prior notification to civilian authorities,
the U.S. military will "mock" invade communities
across America, often causing panic, and in some
cases, death.

On February 25, 2002, in North Carolina, for example,
undercover U.S. Army personnel-engaged in a training
exercise--attempted to disarm an on-duty civilian
deputy sheriff. The officer shot them both. Why would
the military attempt to disarm a civilian law
enforcement officer? On March 13, 1999, without
notification to the bulk of its customers, on orders
from the U.S. military, Alabama Power cut off power to
Anniston, Alabama, so that 800 military personnel
could mount an assault on the local town and airport.
The power company told the populace it was "for repair
purposes" and not that it was part of a military
exercise. Finally, on March 16-17, 1999, Operation
Laser Cup was conducted against residents in Beaver
and Westmoreland Counties in Pennsylvania. Twelve
Black Hawk, Pave Low, and 

[CTRL] Shadow Government: Keeping Perps Safe Underground

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=36contentid=480



Shadow Government: Keeping Perps Safe Underground 
by CAROL RUTZ

While the news media feigns surprise and continues to report on the "Shadow Government" deployed outside of Washington to run things in the event of an attack, we who have written about this "Shadow Government" know that this is nothing new. 

I have to believe there is some purpose to this revelation now, as little is published without the blessings of those in power to use for their own personal agendas. 

There are many underground facilities throughout the United States which are set up to house those people that are considered 'essential.' 

It would be interesting to view the master list, wouldn't it? 

What secrets might truly be uncovered if we were to find out who in this nation is truly worthy of surviving a catastrophic incident? 

When I saw the news article published by the Federation of American Scientists (from the FAS Project on Government Secrecy, Volume 2002, Issue No. 17, March 4, 2002) in which they cited the Washington Post and the Cleveland Plain Dealer and their claims of breaking the news on the "Shadow Government, I became so intrigued that I had to read these stories.

One of the sites that was mentioned was Mount Pony in Culpeper, Virginia. 

One more piece of the amazing puzzle of my own experiences of being experimented on as a child during the Cold War as told in my book "A Nation Betrayed," suddenly came together. 

Sidney Gottlieb who retired from the CIA in 1973 after two decades with the CIA, owned a small farm near Boston, Va., about 10 miles northwest of Culpeper, Virginia. 

The location of his farm seems to be well planned when you understand its proximity to Mount Pony in Culpeper, Virginia. Mount Pony was a 140,000 square foot radiation hardened facility with a 400 foot long bunker, built of steel-reinforced concrete a foot thick and covered by 2 to 4 feet of dirt. 

Until July 1992 the bunker served as a Continuity of Government facility. The facility was designed to support an emergency staff of 540 for 30 days. Some features of the facility were a cold storage area for maintaining bodies unable to be promptly buried (due to high radiation levels outside), an incinerator, indoor pistol range, and a helicopter landing pad. 

Until 1988 the facility stored a $1 billion stock of currency to be used to reactivate the American economy following a nuclear attack. 

Gottlieb's choice of a home seemed to be no coincidence. Such a highly placed, valuable asset would be privy to many secrets other than those having to do with "Mind Control." 

As Ted Gup reports in the Washington Post, "Gottlieb had emerged as a kind of Dr. Strangelove. He had overseen a vast network of psychological and medical experiments conducted in hospitals, universities, research labs, prisons and safe houses, many of them carried out on unsuspecting subjects-mental patients, prostitutes and their johns, drug addicts, and anyone else who stumbled into the CIA's web. Some had been subjected to electroshock therapy in an effort to alter their behavior. Some endured prolonged sensory deprivation. Some were doped and made to sleep for weeks in an attempt to induce an amnesia-like state. Others suffered a relentless loop of audiotape playing the same message hundreds of thousands of times." 

Gottlieb's obituary in the Times of London began, "When Churchill spoke of a world 'made darker by the dark lights of perverted science' he was referring to the revolting experiments conducted on human beings by Nazi doctors in the concentration camps. But his remarks might with equal justice have been applied to the activities of the CIA's Sidney Gottlieb.'

