Re: Sony A7II

[Chris Mitchell]

On 18 May 2018 at 23:33, Paul Sorenson  wrote:

> Didn't know they made them with right-hand drive...
>
> Ha! They don't. The door is on the "wrong" side for the UK, but OK for
Europe of course.

CM
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Re: Sony A7II

[Steve Cottrell]

On 18/5/18, Chris Mitchell, discombobulated, unleashed:

>Here's my retirement present. Hopefully many years of freewheeling to come.
>I retire on 31 July. Can't wait.
>
>https://www.dropbox.com/s/eaulho5sspesx7l/IMG_20180415_135710.jpg?dl=0

Wowsers!

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Re: Sony A7II

[Paul Sorenson]

Didn't know they made them with right-hand drive...

-p


On 5/18/2018 12:23 PM, Chris Mitchell wrote:

On 13 May 2018 at 20:25, Christine Aguila  wrote:





I think I”m going to start thinking of what my retirement present will be.


Here's my retirement present. Hopefully many years of freewheeling to come.
I retire on 31 July. Can't wait.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eaulho5sspesx7l/IMG_20180415_135710.jpg?dl=0

Chris




Cheers, Christine

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Re: Sony A7II

[mike wilson]

> On 18 May 2018 at 20:16 Chris Mitchell  wrote:
> 
> 
> On 18 May 2018 at 18:36, Bob W-PDML  wrote:
> 
> >
> >
> > Funny-looking bike - how do you pedal it?
> >
> > Freewheeling doesn't need pedals...

That's not freewheeling; that's toading.

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Re: Sony A7II

[Chris Mitchell]

On 18 May 2018 at 18:36, Bob W-PDML  wrote:

>
>
> Funny-looking bike - how do you pedal it?
>
> Freewheeling doesn't need pedals...
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Re: Sony A7II

[Bill]

On 5/18/2018 11:36 AM, Bob W-PDML wrote:

On 18 May 2018, at 18:24, Chris Mitchell  wrote:



On 13 May 2018 at 20:25, Christine Aguila  wrote:





I think I”m going to start thinking of what my retirement present will be.



Here's my retirement present. Hopefully many years of freewheeling to come.
I retire on 31 July. Can't wait.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eaulho5sspesx7l/IMG_20180415_135710.jpg?dl=0



Funny-looking bike - how do you pedal it?



Pedals are inside.

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Re: Sony A7II

[Bill]

On 5/18/2018 11:36 AM, Bob W-PDML wrote:

On 18 May 2018, at 18:24, Chris Mitchell  wrote:



On 13 May 2018 at 20:25, Christine Aguila  wrote:





I think I”m going to start thinking of what my retirement present will be.



Here's my retirement present. Hopefully many years of freewheeling to come.
I retire on 31 July. Can't wait.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eaulho5sspesx7l/IMG_20180415_135710.jpg?dl=0



Funny-looking bike - how do you pedal it?



Pedals are inside.

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Re: Sony A7II

[Bob W-PDML]

On 18 May 2018, at 18:24, Chris Mitchell  wrote:
> 
>> On 13 May 2018 at 20:25, Christine Aguila  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I think I”m going to start thinking of what my retirement present will be.
>> 
> 
> Here's my retirement present. Hopefully many years of freewheeling to come.
> I retire on 31 July. Can't wait.
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/eaulho5sspesx7l/IMG_20180415_135710.jpg?dl=0
> 

Funny-looking bike - how do you pedal it?

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Re: Sony A7II

[Chris Mitchell]

On 13 May 2018 at 20:25, Christine Aguila  wrote:

>
>
>
>
> I think I”m going to start thinking of what my retirement present will be.
>

Here's my retirement present. Hopefully many years of freewheeling to come.
I retire on 31 July. Can't wait.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eaulho5sspesx7l/IMG_20180415_135710.jpg?dl=0

Chris



>
> Cheers, Christine
>
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Re: Sony A7II

[John Francis]

On Sun, May 13, 2018 at 06:20:47PM -0400, John wrote:
> On 5/13/2018 06:48, Brian Walters wrote:
> > > On 13 May 2018 at 01:13 Christine Aguila  wrote:
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Hi All:
> > > 
> > > I had the chance to hold the Sony A7 II???the mirrorless full frame.  
> > > Wow!  It
> > > felt really nice in-hand.  I thought the auto-focus had some zip to it as
> > > well.
> > > 
> > > Just sayin  :-)
> > 
> > 
> > Yes - but it's a bloody Sony!  It just doesn't seem right to buy a camera 
> > made
> > by an electronics company.  Totally illogical, I know...
> > 
> > 
> 
> Especially an electronics company whose products have always been a POS. I
> never had one that lasted a day longer than the warranty & I still haven't
> forgiven them for their rootkit debacle.

I, on the other hand, have never been disappointed in Sony Home Electronics 
gear.
>From my first Walkman through several home AV setups, multiple Betamax DVRs, a
linear tracking record deck, my first TiVo, a bookshelf Home Audio Hi-Fi system,
almost every TV I have ever owned up (except for the RCA console that was the
first TV  I bought in the USA, and the Samsung I have upstairsa in the game 
room)
up to and including my current main TV and soundbar, everything has just simply
done what I bought it for, and continued to do so for many years.

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Re: Sony A7II

[Ken Waller]

Sony is the only brand of T V I've purchased in the last 30 or so years - 
simply hard to beat their color rendition.