Along with Gottlieb's close proximity to Mount Pony, we have another key figure who lived nearby. 

Intimately involved in MKULTRA intrigue and the immmigration of former Nazis into the US through the CIA-funded OPC (Office of Policy Coordination) in the State Department was Carmel Offie. He lived 
less than 20 miles from Sidney Gottlieb on a sizable farm in Markham, Virginia. He handed me over to Allen Dulles and Sidney Gottlieb in 1952 for my first experiments and torture when I was 4 years old. 

In 1946 Offie was putting together reports on the movement of German scientists from the American Zone into France, individuals who had eluded Paperclip. 

In the spring of 1948 Carmel was working in Frankfurt at USPOLAD. Burton Hersh reports in "The Old Boys," that "one of Offie's functions at POLAD had been to rake through the flotsam churned up by the postwar disorder—the defunctive Nazi exluminaries and cutthroat émigré politicians and paper mill impresarios of promise—and help the CIC and others plug legitimate experts in around the emerging Cold-War bureaucracies." 

According to Hersh, Carmel Offie was "doubling as a kind of booking agent for many of the refugee scholars" that the U.S. was interested in obtaining. He 

[CTRL] GAO Exposes 1997 Missile Defense Agency Scam

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=103contentid=479



GAO Exposes 1997 Missile Defense Agency Scam
by CONSPIRACY PLANET

According to a new report, the General Accounting Office states that the US Department of Defense falsified data in the first missile defense tests in 1997.

Because a sensor could not distinguish between a warhead and decoys, the report concludes that the test was flawed.

Pentagon contractors TRW, Boeing, and a Massachusetts Institute of Technology review team all exaggerated the success of the test, reported the GAO, the investigative agency of Congress.

"If we can't tell the warhead apart from a decoy, what good is it?" asked Rep. Edward Markey, D-Mass., who released the report.

Protecting lucrative Pentagon fraud, Air Force Lt. Col. Rick Lehner quickly backpedalled, saying the GAO report "doesn't matter, because that was a test of hardware that hasn't been part of the missile defense program in more than four years."

According to an Associated Press report, "the 1997 test, which did not involve an attempt to intercept a warhead, tested a system made by Boeing and TRW that was rejected.

The Pentagon accepted a competing system by Raytheon that relies on a different sensor that uses a different design and different means of discriminating warheads from decoys."

Even though the GAO did not offer conclusions on whether the test was a failure, falsifying scientific and financial data is standard operating procedure at the Pentagon and major defense contractors.

In a previous report confirmed by Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, the GAO found that the Pentagon could not account for $2.3 trillion worth of expenditures. Department of Defense audits have revealed a black hole where the accounting should be.

Regarding this latest Pentagon fraud, the GAO report found that:

* The contractors analyzed only about 12 seconds of data out of more than 60 seconds available because of sensor malfunctions and other problems.

* An engineering team that reviewed the test did not verify whether the data was accurate or whether the software was able to discriminate between a warhead and a decoy.

The open-ended Strategic Missile Defense Fraud was initiated during the Reagan-Bush Administration in an attempt to funnel billions of dollars to defense contractors and other Republican Party donors.

More recently government insiders have admitted that the so-called Star Wars program was an elaborate scam designed to outspend the Soviet Union into submission.

For the complete report, go to http://www.gao.gov








[CTRL] Former Senior CIA Officer:Why the War on Terror Won't Work

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://www.counterpunch.org/christison1.html



March 4, 2002
Former Senior CIA Officer:
Why the "War on Terror" Won't Work

By Bill Christison

Bill Christison joined the CIA in 1950, and served on the analysis side of the Agency for 28 years. From the early 1970s he served as National Intelligence Officer (principal adviser to the Director of Central Intelligence on certain areas) for, at various times, Southeast Asia, South Asia and Africa. Before he retired in 1979 he was Director of the CIA's Office of Regional and Political Analysis, a 250-person unit.. These remarks, which he has made available to CounterPunch, have been recently delivered to various peace groups in New Mexico. His wife Kathy also worked in the CIA, retiring in 1979.Since then she has been mainly preoccupied by the issue of Palestine.

On January 15 the Attorney General of the United States, John Ashcroft, held a press conference in order to describe the initial criminal charges that the government would make against John Walker, the 20-year-old American citizen who had joined the Taliban military forces. In his talk, Ashcroft said this, and I quote: "The United States does not casually or capriciously charge one of its own citizens with providing support to terrorists. We are impelled to do so today by the inescapable fact of September the 11th, a day that reminded us in no uncertain terms that we have enemies in the world and that these enemies seek to destroy us. We learned on September 11 that our way of life is not immune from attack, and even from destruction." 

The guts of what Ashcroft said is ­ and I quote again ­ "We have enemies in the world and these enemies seek to destroy us." Unquote. I submit to you that this is simply not a true statement. The evidence I've seen shows that the real objective of the Muslim extremists led by Osama bin Laden was to rid the Muslim world itself of American domination and influence. They wanted NOT to destroy the United States; rather they wanted the U.S. out of their own land. Bin Laden and his supporters also wanted, and those yet alive still want, to unite Muslim nations behind an extreme version of Islam, believing that the Islamic world can thereby better control its own future. I think they realize full well there is no possibility they can "destroy " the United States, and their objective, while still pretty grandiose, is considerably more limited. Their aim, according to one recent analysis that appeared in the New York Review of Books ­ and I quote again ­ "is to create one Islamic world. .This is a call to purify the Islamic world of the idolatrous West, exemplified by America. The aim is to strike at American heathen shrines, and show, in the most spectacular fashion, that the U.S. is vulnerable, a paper tiger" Unquote. 

These Islamic extremists are not nice people. Those still alive, and other future adherents to their cause, will continue to try to kill innocent people in the U.S. and elsewhere. But what the extremists see themselves as trying to do is to stop the United States from continuing its drive for global hegemony, including hegemony over the Islamic world. I think it's important to understand this, because if people in the United States believe that some enemy is trying to "destroy" the U.S. ­ and actually has some possibility of doing so ­ then waging an all-out war against that enemy can be more easily justified. But what if the U.S. is not trying to prevent its own destruction, but instead is trying to preserve and extend its global hegemony? In that case, I think we should all step back and start demanding of our government a serious public debate over future U.S. foreign policies. We should be strenuously debating the degree to which the people in this country, given all of our own domestic problems, want the U.S. government to continue foreign policies intended to strengthen U.S. hegemony over and domination of the rest of the world in the political, economic, and militarily areas. 

In short, Ashcroft's claim that enemies are seeking to destroy the United States makes it easier for the U.S. government to avoid any limits that might otherwise be imposed on its "war against terrorism" by an informed public opinion. President George W. Bush's references in his own speeches to America's enemies as "the evil ones" tend in the same direction. Although acts of terrorism ­ which I'm defining here as killings of, or other violence against, innocent noncombatants ­ are always inexcusable, simply labeling perpetrators as "the evil ones" makes it easier for the U.S. government to avoid any inconvenient discussion of ways in which the U.S. might modify its foreign policies to reduce the likelihood of future terrorist acts. But are all Afghans "evil ones?" Or all members of the Taliban? Or did only a few Taliban leaders know about the planned terrorist attacks before September 11? In any case, is it clear that all Taliban members were accomplices of Al Qaeda and Osama 

[CTRL] faa sex scandal, Hare Krishna, Children of God, shadow gov't, reporters, cheney

2002-03-05 Thread Smart News

-Caveat Lector-

also has cheney and iraq




these may be heavy for survivors of abuse

A Test of Faith Allegations of past child abuse threaten Hare Krishnas'
existence - Don Lattin, Chronicle Religion Writer Now, 25 years after its
founding, the Hare Krishna movement faces its most serious challenge. Last
summer, a Texas lawyer filed a $400 million lawsuit alleging widespread
sexual, emotional and physical abuse of more than 40 Krishna kids at the
Dallas ashram, at the Krishna temple in West Virginia, and at other schools,
called gurukulas, around the country. At least five of Prabhupada's anointed
successors have been named in the child abuse suit, including one who already
sits in a North Carolina prison, convicted of racketeering.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2001/02/13/M