-Original Message-
>From: Larry Colen <l...@red4est.com>
>Subject: Re: Sony A7II
>
>
>
>John wrote:
>
>>
>> Especially an electronics company whose products have always been a POS.
>> I never had one that lasted a day longer than the warranty & I still
>> haven't forgiven them for their rootkit debacle.
>
>Not quite true, back in the 80's they made some good products.
>
>
>>
>>
>
>-- 
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Re: Sony A7II

[John]

On 5/13/2018 18:30, Steve Cottrell wrote:

On 13/5/18, John, discombobulated, unleashed:


Especially an electronics company whose products have always been a POS.
I never
had one that lasted a day longer than the warranty & I still haven't forgiven
them for their rootkit debacle.


Seems like a great opportunity to roll out this absolute classic from the 
archives.

Best laugh in a decade.



Warning for language!



Bookmarked and added to favorites.

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Re: Sony A7II

[Steve Cottrell]

On 13/5/18, John, discombobulated, unleashed:

>Especially an electronics company whose products have always been a POS.
>I never 
>had one that lasted a day longer than the warranty & I still haven't forgiven 
>them for their rootkit debacle.

Seems like a great opportunity to roll out this absolute classic from the 
archives.

Best laugh in a decade.



Warning for language!

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Re: Sony A7II

[Larry Colen]

John wrote:



Especially an electronics company whose products have always been a POS.
I never had one that lasted a day longer than the warranty & I still
haven't forgiven them for their rootkit debacle.


Not quite true, back in the 80's they made some good products.







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Re: Sony A7II

[J.C. O'Connell]

my top of the line sony blu ray player is ten years old and still works  
fine.

and I always loved those trinitron CRTs back in the day. jco

On Sun, 13 May 2018 18:20:47 -0400, John  wrote:


On 5/13/2018 06:48, Brian Walters wrote:

On 13 May 2018 at 01:13 Christine Aguila  wrote:


Hi All:

I had the chance to hold the Sony A7 II—the mirrorless full frame.   
Wow!  It
felt really nice in-hand.  I thought the auto-focus had some zip to it  
as

well.

Just sayin  :-)
  Yes - but it's a bloody Sony!  It just doesn't seem right to buy a  
camera made

by an electronics company.  Totally illogical, I know...



Especially an electronics company whose products have always been a POS.  
I never had one that lasted a day longer than the warranty & I still  
haven't forgiven them for their rootkit debacle.






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Re: Sony A7II

[John]

On 5/13/2018 06:48, Brian Walters wrote:

On 13 May 2018 at 01:13 Christine Aguila  wrote:


Hi All:

I had the chance to hold the Sony A7 II—the mirrorless full frame.  Wow!  It
felt really nice in-hand.  I thought the auto-focus had some zip to it as
well.

Just sayin  :-)



Yes - but it's a bloody Sony!  It just doesn't seem right to buy a camera made
by an electronics company.  Totally illogical, I know...




Especially an electronics company whose products have always been a POS. I never 
had one that lasted a day longer than the warranty & I still haven't forgiven 
them for their rootkit debacle.



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Re: Sony A7II

[Christine Aguila]

Sent from my iPad

> On May 13, 2018, at 2:40 PM, Larry Colen  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Christine Aguila wrote:
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On May 13, 2018, at 8:18 AM, mike wilson  wrote:
>>> 
>>> What concerns me more is that Sony stuff is very difficult and expensive to 
>>> repair.  In my experience, Sony won't release parts to other than 
>>> franchised repairers.  Very annoying when you just want to replace a 
>>> cracked case or something equally simple.
>> 
>> I’m not really in the market for the Sony, but I’m glad you mentioned the 
>> above.   Good to know.
> 
> Sony does seem to make the best performing mirrorless camera in the 35mm 
> sensor range, unfortunately I don't trust them as far as I can throw a 
> rootkit.
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal


Wow!  I didn’t know about that.  If I did, I forgot about it, but given what a 
shitty move that was, I don’t think I’d forget.   That’s a really shitty thing 
to do to consumers.

Christine

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Re: Sony A7II

[Larry Colen]

Christine Aguila wrote:


Sent from my iPad


On May 13, 2018, at 8:18 AM, mike wilson  wrote:

What concerns me more is that Sony stuff is very difficult and expensive to 
repair.  In my experience, Sony won't release parts to other than franchised 
repairers.  Very annoying when you just want to replace a cracked case or 
something equally simple.


I’m not really in the market for the Sony, but I’m glad you mentioned the 
above.   Good to know.


Sony does seem to make the best performing mirrorless camera in the 35mm 
sensor range, unfortunately I don't trust them as far as I can throw a 
rootkit.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal


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Re: Sony A7II

[Christine Aguila]

Sent from my iPad

> On May 12, 2018, at 10:48 AM, Steve Cottrell  wrote:
> 
> On 12/5/18, Christine Aguila, discombobulated, unleashed:
> 
>> I had the chance to hold the Sony A7 II--the mirrorless full frame. 
>> Wow!  It felt really nice in-hand.  I thought the auto-focus had some
>> zip to it as well.  
> 
> The A7 has ended up being the weapon of choice as a small 3rd video camera 
> for professional TV camera monkeys so the video must be good. I haven't 
> trodden that path, mainly because I'm scaling back as I head to retirement 
> soon. They're all buying 4K stuff now (even though nobody's asking for TX in 
> 4K yet, still HD).
> 
> I've already bought my retirement present (the Pen F) and I'm looking forward 
> to doing some shooting with it any my Fujis when I can pack in all this TV 
> nonesense ;-)
> 
> And just to keep it on-topic, I do (of course) use some Pentax lenses 

I think I”m going to start thinking of what my retirement present will be.