N86735.DTL


Escaping a Free Love Legacy Children of God sect hopes it can overcome sexy
image - Don Lattin, Chronicle Religion Writer - 2/14/02 - One of the the
most detailed examinations of Berg's prophecies and sexual practices is
contained in a voluminous 1995 court judgment in a British child custody
case. In his conclusion, Lord Justice Alan Ward wrote that, at least until
1986, there was   widespread child-to-child sex and sexual abuse of minors by
adult members of the Children of God.  I am completely satisfied that he was
obsessed with sex and that he became a perverted man who recklessly corrupted
his flock, Ward wrote. Citing the prophet's explicit writings depicting
young children as sexual beings, the judge ruled that Berg bears
responsibility for propagating the doctrine which so grievously misled his
flock and injured the children within it.  Another independent observer who
has studied the Children of God, Steve Kent, agreed with Ward's conclusion
that the Family has now stopped most of its past excesses.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2001/02/14/M

N64543.DTL

FAA's Sex Scandal 3/4/02 by Paul M. Rodriguez - Federal sky marshals
allegedly have been frequenting fleshpots in Southeast Asia and South America
to procure children for sexstartling new allegations of sexual misconduct
overseas involving at least three federal air marshals, one of whom is
accused of having sex with a 13-year-old child. The stunning new allegations,
covering a time period between the early 1990s and at least through Jan. 1,
2000, include allegations of visits to whorehouses, bordellos and interactive
strip clubs. These allegations were shared with federal authorities by
Insight because of the seriousness of the charges and the credible nature of
the sources, one of whom has asked to be called an anonymous
whistle-blower.http://www.insightmag.com/main.cfm/include/detail/storyid/1950

10.html

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/mar2002/shad-m04.shtml

The shadow of dictatorship: Bush established secret government after
September 11
By the Editorial Board 4 March 2002
The Bush administration has established a shadow government, consisting of
75 to 150 officials of the executive branch who have been dispatched to
secure, fortified locations to provide continuity of government, supposedly
as a precaution against a possible nuclear terrorist attack on the US
capital, the Washington Post reported Friday
An unconstitutional regime - The most sinister characteristic of this secret
government is that it consists entirely of executive branch officials, in
complete violation of the separation of powers which is the heart of the US
constitutional system. No one in the other two branches of government, the
legislative and judicial, was included in the plans or even aware of them. In
the event such an emergency government were to emerge, it would be an openly
dictatorial regime, consisting solely of executive branch officials
exercising military and police powers, without any legislative oversight or
judicial check on their actions. Despite the rhetoric about continuity of
government, the Bush plan is not based on presidential succession as defined
in the US Constitution.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=storyu=/020228/7/16x4z.html

TOO MUCH, TOO LATE: Wed Feb 27,10:01 PM ET by Ted Rall  Sympathy for
Reporters Follows the Death of Danny Pearl  by Ted Rall

It was a much different scene three months ago, when Defense Secretary Donald
Rumsfeld issued an order to American troops in Afghanistan: they were not to
give assistance to journalists, period. Even Northern Alliance commanders
were advised that they would lose U.S. support if they helped a reporter get
out of a tight spot.

The death count for reporters during the conflict is somewhere between 10 and
15; dozens more came home wounded or minus a limb. Western journalists were
shot, stabbed, shelled and mutilated by mines. They were raped, robbed,
targeted by Talibs and subjected to countless random atrocities. In a land
where no one takes Visa or American Express, every reporter was carrying
thousands of dollars in 

[CTRL] U.S. Deports Israelis Amid Warnings of Espionage Activities

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGAQS1FAGYC.html



U.S. Deports Israelis Amid Warnings of Espionage Activities
By Ted Bridis
Associated Press Writer
Published: Mar 5, 2002

WASHINGTON (AP) - Authorities have arrested and deported dozens of young Israelis since early last year who represented themselves as art students in efforts to gain access to sensitive federal office buildings and the homes of government employees, U.S. officials said.