Cheers, Christine 

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Re: Sony A7II

[Christine Aguila]

Sent from my iPad

> On May 13, 2018, at 8:18 AM, mike wilson  wrote:
> 
> What concerns me more is that Sony stuff is very difficult and expensive to 
> repair.  In my experience, Sony won't release parts to other than franchised 
> repairers.  Very annoying when you just want to replace a cracked case or 
> something equally simple.

I’m not really in the market for the Sony, but I’m glad you mentioned the 
above.   Good to know.

Cheers, Christine 

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Re: Sony A7II

[mike wilson]

What concerns me more is that Sony stuff is very difficult and expensive to 
repair.  In my experience, Sony won't release parts to other than franchised 
repairers.  Very annoying when you just want to replace a cracked case or 
something equally simple.

> On 13 May 2018 at 11:48 Brian Walters  wrote:
> 
> 
> > On 13 May 2018 at 01:13 Christine Aguila  wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > Hi All:
> > 
> > I had the chance to hold the Sony A7 II—the mirrorless full frame.  Wow!  It
> > felt really nice in-hand.  I thought the auto-focus had some zip to it as
> > well.  
> > 
> > Just sayin  :-)
> 
> 
> Yes - but it's a bloody Sony!  It just doesn't seem right to buy a camera made
> by an electronics company.  Totally illogical, I know...
> 
> 
> Cheers
> Brian
> > 
> > Cheers, Christine

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Re: Sony A7II

[Brian Walters]

> On 13 May 2018 at 01:13 Christine Aguila  wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi All:
> 
> I had the chance to hold the Sony A7 II—the mirrorless full frame.  Wow!  It
> felt really nice in-hand.  I thought the auto-focus had some zip to it as
> well.  
> 
> Just sayin  :-)


Yes - but it's a bloody Sony!  It just doesn't seem right to buy a camera made
by an electronics company.  Totally illogical, I know...


Cheers
Brian
> 
> Cheers, Christine
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Re: Sony A7II

[Steve Cottrell]

On 12/5/18, Christine Aguila, discombobulated, unleashed:

>I had the chance to hold the Sony A7 II--the mirrorless full frame. 
>Wow!  It felt really nice in-hand.  I thought the auto-focus had some
>zip to it as well.  

The A7 has ended up being the weapon of choice as a small 3rd video camera for 
professional TV camera monkeys so the video must be good. I haven't trodden 
that path, mainly because I'm scaling back as I head to retirement soon. 
They're all buying 4K stuff now (even though nobody's asking for TX in 4K yet, 
still HD).

I've already bought my retirement present (the Pen F) and I'm looking forward 
to doing some shooting with it any my Fujis when I can pack in all this TV 
nonesense ;-)

And just to keep it on-topic, I do (of course) use some Pentax lenses :-D

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Re: Sony A7II

[Jay Taylor]

 blockquote, div.yahoo_quoted { margin-left: 0 !important; border-left:1px 
#715FFA solid !important;  padding-left:1ex !important; background-color:white 
!important; }  You’re in trouble now Christine!The A7III is even better and SMC 
glass can be used with these cameras too.
JayT


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad


On Saturday, May 12, 2018, 8:13 AM, Christine Aguila  
wrote:

Hi All:

I had the chance to hold the Sony A7 II—the mirrorless full frame.  Wow!  It 
felt really nice in-hand.  I thought the auto-focus had some zip to it as well. 
 

Just sayin  :-)

Cheers, Christine
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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Boris Liberman]

On 12/30/2014 13:52, Darren Addy wrote:

the a7s performance has me thinking about selling a kidney. The body isn't
terribly priced (at all, IMHO) but ...


I think, I should invoke Mark here.

Mark!

:-)

Boris


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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Darren Addy]

Rather than start a new OT Sony thread, I think I'll just resurrect
this one. I continue to be a wee bit fascinated by what Sony is doing
with their a7 line. Despite the similar naming convention, they
aren't the same camera (at all) but each seem to have a radically
different sensor inside and each has it's own unique strength. They
all are full frame. Since Pentax has a fairly long track record of
using Sony sensors, I have to believe that Ricoh/Pentax is going to be
selecting from among these sensors for their own future offering(s) in
the full frame arena.

The one that has my attention is the a7s. Although it is only 12MP its
high ISO performance is off the charts. (If you thought the K-5 family
was great in this regard, get a load of the a7s). Here is a high ISO
video test comparing the a7s with other Sony cameras and a Nikon D810.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsywiyX1iKE

Since two areas of photography that I am currently interested in are
low-light endeavors (astrophotography and stormchasing) the a7s
performance has me thinking about selling a kidney. The body isn't
terribly priced (at all, IMHO) but the good lenses for it are not
cheap. For stormchasing, I would probably pair it with the inexpensive
Samyang 14mm f2.8 on it. (That lens outperforms Canon's 14mm in some
significant ways: http://www.extremeinstability.com/lens14mm.html

Sony has some other things coming down the pike and it will be
interesting to see how they perform and how they are priced. The a9
(to be officially announced soon) is rumored to have a 46MP full frame
sensor. And I'm very curious to see how the new Sony curved sensor
performs, particularly with legacy lenses. No lens puts out a flat
field, so it would be interesting to see if using a curved sensor
actually made legacy lenses perform better than they did on a flat
sensor (with respects to corner sharpness and coma, in particular).
The first full frame curved sensor is going to be in a new RX model in
2015. The curved sensor just MIGHT be the biggest leap forward in
digital cameras since we left CCDs and went to CMOS. Time will tell.