A draft report from the Drug Enforcement Administration - which first characterized the activities as suspicious - said the youths' actions "may well be an organized intelligence-gathering activity."

Immigration officials deported them for visa violations; no criminal espionage charges were filed.

The arrests, made in an unspecified number of major U.S. cities from California to Florida, came amid public warnings from U.S. intelligence agencies about suspicious behavior by people posing as Israeli art students and "attempting to bypass facility security and enter federal buildings."

The Israelis were arrested and deported on charges of working in the United States without authorization or overstaying visits on tourist visas, said Russ Bergeron, a spokesman for the Immigration and Naturalization Service in Washington. He described dozens of arrests since early 2001 but gave no exact figures.

The DEA report said a majority of the students questioned by U.S. investigators acknowledged having served in military intelligence, electronic signals interception or explosive ordnance units in the Israeli military. The DEA said one person questioned was the son of a two-star Israeli general, one had served as the bodyguard to the head of the Israeli Army and another served in a Patriot missile unit.

Israeli Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Yaffa Ben-Ari said it was "nonsense" that the students were spying on the United States.

Another Foreign Ministry spokeswoman, Irit Stopper, confirmed that a few Israelis posing as art students were expelled from the United States for working without permits. However they were not accused of espionage, she said. She did not say how many Israelis were expelled and did not give any additional details.

The DEA report was first obtained by a French Web site that specializes in intelligence news, Intelligenceonline.com, and confirmed Tuesday as authentic by DEA spokeswoman Rogene Waite in Washington. The Web site said 120 Israelis had been arrested.

"That these people are now traveling in the U.S. selling art seems not to fit their background," the report said.

An FBI official, speaking on condition of anonymity, noted there were no espionage charges filed against any of the individuals and that they had been deported. Asked whether any spying activity occurred, the official repeated that no charges had been filed.

A Justice Department official, also asking not to be publicly identified, said investigators have been aware of some "alleged linkage" between the students and alleged espionage activities in the United States since early 2001, and said authorities have made arrests in Dallas, Chicago, San Diego and in south Florida. INS spokesman Rodney Germain in Miami said five or six people were arrested in that area at least six months ago on immigration counts.

Although security experts at the DEA first characterized the youths' behavior as suspicious, and INS authorities later arrested them, the FBI typically investigates espionage cases in the United States.

The DEA report said that among U.S. sites apparently targeted was Tinker Air Force Base in Oklahoma City, home to the military's AWACS surveillance planes and the place where many of the nation's B-1 bombers are repaired. Investigators also said that one female art student went to the home of a worker for the Environmental Protection Agency in Denver to sell paintings and returned later to photograph the house, according to the report.

No one within the Justice Department has expressed concerns about the Israeli students possibly committing espionage, Justice spokesman Bryan Sierra said. The deputy U.S. attorney general, Larry Thompson, declined to discuss the arrests when asked about them during a news conference Tuesday.

The U.S. Office of the National Counterintelligence Executive, a federal agency, circulated a public warning in March 2001 urging employees to report contact with people describing themselves as Israeli art students.

"These individuals have been described as aggressive," the warning said. "They attempt to engage employees in conversation rather than giving a sales pitch."

Cooperation with Israel, a longtime key ally, is increasingly important in the U.S. war on terrorism.






[CTRL] Fwd: TWA 800 WAS Shot Down By Navy

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon



---BeginMessage---
http://www.aim.org/publications/aim_report/2002/03.html



CAN YOU BELIEVE THIS IS A LIE? I CAN'T   THIS ISSUE: 

My by-line is on this article because it involves some very sensitive conversations that I have had and opinions about them that are best discussed in the first person. I am revealing the name of the Navy master chief who last November told an acquaintance of his that on the evening of July 17, 1996, he was on the bridge of the USS Trepang, a submarine that was practically underneath TWA Flight 800 when the plane exploded and crashed into the sea. 

His acquaintance, whose name I won’t disclose because it adds nothing to the story, had called me the night before on a line in my office that had been used to take calls for the TWA 800 Eyewitness Alliance generated by an ad placed in The Washington Times on August 15, 2000. He shared our views about the cause of the crash, and we had a good conversation. The next morning he called again to tell me that he had just run into a casual acquaintance who was a retired Navy petty officer. Because of his discussion with me the night before, he brought up TWA 800. Here is an edited partial transcript of our conversation. [H for him and I for me] 

H: Have you ever heard of the submarine Tripanga? 
I: It rings a bell 
H: He was a master chief on the Tripanga, on the surface, underneath TWA 800, when he saw a missile hit it, and the 747 exploded overhead, and they did an emergency dive, crash dive, to avoid being hit by the debris. They were interviewed by the FBI. They had two- or three-star admirals meet them at the dock when they were recalled to port 20 hours later after filing their reports. 
I: What was their position? Were they off Long Island?
H: They were on the surface, underneath TWA 800.
I: Right underneath?
H: Yup. And they have the debris falling around them on film from the periscope. Because they started the video camera to record what was going on. Did you ever hear any of that?
I: That I have never heard. (Discuss spelling of the name of the submarine. It is Trepang.) You know the Navy denied that it had any assets closer than the Normandy, which was supposed to be 180 miles away. Little by little, they had to admit that they had submarines that were closer, and the radar showed three targets that were close to the shore. They had very short tracks. When the plane came down, they disappeared. I infer that they were submarines that were on the surface and then dived.
H: He also saw the incoming helicopter, the National Guard helicopter. They were right on the scene.
I: Wow. Is he retired?
H: I believe he is. Yes. 
I: Is he willing to go on record?
H: I don’t know that. I asked him if what he told me was classified information, and he told me it was not. 
I: Do you mind telling me his name?
H: I do not. It is Randy, and the last name is BeersHe is out of work right now. 
I: You don’t have a phone number for him do you?
H: I do not. I don’t know him that well.
I: Was he under wraps?
H: He didn’t indicate to me that he was. He said he gave a statement to the FBI. He said they checked all their torpedo tubes and all their missile silos to make sure they had all the missiles on board that they left port with. They inventoried the armament of the boat.
I: Did he say that they were part of an exercise that night?
H: Yes, he did. I asked him if there were other military vessels in the area. He said, “Yes, several.”
I: I’ll try to track the guy down.
H: I can’t believe that I had a conversation with you just last night, and I ran into him half an hour ago.
I: God works in mysterious ways. 

I obtained Beers’ phone number from information and found him willing to talk. In our taped interview, he was somewhat more guarded than he had been with his acquaintance. He said he didn’t want to do anything that might “mess up” his retirement, but nothing was said about the conversation being off the record. I told him that I was with Accuracy in Media and recommended that he visit our Web site, where he would find a lot of articles we had written about TWA 800. The following is a partial transcript of the taped interview. I did not begin taping at the very beginning of the conversation. The transcript begins where the taping started. This was Thurs., Nov. 15 at 10:00 a.m. 

B: I told everything, you know, when the Navy came on board with everybody else on my submarine.
I: What was the name of the sub.
B: Trepang. (spells it)
I: You were off the coast of Long Island that night.
B: Uh huh.
I: And you said the Navy-- Go ahead. Tell me.
B: You know, I don’t want anything to mess up my retirement.
I. Yes. Well, I don’t see how telling the truth can mess up your retirement, Randy. That would be the scandal of the day if they were to- -
B: I told them all the truth, you know, when they came, Reed.
I: Yeh. And what did you tell them.
B: You know, that me and Mr. Leitner were on the bridge. Mr. Leitner was the officer of the deck. (Discuss 

[CTRL] Dulce Animal Mutilations Cervid Brucellosis

2002-03-05 Thread William Shannon
http://www.freeworldalliance.com/newsflash/2002/02newsflash0438.htm



Dulce NM has more than "aliens" to worry about.. 