Based upon this plethora of sensors, it would not surprise me at all
if Pentax announced not just one, but two full frame cameras in
2015... similar in form factor, but featuring different sensors. Or,
like Lucy pulling the football away from Charlie Brown, maybe 2015
lets Pentax FF wishers down yet again.

For the record, I'm not pining for a full frame camera. It is the low
light capabilities of the a7s that interest me and they are a function
of the fact that it is a low pixel density, full frame sensor.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Mark Roberts]

Darren Addy wrote:

Rather than start a new OT Sony thread, I think I'll just resurrect
this one.

Gosh. Thanks.
 
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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Zos Xavius]

Actually most lenses that aren't retrofocus put out a fairly flat
field. Longer lenses are telecentric by design. The curved sensor
approach doesn't work with telecentric lenses since the light rays are
all parallel. You need a matched lens to get real benefit from it and
the benefit comes in reducing the lens size and that's about it.

On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 6:52 AM, Darren Addy pixelsmi...@gmail.com wrote:
 Rather than start a new OT Sony thread, I think I'll just resurrect
 this one. I continue to be a wee bit fascinated by what Sony is doing
 with their a7 line. Despite the similar naming convention, they
 aren't the same camera (at all) but each seem to have a radically
 different sensor inside and each has it's own unique strength. They
 all are full frame. Since Pentax has a fairly long track record of
 using Sony sensors, I have to believe that Ricoh/Pentax is going to be
 selecting from among these sensors for their own future offering(s) in
 the full frame arena.

 The one that has my attention is the a7s. Although it is only 12MP its
 high ISO performance is off the charts. (If you thought the K-5 family
 was great in this regard, get a load of the a7s). Here is a high ISO
 video test comparing the a7s with other Sony cameras and a Nikon D810.
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsywiyX1iKE

 Since two areas of photography that I am currently interested in are
 low-light endeavors (astrophotography and stormchasing) the a7s
 performance has me thinking about selling a kidney. The body isn't
 terribly priced (at all, IMHO) but the good lenses for it are not
 cheap. For stormchasing, I would probably pair it with the inexpensive
 Samyang 14mm f2.8 on it. (That lens outperforms Canon's 14mm in some
 significant ways: http://www.extremeinstability.com/lens14mm.html

 Sony has some other things coming down the pike and it will be
 interesting to see how they perform and how they are priced. The a9
 (to be officially announced soon) is rumored to have a 46MP full frame
 sensor. And I'm very curious to see how the new Sony curved sensor
 performs, particularly with legacy lenses. No lens puts out a flat
 field, so it would be interesting to see if using a curved sensor
 actually made legacy lenses perform better than they did on a flat
 sensor (with respects to corner sharpness and coma, in particular).
 The first full frame curved sensor is going to be in a new RX model in
 2015. The curved sensor just MIGHT be the biggest leap forward in
 digital cameras since we left CCDs and went to CMOS. Time will tell.

 Based upon this plethora of sensors, it would not surprise me at all
 if Pentax announced not just one, but two full frame cameras in
 2015... similar in form factor, but featuring different sensors. Or,
 like Lucy pulling the football away from Charlie Brown, maybe 2015
 lets Pentax FF wishers down yet again.

 For the record, I'm not pining for a full frame camera. It is the low
 light capabilities of the a7s that interest me and they are a function
 of the fact that it is a low pixel density, full frame sensor.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Darren Addy]

On Tue, Dec 30, 2014 at 7:10 AM, Mark Roberts
postmas...@robertstech.com wrote:
 Darren Addy wrote:

Rather than start a new OT Sony thread, I think I'll just resurrect
this one.

 Gosh. Thanks.

Some people care enough to recycle  reuse and some don't.
:)
:)
:)

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Mark Roberts]

On November 27, 2014 5:21:11 PM EST, Bill anotherdrunken...@gmail.com wrote:
On 27/11/2014 10:55 AM, J C OConnell wrote:
 I dont think the $1500 cameras are for beginners who dont know
anything
 about cameras and lenses.

They may not be for beginners but beginners buy them in droves. I
hang 
out ona forum dedicated to Fuji Mirrorless these days, there are a lot 
of rank beginners buying the X-T1, which is not an entry level camera 
with an entry level price.
As always, you display a separation from the real world, and a rather 
ignorant view of other peoples desires and motivations.

bill

Yep. I know two people with little to no photography experience who bought 
Nikon D800s with a kit lens. No earthly reason for it other than they can 
afford it.
-- 
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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Larry Colen]

But will it stimulate your aperture?

I have a couple of drawers worth of manual focus glass in a variety of mounts, 
so of I was willing to spend $1700 to be able to use several hundred dollars 
worth of obsolete lenses without buying film, this might be a good camera for 
me.

On November 27, 2014 8:23:26 AM PST, Darren Addy pixelsmi...@gmail.com wrote:
Point taken, Cotty.
I would imagine that JC is speaking from the perspective of someone
who already has an inventory of Pentax glass. And in that case he may
be right if one puts the emphasis on his use of the word direct.
However, and short flange to sensor mirrorless camera that has an
adapter to accept screwmount and K-mount lenses would still be
attractive for someone who wants FF (with IBIS, as Zos points out) and
doesn't mind losing AF capabilities to get it.

On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 10:01 AM, Zos Xavius zosxav...@gmail.com
wrote:
 The A7 has been disruptive and this will prove even more so. I know
 more than a few photographers that are buying them or are seriously
 considering it. Adding IBIS kind of seals the deal for many people.
 I'd be more interested if their were more affordable native lens
 options. Part of what has kept me with pentax is the plethora of
cheap
 lenses. If I jumped to fuji or nikon I would have to spend a lot more
 than what I did to build up the kit that I have now.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Mark Roberts]

Darren Addy wrote:

By now you have probably seen the Sony announcement for the 24.3 MP
a7ii full frame with in-body 5-axis image stabilization. This camera
is has specs that are pretty close to what I expected from a first
Pentax FF camera, and I think the most surprising thing about it the
price of $1698 for the body only.

Given that Sony previously offered a full frame DSLR with massive
pentaprism viewfinder for under two grand (the A850), $1700 for a
mirrorless doesn't seem that surprising. I'll bet their profit margin
on the mirrorless is greater than it was on the A850.
 
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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[J C OConnell]

pentax is not in direct competition with the sony a7ii because pentax is 
a DSLR with a k mount, and the sony is a mirrorless with a sony mount.

On 11/27/2014 12:15 AM, Darren Addy wrote:

By now you have probably seen the Sony announcement for the 24.3 MP
a7ii full frame with in-body 5-axis image stabilization. This camera
is has specs that are pretty close to what I expected from a first
Pentax FF camera, and I think the most surprising thing about it the
price of $1698 for the body only.

I think this pretty much forces Pentax to price their (allegedly
in-the-works) FF camera at close to the same price, if not less, and I
wonder if this is going to make the bean counters decide there is not
enough margin in a full frame product, after all.

Still, the one thing that the Sony a7 series does not provide to
Pentax owners is AF for their lenses. With the m42 and k-mount
adapters one must focus manually. Here is one Pentax aficianado's
impressions and images: http://photo.net/pentax-camera-forum/00cfJ5

Also, I wonder if Pentax will not skip the 24.3MP FF sensor and go for
a sensor that more closely bridges the gap between the APS-C flagship
K-3 and the 645z. It seems more reasonable to me that they would go
with the 36.3 IMX094AQP Sony sensor used in the Nikon D800 and Sony
A7r (reportedly). If they did, that would allow Pentax to position its
offering closer to the Nikon D810 (currently $3295). It is with that
pixel density that I think a Pentax FF could get away with the same
sort of Anti-Alias scheme as found in the K-3. I have to believe that
the a7ii with its lower pixel density will have to have an AA filter
to avoid moire.

Time will tell.




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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Zos Xavius]

The A7 has been disruptive and this will prove even more so. I know
more than a few photographers that are buying them or are seriously
considering it. Adding IBIS kind of seals the deal for many people.
I'd be more interested if their were more affordable native lens
options. Part of what has kept me with pentax is the plethora of cheap
lenses. If I jumped to fuji or nikon I would have to spend a lot more
than what I did to build up the kit that I have now.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Steve Cottrell]

On 27/11/14, J C OConnell, discombobulated, unleashed:

pentax is not in direct competition with the sony a7ii because pentax is 
a DSLR with a k mount, and the sony is a mirrorless with a sony mount.

With the greatest of respect, if I am in the market to buy a good camera
with a kit lens, in what way are these two cameras not in direct competition?

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[J C OConnell]

If all  you want is a camera and kit lens, might as well buy a point and 
shoot
if your buying with intent to buy multiple lenses, then the mount 
matters because its the

lens system your stuck with.
On 11/27/2014 11:02 AM, Steve Cottrell wrote:

On 27/11/14, J C OConnell, discombobulated, unleashed:


pentax is not in direct competition with the sony a7ii because pentax is
a DSLR with a k mount, and the sony is a mirrorless with a sony mount.

With the greatest of respect, if I am in the market to buy a good camera
with a kit lens, in what way are these two cameras not in direct competition?




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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Darren Addy]

Point taken, Cotty.
I would imagine that JC is speaking from the perspective of someone
who already has an inventory of Pentax glass. And in that case he may
be right if one puts the emphasis on his use of the word direct.
However, and short flange to sensor mirrorless camera that has an
adapter to accept screwmount and K-mount lenses would still be
attractive for someone who wants FF (with IBIS, as Zos points out) and
doesn't mind losing AF capabilities to get it.

On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 10:01 AM, Zos Xavius zosxav...@gmail.com wrote:
 The A7 has been disruptive and this will prove even more so. I know
 more than a few photographers that are buying them or are seriously
 considering it. Adding IBIS kind of seals the deal for many people.
 I'd be more interested if their were more affordable native lens
 options. Part of what has kept me with pentax is the plethora of cheap
 lenses. If I jumped to fuji or nikon I would have to spend a lot more
 than what I did to build up the kit that I have now.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Steve Cottrell]

On 27/11/14, J C OConnell, discombobulated, unleashed:

If all  you want is a camera and kit lens, might as well buy a point and 
shoot
if your buying with intent to buy multiple lenses, then the mount 
matters because its the
lens system your stuck with.