Were the Animal Mutilators, near DULCE, testing for the speading of "cervid brucellosis" ? 
"TAL" 
** 

NOTE : Cervid brucellosis can indeed be transferred to both domestic cattle 
and wild bison that share common habitat with elk. 

Cervidae Brucellosis Eradication Project 
Horse Lake Mesas Game Park 
Dulce, NM 
In 1972, the Jicarilla Apache Tribal Government received two separate shipments of elk from Wind Cave, South Dakota, and Grand
Teton National Park, Wyoming, for stocking of the newly created Horse Lake Mesa Game Park, Dulce, New Mexico. 

This park is a 13,000-acre Class A Game Park created by the tribal government for the purpose of sport hunting. The elk received by the
Jicarilla's were card tested for brucellosis prior to shipment, card reactor animals removed, and the remaining card test negative
(exposed) animals shipped to New Mexico for stocking the game parkFor more info See :
http://www.usaha.org/reports/br97-cer.html 
*** 
Cervidae Brucellosis : 
Cervidae = deer, elk, moose caribou and related species 
Brucellosis (a.k.a. Bang's disease or contagious abortion) is a contagious bacterial animal disease. The farm animal most commonly affected by
brucellosis is cattle. 
Side Note : At time the Animal Mutilators would return to the same herd on a YEARLY Basis. 
Could the MUTILATORS also been MONITORING Bovine Leukosis Virus (BLV) ? 
Bovine Leukemia Virus can create economic losses from the disease in both beef and dairy herds. Blood testing establishes existing disease
levels, and careful management practices will effectively reduce the incidence until all herd animals are virus free. *Yearly retesting allows
recertification on all BLV-Free herds. 

DISEASE CONTROL AND MEAT INSPECTION : http://legis.state.sd.us/rules/rules/1268.htm 
12:68:05 Brucellosis and contagious abortion.: http://legis.state.sd.us/rules/rules/1268.htm#12:68:05 


-- 

Norio Hayakawa 
Civilian Intelligence Network 
http://www.hometown.aol.com/groom51s4



[CTRL] FRENCH MEDIA: US BREAKS ISRAELI SPY RING

2002-03-05 Thread flw

-Caveat Lector-

FRENCH MEDIA: US BREAKS ISRAELI SPY RING
http://www.intelligenceonline.com/

AFP - US authorities have broken a network of Israeli spies living in the
United States who were trying to burrow into the justice and defense
departments, a French website specializing in intelligence matters
reported.
The site, Intelligence Online, said it had exclusive access to a US justice
department report that showed that a huge Israeli spy ring operating in
the
United States was rolled up by the Justice Department's counter-espionage
service. Around 120 Israelis were arrested or deported as a result of the
operation, which it said had been kept top-secret up to now. The website
said the ring was active in the states of Arkansas, California, Florida and
Texas. It was arranged in around 20 cells of between four and eight
members,
who were aged between 22 and 30 and had recently completed Israeli military
service in an intelligence division . . . REUTERS - Le Monde said the
secret
study said the Israelis posed as graphic arts students and tried to enter
buildings belonging to the Drug Enforcement Administration and other U.S.
agencies . . . Asked by Reuters about the Intelligence Online report, an
FBI
spokesman flatly called it a bogus story. The spokesman said: There
wasn't a spy ring. In Washington, U.S. Justice Department spokeswoman
Susan
Dryden said of the Le Monde report, At this time, we have no information
to
support this. U.S. officials said some Israeli students had been sent out
of the country for immigration violations, not for spying.  In Israel, a
spokesman said the prime minister had no comment on the matter.  Le Monde
reported Intelligence Online's findings and added elements it said its
reporters had uncovered.  A vast Israeli espionage network operating on
American territory has been broken up, it wrote.

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Re: [CTRL] Boycott Mel Gibson's We Were Soldiers

2002-03-05 Thread Nurev Ind

-Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: Euphorian [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 2:29 PM
Subject: Re: [CTRL] Boycott Mel Gibson's We Were Soldiers


 -Caveat Lector-

 On 5 Mar 2002 at 11:11, thew wrote:

  War films always do well when the right is in power.
  Welcome to the zeitgeist.

 Like *Saving Pvt Ryan*?

More like - Saving Pvt Enterprise.

J2


 AER

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sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
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That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
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Re: [CTRL] Boycott Mel Gibson's We Were Soldiers

2002-03-05 Thread RevCOAL

-Caveat Lector-

From: thew [EMAIL PROTECTED]
War films always do well when the right is in power.

Actually the facts don't bear that out...

The first real boom (no pun intended) of war films was, naturally enough,
while WWII was occuring; prior to the war one rarely finds a war film being
made, and the few that were had a decidedly antiwar slant (yes, even the
first film ever to win an Academy Award, the 1927 film Wings)

The popularity of films showing war in what could be termed a 'favorable'
light continued for a few years after WWII ended; these films were made
during the Roosevelt and Truman administrations...

By the time Eisenhower was elected, Hollywood had stopped cranking out war
films; one rarely finds a war film that was made in the 1950s, as musicals,
monster/sci fi, and detective/mystery/'film noir' themes were what was
popular in that era...

By the 20th anniversary of America's entrance into WWII Hollywood cashed in
on the nostalgia by resurrecting the WWII-themed film, and found a
receptive public for the next couple of years; this was during the Kennedy
and Johnson administrations

But when Nixon was elected in 1968 the Vietnam-weary public had soured on
pro-war themed movies, and one only finds anti-war films like MASH and
Catch-22 being made...

And one didn't find Hollywood cranking out war films during the Reagan and
Bush Sr. administrations; the genre wasn't really resurrected until Saving
Private Ryan, which was made during the Clinton administration...


June

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Re: [CTRL] Boycott Mel Gibson's We Were Soldiers

2002-03-05 Thread RevCOAL

-Caveat Lector-

From: Joshua Tinnin [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Right, but a lot of films which are in the can and might not have made it
to screen get retooled if an opportunity arises which might make them more
profitable, such as a war.

The thing is, none of these films were sitting around 'in the can'...Black
Hawk Down, We Were Soldiers, etc., were all made within the past 2 to 3
years and were planned to be released in the fall of 2001 and winter/spring
of 2002...


War films have always been popular.

No they haven't.  At least, not films that show war in a favorable light;
John Wayne had a hard time trying to make his pro-war films profitable in
the late 1960s, because the viewing public was turning against the Vietnam
War and wasn't in the mood to watch Wayne's simplistic jingoism...

And war films were definitely NOT popular prior to WWII; and they waned in
popularity in the 1950s...so no, war films are NOT always popular, just as
westerns aren't always popular or musicals or mysteries or monster films;
genres go thru phases of popularity, waxing in popularity in one era and
waning in popularity in another...


Your theory is an interesting one, and I tend to agree with you, having
thought about it myself. But there hasn't been much evidence at all to
suggest that these movies were all part of a master plot which resulted
in
the attack on the WTC and our subsequent war, other than the timeline.

Well of course there wouldn't be overt evidence, other than it being mighty
strange that Hollywood en masse decided in the late 1990s that pro-war
themed films would suddenly become popular, and 'just happened' to start
making these films so that their collective release would occur after
9/11/2001...

Again, none of these films were 'in the can'...they are recent creations
whose releases were planned to occur starting in mid-autumn of 2001, and it
is THAT timing that is so suspicious...



June

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Re: [CTRL] Boycott Mel Gibson's We Were Soldiers

2002-03-05 Thread thew

-Caveat Lector-

:

 War films always do well when the right is in power.
 Welcome to the zeitgeist.

 Like *Saving Pvt Ryan*?


Why do people hear absolutes, when none are uttered?

Reread the above - it does not say war films ONLY do well when the right is
in power.

-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
-- -- --
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better
than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not
your counsel or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands of those who feed
you. May your chains set lightly upon you.
   Samuel Adams




NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew

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That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
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