I want to buy a good camera with a standard range zoom lens on. I have
had point and shoot cameras in the past, but now want a good quality
proper camera. I go to my camera shop to try some out and get advice. I
look at Canon and Nikon because that's what the salesman will show me.
He tries to sell me entry level but I explain that I am happy to pay
good money for the right camera. I am in a good job and have 2 or 3
thousand bucks to play with. He shows me a few other things. I take it
all in and go home to do some more research. I figure that there are
quite a few players out there in the price range I would like to be in.
Canon, Nikon, Panasonic, Pentax, Olympus, Fuji, Sony, and maybe even a
few more. Quite a choice. It wouldn't make a jot of difference to me
what 'full frame' meant - I don't have that level of knowledge. I like
the idea I can maybe buy a lens or two in the future and play about with
that. Later I may get to handle some the smaller ones - the Olympus and
Fuji - 'mirrorless' ?? Cool. And the Sony. Or do I go for the Nikon or
Canon... such a choice.

You cannot place your preferences and values on other people - they
don't think like you. Sure, to you (and even me) you will get locked
into a lens system, but a lot of people out there don't even consider
it. When I look at a camera system I look at the lenses first and then
the bodies. Not our well-to-do customer up there. He has X amount of
money to spend and he will spend it without considering what lens mount
he is 'stuck' with.


I put it to you that Pentax is in direct competition with Sony and all
of the above makes.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[J C OConnell]

I dont think the $1500 cameras are for beginners who dont know anything 
about cameras and lenses.

jco
On 11/27/2014 11:37 AM, Steve Cottrell wrote:

On 27/11/14, J C OConnell, discombobulated, unleashed:


If all  you want is a camera and kit lens, might as well buy a point and
shoot
if your buying with intent to buy multiple lenses, then the mount
matters because its the
lens system your stuck with.

I want to buy a good camera with a standard range zoom lens on. I have
had point and shoot cameras in the past, but now want a good quality
proper camera. I go to my camera shop to try some out and get advice. I
look at Canon and Nikon because that's what the salesman will show me.
He tries to sell me entry level but I explain that I am happy to pay
good money for the right camera. I am in a good job and have 2 or 3
thousand bucks to play with. He shows me a few other things. I take it
all in and go home to do some more research. I figure that there are
quite a few players out there in the price range I would like to be in.
Canon, Nikon, Panasonic, Pentax, Olympus, Fuji, Sony, and maybe even a
few more. Quite a choice. It wouldn't make a jot of difference to me
what 'full frame' meant - I don't have that level of knowledge. I like
the idea I can maybe buy a lens or two in the future and play about with
that. Later I may get to handle some the smaller ones - the Olympus and
Fuji - 'mirrorless' ?? Cool. And the Sony. Or do I go for the Nikon or
Canon... such a choice.

You cannot place your preferences and values on other people - they
don't think like you. Sure, to you (and even me) you will get locked
into a lens system, but a lot of people out there don't even consider
it. When I look at a camera system I look at the lenses first and then
the bodies. Not our well-to-do customer up there. He has X amount of
money to spend and he will spend it without considering what lens mount
he is 'stuck' with.


I put it to you that Pentax is in direct competition with Sony and all
of the above makes.




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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Darren Addy]

On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 10:55 AM, J C OConnell hifis...@gate.net wrote:
 I dont think the $1500 cameras are for beginners who dont know anything
 about cameras and lenses.

If you worked in one of the (rapidly dwindling) camera stores around
the country, or spent some time observing in one, I think you might
change your mind. No, they may not be what the camera company
considers an entry level camera, but that doesn't mean that a LOT of
people who decide to go out and get a new camera without knowing
anything will routinely spend that much or more without thinking a
great deal about it.

My sister and her husband are two such beasts. Both have good jobs and
no kids. Not rich by any means, but comfortable enough. Despite my
sister really not knowing anything about photography, she got a
Nikon D5100 and a Bigma. She likes taking bird pictures and has taken
some real stunners, even though she never takes the camera off of
automatic and doesn't fully get the shutter speed/aperture/DOF/ISO
relationship. She uses it so much that her hubby went out and got his
own DSLR. He loves to scuba on their winter vacations, so he got a
DSLR and a waterproof housing and flashes to go with it. He don't
know anything about photography, but has taken some cool underwater
images with the rig. They make most of their purchases from the local
Rockbrook Camera store in Omaha.

They are nowhere near alone in the world in their circumstances or
buying habits.
- - -
Life is too short to put up with bad bokeh.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Nov 27, 2014, at 7:16 AM, Mark Roberts postmas...@robertstech.com wrote:
 
 Darren Addy wrote:
 
 By now you have probably seen the Sony announcement for the 24.3 MP
 a7ii full frame with in-body 5-axis image stabilization. This camera
 is has specs that are pretty close to what I expected from a first
 Pentax FF camera, and I think the most surprising thing about it the
 price of $1698 for the body only.
 
 Given that Sony previously offered a full frame DSLR with massive
 pentaprism viewfinder for under two grand (the A850), $1700 for a
 mirrorless doesn't seem that surprising. I'll bet their profit margin
 on the mirrorless is greater than it was on the A850.

This is a nice upgrade to the A7, already a darn fine body for use with my 
Leica R and Nikkor SLR lenses. It's that same price the A7 was at introduction, 
adds the IBIS, an improved grip/shutter release, and an all steel lens mount 
(A7/r models have a polycarbonate flange bit, upgraded on the A7s). The rest of 
the upgrades are only useful with Sony lenses, I don't have any of those. 

I'll buy one next year sometime once the price drops into the $1300 range. 
That's what I paid for the A7. 

It would work beautifully with all Pentax lenses other than DA series, which 
need the aperture control bypass. 

G
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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Nov 27, 2014, at 8:37 AM, Steve Cottrell co...@seeingeye.tv wrote:
 
 I put it to you that Pentax is in direct competition with Sony and all
 of the above makes.

The A7 would make a great body for your beloved Pentax 16 and 85 mm lenses...

G

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Darren Addy]

Just one other thought regarding the a7ii and contrasting with Pentax...

Sony's announcing this camera prior to Black Friday and then
announcing that it will be available/shipping for the holiday season
will result in a lot of additional sales for them. Pentax NEVER seems
to release products with an eye to the big shopping /
buying-rationalization seasons. They release projects whenever they
release products. I suppose one could take the Orson Welles/ Paul
Masson approach and say that this is for the best (We will sell NO
wine before its time) but I think in the case of cameras this results
in We will sell fewer cameras.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Steve Cottrell]

On 27/11/14, J C OConnell, discombobulated, unleashed:

I dont think the $1500 cameras are for beginners who dont know anything 
about cameras and lenses.

There ya go again!

There are plenty of people out there who know nothing about photography
who will pay that.

Just like there are plenty of people out there who know nothing about
driving and go buy a 120,000 dollar Porsche.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Steve Cottrell]

On 27/11/14, Godfrey DiGiorgi, discombobulated, unleashed:

The A7 would make a great body for your beloved Pentax 16 and 85 mm lenses...

Actually I sold the K15/3.5 but I would consider buying the camera just
for use with the A85/1.4 purely as a portrait rig.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Nov 27, 2014, at 1:21 PM, Steve Cottrell co...@seeingeye.tv wrote:

 The A7 would make a great body for your beloved Pentax 16 and 85 mm lenses...
 
 Actually I sold the K15/3.5 but I would consider buying the camera just
 for use with the A85/1.4 purely as a portrait rig.

You'd like it. I use a Summicron-R 90mm f/2 on it quite a lot, that's a 
wonderful FoV and just the right DoF from wide open to f/4 or so. :-)

G
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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Bill]

On 27/11/2014 9:26 AM, J C OConnell wrote:

pentax is not in direct competition with the sony a7ii because pentax is
a DSLR with a k mount, and the sony is a mirrorless with a sony mount.




Sony is, however, in direct competition with Pentax for camera body 
sales to people who want to use legacy glass.

This is an important distinction to make.
If you want to use legacy glass on a 35mm format digital camera, if you 
aren't looking at Sony, you aren't really interested in what you say you 
are interested in.


bill

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Bill]

On 27/11/2014 10:55 AM, J C OConnell wrote:

I dont think the $1500 cameras are for beginners who dont know anything
about cameras and lenses.


They may not be for beginners but beginners buy them in droves. I hang 
out ona forum dedicated to Fuji Mirrorless these days, there are a lot 
of rank beginners buying the X-T1, which is not an entry level camera 
with an entry level price.
As always, you display a separation from the real world, and a rather 
ignorant view of other peoples desires and motivations.


bill


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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[J C OConnell]

NO as always, anyone who posts an opposing opinion to yours is called 
ignorant. Im sick of your postsYour last sentence was not necessary.

On 11/27/2014 5:21 PM, Bill wrote:

On 27/11/2014 10:55 AM, J C OConnell wrote:

I dont think the $1500 cameras are for beginners who dont know anything
about cameras and lenses.


They may not be for beginners but beginners buy them in droves. I 
hang out ona forum dedicated to Fuji Mirrorless these days, there are 
a lot of rank beginners buying the X-T1, which is not an entry level 
camera with an entry level price.
As always, you display a separation from the real world, and a rather 
ignorant view of other peoples desires and motivations.


bill





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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Bill]

On 27/11/2014 4:50 PM, J C OConnell wrote:

NO as always, anyone who posts an opposing opinion to yours is called
ignorant.


No John, just the ignorant ones.

Im sick of your posts
Why don't you stop reading them then

Your last sentence was not necessary.




Your tasteless and opinionated little diatribe was not necessary.


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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Stanley Halpin]

On Nov 27, 2014, at 5:56 PM, Bill anotherdrunken...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 27/11/2014 4:50 PM, J C OConnell wrote:
 NO as always, anyone who posts an opposing opinion to yours is called
 ignorant.
 
 No John, just the ignorant ones.
 
 Im sick of your posts
 Why don't you stop reading them then
 
 Your last sentence was not necessary.
 
 
 Your tasteless and opinionated little diatribe was not necessary.
 

Ah, ’tis the holiday season filled with good cheer and never-ending family 
squabbles about who it was that broke Gramma’s favorite relish dish 27 years 
ago and whose turn it is to wash the pots after dinner. Better than watching 
football on the TV…

stan



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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[John]

On 11/27/2014 12:15 AM, Darren Addy wrote:

By now you have probably seen the Sony announcement for the 24.3 MP
a7ii full frame with in-body 5-axis image stabilization. This camera
is has specs that are pretty close to what I expected from a first
Pentax FF camera, and I think the most surprising thing about it the
price of $1698 for the body only.

I think this pretty much forces Pentax to price their (allegedly
in-the-works) FF camera at close to the same price, if not less, and I
wonder if this is going to make the bean counters decide there is not
enough margin in a full frame product, after all.

Still, the one thing that the Sony a7 series does not provide to
Pentax owners is AF for their lenses. With the m42 and k-mount
adapters one must focus manually. Here is one Pentax aficianado's
impressions and images: http://photo.net/pentax-camera-forum/00cfJ5

Also, I wonder if Pentax will not skip the 24.3MP FF sensor and go for
a sensor that more closely bridges the gap between the APS-C flagship
K-3 and the 645z. It seems more reasonable to me that they would go
with the 36.3 IMX094AQP Sony sensor used in the Nikon D800 and Sony
A7r (reportedly). If they did, that would allow Pentax to position its
offering closer to the Nikon D810 (currently $3295). It is with that
pixel density that I think a Pentax FF could get away with the same
sort of Anti-Alias scheme as found in the K-3. I have to believe that
the a7ii with its lower pixel density will have to have an AA filter
to avoid moire.

Time will tell.



I pretty much expect that IF Ricoh does ever decide to produce a FF 
Pentax that they will use the same Sony sensor that Nikon's comparable 
body uses. I's also expect Ricoh to position the putative FF Pentax 
against the D600/D610 rather than the D800/D810.


It will provide 98% of what the comparable Nikon provides (slightly 
reduced frame rate, slightly smaller buffer, fewer auto-focus points  
better auto-bracketing) at about 65% of the price for the Nikon model. 
It will also give the user a lot more control along with some features 
the Nikon just doesn't have.


That's based on what I paid for the *ist D, when Nikon's comparable body 
was the D100, and my subsequent experience with the K10D, K20D  K-3.


If it's positioned against the D800/D810, figure somewhere around $2150 
for the body. If it's the D600/D610, figure around $1350.


If it never gets off the ground, that won't surprise me either.



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Religion - Answers we must never question.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[John]

On 11/27/2014 6:14 PM, Stanley Halpin wrote:


On Nov 27, 2014, at 5:56 PM, Bill anotherdrunken...@gmail.com wrote:


On 27/11/2014 4:50 PM, J C OConnell wrote:

NO as always, anyone who posts an opposing opinion to yours is called
ignorant.


No John, just the ignorant ones.

Im sick of your posts
Why don't you stop reading them then

Your last sentence was not necessary.




Your tasteless and opinionated little diatribe was not necessary.



Ah, ’tis the holiday season filled with good cheer and never-ending family 
squabbles about who it was that broke Gramma’s favorite relish dish 27 years 
ago and whose turn it is to wash the pots after dinner. Better than watching 
football on the TV…

stan



Especially given the kind of season a certain team in our Nation's 
Capitol, whose name may not be mentioned, has been having. At least they 
haven't lost to Dallas this season (so far).


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Religion - Answers we must never question.

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Paul]

On 11/27/2014 5:14 PM, Stanley Halpin wrote:


Ah, ’tis the holiday season filled with good cheer and never-ending family 
squabbles about who it was that broke Gramma’s favorite relish dish 27 years 
ago and whose turn it is to wash the pots after dinner. Better than watching 
football on the TV…

stan


https://app.box.com/s/johwqx5iwnnpg77x14et

-p

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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Stanley Halpin]

On Nov 28, 2014, at 12:05 AM, Paul pentax1...@gmail.com wrote:

 
 On 11/27/2014 5:14 PM, Stanley Halpin wrote:
 
 Ah, ’tis the holiday season filled with good cheer and never-ending family 
 squabbles about who it was that broke Gramma’s favorite relish dish 27 years 
 ago and whose turn it is to wash the pots after dinner. Better than watching 
 football on the TV…
 
 stan
 
 https://app.box.com/s/johwqx5iwnnpg77x14et
 
 -p
 

Perfect!

stan
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Re: Sony a7ii puts the squeeze on a possible Pentax FF

[Paul Ewins]

The last rumour I heard on the subject (from a pro photographer with strong 
links to the local distributor) was 36mp and to be called Spotmatic! Of course 
who knows how much *his* source actually knows and how much is speculation.

Paul Ewins
Melbourne, Australia


 On 27 Nov 2014, at 4:15 pm, Darren Addy pixelsmi...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 By now you have probably seen the Sony announcement for the 24.3 MP
 a7ii full frame with in-body 5-axis image stabilization. This camera
 is has specs that are pretty close to what I expected from a first
 Pentax FF camera, and I think the most surprising thing about it the
 price of $1698 for the body only.
 
 I think this pretty much forces Pentax to price their (allegedly
 in-the-works) FF camera at close to the same price, if not less, and I
 wonder if this is going to make the bean counters decide there is not
 enough margin in a full frame product, after all.
 
 Still, the one thing that the Sony a7 series does not provide to
 Pentax owners is AF for their lenses. With the m42 and k-mount
 adapters one must focus manually. Here is one Pentax aficianado's
 impressions and images: http://photo.net/pentax-camera-forum/00cfJ5
 
 Also, I wonder if Pentax will not skip the 24.3MP FF sensor and go for
 a sensor that more closely bridges the gap between the APS-C flagship
 K-3 and the 645z. It seems more reasonable to me that they would go
 with the 36.3 IMX094AQP Sony sensor used in the Nikon D800 and Sony
 A7r (reportedly). If they did, that would allow Pentax to position its
 offering closer to the Nikon D810 (currently $3295). It is with that
 pixel density that I think a Pentax FF could get away with the same
 sort of Anti-Alias scheme as found in the K-3. I have to believe that
 the a7ii with its lower pixel density will have to have an AA filter
 to avoid moire.
 
 Time will tell.
 
 -- 
 Life is too short to put up with bad bokeh.
 
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